https://www.warhammer-community.com /2017/05/10/new-warhamme

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>>53162152
>Brings a Titan formation to a "narrative" game
>T 20
>W 50
>SV 2+
>each
>Opponent sends fabious bile into combat with them
>he hits first due to assaulting
>hits
>wounds on 6+ (because everything can do that in 8th
>I fail my save
>His weapon is Instant Death
>Remove Titan from the field
>Remove other 2 Titans after failing battle shock

Looking forward to 8ed everyone?

Fucking rulefags. We are sick to death with the rules we want to know what happened to our setting. Throw us fluff bunnies a carrot already.

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>>53162172

>>53162172
stale pasta is stale anon

>>53162172
It's getting to the point where an 8e thread just wouldn't feel right without this particular bit of stupidity

Sternguard edition confirmed

I'M EXCITED.

>>53162172
cheese much?

>>53162201
>MOR DEYTHAN EDITION CONFIRMED
ftfy

Also are twin weapons really two wweapons stacked together and then and additional double shots at half range? So heavy bolters, according to that profile, shoot 12 times at half range? Make LR phobos better too with all those LC shots.

>>53162172
>brings a formation of flyrants to a narrative game
>charges an infinite number of grots with 60 multimeltas
>one gets killed by overwatch, psychic backlash causes other two to get really fired up

>>53162172
>His weapon is Instant Death
Assuming that rule will continue existing in 8th or FB's rules will remain unchanged.

.... soooo.... combiweapons.... awesome that very few faction have that. Why ever take a regular plasma gun or meltagun?

I'm gonna sit here and wonder what I'm getting as an offset. I'm sure other races are getting something.

Wish we could see some melee profiles. Or a twin linked profile. They just swapped the Landraider's TLHB for a HB with 6 shots.

And now you never run out of combi-weapon ammo? More fun for marines I guess.

Twin linked fusion blasters/melta squads are going to be devastating. Especially since scattering deep strike is gone.

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>land raider gets four lascannon shots
>predator annihilator also gets four lascannon shots

>>53162246
Ok theyve updated the article its just flat double shots for twin weapons

>>53162152
Chaos Termis/Chosen are back on the menu!

>>53162309
>Why ever take a regular plasma gun or meltagun?

Because special weapon troopers aren't allowed them, only squad leaders/characters/etc.

So, Hurricane bolters are 3 Twin-Linked Bolters, right?

That means 6-12 shots per side on a Land Raider Crusader.
Pretty good. Not sure if it's going to be good enough with for a Crusader compared to having 6 Heavy bolter shots and 2 Lascannon shots per side.

I wonder if they'll change anything about Storm Bolters. Were there any Twin-Linked Bolters? Those would just effectively make regular Storm Bolters obsolete.
Also, how did Combi-Bolters without another weapon type work again? Pretty sure there were those, without any extra weapon attached, too.

>Ravenwing Black Knights
>bikes
>twin-linked plasma weapons
Fuck. Yes.

>>53162379
Old combi-bolters were essentially what would be "twin-linked bolters" today.

>>53162377
also I'd be willing to bet that combi-weapons will be more expensive this edition.

>>53162285
They've already stated ID doesn't exist in 8th. Also that scenario requires the titans to all be in the same unit so as to have to make battleshock in the first place, and to have a leadership of at most 5 which is silly.

>>53162379
Combi bolters are probably going to be Rapid Fire 2

Storm Bolters I have no idea, maybe assault 3 or 4 because them remaining Assault 2 means they are the worst special bolt weapon.

>>53162437
Yeah TL as well i reckon

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>nobz with 4 shots each
>warbikers with 6
>dakkajets with 18

>>53162172
You forgot

>The titans can't target Fabius with their weapons because he's a character

>>53162476
combi bolters will probably be two boltes stapled together with the combi table, so shoot 1 bolter at full ballistic skill or 2 at -1
While stormbolters will be the same as they are

>>53162428
they might make the new combi-bolters use the combi rules - i.e. you can fire both bolters, but you take -1 to hit if you do.

>we made blast weapons better against single units
>and worse against actual squads?


What did they mean by this?

Battle Cannon: now the weakest main tank weapon ever.

1d6 shot that have to score a 4+ to actually hit something. Lucky average of 1 or 2 models hit per turn. :(

>meltagun
>S8
>AP4
>D6 damage
>if enemy is within half range you roll two dice for damage and discard the lowest

GOD

DDAAAAAAMMMNNNN

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>>53162503
>Nobz with kombi-skorchas
THE ARCH ARSONIST OF CHARADON COMETH

>>53162534
I dunno about worst but I'm really confused by it. They seemed to try and balance its hit number with the number of wounds it could generate but because of their new 'streamlined' system and it came out mangled as a result.

If a Meltagun is S8 Rend 4 Damage D6 we can work out approximate Flyrant stats

60 Multimeltas
3+ to hit modified to 4+ for snap shot, so 30 hits each generating average 4.2 wounds = 126 wounds
3+ to wound assuming T6 or 7, so 84 wounds go through.
If it has a 2+ save, that's 14 saved and so a Flyrant has T6 and 70 wounds.

DESOLATED

>Warhammer 40,000 has no shortage of things that go ‘boom’. Whereas once these weapons would have used a template, in the new Warhammer 40,000, these are resolved much faster by just using a random number of shots. This represents either how many warriors are caught in the explosion, or how direct the hit is on a larger single-model target. Otherwise, these work exactly as any other shooting.

>Explosives tend to work pretty well now against both numerous infantry and large individual models, but not as well against either dedicated anti-infantry or anti-tank weapons.

Thank god! I fucking hate these templates with a burning passion.

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>>53162552
>my rokkit buggies now have 2 shots
>they are as likely to hit as a space marine

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>>53162152
the vendetta now shoots 6 times with its lascannons

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>twin-linking now doubles shots

AHAHAHAHAHAHA, BRACE YOUR ASSHOLES, XENO FILTH!

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>>53162605
even though it isn't technically twin-linked, I wonder if they'll make this heavy20

>>53162634
>>53162605
>That Autocannon Russ gets 8 shots
Sweet jesus.

>Kastelan Robots
>9 Phosphor shots
>18 Phosphor shots per robot
Oh boy. Here's hoping their AP 3 translates into a -2.

>>53162534

It also does d3 damage. Those 2 hits turn into 4 wounds.

>Remora Drones

TWIN LINKED LONG BARREL BURST CANNONS MOTHERFUCKERS

>>53162605
Hope they balance that thing. And flyers in general.

Combi-Flamers seem really fucking good. Only losing 1 on the Bolter roll and still hitting on a 4 is pretty fucking good for d6 Flamer hits.

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>>53162414
>Biker armies get even more broken
>Crisis suits can Quad up on 2 TL weapons
>Wave serpents back on the menu with TL Scatter lasers
>I'm definitely missing some other TL shenanigans
Hyped and scared at the same time.

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>Land Raiders' fire power is now doubled
>combi-weapons are not one use only
Aww yisss

>>53162686
Combi Skorchas are better.
Welcome to da age of Nobz.

>>53162654
As far as we know two hits means, at best, two infantry models killed. The d3 wound are applied on the single models.

>Land Raider Crusader
>12 shots on each side
>6 shots on front
>30 shots per round of shooting
>and a Multi-Melta

BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

>>53162686

Combi- seems kinda OP in general. Are they really going to make underbarrel launchers copying special weapons strictly superior to actually having that weapon? Cause thats what it sounds like.

First new rule that seems really jarringly bad, imo.

>>53162723
It's better at killing big things, like heavy infantry and monstrous creatures.
I do agree with the sentiment though, they really are playing blast weapons very conservatively. Maybe they just want to nerf artillery, but I do want to see the basilisk with at least 2d6 shots or auto-hitting.

>>53162763
>Boltguns do not rend
The only thing of worth is the Assault Cannon now.

So they made battle cannons more of an anti tank weapon than a way to mop up mobs but, with it still has a chance to blow away a couple dudes on a good roll. I guess we'll see the eradicator/exterminator taking over mob work, and actually point our tank cannon, at... tanks and tank equivalents?

>>53162779
>new rule
it's not new, it's straight from 2e

>>53162152
>Double tapping combi bolters
>TL Reaper Autocannon Now fires 4 shots, as many as the assault cannon but at 1 extra strength.
Are traitor Terminators great again?

>>53162709
>Crisis Suits can quad up
No they can't. They have 3 Weapon Hard points.

>>53162654
That won't spread over, so killing two gooks at best.

>>53162309
>Or a twin linked profile. They just swapped the Landraider's TLHB for a HB with 6 shots.
They literally said that's because twin linked weapons now double the shots you nincompoop

>>53162361
This!
Oh sweet chaos gods this!
Rev up those teleporters because the black legion is ready!

>>53162801
Shas'vre

>>53162723

>The d3 wound are applied on the single models.

That's not how it works in AoS, and this edition seems very much like AoS with a lot of minor improvements and a bit more complexity.

>>53162784
Those 24 Bolters will still average on 5-6 wounds against T4 3+ units. Considering the Crusader's guns are primarily meant to soften things up, that's decent.

>>53162763
8 shots on the front brother, them's assault cannons.
>A pimped Storm raven does exactly this with an extra melta shot, while flying, and still has 4 missiles to back it up.

>>53162825
(Commander, I mean)

>>53162790

First rule for the new edition, then.

>>53162533
They did the same with flamers

>>53162827
They've stated wounds don't roll over in 8th.

>>53162801
Unless they can't take twin linked options anymore (which will probably be the case) nothing's stopping them from taking two TL weapons and firing both.

Of course this shouldn't be the case and we're all just throwing shit at the wall.

>>53162837
As long as the Land Raider has 15+ wounds and 10+ toughness on a 2+, I am fine with that.

>>53162825
Crisis suits could already take two weapons instead of twinlinking one. It doesn't change much.

>>53162864
At least in 7th, TLing takes an extra hard point and normal suits only have 3.

>>53162804
See
>>53162827

Those wounds do roll over in the game system these multi-damage weapon profiles are being nicked from. No reason to expect they won't here.

>>53162875
If we keep current weapon purchasing rules, a single commander could have two twin linked weapons and fire the equivalent of 4 weapons worth of dakka a turn. He could have 2 TLs before, but previously they were just two rerolling weapons.

Meltaguns seem to have taken a bit of a nerf at anti-tank. 50% chance to actually wound a tank and could, at best, take off half it's wounds.

Though I suppose they are better now than they were when they were shooting at monstrous creatures before so take buffs with the licks.

>>53162864
A TL'd weapon takes 2 hardpoints anon.

>>53162854
How good/bad it is largely depends on how expensive they make combi-weapons relative to regular special weapons. But like in 2e, I definitely wouldn't expect them to be bargain prices anymore.

>>53162888
See
>>53162863

>>53162866
T9 2+ is my guess. Seeing as the morkanught has 18 wounds, the raider will not have more than 15

>>53162888
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/04/26/warhammer-40000-weaponsgw-homepage-post-4/
>So, as we can see, the bolter does a single wound per hit, and so is optimised for shooting models that have a single wound themselves, whereas the lascannon, one of the most powerful man-portable weapons in the game, kicks out D6 damage, allowing it to blast chunks off large vehicles and monsters and kill light vehicles and characters in a single hit. Against something like Guardsmen or Orks though, this formidable damage output will be wasted.

I'm wondering the statline for Exorcists.

d6 shots, d3 wounds, -4 AP seems my guess (Since they already had random shots and AP 1 ends up at -4)

I mean, in theory they could be d6 shots, d6 wounds -4 AP (Since meltaguns got d6 wounds too as AP 1 weapons) but that seems unlikely due to all those shots it's piling into a poor bastard.

>>53162863

Ah, that does change things then. Yeah, the battle cannon does look bad in that case, unless there's a lot of multi-wound infantry out there.

>>53162933
That doesnt explicitly say that damage doesn't roll over. It could mean that heavy firepower is rare and is wasted firing at basic units

>Vulture with TL Punishers
>40 Shots
BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

>>53162947
Well, Terminators are W2 now. I think we can expect a lot of heavy infantry to be multi wound.

>>53162947

Comedy option, get a perfect set of rolls and it can 1 hit a Morkanaut.

>>53162956
If a lascannon devastator squad could put out 4d6 s9 wounds into infantry squads it would hardly be wasted. Better than heavy bolters even.

>>53162172
Better than 60 multimeltas

>>53162961

Yeah, I'm wondering if it will be 'Heavy' or 'Elite' that gets the second wound.

I could see them giving badass elites (Scions/Seraphim/Chosen) a second wound like how characters got 3 generally.

>>53162956
It does say that elsewhere in the article though.

>Damage is a big change. This stats effectively lets a single hit deliver multiple wounds to one model
>to one model

>>53162980
>using S9 shots on infantry
>meanwhile tanks are ripping your shit up

Win the battle, lose the war

>>53162763
Bolters only shoot once now so a hurricane bolter shoots six times.

>>53162993
Its certainly possible that damage wont roll over. It would even be interesting. Im just saying its not clear and theres no point in making assumptions until we know for sure.

>>53162993
>Buh, buh it doesn't EXPLICITLY

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>>53162152
>play Grey Knights
>No dreadknights, instead play a dual Land Raider list for all of 7th
>https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/05/10/new-warhammer-40000-weapons-part-2-may10gw-homepage-post-4/
>mfw
>ONE OF DA STRONKEST MODELS IN DA GAME
fuck....I think I just came

>>53162779
>>53162854
You only think it's bad because you never played in 2nd Ed when that was just what a combi-weapon was. As long as it's pointed appropriately, it's fine.

>>53162784
Weight of fire is still a thing.

>>53162794
God, I hope that's what a Reaper Autocannon is going to be, but somehow I doubt it.

>>53162933
Hits affects how many models it hit, damage is how many wounds it suffers. A battlecannon against a single target hits D6 times, each dealing d3 wounds. So a battlecannon can theoretically inflict anywhere from 1 wound to 18 wounds on a single target.

It's a giant fucking tank shell.

>>53163013

They still double tap at half range. The Extra Militarium faction focus entry told us how the rapid fire rule works now.

>>53163013
>10 marines meet 10 chaos marines.
>Both behind cover
>10 shots each
>3+ is 66%, so 6-7 hits.
>3-4 wounds as 50% wound.
>2+ save due to cover.
>It statistically takes multiple turns for marines with boltguns to kill even one of the other.
Surely this isn't the case? What am I missing?

>>53163013
Bolters still have Rapid Fire 1. Means they shoot 2 shots at 12" range, so 6-12 for Hurricane Bolters.

>>53163004
Nah.

>>53163055
It is the case. Special/Heavy weapons will be far more important now.

>>53163055
Nothing this is why basic marines on all sides suck. They can barely kill the most common unit type.

>>53162986
>badass elites (Scions/Seraphim/Chosen) a second wound
None of those deserve an extra wound over the common marine or chaos marine. Since Tacticals stayed the same and Terminators got a boost because the 2+ isn't a 2+ anymore it's safe to assume most models will be single wound.

>>53163078
But certainly there shouldn't be a scenario, a pretty common one at that, where the basic weapon of an entire army is effectively invalidated.

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>>53163055
>What am I missing?
nothing? pretty much already the case

>>53163055
Don't run 10 bolter marines, run 9 marines and a special weapon marine?

>>53163087

>None of those deserve an extra wound over the common marine or chaos marine.

Neither does the average run of the mill commisar but he has it.

>>53163055
This is exactly the same as current ed? Marines are tough, not damage-dealing. Walk them into rapid fire range instead of hiding them behind cover 24" away if you want to increase their damage.

>>53163055
Good thing the game is more than just "10 marines that don't move shooting at 10 spikey marines that don't move"

>>53163109
the average run of the mill commissar only has 1 wound

>>53163047
>You only think it's bad because you never played in 2nd Ed when that was just what a combi-weapon was. As long as it's pointed appropriately, it's fine.

I don't dislike it for balance reasons. Without knowing the points and availability of it, we can't really make too much of a prediction there.

I don't like it because it doesn't feel very thematic. Why do special weapons proper even still see use on the battlefield if strap-on models a fourth the size have literally no disadvantage?

>>53163091
They want you to use Infantry for map control now and probably want other, dedicated units to take care of them now instead of Infantries shooting each other off the table.

Marines being that bad against Marines in shooting is also an indirect buff to melee, since that'll ignore the cover bonus and is just as likely to hit and wound.

>>53163055

I'd assume the caveat to this is there will be some way to invest in reducing the cover of a target that will become very important, or it will become much more important to catch targets out in the open while not exposing yourself, making maneuver a bit more important.

>>53163087

The 2+ still is a 2+. Heck, it's better than it was before because it's harder to remove entirely/stacks with cover. Terminators in cover are hard to remove even with heavy weapons.

>>53163126
Because special weapons are wielded by devastators, new recruits given the shitty job of being a target.
Combi-weapons are wielded by terminators and captains, seasoned veterans who have access to the best gear.

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>Twinlinked now fires twice.

BEHOLD!

>>53163126
>I don't like it because it doesn't feel very thematic. Why do special weapons proper even still see use on the battlefield if strap-on models a fourth the size have literally no disadvantage?


Why are regular lasguns still manufactured when hot shot lasguns exist? Thematic rarity is still a factor.

>>53163091

The basic weapons of modern armies aren't especially valid. The vast majority of casualties are does out by heavy weapons

>>53163087

Terminators are the elite soldiers of a marine army but Tacticals are not.

It's like how a ethereal has a lot more wounds than a tactical marine despite not being a combatant worth a damn. He's the notable, elite guy.

>>53163159
No, no NOOOOOOO, they said they would balance tau!!!

>>53163159
Railgun wounds are mortal now.

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>>53162172

>>53163185
>>53163109
Both of your examples are independent characters and not squads.

>>53162152
>Pretador Baal
>Now 8 shots whit the assault cannon
Yeah!

Is the damage stat used against squads, or is it just used against multi-wound models?

Either way this update is great for sisters.

>Double guns on immolators
>Combi-weapons have infinite uses (squad leaders and plasma command squads)
>Meltas rip through any tough unit not just vehicles
>Exorcists > Battlecannons

>>53163204
they may double in points. chil out fagget

>>53163225
as had been said multiple times, it's just used against multi-wound models

>>53163185
>Be 600 Pound 6'9 Monster that can survive head transplants, is immune to disease, and can't die of old age
>2W
>Be some naff panzee in a stupid suit
>2W
Wot

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>8 high strength shots that generate more automatic hits on 6's

Where is your god now?

>>53163234
Cool, I thought so, but wasn't sure since AoS is the opposite.

>>53163159
>>53163204

In all likehood, they will be explosives now instead of just autocanons-equivalents. D8 or something.

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>Play Dark Eldar
>Currently firing 22 Poison shots rerolls to hit.
>8th Ed drops
>Now firing 44-48

>>53163055
You use a thing called tactics. Pin the squad down so they can't move without taking heavy damage. Then bring in something that can hurt them, like a flamerthrower unit or an assault unit. Meanwhile your opponent will be trying the same thing to you.

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>>53163318
LONG LIVE COMMORAGH
YNAREEEE GET OUT

RIP leman russ tanks

you were too pure for this world

So wait is there any way to give guardsmen twin linked?

Because with first rank that'd be 8 shots a man

>>53163318
Yeah, not from your boat though.

>>53163356
Let me just get my 8th ed rulebook and find out.

>>53162172
>owning a formation of titans

>>53163353
now there's an actual reason to take sponsons, though

>>53163353
Good thing I still have a Punisher and Vanquisher. Although I am worried how my Demolisher will be affected

>>53163356
Some sort of Elysian ground scanner thing can, but that's a big assumption that it will A) Still exist and B) Do the same thing.

>>53162709
Crisis suits only have 3 slots, so 1 TL and one noraml at max. Also I fully expect new codex to have no TL option on suit loadup.

>>53162534
Sounds to me like the battle cannon will be good at vehicles/MCs and heavy infantry.

Are MBT main guns meant for infantry? I wonder how they're going to handle basilisk. Since artillery is mainly an anti infantry weapon, 2ish kills per shot will be awful.

Battle cannon is now not so impressive on blobs, nor on vehicles (though it can still deal quite a bit of damage to them, up to 18 wounds), but it is the ultimate Terminator remover.

>>53163253
On Tera, on his golden throne, you xenos scum.

>>53163025
>Damage is a big change. This stat effectively lets one hit deliver multiple wounds to one model.

>One hit
>Multiple wounds
>One model

Are you retarded or just blind? If so, where did you find that Braille monitor?

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>>53163351

SAY NO TO FANATICAL DEATH CULTS!

-Message payed for by the The Comity for the Conservation of Coven Rights.

>>53163412
I could see the basilisk getting something like 2D6 shots, but only being damage 1.

Or maybe artillery won't have to roll to hit, like flame weapons.

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>>53162152

>land raiders get 4 lascannons shots and 6 heavy bolter shots
>Spartans get 8 lascannons shots and 6 heavy bolter shots
>lascannon contemptors get 4 BS5 lascannon shots
>combi bolters are straight up better than storm bolters


>the acastus porphyrion now gets 8 shots with its magna lascannons instead of 4

>legion terminators can all have plasma or melta guns

>headhunters now make sort of sense

>>53162723
>>53162804

It spreads in AOS and they haven't said anything about them not spreading in 8th

>>53163520
>headhunters now make sort of sense
Alpharius playing the long game all along

>>53163559
Read the thread.

>>53163559
they've said it on Facebook, and it was already said on the first weapon article as multiple anons confirmed it in this very thread
you're starting to make me think of the faggot who pretended a lascannon do d3 damage for hours on end

>land raiders get better

Sgt chronus, your up!

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S I X lascannon shots
I
X

>>53163643
It's time to bring my Land Raider Terminus back.

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>>53162605
Brace YOURSELF, Gue'la!

>>53163356

Gear and powers other than having a literal second barrel that used to grant twin linked will probably start explicitly giving rerolls to hit. That was already happening in 7th even, since twin-linking started to interact with other stuff besides hitting and they began moving away from nested special rules in general.

>5 Chaos termintors with combi-plasmas
>at 12" 10 s4 shots and 10 str 7 ap -3 shots
WHERES YOUR GOD-EMPEROR NOW LOYALISTS! WHERES HE NOW!

>>53162534

>hit Tyranid Warriors four times
>2-3 wounds to each

It's worse against hordes, but much stronger against former MCs and multi-wound models. Seems fair to me.

So, what do you think. Will this edition be infantry-heavy, big-monster heavy, tank-heavy or something else given the information that we have learned so far?

>>53163353
>autocannon exterminator
>8 Shots, str 7 ap -2
>Bad
AHAHAHAHAHAHA

>>53163761
it will be heavy
no seriously, everything seems extra-killy

Land Raider Terminus Ultras now get 8 lascannon shots, although without rerolls more likely to kaboom yourself. Still, 8d6 wounds is kinda insande.

>>53163720
>shooting like guardsmen

>>53163761
hard to say, but we might finally see mandatory MSU and mechanization go the way of the dinosaur

>>53163761
Tough to say, but I think it really depends on if you can assault out of transports and if vehicles get some form of relentless.

Right now it feels like infantry is way better. Guardsmen blobs and Chaos terminators in particular

>>53163659

>Tau vs IG
>literally fighting in the shade
>No one can hit shit because all the shots are colliding in the air
>It's raining drops of molten metal and burning bits of aircraft from clouds that look like literal hell because they are made out of constantly exploding shells and missiles and plasma and shit

All is as it should be

>>53163824
I think you mean like TEN guardsmen. With bolt and plasma guns.

>>53162152

honestly I can see why they nerfed cover when battlecannons and other ranged AOEs are going to be that much worse against hordes.

Want to kill that guardsmen blob? You're going to have to do it the old fashion way

>>53163720
Fuck the bolters, I'm just hyped for what are basically special weapon terminators.

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Tau always win

>>53163873
>Rewarding mindless blobbing

>>53163369

Explain yourself.

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>deep strikes behind you

heh , nothing personal kid

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>>53163847

It reminds me of...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sisvti3wbNk

Now you actually have a reason to get twin linked shuriken catapults over shuriken cannons.

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>twinlinked railguns are now good

>>53163898

Heavy bolters devestators are going to be terrifying as long as they aren't obscenely expensive.

>>53163977

>Heavy bolters devestators are going to be terrifying

lol wut

>>53163881
This is very true, but dakka is fun.

>>53163923
rumor has it troopers can't shoot from a transport (unless there are weapons on the transport, but they can only shoot those if it's the case)

>>53163055
Well that's why you either flank the fuckers so they're not in cover or use an anti armour heavy weapon like a plasma gun.

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HAHAHAAHAHA!
FINALLY!!!!

>>53163847
They should have sent a poet...

>>53163824
>>shooting like guardsmen
And that's where the psykers will come in.

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>>53163837
>infantry is better
>due to templates being removed blobs become the new meta
>and blobs of course, require lots of models
>lots of expensive models
>just as planned

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Couldn't they do all these changes without blowing up the setting?

>>53164112
They want to advance the story while also revamping the rules. Nothing wrong with that in and of itself.

>universal shooting, gunline benefits
>minor improvements to charging that also make assault dedicated units more generally useless
>cover mechanics designed to aid infantry
>mass shot profile spammable due to wounding mechanics
>twin linked just adds more shots

Yes, exactly what 7th edition needed. Buffs to static shooting armies.

Hmm my Helblades could potentially have 12 s7 rending shots. Popping flyers left and right.

>>53164021
True. Now I'm wishing I had gone for that impulse to give that Chosen squad all combi-bolters.

Just when I had finished up my Chaos force now there's a whole new variety of changes to play with

>>53162318
>predator annihilator also gets four lascannon shots

Both have four guns, there is no problem with that

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>>53164042

You mean this shit? I don't believe it in the slightest, Anonymous source + other better known sources apparently say its wrong.

If it is true, it guts the entire Dark Eldar Play style (which I really doubt they will do) and really forces you to use venoms to be effective and kills the raider as a unit. Which seems completely adverse to what they are trying to do with this edition.

>>53163055
The replies to this post are like a guidebook to how bad /tg/ is at games

This edition is looking bad

>>53164112
>blowing up the setting
>one planet exploded, galaxy is separated in two by a big warp rift, another god showed its ugly face, and some ultramarine woke up

Beyond that, it is the same setting.

>>53164004

30 shots Wounding on 3's, causing marines to save at 4+ is pretty damn decent if they aren't priced out absurdly

>>53164162
not having a problem, they're both straight buffs (compared to 2 and 3 shots respectively)

And now lascannons can do D6 damage a shot. I can't wait to lasercannon all the dumb fuckin' giant robots to death.

>>53162534
Battle Cannon's going to suck ass against light infantry, but that's what the Eradicator and Punisher are for. I'd rather have a Battle Cannon that does work against monsters, vehicles, and heavy infantry than a Battle Cannon that's not particularly good at anything.

>>53162586
Yeah, can't say that I'm sad to see the scatter dice go. They generate more arguments than anything else.

>>53164179
I meant this shit yes
source on the more reliable sources saying it's wrong?

Whats up with templates and covering more than one unit? If they are Dx shots, will they only wound one unit now? Or everything in reach?

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>>53164259

>>53164004
Move and fire heavy weapons now.

>>53164211
I still feel like the Battle cannon needed to be 2d6 shots. As it is now, you can't even plop it on a marine squad to decimate them.

At the very least it needed to be d6+1 or 2 or something. Having a large blast be the same number of shots as a flamer feels bad

>>53164187
>30 shots
u wot nigga
3 shots per gun, that's 12 shots at most from a single Devastator squad

>>53164259
My Defiler will bring death to everything now.

Also, Combi-weapons on Rhinos are sick

>>53164301

Oh yeah I forgot they were even more shit in 40k, I was thinking of heavy support squads from 30k where you get 10 of the same heavy weapon

>>53164316
>chaos bringing death to anything
>defilers of all units

you have very, very high hopes for 8th ed

>>53163392
this

at this point, you already won - or lost at life and it doesnt matter if you win the game

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>Just realized Justaerin, Deathshroud, sekhmets and Paladins are all probably going to be 3W

>>53164112
Its basically what WoW did in Cataclysm.

>>53164296

Still not clear if we should assume all large blast will follow this pattern, we only have the one example, and one that may have presumably shifted down in hits because it now does multiple damage per hit. Its not unreasonable to assume that the intended target for this weapon has changed from its previous iteration.

>>53164329
>>53164368
didn't they say 30k would stay with 7th edition rules for now?

>>53162863
Where

>>53164358
>D6 battle cannon shots
>4 Reaper autocannon shots
>4d3 Havoc Launcher shots
>All fired at the most appropriate target
>All along with an big pile of wounds
>And probably increased movement speed

It's a big step up from Ordnance

>>53162534
this may be balanced if they get rid of ordinance causing snapshots. 3 heavybolters can pick up the slack.

>>53164413

Only because it seems like they were as blind sided by 8th as us, the FW site says they'll probably be updating the 30k rules to 8th in a while

>>53164413
It's expected that they're going to a 7.5e sort of thing that won't invalidate all the previous books.

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>>53164112
The night sky must be beautiful.

>>53164284

you could do that already

>>53164436
ordinance isn't a thing anymore, I believe

Also vehicles can freely split fire, so the classic battle cannon+lascannon+2HB russ seems like it'll be pretty decent as a generalist. Shoot the big stuff at the big stuff, use the sponsons on the chaff.

>>53162783
And I want to see my local guard fag who never brings less than 3 wyverns commit sudoku.

YOU WANT PRAY INFINITRE?!
TOO BAD, HERE BOMBARDMENT, FUCK YOU!

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>>53164436

>LR demolisher with three heavy Flamers
>rolls up on niggas, drops a demo dump on them before doing 3D6 STR 5 -1 rend auto hits

>>53162947
Shoot battle cannon at big things. D6 hits -> D3 wounds each.

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>mfw "casual" games will be 2000point lists now

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>>53162794
>Defiler has a double Reaper autocannon
>8 S7 R:1 shots, plus 2d6 R:1 Heavy Flamer auto-hits, plus 1d6 S8 R:2 D3 Wound Battle Cannon Shots
Hail Chaos!

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>Vendettas with 6 lascannon shots.
>Vultures with 40 shots.
>Landraider Crusaders with 37 shots.

What a time to be alive.

>>53162318
Annihilator Leman russ gets three lasscannon shots, plus two heavy bolters as well.
Im ok with this.

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The hype train never stops

This fucking game will actually be playable again

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>>53164267

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>>53162172

>>53164526

Rename that filename to Thomas the Deamon Engine.

>>53162605
Brb, going to go buy 3 of these.

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Post the one thing that makes you happiest about the changes in 8th edition

>I can finally put a daemon hammer on an HQ without feeling like a retard for wasting my initiative stat

>>53164457
But now it's hitting on 4s instead of 6s when moving and firing.

Don't be daft.

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>>53162897
Nerf? ARE YOU KIDDING?

Ok envision this scenario. You are playing an unlucky ork mech player, who has to bunch up his vehicles because they take all his damn space up. Now being the cheezy piece of shit you are, you have filled your drop pods with sternguard with combi meltas. You land your 3 pods in front of his line. Now old rules say 3 of those vehicles would be fucked and everyone else is fine, but this is NuGW. Now you can take your 10 to 15 meltaguns, and splitfire. So 2 meltaguns per trukk. Remember there is no scatter on deep strike, so get fucked orks. You are blowing up 5+, 5 being average with a potential 7. This assumes anything less than 8 toughness with 7 or so wounds.

PRAISE THE FUCKING EMPEROR!

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>>53163055
>implying the Chaos Marines don't charge forward in order to slaughter loyalists for the Dark Gods

>>53164493

It's d6 shots, not hits. Your right though, definitely want to keep it pointed at multi-wound stuff. Termis and vehicles and stuff.

>>53164570
Land Raiders are now worth taking.

>>53164561
2 flyers max in a battle-forged detachment :^)

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>>53164596
>>53163055
Shit, wrong bit of fluff.

I look forward to cleaving many a loyalist firing line in the next edition.

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So... why would I ever use the bolter part of my combi-plasma?

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>mortal wounds in the psychic phase
>storm bolters in the shooting
>force weapons in the combat

Grey knights confirmed to be great again

thank you donald trump

Statistic-wise, what is better?, 3 re-rollable 5+ shots or simple 6 5+ shots?

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>>53163204
You were the chosen one New Games Workshop TM.
You were supposed to bring balance to the 8th

>>53164592
Combi-weapons are going to be more expensive than normal special weapons, so those Sternguard are going to be a lot more expensive than they were. How well are they going to hold up to 5-7 squads worth of boyz charging in and striking first?

Plus, if Deep Strike is really just "lol teleports behind you", I'd be surprised if the ability isn't increased in value.

>>53164651

Because you can fire it at the same time as your plasma

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Should I buy one of these

or..

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>>53164689

a few of these

>>53164660

Rerolling hits on 3 5+ shots gives you 1.67 hits

6 shots at 5+ is 2 hits

>>53164112
They prepared the setting for the grand finale.

Remember how Fantasy's last edition was 8th?

Yeah. There will be no 40k 9th.

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Ork bikers now have 90 Street 5 shots...

DAKKADAKKADAKKADAKKA

WAAAAAAGH

>>53164685
At -1.

A warlord titan can take two power fists with twin linked mega bolters and then have a further two twin linked on its shoulders, i.e.

>You can wade into someones army to engage in fisticuffs while spitting out 120 rounds per shooting phase as well as the 12 from the defensive cannon and 4 lascannon blasts for shiggles

>>53164685
yeah, but at the cost of -1 bs.

>>53164752
I didn't know there was a Street stat now.

What quality does it rate?

>>53164775
wisdom, you jive turkey

>>53164721
noice

>>53163847
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31vm3-BQRJU
My body is ready.

Where does it say wounds don't roll over between models?

>>53164652
>Donald Trump
As if Shit Gibbon In Chief has anything to do with GW.

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>mfw hurricane bolters

>>53164570
Nid swarm might be good/fun to play.

Just a question, but how much did Battle Cannons hit the target in everyone experience? Because in mine 1,75 (which is the average now) hits is all around appropriate to how much the hit before, just without the times when they hit a massed blob or something like that.

Looks unironically like the best and fluffiest edition ever and I play since 2nd.

>>53162152

>melee still suffering and not up to par
>they buff shooting even more

Fuck 8e

>>53164828
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/04/26/warhammer-40000-weaponsgw-homepage-post-4/
>Damage is a big change. This stats effectively lets a single hit deliver multiple wounds to one model. So, as we can see, the bolter does a single wound per hit, and so is optimised for shooting models that have a single wound themselves, whereas the lascannon, one of the most powerful man-portable weapons in the game, kicks out D6 damage, allowing it to blast chunks off large vehicles and monsters and kill light vehicles and characters in a single hit.
>lets a single hit deliver multiple wounds to one model
>one model
>Against something like Guardsmen or Orks though, this formidable damage output will be wasted.
>wasted

some other anon also talked about a Facebook post but I won't be reading all that shit again to spoonfeed you so good luck in your search I guess

>>53164428
Ordanance was a shitty rule that limited what loadouts were playable. Thank god it's gone.

Tomorrow, Rubric Marine datasheet. Lord I cannot wait.

So far all signs to my blue and gold fancy hats being baller. Mortal wounds for fucking everybody and AP -2 across the board. GIMME DAT SHIT.

>>53164500
If the game size is anything like AOS, 2000 points isn't all that large.

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>>53164953

>>53164704
Remo... Oh my god. I just realized my own Remora just got 12 shots by itself. Get Remoras. build them yourself!

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8 lascannon shots on these bad lads.

>>53164981
If they have 2 wounds like said it means that Rubric Terminators have probably 3 wounds, with Rapid Fire 2 S4 Vp -2 weapons and a sorcerer that can shit out mortal wounds.

oooo boy

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>>53162152
So Flyrants with 24 shots?

>>53164651
Because you are likely paying a premium price over the regular plasma gun?

>>53164652
>30ppm
>Btfo by any hotshot lasgun squad or autocanon leman russ.

>>53164752
how do you make 90 shots ?

>>53164756
>>53164774
Who cares? units that can take combi-weapons are almost always MEQs with 3+ to hit. You're going down to 50% hit chance but doubling your shots, the bolter part can still wound whatever it is you shoot at now.

5 plasma shots at 3+ is roughly 3.3 hits. 10 shots (5 plasma, 5 bolter) at 4+ is 5 hits. By mixing in the bolter shots you increase the chance your plasmas will hit and generally throw more damage downrange.

>>53164768
>unloading 60 rounds into 10 , 4 point guardsmen.

I mean i you want to pay $2000 to just remove 10 guardsmen instead of going with volcano cannon that select 8+ enemy unit go ahead

>>53165036
hes asking why you would ever fire the bolter

>>53164918
I tended to get a pretty consistent 4 or 5. Large blasts cover a lot of area

>>53165025
Would definitely make them worth their points cost, but we'd need to wait. I doubt they'd get 3 wounds, seeing as they have a better invulnerable than regular terminators.

But the fact combi/TL weapons got better means they also just doubled their shooting output.

>>53162794
Well presumably their lack of whatever the new rending equivalent rule is will make them better than assault canons against high-toughness, but worse against MEQ.

>>53165115

I did spend $2000 and I certainly plan on fucking around with the bolters

>>53165029
24 shots, hitting on 3+, wounding on 3+ against t4 with AP0 vs 3+ armour. Thats about ~5 wounds after saves. All hail our new swarm overlords.

>>53165118
Because the enemy is out of your flamer or meltagun range, or because you are shooting chaff and want to double shots than with your plasma only, or because you are shooting orks with your combi grav.

Also for Sternguard there is the big difference made by special ammunitions.

I dont like 7th very much but if you hate having to roll 200 dice to get through one units shooting and clunky micromanagement it looks like this edition isnt going to help you.

>>53165206
What the fuck are you talking about? You realize that rolling 20 dice is faster than rolling 10 dice and rerolling fails? Also no templates means lots of micromanagement is gone.

>>53163143
I keep wondering if the order of operation will change. Like will cover be added before or after armor mod? Is the minimum still 2+? Or is 1+ possible?

>>53165381
Willing to bet 1+ is impossible but if you have a 2+ save and go to cover for an extra +1, it would take a minimum AP -2 to start budging your save.

>>53165381

I imagine it will be like fantasy was. You can get lower than 2+ BUT a 1 always fails.

>>53165381
I think they said you still fail on a 1 regardless, but I think you can still have modifiers stacked to hell.

I feel like it'll have you add cover first and then subtract any AP, so that they can have units with 'x's save can't be reduced below 4+' without being weird.

>>53164981
I see where in the weapons focus they say it's datasheets next, but where are you getting the Rubric Marines thing from?

>>53162547
Ya I mean arguably meltas were better than lascannons back in 7th but now they're just way better.

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>>53164953
>using a sword when you can use a gun

>>53165534
They said on Facebook that Rubric Marines are going to be used as the datasheet preview to make up for the fact that the chaos preview didn't contain any rules.

Or so I heard. No way I'm going to search for the post.

>>53165534
Some guys on Facebook was complaining about the chaos article. GW asked him his fave unit, he answered Rubes. GW said okay Rube info soon

>>53164651
Firing at light infantry OR you have access to alternate bolter rounds (Sternguard or Inferno bolts).

>>53165547
As they should. Lascannons have a much bigger range to compensate.

>>53165580
>>53165581
Alrighty, consider my boner erected. Thank you.

>>53163204
YOU WERE SUPPOSE TO BRING BALANCE THE CODEX! NOT DESTROY IT!

>>53162152
Score one for my CSM terminators. I can finally run the plasma team of my dreams.

>>53164845
Joke
You

>>53165644
And the one LR we get might be actually playable. Damn I'm excited

>>53162648
>tfw just got my robots in today
>tfw not sure which loadout to go with
well this makes that a pretty easy decision.

>>53164500
Have been here for ages

>>53165118
Think of it this way. You are likely paying for a bolter on top of what you paid for a special weapon. If you aren't going to utilise your bolter, why not spend the points on just the special weapon?

>>53165675
>easy decision
The only correct decision is simply shoving Greenstuff into the hands and guns, cutting off the nob on the arm and putting magnets in both sides.

Power Fist Kastelans are absolutely fucking terrifying.

>>53165663
Now if they buff my lightning claws to be -1 save or something I will be content regardless of whatever else they put in 8th. Terminators have always been my favorite unit despite always being told they're not competitive.

Praise be to 8th! Praise be to the Dark Gods! Praise be to Terminators!

>>53162933
They have specifically answered this multiple times in clarifications on facebook. It doesn't roll over

>>53164673
Drop pods exist, and are marine thing. They would not dare enrage their marine fans. Also who the fuck cares, they just crippled the entire other army. No way they are footslogging across the board against marines, especially if vehicles dying still takes casualties on occupants.

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whats this then

Now im sad i sold vendetta. Atleast i have baneblade now.

>>53165461
They could have a minimum save in 8th by having invuln saves still in their current form (i.e. as an alternate save unaffected by ap).

>>53165719
Lightning claws are almost certainly gonna be -2 or better based on what we've seen. Might even end,up dealing d3 wounds or something

>>53164651
Well gotta kill the last 3 orks on that objective. I will just use the bolters, since I may kill myself with 5 plasma going off in double tap range.

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>Twin-linked now has double the number of shots instead of re-rolling
>Orks as well, renowned for their habit of twin-linking for “more dakka”, gain a lot of bullets from this change.

>Combi-weapons are no longer just bolter/shoota plus one-shot weapon
>...in the current edition you can only shoot the “specialist” portion of the gun once, in the new Warhammer 40,000 you can either shoot both all the time, but at a -1 to hit modifier, or choose to just shoot one with no modifier. This is a pretty awesome boost in power for a lot of elite units like Chaos Terminators, Sternguard and Meganobz – no longer just one-hit-wonders with those shooting attacks.

Not going to lie: I actually yelled "WAAAAAGH!!!" in pure glee upon reading this.

ITZ DAKKA TIME BOYZ!!

>>53163159
May the best dakka win... ya split-faced, grey-skin, assault-failing git!

>>53165719
Lighting Claws are probably -2.

From what we have seen:

AP 5+ = -
AP 4 = -1
AP 3 = -2
AP 2 = -3
AP 2 = -4

>>53165751
That would be amazing. In my area I think I might be the only person who runs lightning claw termies, which is sad considering how cool they look.

>>53165085
3 twin linked shots becomes 6 shots.
90 divided by 6 is 15, the max you can have in a squad. That assumes everything stays as is. Keep in mind its the same amount of hits as before on average, 30. But you have the POTENTIAL to go way higher.

>>53165725
Why do people keep responding telling me wounds don't roll over, I'm on your side, the article I quoted backs our point up.

God I fucking hope that Broadsuit railgun gets FUCKING GOOD. I hate the missilefist looks.

Wounds no longer roll over because now the amount of shots a gun shoots describes how many models are hit in a squad. Or how many hits a single model takes.

>>53165783
I built a squad myself out of the Tartaros terminator box, though that was before I found out that Chaos marines didn't get their own rules from them. Still sweet though, and maybe I'll luxk out and they'll remember this time

>>53165844
If I ever fielded them, I'd make something like Heavyarms Custom. Missiles attached to fucking everywhere. Maybe have one of the pods at the end of the gun.

>>53165872
I run my Cataphractii terminators in IW colors and just use them as normal CSM terminators. Nobody has complained yet.

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>>53165659

>>53165940
I've been running mine as standard too. I was mainly hyped for the idea of grenades and sweeping advances on high initiative slaanesh termies

Wow new battle cannon rules are fucking gay.this D6 and D3 for hit and wound is shit. On average I'm going to be dealing, what, 2-3 wounds maybe? Why can't it be more stable like 3+D3 hits and 2 wounds?

That's pathetic for a big fuck off cannon. Time to swap out for those sweet twin linked autocannons.

>>53165740

Some elder shit. Probably a hat.

>>53164953
What are you talking about ? Charge first, strike first, and they will be battleshock'd to death. Melee promises to be godlike in 8th.

>>53166060
On the plus side, if you hit a single target you get more wounds than you would otherwise. It sucks to see templates go, but it should speed up the game a fair bit and improve template weapons against single targets

>>53165773
>orks
>melee army

choose one

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My tarantulas are now scary

>>53164616
Or you could take multiple detachments..? Also don't know if we can squadron flyers.

>>53166060
see >>53164613
battlecannon is worse against blobs, but better against vehicles (and heavy infantry I guess since the D3 damage means they can one-shot Terminators)

>>53162810
How bout you read the article and the given profiles, faggot? The article talks about twin linked weapons doubling their shots at HALF RANGE.

The land raider used to have a twin linked heavy bolter, and now the profile reads twin heavy bolter. It has heavy 6 instead of heavy 3 twin linked.

Now either I'm an idiot who can't understand what they wrote, or they did not give a profile with twin linked. That twin heavy bolter shoots all 6 shots at full range, rather than the new twin linked profile of 3 shots far, 6 shots at half range.

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You have a Quad gun right?

File: New40kWeapons2BatCan[1].jpg (22KB, 1200x61px) Image search: [Google]

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>3.5 shots
>1.75 hits
vs murines
>1.46 wounds
>0.97 aren't saved
vs some weak t6 3+ monster
>1.94 unsaved wounds
vs another russ
>1.75/2*2=1.75 wounds
>1.16 aren't saved (for the record, the lascaanon on the hull does 1.837, making it better than the turret weapon on the imperiums MBT)
The battlecannon remains useless, hell the only thing it was any good at was spatting marines, now it's pathetic at that to.