>claim to be the most loyal Primarch, putting his father's

Alpharius will return and finish the job.

>>54163831

Only Alpharius can save us now.

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>>54163801

Are you trying to say Chaos was right all along? Because that seems reaching.

>>54163801
I hope the Lion is the next loyalist Primarch. I can see the two squaring off both building and consolidating their own power.
The Dark Angels are also the only other legion that have a power base close to that of the Ultras.
Despite Khan being my favourite loyalist if he came back he'd take one look at the state of the Imperium then fuck off again.

>>54163801
The new fluff is stupid. So very, very stupid.

>Roboute Guilliman's new book on how to govern properly and stop being a corrupt shitshow of an Imperium.
>Lesson one: Completely ignore everything I said about decentralizing power the last time I wrote one of these.

>>54163801
>Opinions cannot change after seeing their implementation over 10,000 years

>>54163801
The Codex was a mistake, Rowboat even admits it, or at least he just ignores it when he thinks he needs to ignore it and if anybody complains he tells them to shove it up their ass.

But yes, we know that he wasn't the most loyal Primarch. That he goes out of his way to hide references to his Second Imperium (and admits it) is evidence enough of that, assuming the very existence of Dorn and the Lion doesn't prove he wasn't most loyal.

>>54164247
No I agree Anon it would be much better if he just left everything to keep going to shit.

>>54164247
>Same speed ahead Kiff!

Please save us Sanguinius!

>>54164296

The things I mentioned dod not happen after Gulliman's resurection. He did that right after the Heresy ended.

>>54163801
The emperors vision was a united, atheist humanity living in a galaxy without aliens.
Things have changed.

The edict was clearly not fit for purpose even during the heresy. The traitors utilised forces that had to be combated by psychology power. The emperor founding the grey knights proves his change of heart.

Guilliman said a soldier should use his initiative as well as the rules of the codex so that when a problem arose that wasn't covered they could improvise.

The imperium stands on the brink of annihilation. Desperate times call for desperate measures. I'm sure guilliman is aware of his hypocrisy but weighed against the future of mankind he will comprise his ideals.

>>54164427
>psychology power
Fucking autocorrect. Unless this is the origin of the Freud marines.

>>54163801

couldn't gw just let him rest in peace sweet prince?

If they need to do Primarchs than just add them to 30k and let every marinelet player throw money at a 30k army and make the poorfags REEEEEEE

>>54165034

Totally agree. Primarchs are what makes HH what it is, but they ruin 40k.

>>54165034
They should've brought back the Lion.

A paranoid and haughty but brilliant cunt who consorts with xenos and uses all kinds of forbidden tech is much more interesting than Emperor but weaker.

>>54165184
The Lion is much more like the Emperor than Guilliman.
Bobby G is too nice.

>>54164247
No no, you don't get the Codex Astartes.
It doesn't say: You shall not centralize power It says: YOU, YES YOU, MOTHERFUCKER, I KNOW YOU ARE READING THIS shall not centralize power. It says nothing about: Guilliman shall not centralize power.

>>54165184
>consorts with xenos and uses all kinds of forbidden tech
This is what Roboute does.

>>54163801
>>claim to be the most loyal Primarch, putting his father's vision of Imperium before anything else

Wrong. Guilliman is more loyal to the dream than the man. A united and prosperous galaxy of mankind is more important to him than the Emperor's autism.

>>first thing he does is gather ALL the Ultramarines second founding chapters together, forming a Legion in everything but a name

The Codex Astartes never forbids co-operation between chapters. It just removes the absolute authority of a strict command chain. Thus the Marines will work together to achieve a righteous goal, but not be fettered by duty to follow a corrupt leader en-mass.

>>54163801
>Meet Lord Hypocrite, new master of the Imperium.

Yeah, because rules should never change once their made. So says some neckbeard off the internet.

Also, my understanding of the librarius is that they maintane knowledge on fighting psychers, which the chapters would be hamstrung without. The edict of Nikea is probably referring to things like, i dunno, a whole planet of psychers.

>>54163831
Guilliman is Alpharius

>>54165695
Exactly, but it's OOC for him.

The Lion would have made more sense, plus they didn't need all those ass pulls

>>54165710
>It just removes the absolute authority of a strict command chain.
Except primarch

>>54165710

DIvision into chapters was meant so that no one man can lead a Legion. Gulliman divided his legion into chapters bearing different names, then took them all under his supreme command and lead them against the Night Lords. I don't see a difference between that and actually leading a Legion.

>>54165735
Nikean Edict meant that the Legiones Astartes, beyond the use of Navigators and Astropaths, would no longer employ psykers.

Saying that it no longer applied after the Heresy because there ware no more Legiones Astartes only mount Gulliman's hypocrisy count.

>>54166042
Because it was for a single operation. Chapters regularly work together on engagements, doesn't mean they're breaking the codex.

And Nikea was abandoned because psykers are needed to fight daemons and chaos.

This is no different than the ban on chemical weapons getting lifted if we were attacked by aliens.

>>54165989
Nope, even Primarch.


>>54166042
>I don't see a difference between that and actually leading a Legion.

The Chapter's agreed to follow him for that mission. Each chapter remained autonomous and could do what they wished. Nothing forbids chapters cooperating, it just means that they won't cooperate if the leader is judged unsuitable.

>>54166312

>Nothing forbids chapters cooperating, it just means that they won't cooperate if the leader is judged unsuitable.

That makes Lugft Huron a rightful leader of the Badabian separatists, at least according to the Codex.

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>>54163801
>Only has a single aquila in his armor

His faith and conviction was always lacking!.

>>54165850
Hivemind

>>54166353
Nope, he cannot lead anything but his own chapter. Other chapters did decide to back him, but he could lead them only so far as they allowed themselves to be lead, he had no official power over them.

>>54166353
The problem wasn't Huron working with the other chapters, it was him rebelling

>>54166434

He took supreme command over more than one chapter and then rebelled. Proving that, in general, what is written in the Codex about "never again one man shall..." and why is right. Yet Gulliman, the author of the book, did exactly that.

>>54166495
Desperate times call for desperate measures.

See: the role of dictator in ancient Rome

>>54166549

True that. But wouldn't that be silly if Marius would say "we should NEVER have one man in charge of everything in Rome!" and then proceed to be the one man in charge of everything in Rome?

>>54163801
Can someone help a newfag out here and tell me where in the fluff guilliman goes off to fight the night lords on tsagualsa?

>>54166616
Night lords trilogy, by ADB.

>>54166590
Well, when he wrote the codex life was pretty comfy; no tyranids, tau or necrons, traitors rotting in the eye, corruption hadn't spread as much through the system.

Now is a different story.

Though I'm sure if one of his brothers returned there would be serious reckoning. I particularly like Abnett's take on Guilly, In that he's subconsciously power hungry and an empire builder at heart, even though he denies this. Thus, even if the current danger passed he'd cling onto his throne.

>>54166590
>But wouldn't that be silly if Marius would say "we should NEVER have one man in charge of everything in Rome!" and then proceed to be the one man in charge of everything in Rome?

No, not if the circumstances changed drastically.

>>54163801

>spotted the Lorgar cry baby

>>54164096
After the whole Cypher being the good guy? The lion is probably a traitor, m8

>>54167501
You dumb. For real.

>>54167501
Loyalty is its own reward, chaosfag.

>>54164439
>Your choice of weapon is illuminating, Xeno. An overlarge power sword? Hm. Tell me about your relationship with your mother.

>>54163801
I can read the words you're saying, but all I'm getting from them is "Matt Ward". They make sense separately, but when strung together they turn into that. I don't know what's happening.

>>54164096
Lion was a traitor

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>AHHHH SAVE ME LEMAN

>>54163801
Like father, like son

>>54168080
>not shown: Russ getting BTFO by Horus at Yarant

>>54163801
What are the chances of Guilliman falling to Chaos, going full Justice Lords on the Imperium and kicking off a new heresy? Cause that sounds neat.

>>54163801
>descends upon Night Lords on Tsagualsa.
you need to stop reading edgy dembsy bowden trash books.
All he ever do is tread and suck on the magnificence that was Lord of the night.

>>54164427
>a united, atheist humanity living in
it was doomed to fail from the beggining. Fucking horus heresy books ruining shit.
40K is nothing without it's dogma.

>>54168080
>I need help in this fight. Better call for the guy who doesn't win fights.

You call for Russ when you want talk. You call for Lion when you want victory.

>>54170324
Wow youre retarded.

>Implying the Eldar didn't mind-wipe Rowbout when they help Cawl bring him back to life.

Considering the sheer number of Eldar "just as planned" types that were on site for the resurrection of Guiliman would you really be shocked if someone like Eldrad didn't do some psyker trickery as he's coming back to life?

Hell Guiliman doesn't even have the anti-psyker defenses necessary.

>>54170386
Lion got BTFO for 10000 years by a non Astartes

>>54164297

Ignoring the codex when it doesn't work or apply was how it was originally intended to be used anyway. He's using it how he always intended it to be used. Did you think Ultra McWhoTheFuckIsThisFaggot from Macragge Macaroni Gluers chapter, 10th Company knows how to use the codex better than its fucking creator?

>>54170660
And yet he still got the job done and won the fight. When can you ever say that about Russ?

>>54163801
He shares his name with the former master of the Imperium

>>54163831
Fulgrim will return and finish the job

ftfy

>>54171179
Fulgrim is too busy farting himself into ecstasy to do shit, per Dark Imperium

>>54171098
Prospero?

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>>54171179
Fulgrim doesn't do jobs. He does art.

>>54172279
>backed by golden boys and pariah bitches
>still barely pulled it off
l m a o

>>54166590
if marius was magically teleported into 4th century AC Rome? Guilliman was Lord Commander of the Imperium and never lost his rank, he never forfeit his authority.

It seems to me that people like to misinterpret the codex. It doesn't drastically change the power balance in the imperium, the Adeptus Astartes combined are just as powerful as the Legions were, but the Codex basically gave every Chapter Master authority over his Chapter, even when Chapters are gathered under central command for a large scale operation, the Chapters themself are individually loyal to the Imperium first, and have no alleigeances in between. This way every chapter that goes traitor does so by it's own volition, and isn't goose stepped into it by a Primarch Figure.

>>54166312
Then how come the Last Wall operation was considered heresy?

>>54172279
No, not at all.

>"Russ, I want you to arrest Magnus. Take some of my best soldiers, these anti-Psyker girls, and your entire legion. That should be enough help to get the job done."
>"Kill Magnus in a one-on-one fight got it boss AWOOOOOOOOO~"
>Barely survives the fight. Would have been killed outright if his girlfriend hadn't gave her life to stop a killing blow. His girlfriend is a wolf.
>Magnus escapes, falls to Chaos, and shatters into different physical beings

End result: Russ failed so badly at killing someone that more versions of that person were created by the attempt. And that's his greatest "victory".

>>54172797
*By the high lords.

Not by Guilliman

>>54172844
>AWOOOO
>gf is a wolf
literally /fur/

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>>54164371
By far the best among them.

>>54172844
imagine being the emperor
>Ah, my noble son Russ, did you bring back Magnus to me so we can sort this mess out?
>bombed the planet
>would've bombed Magnus to death as well if it wasn't for the kine shield
>got a 3rd of his legion slaughtered
>got rekt
>got his wolves rekt
>Magnus escaped and is now most likely with Horus
>on the way back somehow got ambushed by Alpha Legion

>>54172990
Russ will return as a Slanneshi Daemon. Screencap this.

>>54164247
did you even read dark imperium ?
he states that a) he felt it was wrong for spehs mehreens to rule the imperium of man
b) he forgot that mankind is just as divisive and power hungry as the primarchs where
he actually states he fucked up with his old views and realized he's made a mistake
people are allowed to realize their mistakes, it's called character development

>>54172279
>arrest this one person and bring him here for trial
>starts by orbital bombarding the whole planet
he's a genuine retard, russ apologists are the worst loyalists players, that's coming from a loyalist

>>54166678

He was intended to be the Emperor's statesman. We have no idea what role the Emperor was planning to take after the Webway project was completed and the next evolution of humanity arrived.

>>54164427

>We'll hate him because he can take it

Robooty Girlyman confirmed for Batman

>>54163801
>shit on Edict of Nikea and found Librariums as key parts of chapter structure in Codex Astartes
Someone had to. After Codex Grey Knights 5e forced Nikaea into a retardfest, one of the Primarchs had to unfuck it so that GW didn't have to discontinue an entire class of spehs mehreen model.

>>54166103
>And Nikea was abandoned because psykers are needed to fight daemons and chaos.
GEE, IT'S ALMOST AS IF MAGNUS WAS RIGHT

>>54174619
>people take painkillers when they're in pain
>THEREFORE IT'S OKAY TO TAKE THEM ALL DAY EVERYDAY
t. you

>>54172320
M8... He throughly wrecked the 1k Sons, this is not even debatable. I mean he beat Magnus so hard his sould broke into dozens of shards

>>54174735
And he lost a 3rd of his legions, and that's with surprise on his side and the custodes and the SoS.

Magnus was a retard but Russ was as well

>>54173187
So wrong my samefagging friend he tried speaking to Magus through a man who everyone including Valdor, Amon, Typhon, Fulgrim and Askellom believed to be a hidden one. He pleaded with Magnus to surrender peacefully and got no answer so he attacked.

Also the Emperor clearly wanted Magnus dead, if he wanted him apprehended he would have sent someone other than his appointed executioner.

>>54174780
Simply not true. Every source describes Space Wolves losses as moderate, meanwhile 9/10ths of Magnus' legion were killed. A massive victory for Russ amyway you look at it.

>>54174846
>massive victory
>drives a loyal son into the hands of the enemy and wastes the Emperor's valuable manpower when he could've just life eater'd them

Yifffags are as bad as Magnusfags

>>54163801
>>claim to be the most loyal Primarch, putting his father's vision of Imperium before anything else
Inaccurate. What Guilliman is loyal to is is father's end vision of a golden age for humanity, free from the terrors of daemon and xenos. He's just more flexible than his old man was about how to get there, able to recognize mistakes whether his father's or his own and willing to try correcting them. If he was as autistic as the Emperor he'd be fedora-tipping the Ecclesiarchy like daddy did Lorgar, but Guilliman's figured out that policy was retarded.

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>>54163801
Ya'll jealous that he's tapping this sweeeeet ass while ruling the imperium and having new toys from his homie cawl, meanwhile armless the harmless throws a bitch fit and is only saved by the soon to be fired "lore" writers along the vagina faced commies and the other third rate factions.
The second coming of the imperium can`t happen fast enough!

>>54174879
Thats dumb logic and some seriojsly massive reaching. Thats like saying Ferrus could have just life eatered Isstvan or Horus could have done to Terra.

>>54174916
Well yeah, they could've.

They're retards.

What else is new?

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>>54164096
>I can see the two squaring off both building and consolidating their own power.

I need it in my life. Lion and Russ when he comes back putting aside their differences to get things done would be amazing.

So....is Bobby G loyal to the Emperor or the Imperium?

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>>54174963
I think he's loyal to the idea of the Emperor, but loyal to the Imperium the Emperor was trying to make first.

He and the Emperor both seem like "at any cost" sort of dudes and I think, at least to Rowboat in the way he's been written, he's trying to be faithful to the Emperor's ultimate goal.

>>54174941
Neutral observer to your dumb argument, but yeah what a great story it would have been if instead of a galaxy shattering rebellion ended in 10 minutes with a virus bombing. Delete your 4chan account and never post here again.

>>54175001
>durr do u kno it is a feekshunal universe?!?!?!

Yeah no shit retard, next thing you'll be telling me that there ain't no warp or space elves either.

>>54164297
>the very existence of Dorn
He was a much more interesting character when he was just a centurion...

>>54175023
Then what the fuck point were you trying to make jackass?

>>54175040
That GW were retarded for giving the factions such powerful weapons?

If Harry Potter knew a spell which would fuck up Voldy in an instant and didn't use it that's a glaring plothole

>>54164297
>Lion
>loyal

Pick one. Even Malcador had his doubts about the Lion and lets not forget Marines take after their Primarch and the Dark Angels had some very oppurtuneistic Marines

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>>54175023
>>54175040
Holy shit this thread is golden. It's like two retards in a playground slapfight

So, now that Guilliman is the head honcho of the Imperium, is life better in the Imperium of Man nowadays?

How about spreading some of that Ultramar utopia to the rest of the Imperium, hmm?

>>54175080
>Even Malcador had his doubts about the Lion
Which the Emperor told him to set aside, calling him "the most loyal of sons"

>>54175102
Wrong. He actually said Russ was the most loyal in that conversation

>>54175099
He's busy fucking

>>54175102
I think there's some things we can kind of suss out about all this. Cypher was always on the side of the DA's, just not obviously, in the books he even helps them stop a huge warp catastrophe in the ruins of Caliban by turning over members of the Fallen. Azrael and Sapphon are even aware that he is probably more than what he seems, on autistic retards Belial and Asmodai try to merk him.

Plus it's in his genes to be cautious, so it makes sense he'd seems suspicious.

And I'm not sure GW would do that. It'd piss off a portion of the playerbase and fuck with the narrative.

I could totally be wrong, but that's just my read of it.

>>54175219
Is Cypher Zaherial or whatever his name was? Havent read any DA HH books after the one where Lion autistically gives Pert those guns

>>54175349
He is now, but seeing as it's a title he might not be the Cypher of 40k

>>54175349
He was at one point and is probably the first, but like >>54175360 said and going off of some bits of Thorpes trilogy, it's implied that the title has been carried a couple of times, or at least that some Fallen are confused by their use of just the title.

It's vague, but I think Cypher is like Moloch, a title rather than a person and that title carries a goal with it.

>>54175360
Oh snap, he got named Cypher? Why is he not smashing Luther's face in, he knows something is fishy

>>54175422
>Moloch

Like the planet? Explain

>>54175427
Because he has a grudge against the Imperials generally because they're colonizing Caliban and the Lion specifically for killing Nemiel, so for now they're working together

>>54175447
*Moloc
My bad.

>>54175470
Oh, got you pham. I forgot that that darth vader mother fucker died like 9 times

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>>54173127

>>54170386
When Guilliman and the Lion fought Batman, the Lion got bitchslapped whilst Guilliman held his own.

The Lion is a chump.

>>54173127
He also calls the Primaris™ Spehs™ Muhreens™ 'Cawl's abominations' so it sounds like he considers pretty much everything he did 10,000 years ago to be a fuck up.

>>54175620
Why did he call them that?

>>54175590
When the God's of chaos failed to destroy the emperor with horus and turned to their plan two, they didnt corrupt ultramar, they corrupted Caliban.

Even the chaos god's knew the Lion mattered more then ultrafag.

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>>54175590
>>this
Though to be fair all the Primarch power levels are inconsistent as fuck

>>54175664
>Primarch power levels are inconsistent as fuck
Consider the Lion's also been said to be the best swordsman out of them all? I'd say so.

>>54175709
best swordsman =/= best warrior.

>>54175709
That doesnt mean hes the best warrior. Also I got Fulgrim wrecking him in a fight. I would love to see those two traitors fight each other, but since they are both raging faggots they'll probably just fuckeach other

>>54175663
Or just more easily corruptable due to his massive arrogance?

Kor Phaeron tried to corrupt Girlyman at Calth using the same technique that turned Horus, it didn't stick.

>>54175709
>>A primarch that just spent months being hunted non-stop through the DA flagship, not had a moments rest after breaking into the Ultramarines main fort, dueled a (fucking badass) Ultramarine chapter master and is known for hit and run tactics not stand up duels
>>Two of the best duelist primarchs in prime condition with all their wargear --> can hardly land a blow on the fucker

>>54173063
If he ever gets a Model in 30K, I want the armor to look like that.

>>54175709
Swordsmanship doesn't neccesarily mean you're a formidable fighter, it's a single discipline. Guilliman's whole thing is analysing his opponent's techniques mid-fight and adapting in the same way the Custodes do.

Horus rates him as one of the best fighters amongst the Primarchs in Vengeful Spirit, not on his or Sanguinius' level but equal to a lot of the other 'fighter' Primarchs despite his reputation of being a pencil pusher.

>>54175709
The Lion only wins fights by sucker punching/stabbing people

>>54175842
>>Kor Phaeron tried to corrupt Girlyman at Calth using the same technique that turned Horus, it didn't stick.

Because Lorgar wanted Gully to live, if Gully died the entire ultramarine legion wouldn't have squatted on Imperium Secundus, basically removing them from the war.

The Dark Angels were the second best legion after Horus, thats just the way it went. Why go for third place when you could go for second, Gully did all the damage chaos needed while he was alive.

>>54175891
>ambush tactics
Reminder that whenever there was a straight duel Konrad got rekt

>>54175906
Sangy a shit. Horus, Cruze, Russ or Angron would beat him.

>>54175891
Curze is definately one of the more duelist-capable Primarchs, coupled with his precognitive abilities would make him very hard to fight mano a mano.

I don't think the fact he'd been hunted on the DA flagship for months really means he'd be fatigued, he was having the time of his life and Primarchs recover pretty much instantly.

>>54175951
E T E R N I T Y G A T E

>>54175975
He was fighting a horde of demons and traitor marines not the same as fighting a primarch. Even Lorgar wrecked marines when he fought them

Horus, Sanguinius, and Angron are objectively A tier based on Lorgar's "I see the goddamn threads of fate" bullshit.

Lion, Fulgrim, Russ are B Tier

the rest are all around the same skill level, except for Magnus and Lorgar, and Magnus is only on the bottom because we are not counting his psychic powers, in which case he becomes A tier.

>>54176003
He was fighting everyone, it's not like Angron or the rest didn't try to breach, it's just that Sangy was too good.

Lorgar himself says that he'll be unbeatable at the Siege

>>54175932
>Ultramarines conquered more worlds than any other legion
>Defended a larger region than any other legion during the Heresy, against three traitor legions
>Didn't have a minor issue where 50% of their manpower declared for Horus
>Ultimately responsible for relieving the Siege of Terra and beginning the Scouring
>Dark Angels were second best legion after Horus

By what metric?

I never understood why the Emperor didn't just make new Primarchs when the 20 of them were scattered across the galaxy.

>>54176017
Horus is really nothing special. Even Corax was able to fight him competitively

>>54175951
Lorgar flat out said that only Horus or Angron could maybe kill sanguinius, based on fate itself. His entire motive for saving Angron from the Butcher's nails was to try to use Angron to kill off Sanguinius.

Sanguinius PROBABLY was the best fighter, the only time he really fights another primarch is Horus when he is powered by the 4 gods, and they constantly point out that is him at a super natural level.

>>54176030
And before anyone starts crying about Ultras only being good because theres a fuck ton of them remember they were a fuckhuge legion because when the brought a world into compliance they rebuilt it and drew new recruits from it, enabling them to actually grow

>>54176017
>Angron
>A Tier

He struggled against Russ, even with Russ pulling his punches, and even Horus and Sanguinius were wary of Russ. Guilliman should be in B Tier too.

>>54176017
Angron isn't A tier, the only thing he has going for him is basically retard strength, he has no skill like Sangy, Lion or Fulgrim.

If he was put against one of these he'd be dead

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>let me just rip apart a phantom titan with my hands

>>54176050
He was on a schedule. Faster to just collect the Primarchs as he went than create a whole new batch from scratch.

>>54176083
Guilliman managed to hold his own against Angron ffs
Didn't win of course but still impressive that he managed to survive at all

>>54176050
you saw how much shit 18 of them caused, now imagine 38

>>54176030
Before their numbers were ravaged in the Rangdan Xenocides, the heaviest fighting during the crusade, the Dark Angels were the most successful and powerful legion by far. Every tactic employed by the other legions and all new tech was given and masted by the Dark Angels first, its why they have all the different wings.

The Ultramarines had far less asked of them as the Dark Angels, who were always at the forfront of the crusade.

So they were the best legion, rivaled only by the Son's of Horus and the Emperor's Children in sheer quality and tactical use, they just never recovered from having to fight the most terrible campaigns of the crusade.

And gully didnt defend against three legions, the entire point was to keep him alive so he could cause Secundus, which delayed his forces until terra, he played into Lorgar's plans hook, line, and sinker.

>>54176118
Gulliman got wrecked by Angron and I say this as a guy who hates Angron

>>54176083
Even Angrons only friend Logar thinks that Russ beat Angron

>>54176050

Wasn't there some fluff about the Emperor stealing a tremendous amount of power from the Chaos Gods, so that he could become a god himself?

I'd imagine that the Emperor didn't have much power left to spare after creating 20 demi-gods.

>>54176193
Stop posting Lion. You're weird and no one likes you and thats just one of the reasons you were never seriously considered for Warmaster

>>54176207
He was weakened from fighting Lorgar, then Angron charged him and Lorgar joined in and he still managed to survive until Angron went daemon

>>54176207
Yeah but only after Lorgar turns him into a fucking demon primarch or whatever. Before that G was doing pretty good for a fucking politician with a sword

>>54176083
>>Struggled against Russ
>>Russ literally had to surround Angron with his marines because he couldn't actually beat Angron himself.
>>Got called out as a bitch and told to pull the trigger but chickened out because he had no authority since he was doing everything without the emperor's approval.

>>54176118
To be fair, he got train wrecked and his honor guard had to sacrifice themselves while he made is escape, probably would have died if Lorgar didnt begin Angron's Ascension.

>>54176231
poor ultra fag, remind us who has the best first company again? I'll give you a hint, they arent blue.

>>54176224

I think it was implied but they never said specifically what he did, other than the chaos gods are pissed at him for doing it.

>>54176253
Even Lorgar said Russ would have killed Angron when he called Angron out for being a dumbass hypocrite

>>54176250
From what I remember, Angronius was dying from the nails. Made him quite a bit weaker then he should have been.

The whole reason they were trying to demon prince him was so that they could have a chance of taking on Sanguinius at Terra.

>>54176267
>he thinks I'm a smurf

>>54176253
>didn't read till the end of the chapter

Russ jobbed so he could prove a point to Angron, who was too retarded to notice (not to mention he didn't have Emp's authority).

If they were really fighting Russ would have gone guns out

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>>54176193
>the heaviest fighting during the crusade
>implying

>>54176286
Did the nails actually make Annie weaker though? At the end of the day they're still making him fucking PMS rage so they shouldn't make him any worse at fighting. Whatever he loses in what little form he already had he would gain in strength
Fuck I dunno, trying to figure out the primarchs makes mah head hurt

>>54176253
Russ wasn't trying to kill Angron, Angron was trying to kill Russ though. Russ just wanted to prove a point, even Lorgar grasped this.

>>54176347
Angron is just too fucking stupid to grasp the concept of somebody making a point

>>54176342
Maybe no physically weaker but they certainly seem to stop him fighting intelligently, which is something like 50% of what made a lot of the primarchs so dangerous.

Angron with the nails is just raw fury, no technique, no strategy.

>>54176303
>>Killing Angron, but doing so allowing your own forces to be surrounded by world eaters and being utterly decimated.
>>"jobbing"

The whole point was that Russ could kill angron if he wanted, but the cost to his legion to actually go through with it was a cost he wasnt willing to actually take in the end.

Lorgar was right, Russ pulled off an incredibly well done ambush, but Angron was right that the only thing that matters is if your going to pull the trigger, and Russ didn't.

>>54176028
Sangy is like fighting Goku, you see him fighting from far away and you say fuuuuuuuuuuuuuk, and turn 180.

>>54176224
>>54176275

Primarchs were created from warp energy?!

Does that mean that Primarchs are actually daemons encased in flesh?

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>>54176267
White Scars here. Girlyman > Lionautist.

Also dickbike > riding around on a BFG mini.

>>54176318
The first legion tested all manners of warfare, even the Iron Warrior's trencher warfare. The only difference is they didnt cry about their sand castles.

>>54176393
But he would've done his job as executioner.

The WE were like a pack of dogs, if the alpha male died, they'd split into a hundred warbands and could be picked off one by one.

>>54176406
Something like that.

That's why whenever one of them gets killed his legion goes crazy

>>54176378
Angron was always just raw fury
It's what stops him being an A tier primarch
If he actually learned some skills to run alongside his strength he'd be unstoppable

>>54176406
Shhhh dont tell anyone

>>54176059
After Molech Horus was Emps tier.

>>54176393
If Russ was explicitly ordered to kill Angron he would have, he just wasnt going to make that huge of a decision on his own.

>>54176410
Get back to being irrelevant Khan, go surf a razorback or something.

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>>54176460
;__;

Next time you need a traitor advanced harried or a starport defended, do it yourself then! We'll be too busy having FUN on our AWESOME JET BIKES!

Far away from bullies!

>>54176224

He went to Molech, straight into the Warp Realm where Horus later had to endure some trails from the chaod gods. So it seems clear he had at least contact with them.

>>54176439
>>The WE were like a pack of dogs, if the alpha male died, they'd split into a hundred warbands and could be picked off one by one.

Actually numerous primarchs mention that If Angron died the World eaters would have become alot more useful as they wouldnt be following his dipshit leadership.

Angron dying would have been a good thing.

>>54176452
Yes, he has no agency. It's why Angron calls him a slave. Russ knew he should have killed him, was in the circumstance, but couldnt because he was too bound to the emperor's commands, which he was probably already breaking by diverting his legion to confront Angron.

>>54176460
>Reading Scars
>Heresy erupts
>Everyone picking sides and desperately gathering any allies to tip the balance
>Pretty much everyone forgets the Khan even exists and are genuinely surprised when he shows up

>>54176103

Man i cant take that guy serious any longer. The whole emo ark surrounding Unremembered Empire is just so poorly done. Shouldve never read that one...

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>>54176538

>>54176519
Slave, soldier.

Potato, tomato.

Russ was following orders, adhering to a strategy and goals. Angron and the World Eaters were basically just acting like CoD kiddies trying to improve their K/D ratio.

>>54176460
>shitting on one of the most based primarchs

Reminder that his verbal and physical beatdown of Morty was so epic Morty turned daemon because of how butthurt he was
>>54176519
>Actually numerous primarchs mention that If Angron died the World eaters would have become alot more useful as they wouldnt be following his dipshit leadership.
See: post heresy.

Angron ascends, WE are leaderless, Skalathrax happens, only time they're relevant ever again was when Angron reunited them to attack Armageddon

>>54176538
As much as /tg/ cries about their factions Ultra and Space Wolf HH centered stories are top tier tbqh. Starting to think /tg/ doesnt know what its talking about

>>54176572
>>Skalathrax happens

That was Kharn destroying two entire legions, both the World Eaters and Emperor's Children were decimated and scattered after that. The World Eaters functioned fine until then.

And the World Eaters followed Angron through the Dominion of Fire, in which 50,000 of them BTFO of imperial space for 200 years before returning to the eye.

Angron and his legion got shit done, more then any other primarch.

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>>54176193
>the heaviest fighting during the crusade

>>54176639
That was my point, without Angron to focus their rage they'll split into a dozen directions and be swatted down each in turn.

>Angron and his legion got shit done, more then any other primarch.
Lorgar and Hyperion say hi, sorry bout that blade :^)

>>54176406
>>54176439
>>54176443

Holy shit, the Emperor has his own demons, who'd have thought?

But if that were the case, then technically the Primarchs are immortal and can't be killed, since they would just reincarnate and reform back in the Warp.

Not only that, but actually dying and losing their mortal shell would make the Primarchs even more powerful since they wouldn't be limited by a human body anymore.

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>>54176618
Know No Fear remains my favourite HH novel.

Normally I can't stand Spehs Yiffs but Prospero Burns made the seem pretty cool by emphasing their Norse aspects and almost completely removing their wolf obsession. Plus I liked that it was from a regular human's perspective and the Astartes were shown as quite inhuman. Too many novels make them too...normal for my taste.

Still wish we'd get a least a couple of books focusing on the Imperial Army or Navy during the Heresy, I like Astartes/Primarchs more as scenery than point of view characters, I prefer to see how a regular human reacts to being around them, rather than hearing what Demigod #17 or Supersoldier #14634734 had for breakfast.

>>54176697
>But if that were the case, then technically the Primarchs are immortal and can't be killed, since they would just reincarnate and reform back in the Warp.
Basically, yes.

>Sanguinor
>that hint in Gathering Storm that the leader of the legion of the damned has "silver hands"

>>54176697
The Big E raises Manus' ghost to fight in the Webway against the daemon hordes during Master of Mankind.

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>>54176643
>Iron Warriors
>Fighting

More like dying.

>>54176643
>Invite it on yourself with a penchant for bloody attrition.
>Cry that no one likes you and you feel used.

>>54176697
> Primarchs are immortal and can't be killed.

Not unless you got Horus'ed

>>54176716
>silver hands

Damn i was hoping for iron hands

>>54176643
Killing a 10th of your legion doesnt count as heavy fighting...

>>54176732
It's how they win. Pile corpses until you can reach victory. Sort of like the IG but with more complaining.

>>54176771
ZappBranagan.jpg

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>>54176732
Hey remember that time Perturabo dug a big ditch and told Dorn he couldn't fill it with the bodies of his own dead?

And Dorn said fuck you, I'll fill it so full I can walk across the bodies, kick down the door to your house, and punch that smirk off your face?
And he did, except Perturabo wasn't in there and the house was a bomb?

>>54176813
Hey remember that time Perturabo accomplished anything? Neither do I.

>>54176853
who?

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>>54176813
Hey remember that time the Imperial Fists were marooned at Phall and didn't know that they were being set up for an ambush?

And Perturabo said Fucking finally I bet it's that faggot Sigismund commanding I'll get revenge for all those years of bullying,?

And he did, except it wasn't Sigismund and the bitter boys got rekt?

Has it ever occured to Chaos that killing all life in the galaxy would also mean that the Warp would cease to exist, meaning that that Chaos is essentially killing themselves?

>>54176867
Some unnamed comrade in arms.

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>>54176732

>>54176867
Reposting for old time's sake

"Ayyy Sanguinius, Uncle Mal here. Just checking in on some numbers, how many of your dudes are rolling with you right now?"
"Like 80,000 my man."
"In one fleet?! Wow, you're blowing my mind here, Gwinny. Where's the other 20K?"
"Well there's 50 on Baal, maybe another 50 dudes on honour postings here and there, the other 19,900 are split up over the 4,500 fleets."
"Gwin...that'd be like 4 and a half guys for each fleet."
"Mal, we took 250 fleets each"
"Oh right, gimme a sec...so you sent...79 guys to each of your fleets? 79?! That your lucky number or something?"
"Nah, I sent out 100-strong companies to keep the numbers straight and then we just ran out of Blood Angels, so the last expeditionary fleets under my purview don't have any marines in at all!"
"You absolute madman, Sanguinius. Are all your brothers doing this shit?"
"Bro, half of them don't even gaf about the fleets and are rolling balls deep"
"Then whose marines are spearheading the crusade?!"
"Perturabo, we make him do everything."
"Who?"

>>54170386
>glass jaw lion got btfo by non Astarte's possessed human that wasn't even back up by the big 4
Phew lad my as well kys

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>>54176813
I also remember when Perty outnumbered Dorn 3:1 and still couldnt break Terra.

Primarchwank was a mistake.

If it werent for Dantioch IW would be worthless

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>>54172844
>>54173068
T.thousand sons traitors

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>>54176884
You are just jelous that Perty has the best toys and are all hidden in his labyrinth, so nobody can touch them.

>>54176952
>>tfw a crippled old astartes is more badass and memorable than the primarch

>>54174619
Khan and Sangüinius were right, fucking Magnus was proposing daemon pacts as learning methods

>>54176994
Dantioch and Pollux are best bros

>>54176103
>didn't needed warp witchcraft to overpower witch Titans
>scrap them anyways barehanded
Fucking Magnus was a useless chump
>MUH psychic powers undo Titans
>Sangüinius proceeds to do it bare handed
>"see brother? You can do it as well I believe in you"
>REEEEEEE! WHY ARE YOU SO INTOLERANT MAGI IS A LONG SACRED ART WHY NOT DO IT LILKE THIS REEEEEEEE!
Truly Magnus was a pathetic primarch

>>54177113
The best part was that Sanguinius started the Liberarium in an attempt to legitimize the psykers and bring them under control. Khan thought it was pretty smart so he joined up. Magnus and the tsons joined simply because they wanted to look like they had control of their powers while they secretly did all that heretical shit.

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Anyone have the Fagnus version of this?

>>54177189
Yeah they ruined that shit forever, and let's not forget according tho inferno that initially the space wolves were avoiding killing civilians until the thousand sons started using them as puppets with sorcery they knew beforehand and ultimately forcing the SW to kill civilians on sight because if left unchecked the TS would go full jihad with them as disposable suicide units.

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>>54177236
Here, take it

>>54177376
>Orbital bombardment
>avoiding killing civilians

Sure Russ.

>>54165695
Yes, but the Lion was doing it back when it was noncompliance. And he didn't have Emps tell him "You go for it Lion, I've got some serious rotting to do."

>>54175102
>Emperor
>good at judging character

Pick one fggt

>>54165850
Or is he Omegon? Praetorian of Dumb settled the mindfuckery into an incredibly stupid piece of canon.

>>54178045
And last son of prospero ruined the whole subplot, so congrats French and Wraight, for ruining literally a decade of plotting for a cheap twist

>>54171643
If I slit a guy's throat like he's owes me for a ton of blow and the guy shakes it off because Slannesh has done a shit job making his claim good on the Eldar I'd say "Fuck it. I've got a planet of pleasure. Time to enjoy it." Besides, he did take a shot and came up short. I'd go for some R&R too if I knew I was going to end up jobbing for Emperor Junior.

>>54177998
Rowboat didn't ask dad permission to shag ynnari whores.

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>>54176937
>wasn't backed
He was quite literally entirely backed by the big four. Luther was the next chosen champion after Horus.

And just like Emps with Horus, Lion hesitated at the last second against his brother and was lowed instead for it. It was pottery.

>>54176716
>>that hint in Gathering Storm that the leader of the legion of the damned has "silver hands"
Which book was that in?

>>54175651
Real reason - Ignorant Author
rationalized reason - He was being sardonic about the HERESY meme which he hates

>>54176394
>see sanguinius
>fuck he looks mad
>do a 360 and walk away

>>54177376
Inferno says the exact opposite of that retard. Christ Yiffers are the worst.

t. An actual loyalist

>>54174735

>>Thousand Sons book describes how the Thousand Sons could have divined exactly where Russ's fleet would exit warp

>>The book acknowledges that they could just parked their fleet there and completely annihilate Russ's fleet piece meal as each ship arrived one after another.

>>Magnus not only tells them not to but purposely sabotages his own defenses.

>"Hyuck, Russ rekt them thousands sons"

No anon, Magnus killed his own legion, the book series directly points out that if he wanted the entire Space Wolf Legion never would have even made it to Prospero in the first place.

All of Russ's victories are only because other characters allowed him to get away with it. He is the most neutered character in the whole series.

>>54176103
That is utter Primarch wank of the highest order.

>>54179157
I really did hate how basically Prospero was just Magnus being a dumb ass.

If his logic was to sacrifce one legion to ensure that both weren't mutually destroyed by the other why didnt he just kill the wolves and go right for Horus, fucking unleash his sorcerers on him and cripple him at Istavan instead of killing his own, far more useful, legion.

>>54179309
Magnus wasnt expecting the Emperor to destroy Prospero. Russ just followed Horus's orders over the Emperors despite what Valdor wanted because he hated him.
He thought he could handle the punishment but at then end he decided it wasnt worth it and saved his legion.

>>54176030
>>Ultramarines conquered more worlds than any other legion
No, the Luna Wolves/Sons of Horus were solidly at the very top of the conquests, followed by Dark Angels. Ultras had the most worlds made compliant of any loyalist legion, but number of worlds isn't the same as number of conquests or number of victories.

>>54176572
>Reminder that his verbal and physical beatdown of Morty was so epic Morty turned daemon because of how butthurt he was
I like the Fulgrim burn better.

>I hear you do strange and unnatural things to your ships.
>Really? I hear you do strange and unnatural things to your warriors.

>>54179252
>primarch wank

Sanguinius has been doing rediculous DBZ tier shit since the era of Bill King when he literally lifted a Bloodthirster and broke it's back over his knee after fighting for days straight in the siege of Terra

In literally any other narrative Sanguinius would be the fucking protagonist

>>54174961
>Lion is Samurai Jack
>Russ is the Scotsman

>>54179448
VIKING (wolf) RHOONS LADDIE

Come to think of it Lion's autism is pretty close to Jacks

>>54179425
That doesnt make adding more BS on top ok.

>>54179494
All he did was punch it's head until it broke and then tank a psychic laser, I don't really see whats so weird about that considering he can fucking fly

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>>54176073
What? You mean he didn't draw all new recruits from some shitty diseased backwater planet out of retarded nostalgia and daddy angst? That's bullshit. Now excuse me while I breathe poison farts and get bullied by my second-in-command.

>>54179510
Because its a fucking titan. Just seems so retarded to have that shit happen when it adds nothing to the story.

>>54179519
>get bullied by my second-in-command.
At this point i'm half certain this is Mortarion's fetish. Literally Daemon Prince Primarch and Typhus is hanging around telling him what a loser he is

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>>54167501

>the guy who couldn't be corrupted by a daemon prince is a chaos traitor

I want chaosfags to fuck off forever

>>54179578
Lion probably did fall to chaos but only after seeing what huge faggots his legion turned into without him.

>>54179596

nope

>>54179596
Yeah cause the Lion would hate all that secretive and treacherous consolidation of power along with legion building and putting themselves first.

>>54168080
Kor's pencil thin pornostache has always made me feel uncomfortable.

>>54176994
Is there a single non-loyalist IW from any source who isn't shit?

>>54179567
Why does Mortarion get bullied so much? Slapped around on Barbarus. Slapped around by the Khan. Draigo shit fury all over him and carved initials into his chest. Typhus thinks he's a joke. Is there any other Primarch that gets so much abuse?

Plague Marines are great, but Mort can't seem to catch a break in the fluff.

>>54179678
great argument you really convinced me with those hot opinions

>>54179846
Mortarion is made to be bullied. BULLIED! He's reverse Aqua, he touches water and taints it

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>>54179846
>Is there any other Primarch that gets so much abuse?
Lorgar gets quite a bit of it. All deserved.

>>54179846
Mortarion depicts the despair aspect of Nurgle.

>>54179914
yeah no shit

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>>54175830
The level of autism and utter assblastedness in this post is hilarious.

Rogal Dorn was always better anyway

>>54178414
False the image show no such information, Luther was merely corrupted by chaos and hadn't choose yet a patron, and it's Canon now that there's always a single champion of chaos ascendant at all moment to prevent Belakor kind of problems, there are no more undivided champions with the big four blessings besides Abaddon and belakor confirmed in 40k since undivided DP were retconed

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>>54168024
I would love for them to flip the Dark Angels and Alpha legion.

First, it would be awesome.
Second, it would fuck with a friend of mine who spams Ravenwing.

>>54176952
You forgot Kyr

>>54180084
Not him but Luther wasn't a daemon prince you retard.

>>54179854
>great argument you really convinced me with those hot opinions

irony at its finest

>>54180236
Either way there are no champion of the four gods besides of the champion with the mark of chaos ascendant and lile fantasy there is only one champion of the big four possessing that title at any moment,

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>>54180084
Say what you will, but every source shows Luther to be the Chaos Gods' (plural) new hope after the defeat of Horus and the DA return to Caliban from Terra, and "once again, they had been denied" by Luther in the final moment of clarity - first time obviously referring to Horus.

>>54179129
Not that anon but wasn't Tizca the only city in Prospero because of the psichyc parasites?

>lion comes back
>recalls all the unforgiven

>russ comes back
>doesnt need to recall anyone because 'lol fuck your codex'

>dante/The Sanguinor/Or some 'gene call bullshit' makes all the BA successors stay after they defended baal and since they're trapped on the other side of the rift.

I'm sure in a few years GWs will make it standard that the astartes are legions again or at least legions in all but name

Hopefully we get to see some actual character traits with all these primarchs being phased back in rather than just being (literally and metaphorically) giant Mary Sues

>>54180453
The big four attention is always drawn to all chaos incursions, the big four allowed Luther to drawn power from the warp to fight off the lion but when he lost the will to fight anymor, they realized he wasn't going to fall to chaos thus why they destroyed the planet.

>>54179846
Mortarion's patron god is the god of entropy, and indeed, Morty goes from a demigod to a bitch.

Which is fitting, since in the books all he does is bitch.

>>54180453
Not canon. It was Azrael that caused the rift that scattered the fallen.

>>54179553
Ferrus Manus destroyed a gigantic Necron war machine barehanded while he was still young. There's no such thing as primarch wank, you just have to assume they work in anime powerlevels until proven otherwise

>>54180527
>russ comes back
>doesnt need to recall anyone because 'lol fuck your codex'
Do the wolves even have many guys left? They were never huge despite not following the codex.

>>54164096
But anon, we all know who the next loyal Primarch is.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HEZvChBy-sQ&t=18s&ab_channel=BrutalOutlaws

>>54180573
If I remember right he couldn't really hurt it. He had to shove it into magma until it died.

Still impressive.

>>54180576
They were fewer in number because they recruited from, and only from Fenris. Which is now kill, with a lot of the chapter gutted. But they're getting Primaris reinforcements

>>54180640
>Which is now kill
Fenris isnt dead but they did lose a lot of men and then more on Cadia.

>But they're getting Primaris reinforcements
Lame.

>>54180640
will they accept them? They're not exactly known to be the most level headed. Even tho their planet is fucked

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>>54163801
Bobby! Loving thosssse abssss man but you look a bit... wound up. How about chilling out a bit, hanging back and cutting loossssse?

>>54180423
Show me where it says there can't be a champion backed by the chaos gods. All it says is daemon princes you faggot.

>>54163801
Wasn't he also having a plan to move the imperium to ultra mar in the HH, as contigence if they lose; in which he also already delegated ranks to his loyal brothers to form a new imperium.

Girlyman has always being a traitor without a casus belis. He just need a reason to be one but no one gives it to him

>>54180805
How is that traitorous?

Should he have gone on a futile suicide mission to avenge emps and the Imperium? Is that what the Emperor would have wanted?

>>54180805
>hedging your bets
>treason

If Lion isn't a traitor, then Guidosenpai isn't

>>54180799
Show me were it says it can, chaos gods only give their blessing to those who dedicate themselves only to a single one of them, the only exception is the warmaster who is the only mortal sporting the sign of chaos ascendant and the only one before him was Horus.

>>54180837
>>54180838
Mostly because everyone else (mostly raven guard) was already fighting the HH meanwhile he was planing behind emperors back.

And yes, lion is a traitor with luck.

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>>54180775
What if Fulgrim had found a different talking sword?

>>54180640
>Which is now kill
Not according to wrath of Magnus, the planet purged chaos taint the months after Magnus invasion and the inquisitors that were allowed to inspect the population confirmed the surviving fenrisians were free of the chaos taint

>>54180872
FOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOLS

>>54180886
>literally everything went back the way it was tier

I dunno why i'm surprised

>>54180872
He would had killed himself along the EC and denied Horus from getting a legion to join him.

>>54180886
>the inquisitors that were allowed to inspect the population confirmed the surviving fenrisians were free of the chaos taint
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

>>54180860
Because they though the emperor was dead, not to mention cut off by the Ruinstorm so even if they knew he was alive they could have done jack shit.

Why do people who haven't read the fluff insist on having their opinions known?

>>54180899
It's Kelly's favorite chapter, what did you expect?

>>54180775
Everyone knows Fulgrim envies eldar because he can't get pounded by Roboute himself.

>>54164427
the imperium has always ran on hypocrisy, narratively it displays how perfectly the imperium's own ideals fail.

>>54180912
CHAOS taint, CHAOS taint. Not mutation.

There are no wolves on Fenris

>>54180856
That's not how a debate works it works, dumbass. You made the claim that no one can have the backing of all 4 gods so prove it. Holy shit you're a retard.

>>54180923
>>54180886
Fenris is healing and population is rebuilding. HOWEVER, anon lied. WoM says that Magnus planted a seed of Chaos into the population of Fenris. It manifests itself as occasionally homicidal madness and random mutation. This sinister seed will bear fruit in the future it remains to be seen how this will affect the SPESS WOOFS.

>>54180886
>and the inquisitors that were allowed to inspect the population confirmed the surviving fenrisians were free of the chaos taint
Please source your bullshit.
Having agents of the Ordo Hereticus frequently visiting in NOT a sign of things be free of chaos taint you retard.

>>54180945
There have never been more than one champion at any time and in fantasy is mentioned that there is only one singular champion with the patronage of the whole pantheon stop using your fucking delusions as facts! The fact that there have never been mentioned another character directly mentioned outside Horus and Abaddon with the four gods blessing is enough

>>54180997
>It manifests itself as occasionally homicidal madness and random mutation
Wow it's fucking nothing.

Truly the Retard King

>>54181006
False. Krom in fantasy was Undivided.

Huron Blackheart in 40K is Undivided and has the blessings of all the gods.

The Chaos Gods just won't ascend Undivided folks to Undivided daemonhood.

>>54181016
>poison the well from which the Space Wolves draw from
>Space Wolves have the chance of recruiting ticking bombs into their ranks
>nothing

Whatever man.

>>54181016
>>It manifests itself as occasionally homicidal madness and random mutation
> it remains to be seen how this will affect the SPESS WOOFS.

I know exactly how it will express itself, by giving them berserker troops so the woofdogs will have their own Blood Angels-esque Black Company

>>54180997
So nothing that the normal screening process they have can't fix? Really nowadays chapters are more careful with recruitments, even the wolves.

>>54181006
They literally mentioned luthor aa being someone backed by the four. It's right there you dumb nigger.
Are you just fishing for (you)s or are you a genuine retard?

>>54179846
He sold his fluff for good rules

>>54181028
Being undivided doesn't mean you have the blessing of the four gods you imbecile!!!

It only means you haven't dedicate to a single God and upon death undivided followers are turned into chaos gargoyles and denied access to the Pantheon, dammed to be exiled into the chaos winds with no access to the gods lands.

And undivided only have raw chaos energy and mutations as any chaos follower, they'll most likely end as chaos spawn since they never dedicate themselves to a single patron

>>54181045
>homicidal madness and random mutation

Soooo... space wolves?

>>54176991
What is it with all these tubes sticking out of important 30k characters noses.

>>54166590
That's basically what Octavian pulled. It's how he avoided getting stabbed like Caesar.

>>54181045
>implying those individuals would pass the test of Morkai
Anon please

>>54181067
They're literally fucking with him, that's why he prevented his ascension with weird anti warp technology.

>>54181269
>inb4 he was Belakor all along

>>54173127
No, decentralizing the Space Marines wasn't a fucking mistake.
Legion-building and a Chaos Dance over a Chaos Wound is all it takes to get you the Horus Heresy.

>>54181269
No you're just using headcannon. This is your last (you)

>>54181298
>hey yo wez gonna make you a D Prince but with spawn mind iz that kool or what?
>not fucking with him
Choose one and only one

>>54181392
Are you mixing up luthor with Huron? Kill yourself you colossal faggot.

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>>54180570
>Dark Angels Codex
>not canon
>Black Library canon trumps Codex canon

>>54163801
Just unleash Alpha Legion on them.
Problem solved.

>>54181505
Wich fucking luthor are you talking about? because I'm sure as hell LUTHER wasn't a champion of chaos ascendant

>>54180837
Guilliman thinks it was a bit traitorous in Dark Imperium. He actually closed several libraries just so people couldn't get in and find out about his private little heresy, because he doesn't want to deal with another schism.

>>54180533
>wasn't going to fall
Luther already fell. He is one of two (three including Horus) figures to ever turn back from chaos corruption.

But if you want specific quotes that say so:
>Consumed by his jealousy of the Lion’s glories, the heroic knight Luther – formerly Jonson’s closest friend and ally – had embraced the Dark Gods of Chaos. (7E Codex)
>Like Horus, Luther had been corrupted; his pride had been all the opening the Dark Gods needed to make him their own. (6E Codex)
>Like Horus and the other traitors, Luther had been corrupted by the insidious lure of Chaos. His pride and conceit had been all the Dark Gods needed to make him their own. (4E Codex)

I mean, this should have been obvious from the events though. His fight with Lion wasn't some trial. Luther had fallen to chaos and used his oratory skills to turn the entire planet and future generation of Dark Angels against the Emperor and to join Chaos. Only a small (green armored) few ever defied him, and even then only once Lion himself had returned from Terra finally.

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>>54181269
>The chaos gods were just fucking with Luthor.
>Striking down Lion was just a prank, bro.

>>54181648
That doesn't mean Luther was the champion of chaos ascendant, worst bearers and many other none dedicated warbands hear the voices of the gods but that doesn't mean they have the undivided favour of the big four, even now each God is trying to make Abaddon to devote himself to one of themselves alone instead of the whole undivided bullshit

>>54181700
I thought anon was talking about Luthor of the red corsair's, the imbecile doesn't seem to know it's LUTHER not luthor the name of the leader of the fallens

>>54181768
His name is Lufgt Huron not luthor Huron. Jesus Christ you're an actual retard. Don't talk shit if you don't know what you're talking about.
Please kill yourself.

>>54181810
Either way doesn't change the fact Luther wasn't powered by the big four at the same time, he was just merely a warp fulled space marine

>>54181883
>it doesn't matter that I'm retarded and don't know the lore I'm still right
We have been over this. Other anon's have posted proof how luthor was powered by all four gods. Your refusal to accept fact and continuing to be retarded is where I step out. Thread is dead anyway.

>>54179423
Man, the Khan is so fucking brutal.

>>54163801
Council of Nikea only banned sorcery, it's just that Hack Library writers and you are too stupid to know why that's different from being a psyker.

>>54183999
Nice try Tzeentch but that was retconned about 10 years ago now.

>caring about lore beyond 3rd edition at the absolute latest

lol