GURPS General /GURPSGEN/

>>53030558
>What's the best advice you'd give someone who wants to get into playing GURPS?
Find a good GM to teach you. Failing that, GURPS Lite + How to Be a GURPS GM + a game you really want to run, and asking a lot of questions in the thread (or other GURPS forums). Then you can dive into Basic Set to find rules you'd like to use and add on to them.

For example, in the previous thread for an RE2 game, I suggested GURPS Lite and a select few rules from Basic Set that are appropriate to the game (Skull hit location, grappling, etc). I think that's the best way to get started in GURPS; use Lite and then pick out rules from Basic Set until you have what you need.

>>53030558
>What's the best advice you'd give someone who wants to get into playing GURPS?

Read the Basic Set thoroughly and make a couple characters and run a few scenarios by yourself or with a friend. I read 3e's basic set when I was 15 a few years back and I understood the rules. Movie to 4e was a breeze If a 15 year old kid can do it, then a grown adult can too.

If I were GMing a game, and I wanted to bring a character up to speed fast I would just teach the player personally and use GURPS Lite.

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>>53030989
I've been wanting to do my own setting, largely based off of CATastrophe and have been struggling to find a good system for doing it in which has lead me to GURPS, but after reading about the system I've wanted to do something a lot simpler as an introduction to the system for both me and the rest of my group.

So for now I've been looking at possibly doing something like a Payday style career criminal thing.

Can you have Tech-10 wars without destroying the whole world?

>>53031223
Glad you picked up GURPS! If you're asking for advice, Action 1 & 2 are made for action movie/thriller/heist games. Payday would fit in very well. Action 1 has templates for most roles in a heist movie, and Action 2 is an incredible quality-of-life supplement that has a lot of streamlining and very good rules (chase rules, BAD, and the mission planning ones come to mind).

>>53031290
What about stuff like Gun-Fu and Tactical Shooting? Or the SWAT and Cops books from 3e, at least to give some more tools for building enemies with?
Also heard that High Tech has a lot of useful stuff.

Or should I really just try to use only Lite and Action at first and then add more stuff after getting more comfortable with the system?

>>53031460
>Gun-Fu and Tactical Shooting
Gun Fu can be useful, but it's more for John Woo and Equilibrium than Payday (which, to my knowledge, has no bannister sliding or bullet-bending). Tactical Shooting adds complexity to shooting that you don't need for a heist game, unless you want to differentiate between sighted/unsighted shooting and have situational awareness and such come into play. It does have useful cover DR tables, though, which you can pilfer.

>Or the SWAT and Cops books from 3e, at least to give some more tools for building enemies with?
Haven't read them, but if they give you what you need, go for it. I've never converted material from 3e to 4e, but I'm told it's a simple affair.

>High Tech has a lot of useful stuff.
It does. If your players are gear queers, they'll absolutely love High Tech. Keep an eye on those that want to use the ammunition options, though.

>Or should I really just try to use only Lite and Action at first and then add more stuff after getting more comfortable with the system?
It depends on the group, but in my experience, players don't like being thrown into the deep end of the pool. Yours may be different. I've had a number of players that dug right into Basic Set and went for the more complex combat options, like grappling and tactical combat. In general, though, I think they had more fun being gradually introduced through Lite. It helps that I know most of the rules off the top of my head so I can just tell them what penalty to roll at for actions that they haven't read the rules for yet.

tl;dr take as much as you think you and your players can handle, then lower those expectations a bit.

>>53031223
High-Tech has a lot of gun wank, rules for making sawed-off shotguns, adding gadgets, all kinds of ammunition, and a ton of guns.
Also just all kinds of other gear. Like drills.

>>53031223
If you want to simplify GURPS, pick up Power-Ups: Wildcards; that book, by itself, does absolute wonders for simplifying the game by ditching the encyclopedia of skills in favor of a shorter list of thematic mega-skills. Want to play a detective? Normally you need to make sure you take the dozen-odd skills that covers what a detective does (criminology, body language, search, observation, fast talk, intimidation, etc. etc.), and if you miss any, your supposedly-badass detective won't be able to function. . . Or you can just take the Detective! Wildcard skill and get on with the game. It's less stress on the player, makes the game "softer" in general, and ensures a more high-action cinematic breadth of competency.

Also, it's sibling book, Power-Ups: Impulse Buys is all about meta-currency, which in my opinion helps GURPS with lighter settings as it gives the PCs more insurance. CATastrophe doesn't seem like a particularly lethal or dark setting, so PCs should have something to help them avoid in-game catastrophes.

To the guy asking last thread about the steadycam-assisted gun, UT has literally that in the Firearm Accessories section.

>>53031264
Sure. Assume realistic nanotech and development of anti-missile directed energy weapons. WMD can't be delivered, hostile aircraft can't survive above the horizon of point defense lasers. War becomes a crawling battle along the ground where artillery, missiles and aircraft are barely relevant, only very heavily steathed reconnaissance satellites or very heavily armored ones can survive exposure to ground based directed energy weapons.

Are there any GURPS supplements focused on making the combat grid more interesting or making positioning more important?

(Setting is medieval fantasy, if that's important.)

>>53033644
The Tactical Combat chapter isn't enough for you? It makes positioning incredibly important. I can't think of anything else that expands on it. It's up to the GM to utilize it.

>>53033644
The Last Gasp in a pyramid issue gives stamina rules which can make taking tactical breathers and chasing down winded foes a bigger part of combat. It even makes the "Do nothing" action useful at times.
It's in Pyramid #3/44

Here is my attempt at stating out being a "Hiver," as described in Transhuman Space: High Frontier. Note that, despite the name, this is not a true hivemind (where you have one mind distributed across multiple bodies) but rather individual people who have given themselves 24/7 access to each others 'surface' thoughts, emotions, and sensations.


Advantages: Telecommunication (Cable Jack; Sensie, +80%; Secure, +20%; Temporary Disadvantage, Electrical, -20%) [9]; Telecommunication (Radio; Reduced Range, 1/10, -30%; Sensie, +80%; Secure, +20%; Temporary Disadvantage, Electrical, -20%) [21].

Perks: Accessory (Modified "consensual use only" puppet implant) [1]; Accessory (Slinky implants) [1]; Accessory (VII implant) [1]; Application (Hive Management Software) [1]; Application (Shared-private life logging software) [1].

Disadvantages: Chronic Depression (Accessibility: only occurs when you're disconnected from a hive, -20%) [-12]; Indecisive (Accessibility: only occurs when you're disconnected from a hive, -20%) [-8]; Odious Personal Habit (Bizarre Behavior) [-10];

Quirks: A collectivist cultural themed sense of self, but only in terms of your relationship with fellow hive members [-1]; Congenial [-1].

Total Character Points: 3

>tfw I desperately want to play GURPS but all my friends look to me to GM

Fuck me.

>>53034304
>>53034346
Remember that the only difference between an NPC and a DMPC is their plot importance and narrative strength. Give the party a handful of camp followers, mostly logistics stuff like cooks, washers, and loot carriers, but one or two nameless NPC soldiers to fight alongside them too.

>>53034346

What >>53034471 said. Also, consider having a full time DMPC mentor/guide--like Gandalf.

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>>53033924
Man, that's crippling. But it looks just right to show the effect there.

>>53033695
You can go Dark Messiah of Might and Magic and put spiked racks, fragile railings and burning braziers all over the place to kick people into.

>>53035899
>spiked racks
Grab and Smash's Kiss the Wall does thr+1 imp instead of thr+1 cr (unless the spikes are blunted). Might change cr to imp if you shove them into it.

>fragile railings
Could roll 1d and on 1 or 1-2/3 they break, or just have them automatically break.

>burning braziers
Sets a hex on fire, making it difficult terrain and burning people who pass through it/ stay in it.

Seems like it'd be a lot of fun.

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Anyone got the character assistant?

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>>53036600
Come on man, Gurps Character Sheet is free and better supported.

>>53036393
Man, those are nice.

>Fragile clay lamps hanging from the ceiling

DR 1, HP 1. If broken drops burning oil to the square under it and burns for 1d seconds, dealing 1d-1 burning?

What the hell is a dueling halbred?

It's the same reach, damage and ST as a Great Axe, but for some reason its't not unready after use.

And the halbred weighs more

Long axes weigh 40% less, but are unready after use. WTF?

>>53035899
>to kick people into.
Too expensive [resources-effect and result-consequents] compared to generic stab/slash to kill.

>>53039187
Maybe not spiked racks, but fragile railing imply falling damage, which can not only deal significant damage but also leaves the opponent in a position they can't attack you from (anytime soon, at least), and braziers can be an easy source of burn damage.

>>53033924
I think the limitation values on things disadvantages should be higher, since it would be rare not to be connected. -50% at least, if not making them both quirks.

>>53031223
Use Gurps lite rules and add some stuff from action 2: exploits.

>>53033644
Did you check the advanced combat rules in the BS?

>>53038390

I asked the same things yesterday. Probably an oversight or due to the higher TL.

>>53030558
my biggest problem was just getting overwhelmed

I can't stress it enough - keep it as simple as possible, add in the detail only when it's really needed

GURPS is pretty GM heavy, like you'll need to prepare beforehand the sorts of advantages / skills etc that you want your players to choose from

you have rules for pretty much any situation possible, but you don't need to have them at the ready all the time. glance over them, sure, if you think they might come up, but just know where they are for reference in play rather than trying to learn it all at once

>>53040823
Do you reccomend like picking through the books and making lists of what skills and advantages and such you want available to players, rather than letting them choose freely from the books, and if they really want something not on your list they need your approval?

Looking through the books and having not actually played the game I think that would be the best thing to do honestly.

>>53033503
Would that make tanks irrelevant?

1. If the party has a sniper, what's the best way to use enemy sniper to ensure a sniper duel?
2. How an enemy sniper can take advantage of divination powers, aside from Danger Sense?

>>53042329
>>53042329
>1. If the party has a sniper, what's the best way to use enemy sniper to ensure a sniper duel?
Snipe couple of other non-sniper PC
>How an enemy sniper can take advantage of divination power
Precision Aiming on target ways?

>>53042494
>Snipe couple of other non-sniper PC
Oooh, finally some use for the cannon fodder I am providing the players with.

I also just though of Clairvoyance as a replacement for a scope - I assume that a successful use would completely remove range penalties. Divination would be more useful to lead the squad, but I'm not sure how to play the whole "one step ahead of you" thing, or if it's even possible. Just detecting an enemy combatants with ESP and pointing it out to the squadmates would be easier. Danger Sense, on other hand, will be a good way to get my players out of their comfort zone.

To the guy asking for a "steadycam supported weapon" or an Aliens-style M56 Smartgun.

Yes, it exists in GURPS, literally, it's description isn't even subtle, and it's described as having specifically 3 hydraulic joints.

Articulated Weapon Harness, in Ultra Tech p.150.

>>53037235
Looks good to me (besides square - that should be hex)

>>53039187
Consider the following: Some players use inefficient means to kill enemies because they can. Incapacitating someone with a less efficient means is cooler because there's challenge to it. Just throwing out a slew of rapid strikes gets boring after a while.

Also, it would be easy to make it "viable" in combat for lower-skill people if you had the spikes be barbed, so puling off did half-again injury and might require some sort of roll to get off.

Brazier provides area denial that isn't easily achieved without magic or pre-planning on the PC's part, and they might be facing something where fire is a good mode of attack to use, such as a troll, or a monstrous leper with a phobia of fire because it illuminates their hideous face.

So a few threads ago I bitched about how the layout of Basic Set is garbage. The solution is some kind of "players handbook" that organises roughly the same info as basic set but in a way that YOU ACTUALLY FUCKING USE. So there'd be chapters like this, that contain most if not all of the rules, skills, some advantages, and such relevant to the topic, example Chapter List:
>Stats
>Jobs and daily living
>Magic
>Travel
>Survival
>Making Things: Science & invention
>Breaking things (Explosions, fire, SMASH)
>Weaponry
>Combat
>>Melee Combat
>>Ranged Combat
>>Injury
>Healing & Recovery
>Mysteries & Unknown things

No more hopping around to 3 different locations spread out over 2 books just to figure out what happens after someone's stabbed in the gut.

>>53033836
Definitely Last gasp, I've used it for TL4 campaign. REALLY makes your players think, I love it. Also remember that parrying has like -2 to the opposite side the weapon's held in, (unless defensive grip is used IIRC), that makes flanking matter.

I made a tool to make the tracking of it a bit easier, haven't updated it in a while due to not having a last-gasp using campaign, but it's functional enough, at least for me.>>53043144

https://legendsmith.github.io/technicolor-dream-GURPS/tcdgapp

>>53043621
Ignore that random post link, must have accidentally clicked.

>>53043621
It's not garbage. It fills a different need, that is an easy catalog to reference. While a player's handbook would be nice for introducing new players, I would hate it as a GM and a player because everything is scattered all over the book, meaning even more pageflipping than I already do. I feel that skill lists already make it easy to see which skills are needed for a concept, and wildcard skills make that even easier.

Having an alternate layout book would be nice for those that want it, though. I doubt it would ever happen.

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>>53044154
> It fills a different need, that is an easy catalog to reference.
See I used to say the same thing until I realised that even the rules you need to reference are spread out too much.Look at healing and medical aid. You have the skills required for healing, first aid, etc spread out all over the Skills section with it's alphabetical order, while the rest of the rules for healing, first aid, and infection are in Campaigns. Insanity!

>>53044393
True, but when I'm looking at skills I'll usually be looking at multiple different ones for that character concept. Having all of the skill descriptions in one place, even if they don't cover how to use them (medical, grappling, inventing, etc.) is easier in character creation, and referring to any and all injury rules is easy in play because they're in one place without skill descriptions clogging the section up.

Different strokes I guess.

>>53045167
But some of the things you need such as modifiers and such are in the skill description.

>>53045249
True. I'd like those to be double-entried in the relevant sections, but the actual skill descriptions shouldn't. I don't want to have to skip over a page or two of skill descriptions for the rules themselves.

Another issue relevant: electronics operation would be horribly fractured across multiple chapters in your order, and other skills like it. Then there's the issue of where to put skills like biology and chemistry. Where do they fit? Jobs?

>>53045409
The skill descriptions don't need to be totally repeated of course. This is why I said a handbook is needed. It doesn't replace the Basic Set, it just makes it usable for players (and GMs) during play, for most tasks.
Also my suggested list is just a suggestion that I came up with in 10 seconds and could obviously use improvement, but Biology and chemistry would go in the Science section.

>>53045484
A handbook would be nice. It might even make people realize GURPS is full of examples of TDMs beyond the +/-10 one for driving. I guess I can see it as an accompaniment to basic set and not a replacement. It would be even nicer if it was an online compendium where you can select which books to use rules from, so healing dynamically expands to include books like ultratech.

>>53045658
That would be glorious, yes. Hell I'd try to make it, except that I'd literally be sued so hard into the ground I'd come out on the other side of the planet.

>>53041273
Kinda the reverse. A tank could be built large enough to incorporate enough armor to stop most weapons and a laser system able to stop anti-tank guided missiles, bombs, attack aircraft and suicide bombers. Mines, IED and vehicles large enough to mount high velocity guns that can launch rounds very difficult to intercept with DEW.

So pretty much tanks trying to snipe each-other with railguns, tank destroyers trying to sneak around and waiting to ambush them then run away before they get killed and infantry trying to bury mines built to avoid ground penetrating radar in the likely path of hostile tanks.

>>53045957
Are they really that big of sticklers about it?

>>53047444
You have no idea

>>53047782
Seriously? Source? Because form what I've seen, they're pretty relaxed about that sort of stuff.

>>53047942
Ask the official discord ; 99% sure you'll receive a pm from pseudo or ravenpenny about it

>>53047963
There's an official discord?

>>53048496
It's not official-official. It's run by Mook, and plenty of GURPS authors are on there (Ghostdancer and Douglas Cole come to mind), and PK even pops in from time to time.

>>53048531
>It's not official-official. It's just full of the active internet GURPS community and staffed by their writers and contributors.

>>53049410
Yup, It's not official-official, as in not affiliated with SJGames and isn't moderated by them. Or do you think authors hanging out in a community automatically makes it officially part of a company?

In terms of the using the world building tools in Basic Set 2, what would a society where everyone has their brains linked together look & function like?

Note that they'll retain individuality while none-the-less having access to each other's thoughts, emotions, and a cybernetic version of the racial memory advantage.

>>53047782
Not a smart move for a company hemorrhaging money whose biggest complaint is their lack of accessibility.

>GURPS Discord
Literal cancer

>>53049831
Eh, I find it helpful sometimes. At least for speculative campaign ideas among likeminded non-4channers

>>53049693
That players handbook thing that guy was talking about would make this game so so so much easily accessible to new players.

David Pulver...

>>53043621
I will say that better organization would help a lot, though I don't love that setup.

Maybe Chapter 1: Generating Stats and Derived Stats. Wealth isn't here anymore
Chapter 2: Non-supernatural/exotic advantages
Chapter 3: Exotic and supernatural advantages
Chapter 4: Non-supernatural disadvantages
Chapter 5: Supernatural and exotic disadvantages
Chapter 6: Basic skills
Chapter 7: Exotic and unusual skills, optional specializations of skills in chapter 6
Chapter 8: Wealth, Money, Employment, Gear. Explain confusing shit like Wealth determining your Employment choices and how much you will be paid, but Status setting your cost of living.

Honest question: Do people read the gamemastering chapter of GURPS? B496 alone is a wealth of information that covers all of the basic advice for GMing GURPS:
>GURPS is realistic
>Fighting in real life is bad, so people try to avoid it
>People don't throw away their lives. If the fight isn't going their way, they run
>Points don't equal combat effectiveness
>Reduce lethality with a combination of Extra Effort, Buying Success, and Luck

Seriously. It has so much good advice it's insane.

>>53053308
A good number of GMs do, I believe, as well as some players. Memers, though, don't get past page 1.

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>>53053308
There's a lot of good stuff in the Campaigns besides the fluff. It's a great resource.

>>53051703
Yeah I really want to make it, I have the skills but if I put it online, I hurt SJ games. If I don't, then what's the point? It really would make the game more accessible, and GURPS desperately needs that. They should have just made this instead of that dungeon fantasy thing.

>>53051703
Yeah it would huh?

>>53052730
That's still a bit too list-like for me, unless you're talking about an alternate layout for basic set, in which case that is better for sure.

Thinking about running a scenario for a bank heist. Is it possible to use GURPS-lite for this?

>>53056224
Sure. You don't have many options for guns, but if you want to keep things to lite you can certainly handle a bank robbery with the rules in there.

>>53056224
For the players, yes; GMs might want to read Action 2 as well.

>>53056210
>I hurt SJ games
I don't know about that.
I still want to buy the books even though I have the entire library availible for free because I like the system and having physical books is more convenient than pdfs

>>53057161
>>53057914

Cheers, i'll have a look and give it a try

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>GURPS Lite isn't called BURPS

They missed out on that one

>>53058706
BURPS is already an actual RPG though.

If creature does not have FP (such as Vampires from MH), does it means it is completely immune to fatigue damage from freezing attacks?

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>>53061782
Yes

>>53061843
So they can't be frozen? There are rules for freezing the objects, can you use them?

>>53062075
Really it's GM's decision, it's probably just counts as tox HP damage.

>>53062867
>>53061782
Very intense cold does burning damage, with a effect that it won't light things on fire

>>53063312
Yeah, nah, cryokinesis in Psionic Powers is statted as two separate innate attacks, freezing that does fatigue damage, and frostburn that does burning damage.

>>53062867
I'd honestly just crib the rules from Extra Effort and machines (Powers p. 160): instead of reducing your (non-existent) FP, reduce your HT instead. Obviously, I wouldn't use this for FP-draining IAs, but extremely cold weather can cause cars and other machines to throw rods or mess up in other ways. The rules for cold under Hazards combined with this addition would work (just remember to add a bunch of levels to Temperature Tolerance for most machines/undead creatures!).

Alternatively, just use the rules for Slime, Sand, and Equipment Failure (p. B485) any make judgment calls on how often to roll.

>>53066298
Nice reading comprehensio, but I need it for creatures, not objects.

>>53068753
For the purpose of handling the FP issue, an undead creature IS an object fucktard. You've got things with FP and you've got things without FP.

I love Sorcery!

I am looking for a few players/playtesters for a Megadungeon campaign im building. I'm planning for it to be 250/-50 High Fantasy. for more info join my discord channel at https://discord.gg/SC7NhuD for more details on the setting and general questions.

>>53030558
I'd love to get into GURPS but like, do we have a MEGA or something where I can actually get these books?

>>53072437
>he didn't read the OP

>>53072437
Look at the OP's image.

I am new to GURPS. Why the "Bear" from DF Allies doesn't have No Fine Manipulators? What would Bad Grip 1/Ham-Fisted 2 allow a real bear to do which justifies not giving him Quadruped?

And if that's an.. unusual bear, he totally can wield swords with that shit, right?

>>53073248
Because they wanted it to be better than ordinary bear. They even putted emphasis on this fact in description.
And yes, such bear can wield sword, although it is not necessary a good choice, considering he will get -2 penalty from Bad Grip and doesn't have any weapon skills in the first place.

>>53073248
>>53073388
Also, even ordinary bear isn't Quadruped, since they are Semi-Upright instead of Horizontal because they can walk on two legs more or less normally.

>>53073388
> They even putted emphasis on this fact in description.
I skipped the descriptions, so that's my bad, thanks.

>>53073436
Yeah, I think I need to just go and watch some wildlife on tv. I am also planning on looking through the 3E Bestiary, from a quick glance it has a lot of info on how and why animals are statted the way they are (although I am not sure if that's still relevant in 4e).

>>53073388
>Because they wanted it to be better than ordinary bear.

He's smarter then the average bear.

He can bear the heaviest loads and beat the Pooh out of the grizzliest competition.

How do spells that you put energy into each turn work with the reduced cost for high skill levels?

Does the reduction work on the final cost of the spell or the cost each turn?

>>53075482
Final cost.

How do I stat the ability to disregard range penalties at certain range? Fluffwise it's a limited precognition that allows to predict the bullet path.

>>53075655
Telescopic Vision does exactly that. No Targeting, -60% if you don't want accuracy bonus.
For limited range, I don't think there is straight solution, but here are my thoughts:
Increased Range, LOS is equivalent of 2000+ yards range.
Thus, assume that unmodified ability would work only on that range as feature, since it is not meaningful limitation in most cases.
Then apply Reduced Range to bring it to 1000, 400 or 200 yards. I guess you can extrapolate range divisors further if you need to.

>>53075888
>Telescopic Vision
Fucking wow. 18 points, and you get no range penalties at two kilometers. Quite unrealistic, I think - zooming in is not the only thing that matters in targeting, you also need to account for ballistics, wind etc. My original plan was to use Clairsentience to get a vision of the target up close, but I abandoned it for exactly that reason, hence why I want it to be a full-on precognition. Or am I overthinking this?

>>53076097
GURPS doesn't take bullet drop into account as far as I know. Or at least doesn't separate it from general range penalties.
>18 points
36 points. Telescopic Vision 18 is 90 points, -60% for No Targeting makes it 36.
It's cheap but auto-hitting innate attack isn't necessary more expensive.

I've been running and playing modern gurps for a while, still dont get unfamiliarity penalties.

What decides which weapons you're familiar with and which ones you're not? What are the categories? Does it always apply to weapons you're using with skill defaults? Ree.

>>53076379
Each model of weapon is its own familiarity (subject to reason as determined by the GM of course; exceedingly similar models like updates and minor variants should fall under the same familiarity). I think I remember reading somewhere that characters start with two familiarities for each point in the skill, so a guy with Guns (Pistol) DX+2 [4] is familiar with eight varieties of pistols (plus any other pistols that at every similar to those models, as well as any familiarities learned during play). However, character background should determine what those familiar weapons are -- a cop and a mafioso probably have different gear they are familiar with.

I do think that unfamiliarity stacks with defaulting.

>>53075888
>>53076097
>>53076272
Telescopic vision doesn't help with attack rolls. It only applies to Vision rolls.
The full version adds a bonus to Acc, and that's the only way your attack rolls can benefit from Telescopic Vision.

>>53075655
I'd go for Guided or Homing. Easiest and most straightforward way I can think of is to just use the Imbuement for it. It's not 1:1 what you want, but it's pretty close and does let you ignore range penalties.
Powers, I think, has the cost for applying regular enhancements to non-innate attacks like guns.

Did anybody work out a system for kingdom/country gestion ?

>>53077194
Start with boardroom and curia, stat out your national or city governments as organizations, use the rules for influencing internal policy; use Social Engineering rules to influence government organizations of other nations or cities. Combine it with City Stats if you want help determining tax rates for military expenditure, and especially with Mass Combat if that is your goal.

>>53049665

Bumping for a response to my post.

>>53049665
>>53078142
>..., what would a society where everyone has their brains linked together look & function like?
>Note that they'll retain individuality while none-the-less having access to each other's thoughts, emotions, and a cybernetic version of the racial memory advantage.

Sounds like you've already decided they're a normal typical society, but all members have cybernetic racial memory.

What else could we tell you?

Are permanent advantages made temporarily activated (like Amphibious that Costs Fatigue, for example) legible for Temporary Disadvantage limitation (continuing the example above - the char's skin turns scaly and ugly)?
>You may add this limitation to any advantage that can be switched off and on at will, and that takes at least one second to switch.
These clauses confuse me.

>>53080966
Yes; if you have modified an advantage to have a certain [quality] that makes it a valid choice for other stuff that looks for [quality]

>>53081069
Thanks!
Another question: if you tack Takes Recharge onto Striking ST, what would Striking ST's duration be?

>>53081093
Usually if you make something have limited activations or uses, it has a one minute use time, AFAIK. Check Powers for details, but I think that's the default assumption.

>>53081093
>>53081258

Striking ST is a weird one though, one "use" of an advantage like Innate Attack or Warp is simply one activation, it's possible that one use of Striking ST is one attack.

If one wanted to stat a, for lack of better example, The World/ZA WARUDO style time stop, what would the best way to do it be?

Right now I'm considering ATR, with "needs recharge" but lasts for 1 second per activation rather than one minute, and linked with Invisibility. So you can once every few minutes, take X (where X is levels of ATR) actions instantly, and no one can perceive you during this timeframe. Does this seem good?

>>53081574
Impulse Points for bullet time is cheaper and easier. Pyramid #100 for details.

>>53081574
Bullet Time. It's an option that lets you spend 3 character points to stop time for one second. It can be activated whenever, even when it's not your turn. During that second, no one can move, react, or make active defenses; further, if you activate BT in response to being attacked, any movement on your part makes that attack just straight up miss.

ATR doesn't work because people can still trigger their Waits and make active defenses during your extra turn. The time stopping abilities from Powers have weird caveats like you not being able to interact with targets (plus they get to resist).

BT is expensive, but there are some advantages that give you a constantly supply of points you can spend like character points to buy success or influence the game. One of the recent issues of Pyramids explored taking the cap off of those advantages; a pool of 15 points (enough for five consecutive seconds of stopped time) that refreshes fully after every 30 seconds of game time and can only be spent to stop time costs a very reasonable 1k+ points (I think; I might have messed up the calculations a bit).

>>53081649
I don't see how? It costs 15 points to have enough IP for one second of Bullet Time, and then 240 points to get 1 if those back every two in-game hours. 720, if you want to get 3 back every two hours. And that still only gives you 1 second of bullet time, and that's every two hours.

>>53081854
Okay, not cheaper, but more accurate, and definitely easier.

>>53081773
>very reasonable 1k+ points
If this were a character in an otherwise rather mundane setting that would be insanely reasonable, but I feel like an otherwise mundane human with that power would kind of be outclassed by a more properly built character with 1K points. They'd be able to run amok as a god against normal characters, but would be useless in the kind of conflict you'd see in a 1k point game.

>>53082113
Yeah, and a character with a really cool 50-point ability is going to be useless in a 50/-15 point game. Never drop all your points one one ability, even a really adaptive/modular one.

Also, there are always ways to make it cheaper. These range from legit (Costs FP/HP, Takes Extra Time, Gadget, etc.) to cheese (buy a STANDO ally and have the Ally waste all their points on Bullet Time instead of you).

Also also, one last thing, I messed up earlier because it should be recharges every 30 seconds of play time, not in-universe game time. I don't know if that changes your evaluation, but yeah, the ability to stop time nearly constantly is very powerful and SHOULD be very expensive. It doesn't take much creativity to think up ways you can wreck nearly anyone's day with time stop.

>>53082848
Okay, now what if I were okay with the limitations that come with ATR+invis? IE:Active Defenses(probably some fluff about it not being quite perfect, and then able to get an "impression" of an attack, albeit penalized, because invisible) would that still work as a decent, lower level jury rig, especially if I were more focused on the utility, rather than pure combat murder?

Why doesn't Tactics require specialization?

>>53084518
Isn't the point being that you literally stop time and can act and kill people that are totally helpless, and avoid otherwise impossible to escape attacks?

I don't think it's possible to get it for cheap because it's not a cheap effect. ATR+Invisibility would be something else, and arguably more interesting. Someone too fast to see, but not a bad writer's infinity+ 1 power.

>>53088023
Well yes, hence why I'd be happy to roll with it, I'm just curious if it would be a good approximation of a "soft" timestop kinda thing. If that would be an appropriate fluffing for the effect.

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>>53086092

Should I allow players to trade in points spent on skills towards the skills' attribute?

For example, if they've spent earned points on 5 DX/Hard skills at DX+1, could they reduce those skills to DX+0 and spend the 20 points that frees up buying an extra level of DX?

I'm thinking of allowing it because being able to spend earned points immediately seems more fun than having to save them up for several sessions, but I'm not sure if it would be balanced.

>>53089425
I'm not going to say whether or not it's a good idea, but consider this: Having five off-hand weapon training perks allows you to exchange them for the Ambidexterity advantage. So I think it's fine to go ahead and allow it, but be mindful that it's making characters much more competent than what their previous point allocations allowed.

>>53030558

Be a good GM.

Inform them of the very basics.

Tell them you'll do all the work, and to just ask you how to do something when the time comes.

They'll probably learn the system from there, or even choose to read stuff at their own pace.

More work for the GM, but it's much safer to get players into a game by not having them do too much work to get to the fun.

>>53089425
I think Social Engineering Back to School has a mechanic like this, with a slightly less favorable exchange rate... I think it is either 6 or 7 skills instead of 5.

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3e art was pretty good.

>>53091007
DELETE THIS
Fuck, his face always makes me laugh

>>53090996
>>53091007
What went wrong?

I'm quite a fan of Car Wars, especially the way vehicles handle. Do you think converting over some of Car Wars vehicle rules over to GURPS would work well?

>>53043144
Those are neat, you can mount an M2 Browning on one. Grab the two perks that allow you extra strength solely for weapons, and 12 strength and you're toting a real nice, albeit expensive, weapon that can kill most power armor or buildings.

>>53046756
This is basically the future we're heading towards currently with laser systems. The air force is in denial and trying to get a tank-killing laser working aboard an aircraft, ignoring that a much less powerful laser can be mounted on a more survivable ground vehicle and nullify their airborne laser by simple expedient of dazzling the pilots.

>>53091707
>The air force is in denial
A large amount of any military operates on denial, sometimes because their income depends on it, sometimes for other reasons. This usually lasts until the next conflict with a similarly (or better) equipped opponent, at which point their denial has to face the cold, hard facts and they are forced to adapt or die.

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>>53091745

Give an example for this speculative-seeming shit?

>>53091818
History is rife with examples of advisors with new ideas being overruled by the old guard resulting in the deaths of a bunch of soldiers.

WW1 is a great example. By the time the war rolled around, there was already plenty of information about the changes modern weapons brought to the battlefield, but the main militaries involved were too conservative in their attempts to adapt to this new style of warfare, which resulted in a lot of lessons learned the hard way. WW1 also led to the development of several ideas by military theorists very similar in concept to Blitzkrieg, which were dismissed in the interwar period by countries like the Soviet Union (mostly for political reasons).

A story of denial going the other way is the infamous removal of guns from early jet fighters and lack of dogfighting training by the US forces once guided missiles became available.

>>53091872
Also see: Japan building mega battleships in WW2 instead of focusing on more carriers.

Or currently, how the USAF has been trying to retire the A-10 for years, despite its being supremely effective in the middle east conflicts.

>>53091707
Hell, with FEL miniaturization hitting full stride the problem is that aircraft simply can't mount enough armor to survive 2-3 seconds of flux from a high energy laser in the x-ray band and a tank could mount enough armor to hold out for thirty seconds.

>>53091872
Despite the infamy of guns being mounted only on external pods for the USAF's F-4 fleet in Vietnam the reality of things is that guided missiles were the real killer, with 86 guided missile kills to 16 kills between internal guns in the F-4E, gun pods in the C and D and counting a kill where a MiG massively damaged by a sidewinder was finished off by gunfire.

The F-8 Crusader has a slightly more absurd story.. It was the 'last of the gunfighters' and had 19 air to air kills.. and only four of them were with the four 20mm cannon they carried, 14 from the Sidewinder air to air missile and 1 from Fear. (Or hostile malfunction. Opposing force pilot ejected from an undamaged aircraft).

>>53092059
>guided missiles were the real killer
Yes, but you're missing the point as to why that incident is so infamous.

I'd elaborate, but it's almost 3 a.m.

>>53092059
Yeah, but the missiles they were using, the Falcon? Was all but useless in terms of reliability and effectiveness. The real clincher is how many comparatively very expensive missiles were expended to get those kills, vs how inexpensive bullets were.

Not to mention having only AA missiles means the jet can't even do minor ground attack like you can if you have a cannon mounted.

As you mention, switching to the Sidewinder was more effective, but it had a shorter range which still let enemy fighters close to near cannon range.

>>53092082
>>53092109
In 'Nam? The biggest killer is the AIM-7 Sparrow, a semi-active radar guided medium ranged missile. followed by the AIM-9 Sidewinder, a short ranged IR guided missile.

You aren't wrong about the Falcon. In 54 launches resulted in 5 hits. It required up to 20 seconds to achieve a lock.

That said, the F-4 wasn't restricted to AA or ground attack load outs. The relatively light sidewinders could be mounted on outer pylons, while four inner hard points could carry long ranged Sparrow missiles, air to ground guided missiles or bombs.

>>53092082

It's sort of infamous because the USN deiced the reason for their problems was a lack of air combat training. So they created a program for tactical air combat training.

This was called 'topgun' and inspired the movie Top Gun.

I'd argue that a gun is a good tool for a fighter because otherwise you can end up with some timidity and a lack of confident in tight maneuvering. Pilots without a gun tend to be very aware of the minimal ranges of missiles, and thus the gun is more useful then the pure post-combat statistics would suggest.

>>53092299
A gun on a fighter is like a knife or bayonet in the infantry kit. You'll almost never need it or use it, but it's still good to have just in case.

>>53053361
>Implying memers actually touched any of the books, even Ultra Lite

Ok, a stupid question. Should a leather jacktet - you know, the type you can expect from a stereotypical biker to wear - provide any DR or it's still just under 0 DR clothes?
I'm not asking about stopping bullets obviously, but does it come with any DR at all?

>>53093324
Leather usually provides 1 DR, but I think that's for boiled leather armor, not just clothing. Should ask your GM.

I'd lean towards yes, personally. Bikers wear leather for protection after all, and it's only one DR

>>53093351
Thing is - I am the GM. I know biking gear (the professional one) can sustain some serious damage, as it exists to protect your body in case of accidents and it's damn good at stopping possible damage caused by friction. I know basic leather jacket and trousers would do the same, only less reliably. And it's about stopping cut damage, for which leather, if just thick enough, is pretty good.
Just asking around for opinions, since I think myself it should give 1 DR against slash damage and it's pretty important for upcoming campaign.

>>53091672

Note the excessive combined weight though, you'll need power armor or a fuckton of implants yourself to get the ST just to lug the thing and it's ammo around. And of course, you should reasonably expect enemy power armor units to field similar weaponry.

>>53094058
Replace M2 with Kord, this will save 27 pounds.

>>53094058

Yeah, you should. I've been arguing with my GM that most PA in the setting should have at least .50 caliber 'assault rifles', maybe something like an XM500 with an expanded mag.

On the other hand, most of my character's fighting is done in micrograv, so it's mostly just dealing with inertia and recoil instead of worrying about weight.

>>53094221
Would have, but most equipment was limited to NATO-surplus. Good idea for anyone else with less restrictive equipment on starting though.

>>53072437
I know that I'm a day late on this, but I'd still like to take a moment to highlight the utter retardation of this poster.
>Do we have a MEGA or something where I can actually get these books?
>He asks while literally quoting the post containing the MEGA
I can't tell if this guy is trolling or seriously that stupid, but surely he is a candidate for shit-poster of the year.
Congratulations, you are dragging the quality of this board down simply by being here. We are all stupider (Relax, it's intentional) from being here with you.

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I told you this would happen, but you didn't listen.

>>53095946
To be fair, you could've posted that yourself.

>>53095946
Shotgun guide:
If using shells, treat as an automatic gun with RCL of 1 and RoF as the resolved product (eg 3x9 = 27)
If using slugs, multiply damage times 5, upgrade damage to the next level PI, set Rcl to 3, and RoF as first multiplicand (eg [3]x9 = [3])

for optional rules such as damage at close ranges, custom ammunition types and loads, or others, consult the appropriate sections in Basic Set, Low-Tech, High-Tech, as appropriate according to your genre.

Is that a good Shotgun cheatsheet?

>>53096119
Well, can't argue with that, but I can still be upset that this image is earnest and being used for the exact opposite of what it was made for, regardless of its quality.

>>53096163
Calling RoF a resolved product or multiplicand is too math-y and will scare people away.

Something more like this as a guide:
>A weapon with a RoF followed by a
>multiplier (e.g., RoF 3x9) fires shots
>that release multiple, smaller projec-
>tiles. The most common example is a
>shotgun. The first number is the num-
>ber of shots the weapon can actually
>fire; this is how much ammunition is
>used up. When resolving the attack,
>however, multiply shots fired by the
>secondnumber to get the effective RoF.

>Example: Father O’Leary’s shotgun
>has RoF 3x9. He chooses to fire three
>times at a demon flapping toward
>him. For the purpose of the Rapid Fire
>rules, he his three shots are an attack
>at RoF 3 x 9 = 27, because each shell
>releases multiple buckshot pellets.

>At extremely close range, multiple
>projectiles don’t have time to spread.
>This increases lethality! At ranges less
>than 10% of 1/2D, don’t apply the RoF
>multiplier to RoF. Instead, multiply
>both basic damage dice and the target’s
>DR by half that value (round down).

>Example: Father O’Leary’s shotgun
>has 1/2D 50, so once that demon flies
>to within 5 yards, it is close enough
>that the pellets won’t disperse much. If
>O’Leary fires three times, his RoF is 3,
>not 27. But since the attack is a ¥9
>multiple-projectile round, a ¥4 multi-
>plier applies to both basic damage and
>the demon’s DR. The shotgun’s basic
>damage is 1d+1, so O’Leary rolls 4d+4
>for each hit (up to three, depending on
>how well he rolls). However, the
>demon’s DR 3 becomes DR 12 against
>the damage.

would be better for teaching people how to use shotguns, and coincidentally is the exact text from B409. Add on "Rcl: Shotguns have two Rcl figures. Use the first when firing shot, the second when firing slugs or other single projectiles."

So, I am planning a cyberpunk style game for GURPS, set in the far distant future with a focus on biotech. Any advice or helpful tips for me? This will be my first foray into GURPS.

>>53096370
Probably going to want to be a bit more liberal with points than a standard GURPS game, since unlike shadowrun augments in GURPS cost points and cash instead of just money.

>>53096419
I thought that I could rule that they only cost cash. Thats what shows up as an option in GURPS cyberpunk, although I will be using 4e

>>53096474

You can rule that if you want, and arguably should. I kinda wish my GM would. I'm in a 20 minutes into the future game where augments are a thing, but I can't leverage my character's expertise as a geneticist to reverse engineer or put together any augments because no one can afford to pay ten sessions worth of points on an improved heart when we only play weekly.

>>53096474
It IS an option in 4e (B295).

>>53096370
While BioTech can be a very useful book, don't feel beholden to it. Read How to Be a GURPS GM.

>>53096419
That's entirely up the the GM. Character enhancements can cost points, cash, both, or neither as appropriate for the setting, tone, and sense of balance.

>>53096614
I will bring that to my GMs attention and see what he says. Recovery time will be a pain, but still faster than waiting for an appropriate number of points to build up.

>>53096523
>>53096522
I am planning on ruling that, as it seems more logical for you to buy equipment and so on. However if they want to not use money, I will give them the option to spend points to represent them being poor punks, who got some street arguments before starting the game and being hired as an operative by the corps.

>>53096652
If not, you can always try and take limitations that you remove later to represent the augment needing time to fully interface/activate/normalize. For example, an implanted super-heart may require the recipient to take immunosuppressants to avoid rejection; this not only makes sense in-universe, it also adds on cost-cutting limitations like Temporary Disadvantage which makes the advantage more affordable. When you can afford it, buy off the limitations; the implant no longer risks rejection.

>>53096811
That's only true if you're not using the patient's own genes and tissues to construct the heart, but I'll see what the GM is willing to lean on. I really want to be able to reinforce bones and muscle.

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>>53095946
Here gurpsgen I made this

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>>53097129
Also this simpler one

>>53097129

Wish I had this one last night, some FATE players were whining about GURPS in the Eclipse Phase general. Thinking I ought to switch to Transhuman Space.

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>>53097129
>>53097282
Memetic warfare is a tricky thing. I appreciate the effort, but presentation is everything. Keep in mind that the smaller it is and the less information, the better. Pic related is the extent of shotgun rules in Basic Set. No rapid fire because that applies to most guns, no calculating hits by Rcl because that applies to most guns, no statlines that muddy the waters. Just the shotgun rules and nothing else.

>>53097282
This one wins by the virtue of not being passive-aggressive and showing how much useless, super-specific stuff was added to the original "cheat sheet"

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>>53093351
>>53093384

Per Low Tech a modern motercycle jacket would count as Light Leather, providing DR 1 vs CUT damage and DR 0 otherwise. Particularly durable, heavy leather jackets would count as Medium leather, and give 2 DR vs all damage and 1 DR vs IMP damage, but it would weigh 12 pounds (quite a heavy coat, but not out of the relm of possibility).

This is explicitly not hard boiled leather, it's flexible and vulnerable to blunt trauma. The boiled leather version weighs a bit more but isn't flexible and doesn't take any penalty to protecting from IMP damage.

So on the topic of shotguns doesn't the rule where basically half your shotgun projectiles autohit when in close range mean that you could theoretically do more damage from far away if you got a roll good enough where ALL your shots hit? Also doesn't this make slugs better than most buckshot at close range as it does 4x damage which is as much as the bonus you'd be getting for close range shots with most buckshot without all the multiplied dr and a bonus of better damage types, more accuracy, range etc.

>>53100416

Maybe? It mostly evens out since DR is increased as well. And yeah, slugs are pretty awesome, as long as you're accurate. With buckshot, you're at least guaranteed to hit something, and usually all over where armor isn't thickest such as over the limbs or eyes.

With slugs you're basically stuck hoping for the best, or trying to power through DR with raw damage. Which isn't always a bad idea with APHC or sabots.

The real fun is in autoshotguns like the USAN, seeing as they reduce slug recoil, or can pump out buckshot like a mini-flak cannon.

>>53100416

Not only that. RoF 1x9 gives a +2 on your attack roll, so disregarding range penalties, on the same roll you'd get 1 hit up close, 3 hits on range. It's very easy to do more damage from far away, you only need to roll two lower than up close to get more damage.

>Also doesn't this make slugs better than most buckshot at close range
Slugs ARE better than buckshot at close range. One solid projectile as opposed to a loose collection of small projectiles hitting close to each other.

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>>53100416
Yep. In general I'd suggest that instead of the weird multi-hit rule that you treat point blank shotgun fire (within 4 yards) as a slug with (.5) armor divisor.

This also prevents magnum 10 gauge from dealing 12d (DR x 6) at short range, something that can send people flying absurdly around.

>>53100625

Slugs, especially magnum slugs, can crash though a LOT of armor. APHC shotgun shells can crack even heavy body armor.

>>53100771
Like I said, with APHC or sabots it's not a bad idea trying to just overpower DR.

>>53100771
>12d

>42 damage average
>Flying back 12 feet even if the DR stops all of it.

How it feels to chew 5 gum.

>>53100771
>>53100924
Only Crushing and Cutting attacks inflict knockback

>>53100771
>>53100827
Still can't compete with a battle rifle though, unfortunately.
The only place a shotgun really shines after TL 5 is when you need easy access to exotic ammunition on the fly.
The same weapon can fire armor piercing discarding sabot against armored units and perform almost as well as an assault rifle, shoot down small flying drones or what have you with shot and perform almost as well as an SMG, and additionally can fire teargas or beanbags against unruly civilians.
And even then it's sort of a hard sell, a combat shotgun with ammunition is very heavy, and you might be able to get a rifle with underbarrel launcher for the same weight.

Or in a magical or post apocalyptic setting, where the extreme ease with which you can load shells with bits of silver or nuts and bolts and still get a decent performance makes up for it's shortcomings compared to rifled firearms.

>>53101103
My character mainly fights aboard ships with relatively delicate hulls or engineering spaces, so yeah. Specced into SMGs and Shotguns just for the flexibility.

>>53101144
You'd probably be better off just using hollow-points than a shotgun in such circumstances, which weapons like assault rifles and SMGs already have easy access to.

>>53101254

Naw, shotgun offers better chances of hitting exposed bits and puncturing less armored areas of suits. I've already had hollowpoints fired at my character's suit and was not impressed favorably.

>>53071350
RPM master race!

>>53101343
Hale?

>>53101343
No, Corpsman Krueger, but good to hear other people are plying to spacelanes in their games.

Well fuck, >>53102980 was supposed to for >>53102695

>>53100625
>>53100667
>>53100771
Would having half the projectiles PLUS your margin of success hit at that range be a good house rule?

>>53103011
That could get really, really ridiculous with the modifiers from an autoshotgun. I think it'd work alright with just a shell or two, but it'd get exploited by anything pump or semi-auto.

Give it a try and see what happens, it might work for your game.

>>53103080
Well with the default rules I feel like a shotgun can hardly out damage a single shot from most assault rifles at close range where a shotgun should excel, I think it shotguns need a good buff.

>>53101103
Shotguns have a real niche post-apocalyptic, as you can keep building shotguns as long as you can knock together electric igniters and black powder. The barrels can be made from old pipe if needed. Rifle barrels and higher pressure means you are looking at a lot more time if you need a rifled pistol or long arm.

>>53103139
That's what slugs and specialty ammo are for. Don't forget, shotgun slugs do pi+ damage, most ar do pi or pi-. So a slug that penetrates DR is gonna do some really meaty hp damage to anything that doesn't have some sort of injury tolerance.

>>53103139

Shotguns are also really good at downing drones and small things with injury intolerance unliving. Multiple penetrations and better probability of hitting weakspots.

>>53103372
Slugs are pi++ unless they're smaller than 20-gauge, so they're the most effective against IT(Unliving/Homogenous) creatures, unless you're shooting a bigass rifle.

>>53103427
Right! Sorry, I'm used to using sabots. Standard slugs are pi++, APHC and APDS are pi+.

Summer is coming up. I'm thinking about running a couple introductory games for people completely new to GURPS. Anyone have any recommendations on the easiest types of games/adventures to introduce new people? I'd think Action, After the End, and Dungeon Fantasy would be the simplest.

>>53105422
Action is designed for high-speed shout-and-roll games, so it should be the easiest for newbies. On the other hand DF offers more familiar environment for dnd migrants.

So, just for the sake of curiosity, what would be the penalty for trying to throw a falcon? A hooded one, if it matters.

>>53105422
I love to run goofy infinite worlds for people, it allows them to see how much you can do with GURPS chargen as well as having a fun simple campaign. I just tell them they can make anything they want and then help them stat whatever their hearts desire. Then I just come up with anything I can think of for an adventure. After they finish one adventure the next one can be anything you want, doesn't even need to be related. I like setting the TL as 6 for infinite worlds as it's right in the middle, it also makes it so they don't have too much money and that good guns are a bit more expensive.

>>53105515
>A falcon

W.. what? Like a bird that isn't aware?

I feel like it would fly about 5 yards as a clumsy object of it's weight, call it 2-5 pounds for most. Then it would unfold it's wings reflexively to control the fall and attempt to land.

>>53105481
I'm torn between the two, personally. However...

>>53105675
I've never read the IW setting chapter. Maybe I should. I did pick up Mars Attacks recently, which is in the same vein where there are humans that come out of cryostasis that were held by Martians. It would allow for everything from crusaders to samurai to cowboys in the same party. They could run into ISWAT or whatever it's called, and go from there.

Either way, I'm going to make them use templates or, if one isn't available, make the characters myself.

>>53105727
I've only briefly read the Infinite worlds section, I really just got the gist of "infinite number of alternate universes some of which are completely different, some of which are alternate history, some of which are just different time periods, etc.." so I took the concept of pretty much "Anything goes" and ran with it.

>>53105718
>W.. what?
A peregrine falcon. It's a crow-sized bird. They weigh like 3.5 lb max, usually much less.

>Like a bird that isn't aware?
Yes, because it would be wearing a hood.

>>53105829
Why? Just.. I don't normally ask for GURPS, there's lots of weird shit in this game, but why in gods name are you using a unaware bird as a projectile weapon?

>>53105971
As a distraction, not as a weapon.

>>53105999
It even works as a meta-distraction. I'm distracted and confused.

>>53106205
It's simple, Anon.

>party gets pinned down by enemy fire
>said fire is coming from automated motion tracking guns
>throw falcon to keep guns busy

>>53106235
Different anon, but have it occured to you it would work better to unhood the falcon and just release it? So the gun will go after the falcon in the air and the bird actually using the advantage of being capable of flight, thus providing MUCH better distraction.

Because so far it's one of the most retarded ideas I've read in a while. Even if hooded, the falcon will try to flap its wings, just because it's in the air already. It's like you never heard about vestibular system.

>>53091300
Probably. There's a conversion guide in GURPS Autoduel iirc, so it'd be a matter of converting them from Car Wars to 3E to 4E.

>>53107430
>>53106235
This really opens a lot of questions.

Why the fuck were you carrying around a BIRD in a situation where you were going to be fighting enemies with automatic motion tracking guns?

Why did you think the bird would be a better distraction thrown then flying around?

How long did you expect the falcon to last with automated machine guns firing?

>>53108101
JANNY DELETE THIS

>>53108252
>mfw /int/ is my main board and porn stays up all day before getting deleted

if i want to run something like Deus Ex HR, which parts of GURPS should i use?

>>53108604
ACTION and ULTRA-TECH

>>53108604

Action! Ultra-Tech, High Tech, and maybe a little Bio-Tech. Be sparing with Ultra-Tech, it's kind of wonky. The weapons increase in power a bit faster than armor so you might have to tweak some stats.

>>53108604

https://edgerunners.obsidianportal.com/

This is a pretty good place to look - they've done most of the work assembling a Deus Ex HR-style setting and sorting out equipment and cyberware.

>>53108646

For Deus Ex and similar early TL 9, I find just using High Tech weaponry and armor works great.

>>53108701
Agreed, but there's some things you can add to it. Get Pyramid 3/57 Gunplay. Additionally you can use the ETC rules from Ultra tech and apply them to the weaponry in high tech to give them a more modern kick.

>>53097844
>>53096344
Wait, so if someone with a really high skill with a shotgun shoots someone far away, they'll hit with more pellets than if they'd fired almost point blank?

>>53108803
Yep, fortunately that's one of the beauties of GURPS, if you don't like the rule you don't have to use it. Or just fire slugs out of an USAN and annoy your GM.

>>53108826
Oh yeah definitely. Also, on a similar note, do multiple pellets outside of the point blank range, count as "one" injury for the purposes of determining if it's a major wound? I'd assume so since all that trauma is happening at once.

>>53108854
I'm not sure, but I think it depends on if they hit the same location or not and GM ruling.

>>53097129
Why not just say the truth
>If you think any of this is cumbersome or hard thanks for proving you're a proud African native, please do not learn gurps and try to learn how to farm instead

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>>53097129
>mfw thought pi meant you had to multiple the dice roll by pi

>>53105971
Birdshot dummy.

>>53097129
What does the i mean in Shots 5(3i)?

>>53110847
Individual? Im not sure about the exact meaning but it means each individual shot takes that amount of seconds to load into the gun

>>53110947
Ah that makes sense cheers

>>53110847
>>53110947
>>53111067
That's why I love the USAN and homebrew Saigas, reloading shotguns with mags works wonders for making them competitive alternatives to assault rifles. Especially with Fast Draw (ammo).

>>53107430
>have it occured to you it would work better to unhood the falcon and just release it?
I tried that first, but I rolled really crap on Falconry, so it refused. Probably because we were underground.
Then one of my partymembers tried to assist me, and rolled a critical failure, causing the stressed out bird to attack him. Figured it was best to keep the hood on after that, so that it wouldn't try to return to us.

>>53108053
>Why the fuck were you carrying around a BIRD in a situation where you were going to be fighting enemies with automatic motion tracking guns?
The guns, or rather the spider tank they were attached to, came as something of a surprise.
The bird was there mostly because I was already carrying it around when we got into this situation, and I didn't just want to leave it by itself.

>How long did you expect the falcon to last with automated machine guns firing?
Long enough for us to get out of harm's way and into a better position, hopefully. I'll admit it was something of a desperate plan.

>>53112909
Probably better to just throw rocks into the air or something. The bird is not very survivable.

>>53112955
>The bird is not very survivable
True, but we suspected the tank might have thermographic cameras.

>>53111470
Considering some of the fast loading techniques that exist IRL, I'd say that a homebrew Fast Draw (Shotshell) should exist. You can find videos online of people reloading 8 shells in 3 seconds, like below:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USdFTFG0iCI

>>53112909
The bird will fly straight in the direction you've tossed it if it will be unable to rise up.

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How viable are attack dogs in modern gurps?

Anyone ever used them or had them used?

>>53116045
I'm not sure what you mean by viable. Animals are scary, and things that bite become terrifying when using the biting rules on MA115, which allow automatic grapples and do free damage from worrying.

Can you only use "treating shock" after you've bandaged someone? If not, how would you fluff treating blunt damage?

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>>53116158
I mean that in a tacticool situation where everyone's toting firearms, is Releasing The Hounds going to effectively fuck up the other guys, or is scooby going to eat a 15-layer 7.62 sandwich

>>53116208
Depends on the situation. if they're in close quarters (less than 20 yards), then some/all dogs will manage to read the other guys and can start fucking them up. If it's beyond 20 yards, probably not. 10 yards is ideal as a dog can Move and Attack at that distance. And time spent shooting at the dogs is time not spent shooting at the guys with guns.

>>53116260
>And time spent shooting at the dogs is time not spent shooting at the guys with guns.
This.

You don't use dogs as main attack force. You use them as distraction. The other guy keeps firing on you? Then the dog is going to fuck him up. He focused on the dog? Then he's not putting suppressing fire in your direction or any fire at all.

>>53117578
On the other hand, with suppressing fire they've got a decent chance of nailing the dogs and whoever cut them loose. If they're military dogs, you should at least give them body armor vests.

If you're of a high enough TL that Bio-Tech is applicable, inherent DR and sneakiness is the way to go.

>>53116162
>Treating blunt damage

Assess the wound, check for any broken bones, treat any abrasions, remove any foreign objects, clean any broken skin, compression bandage, cold pack, elevate, keep in a gently stretched position, painkillers, monitor for any internal bleeding or unusual swelling, check for concussion.

>>53116208
>>53116260
Dogs are best used for guard duty and explosive detection. Dark and close quarters can make an attack dog very dangerous, especially if the GM lets it be smart enough to flank and stay stealthy until it's ready to attack (not wholly unrealistic).

That said, I'd be happy to in a less then stone cold tactical game talk about giving a dog a version of 'mook chilvery' rules, where most enemies won't shoot at the dog unless it's clearly attacking them personally.

>>53117612
Don't forget draining the wounded area.
>Cut me, Mick.

>>53030558
Does anybody have any good character sheets for Gurps Ultra Lite?

>>53119819
Pretty sure they sell packs of them at most grocery stores; check under 'index cards."

Seriously though, UL hast like, four things to track? You don't need a full sheet for that; hell, if you're pressed for space, a post-it would do fine. That's the whole point of UL.

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>>53119819
Duude, hes >>53121225 really not jokin'

>>53121333
I don't see any Ultra Lite here. What are you talking about?

>throw large, powerful monsters at the players
>they get rid of them with minor injuries
>throw smaller, younger, easily killed versions of same monsters at the players
>almost a TPK
Dayum. Of course, younger monsters were present in larger numbers and constantly used All-Out Attack (Double), but still. Also RNG was really unfavorable to players - beasties got, like, five critical hits on them, and plenty of hits to places not protected by armor.

>>53122477
>Don't know about action economy
>Don't know about ganging-up in GURPS punish absurdly hard

>>53122477
>Of course, younger monsters were present in larger numbers
Well, what the hell did you expect to happen? Most characters only get one attack per round.

What are you currently playing/running?

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>>53122477
Try more or less always giving the enemy equal numbers to the PCs. If you give them the advantage of numbers then the bad guy can be MUCH tougher.

1.5 to 1 odds in the opposing force's favor are about the highest you can take without making the other guys considerably weaker then the PCs, or giving some other major advantage to the PCs. 2 to 1 is BRUTAL in GURPS.

That said, it works the other way too. If the PC's outnumber the other side by 2 to 1 they will pretty easily take apart most targets.

>>53122918
Not much. With Gyrmwild on hiatus for 2 weeks I'm spending some time building up my own game idea, trying to get it ready for prime time. I should have it ready soon enough and might start looking for players soon.

>>53122918
X-Com 1885 - bunch of Frenchmen riding across the country on trains and battling occult threats.

>>53123208
I just wanted to try my hand at using hordes of cannon fodder monsters. Last time, heroes had outnumbered enemy monsters 8 to 6 (including their own cannon fodder, which is actually surprisingly competent in combat), aside from the fact that monsters just refused to die, even though they had "just" HT 11. This time, heroes didn't had their cannon fodder around, and got cut badly - out of four characters, one almost died (he failed HT roll, but was saved by Luck), other fell unconscious, and another got his leg fucked up. I think I actually quite like the end result - fight was challenging, yet no one died. Especially considering how they could've avoided that particular fight completely.

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>>53122477
Answer me this:
What would you rather fight - a single dragon, having 9 warriors, or rather about 5 thousand cavalrymen with torches, still having 9 warriors?

>>53124484
You are exaggerating way too much. Dragon isn't even worth that much.

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>>53124536
I'm not exaggerating. You are simply too young to grasp the reference

I'm learning GURPS to become a GM, and finding the rule book to be infinitely better than DnD 5e.

I swear DnD tries do obfuscate the information and spread it out overa lot of pages just so people can't make handy screenshots of useful data. A kind of copy protection. What a clusterfuck. GURPS is so informative by comparison

>>53124817
If you are making a game that even in the name is generic and universal, you literally can't make the book in any other way than always pointing the page (or book) to look up details for needed stuff

I wish it was an universal rule to all TTRPG books, not just generics

>>53124831
Just the way the info is organized into sections, with a great balance of crunch and guidelines

What is the equivalent o the core rule book for GURPS

>>53124996
>What is Basic Set
Seriously?

>>53125001
Was wondering if it was Basic Set or Lite desu
Thanks

>>53125005
Lite is collection of most important rules and only for realistic games, with no magic involved at all and only a handful of advantages and disadvantages.

It's a teaser. Sure, fully workable teaser that allows to play few different types of games, but a teaser nontheless

>>53125015
Thanks, got it
>distances are given in feet and miles, rather than arbitrary units
>feet and miles
>not arbitrary units
:thinking:

>>53125022
Yeah, got the same problem. I'm just using their simplified conversion rates most of the time and present my players with the game in metric.

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>>53124536
Different anon, but seriously, this is one of those movies every single person visiting /tg/ should watch.

>>53125022
>>53125068
All measurements are arbitrary when you get down to it. All that is saying is that GURPS doesn't measure things in squares or whatever.

>>53125101
I watched it exactly one time and barely remember anything besides scene when they used same bowl with spit and snot to wash their hands.

>>53125022
as opposed to hexes or squares or units.
FATE uses 'zones' for instance, which are incredibly abstract and can cover everything from a large section of the street to an area the size of a closet

>>53122477
A single powerful monster versus a whole party in GURPS = party wades in with All-Out Attacks (insert Persona memes here) and big monster gets overwhelmed pretty quickly without certain Advantages and/or Powers.

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>>53125131
Watch it again then. Just remember to watch it as not-too-serious adventure movie or someone's mid-power campaign turned into a film. And it's really great at explaining how to handle different things in game, including weird characters apparently not fit for the prepared campaign.

>>53125173
thats why you always play cinematic fucker

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>>53125215
I'd rather watch something actually funny. Or actually serious.

>>53125173
>big monster gets overwhelmed pretty quickly without certain Advantages and/or Powers
He'd better be, because if he doesn't, they are all entering the world of pain.

>>53125252
>Implying the film isn't funny
K

>>53125122
dude

dude

dude

when you're trying to imagine a hypothetical scenario and make decisions inuitively based on your knowledge of real life, which helps you make a decision easier:

>it's 3 units away

>it's 6 feet away

>>53125380
Using "6 feet" as a unit makes as much sense as using the (equivalent) "the minimum height of a non-manlet as seen by /fit/", they're both dumb units made by dumb people.

>>53125380
Not him, but since I don't use imperial, both of them mean absolutely NOTHING to me and are purely abstract. So it's zero difference if it's feet or unit, because feet don't ring me any distance, unless I recalculate them into metric.
And guess how many countries use metric.

Personally I think it's one of the reasons why it's so hard to market GURPS around - it's entirely written in imperial and requires to "walk the extra mile" (pun intended) to get it working if you aren't American, Liberian or from Burma.

>>53125403
well i'm canadian, we use both

>>53125403
D&D and Pathfinder both use imperial too though and they're far larger than any competitor.

>>53125407
I'm so sorry.

>>53125418
fuck you, that's supposed to be my line.

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>>53125407

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>>53125173
>>53125217
>>53125318
Speaking of powerful fuckers that will tear the party like wet paper, unless killed quickly
Sorry for .png, but for whatever reason I couldn't post it as .pdf

>>53125412
Every edition of D&D published in my country is in metric, just saying...

>>53125380
dude

dude

dude

You type like a poof and at no point did I say that made up abstract units are in any way better than IRL units. What I was saying is that all units of measurement are arbitrary, so there's no reason to start national dick waving over metric vs imperial; we're not engineers here -- all that matters is that you use a unit of measurement that your group can easily visualize like feet/inches or meters rather that squares, paces, or generic "units."

>>53125453
Oh really
Fuck I guess they walked the mile for you

>>53125457
>national dick waving
*global
Nobody who anyone cares about except the US uses imperial, which is fitting, because the US doesn't care about anyone but themselves.

>>53125457
>- all that matters is that you use a unit of measurement that your group can easily visualize like feet/inches or meters rather that squares, paces, or generic "units."
>Still missing the point
>Still assuming that imperial means anything to anyone who is not using imperial in daily basis.

Look, I get your main point, but my counter-argumetn about it is how abstract imperial units are to people who don't use imperial in daily life.
Which means almost entire human race.

>>53125436
>burning leaves instead of using them for compost
What a waste.

>>53125446
DR 10 is pretty crazy. Aside from that, my party pretty easily killed 6 of picrelateds.
Ironically, one of the characters actually was a descendant of Jean Chastel.

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>>53125495
Whoops

>>53125457
The point here is about using units that are JUST AS ABSTRACT. You see, unless your brain is operating in imperial, there is literally no difference if you say "the bandit is 6 feets away" or "the bandit is 2 squares away", because both of those won't kick in. Instead, you will wonder "ok, but how far away it is?". Hell, I'm going to say that using completely abstract squares, hexes and other stuff like that would be EASIER to handle, just because you know you can't reach someone two squares away, but you need a moment to think if you can reach them if they are 6 feets away.

>>53125459
It probably helps that D&D doesn't really care that much about specific values in the first place; 5'x5' became 1 sq. m or maybe 2m x 2m and nothing really changes.

>>53125526
I have always maintained that changing the original imperial units to metric makes the entire system suddenly feel more heroic. No longer do you only run four metres a second in combat like some sort of high school kid, you can now run twenty like usain bolt if he had cybernetic legs and lungs.

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>>53125495
The DR 10 comes from the fact it's wearing a kind of armor, so unless you target gaps, you aren't going to harm it at all. The beast sustained taking an ax in the "head" and it just get suck in the armour rather than penetrating. The sides of the armour were thick enough to turn a musket shot into minor bruise.

So the 10 DR is pretty much justified. And this is a sneak-close-and-tear-apart kind of predator.

>>53125553
To be fair, my players didn't knew the DR on monsters, and since one of them shrugged off the shotgun blast at point-blank range (courtesy of the unlucky damage roll), they assumed that it is a fucking ironclad and started trying to hit it into the gaps, even though their weapons were perfectly capable of damaging it.

>>53125446
Holy fuck

>Can't hit because base Dodge 11
>If you hit, can't wound because DR 10
>If you wound, won't bring it down to 0 or death threshold because HP 20
>If you bring it down low enough, it still has a decent chance of staying up because HT 12.

Alpha strike it with a nuke while it's sleeping. It's the only way to make sure.

>play my first GURPS game with my DM (who's been running other systems for our group and wants us to try GURPS), just a generic postapoc
>take v. beautiful because I want to be the party face
>don't read too much into the description
>DM actually makes slavers and drunks a serious fucking issue for me
I got fucking kidnapped.

>>53125588
>very beautiful
>post apocalypse
No need to read the rules to know what's coming there, buddy.

Next time get Transcendent and blind everyone with your beauty.

>>53125584
It's all intentional. It was supposed to be OP as fuck to easily survive at least 3 encounters with the party even in case of crits on player side, and they didn't even know about the armour until meeting it up for the first time, expecting nothing more than some oversized wolf.
When they've finally tracked it for the 2nd time and beat it, it was already dying from all the sustained injuries anyway.

And I love playing with movie-illiterate folks, so you can pick Brotherhood of the Wolf, spin a campaign out of it, everyone is having fun, then watch the movie together and everyone is still having fun, realising all other options they could pick or (which is usually the best) realising they were smarter than the characters from the source material.

>>53125618
My DM generally isn't into doing lewd stuff so I just assumed it wouldn't happen
Guess it serves me right for metagaming

>>53125588
>not seducing slaver and kidnapping him first
Wasted opportunity here. Could have got some free slaves.

>>53125642
Pitiable doesn't work on slavers, I tried appealing but just got slapped
Slaver-san is a meanie

>>53125584
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aCbfMkh940Q

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>>53125621
>make an adventure very loosely based on Tremors, especially the second part
>players remember every fucking work with burrowing monsters ("Half-Life 2! Dune! Dwarves of Demrel!") EXCEPT for Tremors

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>>53125588
>Picking any of the Appearance modifiers higher than Attractive

>>53125584
>Can't hit because base Dodge 11
>If you hit, can't wound because DR 10
That's why you bring high-bore rifled guns. The moment you realise they are gaps in armour (which you should target by default anyway), it's just a matter of concentrated fire.

Honestly, any campaign of TL6 and higher is unfun, solely because you can bring machine guns on site or at least guns capable of firing each turn and suddenly what would be a fucking terror of the night in lower TLs changes into a practice target full of holes and bullets.

>>53125730
Reading this gives me a question. Given 300+ posts, probably nothing will come from it, but let's try anyway:

Can you have a TL4 artillery piece that is RIFLED? I assume it would be a muzzle-loader due to being TL4, but I don't even know how long it would take to load it (and thus maybe making it worthless in the process) or if it could be breech-loaded. And how much it would cost compared with standard cannon.

>>53125770
I guess you could, though I have no hard evidence to back that up. The big question, though, is why? You don't need to snipe with artillery; you point it at something big (a ship, a wall, another army, etc.) and lit it rip. Also, the accuracy of large artillery pieces is sort of moot as you can't easily aim them -- a 30 lb. cannon is pointing where it's pointing, and while you can make gross changes, you aren't going to be tracking targets with it or worrying about keeping it steady.

>>53125730
It's boring if you don't update the threats, yeah. At low TL, you challenge your party with a tiger. At higher TL, you challenge your party with a Tiger I.

>>53125770
You technically could, rifling was invented in the 1500s, which is early TL4 so it wouldn't be that large a leap of logic to try it on artillery.

In the real world, I think rifled artillery didn't become popular until something like mid to late 1800s, and by that time cannon was mostly breech-loading.

There'd be little point to rifling early cannon, though, because gunpowder wasn't all that in those times so range and accuracy (both in gunpowder loading consistency and aiming the damn heavy things) was lacking, typical effective range being somewhere between 500m and 1km (maximum potential range could be much longer, but still something like 4km). Massed fire was the order of the day.

>>53125948
Rifling is incredibly difficult if you're loading from the muzzle though.

I already asked this on the forum, and I got an uncited response, so I'd like to ask it again, because I'm writing code, and I want the answer to be as RAW as possible, so here is my copy/pasted post:

So weird conundrum.
Basic set and lite say:
>Each competitor attempts his success roll. If one succeeds and the other fails, the winner is obvious.
Fine, so let's say:
Sean has Strategy-20
Anna has Strategy-15
Sean Rolls a 17; Anna rolls a 15.
Anna succeeded because "The winner is ***obvious.*** (Is it?)"
But her Margin of Victory is... -3?
Where does that fit on the Mass Combat's Combat Results table (p.47)?

Do Quick Contests have a minimum Margin of Victory? Should a margin of victory be floored at 1? Also, can I get a generalized ruling for all Quick Contests?


The answer I was given is that rolling a 17 means that Sean automatically has an MoF of -1, but for reasons, I think it's not as good as saying that Anna has a minimum Margin of Victory of 1. I mean, if there is a book reference, I won't argue it, but if there isn't, I like my solution better.

>>53126401
>negative margin of victory
This was discussed and joked about in discord at some point but as far as I know there is no clarification anywhere.

>>53126552
Hmm, after doing a tiny bit of research, I think that might be a canon answer, but I found it in a weird place: Power-Ups 5, p. 5

In the conversation on Impulse Buys and buying success and the effect it has on margins, it specifies at each step of bought success, that the margin is as follows:

> Bought critical success: Margin of success is (effective skill)-3, but at least 1.
> Bought success: Margin of success is (effective skill)-10, but at least 1.
> Bought failure: Margin of failure is 10-(effective skill), but at least 1.
> Bought critical failure (when using Buying Failure): Margin of failure is 18-(effective skill), but at least 1.


>But at least 1.

So to me this says, if it matters, if skill-3 rolls a 4, they have a minimum Margin of Success of 1, and if skill-100 rolls a 17, they have a minimum margin of failure of 1.

In that specifically contrived situation, skill-3 has a margin of victory of 2.

>>53126690
Well, thinking over this once again, a Margin of Success of 0 is a nominal, common outcome, so even then, these rules don't make sense.
I could say that winners always have a minimum margin of 0, and losers always have a minimum margin of 1, but then I'm pulling that out of my b*tt again, and if that's the case, I would prefer adjudicating:
> If there is one winner and one loser in a quick contest, the minimum margin of victory is 1.

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>>53126256
Yeah, that too, but breech-loading cannons are TL4 tech.

The earliest medieval cannons (breech-loading swivel guns, for example)were breech-loading, but they were pretty dangerous and didn't scale due to bad seals and undeveloped metallurgy, so they moved to muzzle loaders until the problems got fixed.

So yeah, if somebody wanted, they could successfully argue for TL4 breech-loading rifled cannons and add some to their world, but they wouldn't be all that realistic, or good.

>>53126848
Those things had a nasty tendency to simply not fire, or worse, explode.

Is Common Sense a safetynet Advantage or something? Do GMs use it as a weak sort of preiscence or is it basiclly worthless if you already have common sense?

>>53127015
Both.
It's best described as an insurance, preventing GM from fucking you up as long as something is within the reach of your character.

>>53125770
Of course you can.

What you are looking for is a swivel gun. Most of those were rifled, so despite their small size they were packing some serious punch. In fact, those were usually breech-loaded too and with proper training and few spare parts, you could literally just keep feeding new loads into the gun, maintaining a fire rate of roughtly 8-10 shots per minute.
The problem with loading "full sized" cannon would be the fact it would have to be breech-loaded, which would (given TL4) affected both cannon reliability and the maximum range of it (since at least part of the propelling gas would escape the wrong direction). Said that, the rifling would allow to still outrange a smooth-bore cannon of the same size. It would just not be maximum efficiency, as there would be neither closely fit parts (unless you would pay through the noose) nor rubber gaskets.

>>53127087
Guess I should've taken that before walking into the tavern as V. Beautiful while the party was still outside
fuck I'm dumb

>>53125835
Did you seriously asked why to rifle a cannon?
How about increasing its range about threefold? Or allowing to aim it properly, thus taking potshots? Or adding it the extra penetrating power, so rather than bouncing, it will crush through the target?
Because cannon balls tend to bounce off the targets they can't penetrate, you know.
In case of naval warfare, having front/aft cannons that can be fired at greater distance and aimed more accurately can make a fuck-huge difference when in chase/escape.

And rifling of artillery was a thing since mid 1600s, so that's pretty much the epitome of TL4.

>>53126869
>I take my knowledge about gun durability from WFRP
The gun you are (probably) thinking about would be a TL3 design and it was blowing up due to a medieval technique used to make them (connecting a bunch of rings and metal plates rather than casting the gun fully). Assuming TL4 is involved, that's no longer an issue, since completely different technique is used to make the gun.

>>53125948
>Massed fire was the order of the day.
Given the party will rarely operate entire gun battery or carry one with themselves, a single, but extra-good cannon is well worth its price for them.

>>53127015
>is it basiclly worthless if you already have common sense
Players don't have common sense.

But seriously, there's two real reasons why players don't have common sense. For starters, what a GM might consider "common sense" and what a player might consider "common sense" are different. The second reason is that the world of the game might have it's own common sense that the players aren't aware of, for example they might not know that amethyst attracts dragons or something, which could be common knowledge in the world, so you can use the Common Sense advantage as a simple way to get world details to the players without having to dump exposition.

I basically require that at least one of the players in the party takes common sense.

>>53127112
Yeah, that's a perfect example when Common Sense would work, as the GM would be obligated to inform you about it beforehand or be called on this if not warning you.

>>53127015
It's metacommentary on how PCs tend to act

>>53127129
Wrought iron breech-loading swivel guns are very much a TL4 tech, early TL4 but still TL4.

By the time cast-iron cannons came into play, breech-loading swivel guns fell out of favor (not completely, as they were still good antipersonnel weapons) and European production was focused on muzzle-loading cannon.

>>53127121
>And rifling of artillery was a thing since mid 1600s, so that's pretty much the epitome of TL4.
This is going to require some source, since rifled artillery began to appear en-masse only towards the late 1800s, as far as I know. Before 1800s, most heavier cannons were muzzle loading smoothbore.

>>53127147
>extra-good cannon is well worth its price for them.
They're get a lot more bang for their buck out of getting better powder or a more advanced carriage and trunnion for their cannon than a better cannon at that tech level.

>>53127268
>Unless it's mass-produced, it doesn't count
By this logic you shouldn't have a breech-loading rifle until TL6.
Guess what type of long-barrel gun is one of the most often used by players in TL4 campaigns.

>>53127294
Why not both?
It's not like you can't have both.

And for whatever reason when I reply to more than one post at time, I keep getting connection error. Fucking annoying.

>>53127409
Point me to an example of a rifled artillery piece from that time. I'm honestly curious because I've been looking and haven't found anything that's ever seen any kind of recorded use, even experimental.

>>53127471
I've lost count how many times swivel guns were already brought up.

>>53127620
Swivel guns aren't artillery, they're tiny, they filled the same role a machinegun would fill on a modern vessel. Also there's no evidence they were rifled until the 19th century.

>>53127652
>Artillery is not artillery, because I say so
I guess I'm done then

>>53127698
>I have no argument so I'll say I'm done
Even if you think they're artillery, point me to a rifled one.

Anyway, it was fun while it lasted.

How would I make a shotgun that fires hooded falcons?

>>53128043
Forgot to add: I need to make it quickly as we are in the middle of combat right now.

>>53128043
Engineering to devise one that doesn't just roast the falcon or blow it up. Armory (Small Arms) to actually make it. Possibly Machinist to make the component pieces.

Quick Gadgeteer to do the above in a timely manner.

>mfw nymphomania is not a disadvantage
It'd be pretty crippling though wouldn't it?

>>53128043
Have you tried just throwing the falcon at the shotgun?