>fills the character sheet with numbers that mean nothing

>>54438323
This is how Americans think RPGs should be. Their burger filled brains cannot comprehend role play as something deeper than "oh no, these are orc babies, should I kill them or not?"

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>>54438323
So this is the power of marketing

>>54438323
Yus forgot
>is fukken EPIIIIIC!

>>54438437
This didn't take me more than five minutes to write down at most.

>>54438489
I'd almost be willing to believe that is the case. A part of me, however, refuses to believe that an entire nation of people is that retarded.

>>54438699
Never mind, I guess they might be,

Pathfinder is the best system ever.

>>54438526
What did he mean by this?

>>54438323
D&D is shit. What's your point, OP?

>>54438323
Have you tried not playing D&D?

>You
>five minutes

You could have spent that time jerking off which would have been more productive.

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So what I'm hearing is that you want me to post knights?

>>54442355
Deus vult

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Because that's what I'm doing

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I've got two hundred and seventeen knights in my folder so don't think I'll run out.

>>54442355
Yes, post knights.

>>54442366
Fuck off

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Well it's more just dudes in plate armour but plate armour is pretty much synonymous with being a knight.

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Can we all agree that aasimar is a literally who race?

>>54442468
This guy's artwork gets me hard.

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Does anyone want to see my dog?

Hey Bob.

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>>54442482
Sorta sucks that he's only known as "The mount and blade artist"

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>>54442455
I like dropping them into a game because it immediately and fundamentally changes the cosmos. Now you don't just have people touched by things outside the material plane, you've got a literal lineage of pure Good in the world.

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>>54442524
Fair enough but in my opinion aasimar really don't belong, but then again I have my opinion and you have yours.

>>54438323
What I like about DnD is finding ways to abuse those convoluted rules in order to find the most unexpected, crazy and hopefully also funny ways to solve problems.

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If you ever get writers block just ask other people for help rather then force your way through it.

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Remember that /tg/ is a community and we all need to help eachother at some point. Never forget that and this place will stay alive no matter the amount of shitposts.

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And don't forget that knights are pretty cool.

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Any knights someone wants to see? Specific weapons and such?

>>54442636

>You will never be so triggered that you waste an evening spamming a waste thread

>>54441626
>>54440208
>Am I fitting in yet

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>>54442703
Negro please I just want to stroke my ego for a while.

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>>54442703
Well that and post knights.

So what are we listening too right now?

>>54442703
Don't listen to this dullard

>>54442792
Yeah I like the knights, keep em coming

>>54442455
I fluff them as having alchemically useful tissues and organs, which makes them nice guys who are REALLY reluctant to go out and do anything.

>>54438323
Why did you make this thread? You're right, but you offer no coda.

>>54442901
(You)s

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>>54442876
So meeting one would be like,
"L-look it's not that I don't like you but..I just don't trust you, very sorry if you take offense. You're more then welcome to stay at the door though I haven't had company in ages. I'll make some tea."

>>54442921
More that they intentionally do everything alone because they literally glow a bit when they feel righteous or in the presence of evil, which is a dead giveaway.

But yeah, when you meet one your encounter is likely to be awkward, brief, and strange.

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>>54442949
Must suck to be hunted down for your organs while you yourself have done nothing wrong.

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It is optional but yes Knights can be for cute

>>54442983
Yeah, thats why if they do travel they do so in groups and heavily armed. They also try to wear heavy clothing to hide their nature.

To give you an idea of how hard people gun for them: if you can keep their heart fresh it can be used to make a few grams of Philosopher's Stone.

Any GURPS players?

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>>54442998
Holy shit.

>>54443032
Yeah.

"Alchemically useful"

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>>54443039
More like Alchemically amazing.

>>54438323
congratulations, now there are 2 threads about that system you don't like instead of one.

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You ever wonder if Dragons act like humans when their alone? Like thinking about winning arguments and them acting out scenes of a show they imagined making?

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Sure is quiet in here.

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>>54443222
Close enough

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>>54438323
>Makes a ton of vague complaints but doesn't actually address them
What numbers that mean nothing? What archaic mechanics that the "rest of the industry abandoned decades ago?" How does it play like a wargame, and which one does it most resemble? How would you "make all of your stats less useless" in terms of d20 rolls?

It's easier to complain than think of a solution. Have some art.

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>>54439050
MemriTV is awesome

>>54443012
I played a couple sci -fi gurps campaigns

>>54438323
More or less correct. But during the years I found that D&D is still serves as some kind of middle ground.
Simply put, it's hard to find a group, where each member can enjoy some PF/3.5/GURPS number crunching, or creative enough to play a narrative based game like Fate. This especially true if you are playing with friends and acquaintances.

>>54438323
thats_just_like_your_opinion_man.png

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stat me

>>54443687
Fighter/Barbarian with the Gourmand feat, for the bean sprouts. They don't do a whole lot of ninja'ing anyways

>>54443784
>They don't do a whole lot of ninja'ing anyways
my thoughs exactly

the most thing would be kenshi monk for some of them, but even still they fit ranger or fighter class better than rogue or shadow monk

>>54442433

Is that knight's sword connected to his tits?

>>54443842
Yeah, good way to make sure you don't lose it.

>>54443824
There would be a few unique combos, though. Daidoji would probably be Barbarian/Monk because she punches things, and Rin would fit as a Rogue/Shadow Monk because she's fast and supposedly sneaky.

>>54443350
>What numbers that mean nothing?
Off the top of my head, attribute scores exist only to calculate the modifiers which makes one wonder why they need to be written down at all when you could just have the modifiers instead. Attribute modifiers, on the other hand, are almost only ever used to calculate skill modifiers.

>What archaic mechanics that the "rest of the industry abandoned decades ago?
Hahaha, seriously? The alignment system is a big one. So is the leveling system where you're given a whole bunch of upgrades in a predetermined package every few levels rather than gradually get better as you go.

>How does it play like a wargame
By being entirely focused on combat, and, especially after 5th level, being all about maximizing your efficiency in combat by getting as many extra attacks as possible while denying your opponent theirs.

>How would you "make all of your stats less useless" in terms of d20 rolls?
There are several ways, the easiest of which would be to not make it d20. 3d6, for example, provide a bell curve of probability rather than a flat line, automatically giving your modifiers more impact. Or, make it so that you have to roll under your skills to succeed rather than over an arbitrary DC. Or both.

>>54438323
To be fair, do you really want a system that handles both combat and say skill checks with the exact same amount of crunch?

You're either dropping tactics in favor of heavily abstract combat, or making a fucking mess out of skills and the size of the book.

>>54443903
You're right but this thread is still garbage, also how come knight anon wasn't saging?

>>54443896
supossedly they are all sneaky but because they use ninja magic bullshit that directly makes them invisible to non-ninjas, so that's why they get away with their clothing and weapon choices

>>54443981
>how come knight anon wasn't saging?
Because he was an idiot?

>>54438323
>Says there are numbers that mean nothing, but does not point them out.
>Does not point out which mechanics are archaic.
>Is correct about it being a war-game but does not explain why that is bad.
>rolling a d20 for most things allows for luck to play into it more then rolling 3d6, allowing for uncertain outcomes.
>supposedly rules medium because it IS rules medium but having complex and simple rules.

If you are going to waste a thread hating the game everyone hates, at least do it right. You're making us look bad by relation.

>>54444018
He...did. You just didnt read the thread.

>>54444018
It's the 5th post before yours. You could've seen it on the first page.

>>54444018
>Is correct about it being a war-game but does not explain why that is bad.
Because my goal when playing a role playing game is to role play and immerse myself in my character and an imaginary world. If I wanted a war game there are several other, better options to choose from, and if I simply wanted to game of wizards fighting there's Wiz-War.

For your other concerns, see >>54443903

>>54444095
Why exactly is it impossible for you to get immersed in the game if you have to reference the mechanics?

>>54444046
>>54444076
Well shit. My bad.

>>54438323
Yeah, we all know D&D has serious mechanical flaws that have never been resolved and stays on top of the pile only by virtue of brand recognition and mommy Hasbro's money.
Now, instead of making another thread about a game you don't like how about you make a thread to spread awareness of games you like? What's your favorite system OP?

>>54444139
It's not so much a question of having to reference mechanics. I do that all the time in systems with a bit of crunch. D&D, on the other hand, plays, and is designed like, a board game. I don't get immersed in board games.

>>54444169
>make a thread to spread awareness of games you like?
Like it or not, but /tg/ is awful at discussing other games than the Big Three simply because not enough people here play anything else.

>What's your favorite system
Most of my favorite systems haven't gotten, and probably never will get, an English translation. BRP is a pretty good generic system though. Other than that, I tend to enjoy experimental systems where the GM responsibility is shared among all people around the table.

>>54444139
Because in real life you dont stop to figure out how long it will take to drown, or how far you can climb up a wall.(Most) Movies dont stop to explain exactly how a poison is effecting the heroes and how long it will last, or that the hero is especially good at tripping people.

>>54444304
That, or people's D&D alternatives dont fix anything. Mythras is a great example of not-D&D that is anything but, and its getting shilled hard on this board.

>>54438323
>tl;dr D&D is garbage

But I'm having fun so why should I care

Yeah but it has the support and presentation that nothing else does, which makes it a lot more palatable to me and my normie friends.

>>54444401
Because you could be having more fun.

>>54444382
Real life isn't a tabletop game and most movies don't even give you the option to affect the narrative.

In a tabletop RPG, you'll need to reference the mechanics to figure what is or is not possible for your character; both to figure out what your options are and to see how you stack up against others within the same niche. If you don't, it stops being a game and starts becoming an interactive fanfiction.

>>54444449
Why should I care about having *more* fun when I'm already having enough fun as it is?

>>54444382
>Because in real life you dont stop to figure out how long it will take to drown,
No nature and your own biology handle the crunch for you
>or how far you can climb up a wall
Never met a climber or parkour enthusiast have you?
>(Most) Movies dont stop to explain exactly how a poison is effecting the heroes
If you want to play a game based on a movie savage worlds is your bet, otherwise again your biology and nature generally handle that crunch.
>or that the hero is especially good at tripping people.
If its a good movie it'll show a scene of them tripping a bully at school during a flashback thus alluding that the hero will trip some plot issue later on.


Dingle dangle get your fucking argument set in a serious basis. You're jumping from real life to a movie. What do you want out of a game? You literally cannot do both realistic and cinematic, the later requires too much abstraction. Pick one, focus your points and try again.

Why did you stop sending knight pics I want more

>>54444526
Yeah, but biology and nature dont stop to consult a book. Games are not automatic, idiot.

>>54444485
Or you could just use the GM as a ref on what's doable, and have established relative difficulties. It works perfectly well for games like BoL.

>>54444526
Im not aiming for realism at all. These games are about telling a story and people playing a roll, any grounding in reality is only to keep people on the same page. Just because you cant un-Asperger yourself long enough to play a less crunchy game doesn't mean nobody can.

>>54446860
I mean, if you are looking to play a realistic game, D&D is certainly not the one you should go to.

>>54442455
I find them very frustrating. They feel less like a race and more like "can I play a human with a really interesting and unique feature"

>>54446820
But then you're still referencing the mechanics, even if you just foisted the job onto the DM who now has to account for your shit and the shit that he controls as the DM (NPC's, monsters, quest, setting, etc.)

I still don't see what's the issue with referencing rules, I understand that 3.PF is infamous around here for being crunchier than a peanut brittle nut bar but I don't see the point of sitting down to play a game without actually knowing how to play said game.

>>54443903
>the alignment system is a big one
listen here, fucko; the alignment system is the greatest invention of all time.

granted, D&D has some retarded mechanics, but i just love the crunchy feel of 3rd edition in particular (and fuck you, alignment is the shit)

>>54449020
In D&D, that's every race though.
>Pointy-eared humans
>Green humans
>Short humans
>(annoying) short humans
>Half humans
etc.

I mean, sure, some races might get new abilities and what-not that technically sets them apart from humans but at the end of the day, you're still dealing with humanoids whose only distinction is that some are better at one class than another.

>>54438880
>best system ever
>having shit balance that cucks classes which don't use magic in the same fashion as its predecessor without even fucking thinking about how they could fix it

>>54449949
>>having shit balance that cucks classes which don't use magic in the same fashion as its predecessor without even fucking thinking about how they could fix it
Why would they "fix" it?

It's clear as day that people love D&D when it has awesome magic spells and shitty martials. In fact, the only reason why martials are still in the game is for the same reasons why alignment, HP, and classes are still in the game.

Sacred cows.

>>54449949
Don't fix it if it ain't broke, right?

>>54450009
>>54450001
It's clearly fucking broken then isn't it? It's easy to make a shitload of spells. It's difficult to have rewarding and interesting combat at the most basic of levels. Your game failed to deliver. Get over it cucks

>>54438323
>1d20 roll over for all checks, which makes your stats practically useless as it's almost entirely luck or not wether you succeeed, not your build
>b-but muh build
This shit ruined TTRPGs.

>>54451965
Building a well-balanced character that can deal with problems thrown at them is pretty useful, no?

>>54442933
LOL, I have never made a D&D hate thread, I don't hate D&D but now I am tempted to post a D&D hate thread daily, just to see you try to autosage every single one of them for the rest of life.

>>54444401
>But I'm having fun so why should I care
good for you, for me it's not great

>>54450418
>It's clearly fucking broken then isn't it?
Not really.

It's like saying that SF fails because Dan Hibiki is purposefully designed to be the worst character in the game.

If people choose a subpar option, that's not the game's fault, it's the player's fault for not understanding how the game works, especially when it's obvious where most of the work was put into since the magic section takes up close to half the book.

>>54438323
I'm not a huge fan but, shit, if someone likes to play it then that's fine.

>>54452681
SF labels dan as a joke character.

3.x doesn't label fighter/rogue/monk as joke characters (they do label the commoner classes such, for what it's worth).

What system do you like most? I've only played end.

>>54453346
They don't have to, it's obvious.

>Martials
>Most gain abilities that relate to either damage or a super situational niche.
>Combat basically revolves around grid combat where you get into melee and race to drain the other guy's HP first.
>Combat maneuvers are codified to be worse than draining the other guy's health as quickly as possible.
>Feats are generally made to force you to spec in a specific strategy
>Only real means of progression is slightly inflated numbers.

>Mages
>Gains a plethora of abilities that range from damage to C.C. to debuff to support.
>Spells add massive utility to out-of-combat abilities as well.
>Spells can be utilized without rolling
>Certain spells ignore spell resistance
>Certain spells ignore saving throws
>Certain spells do something even if the enemy saves against it.
>Choosing the right spells to prepare requires intimate knowledge on the system.

How do you look at them and think "hmm, they're both equal in every way?"

Are you stupid?

>>54449841
Build in this case clearly refers to stats in general and that different characters have different stats, not some form of optimization.

>>54442355
is knight anon back?

>>54453760
you mean D&D shill?

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>>54438323

Please give examples. What mechanics are archaic and abandoned? What numbers are meaningless? Don't just make vague statements. Make arguments.

It's almost like... you're just shitposting for attention because it's the cool thing to start arguments about on here.

Almost.

>>54456591
Read the thread.

>>54453664
I bet when you play a fighter type you just advance and roll attack.

>>54456642

I don't give a fuck about everyone else in the thread. I'm making a point about OP posting this thread without making a single argument. Like I said- it's just intended to start a thread/flamewar. I don't give a fuck that the rest of you idiots fell for it. Honestly they should just ban these threads already, it's like having an active garbage fire and never bothering to put it out.

>>54438766
>This didn't take me more than five minutes to write down at most.
You had it on tap because it's all you ever think about.

>>54442294
>You could have spent that time jerking off which would have been more productive.
-how do you know he didn't-

>>54456659

this. I've won combat encounters by using my str to shove an enemy backwards so an ally can catch him in a door, I've used tactics to force huge swarms even a wizard would have difficulty killing to become a slow trickle, and I've destroyed entire ships with a handful of ingredients, a handful of skill checks, and creative thinking. If your DM isn't capable of reacting to this shit in real time, get a better DM. If you aren't capable of coming up with it, try to improve as a person.

>>54456685
Learn to use filters.

>>54456591
>>54456685
Maybe he just assumed that people would know what he was referring to considering that these are very common complaints about the system.

>>54452273
>>>/reddit/

>>54456852

then why post the thread? If you don't have any new arguments, there's no point to the thread.

>>54456919
To draw attention to them? To make people realize how many of these issues there actually are and how big they are? Make people see that these are not issues that every other system has? To get people talking about better games out there?

There are several reasons I can imagine.

>>54456919
You can post improvements you've come up with.

For example, the difference in bonus given by average and peak human ability score is +4, which is just a 20% increase in succeding and this is complete nonsense. Bonuses from high ability scores should be exponential to reflect more realistically the effect of high ability i.e. 12 +2, 14 +4, 16 +8, and 18 +16. This fix alone would make the system make much, much more sense in practice.

>>54438323
Ignore it and find a real RPG?

>>54457006
The fact that attributes play such a large part in skills is really strange to me. Especially how D&D gives you one attack modifier that's the same regardless of weapon. Now, the former at least D&D is not alone about doing, but I have noticed more and more, especially newer, systems forego attributes entirely. An improvement if you ask me.

Being really strong does not mean that you're good at sword fighting, and being a master with a sword does not translate into being a master with a quarterstaff.

>>54456968
I know you're just pretending to be retarded, but here goes anyway.

>To draw attention to them?
To draw attention to what? The arguments that everyone knows about? If everyone knows about them then they don't need anymore attention, we already knew; if we didn't already know then the thread does nothing because the arguments aren't actually stated.

>To make people realize how many of these issues there actually are and how big they are?
Judging by the contents I've seen so far in this thread the answers to those questions would be "relatively few" and "pretty small unless you're autistic." Actually stating the issues would have been much more effective.

>Make people see that these are not issues that every other system has?
That can't be it because there's no comparison to other systems, just bitching about alleged, vaguely defined issues with D&D.

>To get people talking about better games out there?
In what way would complaining about vague issues with D&D and no mention of other systems get people talking about other systems?

This whole thread and others like it are daily garbage fire threads that should be pruned on creation by the janitors. If you want to talk about another system, talk about another system, if you want to talk about issues that D&D has, then name actual issues instead of vague shit like "filled with archaic mechanics that the rest of the industry abandoned decades ago."

Everyone knows these threads are just bait threads, but everyone here is so goddamn eager to prove how clever they are by trying to out retard the retards. Fuck.

>>54438323
Ya know, just because you post the same thread but you've finally decided to change the OP image doesn't mean you're not obvious

>>54443938
D&D combat is already highly abstract and, in fact, way more so than many more rules light systems. The fact that combat takes so long, especially at higher levels, also means that you'll quickly run out of different ways to describe the way combatants swing their swords around, turning the whole thing into a simple competition of who can roll the highest number the most times.

>>54442690
Thanks. I was looking for a character pic for a LotFP Fighter who had a mace and pistol.

>>54458489
>That can't be it because there's no comparison to other systems, just bitching about alleged, vaguely defined issues with D&D.

>linear fighter quadratic wizard
>alleged
>vaguely defined

>>54452014
Maybe in video games.

That should have nothing to do with modern roleplaying, though.

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Because nobody takes the DnD haters seriously anyway, this is now a char creation thread.

Give me 3D6 down the line for Abilities!

>>54459068
The thing is that in D&D your stats hardly matter at all. The way OP uses the word "build" has obviously nothing to do with creating an optimized character.

Amazing how the people calling this a troll thread are the ones filling it with shitposts while the supposed haters have provided good arguments.

>>54442910
Anon, OP gets no (you)s.

>>54456659
>>54456704
Playing "Mother, May I?" with your abilities is not the same as having actual mechanical depth.

Think about it, the only reason why you won was because the DM allowed you to win while the mage won because he used the right spell in the right way and it ended up being used to great effect.

Rolled 3, 1, 5, 3, 2, 4, 4, 5, 1, 3, 5, 4, 4, 5, 4, 1, 1, 6 = 61 (18d6)

>>54459102
Rollin'

Rolled 4, 2, 5, 4, 5, 3, 1, 5, 4, 6, 2, 5, 4, 2, 5, 6, 1, 2 = 66 (18d6)

>>54460380
STR:9 (-1)
DEX:9 (-1)
CON:10 (0)
INT:12 (+1)
WIS:13 (+1)
CHA:8 (-1)

These stats suck, rerolling!

Rolled 12 + 1 (1d12 + 1)

>>54460396
STR:11 (0)
DEX:12 (+1)
CON:10 (0)
INT:12 (+1)
WIS:11 (0)
CHA:9 (-1)

Meh, I'll keep it but at least it'll die in the first round of combat.

d12 decides my character, d10 decides my race, name's unimportant.

Rolled 6 (1d10)

>>54460430

>>54460430
>>54460439
Dragonborn Wizard it is.
STR:13 (+1)
DEX:12 (+1)
CON:10 (0)
INT:12 (+1)
WIS:11 (0)
CHA:10 (0)

Cantrips: Mending, Mage Hand, Dancing Lights
Spells: Mage Armor, Feather Fall

>>54442690
I need pictures.
Pictures of knights wielding lances.
(preferably on foot, even though lances are designed for horseback (because I like the rule of cool damnit))

>>54460485
The Dragonborn Wizard has descended the stairs into the Dungeon (of Dragons). The doorway collapsed behind him. His quest is to find the amulet off arcane mightiness. The room is empty, a corridor leads to the east, a door is on the northern wall.

What do you do?

>>54444501
Rolling around in grass all day can be fun. It's dumb tho when everyone insists always on rolling in grass every time. There are other, more fun things to do, but here i am, stuck with an entire fucking community who defend their dumb pass-time as 'fun enough'.

>>54438766
>part of me, however, refuses to believe that an entire nation of people is that retarded
hold my beer

>>54460575
Why not gather a group of like-minded individuals and do something that isn't just "roll around in grass?"

There's over 7 billion people on this planet anon, statistically, you're bound to find 2-6 people eventually.

>>54460563
>N

>>54438323

D&D is successful because it's made in a way that allows a fucking ape to be the GM.

Other systems require good GM's. D&D crowd will be satisfied with an idiot throwing them into a generic dungeon #5354235.

>>54460575
>the lamentations of people with zero charisma

That's why these troll threads are so sad and pathetic.

>>54442875
Redwall was great.

>>54438880

It's 3e for even more autistic people. It adds tons of shitty rules and pointless crap while still suffering from drawbacks of all D20 systems.

>>54460618
The Northern door opens to reveal a closet. A man stands within, fat and unwashed. Startled, he stares at you. "Oh no", he blurts out, "I need to make another thread about how DnD is ad on /tg/!" and teleports away. Lying on the floor of the closet, you see a sword.

Not enough people suggest alternatives in these threads.

What's a good fantasy role-playing system for a long-running campaign, featuring character progression and a good crunch-to-narrative ratio?

I liked Dungeon World but I can't imagine playing it for more than two or three sessions.

>>54460669
*bad

>>54460669
>E

>>54442455
I cant see myself ever running a game where i allow aasimar, tiefling or dragonborn without a drastic change of their fluff

>>54460682
Ignoring the sword, you march east. Walking through the dark corridor, you hear a faint wailing in the distance. After about 40 steps, you reach a corner turning north. After about 50 steps more you reach a doorway opening into a natural cave lit by a few torches. Within are 2d3 Goblins wielding crude spears, apparently in a quantum-superposition of possible group sizes, sitting around a campfire. They seem to be arguing about splitting treasure when they aren't even sure of their own existence.

>>54460685
That's me as well. It pisses off the edge lord furry in my group. He's a fantastic player, but if he can't be a wolf man, his next choices, in order, are a lizard man or the most edgy thing he can be. Luckily we don't play D&D much, but I've yet to see him build a Cypher character whose focus isn't "Murders."

File: [Commie] Senki Zesshou Symphogear GX - 05 [BC9F61B4].mkv_snapshot_20.12_[2015.08.08_00.36.20].png (1MB, 1280x720px) Image search: [Google]

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Can someone explain why D&D is so dominant in USA while just being one of the more popular systems everywhere else?

>>54460676
>fantasy role-playing system for a long-running campaign, featuring character progression
That's, uh... that's pretty much all of them, anon.

>a good crunch-to-narrative ratio?
What's a good ratio in your opinion?

>>54460755
I hate snowflake races and classes so much, ever player except me seems to always wants to play some special-ass background.

>>54460779
It's generally #2 in just about every country it's not #1, and that's largely because the #1 game is some nationally produced game and there's actually a fair amount of national pride when it comes to these sorts of things.

>>54460831
The thing about D&D is the sheer amount of content supporting it: random dungeon generator, random race generator, random npc generator - they always use D&D

plus i dont like it when a system tries to push some sort of 'unique' mechanic like 'oh the players take part in creating the setting as the game takes place' or something.

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Oh my fucking god this thread is still alive? Back to knights

>>54460855
>It's generally #2
Nope.

>>54460891
Actually, yes. At best, it only ever dips to about #4.

>>54460871
>random dungeon generator, random race generator, random npc generator - they always use D&D

You can usually reuse them (especially the random dungeon generator) on some level, or you don't need them cause your game is simple enough to not need generators.

>>54460676
We got >>54429350

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Y'all cowards don't even smoke Charecter sheets

>>54460905
and also >>54439004

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I haven't slept for two days

>>54460715
>Cast Dancing Lights

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The longest I've gone is a week and a half

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Look I'll call anything a knight if I like it okay?

>>54460930
Startled, their wavefuction disperses, leaving behind 32 silver coins and crude leather helmet. A chest stands in the corner. There is a door in the North Wall and a door in the West Wall.

>>54460964
These trolls will just make another thread as soon as this one hits bump limit.

You don't seem to understand just how sad and pathetic these trolls are.

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Can anyone else just imagine a small tale to go with these images?

>>54460968
>Cast Mage Hand on Silver Coins

>>54460899
>Actually, yes
Show some statistics then.

>>54460831
>That's, uh... that's pretty much all of them, anon.

There are games that aren't suited for long campaigns, and there are games where the characters don't progress (at least in the D&D sense) at all. I mean something where the characters gain levels or skill points.

>What's a good ratio in your opinion?

That's what I'm asking you! I suppose as long as it's neither extreme (freeform role-playing or tactical wargaming).

>>54460905
>>54460916
That's what I get for not using the catalog, thanks.

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>>54460972
Don't worry my armour negates mental damage.

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When you stay up for days and all you've eaten for five days is fudge cookies and the only drink left is tap water you get real resistant to trolls. Atleast in my experience.

>>54460855

Bullshit. Warhammer is #1 in eastern EU and D&D is not even in top3. It also does terribly in Asia.

>>54460996
>There are games that aren't suited for long campaigns
Yes, but they also aren't in the majority, and they're usually marketed as suited for short or stand-alone adventures and the like.

>and there are games where the characters don't progress (at least in the D&D sense) at all
The only games where characters progress in that are pretty much D&D and its imitators.

>That's what I'm asking you!
But the recommendation would depend on what you're looking for. "A good ratio of crunch" could mean literally anything, and your insistence on not clearing up what you mean by it only implies that your intention is to shoot down whatever people suggest as even worse.

>>54461124
>Warhammer is #1

WHFRPG and the various WH40KRPG's aren't even in the top 5 in most Eastern European countries, even when combined. Are you getting numbers mixed up by including general 40k sales figures into the mix?

>>54438323
D&D is a very old game, and in large part the charm of it is how entrenched in draconian rules it is. There are foot prints left on its core design that suggest how people were thinking back then when role-playing games were in their primordial state. Ability scores, (as an example) are first and foremost suppose to be the randomly generated building blocks that you base your character on. Ability scores do not exist to apply a modifier, modifiers exist to help represent what your ability score says about your character.

Quadratic wizards and linear fighters are another example of its tradition showing through, investing into a magic user means your early game is going to be difficult but you'll be rewarded later by having awesome powers if you survive, whereas in early editions of D&D fighting men were expected to eventually become kings or warlords, controlling the world not through magic but political power and generalship.

That has mostly gone away, but the martial vs. caster issue remains. I'm not familiar with the other editions of 3.PF, but from what I understand in 5e the classes are on more even ground at high levels.

It has a heavy emphasis on combat because that is the kind of narrative D&D is focused on simulating, and this has its origin from being a conversion of chainmail, ( a wargame set in the Middle Ages). There's nothing wrong with D&D being a game about dungeon crawling, and it makes sense for the developers to not try and make complex rules on things which most players and DMs won't bother to focus on.

A 1d20 role + mods vs a target number is easy to digest and easy to run. It wouldn't "feel" like D&D or a role-playing game without all the weird dice, just because they've been associated with D&D for so long. Modifiers are not totally ineffective in d20, just less so than in other methods, sacrificing it for a more normal distribution is not really worth it because a more normal distribution is not inherently more valuable.

>>54442433
>1300
>thou dost not havr teat-chains attached to thy weapon
kill thyself

>>54461311
More normal distributions do add something on their own.
They are less swingy while still allowing for rare extreme results, giving a randomness that feels more natural.

The old d20 roll over does have simplicity going for it, and the association with D&D you mentioned I suppose.

>>54461249

You obviously have no idea what you are talking about.

Warhammer obviously don't sell for years but people download pdf's and play all the time. It's by far the most common rpg system in Germany or Poland.

Once 4e comes out you'll see real sales.

>>54461454
>They are less swingy while still allowing for rare extreme results, giving a randomness that feels more natural.

This is just an idiotic fallacy coined by people with no clue about what they're talking about, and only understand one part of the equation.

A d20 by itself is one thing, but what you're supposed to be looking at is the fact that it is trying to meet a target number with a binary pass-fail result. How the dice roll is achieved in this regard is considerably less important than what the target number is set as.

Want less "swingy"? Reduce the target numbers to make the pass results more consistent. It's actually considerably easier to do using a flat distribution roll, since the math doesn't start to become unwieldy as you stray towards the extremes.

In general, trying to call the mechanics used in modern D&D's as ancient or sacred cows is really just failing to appreciate just how much the games have changed, and how the parts that were retained weren't done so arbitrarily or for some sake of blind tradition. It would be doing yourself a service to try and recognize why these mechanics remain popular, and not simply trying to dismiss them as antiques that designers lug about because they genuinely don't know any better.

You need to remember that D&D is the gathering point for many of the best game designers, and is the game that has undergone by far the most scrutiny. Every aspect of the game has been examined, to almost a frightening degree.

Even the question of "can we make the d20 rolls more reliable aside from lowering target numbers" was adressed in 5e, with the inclusion of the advantage system.

>>54461481
>It's by far the most common rpg system in Germany or Poland.

I return your own words to you.

>You obviously have no idea what you are talking about.

>>54461540
I really hate how you mix reasonable points in with such obviously stupid bullshit.

First half of post good points followed by pretending to be a stupid fanboy.

... which is actually a posting style I see a lot in D&D troll threads.

>>54461548

I obviously have no idea living there and playing rpg's for over 20 years.

Most of rpg players I know tried D&D at some point and stopped. I still have 3e books. It's the butt of jokes in rpg community here.

>>54461635
I think that's just your trollblood and hatred of the system getting the better of you.

You really need to understand that D&D's popularity isn't some marketing fluke or that it's not evolved dramatically over the decades, or that it hasn't been under constant scrutiny and criticism.

It's a game that you might not agree with on many points (I also disagree with many of its design decisions), but at the same time, you're really not doing anyone a favor by failing to see pretty obvious reasons why they kept certain mechanics (and why those mechanics are popular) and discarded others.

>>54443903
>you could just have the modifiers instead
That way you can have ability scores increase gradually in 1-point increments. Even-numbered scores increase modifiers, odd-numbered scores unlock prerequisites for feats and other things. And using the same 1-20 scale makes it easier to roll for things like "reduces your Dex by 2d4".

>The alignment system is a big one. So is the leveling system
5e removed alignment prerequisites. Besides being used in certain spells, alignment is now a quick option to flesh out a character, similar to bonds or flaws. Class vs classless is a matter of preference

>By being entirely focused on combat
By default, characters are swords-and-sorcery action heroes, so the class options are mostly about combat. Backgrounds are not combat-focused, though.
The DMG does have options for combat-light campaigns: remove long rest healing and/or increase time needed for rests. Or you could crank up the combat with Healing Surges and Epic Heroism rests, and raise the stakes of each encounter.

>being all about maximizing your efficiency in combat by getting as many extra attacks as possible while denying your opponent theirs
Lots of options. Sneak attack, stunning strike, goading attack, and many ways to give benefits to allies. If you're designing an encounter, use an enemy that does more than hit, or create your own.

>not make it d20
There's actually a variant rule option to use 3d6. But doing so will make roll results more predictable and less swingy.
5e specifically reduced modifiers and added the advantage mechanic so the unskilled could still succeed and the skilled could fail.

>roll under your skills to succeed
Roll under, especially percentile, conveys the chance of success more intuitively, while roll over is better if the difficulty is unknown (the dice roll won't immediately imply whether you succeed/fail) or for opposed tests.

And of course tradition is important for a player community as big as D&D/Pathfinder

>>54461684
>I obviously have no idea

Yes. You're clearly relying on your limited experience and hoping that somehow trumps convention statistics, sales charts, search numbers, and online roleplaying stats.

The fact that you're saying Warhammer is the most popular is extremely odd, because it clearly shows that you're not even in the ballpark of understanding what the trends in Eastern/Central Europe are.

>>54461540

And yet D&D still suffers from crap like hp bloat or number of attacks being far more important that weapon statistics. And don't even get me started about magic system.

Shit works like as a board game and that's how most D&D people play it. Glorified board game with rpg elements.

>>54461713
>HP Bloat

Oh, it's this idiot troll again.

God, you never give up with your incessant and pathetic bitching, do you?

>>54461712
>You're clearly relying on your limited experience

Oh yes. Going to largest cons or visiting the largest rpg forums for over a decade is limited experience.

Two of my friends work at the biggest hobby shop chain in the country. I know what sells here. D&D isn't. FFG Star Wars, Shadowrun and WoD completely overshadow it while Warhammer remains fan favorite with Cyberpunk following closely.

>>54461454
>less swingy while still allowing for rare extreme results

The d20 makes rare results merely uncommon instead of rare. Maybe the normal distribution is closer to real-world statistics, but when weak characters can still have an appreciable chance of success and even strong ones might fail a significant portion of the time, I think that makes a more interesting story. Whichever option feels better is up to personal taste

>>54461727

It's not like hp bloat is one of the most common complaints about d20 systems or anything.

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>>54461540
>that first sentence
Way to be rude at the starting gun.
Also I actually did the math, not just "one part of the equation".

>just reduce target numbers
That doesn't change the variance of your roll, it shifts the expected value.
I crunched some numbers, the actual probability still doesn't have d20 looking great.

>math unwieldy towards the extremes
You mean you expect the GM to think explicitly in percentage chance instead of just fiddling with the parameters of whatever rolling distribution/system you decided on?
Explain yourself.

>the rest of your post
Mate, I wasn't even hating on D&D as a whole, I was commenting on the dice math.
And I don't care how much you idolize the system, we can still talk about some of its mechanics critically.

>>54461689
>I think that's just your trollblood and hatred of the system getting the better of you.

I don't think I've made a comment in this thread before that.

I'd also

>That way you can have ability scores increase gradually in 1-point increments. Even-numbered scores increase modifiers, odd-numbered scores unlock prerequisites for feats and other things.

These lead to stupid number crunching/pre-planning builds so your feat and ASI choices end up with even numbers, that doesn't positively affect the game.

>And using the same 1-20 scale makes it easier to roll for things like "reduces your Dex by 2d4".

This makes no sense. A -x is a -x and will add -x to your rolls no matter how the scale is placed. And even then, the 1-20 scale could be kept, but you could just handle it that the modifier is your stat-10 (like, say, Shadow of the Demonlord does it), instead of stat-10/2.

Stats as they are had been carried over, despite the roll-under system using them not being in place anymore

>>54461744
I'm sure your dad works at Nintendo too, but really, you're really barking up the wrong tree if you think that naming games but somehow actually missing the best sellers can convince anyone.

I'm genuinely shocked, because it sounds like you're trying to sound like you know what you're talking about, but you're not even close to what the statistics show.

Do you live in some remote forest, cut off from all civilization?

D&D has bullshit like tiny hand crossbows doing the most dps because of idiotic multi attack rules. How the hell could anyone defend this shit system?

>>54461769

What statistics you retarded ape? Go ahead and post sales stats from east Europe. All you do is bark showing shit.

Obviously you know what is popular here living on other side of the planet where trash like D&D rules only thanks to brand name.

The hilarious part is how it was Baldur's Gate that made rpg explode here. Everybody tried 3e when it came out. Then abandoned it and moved to better systems.

>>54461755
>That doesn't change the variance of your roll, it shifts the expected value.

You don't really get it. In binary pass/fail systems, reliability and consistency are not a question of how often a particular set of numbers appear, but how reliably someone passes or fails. That is far more dependent on the target numbers that are being assigned, and the question of "How reliable should something be?" is always something that is affected by taste and perception, meaning its better to make the target numbers easy to adjust and modify than it is to try and establish a universal answer.

It's why a common complaint about systems like GURPS and FATE is that the dice mechanics lead to boring and predictable results, and a GM has to go out of their way to make the dice mechanics exciting.

>>54461635
I am honestly starting to think that most of the self-proclaimed defenders of D&D only come into these threads to give D&D players a bad rep.

>>54461804
>Everybody tried 3e when it came out. Then abandoned it and moved to better systems.

I think that has less to do with quality and more to do with most D&D books never getting a translation for eastern european languages.

Not saying D&D is good, just that the reasons a game is popular or not has very little to do with its quality. We have a game that was very popular in the 90s-early 2000 which is absolute fucking schlock, worse than any edition of D&D I've ever seen/played, but it caught on because you didn't need to learn english for it.

>>54461712
You haven't shown any statistics that support your claims.

>>54461823
Yeah, I think so too. I'd be really surprised if this level of stubborn fanboyness wasn't some sort of troll tactic.

I mean, I know this type actually exists in certain fandoms, but what the fuck would it be doing on /tg/?

>>54461804
What's hilarious is that you probably don't even know about games like Das Schwarze Auge, yet still want to be taken seriously.

I get it. You hate D&D and want to pretend that D&D isn't popular throughout the world and that it must be something wrong with Americans.

But, the funny thing is that 5e is actually growing immensely in popularity worldwide, and when we want to talk about people moving to better systems, that is the one that is soon to hold a world wide majority, not simply a majority in America.

>>54461823
>>54461853

I honestly think that you trolls hate it when someone flattens you in an argument, so you try to lick each others wounds to feel better about yourselves.

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>>54461868

This is from the largest polish online store doing rpg's and board games.

Neuroshima is a shitty polish game.

>>54461727
In older editions, you stopped rolling for HP after like level 10 (IIRC) and something like an adult dragon would only be rocking like 100 HP overall, while rocking five attacks that could kill 1-2 party members minimum even on an average. This meant that generally, you weren't beating this thing in a slugfest so careful tactics were more effective, even the wisdom to know that some fights are better left avoided.

Nowadays though, that same adult dragon is rocking close to 200 HP by default, yet only deals like 14-17 damage per attack. At the level you fight one, even if the dragon focuses on one dude, the chances of it actually killing them is low since you get so much HP from HD+CON. This meant that generally, most encounters could be beaten by just rolling attack/damage every round and hoping the other dude runs out of HP first.

Because of this, combat becomes less engaging (as do martials) and spells that end combat in 1-3 turns become much stronger (as do casters).

>>54461868

https://leisuregames.com/collections/rpg?sort_by=best-selling

>>54461833
>most D&D books never getting a translation for eastern european languages.
During the 80's, D&D even got a Swedish translation. No one played it regardless.

>>54461833
>D&D books never getting a translation for eastern european languages

They were translated in eastern Europe.

>>54461948
>yet only deals like 14-17 damage per attack

With multiple attacks. A dragon dealing 50+ damage in a single round is actually lowballing it, especially considering one or two critical hits can skyrocket that damage into 100+, with even high con, high level martials having second thoughts after enduring a round like that.

Your math is basically fucked, and it reads like you've never actually played later editions enough to know just how off base you are.

>>54461962
How's Sweden eastern Europe though?

>>54461976

The core books, maybe.

The only (officially) available D&D here is 3.0 with the class option books (Sword & Fist and the like). Everything before/after is fan translations at best.

... that said, I guess I could be in an unlucky spot? Maybe the rest of EEU is swimming in tranlated D&D material.

>>54461814
As it turns out, "how often a particular set of numbers appear" does have a substantial effect on "how reliably someone passes or fails".
I have *specifically* considered the binary pass/fail chance.
With a d20 for a given target the modifier always gives a linear 5% (with a certain pass/fail at the ends).
I still think this scales flatly, and you'd have to do extra math (possibly hidden in pre-calculated tables) to make power and skill progress act nice.

>>54462034

Can't say about the rest but Poland gets everything translated.

>>54462034
>How's Sweden eastern Europe though?
It isn't. The point was that even a small country such as Sweden where a definitive majority of the population is fluent in English got a translation of the game, and it still didn't help its sales. And no, it wasn't because of a nonexistent RPG scene in Sweden either. RPGs were, and still are, huge there.

>>54462005
By level 14-16, when you're expected to fight these things, a martial could have more than enough HP to survive one round of taking 100+ damage, and that's if the dragon decides to personally fuck up a single dude as opposed to the entire party.

Meanwhile, you're talking about 3-6 dudes who can deal comparable damage on their own, fighting against a single creature whose defense favors the group heavily since eventually, you're going to end up hitting his AC based on the averages.

Not to mention, you can also pop heals to keep party members from falling unconscious, pop class specific abilities to increase DPS even more, load yourselves up with spells to make the dragon's attacks deal a fraction of the damage overall, or even hit him with a SoL/SoD spell that forces it to waste a few legendary resistances before hitting him with the big shit.

A slugfest is king in this scenario because at the end of the day, the action economy heavily favors the party.

>>54462045
Not that guy, but it really doesn't fucking matter how likely you are to get a 2 on a d20. What matters is how many numbers are above and below. For curves it also matters how _likely_ you are to get them, which just complicates math.

Curves aren't bad, but a system not using them has its advantages, such as simple math (the dice in 5e is still too big compared to the modifiers).

>>54462005
>A dragon dealing 50+ damage in a single round is actually lowballing it

An Adult Red's multi-attack has the average damage of 19+15+15. It is exactly... 49, and that's assuming they all hit, when the dragon has a good 25-30% miss chance on an armored+shielded martial (not counting magic items/class abilities that buff dodge).

The scary thing about it is the legendary actions, which, when trying to optimize single target damage, gets him 3x17 (3 tail attacks) on a target. This is about 51 HP. So in total the adult red's damage is exactly 100 a turn assuming everything hits and the target doesn't have damage resistances from being a barbarian, for example.

>>54462045
>As it turns out, "how often a particular set of numbers appear" does have a substantial effect on "how reliably someone passes or fails".

Nowhere to the degree that the target number does, to a point where your argument is largely rendered moot.

>I still think this scales flatly, and you'd have to do extra math (possibly hidden in pre-calculated tables) to make power and skill progress act nice.

It's considerably easier to do than trying to manipulate a curved probability, which is a major weakness of curved probabilities. The d20 is considerably more versatile in this regard, because it can be made to be more or less flat with barebones understanding of probability, while trying to do the same with 4d3 or 3d6 is considerably harder to untangle.

Out of the box, without doing anything and ignoring anything like target numbers or modifiers, yes, a curved probability provides more consistent results. But, that's not what we're discussing, and with the fact that we're discussing roleplaying games where consistent results are not always desirable, having a more adaptable dice mechanic that can be more or less swingy as the need arises is generally preferable to a set of dice that struggles to work outside of a valley set by its own curve.

>>54462163
mews road, right, fogot to mention, a 16th level fighter already has 100HP with exactly 0 from CON (10 for first level, 15x6=90 from the next 15)

Even if he's only 13 (which makes the adult red a deadly challenge) he has 82, meaning that if a dragon misses an attack (of which he makes 6) and/or rolls badly on damage he's going to survive.

And this was a 0 CON fighter. Who the hell makes a 0 CON fighter? No buffs either.

Worse, when he does fall, he's going to be picked up by a bonus action.

>>54460855
nope. it's probably the #2 fantasy RPG in Germany but Shadowrun and DSA are very likely ranking higher.

>>54460899
that D&D generally makes the top 5 is more believable, yes.

>>54461481
>It's by far the most common rpg system in Germany or Poland.
hell, no. again, DSA and then probably Shadowrun are most popular here. CoC also has a sizeable following. for fantasy there is also the german Midgard RPG. also probably more popular than the legacy (but superior) WFRP.

>>54461883
>someone flattens you in an argument,
I am always amused when you claim that you have thrashed someone's argument when you have done nothing like that outside of your own propaganda.

>>54461883
Ah yes, nobody ever expects the "shits self and run away" style. Almost 100% effective since most people won't attack who smells of month old egg roll.

>>54459054
Never once said alleged, D&D does have issues.

>linear fighter, quadratic wizard
>not vague as hell
Jesus Christ I sure hope you're just pretending to be this retarded.

>>54464817
>linear fighter quadratic wizard
>vague as hell
It's a relatively old and well established term for the issue that a wizard's power increases faster per level than a fighter's power.

>>54463116
I'm always amused when trolls think they haven't been obliterated, and are dumb enough to continue to try to perform damage control.

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I'm not sure the thread ever started in a good place, but this is something else.

>>54465116
>Everyone's a troll except me.
Why are you even here?

>>54466062
>a few trolls in a troll thread are upset

Awwww, poor baby.

>>54466155
I'm not upset, I'm just puzzled that someone would waste their time staying somewhere where "trolls" are in great number.

Someone might even suspect that you enjoy being around trolls more than you enjoy being around genuine discussion.

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>>54466231
>I'm not upset,

>proceeds to show how upset he is

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>>54466274
Whatever you say man.

>>54466325
>this upset

I love how easy it is to rile up trolls.

>>54438489
>Americans are so stupid and can't comprehend roleplaying
>Here play some REAL rpgs like Das Schwartzer Autist or World of Darkness (Made in USA).

>>54443842
Yours isn't?

>>54461689
>Class vs classless is a matter of preference
He didn't mention class vs classless. He was talking about D&D's level system where you are handed large packages of abilities and upgrades every once in a while rather than gradually get better.

>The DMG does have options for combat-light campaigns
And the only thing on the character sheet which isn't combat related is still the skill list, which in 5E, is entirely predetermined by your class and where all your skills increase by a single point evey fourth level with you having no say at all into what your character is actually good at.

>But doing so will make roll results more predictable and less swingy.
So? The fact that the d20 is swingy is the criticism.

>>54468621
I'm not the fan-troll you are replying to, but I feel your points are a bit off.

>He didn't mention class vs classless. He was talking about D&D's level system where you are handed large packages of abilities and upgrades every once in a while rather than gradually get better.

This is intentional, there's a small jump in power every tier of play. Otherwise it's pretty linear though (and even between tiers the jumps aren't that big). The only outliers are the ribbon abilities, i.e. the non-combat stuff that doesn't exist.

>And the only thing on the character sheet which isn't combat related is still the skill list, which in 5E, is entirely predetermined by your class and where all your skills increase by a single point evey fourth level with you having no say at all into what your character is actually good at.

Case in point, while martials are yet again screwed over and can only rely on skills, magic users still retain a fair bit of utility, it's just not in the class itself but the spell selection.

Also, skills are decided by your class (usually has a wide selection), your background and your race, and you can gain more with training. "Can't decide what a character is good at" is a fucking ridiculous claim when you can decide what class/background/race he is, and what skills he exactly picks up from that combination.

>So? The fact that the d20 is swingy is the criticism.

d20 is linear. As long as the bonuses are appropriate to the die, it is no more swingy than any other linear die, be it a d6 or a d%. The reason skill use is swingy (for low level characters without expertise) is because skill bonuses are about half as big as they should be compared to the DCs, and the stupid insistence to use contest rolls in an otherwise linear system. Also, crits/botches, but again, that's a system issue not something inherent to the dice.

>>54438323
>Cultural inertia

>>54462118
One of the biggest differences I have noticed between US and Swedish role-playing in particular is that in the US it seems to be something that only socially awkward dorks do, while back in Sweden it was something that everyone did. Even the cool kids.

>>54442994
There's a chink in that armor.

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>>54444401

>>54443903
>i need rules to act

Jesus wept, what the hell is wrong with people like you? DnD exists to provide rules for making combat a thing--you can just pretend the fucking rest. You know, theater of the mind and shit? LIKE WHAT ROLE PLAYING IS ALL ABOUT???

You only need rules for combat and skill checks. If you *need* rules to codify how to pretend to be someone or something else, you also need a heavy dose of lead to the brain.

>>54438323
Eh, i still like it

>>54438323
>fills the character sheet with numbers that mean nothing but are there because they always were
Such as?
>filled with archaic mechanics that the rest of the industry abandoned decades ago.
Such as? The biggest non-DnD and non-DnD ripoff systems are not even fantasy games. And the entirety of the "rest of the industry" has like 30% of the market share at most
>plays like, and is written to be, a war-game where your army is reduced to a single guy
Hasn't been true, even in principle (you clearly don't know what you're talking about) since 3e when the core mechanics were completely rewritten, and all editions prior and following 3e have been better
anyways

>>54442884
Cute

>>54469012
>not something inherent to the dice
No one said it was.

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>>54469457
>Hasn't been true, even in principle (you clearly don't know what you're talking about) since 3e

>>54469548
Do yourself a favor and read this
https://muleabides.wordpress.com/2010/03/05/dd-was-a-wargame-i-do-not-think-it-means-what-you-think-it-means/

>>54460366
>Playing "Mother, May I?" with your abilities is not the same as having actual mechanical depth.

Found the simulatautist.

>>54469548
>name, class, background, race, alignment and current EXP are a combat focussed part of DnD
>personality traits are a combat focussed part of DnD
>bonds are a combat focussed part of DnD
>ideals are a combat focussed part of DnD
>flaws are a combat focussed part of DnD
>features and traits are a combat focussed part of DnD
>other proficiencies and languages are a combat focussed part of DnD
>equipment is a combat focussed part of DnD


You fail even at pretending to be retarded, because doing it this shittily is itself retarded.

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Should we go back to knights?

>>54443903
>Skyrim the Post
Also
>WHY IS THE 40 YEAR OLD CREATOR OF A GENRE OF GAMES USING OLD MECHANICS? REEEEEEEE
Ever heard of "play something else" if you're too much of a scrub?

>>54469607
In a game where every action is resolved through "Mother, May I?" anything you do is dependent on the whims of the DM more than any skill on the player's part.

I've seen both sides of the equation. I've seen games where players couldn't do anything without the DM trying to stop them in every way they could think of (including threatening to alter the rules for "balance") and I've been in games where one could kill gods because the DM allowed a player to roll for "Le ebin NAT 20 xD."

I don't know if I'd be a simulationist or a gamist or whatever the fuck, but I'd rather play in a game knowing that I won due to careful consideration of my abilities in relation to the obstacle standing in my way than winning because the DM liked me as a person and thought that my character's actions were amusing enough warrant a roll, even though it shouldn't have technically flew due to the context of the situation.

>>54470443
You just played with bad DMs. Older editions of D&D had far slimmer rules and required much more DM fiat, but it usually boiled down to "use common sense", "roll me a d6 and add x" or "do a saving throw vs x". It worked fine as long as the DM wasn't a dickhead

>>54442948
Just FYI since I've seen this typo twice in your filenames now...

It's "arctic," not "artic."

>>54470549
>You just played with bad DMs.
>It worked fine as long as the DM wasn't a dickhead
and the unfortunate reality is that most DMs are terrible, it's why most people generally only play with friends or co-workers who they can stand to be around for over 4 hours at a time.

In most cases, it's better to have clearly defined rules/limits than not, just so you have something to protect you and keep things relatively grounded.

>>54469654
my nigga knight anon, please dont change. You're so pure, you're a bastion of light.

>>54470443
I've seen some of this too.

I prefer games where the rules are clear enough that the dms job is the campaign, not to fill in the large gaps in the rules.

One of the worst parts of 5e is the shortage of codified DC benchmarks.

Having such codified dcs is one of the best things about 3.5/pathfinder.

>>54438489
O B S E S S E D

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Congratulations. You've managed to pull together the same tepid, nit-picked arguments as thousands, if not millions of other people. You have passed the test, the crown is yours. The strike team that has been waiting to hear you make any dissident remarks about the world's most famous RPG has been called off. You're free. You have been released. You need never play a game of Dungeons and Dragons, nor any other RPG as long as you live.
Enjoy it.

>>54471803
If only it were that easy...

>>54442748
Nightcore forever, sped up pop is my bag.

>>54442455
Aasimar are good for high-magic/high-divinity settings. I'm playing an Aasimar cleric in a setting where we're literally interacting with an entire pantheon of gods on a regular basis and it adds some fun flavor in the form of my char trying to leverage his divine heritage for boons/favors.

>>54438323
And that is the way we like it!