Warhammer 40,000 General /wh40kg/

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First for Primaris Ultramarines!

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Killed by a silver potatoe edition.

world eaters

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thoughts?

Brothers and Sisters of the Imperium, I come today to propose and discuss the formation of a new Chapter. One of which has set it's prime directive to bring forth a new Golden Age of Man.

Chapter: Chrono Liberandum


Formation: Adeptus Mechanicus priests escorted by Space Marines


Background: After the events of the Horus heresy and the continual, accelerated decline of the Imperium, this task force would be formed to attempt to seek out and recover relics of the golden age, to study them, and resurrect Mankind's might in the sector.

First Directive: Reconnaissance, Review and Recovery

The main objective. This fleet is not to liberate Craft Worlds already tainted by xeno, but to extract what’s left of the Imperium’s technology. The squadrons are not given orders to fight and eradicate the invaders, but simply buy enough time for the Adeptus Mechanicus in the platoon to locate, appraise and extract the valuable works of the Imperium. These would be brought back to Forge Worlds to replicate for the arsenal, and at the same time studied to improve upon and reverse engineer to manufacture new technology.

Second Directive: Scavenge and Assimilate

Squads are sent from the main fleet to support other chapters in their crusade. Once having driven out the Xeno infestation on the battlefield, they are sent to scour and collect any Alien technology found useful, to bring back to better understand the strategies and arms that the enemies of the imperium carry, and to attempt to learn from their technology to better our own arsenal.

What do you guys think? I'm still rather inexperienced in 40k (having read a LOT of fluff, but I think it's still not enough due to not having played any tabletop games cause I've no friends) honestly and this is almost unfiltered rambling so a lot of fine tuning, expanding and consistency checking still needed to do. But is this interesting? I kinda want to write a novel in the 40k universe with this Chapter. Has this been done before?

>>54015682
How do you make these lists?

Is it worth picking orks in 8e? How should I start - is a start collecting and a trukk boyz box enough to start with? my second pick are T'au so show my why orks are great army for a newbie

>>54015682
I would remove the trukk boyz and eother run nobz out of it or remove the trukk for more boyz. Trukks are too expensive to run boyz in, 12 boyz cant accomplish shit.

>>54015683
so basically a chapter that does what the mechanicus has always been doing ?
Well done son.

>>54015691
You don't.

>>54015691
an online list builder that got killed off due to GW legal team (probably rightfully so). I've kept a browser window open with it up

How do you stop Tau from deep striking Commanders and blowing up all your tanks and monsters in one turn?

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So how long until Forgeworld puts out an FAQ for their indexes do you think I used to run a pair of Malanthropes all the time but don't feel right running them right now until its confirmed that the 90 points should be 190 points.

>>54015700
those are both very solid boxes. I've been playing orks since 4th edition. I love em. Three games into 8th and it seems like the mob of boys is a solid way to go but you'll need to have something hit their lines a bit earlier or you'll get shot off the table.

>>54015707
I thought the mechanicus were forbidden with tampering with the blueprints?

>>54015722
As others just explained to me: Make sure there's no room for them to deep-strike in close enough to do serious damage

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>>54015709
Couldn't you save the webpage and upload it somewhere?

Do you think it's available on the internet archive?

>>54015705
Putting myself in a corner is a bad idea. He can just hold off on his deep strike until I move out, taking objectives and shooting me with his longer range attacks and forcing me to come to him.

>>54015735
>Homing Beacon can only be used by one unit once
That's exactly what he did. One of his commanders used the beacon to get in shorter range of the land raider, the other deployed normally to shoot predator in longer range.

>>54015734
mechanicus isnt great at following their own rules, and there's always made excuses.

And more importantly, if they cant tamper with the remnants of humanities past glory, they will sure as hell not let an outside organisation tamper with them. Wars have been started over less.

What do you fellas think of Primaris marines conceptually?
I can't help but wish they made the truescale effort without the radical fluff changes.

>>54015727
Whats that in front?

>>54015734
not per se. low ranking guys can't but magos like Cawl can do what they want

>>54015722
field more or keep them in reserve until turn 2

>>54015727
Could take anywhere from months to centuries.

>>54015768
Yeah I think people would have had no problem at all if GW just released them as truescale alternative models without the weird fluff trying to shoehorn them in. Sometimes things don't need any other explanation beyond "We think it's cool"

>>54015768
Awful idea that obsoletes the classic poster-boys the game has had since day 1
It's like DBZ-shit to say 'These guys are the ULTIMATE warriors, raised to SUPERHUMANS as the MIGHTIEST WARRIORS of mankind...'
And then say 'Never mind, these guys are better.'

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>>54015770
dust tactics axis armored transport I use them for my underwater themed genestealer cult as goliaths.

>>54015741
>Did he know in advance you were bringing heavy mech?

No, it was a blind match. He brought a pretty well balanced list. Missile broadside, fire warriors with the infantry hero, crisis suits with plasma rifles (I think?) and flamers.

I was playing a list where everything started either in a tank or off the table to deep strike in later.

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Was looking through the AM FW index and noticed that Malcadors are now Heavy Support instead of Lords of War. Anyone's thoughts on using them instead of Leman Russ tanks?

So I just started painting, I started with my deathwing terminators, after a couple of hours I have done the base coating and just a couple of details, but I feel like it's taking longer than it should

Will it get faster with practice?

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>best builder ever killed by GW
Jesus fuckin Christ - did they learn nothing? They had no problem with collaborating with the AoS listbuilder creator so why not work together with the 40k one? They didn't even announced a 40k app for real right for now

>>54015816

adiosMalcador

>>54015774
>field more or keep them in reserve until turn 2
I had 2 land raiders and 2 predators. He killed 1 of each with just his commanders, then focus fire dropped the other predator.

>>54015767
>>54015774
ok, what about the assimilating xeno tech? that'd be deff heresy, but it would work if this squad was some CIA shit, no? also, I was proposing basically starting a chapter where the mechanicus were 'allowed' and encouraged to do these things to help with fabricating NEW blueprints. Or should I just write a novel based on the mechanicus and scrap creating a new chapter?

>>54015734
Mechanicus even "reverse engineer" xeno tech, slap a mechanicus logo and call it lost tech.

People forget Admech actually invents and copy new things. They just need to be sure the bloody thing won't backfire into demons or some shit.

Unlike Tau for example Mechanicus has to worry about scrap code crap and demons that seek out human tech to possess and do demon stuff.

You need to know super science and warp science in order to make new stuff for human tech. Tau on the other hand do not have that issue, since no one cares about them

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>>54015664
Rate my not tau

Also make sure to email/facebook post/call about the removal of the army builder. Community wants it back. The creator and GW can easily reach some agreement on the matter.

>>54015664

Imhotek is a cunt.

>>54015823
Yes. Also, starting with a white undercoat might be helpful, if you didn't already.
Don't paint every model seperately from start to finish, make a production line, sort of. Basecoat on all, then layers, shades and lastly details.

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>>54015825
Some stupid shithead fucker send the builder link to the official GW Facebook and ask them to support it. Guess what happened ?

>>54015727

Same thing for shadow specters

PL suggest they should be around 40pt /model, point cost puts them and an incredibly low 23pt/model

>>54015863
Reason why recasters ask to not share their contacts.
Too many fucks have linked their stuff to GW.

Like people do not understand copy right exist and so recaster and the list builder are illegal crap.

Is it me or are Tyranids, for all intensive purposes, hobbled by synapse? Either you bring loads so you have fewer troops or you bring little so your troops can be cut off easily. Finding a balance doesn't seem easy.

>>54015816
Tempted to use Mad Robot's hull and use them just for style.

How do Renegades & Heretics hold up this edition? What about Genestealer Cults?

>>54015888
I mean, yeah, that's the point. That's why it's in the game.

>>54015888
Extents and purposes, not intensive.....

>>54015901
Terribly, and great.

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>>54015863
The only point of killing this builder would be an official 40k app release but on the other hand GW released an official app for AoS and also kept an online listbuilder alive tho

>>54015905
>Being this new

>>54015903
Sure but for orks and IG who also spam infantry, they have nowhere near the tax you see in Tyranids.

>>54015839
>if this squad was some CIA shit
Pretty much the Deathwatch, and their use of xenos tech is barely tolerated, and much less assimilation/ reverse engineering.

Creation of new technology isnt entirely unheard of, despite the memes made about the mechanicus, but STC's are incredibly holy things, and trying to make new ones would be like writing new chapters into the old testament.

>>54015851
Oh, I followed how duncan did on the painting tutorial, as in I used a black primer.

So far I prime all -> base -> layer -> details ->shade-> layer-> detail

After almost every step I have to go back in to neaten up, because I aint that steady

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>>54015916
Very well, then their app better be good.

>>54015841
shit alright i'm a fucking retard. please point me to more mechanicus fluff so i don't fucking humiliate myself again. like what are the best novels to read or where can i get all the admech novels

>>54015744

maybe? I don't know

>>54015841
shit alright i'm a fucking retard. please point me to more mechanicus fluff so i don't fucking humiliate myself again. like what are the best novels to read or where can i get all the admech novels

>>54015932

just use synapse characters with less than 10w and they are almost impossible to remove.

>>54015905
>>54015888
Intents and purposes. Jesus fucking christ.

>>54015928
>Being so bad at English you didn't even realize the correction was wrong.

>>54015944
>doing what (((Duncan))) tells you

>>54015972
Being this new

>>54015944
Well, that's okay, but for light colours it's generally easier to start with a white undercoat, else you need a shitload of basecoats to lay down. Just ask your local Imperial Fists player.

>>54015970
Aye, Tyranid Primes and also just units of warriors do wonders for synapse.

>>54015963
the lords of Mars series is supposedly pretty good, but that might be 30k material. Some of the novels they released around the same time of the 7th edition skitarii/CultMech codices are pretty allright material.

I just read the rules for 8th edition. I have a question for transports.
It says that to embark, a unit has to end its movement within 3 inch of a transport; and to disembark, the unit can get out before the transport moves.

Does this mean that a unit can move towards (and even advance) a transport, then the transport can move (and even advance), and next turn the unit can get out and move (and even advance) and then the transport can then move (and even advance)?

>>54015963
Mechanicus lore goes back to the birth of 40k

Splatter across rulebooks, codex, and even crappy novels

>>54015915

What did they fuck up about R&H? I was building my own Lost and the Damned army but from what people have been saying they're trash; not sure why.

>tfw built over 120 mutants and a number of Ogryns, custom mutant dreadnoughts and a tonne of traitor guard for a huge horde mob army.

>>54015836
yikes, tau aren't fucking around any more. might be time to invest in some cheap landspeeders if your expensive stuff is so vulnerable

>>54015888
>intensive purposes
>laughing slaanesh whores.jpeg

no Khorne, it's intents and purposes

>>54015905
Actually, it's 'retentive porpoises'

>>54016014
Enjoy your inferior Conscripts.

>>54015992
>>54016003
yeah i'm just going to start reading from the very conception of the mechanicus and learn. will probably take me some 5 years before a novel is churned out... but all things take time!

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>>54016014
Renegades were always good on the strength of their unique rules, and how cheap to field they were. Now Guard and Chaos both have cheap, effective, horde units compared to Renegades, and Renegades have very little unique rules. I still think they have their place, in a very specific Daemon Summoning Bomb List, but that's it.

>>54015999
Yes

>falling for the 'intensive purposes' bait

I bet you fall for the 'average of d3 is 2 bait'

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Is it worth upgraded all predator guns to Las? I was wanting to use is as my main anti-Vehicle unit for Death Guard.

are the Krieg worth getting? for aesthetic and tg purposes? I was thinking on buying 2 sets off Forgeworld and painting one as the Kill Korps of Krieg (you get the idea) and one of them in their standard colours.

they look fuckin sick, but i don't want them to just gather dust after painting them, are they viable?

An app would be terrible.
I want to sit at my desk and make a list with my keyboard and mouse or at worst on my windows tablet.

I don't want to pull out a shitty android or iphone to put a list together and then keep referring to a tiny phone screen when I want to show someone what I have in my army etc.

Back to doing everything in Microsoft Excel!

>>54016029
Fusion-quadmanders are terrifying.

>>54016014
By and large they are just inferior to Guard in every way now and errors in their rules make them fucked. They can do conscripts ala AM, but their Commissar equivalents lack the Character keyword. They don't have anything to take the place of orders, and so on.

RAW, they can't even use Dedicated Transports they can buy, though clearly that's not the RAI. Not sure on if their Enforcers should be characters.

That said, their Ogryn are now inferior to loyalist ones, and so on. Just...

Basically, they're AM, but worse in every way.

>>54015888
You've got much more wiggle room for charging based armies, since you can still move your troops normally to change the closest target. But for any artillery unit (such as exocrenes), you need to pay a synapse tax and hope they don't deep strike you.

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Has anyone tried to make their own blight launchers yet or have any ideas as to what would make good ones that you can give to the DI Death Guard models

>>54016082
they're fine game-wise, and absolutely beauties model-wise, so yes, very much worth getting.

>>54016080
Sure why not.

Death Guard are supposedly getting a unique vindicator so may want to wait for that.

>>54015748
>He can just hold off on his deep strike
He has to come in on turn 3. Your tanks have 48" and/or 36" range. They'll be providing fire support anyway.

What other fast stuff do you have?

>>54016080
No, actually. Ironically, the best set up for Preds in 8th is Autocannon (as it got buffed and is amazing) with Las sponsons if you wannt also hunt vehicles or bolters for more infantry focus.

>>54016082
Never been more viable. Infantry and arty has never been more in style and they have the best.

>>54016091
>Basically, they're AM on Hard Mode.

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>>54016098
official DI styled blight launchers soon m8

>>54016111
Average 3 autocannon hits vs guaranteed 2 lascannons

What's the appeal of the autocannon? It's only a single point cheaper.

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Does the "titanic" rule actually do anything besides making you vulnerable to the new macro weapons?

The Gargantuan squiggoth doesnt have any of the superheavy walker rules that would allowe it to leave combat or walk over dudes (despite being fuckhuge) so thats why im askin.

I bought retribution in the summer sale. It's pretty fun. Has anyone played with the mods that add factions? Are they any good?

>>54015836
Land Raiders in the middle, Predators on each flank. Stuff in front. Raiders are safe. I assume you have termies inside them?

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>>54016119
More like I Wanna Be The Guy mode. They are effectively a throwback to what IG was after 5th edition but before the 5E codex.

Except the 4E codex had doctrines, so they lose to that too.

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>>54015682
ALTERNATIVELY

I hole-hardedly agree, but allow me to play doubles advocate here for a moment. For all intensive purposes I think you are wrong. In an age where false morals are a diamond dozen, true virtues are a blessing in the skies. We often put our false morality on a petal stool like a bunch of pre-Madonnas, but you all seem to be taking something very valuable for granite. So I ask of you to mustard up all the strength you can because it is a doggy dog world out there. Although there is some merit to what you are saying it seems like you have a huge ship on your shoulder. In your argument you seem to throw everything in but the kids Nsync, and even though you are having a feel day with this I am here to bring you back into reality. I have a sick sense when it comes to these types of things. It is almost spooky, because I cannot turn a blonde eye to these glaring flaws in your rhetoric. I have zero taller ants when it comes to people spouting out hate in the name of moral righteousness. You just need to remember what comes around is all around, and when supply and command fails you will be the first to go. Make my words, when you get down to brass stacks it doesn't take rocket appliances to get two birds stoned at once. It's clear who makes the pants in this relationship, and sometimes you just have to swallow your prize and accept the facts. You might have to come to this conclusion through denial and error but I swear on my mother's mating name that when you put the petal to the medal you will pass with flying carpets like it’s a peach of cake.

>>54016111
Even for DG they are lacking in ranged AV as it is.

>>54016155
they also forgot the rokkit-bombs on the meka-dred

and the mega dred

and grot bomb launchas

FW rushed teh fuck out of those rules

>>54016115
>>54016100
why the hell are they sold as 'advancing' and 'attacking' sets, do the models have locked poses? are they like beginner edition models or can i set them in less restricted poses?

>>54016176
>mothers mating-name
gets me every time

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>Tau players in this thread and the last

>>54016199
It's because Forgeworld wants your sweet NEETbux.

>>54016199
The legs and torsos specifically are locked. Everything else is like the usual kits.
this is not unusual for kits with great coats

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>>54016190
yeah i hope that sooner or later they will realize that having universal special rules that would take like one or two pages max and that they can just slap on vehicles/monsters/bigGuys is a better way to go than to shit up the datasheets with them or to just flatout forget to put them there

ZOG

>>54016239
>HAHAHA EAT A DICK TAUFAGS, DO YOU MISS YOUR RIPTIDES? HAHAHA
>2 weeks later
>FUCKING TAUFAGS AND THEIR OP COMMANDERS

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>>54016264
Imperium cucks BTFO once again

TS guards when?

also are primaris marines meant to be mk5 power armor or are they a whole new geneseed breed?

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>>54016175
>grotzookas
dont do this to yourself

>>54015916
Also trademark law. Don't use it? You lose it. Is a thing.

>>54015950
Now it won't have to be.
They can even charge for it.

>>54016264
Watching the drama unfold is the best thing about a new edition. Everything [Army I play]] is terrible and should be buffed, while everything [Army I don't play] does is completely OP and should be nerfed. Witnessing this much nerdrage is wonderful.

I'm waiting for the next episode, when the next FAQ will drop and will say that drones can't take hits for unit with wounded model.

>>54015963
Just read the first lords of mars boom. After that it does rapidly downhill. The last one is fucking retarded.

>>54016339
Please stop continuing this meme. Copyright law is retarded, but letting this stay up would in no way put anything at jeopardy.

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What is the most complete list of 40k mods for tabletop simulator right now? Just bought it and want to play with a friend

>>54016327
S6 Heavy 2d3 with Grot BS is rather nice.

>>54016052
Or so you can get your 4 Basalisks in your IW army again

>>54015807
Holy shit that thing just needs an Icon Mechanicus and that's a perfect Skitarii transport right there. AAAND now I can't even buy three and Count As them as allied Inq Chimerae anymore, but I would still love something like that for Mech.

>>54016359
babby's first GW copyright stupidity? they've been doing this since the beginning of time, and it's not likely they'll stop soon

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Heavy bolters or Lascannons for guard infantry squads?

>>54015971
I think you got double baited.

>>54016378
GW taking it down is entirely on them, not some overarching scheme that might lose them the IP. That's all.

>>54016381
Las for big shit, HB for small shit.

>>5401cu7o72ngDepens, anti-infatry or vehicle ?

How to use Land Raiders this edition? Just as an unkillable lascannon platform?

>>54016136

What are the six marines? Only three of them look like the new Juggalo ones.

>>54015916
sure, not the fact that he wanted money... sure

>>54016359
UK copy right laws demands asshole actions otherwise you might lose it

>>54016381

Mix of HB, Lascannon and Autocannon

HB for infantry

Lascannon for tanks and characters

Autocannon for boths

>>54016381
Depends, anti-infatry or vehicle ?

>>54016406
U ok hun?

>>54016415

So? They're British, they don't need to bow to retarded US copyright standards.

>>54016327
I know my man but I scratchbuilt so many

>>54016408
others look to be intercessors

>>54016438
Are you stupid? Or just new?

>>54016366
-1 BS for moving, an average of 4 shots with only one actually hitting something.

>>54016359
UK and US copyright/trademark law basically states of you let one guy get away with losing your stuff you lose a modicum of protection. Then next time you're in court some lawyer is going to go "I don't see the problem, Bob here used this so called copyrighted material with no issues, why is this only being applied to me!? Its unfair!"

And bam. Bye bye IP

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which set has this specific helm to outfit my smurfs with? i love the design

also no grey knights cause their mouthguard looks way too big

>>54015727
OR, they will ipdate the cost from 1p PL to 5 PL and they will stay 90pts

>>54016154
BAIIIIIIITTTTTT

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>>54016344
Ok, now that's just bullshit, I poured a fuckton of money on my models and paints, now I have to pay just to use a builder app ? ( to be fair I'll use it quite often though ).
>>54016433
Just my keyboard shitting on me like usual.

Are tactical marines still the worst troop choice in the game?

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r8 my list

>>54016463
Fan work that doesn't attempt to usurp the IP wouldn't stand up in court at fucking all. All this retarded shit got brought up around the time of "Elder Scrolls vs Mojang Scrolls" where there were some weird IP laws going around and everyone has assumed the worst ever since. US patent/copyright law has a bunch of shitty loopholes and patent trolling, but some dude doing fan work that coincidentally happens to be making money wouldn't hold water in any case.

>>54015842
>Also make sure to email/facebook post/call about the removal of the army builder. Community wants it back. The creator and GW can easily reach some agreement on the matter

not until he gives back the thousands of dolaridoos he made with his patreon.
And something tells me he much prefer 30k $$ than putting it up again

>>54016463

True, but there are less asshole ways to deal with this.

IE: grant the guy a (restricted scope) license to use the copyrighted material in exchange for a one-time fee of £1.

>>54016493
>what are tau?

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>>54016442
i feel ya, my favourite kan Stompy is also modeled with one

>>54016473
One on the Deathwatch upgrade sprue.

>>54016409
[citation needed]

>>54016512
Literally none of the Tau troop choices are bad you retard

>>54016493
No. Intercessors are.

>>54016511
you're assuming they're less assholes, and right there your argument completely falls apart.

they're a CORPORATION and they exist to make money, the more money the better, the less leeches the better

>>54016512
>S5 basic weapons
>bad

>>54016505
You can't let a single thing slide.
With how much of a clusterfuck the laws are, even a little leeway could be enough

I tied Tyranids with my Thousand Sons yesterday. It's the first time I haven't just gotten outright steamrolled off the board. Another turn and probably would have tabled him. I'm just happy and thought I'd let the world know.

>>54016493

Breachers are godawful.

I'd be amazed if Wyches are any good now.

Are power armoured grey knight troops still sucky?

>>54016493
Yes. They die faster than guardsmen and put out less than half the damage.

>>54016541

and you are assuming that the builder harmed GW in any way other than the copyright infringement.

I am quite sure that it was a quite beneficial thing instead.

I actually believe GW willfully ignored it until a moron linked it in their facebook, making them lose any plausible deniability (since they were not required to take legal action if they could claim to have been unaware of the infringement).

So, Thousand Sons, Orks, or Eldar. Steer me in the right direction guys, could use some help.
I'm looking to get started and those are the 3 armies that draw me in

>>54016594
Breachers in Devilfish aren't too shabby.

>>54016493
>Renegade Militia
>Dire Avengers
>Intercessors
>Plaguebearers
Tac squads are pretty okay.

>>54016602
They're probably just making their own and told the guy to fuck off.

>>54016545

He means Breachers.

They're kinda like close combat troops, except they have no CC ability whatsoever and need to be within 5 inches to get the most out their guns.

>>54016561

Helps they have very little moultiwounding to deny all is dust

I though the stompa had loads of wounds, then come the eldar phantom titan...
Big stompa when?

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mutant = manlet

>>54016610

>Do you like kitbashing stuff
Orks

>Do you like small model numbers?
Thousand sons

>Are you a raging faggot?
Eldar

>>54016611

>Breachers in Devilfish

So you buy an expensive, not very high firepower transport to get in range for one turn?

>>54016620
>>54016594
Breachers weren't bad last edition and if anything are better this edition. They WILL shred anything they dump out of their devilfish next to

>>54016610
Thousand sons have the prettiest models and solid units but lack a variety psychic powers due to index being barebone. have a lot of daemon support options
Orks are fun to kitbash and are currently top tier but have some old models and painting hordes can be time consuming.
Eldar have a solid aesthetic and are never bad but have decade old sculpts and people are more hostile towards Eldar. If you mean Dark Eldar, they're awesome all around.

>>54016623
>Big stompa
Da Orky an' betta coz Orky vershon o da big punies iz calld a Gargant, ya git.

>>54016655

>Breachers weren't bad last edition

How do you live with such complete detachment from reality?

>>54016655

If you want a suicide unit, plasma command scions are better.

>>54016677
Don't think they can join Tau

>>54016677
Indeed. And if you want a melee unit, the Hierodule is better.

>>54016613
>plague bearers
>gained the ability to run for -1 movement
>can buy +1 run and charge anyway
>FnP that cant be taken away by instant death
>still cheap as fuck
Is it because they're weak to mortal wound spam?

>>54016601
I'd love to know how you found T4, Sv3 units die faster than T3, Sv5 units. I mean, they die at about the same rate to a S5 AP-4 gun, or a S8+ AP-4 guns, but that's it.

>>54016415
No it doesn't. There is literally no way that a rights holder can stop owning their copyright other than it expiring or the holder transferring it. This shit is a fucking meme. The rights holder is also free to grant permission to use their IP or parts of their IP to anyone they want whenever they want and to retract that permission agianst whenever they want. Also granting one person permission to use their IP does not grant anyone else permission to use it.

There is nothing about British copyright law that requires GW to do send infringement notices or C&D notices to anyone. If this was the case they would have to send notices to literally every website that has an image of a model taken by a GW photographer or that uses the warhammer 40k logo. That would include every fansite or news site ever and they would be entirely within their rights to do that, the logo in particular since that is an actual trademark.

>>54016712

Depends if you consider dead models / turn or dead points / turn.

>>54016674
With an ethereal and darkstrider + 10 breachers in a fish last edition you had 30 str 6 ap 3 shots that wound marines on a 2 and instant death any t4 characters. Literally kill yourself you fucktard

>>54016707
Also noguns and meh melee capacity.

>>54016705
He could always do A Monolith if he needed something large and LOS blocking with a good bit of wounds.

Any word on if Death Guard will be getting any new units? I asked on GW's Facebook and they won't answer me

>>54016610
Is this your first army? How much experience do you have with modeling?

>>54016712
I think he meant equal points' worth of each.

>>54016406
yes

>>54016739

>All that buff stacking and a pricey transport on a suicide unit

>"Good"

You're confusing good for "Can under optimal circumstances get one good shooting phase."

>>54016749

Try linking the MEGA rules folder, see if they answer.

>>54016749
Someone said we are getting a Vindicator.

>>54016718
GW actually did used to send out infringement notices to fansites for using the 40k logo, but they stopped doing it as frequently recently. Probably because they realized that having your legal department spend their time harassing people for promoting your product is really dumb.

>>54016749
Mortarion and Friends within the next couple months. Probably in August.

>>54016749
Terminators at least

>>54016263
We tried that in 7th. It uh, didn't really work as well as expected.

Although some of the rules in the FW indices are just insane. I think the Titans have rules paragraphs long!

>>54016749
Probably because its a question thats been answered a couple hundred times already

>>54016768
7/7/17

>>54016610
Orks generally require a whole ton of modeling/painting just to get started, but are pretty cool. Eldar have the oldest shittiest models in the game right now, but can be kinda cool. I would recommend Thousand Sons as a first army. Low model count, simple enough paint scheme, easy to get behind/understand lore. Plus they're easily allied with other chaos down the road if that's your thing

>>54016438
Nice reading comprehension.

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/tg/

training copyright lawyers since
[currentyear]

>>54016761
I think you're the one who's confused. You are confusing "good" with "WAAC tier auto take". Breachers are, and have been for a while, a serviceable unit that has it's niche.

>>54016263
GW editing would just forget to put the special rules on there. And the special rules would be 10-20 pages, but scattered throughout the BRB in an annoying way, so that to figure out how a model works, you need to have 2 or 3 pdf tabs open to all its special rules, if you can even find them.

>>54016787

Best gif of the thread

>>54016804

Buddy an expensive suicide unit isn't "serviceable", it's "Can just barely do one thing if used in a specific way".

/tg/ poll: do you allow forge world models in a game?

>>54016381
Personally like Missile Launchers.

>>54016838
Different guy: Breachers also have a role in 8e as a screening unit, as an alternative to Kroot. Put them between enemy assault units and your main fireline and have them play guard-duty with their powerful overwatch.

>>54016838
>expensive suicide units aren't serviceable
Holy shit how new are you?

>>54016779
Would be an awesome announcement date for the release date. It's too close to be the model release date though.

So, Ive got a Catachan list im working on... And Sly Marbo has been squatted. How would you guys feel if I ran Sly as a "Counts as" Eversor Assassin?

>>54016743
>cheap melee swarm with layered saves and rerolls to wound
I thought this was the melee edition?

>>54016858

If they are not obviously broken.

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what happens to the Imperium in 8th E?

>>54016057
Mean=(sum of all outcomes)/(number of outcomes)
(1+2+3)/=6
6/3=2

Or are you talking about the difference between theoretical probability and experimental probability?

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Seems the FAQ will address the 'Khorne Berserker' thing.

>>54016339
AOS guy did the same thing
Learn what words mean as you look that up

Can models embark and disembark airborne vehicles?

>>54015683
Meh. The AdMech already do this with their Skitarii legions, and the Steel Confessors are tge AdMech's sole chapter, since they're banned from having any chapter he truly theirs. Now there are a few chapters that do have a rapport with the AdMech, like the Iron Hands and their sucessors, including the Steel Confessors who are the AdMech's (somewhat) personal chapter.

>>54016930
RAW? Yes.

>>54016858
Normally: Yes. They are as official as anything else, and people likely spent good time and money in purchasing and preparing them. Why not let them play with their toys?

In 8e: Not until the FW indices are fixed. The current rules are absolutely awful. Bio-Titan hitting on only 3s, a tau aircraft which isn't allowed to fire its gun, random d6 rolling, another unit which requires time-travel to operate, random imbalances like Malanthropes being silly-cheap or R&H being strictly worse IG. Once FW gets their shit together, yeah I'll happily play against it.

>>54016407
I use them to move company vets or assault centurions into melee or BBRRRRTTT range

>>54015700
Mind you that the Ork Painboy used to be an HQ, but is one no longer, so you'll need to buy another HQ for the Orks as well.

For the first time in the history of the game, I'd say Orks are a legitimately solid pick.

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>>54016898
Do you let people use Obviously broken GW models?

>>54015916
The problem is that the 40k had images of the models and also asked for donations.

If there was nothing but points values and unit names it would have been fine.

>>54016911
Surprise buttsex and not so surprising buttsex

>>54015825
Because the guy monetized it and used GW assets, unlike the AoS guy who only used names and point costs. Nothing else. No patreon link, either.

>>54016886
Nuglings have S/T2, 4 wounds, 4 attacks and not!-infiltrate for 20 ppm and may field up to 36 wounds/unit

Plaguebearers have S/T4, 1 wound, 1 attacks
and may field up to 30 wounds of models/unit

>>54016506
>thousands of dolaridoos
Provide proof faggot. He had at most 24 people giving $1 a month just before the takedown request.
Unless you're some leet hacker, you're just blowing smoke. Even then, you still are.

>>54016974
on that note: open source github point calculator when? it's honestly not that hard to make a glorified excel sheet

>>54016674
Found the WAAC tourney fag
>Daily reminder: No one likes you

>>54016945

No, i have enough friends playing 40k that I'm not forced to play assholes.

Played against riptide wing once in 7th, afterward I simply "forgot" the guys number and never set up another game with him.

SQUATTING ELDAR WHEN

>>54015842
Holy fuck, that's a lot of models for 2k pts.

>>54016974
GW monetised their moms on the street corner, so its fair deal.

>>54016911
Remember all those people telling jokes about flashlights? They are dead, Jim.

>>54016610
>>54016643
>>54016664
>>54016780
thanks for the input seriously. Are orks so bad (all those models building/painting?) and i've been on the boards long enough to pick up that eldar Craftworld? are pretty despised which doesn't sound like fun. Also magnus and those rubrics look sweet as fuck

>>54016751
I've helped my roommate build his Space Marines and have a start collecting skeleton horde from sigmar i've built and painted so i have a workable understanding of the basics. but yeah first 40k

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So it is agreed renegades and heretics troops are shit, but is it possible to make them work using their elites like Marauder and Disciple squads with the elite heavy detachment? Marauder Stalkers seem pretty great with having a 3+ in cover and the -1 to hitting them

how to munchkin proof your army?

>>54016838
>Can just barely do one thing
You act like 20 str 6 -2 ap shots are bad or something.
It absolutely murders pretty much everything but heavy vehicles and MC, and comes from a relatively cheap troop unit.

>>54015842
How do you plan to deal with heavy infantry? You have ludicrous quantities of firepower to kill GEQs and are decent vs MEQs, but W2/3 units will be a pain. Sheer volume may work out, though.

>>54017032
Be selective with opponents.

Best recaster to get FW dreads from?

>>54017029

>Are orks so bad
No, but a big part of the ork spirit is kitbashing a vehicle from some leftover bits, a paperclip, tinfoil and faerie dust.

>>54017063
Lu Yin

>>54017009
Thank you, I try pretty hard when it comes to making bullshit, yet still effective lists.

Pays to play the army and not a list. So glad WAAC fags are selling their riptides by the dozen, not that I need any more...

Best Snipers for guard? Ratlings, Special Weapons Squad or Elysian Sniper teams?

>>54017032
Smite. Honestly, so far i have killed custodes and flyer armies, thanks to smite

>>54017083
How to find.

Hey /tg/, can you clarify something for me ?

>If a model has several
weapons, it can shoot all of them at the
same target, or it can shoot each at a
different enemy unit.

Does this mean that say a Tactical Marine can fire both his bolter and bolt pistol and each at a different target if he wants in one shooting phase ? What if they have a combi-weapon and a bolt pistol ? They can fire all three but since the combi-weapon is one weapon it has to be fired at only one target ?

>>54017094

Depends on GW clarifying if you can have Auxilliary officers.

If you can, ratlings hand down, if not it's an open discussion.

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Are there any other assassin specialities that could possibly be an Officio Temple? I'm trying to think of anything not already covered by the fluff.

>>54016555
A copyright holder can let literally any infringement slide by granting limited permissions to use their IP. This is how fan works exist and it's basically required if you have an IP popular enough that people want to make fan works based on it.

Problems only arise when a copyright holder doesn't ever grant anyone any kind of permissions to use any part of their IP (which is what games workshop does) and then also has a fandom that produces fan works. They end up perpetually chasing their own customers around the Internet because they use the most restrictive possible licences and if asked never grant anyone permission to use anything.

If you ask GW for permission to write a blog article about a campaign you're running at a local gaming club they'll deny you permission and send you a list of ways that infringes on their IP. There's no need for them to do that, but they'll do it anyway because no is the easiest answer.

>>54017031
Vanguard detachment is pretty much the way to go with R&H right now. All their decent units are Elite.

I'm not sure about Marauders though. They look awesome but that battleshock rule is heavily exploitable.

>>54017124
No, you can either fire all pistols, or all non-pistols.

>>54017124
Not the pistol, you can fire all weapons xept pistols, or all pistols.

>>54017124
Read the description of Pistol weapons again.

Can you make R&H work with their new "cultist" units as theyre nearly comparable to guard with the nurgle covenant?

>>54017049
The vespid can punch through stuff nicely, if I really have to the krootox autocannons can provide assistance on that matter.
Commander with cyclic ion blasters also can fill this role. Add the kroot hounds 2 attacks per at -1 ap plus rapid fire and charge kroot, with the shapers giving all kroot re-rolls of 1s when wounding, it works out.

If all else fails, hit it with a railgun. At least mortal wounds can spill into other models.

>>54017130
Fair Use

>>54016176
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!

>>54016362
Selfbump

>>54017126
>Vindicare Snipers
>Callidus Infiltrators
>Culexus Anti-Psykers
>Eversor Kool-Aid Men
>Venenum Poisoners
>Vanus Manipulators

I don't know, they've kind of got all their bases covered.

>>54017137
>roll a 1
>command point to re-roll
>problem solved

>>54017126
You know about the extra two (poisoners and haxxors) from the heresy era, right?

I guess one thing we don't have is an assassin temple entirely consisting of psykers. Probably wouldn't exactly be BFFs with the culexus temple...

>>54017029
I would probably suggest thousand sons or eldar first, Orks are best as a second army.

They have four to 10 times the number of units, complicated sculpts and paint jobs, and tend to be very bad in most editions (being super good right now though). Thousand sons are the easiest to build and paint, but share the "usually awful" issue and are kind of boring.

Eldar are usually pretty good, wide variety of styles and models, and their start collecting is great.

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>>54015677
> Mfw I killed one of these in 1-round with a Leviathan Dreadnought

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>Like Tau suit armies, not because they were good, but because I thought they looked cool and I like smaller model armies anyway
>Tau suits are shit now thanks to 7e WAAC players

>>54015677
Now who is this?

>>54017232
>got buffed like crazy
>shit now
okay.jpg

>>54017172
Fair use doesn't protect fan works.

>>54016284
> Dat tiny bit of fluff at the top of their hooves
Hnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnng

>>54017260
Burning One C'tan, got Cato'd at the battle of Damnos.

>>54017265
Weren't they nerfed? That's what I heard. Or was it just the Riptide?
I haven't looked at the numbers because they mean nothing to me since I didn't play 7e, or any edition before it.

>>54017265

Ha ha, what?

Battlesuits have way more wounds, but pay out the ass for them without an equivalent boost in firepower. That's a nerf by any definition.

>>54017232
crisis suits and broadsides are beast presently

>>54017269
Upload your fan work to russian hosting they dont give a shit, or if they do it will take 1,5 years

>>54017232
Suit armies aren't shit now. So many people seem to think all these random Tau units are bad, maybe it's just elaborate or not so elaborate I guess trolling. The only suit that really got hit at all is the riptide, which will most likely be getting a point drop in an FAQ soon (unless when tournies roll around riptides do better than most anticipate). What is it you think that makes suit armies shit anon?

>>54017290
Crisis suits and Commanders, especially the coldstar, seem good.

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>>54017290
Commanders are really good now. Basically the new tau spam list is commanders and drones.

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>>54017232

Reece here! Don't worry, your suits are still good! We just needed to give them a little nudge in the right direction to increase participation for other factions! After all, the more people buying ticke...ah, enjoying the Fun and Balanced game, the healthier our tourna...er, the Game Scene is! Want to see? Buy your entry pass to BAO 2017 now!

>>54017232
Crisis/broadsides are quite good, and the rest look like shit anyway, except that Rvarna or Yvarna or whatever its called. Well, HAZARD look ok too.

>>54017290

Commanders, Stealth Suits and Ghostkeels came out well from the changes, but the rest took big hits, especially the vanilla Riptide which went from "You're a douche if you spam this and use formations to shut off it's one limitation" to "Ha ha what who would take this shit".

>>54017232
Welcome to the Warhammer community. They don't know you yet but they already hate you.

>>54017301
See >>54017290
It's just from what I've heard here. I'd be happy if they turned out to be good though.
A lot of people at my local GW played? Tau so I'm not sure if I'd want to get into them anyways, but it's nice to know that they're an option.

>>54016525
He had a patreon.

>>54017290
Lots of stuff got price-hikes, including Crisis and Riptide. Riptide ended up as a straight nerf, which it really needed. Crisis, however, benefited in a number of other ways; it's now allowed to take and fire three weapons instead of two, it now can freely split its fire among multiple targets (since everyone can now in 8e) which is something you had to pay points and use a slot for in the past, you can moonwalk out of combat, they got access to some great new support systems like the ATS, etc. etc. So they're pricey, but good. Only real issue right now is that the Commander is strictly superior for almost all purposes, due to BS2+, Character protections, and a fourth hard-point. Crisis need to be dropped a bit in cost and Commanders bumped up a bit to give them each distinct roles.

>>54017300
That pretty much seems like the best answer.

>>54017299

Both are obviously overcosted, though not unusably so.

>>54017172
In practice fair use protects quoting things in news articles, making parodies of things and not much else.

>>54017281
Cato sounds like a badass

>teleports 9" away from you
Heh, nothing personal kid.

>>54017353
Crisis suits are pricey now sure but I wouldn't call them "overcosted". If anything I think Fusion guns are a little overcosted

>>54017300
I don't think it's that they don't give a shit, I think it's more that it becomes difficult to actually take any kind of action.

>>54017397
It is a shitty story. Cato Sicarius is a huge Mary Sue who beats a 60 million year old overlord in a sword fight, turns around and throws a 1 use warp grenade at the C'tan while it is destroying millions of Necrons, Imp Guard and routing the Ultramarines and it dies instantly.

>>54017371
Fair use is a weak defined thing. It gets judged from case to case. For example: It says, that it also protects you, if you add changes to the original work (transform it etc.). That´s why you basically can upload copyrighted videos to YouTube, add a small window that shows you, watching the shit and BOING!!!- legal. Meanwhile, in reality, you will get your ass kicked by so many lawyers if you do this to a big studio like Disney, that it might not be wise to do it at all.

>>54017397
>Psssh...nothing personnel...kid...
It's just not the same without the typo and annoying ellipses.

Can someone explain this to me please?

Black Templars hate the codex astartes.

Black Templars act very different to the Imperial Fists legion.

Isn't that a contradiction?

Necrons good or bad?

>>54017505

Good, particularly warrior spam

>>54017232
>i can't win now by just fielding the army and I have to actually play the game
>EVERYTHING IS SHIT, I WANT TO DIE

kill you self please. people like you are the reason tau are conisdered cancer.

>>54017505
Necrons are awesome! Best fluff, good on the tabletop, no bullshit just tough and plentiful.

>>54017300
Fanart is perfectly legal, as long as you don´t earn a penny with it. No matter if it´s copyrighted. Why do you think, it exists in such numbers in shitholes like DeviantArt? Disney once tried to sue a tattoo artist for tattooing their characters on people. They lost in spectacular proportions.

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>>54017526
>best fluff

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>>54017485
Imperial Fists weren't big fans of the Codex either. Most of the Legions resisted its implementation, just with varying degrees. A few told Girlyman to fuck off entirely with regards to organization. The "1000 Marines" rule in particular seems to get totally ignored by more than a few chapters.

Templars are just Fists who resisted more strongly than the main body of the Legion.

>>54016159
That positioning doesnt work against a homing beacon

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>>54017522
I've never even played Tau, I just think their suits look cool and their drones look cute.

>>54017526
>Best fluff
yea, like before 5th edition when they just became another faction with egyptian theme

>>54017538
Sure they resisted, but my point is that the resistance seems pointless or contradictory since they act nothing like the imperial fists.

>>54016528
Kroot are pretty much hot garbage

>>54017566
They also resisted typical IF doctrine for multiple reasons.

>>54017561
Regardless, I think the point is that the ideas you were repeating are emblematic of what is considered the worst of Tau-player culture, and something many of us are hoping to finally escape now that our faction isn't stupidly powerful.

>>54017561
Then are you crying just because of the memes and the sperglords ranting on /tg/?

tau suits are still beasts, but at least now they cost appropriately and you have to use them with a strategy in mind, not simply closing your eyes and tabling your opponent turn fucking 2.
becaus ethats what happened in 6th and 7th.

>>54017403

That's pretty much exactly what I said, just semantically different.

If something feels very pricey for what you get but you still want to take it, that's overpriced but still usable.

>>54016620
>>54016594
breachers are really good

if you cant find ways to make 10 S6 AP2
shots at 40 points work then youre just shit at this game

you need to step it up

>>54015722
As nids I surround my big guys with a bubble of gaunts. If you play all tanks or leave artillery sitting in the corner all game like a guardtard then yeah you're fuked and rightfully so -_-

>>54017587
Cheap, effective screening unit.

>>54017589
So what's their deal? They hate the codex which split the legion and hate the legion they split from?

do we have rules for tyranid hierodules or dimachaeron yet

>>54017566
It's also true IIRC that the Templars were more fanatical than the mainline Fists were. They were formed out of the sword brethren and other elite troops within the Fists Legion. Sigsimund, the galaxy's newest instance of a human slap chop, was given command and passed his zeal down to the rest of the new chapter.

Successors sometimes act totally differently from their progenitors because they're taken out of a particular population within the parent chapter. It'd be like recruiting all the green crayons out of a box to form the Green Legion and leaving the parent with very little in the way of green after that.

How tf to find chiacasters outside eBay?

>>54017538
>Most of the Legions resisted its implementation, just with varying degrees
That's actually wrong though.
The majority of loyalist legions (UM, RG, IH, BA, DA and WS) supported the codex, while only 2 primarchs openly opposed it, dorn and russ, with vulkan not being opposed but afraid that their low numbers would prevent them from being able to follow it.
10,000 years and you still can't accept it's better than legions son of dorn? Stubborn as always

>>54017618
They worship the Emperor as a God.

Can someone clear something up? Can Tempestus Militarum take orders> The orders rules say that the units giving receiving orders must be from the same <regiment>. None of the Tempestus even have a regiment. So by that logic, Scions Squads and Command Squads can't take orders, and Tempestor Primes can't actually give orders to anyone, despite having the ability to give 2 orders.

>>54017618
The black templars just kinda hate everything that isn't painted black and white. And a number of things that are.

>>54017469
Cant even get good memes anymore

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>>54017485
Dorn never wanted to split the legions until after the Iron Cage, after that Dorn gave the more zealous and angry Imperial Fists to Sigismund and he continued this hatred for the Codex Astartes as the rest of the successors accepted the codex. While the majority of Chapters began a new era the Black Templars kept their old hatred alive and burning, this and the fact that they follow the teachings of Sigismund with their own books means that they have strayed even further from their progenitors.

>>54017612
Fire warriors cost 2 more points per model
>better leadership
>bonding knife to give them auto pass leadership on 6
>can benefit from fireblade ability to get a 3rd shot in rapid fire range
>can have a markerlight
>photon grenades

All Kroot can do is suck and die and then run away

Theyre better at doing damage in melee but that is not really relevant

>>54017606

The way to make them work is to spend 127 points on a transport to get them into position, assuming the transport isn't destroyed on the way over, for one turn then get shot off the board.

Their damage potential isn't in question, it's the agressively awful ability to realise that potential that's the issue.

>>54017668
>The black templars just kinda hate everything that isn't [s]painted black and white[/s] gargling the Emprah's semen. And a number of things that are.

FTFY

>>54017403
There's no crisis loadout I think is worth the point cost. 70/105 points is just nuts.

>>54017533
This isn't true. Fan art and fan fiction are not legal and if you create a derivative work based on someone else's copyright the copyright holder owns the rights to distribute that work.

The reason lawsuits related to fan creations are rare is because theres basically no reason for copyright holders to pursue them 99% of the time.

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>>54017668
They're friends with the Spess Africans and the Spess Mexicans.

Both of which are IF successors.

>>54017634
Yeah, they are both pretty good.

>>54017697
So you agree that they're cheaper and better in melee. That's literally all I said: cheap, effective screening unit. Their purpose is to start the game between your main line and the enemy assaulters and eat a charge. They are better at this than standard FW, due to being cheaper and a bit better at CC, though either unit would likely die in the effort. They are expendable meatshields.

>>54017744
Space Spaniards

Space Mexican would be LotD, they are basically "Dia de los muertos" the army.

What's the best fast melee army in the game in anon's opinion? I have a slow shooty army so a fast killy melee force sounds fun.

So far it looks like TWC/Wulfen SW is quite powerful but I know there are some other good ones out there.

>>54017777
Harlequins by a mile.

>>54017777
Genestealers and Seekers are probably the fastest and very killy.

>>54017777
Tyranids or Chaos.

>>54017533
If GW decided to sue you for writing 40k fanfic or drawing space marines they could and would win. The characters in their works are protected by copyright and your derivative work is almost certainly not protected by fair use unless the purpose is parody or criticism.

It sounds bizarre, but fan art and fan fiction are unauthorized derivative works.

A question; are we meant to measure shooting the base of models, including skimmers? I ask because of the Hovering rule which allows models to move/fire from any point on the model. This is great for things like the Raider as it can hide over 50% in cover and still fire. However the Ravager does not have Hovering, so does this mean you measure shooting from the weapons like before or from the base. If it's from the base but you can target the model, it's a nerf against skimmers with side sponsons weapons unless you fly them sideways.

>>54017208
>>54017029
Ok, I'm diving into Thousand sons and keeping an eye on orks in the future. Am going to get Magnus, because reasons, anything else i NEED to get? or daemons? or what? any advice would be greatly appreciated

>>54017767
Kroot dogs are better at being cheap and dying than kroot are. If Carnivores had 2 attacks they might have been worth something.

>>54016938
>another unit which requires time-travel to operate
what is this?

>>54017844
where are people getting measure from weapons from in this edition? madness? or am i blind

>>54017666
militarum tempestus is a regiment you ape
it specifically states so in the index

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Storm Cannon - 50 points

Grav-Flux Bombard - 50 points

Cyclonic Melta Lance - 75 points

So I can see a few situations where the storm cannon is the better ranged weapon, mostly against infantry units with less than 20 models, but none where the Melta is.

>>54017876
I sadly must agree with this. Kroot have the slight advantage of having a proper ranges attack, but it's pretty shitty. They're not unusable at present, but could use a little something extra.

>>54017926
If lady luck smiles at you and you want to get close and personal, a d6 or 2 of damage is not bad.

>>54017816
Are we pretending this shit hasn't had 1000s of precedent cases already. No they wouldn't, fanfic being non monetized is part of its definition.

>>54017890
Macharius Vulcan. If you stay immobile this turn, Its main gun shoots twice in the preceeding shooting phase.

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Opinions on these masks for alpha Legion? Should I leave it for veteran-types or give them to sergeants/characters?

>>54017232
nigga every battlesuit is still amazing

actually play the game before shitposting

What do you reckon the benefit of using the new little Primaris Captain instead of the Gravis one will be?

>>54017328
nah riptide is still good, just not "bring 3 of them in every list" good

>>54017713
2x Flamer + ATS, 3x Flamer, 2x Missile Pods + Flamer, 2x CIB + Flamer, 2x Plasma + Missile Pod

Putting more than 2 expensive weapons on a Crisis is pretty dumb.

>>54017770
>once upon a time in space mexico...
https://youtu.be/WGmmXd8r4YQ

>>54018029
I'm a fan of 2*MP+ATS, myself.

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kawaii inquisitors/SOB faces when? i just want cute /tg/ waifus ;-;

>>54017701
Theyre a good riposte unit, too

Just assume that they'll die after shooting and you're only getting one round of value from them.