EDH/Commander General

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Let's play another round of "Guess this Curve".

I want to build like three decks right now and I want to order cards immediately but I'm poor

how many of you have this problem

How good/fun is Kangee? I want to build a commander with white and I like the older commanders more. Also I already own some good bird cards so thinking about him.

>>53980724
>>53980966

maybe competitive was the wrong word. Its more like tryhard casual.
The deck, while looking like shit, is actually insane. All those impulse clones mean you're guranteed to draw ramp and counterspells/boadwipes to stay in the game. And once you set up a 4+ extra turn combo, you drop kraum and swing at someone until they die while spending your mana to cast more turn spells
its more of a thinking man's deck

>>53982358
I too like for no one to so much as glance at me for 7 turns.

>>53982342
me

i recommend doing what i do: install xmage and get your new deck brew fix there.

>>53982229
>What's a card you don't play that runs roughshod in your meta?
Ad nauseum

Bumping my question.

>>53981871
>>53981871
>>53981871

-

>Thread Question
>That incorrect use of roughshod
But for real though, I used to love Possibility Storm.

Then everyone I played against started to play it because "wow such random, much funny" games were pretty much guaranteed when one of them got out. Me and one of my mates noticed that out of the regulars at the store, almost all the Red players were playing it and they also made for the least fun games.

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>Could buy one LP Volrath's Stronghold for $28
>Or two NM Volrath's Strongholds for $52 total

I don't even really "need" Volrath's Stronghold.
Why am I doing this to myself?

>>53982877
You need one of them, desu. I don't think there is a good reason to have two unless you have the money to spare. LP vs NM should not be significant at all, but you never know and either seller could be lying about the condition.

It's on the reserve list and it's extremely strong, just buy one or two.

>>53982358
>its more of a thinking man's deck
Is the thought "I'm an idiot, I should have run Sidar Kondo, Reyhan, Ikra Shidiqi, Tymna, Ravos, Thrasios, Kydele, Vial Smasher, Silas, Akiri, Bruse Tarl, Ishai, Tana, Mizzix, Niv-Mizzet, Melek, Jhoira, Nin, Keranos, or Jori En, literally anyone other than Ludevic would be more useful sitting in the command zone?"

>>53983211
before all of the partners were spoiled i speculated that a kraum/bruse tarl deck would be pretty good in a control/voltron shell.

ludevic is pretty bad though, i think we all agree there.

Not necessarily a card but everyone in my meta has green in their decks except me. They all say that it's widely accepted that green is the best color in the format and I'm dumb for not playing it in most decks.
They also straight up netdeck. like I'm okay with checking out edhrec but straight up looking up "best Meren edh deck" or "best green edh deck" annoys me because they won't even try to tune it for our metas. One of them is also the same guy that goes to modern tournaments with me and bases his side off of mtg top 8 even though they usually have tron/eldrazi hate in their side and no one where we play plays tron or eldrazi.

But yeah I get told I don't take edh competitively because Im not running my decks 100% optimally (i.e not running original duals and tuning my deck for our meta) because I don't straight up net deck even though I probably have the highest win % because they don't know their deck synergies, best ways to work the stack, and other things you learn from playing a lot of magic

tldr; friends look up "best decks ", say green is best, I don't build green decks so I'm "not competitive "

>>53983386
build angus mackenzie fog&wrath tribal with no win con or some other similar no fun allowed deck and make them suffer for their insolence

>>53983477
I've actually considered doing something like that.

Another thing they said was "Why are you playing breya don't you know that yidris is the only tier 1 4 color commander?" just because they found some site with commander tiers.

I just like playing commanders I like and I mean it's edh there's no 1 true best deck of all time

>>53983605
>>53983386
Find some other friends to play with

>>53983605
i'm with you man. i've got a reasonably competitive meta (strong commanders, perfect mana bases, etc.) and i'm the johnny with the bad bullshit decks that gets laughed at for playing "bad cards".

the laughter stops when follow up on my knowledge pool by flashing teferi in from the command zone.

>>53983605
If anything Breya is the more competitive 4-color commander because artifacts and she's a wincon on her own.

>>53983386

Next time bring monocolor Teferi and show them the truest best edh color

>>53983605
Eh, Breya has her own combos. Yidris requires you to connect, and even though he's stupid good, I don't think that he's worthy of using just because someone said on the internet that he's the best.

>tfw no one truly understands how fucking great arcbond is
>Suddenly Blasphemous Act can hit everyone for 13

Christ alive, every Red deck of mine is going to have it now.

what is your most competitive deck?

>>53983859
yisan because it was cheap to build and still crazy strong

>>53983627
I would but they're the few people in the magic club that actually play commander so its kind of like I either play with them or don't play edh.
>>53983691
I mean it's not like I play super janky things. I just don't want to spend several hundred dollars for the original duals. They just consider my stuff not competitive because I didn't find a specifically made list online that said "100% most optimal build for this commander" instead I look for specific ways I want to build a deck, I'll even check out edhrec, and make my own decisions. I guess I could post my breya deck since it's the one I tuned the most to see if you guys think it's janky or not.
>>53983701
>>53983731
I mean I like yidris but I just think breya is a lot cooler. She's definitely good but these are people who give me shit for having liliana of the veil in grixis death shadow for modern tournaments because she wasn't on the mtgtop8 side board even though out of 25 people that go to our lgs 9 play boggles and she's the best answer to them in grixis colors.

They also gave me shit for taking apart yidris and using a lot of the stuff in my yidris deck to make a nekusar deck because he's considered weaker. I just think Nekusar is cool and I like changing things up.

>>53982300
Wow, tough. Not enough artifacts for Sydri, not enough white for Zur, not enough Blue for Sen Triplets or any other non-build-around.

Maybe Ertai, the Corrupted Reanimator?

>>53983979
i'm pretty sure that's gold for multicolored, not white

Sheldon is holding the format back.

>>53982300
>>53983979
I'm going with Gisa and Geralf.

>>53984021
you don't have to listen to his banlists, talk to your group and figure out what works for you.

>>53983940
I think that most Nekusar decks are bad, because usually it's a bad idea to give opponents all the cards they would want.

I used to be a Phelddagrif/Norin chaos and Grouphug memester and these days that kind of shit just sickens me

>>53984004
>>53984023
Wow, I must've had a stroke. Yeah, definitely G&G.

>>53984057
most of the nekusar decks i've seen only play him when they've got a way to give him infect and then wheel twice for a quick win

>>53983859
Probably Jeleva. I played it vintage singleton grixis storm, and picked Jeleva as she was the most disruptive/cost effective commander there was in those colors. She also provided a fairly reliable alternate wincon, or an alternate means to increase storm count/cast doomsday. I only played it when I knew the game was going to be super competitive, with similarly powerful decks.

The most accidentally unfair deck I created though was Reki, History of Kamigawa. It could reliably go off T3 or T4 with a huge storm count by casting most of the deck, into a craterhoof. I built it because he seemed interesting and wanted a timmy kind of deck. I ruined a few games with 20 minute storm turns, then retired it, because as broken as it was in the meta I built it for, it wasn't going to ever be good enough in the vintage singleton metas that I should have played it in. I think about revisiting it every now and then, because I loved playing with all those cool legendaries.

>>53984035
The same is true for all formats anon, but only EDH has the problems it does.

>>53984021
>>53984035

Not him, but a lot of people play with multiple groups. That's the point of defining a format, a critical mass of players all agree to follow the same restrictions.

It's okay to have beef with Sheldon is my point, I guess. Also okay to ignore him entirely, but you're not playing Commander at that point.

>>53984096
the EDH banlist was never really a set in stone thing on account of it being a strictly casual format, even to the people who build 100% competitive decks.

it's a thing to play with friends for fun, so house ruling something is a lot easier than, say, getting such and such card unbanned in modern or legacy.

Could we talk about Archenemy in this theead? Its kinda tangentially related I guess and Ive been thinking ofnreworking the precon decks to be a little better balanced and more powerful, buildimg a little more around teammates, like using Minds Aglow, and giving Bolas some of the stronger schemes from the previous sets and making him a little lighter on one for ones in exchange for more board wipes like Sweltering Suns, etc.

But it isnt realy xommander though. So.

>>53984119
>meet with a new group
>"hey guys is it cool if i use tamanoa as my commander/use emrakul in my deck?"
if they say no, play something else or swap out the problem card. if they say yes, you're all good.

>>53984126
>>53984119
Having no solid footing to base your lists on results in problems when:

1. You play with multiple groups
2. You play online (solved, since wotc did the right thing and kicked the RC out for online games, but it was a huge mess before)
3. You play at tournaments in between rounds with people you just met!

The EDH banlist being shit creates all of these problems, and effectively encourages not meeting new people, but retreating into insular communities, increasingly alien to every other insular community. The EDH banlist encourages the exact opposite of the sort of behavior it should.

>>53984023
>>53984062
It's Grim-Grin, but the twins are in the deck, so it's probably impossible to distinguish between the two from looking at the curve.

>>53984127
I'd be interested. Archenemy is a fun format and I'm all about multiplayer. The decks definitely need better balancing. The red one in particular sucks donkey dicks.

>>53984177
i remember you, you were the guy complaining about fast mana being legal in the format a few threads ago.

i agree with you to an extent, someone going t1 mana crypt sol ring wheel can be pretty good in a 75% meta, but a lot of decks NEED that shit to deal with the food chain, hermit druid, and buried alive decks that dominate the more competitive metas.

>>53984276
That's incorrect. Sol Ring helps the unfair combo decks as much as it helps any other deck. (Seriously, every single deck you mentioned runs sol ring). The problem with it is that it creates really broken gamestates.

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I dunno if there's enough distinctive about this curve, but we'll see.


>>53984346
>Seriously, every single deck runs sol ring

FTFY

>>53984346
yeah, they all use it, but the decks i mentioned get a lot less mileage out of it than something like a teferi stax build or a storm list. without the fast mana, prossh would still be almost exactly as powerful and degenerate of a deck and the slightly slower control decks wouldn't be able to compete any more.

>>53984057
That's the kind of mindset I was trying to avoid. [insert commander] is bad or less competitive than this other commander so you shouldn't play him. I mainly built him to try some new things to see how I like them or how well they do. obviously if I just wanted to win every game id spend a few grand and get the most optimal everything and wreck everyone i come up Against but that doesn't sound that fun to me .
>>53984080
I've tried nekusar infect combo and it ended up working well. I also tried nekusar built around milling and a more control version of nekusar. Is he a tier 1 commander? no not at all. I still had fun and got some wins with him.

>>53984246
Really Im just interested in adjusting them because the dynamic of having three team mates versus one player adds an interesting layer of interaction with some cards that the set didnt really do much with. It had a few things that took advantage of it, like Vision Skeins and Fertilid, but I think there could be more, like the aforementioned Join Forces cards or some more obscure ones like Indentured Djinn.

And to compensate for stronger team mates, Bolas could have more powerful individual cards like fast mana and more boardwipes than he currently has, as well as go back to some of the stronger schemes archenemy had before, which I heard were actually too powerful, but if the team mate decks are drawing 6-9 cards between them, and the prof has said the balance is leaning a little towards ths Gatewatch in this set already, then I feel like Bolas probably will need some help.

The main thing is Im not quite sure how to go about building the remodels. Should they be built like "real decks"? Mostly singleton like the actual precons for variance? How do I determine what cards should be more and how many to use? Should the decks have a subtheme like some currently do on top of their role in the team (nissa supports, gideon protects and removes, chandra is dps), like Nissa has a landfall subtheme?

>>53984416
Okay, that's just blatantly incorrect. Have you even played the competitive meta? Consider for a moment that you're saying, the presence of sol ring, a card that any one player has a low chance of drawing in a short game, makes some decks competitive viable against other decks, that apparently can consistently combo out on turn 3 or 4 regardless of their sol ring draw. The logic just doesn't work. Sol ring is not a format police card. It's ridiculous that you think it is.

>>53984394
Well yeah. It and Mana Crypt are arguably the two best cards in the game.

>P-Hulk unbanned
>Gifts still banned
>"B-but gifts enables to many combos..."

Yeah, because ProHulk combos aren't even that gud in EDH amirite.

>>53984485
You forgot the major difference:

>P-Hulk is a glorious creature
>Gifts is a dirty instant.

>>53984483
sol ring, mana crypt, mana vault, basalt monolith, chrome mox, grim monolith, mox diamond, mox opal, and thran dynamo are all cards that get played in these decks and allow them to keep up the pace. you also can't forget cards like tezzeret, enlightened tutor, and trinket mage among others to draw these cards with consistency.

how many tutors do you typically play with?

>>53984552
>lists fast mana that all unfair combo decks have access to and can use in equal measure
>tutors (when all unfair combo decks run tutors as well)

You still aren't convincing anybody that these decks somehow benefit less than any other deck by randomly getting +2 mana in a game.

As for my tutor count, it depends on the deck and the meta I'm playing for.

>>53984485
I play protean hulk in two decks, but I'm never gonna defend the thing. Shit's broken as hell and I feel like Sheldor is out of his mind.
Frankly, I would like to have less degenerate shit unbanned, like Painter's Servant and Limited Resources to limit the UG shitters. Also, inb4 "b-but muh Iona and Grindstone"

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Guess!

I don't know if this makes it too obvious, but as a hint the deck is built for flavor

>>53984615
Ayli

>>53984596
B-b-but muh casual friendly and totally fun Iona that should never be banned in a casual format, and muh infinite combo with grindstone that can only kill one player a turn in a multiplayer format and loses to Eldrazi, Gaea's Blessing, Darksteel/Blightsteel Collossus, Elixir of Immortality and any other number of cards that completely hose non exile based mill!

If you let painter's servant back in the format, these two cards would be so degenerate!

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>>53984623
One and done, good job anon

>>53984591
>t1 llanowar elves
>t2 tutor + second mana dork
>t3 food chain, play prossh, haste enabler, win the game

as a teferi player, i'm not gonna have my stax lock down by then without access to my fast mana. the best possible options i have for beating this without it is hoping i've got mana drain, swan song, or force of will in hand.

if they were banned, my combo would be a lot worse, i'd have to rely on weaker mana rocks, and the prossh player across the table can still reliably go off on turn 3.5 every game with 1-drop mana dorks.

>>53984429
The list of "Tier 1" commanders in multiplayer is not large, because of the nature of multiplayer. Off the top of my head:

Karn
Grand Arbiter
Angry Omnath
Baby Teysa
Mizzix
Meren
Derevi
Zur
Oloro
Prossh
Marath
Mayael
Animar
Ghave
Narset
Atraxa
Ydris

OG Sidisi might make that list, and I expect The Locust God to as well.

Either way, my point is that there are tons of perfectly viable commanders that aren't "Tier 1," and Nekusar is plenty powerful.

>>53984615
>>53984623
>>53984685

Yeah, it was very obviously Ayli-Drazi.

>>53984685
The flavor part did give it away. Only other option off the top of my head was the Kaladesh guy and putting lots of artifacts in his deck. I would have never guessed Ayli would have that much colorless otherwise.

>>53984715
ehhhh, i'd say marath, omnath, ghave, teysa, atraxa, and karn are T2 at best.

>>53984696
Then you play/build like shit.

1. I'm not talking about banning all mana rocks. Just sol ring and mana crypt, both of which can enable a t2 food chain, which is even more unanswerable.

2. You should have more counterspells that you can easily cast. This is a huge flaw with your list. Git Gud.

>>53982229

Gaea's Cradle

If I have some cash I'd pick it since it will never go down in price, but I don't want to invest in cardboard

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>>53984715
Does Sidisi ANT not count? I'm a little confused that she's never mentioned here or ever came close to being banned.

I can understand nobody playing her because it's incredibly linear, but it seems powerful.

>>53984768
i do have more counterspells, and i know you're not talking about banning all rocks.

my point is that a competitive deck aims to win or secure a lock on turn 3.5 every single game. decks that use hermit druid, buried alive, and food chain to do this can easily accomplish that task without fast mana, while many other alternative strategies wouldn't be fast enough to compete without it.

>>53984789
His list is kinda bullshit and wrong. Most obvious transgressions are angery omnath and mayael.

Gonna build a naya deck that gets max value off my commander hitting opponents. But not voltron.

What are some of the best double strike/unblockable cards I can use?

I have Rouge's passage, Glaring Spotlight, Duelists Heritage.
What else is top tier?

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>>53984853

>>53984853
Duelist heritage has compatriots in silverblade paladin and ajani, caller of the pride. One of the elspeths is pretty good too, gives flying and a pump, but I forget which.

>>53984789
OG Sidisi Living Death is scarier than Nu Sidisi ANT, at least partially because you get blue and green in the deck. Even then, I left it off the list because it requires quite a lot of setup and other commanders can combo off quite a bit faster. JMHO, this is obviously very subjective.

>>53984761
Teysa and Karn are absolutely T1. If any Naya commander moves down, it's Mayael, because Marath combos are ridiculous.


Also, I definitely forgot Jhoira in my tier list.

>>53984715
>it's another "anon who knows nothing about competitive edh pretends to be a tier whore to look cool on an anonymous imageboard" episode
Come on bud, you have no idea what you're talking about. Almost all those decks are t2, or lower, you forgot planeswalker teferi and azami outright, while also putting old teysa on the same tier as Ghave. You don't even get points for effort here.

>>53984841
And that's still retarded. Sol Ring will always boost whoever draws it by 2, allowing for even faster combo wins than without it. Without the best mana in the format, more fair decks will have a chance to fight based purely on land drops.

You're so wrong here, I suspect you haven't even played the competitive meta you're claiming to have knowledge about.

>>53984885
Teysa absolutely cannot compete with the likes of General Tazri or Thrasios

>>53984886
>It's another "Shit on someone's opinions because you always know best and need to let everyone know it" episode
I did miss Azami, but Teferi seems to follow the trend of 'walker commanders being too fragile.

So I am dreaming up an unblockable tribal under UB sygg, and while I will uave card draw out the ass, what should I put in to actually Kill people? Infect? Lots of weapon equipment? Hatred and similar effects?

>>53984888
you seem aggravated. no need to get so upset, friend.

i'd be happy to see fast mana banned out, but only on the condition that a bunch of other stuff gets banned as well. in fact, i'd like to see most of the faster tutors banned too.

>>53984847
Yeah I guess I didn't read it closely.

>>53984885
>Sidisi ANT requires quite a lot of setup
No, it only requires lands, rocks, and rituals and 1 game-winning card which you can tutor up with your commander. And ramp + combo pieces only take up ~20 slots so you can pack a lot of combo protection.

>Karn
>Mizzix
>Mayael
>Ydris
>JHOIRA
>t1
C'mon, anon. You thought Sidisi required setup?

>>53984715
>Karn
Definitely not tier 1
>Grand Arbiter
Maybe
>Angry Omnath
Sure
>Baby Teysa
Only because of Darkest Hour desu
>Mizzix
Sure
>Meren
Tier 2 imo. She's super grindy and gives tons of value, but she isn't as explosive or controlling as most of this list
>Derevi
Yes
>Zur
Yes
>Oloro
Yes
>Prossh
Fuck yes
>Marath
Yes
>Mayael
No lol
>Animar
Yes
>Ghave
Tier 2 imo. He's just really outclassed by Marath
>Narset
Yes
>Atraxa
No.
>Ydris
No

>>53984971
Just put in some sort of easy combo and use your draw to put it together. Doomsday, Palinchron, rings + monolith, etc.

>>53985003
>ramp + combo pieces only take up ~20 slots
Sorry, I wasn't counting the cheapo cards which power Tendrils. You could also go Sickening Dreams + Sphere, I suppose

>>53984930
Teferi is so good there is a reasonable discussion about banning him outright. You know how his deck works?
>ramp into teferi
>untap your rocks/doubling cube
>shit out so much goddamned mana the rest of the game is completely trivial

Now, that being said, yes I'm shitting on your opinion because of your false-authoritative bravado that's horribly misinformed. Memnarch is more deserving of undeserving t1 status than half of the guys on your list. Even t2 darietti is more deserving. Also, no fucking yissan? Come on bud, you should know better.

>>53985024
Teferi seems to be really obscure. Like nobody talks about him, but when they do it's all about how powerful he is. It's a weird effect.

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I just swapped all my foil and full art swamps and also a normal chinese esper swamp for snow covered swamps and an Extraplanar Lens in my mono black deck. I know it's the best choice for my deck, but I can't help feel like part of me died.

>>53985074
Why the fuck are the Esper swamps so god damn expensive. I was building Silas/Akiri storm and I wanted the esper swamps to match but god fucking damn.

>>53984991
Well unfortunately it won't ever be, because Sheldon is holding the format back.

>>53985090
i think the REAL lesson here is "don't play EDH with randoms"

>>53985024
Only one acting authoritative here is you, bruh. I literally pulled that list out of my ass, said as much, and have already noted a couple of misses.

Yisan was better in the 99 of a UGx Prophet list than he is as a commander.

>playing commander with 3 buddy's at LGS
>dude comes in and buys some singles to finish up his deck
>sits next to use asks to test his deck out
>"sure"
>4th friend sits out to eat
>game gets started
>new guy cheats out avacyn turn 4 with quicksilver amulet
>armegaddon next turn
>path avacyn in response
>he yells at us for not letting him win

Are all MLD players autistic?

>>53985109
Or we could make EDH a format where it's safe to meet new people and play a friendly game, men and women, all physically fit and emotionally mature, able to have a nice game over craft brews in a new pub.

Or we could have Insular, EDH bubbles of increasingly unhygenic neckbeards with in-jokes that make no sense.

The latter of these is Sheldon's vision, and it sucks.

>>53985126
>Are all MTG players autistic?

>>53985113
...no?

no, that's actually wrong

>>53985126
Any player who can't accept that delicious irony sure as fuck is.

>>53984715
>Karn
>t1
BAHHAHAHAHAHAHAH wow imagine being this diluted!

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>>53985113
>UGx Prophet
What did he mean by this?

>>53985126
how much of this story was true

did he really yell

>>53985150
I could almost buy someone thinking Karn was t1. It was Mayael that made me lose it.

>>53985164
Well, considering the lgs is pretty loud by default. He was visibly upset.

Said he just put it together and we didn't have to be dicks about it. I couldn't tell if he was memeing or not.

Since he packed up and left after that game, I think he was genuinely salty.

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>>53985161
Before pic related got banned, there was a large number of UGx decks that were devoted to finding it, protecting it, and abusing it, such as letting you tick up Yisan terrifyingly quickly.

>>53985113
That's objectively incorrect. Yisan is firmly t1.5, because the deck is toolboxy, can answer anything, and with unbanned Hulk, now can shit out insane value with ease.

Assuming prophet was unbanned, yisan is still 1.5 because he's just so powerful outright. Have you ever played competitively? I'm pretty sure he's banned 1v1 for being unanswerable.

>>53984445
I'd keep the Gatewatch decks to a theme, but I wouldn't have them singleton. No more than 3 of any card though. And yeah, the Nicky deck needs stronger individual cards and Schemes while the team decks should focus on synergizing with each other while having weaker cards overall. For example, Nicky B gets Lightning Bolt while Chandra would maybe get a Searing Spear, and no more than two-of.

>>53984643
I seriously don't understand why PS was banned in the first place. It's just ultrajank that just screams Johnny. Existence of Iona and Grindstone doesn't justify it's ban. Hell, black Mike is more degenerate

>>53985186
>competitive Edh

Go away.

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>>53985183
yisan can go get this though, plus other things that untap him multiple times in a turn AND give you huge card advantage

>>53985183
That was a year and a half ago. Why bother bringing it up?

>>53985206
Sheldon thinks that there are going to be more and more unfair combos printed with Painter's Servant. To be fair, he is technically correct. Since the banning, All is Dust and Ugin have both been printed. But I propose that anyone who would combo painter's servant in that way is not the type of player the RC's artistic vision applies to.

So my working theory is that Sheldon lost to painter's servant once and the format was never the same. Basically the only way to justify any of the numerous inconsistencies on the banlist.

>>53985207
The whole purpose of tier lists is for competitive edh you fuckwit. In casual, everything's viable, and tier lists fundamentally miss the point of the format. No one runs a "casual" 2k tazri foodchain deck, like no one runs zur doomsday or scion hermit druid to play "for fun". What are you even on about?

>>53985186
That makes sense, I haven't played against it since the Hulk unbanning.

1v1 power/ban-worthiness doesn't always equate to multiplayer power. Edric is insane 1v1 but just quite good in multiplayer.

>>53985250
>tiers
>competition
>playing to win

Wtf are you still doing here?

>>53984394
Got a lot of bases covered with the multicolored blocks, so not a lot of clues about what it could be from there. Not having any 6 mana artifacts would be unusual for Sharuum, Sydri, or Triplets since you'd be missing out on Wurmcoil, Mycosynth Lattice, Duplicant, Mindslaver, Staff of Nin, etc., not to mention the obviously lack of Darksteel Forge. No 3 mana White cards pretty much guarantees no Zur or Ertai. Not enough Baubles for it to be Silas Renn / Ravos, and none of the other Partner groups really make sense. The Eldrazi at the end is kind of peculiar, and could point to something like Dakkon, but you don't have enough CMC 1 artifacts to be having Expedition Map, Wayfarer's Bauble, etc. We can probably safely rule out Evangela, Halfdane, and Chromium just on usage statistics alone.

Narrowing it down to Oloro, Merieke, or Dromar. I feel like the huge bulk of 4, 5, and 6 Blue spells would be unusual for Oloro, as well as the lack of Archangel of Thune. Between Meriek and Dromar, I'm going to call it at Merieke, since she's maybe 9x as common as Dromar.

>>53985238
That's why I said "was" better.

>>53985251
>]
Edric is probably still one of the best multiplayer commanders. I'd say at least somewhere at the lower level of 1 or high end of 2. The main differences between duel and multiplayer are the archetypes. Duel has traditional aggro or decks and control decks which aren't really a thing in multiplayer. That's about it. For the most part the competitiveness of certain decks otherwise carries over.

>>53985246
But that situation would be just super costly Armageddon most of the time.
I still wonder that what the fuck is going on in his mind. They seem to be the biggest casuals this planet holds, using the retarded Gis mulligan and upping basic count just to nerf Hermit Druid for Karador

>>53985302
Oh and also decks super reliant on the broken mana rocks, like Teferi, don't translate to 1v1. He still works but is beat out by Jace and maybe Baral there

>>53985274
>muh spirit of the format
>ugh who plays to win
Post your Palladia-Mors deck or shut the fuck up, you busch league casual.

>>53985302
>no control or aggro decks in multiplayer
i hate this.

my group had fun with EDH back when we were all new to it and messing around with the new legendaries from shards of alara, but as time went on and we streamlined our decks, it became a "who draws combo first" competition and that's no fun. i barely show up to meetups any more because it's just such a chore and there's no real interaction between anyone, it's just a combo race.

>>53985289
Well-reasoned, but the two things that threw you off are related. It's Battlecruiser Oloro, with no AoT *because* it's battlecruiser.

>>53985332
>I can't cut it in real competitive formats so a beat up kids and their pack fresh precons.

Wew

I should have known it was too good to be true. Saw a Primeval Titan for sale for 8 bucks, grabbed it up, and was super fucking excited to slap him in my jarad deck. And now I find out he is banned. Gods damn it.

>>53985328
They're super casual, and there is nothing wrong with that. But the problem is they expect everyone else to be super casual too, and have deliberately created a format police attitude in the repulsive neckbeards that follow them.

Most of my problems with EDH come from the arguments these games inevitably create, because half of all players think the definition of "casual" and therefore the limit of acceptable play only encompasses their deck and anything their deck can beat. And sheldon and his cronies encourage this bullshit.

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>>53985350
Pic related

>>53985338
Try Angry Omnath. It's not "aggro" in the traditional sense because it's a ramp deck, but it goes wide and the natural synergy with ramp spells makes sure you can keep casting Omnath when he gets blown up. Artifact and enchantment destruction can stop a fair number of combos, though admittedly not all.

>>53985338
Control kind of works depending on your playgroup (it works better when you're not in a hyper competitive group, where everyone is casting potential game enders every turn after a point, and you can more safely dole out counters only when directly threatened), but aggro is pretty much not a thing unless it's tied to a combo somehow except in casual groups.

>>53984696
Fast mana, the cheapest tutors, and the most broken combo pieces are exactly the bans necessary to crack down on fast combo decks making most other archetypes obsolete. That's already what every banlist other than Sheldon's does.

Meanwhile Sheldon does face-on-desk stupid shit like unbanning Protean Hulk -- now combo decks don't even need Mana Crypt for turn 1 wins!

>>53984715
None of that is correct.

http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/list-multiplayer-edh-generals-by-tier/ Is the closest we'll get to consensus. For the record, the unrestricted T1 (not 1.5) are

Tazri
Jeleva
Prossh
Teferi PW
Thrasios/whatever but it's a partner so fuck it
Yidris
Zur

Your other choices were Karn (Tier 3), GAAIV (1.5), Omnath (3), Teysa (2.5), Mizzix (2), Meren (2), Derevi (2), Oloro (3), Marath (2), Mayael (3), Animar (1.5), Ghave (2), Narset (2), and Atraxa (2). None of them are truly godawful but you go as low as Tier 3 so I suspect you can't really tell the difference between a top-tier commander and a good pub-stomper.

>>53985346
Ah well, I got most of the way there.

>>53985387
i did when he came out. i never actually swung in and usually won through goblin bombardment or ashnod's altar sac triggers for damage.
>>53985390
mhm, i've tested the waters. turn two blood moon into turn three ruric thar makes the storm decks at my table cry.

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Should be pretty easy.

>>53985419
ub combo was a mistake

>>53985390
Tasigur control is high tier, a major reason being you can quickly ramp enough mana to recur counterspells and other control pieces.

>>53985467
Peepaw Karlov

>>53985419
Tier 1:
>Tazri
>Jeleva
>Thrasios
>Yidris
Tier 1.5:
>Captain Sisay

Huh? Are some of those up there only for their colors?

And I thought Arcum was t1, personally.

>>53985419
Hmm. I've been out of the loop for a bit. I can see arguments made for every general in that tier except Tazri. What makes her so good?

Also
>tfw beating t1/1.5 metas with something people consider t4.

Ultimately, general choice doesn't matter that much in vintage singleton, but it is a nice feeling regardless.

>>53985338
There is control. It's called Stax, and while some people may dislike it, it's necessary for the health of advanced multiplayer metas. Traditional Draw-Go doesn't work because you can't afford to trade resources 1-for-1 with multiple opponents. Stax works because you can trade one of your resources for one from everybody else.

Aggro exists at all but the most cutthroat metas with go-wide tokens. Fast aggro is of course dead since Goblin Guide does fuck all to 120 life worth of foes but midrange or hybrid aggro/control can actually work out if you play smart threats that promise reliable value rather than just assuming your linear craw wurms will wind the day. EDH also has its own form of aggro: Voltron.

>>53985467
why is everyone making orzhov decks, there are only like three different possible lists you could build (daxos, karlov, aristocrats), they're so samey

>>53985376
I dislike the word "casual" as a whole when it comes to EDH anyway. Including what you stated, most retards, including some youtube MtG people, just say that "if you want to play anything other than vanilla creatures/combo/deck that has thought behind it/anything not draft chaff/ go play legacy"
I don't even understand it, why does every retard just say that you should play legacy instead of EDH. I realize that EDH is a casual format, but casual format doesn't mean that you must play a bad deck.

>>53985481
I knew Tasigur was good but I thought it was mostly just an infinite mana outlet more than anything else

>>53985505
>I can see arguments made for every general in that tier except Tazri. What makes her so good?
Food Chain combo. The description of the tier list links decklists for... I think everything T2 and above and some down as far as 3.

>>53985505
Tazri is just a 5 color food chain combo deck. Tazri herself is used because she searches combo pieces.

>>53985513
I think casual is more properly defined as an attitude. You can be casual while playing vintage singleton. It's low REL, lots of talk around the table, good food/drinks around you, and even better people.

But yeah, some people think to be casual you have to not attack before turn 16, and only draw 1 card per turn.

>>53985507
i'm well aware of that. i've built stax and token decks aplenty, and my titania deck is half decent, it just doesn't feel like a traditionally aggressive deck. i want that feeling.

>>53985556
I dont think anyone thinks that.

>>53985513
Personally I use "casual" in an EDH context to refer to anything that isn't worthy of the title of 'competitive' EDH. Though I'm not sure 'worthy' is the right word. Can you be 'worthy' of cancer?

>>53985505
Tazri food chain. Fast mana, tutors, food chain. Tazri is the infinite mana sink.

>>53985511
Selenia is another option

>>53985558
Ah, well then you're probably looking for Ruric or Angry Omnath. Maybe Lord of Riots with discount Eldrazi.

>>53985419
I trust the collective opinion of Tappedout even less than the collective opinion of /tg/, heh, and apparently I was generous with the size of the tier (~20 decks as opposed to 7), so I'm curious to see what they have in T2 that I didn't have at all.

Jeleva in T1 is the only real surprise to me.

>>53985570
Can you be deemed worthy to be killed and become a mindless undead? Magic says yes

>>53985582
Ruric and omnath are not that. Compare mtgtop8 decklists of things like Thalia/Kytheon or lil Zurgo

>>53985582
>>53985441
this is me, i've played both of them.

rakdos seems neat, but i think i'm gonna build neheb+earthquakes eldrazi instead once that boy comes out

>>53985568
You haven't played online or with a lot of people IRL before.

>Play spot removal on a dangerous creature
WTF DUDE CASUAL LMAO
>play any form of stax
WTF DUDE I'M LEAVING
>attack someone on turn 2
WTF DUDE, LET ME BUILD UP FIRST

>>53985556
I think that in EDH the casual means just that you can't play cards that make your opponent feel bad, so you can't play any LD, including mass or singular (Armageddon, Strip Mine), any kind of discard, removal or wraths. You're destroying the casual format with disruption, which apparently doesn't have any place in EDH. Here everyone just wants to spam creatures until they can play Craterhoof Behemoth to win the game.

Oh, I've also gotten complaints about casting Fog in such case.

>>53985511
There are 3,000 Atraxa decks on EDHRec, 2,200 Breyas, 2,100 Merens, 2,000 Oloros, etc.

The majority of people are going to be doing what the majority of people are doing. It doesn't matter if it's "samey" or not, striving to be unique is a chore.

>>53985618
my LGS is the worst with this. we might be two hours into a shitty game and no one has the balls to kill anyone because it's mean to take someone out of the game :((((((

>>53985618
Sorry, I have only seen one or two people act that way in years of playing this game. Are most people that you play with like that?

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>>53985618
I once stifled a Norin's return trigger and the guy scooped with tears in his eyes.

>>53985489
Nope.

>>53985511
You forgot Kambal Stax, Big Teysa Pillowfort, and Selenia Life Manipulation.

>>53985570
Usually each pet card is casual and they're usually only played in a deck that isn't fully optimized.
I would say that each deck that isn't optimized and doesn't play in extremely powerful strategy is a casual deck, but there's a lot of variance in between power levels of different decks.

>>53985576
wouldnt selenia just be aristocrats

>>53985646
I'd say there's usually one in any random online game.

>>53985626
>I think that in EDH the casual means just that you can't play cards that make your opponent feel bad

This right here is the fucking problem. If you feel bad because something in the game happened that decreased your chances of winning, you probably aren't a casual. These people are pretend casuals, using the "spirit of edh" as a meta way of getting people to not beat them.

>>53985618
If this is what you deal with. Move.

Immediately

>>53985671
>Not Karlov
Huh, I legit have no idea then. Most WB decks lean black to my knowledge with Karlov leaning more white.

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>>53985618

The closest I've seen this happen is still funny to me.

>Casual EDH
>One player playing fuckin' mill
>He mills someone's Ulamog
>As he goes to shuffle it in someone cremates it
>He gets super mad and scoops as we are "Ganging up against him"
>Table's face

>>53985680
Those are called scrubs.

>>53985675
Oh, I'm confusing selenia with something else. I thought selenia sacked to pump or something

>>53985711
You're probably thinking Vish Kal.

>>53985702
Infect is another big bringer of tears.

>Enemy Gisela is attacking somebody else. With the damage doubled, it will deal 10 damage to them. He has enough to live, untap, and win next turn.
>Asks calmly if any blocks are declared
>no blocks declared
>I cast tainted strike to make it lethal and knock the combo player out of the game

He almost flipped the table as he stood up and started yelling about infect.

>>53985618
>tfw everyone takes the bait from Tempt with Discovery in a 7 player pod
I tried to Armageddon on my turn, but the blue player who had plenty of artifact mana wasted his FoW on it, because he was too dumb to understand that the guy that originally casted the Tempt card was sitting on like 20 mana and obviously would go infinite next turn, since he had Horde of Notions and Phyrexian Altar on the field.
I even got groans and mean looks when I was the only one who was trying to do anything. The Horde player won the next turn, obviously.

>>53985680
It's okay not to like playing against certain things. Land destruction and Stax decks are the main complaints for a lot of people, but some take it further to any hard control or fast combo, and some unfortunate souls go all the way to "anything that can beat me."

What's not okay is trying to dictate to your group, especially if they are randoms, what they are and aren't "allowed" to play. If you want to start your own format with blackjack and hookers, and exactly the banlist you want, that's fine, but don't expect anyone to join you.

>>53985755
poor threat assessment is what causes my table to do silly things like gang up on the malfegor player for being "annoying" with his board clears the turn before babyjace is about to high tide and draw a million cards

>>53985751
This shit is what makes me wish I could play Tainted Strike, holy shit. I dont know how anyone could have been mad about that. I can just picture the scene with the people I play with. That would have been the talk of the night.

>>53985668

How? The exile and return clauses are the same effect. In order to do that you'd have to hit the whole effect when it initially triggers, meaning he never gets exiled.

>>53985755
>Tempt with Discovery
Had to cut it from my multiplayer cube. Either everyone took the bait and ended up losing, or nobody took the bait and it was a 4-mana rampant growth.

>7 player pod
Dear God, why?

>>53985691
Hint: The answer is in all the 3-cost White cards.

>>53985513
Because they're trying to justify their outright mediocrity and complacency rather than getting better. I see it all of the time in fighting games
>Someone intentionally picks Dan in SF
>They win and brag about that one time they totally beat a spamming tourneyfag
>They lose and bitch about how people don't play the game honorably or how the devs intended
>They call things broken when those things can get stuffed easily
It's called Dunning-Kruger Effect, where they think they're better than everyone else. It's a delusional belief, and proving otherwise sets them off on a cognitive dissonance triggering. As repulsive as he is, Sirlin hit the nail on the head with his scrub definition. A scrub is one who refuses to get better and thinks himself as a top player. If anyone else challenges that belief, the scrub will attack the better player. The scrub sees himself at the top of the mountain, and he'll be damned if he doesn't stop other people from climbing the mountain past him.
So in here, a scrub would bitch about CEDH ruining the format and bitch about spikes. But the format itself is naturally getting more and more competitive. That's due to the nature of how the format works naturally, (the more you play, the more you want to learn about the format, the more likely you are to buy singles, etc.) and the increased amount of improved quality resources about EDH. EDH is still very much a casual game, but people are picking Demonics over Diabolic now.

>>53985808
Eh, Id pay 4 mana to search any land if I needed it, like Gaea's Cradle.

I need instants or sorceries in Simic

>>53985804
It's such a fun card. Also remember, you can cast it on anything with 8 power that's attacking you to save yourself from dying to normal combat damage!

>>53985807
Nope, delayed effects still go back on the stack and have to resolve.

The actual way out is to say you put Norin in the command zone when he blinks out. The effect that brings him back is not actually dependent on Norin _being_ in exile, just that you go through the motion. Then you can still hard cast him if the return trigger gets stifled.

>>53985680
I feel mostly bad when I need to play against people who have absolute shit tier threat assessment. Even when it's against me. I had someone casting Naturalize on my Aura of Silence instead of my Necropotence for god's sake. The guy wasn't even playing artifacts or anything that much. If I remember correctly, he was playing Ruric Thar creatures.

>>53985815
That was one reason I thought karlov man. Ajani, Duelist heritage, silverblade, etc., plus random stuff like the dfc soul sister from SOI.

>>53985815
Daxos O-Ring tribal?

>>53985815
Daxos?

>>53985618
>tfw noone at my lgs even plays commander anymore because "the games take too long"
>tfw bought all planes in the hopes of playing planechase commander

Sucks to be honest. I also plan on building my first "real" EDH deck once razaketh comes out.

>>53985832
No Cradle or Depths in a Conspiracy cube. =P

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How do I get my group to play at more or less the same level? We have some people who insist on playing high-powered generals with unstoppable combos, and then others who insist on playing decks built around flavor.

Nobody's having much fun, since the flavorfags don't put up enough of a challenge to engage the powerfags, and the powerfags dominate the games before the flavorfags get a chance to enjoy themselves.

>>53985845
I mostly ujst donr feel comfortable with it because its a combat trick. I tend to build my decks to be pretty hardcore even if its a silly commander like Karlov, which is the main deck id like to try it in but dont have the originality or balls to do so and decide if its worth it.

>>53985751
Tainted Strike is like an even better Hatred and both are very easy ways to make people rage. I think they're pretty funny though and accept them. They move games along quickly.

>>53985853
>>53985857
>Act of Authority
>Aura of Silence
>Ghostly Prison
>Grasp of Fate
>Karmic Justice
>Oblivion Ring
>Auramancer
>Eidolon of Rhetoric
>Mesa Enchantress
>Monk Idealist

Yeah.

>>53985883
The best way would be for everyone to make decks for the different power levels and play whatever when the mood suits them.

If people disagree then maybe split up.

>>53985891
Fair enough. I ran it in Toshiro, mostly because it was a secondary win condition as much as it was a combat trick. The monoblack instant control shell is pretty strong.

>>53985808
To be fair, Tempt is pretty good by itself if it only searched for only one land anyway, since you can get any land you want untapped, so Cradle, Sanctum, whatever. The bait effect is just too much, since if there's a single retard who takes the bait, everyone else will follow every goddamn time. Worst is that they will never even learn and do the exact same mistake. It would be excusable, if everyone searched for a Strip Mine or something, but I'm shit out of luck and that never happens.

>>53985823
This is also why a "casual-oriented" banlist is stupid. The banlist should be centered around maximizing depth at the highest level of play because players will naturally optimize and gravitate towards high end cards even if they don't straight up netdeck a $4000 Tazri Food Chain list.

>>53985883
I think there's room in competitive EDH, especially the mythical 75% format, where flavorful decks can succeed. But budget is a huge issue there. The group can also make a casual and a competitive deck, but budget is an issue here too.

The cheapest solution overall would be building a control deck, that can slow down the competitive guys, giving the less competitive guys a better shot. Monoblack control works, anything with blue can work.

>>53985929
Honestly the best strategy probably is for everyone to take it, IF everyone knows to grab strip mine, I think. But it may still fuck you up if the tempt player plays all the land death lands.

>>53985903
>>53985751
With that in mind, how do you deal with an infect player who gets irrationally upset if you target them? Once a haste-giver hits the field, 9/10 times they stand the best chance of killing me from nowhere, so why shouldn't I mow them down with Eldrazi?

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I took apart my Xenagos ramp deck, because ramping and then drop Eldrazi continiously from T5 is actually not that fun. Should I rebuild it as Samut tokens/landfall or 2ManyCombatPhases?

>>53982229
So, I've got a stupid question. I played a lot in the mid to late nineties, stopping around the time Stronghold came out. I've glanced at cards, but never really played, especially not competitively, since then.

What the hell are EDH and Commander? How are they different formats from just good old fashioned standard?

>>53985992
Tell them they don't have to telegraph their play by putting the haste enabling creature down a turn or more before they're ready to kill you.

When I run a deck that relies on Anger to win, I never put the anger in the graveyard until I'm ready to win.

>>53986020
It's ontop of that, that along with his infect cards, he has like fuck, 8 or so proliferate cards, some of them repeatable. He just always get butthurt when I go for him as he tries to point to a recently cleaned board as the reason not to attack him, when his fervor is still in play.

>>53986005
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2n6rIzIA6A

>>53985501
He used to be. He was one of the old EDH power-house commanders like Rafiq who fell out of favor over time.

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SUPER casual deck this time.

>>53986005
Technically both formats are different from each other, but 99% of the time people are talking about commander when they say EDH.

Commander is 100 card singleton. 99 card decklists, with 1 Legendary Creature that is your commander. Your commander starts in a special zone which you can always cast it from. It's meant for multiplayer, but there are duel variants.

>>53986068
Dude what. Old gisela or aurelia or razia angel tribal...?

>>53986068
That one crazy dragon/angel/demon chick

>>53985883
What about this is black?
Is it bad if I would unironically like a GW version of this card for some of my decks?

>>53986068
>>53986091
No, cant be, no plat angel... i have no clue dude.

>>53986104
Kaalia of the vast?

>>53986052
>>53986005
Also, with a new change of the rules:
-You actually can produce mana outside your Commander's color-identity
-You can choose to return the commander to the Command-zone whenever it would switch zones, be that from battlefield to exile or graveyard to library

>>53986128
Yes, that's the name. Thanks

>>53986091
Got it in one, my first EDH deck that I keep updated mostly out of nostalgia (Usually about one card per block: Emeria Shepherd, New Bruna/Avacyn, Planar Bridge, Angel of Condemnation).

Razia got cut a while back, but the other two are still in there.

>>53986052
>>53986082
Cool, thx.

>>53986104
>>53986128
>>53986138
No black

>>53986124
Just got instagibbed every time, literally not worth the slot. RW is garbage at protecting things.

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>>53985992

>You're just mad because I play infect
>Sounds like a personal problem

You can use that line fucking everywhere and it works, honestly.

>>53986183
So who's the commander? I kinda cheated and just listed every WR angel that came to mind. I forgot nu avacyn too. Ive been mwaning to work on a nu Bruna reanimator combo deck with a small angel theme

>>53986232
Usually Gisela, because she was the original and the deck is obviously pretty terrible anyway, so switching to Aurelia isn't crucial. Plus the one-shot potential is real. New Avacyn is making a case for herself though.

I want to play white and birds. Was looking at kangee. Can i have fun and sometimes win with him? How about the mono white birds?

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So, Wizards fucked up big time on the wording of this card.
As it is written it seems that you can cast it for BB to get the effect once but apparently not.

>>53986331
The smart thing to do would have been to cost it as X1BB, and have it read "When you cast <CARDNAME>, copy it X times"

>>53986325
He's far from bad. Maybe partner with Thrasios to shore it up, add green ramp and tutors.

>>53986331
I don't know what's not to get. You can repeat a process 1 time, but it doesn't imply that you'd need to do it multiple times.
You have a set process you can complete, where repeating it means just means that you can complete it one or more times. I have no idea why it's so hard to understand for each repeating retard here in /edhg/

>>53986449
Repeat: to do, make, or perform again.
The card reads as "to this again X times". They fucked up.

>>53986331
If X is 0, you do the process 0 times. The only confusing part is that they used repeat, which implies there's a first rep. It should be "Do the following process X times."
Even if you could do 1 rep, it's not a very good card at all.

>>53986483
Yeah, you do it X+1 times total. Seems fair to me.

>>53985547

She is a combo piece herself

>>53986483
I dunno if it's language barrier or something, but at least in chemistry we talk about repeats, even if we do it just once. It's just doing a set process and to me it doesn't translate doing it multiple times necessarily.

>>53984685
Where did you get that pic of Kozilek?

>>53987068
Got it a long time ago from Pixiv. File name should be the ID of the picture although I don't know if you can back-trace it that way

>>53987068
Damn, I know the artist, I got him bookmarked, but I cant get there right now to link you. Sorry dude. He does a lot of mtg art

>>53986573
But you don't actually do it X+1 times, wotc is bad at wording cards now.

>>53987342
Have they confirmed what the intent is? BB for 3 an opponent's choice between life loss/discard/sac is okay to me. It makes sense that they would design it so each additional mana spent is an additional effect.

Posting again, I updated the decklist a little bit. I'm a bit on a budget and my meta is kind of casual so I decided not to include stuff like mana vault.

http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/razaketh-test/

Thoughts/input/suggestions?

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>>53985995
Bump, one thing I really would like to do is abuse this fella

>>53984885
>Jhoira

You have no idea what you are talking about, any t1 (and I mean true t1 not your retarded list) beats Jhoira usually before she could even suspend anything. It's a powerful deck in a casual group and that's it.

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>>53987522
Fuck, wrong pic

>>53985586
Jeleva is Grixis storm. She could be Marchesa or Nicol Bolas or Sedris or Nekusar, but at a competitive level you look for every tiny advantage, and the one game out of one hundred where you cast and swing with your commander, Jeleva is most useful. It's the same reason why Doomsday Zur is Zur instead of Merieke ri Berit.

Quick rules question:

If an opponent has a Teferi out and I thus can only cast spells when I could cast a sorcery, that means I can't cast the spells I copy with Mizzix's Mastery, right?

>>53987463
Doesn't contamination counter Cabal Coffers et al? Just my first impression.

>>53986331
>>53986558
It's only as bad as "returning" a card to a player's hand when it was milled from library to grave and technically never in that player's hand to begin with.

Magic Rules Text is not English, it's basically a programming language.

>>53985089
Because they're really pretty, I guess? I was lucky to find that swamp at the basic land bulk box of my LGS.

>>53987811
>>53987857
Yes.

>>53987857
Now that you mention it, they do not work well together depending on the amount of creatures in my graveyard.. Kind of an oversight from me.

>>53987811
Wrong. Mizzix's Mastery has you cast the copies as part of it's resolution and it's still on the stack as the other spells resolve, so Teferi has no effect. Timing restrictions are ignored

>>53987912
That would be the case normally, but teferi stops it completely. He also stops spells coming in off of suspend, knowledge pool, and more.

In short: you are wrong, read a book nigger

>>53987907
>>53987857

And now I confused crypt and coffers, fucking hell.

Anyways it's still useful to get razaketh out fast, and after that I can tutor up the combo of my choice anyways.

>>53987972
But I have read a book. I just finished Jurassic park few days ago

>>53983837
Well actually it hits everything for 13, then triggers start happening. If you have two indestructible creatures and a way to copy arcbond, that's infinite damage in 13 dmg increments.

Enjoy that spicy tech. It's on of my favorites in zada - drop an eldrazi monument, then next turn arcbond+blasphemous (and if you're really spicy, some kind of life link on your creatures so you don't just lose for having the lowest life). Just make sure you're either within a window of 13 of everybody to tie the game, or outside that window to win the game

>>53983837
Also, once had a guy windmill slam a hasty, trampling Malignus onto the table, swung at a guy, and flashed out a Dictate of the twin gods

I cast arcbond targeting the guys blocker

10/10 would do again

>>53985842
>>>/edhrec/

>>53982798
http://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dictionary/english/run-roughshod-over-someone

Please anon.

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How do I make Khefnet a fun commander?

So uh... How does Yidris Wheels actually win? I dicked around with the precon and it was stupid fun, and I want to give it a try

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Assuming I have the cards to make an optimal build, who should I make for Temur Tokens: Riku, Maelstrom Wanderer or Tana/Kraum?

>>53989063
Riku

For a God Tribal EDH deck, should I use Horde of Notions as my Commander for that sweet Haste+Vigilance+Trample, or Sliver Hivelord for being Indestructible and thus drawing more removal?

I've ruled out Child of Alara, because I have no real way to bring her back from my grave for extra uses. And Progenitus is just not worth the effort to bring out compared to the 5CMCs who fuel my Gods' Devotion faster.

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>>53985126
This doesn't happen to me because everytime I sit down to play with randoms I bribe the most dangerous decks. Everyone's got a price.

>>53989077
I personally like Hivelord for two reasons: 1) 5/5 Indestructible for 5 is still a good creature even without Sliver memes, and 2) he's got a better chance sticking around to give you devotion.

>>53989063

Riku, 100%

>>53989073
>>53989104
Works for me. Thanks.

>>53989097
That's kinda what I'm thinking. The extra damage from Horde coming out swinging on turn 4/5 isn't adding up to how often he fucking dies.

Plus, I can throw down Conspiracy to make the 6 or so non-God creatures Indestructible as well. Not to mention fucking over other Sliver players by stealing their buffs.

>>53989077
Child of Alara is pretty ideal for this deck though. Just add Volrath's Stronghold and a card that tutors for it. Maybe a small amount of reanimation since that also works on the gods.

Who's excited for those new commanders from Amonkhet?

I'll have a deck for each grixis god, please.

>>53984394

These graphs are factually incorrect

>>53989157
The issue I ran into with Alara though is as much her just sitting in my grave as it is her blowing up my other Enchantments. Then I'm losing 2-4 Devotion a God. Sure, I'm blowing up other people's stuff too, but I feel like I'm losing out just as much.

>>53989224
Locust God is already a plague upon all our houses. He's easily the best card in the entire set, IMO.

>>53989224
Razaketh has me excited because I love big legendary demons.

The locust god and scarab god are pretty sweet too and I'm sure you can make a really sweet deck with the scorpion god too.

>>53989224
Scarab God is more or less Dimir Chainer, someone who I wanted to have a second color without resorting to monoblack memes. Toshiro is my guy for that kind of thing.

>>53989077
>God tribal

Hey, how about Karona, false God ?

>>53989264
The only issues are some fuckery with split cards, and the fact X spells or cost-reduction effects like Delve can't really be taken into account.

Staples for an artifact deck?

>>53989003
why do I feel like this is cropped porn?

>>53989077
Play horde, you can make your gods elementals and cheat them out with horde and repeatedly use spells like crib swap.

What are some essential cards for Knight tribal? Or at least a knight-based deck.

>>53989654
You need to play sidar kondo and vial smasher to play all the knights. The secret tech for knight tribal is praying to a higher power.

>>53989834
Already got Sidar, but paired him with Bruse.

>>53989849
Youre gunna miss out on a lot of black knights and black in general.

>>53989865
I'm mostly asking for a friend who already settled on his commanders.

>>53989422
You didn't answer my question.

>>53989904

Neither did you, but I'm not interested in yours, I want to know if its pron too.

>>53989392
Darksteel Forge, Foundry Inspector.

>>53986082
>Technically both formats are different from each other
Come again? This is the first I am hearing of this.

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Guess who.
First two don't count.

>>53990168
oloro
oloro
oloro

>>53990168
Dralnu.

>>53990168
zur

>>53990211
>>53990226
Why do people keep making this mistake? Gold is multicolor. That's a Dimir list, not Esper.

>>53990211
>>53990226
Gold is multicolored, not white, so... No, not at all.
>>53990214
Correct colors, not the correct general.

>>53990236
it could still be oloro if you just want the free command zone value

>>53990252
Sygg?

>>53990293
Nope.

I'll give you a hint. 2 of my 7 drops are boardwipes.

>>53989869
chaosphere is really my only secret tech that knights can use. Those knights have a lot of innate first strike so deathtouch on effects like basilisk collar wouldnt be a bad idea. Also brave the sands has good synergy with 2/2 that have first strike and death touch. If your buddy doesnt have one he should really look into proxying/obtaining a sfm a batterskull and a couple other key equipment like skullclamp to shore up a few disadvantages youll get from not playing balls to the walls cards like fow and vamp tutors. Also the sfm package gives you a reason to play puresteel paladin which is a knight.

>>53990168
>that spike at 3CMC
>all those multicolour cards
Lazav. What's your nine drop, Clone legion, Breaching Leviathan maybe?

>>53985702
To be honest, that was a dick move, but at the same time, if the Ulamog was a huge threat and him having his entire graveyard back was scary, then I would do it too.

>>53990341
Nope, sorry.

>>53990419
No it wasnt, a player found an opportunity to exile a fucking eldrazi titan and took it. You carebear types make me sick.

>>53990315
Wydwen? I just wanna know if that nine mana blue is Expropriate.

>>53990501
>tfw fucking Rakdos Charm lets you win against Tamiyo, the Moon Sage emblem

I legit love this card. Hoses go wide token vomit decks, hoses graveyard when you need it, blows up an artifact.

It always has uses.

>>53990544
Nope, but I will give you one more hint.

I pay one mana for lots of things, most of them creatures.

>>53990580
Fuck if I know. Gisa and Geralf?

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>playing EDH with my buddies, and we order some pizza
>driver shows up at the door, stocky little bald man in the stupid uniform with a shitty mustache and a round, pudgy face
>nervously fumbles with his debit machine
>I make some stupid joke about how I'm bad luck around technology because it's tense as fuck and I'm awkward
>he doesn't try to break the tension, specifically asks me to repeat myself, which I did, and seems completely oblivious to attempted small talk about the weather/local sports team
>carry on through my weird debit transaction, give him a $5 tip on $15 of pizza, and hand him the machine
>"Hey, did you see that party a couple of streets over? It was out of control."
>living in a shitty area filled with shit heads, I ask him about it
>tells me the longest, most rambling story of my life about how he heard loud music, went to walk his dog, and saw the party
>he describes the path he took and the timeframe in excruciating detail, consistently forgetting what he's saying as he's saying it
>tells me it was a nonparishable food-drive, but by the time he went to get his beer, the party was over, because they respect the 12:00AM curfew, man
>I'm standing there dumbfounded, trying to be pleasant
>just then my buddy Ty shows up with a bunch of deckboxes and some dice
>"Oh, you guys play MTG?"
>tell him we do, just playing some commander over pizza and brews, and he starts talking about how he plays commander
>missing our bizarre interaction, Ty invites him over later as a joke
>two hours later, he shows up wearing a purple tie-dye shirt with a dragon on it and a pair of sweatpants
>we invite him in, he takes out his decks
>Tazri, Zur, Scion, and Animar
>kicks our ass, but contributes a 24 of good beer and is no more autistic than anyone else
>leaves appropriately at the end of the night, we had fun
>he's invited to our next night

>>53990618
Nope.
Ninja tribal Vela the Night-Clad.

>>53990580
Inkwell Leviathan is the only other blue 9 drop, I think.

It has to be oona, why are you running inkwell in oona?

>>53990646
Heartwarming desu

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>>53990646
I was expecting spaghetti, but this was nice

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>>53990697
>forgetting Grozoth

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>building a new deck that i have no pieces for
>hitting $350 at 90% performance

Better than expecting seeing as the most expensive is sword of feast and famine

>>53991010
EDH decks are so expensive.

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>>53987540
>>53987522
>>53985995
Bump again, anyone have any experience?

>>53991010
>tfw i made what has become a casual brew for me and its 500 dollars
At least I already own the cards.

>>53990888
What am I even looking at?

>9/9 defender
>tutor any combo of cards to your hand with CMC 9, or any number of 9 cmc cards in your deck, maybe?
>pay 4 to make it lose defender
>or pay 1UU to... search for a card with CMC 9?

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I want to build this lady. I have the artifact ramp for it and shes pretty much going to be the end of my mana curve. Question is: What is the best way to make her? Yeah I know, damage doublers and junk but, then what? Anybody have any decklists to point me in the right direction?

>>53991028
not really. EDH is an extremely budget friendly format. you can build incredibly powerful decks for 100 bucks that will beat 4000 dollar decks

>>53991204
It's 9, the card. Doesn't search for total of 9 CMC, just 1 CMC 9 for 1UU or any number of CMC 9 for 6UUU.

>>53991208
Try archangel avacyn instead with her in the 99. Its so much more of a blow out when they dont play around her and then you play her.

>>53991208
boros is dog shit.

doesnt really matter how you build her cause you will never win

>>53991288
You make a good point. How does one go about winning with her?
>>53991294
ebin

>>53991314
Not him but Brion is basically the only not shit Boros deck and even then he is still pretty bad compared to everything else you could play.

>>53991260
Neat. Really neat actually, I've never seen a creature like that. I bet it would have made a fantastic commander, even if you could never transmute it.

>>53991208
What do you have available? Boros seems to be more... voltron given that this is the only reliable way to get card draw. Puresteel paladin and Sram are pretty reliable but they're kind of hard to source. If you're going the voltron route, you could throw in a stax package to fuck with people's lands, particularly if you're running rocks. You could just build it as a red darietti deck with a splash of white to get you swords to plowshares and cheap wraths.

>>53991010
>build mono coloured "casual" deck
>around 500$

O..oh.

>>53991344
Keep your pitchfork and torch handy when I say I actually took Brion apart. Didnt click for me.

>>53991359
As of now: Ishai+Bruse (Voltron Control), Titania (Aggro Rush), WB Daxos (Enchantment Control. A lot invested into it), Samut (Big ass creatures and Voltron), Zurgo (Wraths and Planeswalkers), Arjun (Eggs Storm), and Gonti (gonna be Scarab God tho)

I know what you are talking about though. I have Ishai for Voltron and that has RW in it, stax is technically Zurgo, and Brion died for Samut for big creature memes.

Artifact-essentric seems like it can work yeah.

>>53991314
>>53991314
heres my 2nd draft, i havent updated it with cards like land tax btu heres a rough idea. Also splintertwin was too cute so its kikijiki now. The last game I played I won with 82 life so its a good outline for what you can tyr to do. Im trying annointed procession with flameshadow conjuring right now.

>>53991645
Fucking garbage phone dropped my tapped out link jfc
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/archangel-avacyn-midrangecontrol/

>>53991615
Brion still is not good don't get me wrong, he is just the best boros commander. That is not really saying much though.

>>53991252
Sure, as long as you want to play linear boring decks.

>>53991886
kek, clearly you have never played commander before. generally the more money is put into a deck the more linear a deck is unless its mono color

>>53991775
Nah, fling tribal is a shit strat for Boros. Tokens/artifact stax or control into voltron 1shots are the way to go

>>53991903
I don't think you understand what the word "linear" means. Versatility and lines of play only tend to increase with the amount of money you put into stuff.

Tell me, which is more linear, Dismiss or Cryptic command?

>>53989274
>Locust God is already a plague upon all our houses. He's easily the best card in the entire set, IMO.
You mean scarab, right? If locust is so good, then post a list.

>>53990168
Sygg.

>>53992320
He answered already. >>53990647

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>>53990646

>Good end

I was not expecting that.

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>>53991010

>tfw got all the good shit when it was cheap and now I just have to buy random uncommons from Weathlight when I build decks

>>53982229
>making ezuri deck
>need more natural order targets/green sun taregets
I need Craterhoof and regal force, but what elSe?

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>>53992733
These are the ones I have

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>>53992749

>>53992733
Craw Wurm.
Vorinclex, Stonehoof Cheftian

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>>53992801

Does anyone have a link to the YouTube video of the kid throwing an autist shitfit because his friends won't let him separate his library into two piles in his Melek deck?

>>53992985
Why would anyone have that?

I really enjoy Gisa and Geralf but don't seem to like it simply because Muh Recursion. I can't find another Commander I really like can anyone recommend me some Commanders? I've tried Lovisa and hated it if that helps.

>>53992124
More money means more consistency. You lean on your best wincons, have nifty tutors for it. Money 100% correlates with linearity

>>53993278
Tutors and powerful combo wincons aren't the most expensive cards in the game though. Half of the cards in TFC are under $1.