Will /tg/ finally want to talk about Burning Wheel now that

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It was rarely talked about before it was out of print, so I doubt it.

But its a great game, so lets talk about it.

Has anyone read the codex already? I'm interested in the description saying that Wizards are a life path set now.

>>52225633

Ive skimmed through it, its kind of like the magic burner chapter than adds more options and lifepaths for being a wizard.

>>52225309
Was there even a demand for this?

>>52226233
They never made PDFs so one of the books was basically not available. Now I just hope someone scans it.

>>52225665
Isn't it just Magic Burner, Monster Burner and Adventure Burner in a new book and changed to fit the minimal changes of gold edition?

>>52225309
There isn't much to talk about, outside of "Boy, this is beautiful. I wish it was actually a good game."

>>52228030
>I wish it was actually a good game
But, it is.

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>>52227946

Mostly that, but it actually has a lot of corrected, and some new, content.

>>52228030

It's a great game, but its approach is pretty different than most RPGs, it most certainly wouldn't be for everyone.

>>52225309
there was a thread a couple days ago, and people were kind of shitting on it for unfair reasons. I didn't get around to explaining why they were wrong about everything though.

I think I'd be more into BW as a system if it had more than 0 provision for anything which isn't "medieval fantasy" though. I know there's (1? 2?) other lifepath/setting books, but I basically don't see any reason to run 'elves and dwarves fantasyland' in any system other than DND. BW for me should be about exploring weird moments of history on a social level, and RAW it doesn't provide at all well for this.

>>52230404
I vastly prefer systems that have a focus, know what the focus is and hit it. And Burning Wheel's approach to be all about Tolkienesque fantasy works.

>>52230622
I agree, it's just that the periods of history I'm reading about and would suit the system (focus on narrative, social dynamics, player failure) really don't translate well. I am lazy, and thinking about having to do hard work to make it fit properly makes me sad. As such, instead of putting in time to hack lifepaths/settings for appropriate periods, I complain on messageboards.

>>52230404
oh and more criticism of BW, from the perspective of someone who has played and enjoyed it.

-Art magic is a good system, and is confined to the codex. It fits in with how all the other mechanics are implemented, and should be the main system.

- speaking of art magic, for a game which is built around having intentionally 'pointless' things like baking or firebuilding, there sure are trap options where there ought not to be. The 'Arcane Action' Art magic school is the only one of any practical use in magical combat. It should be clearly, really really clearly labelled as such. It resolves 2x as fast as any other spell except illusion, and can interrupt them or end the fight in a single action.

- It's maybe too hard to pick up social skills from lifepaths? I tend to spend 2/3 of my general points on picking up at least something here, or spend the first 10 sessions learning persuasion. Maybe that's my playstyle, but still.

- as above, takes more than a little work to use for radically different settings than 'standard feudal'.

- difficult tests for learned skills going into the stat. This is mostly irritation at not being able to advance learned skills easily- probably advancing stat would end up better, but I'd like to be given the choice.

- certain stats working totally differently from others. Resources gets a free pass from me here; there's a good balance reason it should work how it does with advances. Perception however, is an exception for the sake of it.

- Stat double ups. Health/Forte/Steel, (+Will) are almost too similar. I think one or more could certainly be cut, without losing a huge amount.

>>52230791
>Perception however, is an exception for the sake of it.
In reversed perception was always open ended, so it requiring successes to advance made more sense.
Now it's that way, apparently because it's thrown a lot in Luke's games.

>>52230791

- Bloody versus is a good system, and I sort of prefer it to Fight! just for retaining the speed of the narrative better, and simpler resolution. I'd like better guidance in the system as to when to use it aside from 'if you're scared of how complex Fight! is'.

- too many in-jokes in the traits list. Sure, I've read ringworld and appreciate the call-out to Louis Woo, but it's needlessly confusing for someone who hasn't. Also, more guidance on 'create your own die trait' would be nice, since character traits 'upgrading' into die/call-ons is part of character progression (trait vote, unless i'm mistaken.

- Are there mechanics for seeing other characters' beleifs/instincts? If not, there maybe ought to be. Is it under Aura Reading? Honestly this point should just be "some ENTIRE subsystems are hidden in a paragraph of text in the 'skills' directory".

- Duel of wits is a fantastic conflict resolution system. This complaint is that it relies too much on a complex stat/skill based summary of a character's social abilities for me to easily port it to EVERY other system for (rare) PVP/Very-important-NPC social combat.

- Same goes for Beleifs/Instincts and the corresponding Fate/Persona system, though to a lesser extent. This is also not really a complaint about BW, more a complaint about all other games being less good at forcing players to be good at roleplaying.

>>52230923
>Duel of wits
>social system using volleys
>good
It's bad for realism, internal consistency, and is mediocre at best for tactical thought compared to a non-volley based system. If it was one volley at a time, it would be much better. I realize this shouldn't bother me as much as it does.

>>52228056
>implying

>>52230404
>I basically don't see any reason to run 'elves and dwarves fantasyland' in any system other than DND

I have the opposite opinion of this, which is "why would I ever run anything in D&D?" I don't play hack and slash-y dungeon crawls though, which is what D&D is great for.