Horus Heresy General /HHG/

First for Curze

File: doom guy vs worst bearers.jpg (122KB, 599x383px) Image search: [Google]

122KB, 599x383px

word bearers a shit

>>52219259
C'mon man, at least give Doomguy something remotely challenging to fight against.

File: Perturabo.jpg (1MB, 2060x2609px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 2060x2609px

FIRST FOR SIEGECRAFT

What was the point of Chaplains in non-word bearer legions?

There's no veneration, Chaos is hidden info so scanning for corruption isn't on the agenda. Skullman seems just useless.

Also Assassins when?

I want to WRYYYYYYYYYYY so badly

>>52219259
Lorgar can't even shoot rockets out of his hand ffs

What would be the best type of Automata for Scoria to join in? I was thinking about Vorax for Outflank. Any ideas?

File: 1477594140263.gif (157KB, 550x729px) Image search: [Google]

157KB, 550x729px

a manhole cover just blew up outside my house

anyway, breacher fag from previous threads here. I finally figured out what legion I am going to play. I'm gonna go cheeki breeky Raven Guard, but I am gonna paint and fluff them as pre-corax Terran raven guard, the Pale Nomads. They fought alongside the Luna Wolves for a while and used similar tactics.

In my mind this works because these dudes were basically a bunch of angry Terrans who are there to kick ass and chew bubblegum, and malcador took all the gum.

So for my list, I sort of want to avoid tanks if possible. I was thinking Vigilator, 20 breachers, 10-20 assault marines, possibly 3 contemptors, and leviathan and dorito dreadnoughts? Is this feasible or retarded? No Idea what I am doing when it comes to making a list, I just know I want to base my army around 20 breachers, and would like to avoid tanks. It will take me a while to buy all this stuff anyway. Are tanks pretty much necessary?

>>52219482

They probably evolved from the military police and are just a consul option to maintain legion-wide discipline.

>>52219799
So you could call one of them a....
Angry White Guy?

*puts sunglasses on over MkVI helmet*
YEEEEAAAAAAAAHH

>>52219228
So since there's no 40kg i'll ask you guys.

Are regular primarchs stronger than demon prince primarchs? Because when Girlyman came back everyone in the galaxy shat their collective pants - while the chaos primarchs have had their shit pushed in multiple times in the last 10k years.

Hell, a primarch demon prince isn't even the leader of chaos.

>>52219924
>So since there's no 40kg

It literally has 40kg in the title you faggot you didn't even CTRL + F

>>52219924
They are supposed to be stronger as a demon, but fluff =/= rules and plot demands chaos losing.

>>52219799
Not really necessary, but you will need to be able to kill enemy tanks without anti-armour tanks of your own. A Typhon is basically a hard-counter to infantry of any description, and various other tanks can also be nasty. The other thing to watch for other than shooty tanks is a primarch deathstar in a Spartan, which may be the majority of an enemy's points but it will annihilate everything it touches. Even a Deredeo with the Arachnus won't reliably damage flare-shielded AV14, so having something to remove typhons/spartans/fellblades/similar should be the thing to base an army around. Some people go with a Leviathan in a pod with a drill and a melta to remove enemy armour, which is what i use. I play in the tank-heavy Australian meta, but even elsewhere you can run into mechanised lists that can be really nasty to an infantry/walker list. Your Dark Furies are the ultimate marine blenders if you can catch something with them, and can do damage to small units of terminators too i.e. not fat two-wound deathstars, so i would use them instead of your assault marines. Otherwise, sounds good.

File: konrad.jpg (603KB, 1200x900px) Image search: [Google]

603KB, 1200x900px

Did Curze or the Night Lords win literally any victories against loyalist forces during the Heresy? Isstvan V doesn't count.

>>52220023
No because the Night Lords are the punching bag of the traitor legions.

Just like the Iron Hands are the same for the loyalists

>>52219937
Whats strange is how the 40k universe has existed for decades and within the span of a few months all of the scales are tipped in favor of any faction OTHER than Chaos.

Turns out the Necrons had essentially always had the capacity to close the Eye of Terror.

The Eldar gods were never LESS powerful than the Chaos ones, it just so happens for a span of time Chaos was in flux and had defeated/devoured large portions of their pantheon.

The Tyranids never posed a galactic level threat to any of the other factions save for maybe the Tau.

The Dark Eldar have been all but obliterated.

Portions of the traitor Legions aren't actually traitors, specifically the Thousand Sons when Ahriman resurrects them among the Fallen being the loyalists all along.

>>52219937
I'm having a hard time viewing Chaos as a legitimate threat anymore.

Having read all the heroic sacrifice across countless books about galaxy changing mcguffins. I'm starting to get the feeling that Chaos has never really been anything more than a wrench in the Emperors plans.

The guy is still alive after doing battle with Horus backed by the power of the Chaos gods who promptly abandoned him when the Emperor destroyed his soul.

The Emperor as a dying corpse is powerful enough to hold back the gods from breaking into the Imperial palace while simultaneously projecting his pyschic might across the galaxy in the form of the Astronomicon. While also performing minor miracles and other fuckery.

What the actual fuck.

File: u alright.jpg (31KB, 720x400px) Image search: [Google]

31KB, 720x400px

>first game with talons of the emperor
>Friend says he wants to put his gal vorbak up against my Hetaeron Guard squad and shield captain with paragon spear
>His face when the shield captain murders 3/5th of the unit before the others even get to swing

Now there is even hinting that the Horus Heresy was among the Emperors cards the whole time as a means of quelling the Astartes.

In other words, the Emperor wanted to conquer nearly all the known galaxy while devouring human souls for ten thousand years in preparation for his apotheosis as even godlier entity, one capable of striking down the Chaos gods.

God damn it.

>>52220141
Did you tell him that your models are all CC monsters?

>>52220141

From another lore perspective, the Gal Vorbak with higher quality demons still only amount to a Custodian stat line, while being equipped with shittier gear and rules.

The Emperor was making super soldiers more powerful than Daemon possessed space marines since before the Great Crusade.

>>52220091
>Ahriman resurrects them among the Fallen being the loyalists all along.

Wait, what? Is it from the gathering derp book 3?

>>52220091
Are you surprised?
The Fallen have been memed into being the loyalists forever, and the resurrected thousand sons probably all went 'my dad's a douchebag, but Grandad is a cripple with our retarded siblings sitting on his lawn'
>>52220127
All hail the God-Emperor Mary Sue?

>>52220179
Phone corrected shitting to sitting.

What is everyone working on tonight?

>>52220173
Ok, so here is the break down.

Inferno breaks down the math of Chaos blood magic and indicates that it is impossible for the number of souls at the great temple of Magnus at the time of transposition into the warp was enough of a sacrifice to perform such a feat.

In essence, with the amount of soul magic used in the sorcery, there would have only been enough sorcery to transport Magnus, Ahriman, one other person and the pyramid to the planet of the Sorcerers. Perhaps more or less, I'm not entirely sure but the point is it wasn't possible.

It's implied that Ahriman's traveling around with not Thousand Son Thousand Sons.

This means that nearly his ENTIRE Legion died Loyalist at the battle of Prospero.

Resurrecting his Legion would result in a Legion of Loyalists appearing out of nowhere.

>>52220179
Yeah it's fine the Fallen are loyalists, whatever.

It's annoying that this great epic "grim dark" universe was the Great Crusade, electric boogaloo the whole time.

The Emperor had planned on killing off everyone who could threaten the Imperium before consigning himself to absorbing soul energy for ten thousand years.

The Legions that fell during the HH are inconsequential. The HH itself is pretty much inconsequential because it sets up the Emperor's inevitable rebirth as the legitimate God of Order.

I can smell the Age of the Emperor nearby...

>>52220278
I had known it would go this direction from all the vague indications that the Emperor was either a retard or all powerful all along.

GW clearly doesn't want a retard at the helm of their IP.

>>52220256
Well, that is just the Imperial theory of course, Tzeentch is presumably powerful enough to just ignore restrictions like that.

>>52220323
Is he though?

>>52220323
As far as I can tell Tzeentch is incapable of any decisive action due to his "Just as Planned" web of plans that undo themselves.

File: IMG_0651.jpg (1MB, 2448x2448px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 2448x2448px

>>52220225

I'm about to tear these off their bases, apply Martian Iron Earth, Ard Coat and then glue them back on.

>>52220256
>>52220395
Do not reply to tripfags

>>52220395
Negatron Megatron.

These suckers are glued on tight.

Do you guys attach any IC/character (Apothecary, etc) to your vets?

Land's Graviton Raider, 480 points.

AV14/14/14, 4HP, BS5
Gravitic Flare Shield
Grav-backwash (only a-1 to hit this time, too heavy and big, but only works stationary)
Explorator Adaptation
Reinforced Structure (6++)

Primogenitor Supernum
Master Explorator Array

Quad-volkite turret with thermo-targeters (S6 AP4 Deflagrate Heavy 8, twin-linked)


Thermo-targeters:
A very helpful device for Archaotech scouting, it also finds an excellent use in battle. If a unit has taken wounds from Volkite or Phosphex weapons, including as a result of the Crawling Fire or Deflagrate special rules, the quad-volkite gains AP3 against that unit for the duration of the game.

Primogenitor Supernum:
First and greatest of the Raiders, this vehicle is immune to the Melta and Lance special rules, and reduces the extra D6 granted by Armourbane to a D3. Anything that would cause an automatic pen causes a glance instead.

Gravitic Flare Shield:
Normal Flare, but instead of a-2 to Blasts it can be extended to the side armour if the vehicle is stationary (Inc. pivoting).
Transport cap 12

Master Explorator Array:
Reroll on Reserves, all scoring units now contest or control objectives within 5" instead of 3, and all vehicles gain IWND, like an Archimandrite.
Can select D3 units within 12" after deployment to gain either Twin-linked, Monster Hunter, Tank Hunter or Enhanced Targeting while Land is alive, all must have the same rule.

Taghmata or Reductor LoW.
Counts as an Archmagos, and is automatically Warlord, Primarch style, but has no Warlord Trait as it's included in the package anyway.

What do you think?

Big unkillable brick with buffs, but he has to be still to survive best, and doesn't have much firepower on it's own.

Buffs are huge, but it lacks firepower itself, so if you shoot the things around it it's reduced to bullying tactical squads every couple turns. Unlike Primarchs, it can't just lol through anything it reaches, so it buffs damn well.

>>52220533
It depends on what your Vets are doing. If they are your Troop choices I would suggest attaching apothecaries for staying power.

If you intend on using them as strikers I'm not entirely sure what kind of support unit would have to be attached.

>40k gets Tartaros rules
>loyalist SM only
>includes Volkite, plasma blaster, and REAPER AUTOCANNONS
>CSM get nothing

I think I'm just going to redouble my efforts for 30k, guys. If you don't play loyalist space Marines in 40k, you're not worth GW's time.

Ave Dominus Nox...

>>52220550
Heavy 8 or twin linked, not both. Thermo Targeters mechanically do not make sense, how would targeting suddenly allow your weapon to penetrate armor it couldn't previously?

I recommend +1 to hit rather than lowering ap or rename the ability to something else.

>>52220569
Can you feel the noose tightening yet?

Are you prepared for the next edition when the Emperor has been resurrected and 30k/40k officially merge as elements of the Legions from the HH days rejoin the Imperium to destroy chaos, aliens and heretic alike?

It's happening.

It is already happening.

File: Result 2 Image Searching 'Smug Perturabo'.gif (318KB, 325x284px) Image search: [Google]

318KB, 325x284px

>>52219450
Can't be Perturabo, pic related.

Could use some list advice, this is for casual play, with the only goal being to kill a few things and then laugh as I deny victory points with the Sagyar Mazan.

>2500pt Shattered Legions, White Scars/Imperial Fists

>Rite of War: The Sagyar Mazan

>Scars Praetor, Paragon Blade, Archeotech Pistol, Iron Halo, Cyber hawk

>Fists Legion Champion Consul: Master crafted Power Axe, Artificer armor, boarding shield

>10man Scars Assault Squad, 1 each Power Sword, Axe, Glaive

>17man Fists Breacher squad, 3x lascutter, power fist

>3x Scars Apothecaries, 3x power glaive, 1 bike, 1 jump pack, 1 combi-plasma

>10x Scars Seekers, 10x combi-plasma, Power glaive.

>9x Scars Outriders, Power Sword, 2x Power Axe, Sergeant, Power Glaive,

>Fists Leviathan Siege Dreadnought, Claw, Grav flux bombard, Calivers, Phosphex

>10man Fists Heavy Weapon squad, Missile launchers, Flakk Missiles, Augury scanner

>Total, 2500pts

>>52220680
Should add that this is composed of stuff I can potentially have built for a few 2am games at Adepticon when nobody is watching. I like infantry more than I like bikes, and this is shit I can run with absolutely no proxying.

Russ and Custodes need beating! Help!
Scoria 2.5k list, need help with filth, very new to Mechanicum.

Scoria
magos (to sit with thanatar)

Castellax x 2
Castellax x 2
Castellax x 2
thallax x 3
thallax x 3
thallax x 3

Vultarax
Vultarax
Ursurax x 4 PF

Thanatar + targetting
Thanatar + targetting

>>52220575
I thought the goto statline for quad-weapons is double the shots and twin-linked, so that's what I have it. Targeters represent it getting accurate scans of how enemy armour is affected by those weapons and hitting the weak spots next time, but I didn't want to have a massive blurb in the middle of the stat block.
Dropping TL isn't a big deal, so sure. +1 To Hit is pretty much useless given it's BS5 already. Maybe have the Targeters grant Rending or PE instead?

>>52220584

40k is a shitshow. I'm just glad that I found people who play 30k.

>>52220770
>he thinks 30k isn't in the process of turning into another shitshow

Let me guess, you weren't around for books 2 and 3? Book 5, surely? The current Custode shit is just the tip of the iceberg.

>>52220801

It's turning into one, but it's not quite there yet.

>>52220179
>All hail the God-Emperor Mary Sue?
Pretty much. One of my chief irritations with 30k. Makes it seem like everyone and everything that ever lived are apparently weaker and dumber than some shamans on Earth for some reason. I mean the Emperor isn't even close to the Age of Szarehk, Ceograch and other beings int he galaxy yet seems stronger and smarter than everyone combined. Not to mention pretty much anything that might go wrong for him is then implied to maybe be all according to keikaku. Its infuriating.

I know people complain about chaosfags who are all 'we've already won its inevitable' but I find emperorfags who go 'the Emperor is stronger than everyone he's already planned it all out' equally irritating since in both cases we have two groups of fans effectively telling all the other factions they are pointless because all that matters is Chaos/Emperor (pick your poison).

I got shafted in a trade and need to replace 4 mkiv backpacks. Any suggestions for alternatives? I checked ebay and for the price they're all going for I might as well just buy another squad.

>>52220956
Sanguinary guard. They're cheaper and the. Backpacks are the exact same if you don't glue the wings on.

>>52220091
Agreed, Gathering Storm could at least have had a fourth book before RoTP where we got to see Chaos making serious gains. The problem with how the narrative is presented now it it looks like Chaos won at Cadia...then achieved nothing of import and got its ass kicked.

Not to mention the fact that the Imperium's response to what we're being told is their greatest defeat ever is that...they are going to be stronger, more numerous and better equipped...

I was honestly hoping for a significant shift in the narrative, with the Imperium having suffered a net reduction in its overall power, opening up a more multipolar galaxy.

>>52220995
cool, thanks dude

File: IMG_20170317_050011.jpg (87KB, 730x599px) Image search: [Google]

87KB, 730x599px

Got it. Solved the puzzle of the backwards hands! Whomever designed this particular chainglaive bit can go fuck himself with a chainglaive.

Is there any alternative (even 3pp) head parts for Vorax Automata?

>>52220680
Drop the lacutters, they are the worse weapon in the game by far.

>>52220998
Even the Cadia part leaves the impression of Chaos Marines going down like orks to the loyalist marines. Like multiple instances of vastly outnumbered loyalists surviving against an enemy horde with only a handfull of casualties. Though this is basically always the case, also in HH novels. The one fight in Fallen Angels did it the best, where the DA character the story follows compares the losses after repelling a wave of traitors and is horrified by how close it was to mutual destruction.

I'm kinda glad not too much changed in the end, but it is weird how suddenly the Imperium can pull a bunch more equipment and troops out of nowhere just because Roughbutt Girlyman asks nicely.

>>52221014
>Whomever designed this particular chainglaive bit can go fuck himself with a chainglaive.

High praise indeed

>>52220395

Why? Can't you just paint the bases?

File: 2000.jpg (199KB, 512x1742px) Image search: [Google]

199KB, 512x1742px

Hello, mates. Can you guys check what I could fix / improve on this list?

Haven't decided on RoW yet, but I'm thinking of the Long March. 60pts left will be used on upgrades.

Oh, sadly no Drop Pods or Dreadclaws available.

So I've build my Moritat with 3 pistols (2 plasma 1 bolt) just because you can, but now I've re-read the Chain Fire rule and would like your opinion on something.

If I choose to chain-fire only using the Bolt Pistol, can I still get to 12 hits total ? It seems like you can, because the shooting again upon succesfull hit mentions weapon, not weapons, and the 12 hit cap is for both pistols, there is no cap for each individual pistol.

File: Lev.jpg (50KB, 480x640px) Image search: [Google]

50KB, 480x640px

First round of damage on my Leviathan. I feel like whenever I need a break from building shit I'm gonna do another, til he's properly beaten to shit for a Shattered Legions force.

>>52221917
Looks nice, are you planning on weathering him?

>>52219228
>properly arched, plucked eyebrows
>almond shaped grey eyes
>high cheekbones
8/10, would rub down with oil after a hard day purging the Emperor's enemies.

>>52221936
You forgot the best thing
they Never talk

>>52221936
Is it whole Brits, or GW that is obcessed with high cheekbones and almond eyes? "Too fucking beautiful for human eyes" Eldars have those and now this.

>>52219937
>They are supposed to be stronger as a demon
When you ignore all the specific weaknesses that daemons have, sure!

But considering there's tricks to fuck over daemons that even regular humans can employ, clearly the 'upgrade' comes with its own package of weaknesses which bring them back down to the level (hell, even lower arguably) than the uncorrupted Primarchs.

File: Untitled.png (97KB, 603x374px) Image search: [Google]

97KB, 603x374px

Warhammer TV put up the Angelus seminar from the weekender:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zmiEKR4Nxg
Doubt there'll be anything we don't know, but in case it's of interest to anyone here.

There's also a vid about Inferno:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zQ_TK_SGbyo
>"It's got the Space Wolves in it"
>yah-boooooooo
>"It also has the Thousand Sons"
>yeaaahhhhhhhh
Kek.

>>52220953
>thinking that living millions of years as a daemon in the warp, having your every whim catered to because you can imagine stuff really well
>and acting in pre-defined ways because you're just a shard of a greater being's conciousness
>counts more for experience than living 50,000 years of human history
Yeah, nah.

>>52221951
Body language is a most sensual thing.
>>52222036
They are considered high marks of beauty in both males and females.

>>52220127
>The Emperor as a dying corpse is powerful enough to hold back the gods from breaking into the Imperial palace
No longer a thing, Master of Mankind expressly says the webway gate is sealed.
>while simultaneously projecting his pyschic might across the galaxy in the form of the Astronomicon.
Untrue, the Astronomicon is the burning light of all the psykers hooked up to it, the Emperor simply guides and focuses the power like a giant lightning rod.
>While also performing minor miracles and other fuckery.
Assuming it's the Emperor and not the reflection in the Warp of the belief of trillions of people.
Yeah, the Emperor is all that, when you don't know the lore you are trying to quote.

>>52222210
>Master of Mankind expressly says the webway gate is sealed.

Sorry but BL isn't cannon as long as the don't fix the claim that there's such a high pressure in space that fighters implode when their hull is compromised.

>>52220158
Always thought it was pretty ridiculous to suggest that thunder warriors who barely conquer ONE dystopic planet are more powerful than astartes who conquer the fucking universe.

>>52222340
I'd be inclined to agree if the whole "demons under the golden throne" thing was fancanon anyway.
No codex source has ever said that would actually happen, only mentioned the shattered webway project and a daemon incursion.
Only MoM actually went into detail on how it was resolved. Idiot fans assumed it was NEVER dealt with, because obviously such a thing can't be closed or sealed up in any way, and repeat the meme until more idiots like you believe it.
I remember when Templars were 6000 strong, when GK were 3000 strong and had wards inscribed on their bones, when the Nids were running from something else, and a whole lot of other bullshit people tout around here as truth.

>>52222349
universe...? you mean they destroy a few thousand planets in one part of the galaxy ?

>>52222349
>thunder warriors who barely conquer ONE dystopic planet are more powerful than astartes who conquer the fucking universe.
Thunder Warriors were less stable, both mentally and genetically.

We also don't know what requirements there were for becoming a Thunder Warrior, as well as the success/fail rate, compared to that of Space Marines.

>>52219259
Word Bearers, but not without being reduced to chapter size first. That includes any daemonic allies with them at the time.

> produce only half as much as Marines
> save budgets on armor, bolters, implants, etc
> equip all remaining Marines with plasmaguns as default with saved budget
> conquer galaxy faster and easier

Profit?

>>52222442
>equip all remaining Marines with plasmaguns
GETS HOT

>>52222394
I meant the 40k universe aka galaxy seeing as they fuck over the Eldar and orks and other in universe races.

>>52222417
true, and they may have had shittier armaments before the Mars treaties, but it is strange since the astartes tackle an unimaginably greater threat every day for 200 years. Why did the Emperor even need super soldiers to take Terra?

Sell me on Wolves, /tg/.

>>52222448
Invest on thicker oven gloves I guess?

>>52222452
Horus Rising sold me on Wolves for sure. And Galaxy in Flame 'Wolves once again' scene too.

>>52222442
> save budgets
It's not a computer game, the emperor didn't have X spacecredits to spend each turn.

>>52222370
The people who cling to what was written in MoM as if it is some holy writ like the bible are hilarious.

But sure, chaos best stepdad and Horus was just a prank bro.

>>52222516
why wouldn't they, it's a gw sanctioned piece that deals with a lot of vague or non-existent lore. Also GW is making more and more lore choices that seem to comply with bl books now.

>>52222451
Other people had super-soldiers. Sadly they don't go into too much detail (Inferno basically re-hashes what we already know, in its fluff section on the Custodes), but the other warlords of earth had "techno-barbarian" soldiers of their own, and possibly worse things if some of the 'legends' about the battles are to be believed.

Whether the Thunder Warriors were just more of what Terra always had running around, or some kind of true prototype of the Space Marines, is unknown.

It also mentions that the Custodes were made even before the Thunder Warriors, but given the complexity of their creation (likely requiring direct use of psychic powers by the Emperor) and very small pool of potential candidates available, it's no wonder that they never became the main army.

>>52222475
>Space Wolves
I meant Space Wolves. Luna Wolves are the best wolves tho.

>>52222540
There's 10,000 of the custodes, which surely would've been enough to take Terra if they are superior to thunder warriors.

>>52222452
They're a bunch of cunts to everyone and everything. They act dumb but are actually smart but really they're wrong about that, they're fucking stupid. Their planet is some Dark Age prison designed to be so inimical to life that freaky shit like the Canis Helix has to be used to survive. They're too cool for apothecaries and librarians, but still channel an actual warp entity for power rather than twisting the warp itself like every other non-daemonic psyker ever. It remains to be seen exactly what this means, but since its literally what the 1ksons were doing, its probably wrong. They do have the whole executioners thing and over 300 confirmed legion kills, but since everyone's hush-hush about what they've done we don't know whether they've earned at least one victory or are eternal jobbers. They also have the Field Policeman Dredd, who is the law and doesnt afraid of anything.

Rules-wise, theyre a faster, weaker version of the World Eater berserkers we know and love, with run and charge mobility and cheap power weapons, instead of free chainaxes and millions of attacks. Their characters are average, the priests are nothing special and are mostly just a rehash of what they replace, their primarch's decently killy but will never ever lose a duel since nothing can ever hit him enough in a match to kill him before the end of the game. His oversized shitty resin wolves arent amazing, since ap4 doesnt cut the mustard even with rending.

>>52222602
10,000 by the mid-Great Crusade, which didn't actually start after the solar system had been conquered.

>>52222613
>inimical to life

and yet there are a ton of tribes who live above ground there and survive pretty well, with enough numbers to sustain one of the biggest legions despite selective recruitment, suggesting a population of some millions.

Also the Rune Priests thing is obviously hypocritical, but I think the difference is partly that they trap warp energy in fetishes and runes (same with whfb dwarfs) and they have nature rituals which basically limit their powers and temptation to draw power directly from the warp.

Frost weapons have some great rules and are fairly cheap and Geigor is a character every legion should have but doesn't. He'll be totally OP in zone mortalis.

>on Thunder Warriors,

We really dont have much info or fluff at the reunification of Terra but its quite heavily implied that it was a very difficult reconquest and inconsistent lore mentions Big E having to deal with Terra a few times long after the space marine legions came about.

The old earth nations also had massive armies of super enhanced warrors, psykers, archeotech and mutants. A few of the nations, the Emperor even had trouble subduing and had to resort to diplomacy.

He also had a far more limited resource base than the Great Crusade.

>>52222698
also presumably the lords of terra are members of some of those resistant factions and were probably about equal to the Emperor at the outset.

>>52220142
>Now there is even hinting that the Horus Heresy was among the Emperors cards the whole time as a means of quelling the Astartes.
>hinting
It was outright stated that he had a limited form of foresight (Eldrad chides him on it) allowing him to foresee basically all major events up to the moment one of the primarches turn traitor.
But he didn't know which one it would be, or how many, or anything that would happen up to the moment one of them turned.
Thinking about it, that would be an explanation for Angron. Using him as the sacrificial lamb, a warped, angry, bitter creature that coincidentally had a terminally short lifespan that turned traitor (and took his warped spawn with him) would be the best possible end. Further, it would explain the whole throwdown between the World Eaters and Space Wolves.

>>52222698

Forgot to mention, but the astartes were made for pulling off completely difficult bullshit attack plans, master every form of warfare and use combined arms with all elements of the Imperium.

The Thunder Warriors were basically crude thugs, similar to the other techno barbarians of Terra except with marginally better gear, thicker muscles and smarter war leaders. They prob would be illsuited for pulling drop pod attacks on a Tyranid hiveship or fast attack to cut off an Ork Gargant or support an imperial guard armoured push against a demon horde.

>>52222516
>The people who cling to what was written in MoM as if it is the sole piece of material dealing with the events it covers
Anon, the AoS thread is a few pages down, take your gross denial there.

>>52222761
I'd say for gross denial check out the whfb general.

>>52222663
The rune priests are still drawing their power directly from a warp beasty, which is bad juju no matter how you look at it. I suppose fetishes and runes might be protection, but i doubt that'll be good enough if the fenris creature wants to do something. Still though, they've been doing it for ten millenia by the times of 40k and arent all chaos spawn, so who knows whats going on.

Frost weapons are decent, despite their uninspired rules, and geigor is alright. I don't know about OP, a dread will fuck him up without difficulty and i never play ZM without usually two. I'm more scared of Hvarl Red-Blade

>>52222834
>The rune priests are still drawing their power directly from a warp beasty, which is bad juju no matter how you look at it
They directly admitted as such, so it's difficult to hold i against them when they said so from the word go.
> I suppose fetishes and runes might be protection, but i doubt that'll be good enough if the fenris creature wants to do something. Still though, they've been doing it for ten millenia by the times of 40k and arent all chaos spawn, so who knows whats going on
It works, anon, I know it's hard to give Space Wolves any credit because you are nursing that 40k hateboner, but it doesn't apply here.

>>52222834
you don't need daemons to draw power from the warp, they are just entities drawn to the souls of psykers, they aren't the energy itself. Unless you mean to say there is some entity on Fenris they draw power from, which is probably a tyranid (krakens could be zoanthropes that are trapped on Fenris due to there being no biomatter to expand with).

>>52222908
>Unless you mean to say there is some entity on Fenris they draw power from
There expressly is, Battle of Fenris proved the Wolves were objectively correct about channeling the spirit of the world.

>>52222970
true, but it isn't neccessarily a warp beasty. It could be a C'Tan, Tyranid or something that the Emperor left in the Fang which would explain why he wasn't bothered by wolf priests at Nikaea. also

>wrath of fagnus

>>52222993
>all this salt and butthurt
The most reasonable explanation is that Fenris is an Exodite world that is constantly trying to kill it's inhabitants, but they keep on surviving anyway.

>>52222887
I find their 30k incarnation way more annoying than 40k, where they're just regular old Big Damn Heroes with a boner for wolves, which isnt that bad apart from their lack of naming creativity. In 30k, they're just assholes though. Russ is a overconfident twit with no concept of how his brothers think, seen both in his scrap with angron and thinking he can take out Horus, and whose hatred blinded him to the bizarreness of Horus saying that the emperor totally wanted Magnus dead instead of brought back to terra despite having orders to the contrary. His whole schtick of being actually civilized and intelligent, just pretending to act like an idiotic barbarian falls apart because he acts like a barbarian when he ought to put his intelligence to use. The whole Emperor's Executioners thing could give them some character, but FW and BL will never release any information about exactly what happened to the [REDACTED] legions.

>>52222908
>>52222993
The Spirit of Fenris is now explicitly a warp entity, they draw power from it instead of twisting the warp like literally everyone else does. What exactly the spirit of fenris is remains to be seen, but drawing power from warp entities is what got the 1ksons censored. Why this one is relatively benign is unknown.

>>52222602
10'000 dudes is not enough to take a planet pretty much regardless of how good at stabbing people they are. 1.5 million is barely enough, which is why Astartes a shit and Imperial Army/Mechanicum a best. They did all the actual work.

>>52223050
>10,000 dudes is not enough to take a planet
>astartes regularly written to number less than 1000 and take planets unaided

>>52223023
yeah but wrath of fagnus

>>52223022
>salt and butthurt

not particularly, never played 40k but the writing is terrible shit.

>>52220569

They're still just vanilla termies with sweep. At best, people will get 5 just to have optimal LC termies.

>>52223023
>seen both in his scrap with angron and thinking he can take out Horus,
The fight with Angron was an object lesson about fighting and winning the war means not rushing after the prize of the biggest head.
And do remember his words were, "Horus is the one I'm not sure I could kill".
>and whose hatred blinded him to the bizarreness of Horus saying that the emperor totally wanted Magnus dead instead of brought back to terra despite having orders to the contrary
Or, like a decently loyal general, heeded the words of the Emperor to consider Horus' orders as the Emperor's voice in all respects.
Your opinion is laced with your own ill will mixed with omniscient knowledge of how things go wrong.
>>52223094
All the writing is shit, but don't talk shit when a book directly says "This is how it is" and you are the ignorant one.

>>52223050

Why are you going to post in these threads if you're not even going to read the FW HH books? Latest book had 200 TS conquer a Knight world.

>>52222815
top kek

>>52222448
More like "take gun to a techmarine for hours of reloading per 10 shot plasma flask."

>>52222993
>>52223022
>>52223094
>>52223119

The Emperor foresaw the events leading up to the HH and planned accordingly by having major bastions built. The Imperial Palace being as fuckhuge as it is and the Fang being the sole property of the Emperor's executioners are no coincidence. However, the Emperor did not foresee the Space Wolves getting themselves dicked time after time again in the HH; so his investment in the Fang was fruitless in the sole context of the HH.

>>52223173
>The Imperial Palace being as fuckhuge as it is and the Fang being the sole property of the Emperor's executioners are no coincidence
That makes little sense.
It's like saying he foresaw the need of Ultramar being as huge as it was just in case he needed a second Imperium.

>>52223173
Never trust a wolf to the job of a lion

>>52223226

>It's like saying he foresaw the need of Ultramar being as huge as it was just in case he needed a second Imperium

Your comment is retarded. Ultramar was already as huge as it was before the Emperor came. The Emperor didn't dismantle Ultramar because it was basically a galactic equivalent of one of the old Terran empires which couldn't be easily broken, and because Guilliman was already running the whole thing.

The Emperor kept confidence in a few Legions, and His actions prove this - his choices being most evident in the Imperial Fists, the Ultramarines, and the Space Wolves.

>>52223094
>>52223129
Yeah,bed all know that Games Workshop and Forge World have a truly terrible sense of scale. The war for Vraks was about right, but they seem to keep confusing planets with cities and sectors with small countries.
And Terra wasn't like the billion Firefly-scale titchy planets they took easily during the Crusade and mostly didn't have to fight for, there would have been stuff that actually put up a fight.
"Muh Martial Perfection" doesn't stop the fact that they flat out couldn't hold Earth with just the Custodes by dint of only being able to stab a spear so far. 1.5 million dudes is pitiful compared to the forces of one Forge World, so therefore the Army did the majority of the fighting by inference.

>>52223119
Angron doesnt give a shit about object lessons though, hence both of them coming out thinking they had the win. Russ thought he was teaching a lesson, angron didnt even realise-Russ completely misjudged angron, angron didnt give a shit in the first place. You dont expect that from a blood-mad berserker with brain nails, but Russ was always seen as intelligent, and completely misjudged how his brother thought.

Even when he wasnt sure about killing horus, rather than working with his brothers in defence of Terra he Leroy Jenkins'd off into the distance and got his legion destroyed, his dogs dead and got severely wounded. If he stayed put and wasnt acting impetuously, he wouldve helped at the Siege and maybe things wouldnt have been quite so shit.

A decently loyal general with one set of orders, countermanded by a bizarre different set of orders, ought to question said orders, lest you wind up at a military tribunal saying you were only following orders. He had Valdor in his force being a naysayer. He shouldve at least called home, rather than joyously acting on his irrational hatred.

My opinion is formed simply because they fucked up every single time they attempted something throughout the heresy. Prospero burned, the Wolf Cull happened, he was not at Terra when he needed to be.A negative bias exists simply because they were the biggest failure of the loyalist side, and every time they were given an opportunity they fucked it up. But blame everything they fucked up on me having 'ill-will' and retaining a 40k bias, thats sure to convince me.

>>52223232

A lion sits on his shit unless something comes along and messes with him. The Night Lords came along and messed with the 1st, so they got their entrails scattered across half the fucking galaxy because they were stupid white bois messing with goddamn lions.

Leman Russ wanted to be engaged in loyalist efforts, but ultimately he was outmatched by the very fact that he never gave great consideration to the idea that extraordinary circumstances require thinking outside the norm he is used to.

>>52222370
GK do have wards inscribed into their bones

>>52223259
>Ultramar was already as huge as it was before the Emperor came
Ultramar reached it's 500 world zenith well towards the end of the GC, not before.

>>52223279

Angron never even went to school. Angron never even had adoptive parents or tutors. The Fenrisians at least had moms who fed them and dads who beat them into learning. Leman Russ can't grasp the simple fact that some people think differently from him.

>>52223173
The fortifications came handy against the Ecclesiarchy and Inquisition, though.

>>52223285
>A lion sits on his shit unless something comes along and messes with him. The Night Lords came along and messed with the 1st, so they got their entrails scattered across half the fucking galaxy because they were stupid white bois messing with goddamn lions.

If I ever took NL seriously before, this shattered any possibility of doing it in the future.

Thanks anon, made my day.

>>52222602
Any other anons correct me if I'm wrong, but Inferno implied there were only four custodes at the time he was uniting terra.

>>52223296

Did I say it was the hugest it had ever been? It was absolutely huge in the context of stellar territories already under Primarch control by the time of the Emperor, and needed no additional special propping up like what the Emperor did for the Space Wolves.

>>52223119
Leman still does a terrible job of understanding his brothers, leaving aside the adversarial ones. He's completely stunned that the Khan doesn't come running to his aid when he calls and nurses a grudge against him for years, never once considering that Khan could've had a valid reason. No empathy.
He has no understanding of the Lion at all and doesn't get anywhere close to that until after the Lion is thought dead. To be fair to him, he regrets that he never made an effort, but too fucking late man.

Now, many of the primarchs had no idea how to relate to their brothers, so Leman is not alone. But for someone who is supposed to be intelligent and perceptive under a skin of alpha pack leader arrogance, he doesn't fucking show it when it would be useful.

Russ' arrogance routinely getting his men killed is something that always kind of bothers me. I know the SW are cool with it and the whole pack mentality thing trains them to fight like that, but for a good guy genius I-was-just-pretending-to-be-retarded, Russ commits to the act too strongly.

>>52223339

Just read the damn thing. That was just one story where the Emperor had a diplomatic meeting with 4 Custodes escorts, and His idea of a successful argument is having said 4 Custodes massacre everything in the room. He created more of them by the time of the Thunder Warriors massacre.

>>52223366

The lore keeps emphasizing that Leman Russ was far smarter than the average wolf, and yet his actions just keep painting him as an above-average wolf.

>>52223279
>Russ was always seen as intelligent, and completely misjudged how a madman thought.
Ok.
>rather than working with his brothers in defence of Terra he Leroy Jenkins'd off into the distance
So did the Dangels, except we don't even know exactly what Russ was doing since we only have a barebones outline. You are reaching for arguments in the space of ambiguity.
>ought to question said orders
That is not how it works, anon. Even then, the person he would question would logically be Horus, since you want to use a military argument, because you don't leap chain of command, which coincidentally ended with Horus, anyway.
>Prospero burned, the Wolf Cull happened, he was not at Terra when he needed to be.
And this makes them different from the Dark Angels, Ultramarines, Raven Guard, all of whom fucked up, had their numbers decimated (and in the case of Raven Guard, had them decimated TWICE) and missed the siege entirely, how?
The problem with your argument is that some version of it, mistakes made, numbers cut down, missing the siege, is one that only works with both godly omniscience and a desire to cast a particular stone.
Hell, we know exactly HOW the Ultramarines and Dark Angels fucked up, we don't know what the Wolves were doing.
>>52223343
>additional propping up
Like all those other primarches that didn't have space empires, ie most of them?
Or Johnson and Mortarion, who had to be introduced to technology?

>>52223368
Either way it wasn't fucking 10000 of them

>>52223401

>Like all those other primarches that didn't have space empires, ie most of them?

Yes, like all the other primarchs who received the usual treatment of induction into the empire and the usual technological updates. Above average treatment is distinctly noted in lore. Everyone bitched about the Fang belonging to the frat boy club of the Astartes, for example.

>>52223442

There could have been close to 10k, its not noted for certain. However, its reasonable to assume (and heavily implied) that going strictly the Custodes route would have taken far too long for the Emperor's liking.

>collect 30 Tartaros termies
>start having doubts about fielding 30 termies in a single battle
>suddenly 40k rules

Well ok then, guess 10 of these guys are gonna be Blood Ravens now.

File: 99560101535_LemanRuss04.jpg (72KB, 369x360px) Image search: [Google]

72KB, 369x360px

Leave Leman Russ alone ! Just leave him alone ! He's a special boy, he can't help he's the way he his, and you should respect him for that ! Leave him aloooone

File: God Emperor.png (2MB, 1111x1920px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 1111x1920px

>>52223401
>ought to question such orders
See, i hate to be the guy to bring up the Nuremberg trials, but 'i was just following orders' doesnt excuse you from doing dumb shit. You are still responsible for your actions, and while you follow orders within reason, having your orders completely swapped to 'kill our allies' is not within reason. Especially when Valdors there going this isnt what was planned. And the chain of command in this case comes from the Emperor, who gave the order.

The Dangels were fighting their own civil war and tearing the Night Lords sixteen new assholes while stuck on the other side of the galactic warpstorm, the ultramarines were the second-most useless loyalists who were also stuck on the other side of the galaxy, the Raven Guard got sneak-attacked and nearly all died, which you cant blame them for. They then fought guerilla warfare for years, and eventually rescued Russ from his own folly at Yarant. They had reasons, nominal ones in the case of the Ultramarines. White Scars and blood angels went through hell to get to the siege, the wolves left Terra before the traitors arrived to try and execute Horus by themselves.

Russ sneak attacked the thousand sons who were nominally allies at that point due to wanting to kill magnus, got mauled and didnt even kill Magnus, eventually got back to terra-i.e. where he shouldve stayed and helped the fists defend like he was told-and got mauled again when he ran off to Yarant and tried to 1v1 Horus. His legion got knocked down to a few thousand at the wolf cull. His mistakes were made by none other than he himself, whereas every other legion's problems were enemy actions or warpstorm concerns. He was at terra, and rather than stay in a fortified location with too few defenders already, he took his legion and ran off for glory or redemption or what have you. This is no omniscient view with a illogical bias, he flatly made more mistakes than any other loyalist primarch.

File: 1487899069950.jpg (187KB, 985x865px) Image search: [Google]

187KB, 985x865px

>>52223580
hello
hello you stinky yiff
go be a failure ugly

>>52223668

Not really a counter argument, but a few things I want to point out.

>DAngels
Although in hindsight we can say that annihilating the Night Lords was a waste of time, it seemed opportune to break an entire traitor legion at the time.
>Ultramarines
It was only the third most effective sneak attack in the HH which crippled them, virtually wiped out their space fleet, and the ensuing Ruinstorm that followed which kept them busy for much of HH.
>RG
Also tried their best to rebuild before confronting Horus, we all know how that went.
>Space Wolves
Russ is just consistently the galaxy's premier space jock. He didn't even surprise attack Prospero (successfully, anyway). Valdor bought a fucking clue and made him voxcast on all channels for almost an hour. But apparently 45 minutes is too long a wait for the "honor of the Space Wolves" and he decides to order a bumrush.

At every major flashpoint where Russ was involved in the HH, all anyone can think was "what the fuck was he thinking???".

>>52223724
Why is this so funny?

>>52220080
Didn't the iron hands under Autek Mor crush the world eaters on Bodt?

>>52223770
For some reason it also reminds me of the Shooting Stars maymays

>>52223773

Yep, pretty much destroyed their capacity to reinforce.

>>52223748
annihilating the night lords was maybe less fruitful than turning the First on the other traitors, it certainly softened them up for the post-heresy beating the Ultras gave them and probably made them a lot less dangerous in the scouring, since a full-strength night lords wouldve been pretty nasty to deal with when all the legions were decimated.
>ultras
True, but their efforts to get to the siege were lacking compared to most of the other legions. While they're the second-worst legion, they're miles better than the wolves.
>RG
True, but that involved alphariatic intervention, which i class under enemy actions. Also, they had Sharrowkyn, who despite his suedom was entertaining to read about.
>other dropsite legions
All went off and did their own thing to throw spanners in the Traitor war machine, Salamanders did the least but were still present.
>wolves
Every time the secretly civilised barbarian thing is brought up, i was hopeful it would lead to some masterful deception where this hinted intelligence would be shown, but no, every action russ takes leads to disaster due to arrogance and impetuosity and a flat inability to understand others. He's as bad as Dorn or the Lion.

File: What in the Emperor's name.png (735KB, 1260x962px) Image search: [Google]

735KB, 1260x962px

>>52219228
I think someone is going to get decimated for this.

File: Get decimated Ironfire Riders.png (536KB, 1258x960px) Image search: [Google]

536KB, 1258x960px

>>52223848
>old
>obsolete
>0%

>>52222602
I think at the start of the unification wars, the emperor only had a dozen or so custodes. At the end of conquering Terra he had 30 or so. 150 years later he had 10,000. With expansion came the resources and candidates to make them more quickly albeit still extremely slowly and resource intensive.

>>52219228
....How is that gorget attached?

>>52223899
Surgically attached.

>>52223817

>True, but their efforts to get to the siege were lacking compared to most of the other legions.

For a Legion which originally believed Terra was already lost and started the race back to Terra pretty late, they did a great job trying. There was no way Guilliman could have known that the Emperor would decide to be a fucking gambler during the siege. By all tactical estimates, the Ultramarines performed optimally.

>Russ being as bad as Dorn or Lion

Dorn got fucked with by the Chaos gods when he sent his legion out to combat the Iron Warriors, where Perturabo almost bit the dust. Whereas other Primarchs would have or are shown to have lost their nerves, Dorn stood and made the best out of a hellish scenario. Dorn did great, and the only thing he could be faulted for was not handcuffing the Emperor to His throne when Horus lowered his shields.

Lion operated on a different set of priorities to begin with, which did affect his Legion's operational tempo. However, its hard to argue that they could have done more or they did less than what they could; since they were just as much in the dark as many of the other loyalists.

>>52223911
For real? I remember the sisters being mute but is that why? I always assumed it was more of a vow of silence kind of deal.

>>52223922
The gorget is but they do the vow of silence.

File: 1427169564346.jpg (301KB, 720x520px) Image search: [Google]

301KB, 720x520px

>>52223911
No.

>>52223933
That's what I remember from MoM.

File: 1stcaptainisbestcaptain.jpg (80KB, 1339x623px) Image search: [Google]

80KB, 1339x623px

>>52223874
>>52223848
Ave Dominus fucking Nox.

File: 1427169294672.jpg (777KB, 630x1035px) Image search: [Google]

777KB, 630x1035px

>>52223939
ADB fancfiction<GW

File: Loyalty's rewards.png (765KB, 1240x984px) Image search: [Google]

765KB, 1240x984px

>>52223954
I don't think it likes Perturbo or the Iron Warriors.

>>52223972
Where did I go wrong? When I read ADB?

>>52223337
Eh, night lords lost because they tried to fight the dangels straight up instead of as night lords. I can't remember where but sevatar even remarked about how the dark angels might not have won if the night lords hadn't forgotten themselves.

File: images.jpg (12KB, 207x244px) Image search: [Google]

12KB, 207x244px

>>52223972
ADB's NL>GW

>>52223998
Because trying to act scary is a good counter to space marines.

>>52223998
>Sevatar remarked they could have one
>I could totally beat you I just wasn't trying
Yeah no bias there

>>52223972
>[here sister, let me give you a big hand]
>[emperor dammit sister, why must you do this]

File: JenetiaKroleInferno.jpg (131KB, 648x714px) Image search: [Google]

131KB, 648x714px

>>52223988
Latest example of SoS without gorget.

>>52223917
I'm undecided about the Ultras performance in the heresy, i admit i think their post-heresy actions were a bit bullish, by essentially threatening civil war unless the Codex Astartes was adopted leaves me with negative feelings about them more than anything they did in the Heresy. Calth was a big clusterfuck but they came out of it better than anyone expected, which is to be respected.

Both Dorn and the Lion did great with what they had, especially Dorn. I was talking about their personality, what with Dorn being brutally direct to the point of insult and the Lion having flatly autistic tendencies. Russ and his lack of empathy or even basic consideration for others is, to me at least, equally disabling as the two primarchs generally seen as having social interaction problems.

>>52224014
*won
Fucking phone

>>52224020
Throw me a painglove.

>>52223998
Yeah, Sevetar had it right on the spot. The NL's don't farewell fighting against someone their own size. Couple on the fact that DA have void superiority over pretty much every space marine legion and you have an easy stop. Curze just doesn't know how to pick his fights i guess.

>>52224014
Sevatar was meaning that they could have won if they had played the game more their way instead of the straight-up void war that happened in Prince of Crows.

>>52224023

>Ultras
Codex Astartes was just the pretext. Subdivision of the Legions was absolutely necessary, and Dorn's unilateral actions prove it.

>I was talking about their personality
Dorn was an uncompromising but successful stellar ruler, the kind of man who is valued in the post-GC Imperium which the Emperor envisioned. He told other primarchs to get on his boat or go fuck themselves, and the only real disagreeable opinion he held was that all psykers are bad. He didn't have social interaction issues, he just didn't feel the need to correct other primarchs to the point where he would have to bend over and kiss their asses. After all, he is royalty.

Lion is just plain autistic, though - to a strange and obsessive degree.

Russ just had general brain problems. He wanted to show Angron he was wrong, but he failed to consider that Angron came from an individualistic gladiatorial background. Russ wants to be smart and argumentative and tricky and fierce like all his other brothers, but in the end comes off as third rate.

His "success" as the Emperor's executioner also seems to be attributed to cheating with stasis bomb fuckery, and the mystery surrounding the elimination of the [REDACTED] shrouded in metric fucktons of Wolf Priest propaganda.

>>52223998
It's true. Night Haunter was an idiot.

>Wow. The lion gave me eleven mortal wounds last time we fought, I'm still not healed, and I just woke up from the coma he put me in.

>What? Their fleet has us surrounded and is cutting us apart? We have a way out?

>Rally the troops, we're boarding their flagship. I feel like I can take him now that I'm gravely wounded and can barely stand.

>What? They surrounded us? Stand your ground! Don't try any of our usual tricks, just fight them like equals!

Seriously.

The Lion legitimately beat Curze so hard he made him retarded. Then in Unremembered Empire he found his tard strength.

>>52224115

Night Haunter was never meant to run an organization, let alone fight someone on his level.

>>52224137
He was a primarch. That was exactly what he was supposed to do. He was literally built to run a legion.

>>52224147

complete fail of a primarch

>>52224147
And was he in any way capable of ever doing that? Maybe when he was in his test tube he could be the Gestapo Emps needed, but ever since he got chaos-scrambled and went headfirst through adamantine crust, he was never going to be anything but a failure.

>>52224165
I'm not arguing that he wasn't a failure. I'm arguing against the idea that he was never meant to run an organization.

Every primarch was built from the amino acids up to run a gigantic piece of the great crusade. They just ended up landing on planets where an evil gang society, a couple of creepy chaos catholics, or some douchebag with a hammer and some archeotech nails fucked them up.

>>52224204
>never meant to run an organization.
>Here's a legion, run it

>>52224204
i was in complete agreement with you, hence my comment about when he was still in his test tube he mightve been what daddy wanted

>>52224216
I don't understand this response. Are you saying I'm wrong? Did I contradict myself? I need more words to understand what this greentext was supposed to mean.

>>52224241
No, I was agreeing with you. Though I can see how that intention may have been lost.

>>52224263
Oh, all right. Cheers.

File: image.jpg (41KB, 377x377px) Image search: [Google]

41KB, 377x377px

Bitter boys, can I get a hand?

Does anyone know whether the Iron Warriors Heavy Bolter shells have special models or not, and if not what Hbolter pattern were they likely to use?
My custom Ordo Reductor Manta airship needs 16 S5 AP5 6 shot guns, so I was thinking of using 16 pairs of those. Also, any Heresy gun that is S7 AP3? Need a substitute for 3 twin-linked Ion cannon too, since I'm not using filthy Tau tech.

>>52224011
No you muppet, Fighting dirty instead of straight up.

>>52224326
Anything the night lords can do the dark eldar can do better

>>52224043
I think the only legion that could take the dark angels in space were the imperial fists. Other than that, 3rd is quite a ways away.

>>52224336
>Have a shitty primarch
Checkmate knife-ears.

>>52224324
>S7 AP3
The leviathan dred's storm cannon has that profile. Also the krios tank's lightning thingy, although that's a blast not a multishot gun.

>>52224326

This. Word Bearers fought dirty as backstabbers and rulebreakers. Death Guard fought dirty with dirty bombs. Sons of Horus fought dirty by kidnapping little psyker children for demon fuel. Alpha Legion fought dirty with subterfuge.

Night Lords fought like retards. In stark contrast, loyalist Night Lords fought dirty as elements of loyalist armies and were pretty fucking good at it.

>>52224326
>>52224370
Night Lords fought dirty by trying to act scary.
Doesn't work against Space Marines.

>>52224388

>OOGA BOOGA BOOGA
>SEE IM FIGHTING IM FIGHTING

File: too sexy for my warpshirt.png (520KB, 1242x633px) Image search: [Google]

520KB, 1242x633px

>>52223848

>>52224388
Nice bait

>>52223848
>>52223975
>>52223874
>Bitterness intensifies

>>52224370
>loyalist Night Lords
Can you give me any books/fw page references to read featuring them? I like the idea of a Terran Vet looking on what has become of his legion and feeling disgust, returning to help fight with RG or other loyalists from traitor legions.

>>52224357
That looks shiny. It's even Heavy 6, so works nicely as S7 AP3 Heavy 3 twin-linked, and I can mount them in turrets easily enough.
What parts does it come in? Can I split the the four barrels into 2x2 like the quad-bolter ball turrets?

>>52224437
>vs Competent Legion
>"They're jamming our comms."
>"They've spent their time fortifying their defensive position."
>"They had a well coordinated battle plan."

>vs Night Lords
>"They're playing spooky noises over our comms."
>"They've spent their time covering their armour in spooky bones."
>"Spookmaster Jagged couldn't control his men very well."

File: 20170317_181334.jpg (575KB, 1306x980px) Image search: [Google]

575KB, 1306x980px

What are you working on this weekend /hhg/?

File: Phosis'bustodes't'kar.jpg (187KB, 1419x652px) Image search: [Google]

187KB, 1419x652px

>>52224406
my space nigger

File: 17360523_10154550420668737_1701449323_n.jpg (40KB, 450x800px) Image search: [Google]

40KB, 450x800px

>>52224516
Victory is Vengeance models for an upcoming campaign.

File: Guilly.jpg (612KB, 1495x623px) Image search: [Google]

612KB, 1495x623px

>>52224568
>>52223848
>>52223874
>>52223975
>>52223954

Step up kids.

>>52224516
Getting drunk.

>>52224632
He truly was the Ultramarine.

File: heard you have been a loyalist.png (622KB, 1205x558px) Image search: [Google]

622KB, 1205x558px

>>52224632
There's no fun in perfection.

File: 1474139118678.jpg (218KB, 800x1035px) Image search: [Google]

218KB, 800x1035px

>>52223232
amen, battle-brother

File: Screenshot_2017-03-17-10-42-08.png (255KB, 1024x600px) Image search: [Google]

255KB, 1024x600px

>>52224723
This site works as intended.

File: Uninterested Medusa.png (200KB, 732x986px) Image search: [Google]

200KB, 732x986px

>>52224406
Kek.
>>52224461
Tip top kek!
>>52224632
He's the spiritual liege after all.
>>52224757
It does give me meme fuel.

>>52219924
they gain powers from chaos gods but then they suffer the same weaknesses as normal daemons so there's a tradeoff

File: 94738274.jpg (111KB, 1349x661px) Image search: [Google]

111KB, 1349x661px

>>52223848
>>52223874
JUST

Didn't Dorn threw his Marines into IW meatgrinder knowingly and willingly for some derp reason? Couldn't get to like him after that.

>>52224632
>>52224723
>>52224757
>>52223975
>>52223874
>>52223848

*teleports behind you*
*stabs you in back with claws*

Hmph, amateur hour!

>>52224847
It's okay, he was just pretending to be retarded.

File: 35346346346.png (734KB, 1331x545px) Image search: [Google]

734KB, 1331x545px

Not a fan of Scoria.

File: Laughing Tomoko.gif (2MB, 480x270px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 480x270px

>>52224827
Ayy!

File: 35346346346.png (634KB, 1265x659px) Image search: [Google]

634KB, 1265x659px

>>52224861
Dorn's cool though.
>>52224847
It was a legion sized pain glove.

File: Screenshot_2017-03-17-11-56-24.png (471KB, 1280x720px) Image search: [Google]

471KB, 1280x720px

>>52224723
Exactly, got to have some flaws. Otherwise there's no point.

>>52219924
>while the chaos primarchs have had their shit pushed in multiple times in the last 10k years
Have they? Until the recent Thousand Sons story they mostly kept to themselves.

File: 25436543536.png (947KB, 1345x663px) Image search: [Google]

947KB, 1345x663px

>>52224723
Agreed, this best thing to do is get a close as possible to 100% without reaching it.

>>52224897
>those suggested tags
Well damn.

>>52224909
>Guilliman is more perfect than Emps
>laughingYvraine.jpg

File: Screenshot_2017-03-17-12-00-28.png (467KB, 1280x720px) Image search: [Google]

467KB, 1280x720px

>>52224909
Correct as always space father.

File: Untitled.png (549KB, 1305x648px) Image search: [Google]

549KB, 1305x648px

:'(

File: niga what.jpg (92KB, 800x999px) Image search: [Google]

92KB, 800x999px

>>52223817
>While they're the second-worst legion

File: 32589323650.png (855KB, 1287x665px) Image search: [Google]

855KB, 1287x665px

Interesting.

>>52224885
Basically this. It was a combination of penance, punishment, and removing the weak from his legion. What remained were the hardest and most skilled core of veterans to form into chapters.

File: Rogal Dorn 3.jpg (51KB, 466x466px) Image search: [Google]

51KB, 466x466px

>>52223817
>talking shit about Dorn

>>52224983

>IW were left with the shittiest geneseeds

just as planned?

File: trash.png (637KB, 1352x662px) Image search: [Google]

637KB, 1352x662px

>>52224925
>Yvraine

That whore isn't good enough for best boy Bobby G.

>>52224943
Try the other ones.

>>52224897
>Christianity
>Jesus Christ
Papa Sang reaffirmed to be Spess Jesus.

Why the fuck BL had to make Primarchs literal idiots and cripples again? I mean come on, they're supposed to be best of mankind but theor decisions and actions are worse than my alcoholic neighbor.

File: bodt.png (440KB, 1346x526px) Image search: [Google]

440KB, 1346x526px

What the fuck. It's a fucking moon, on fire, crashing into a planet. How is that not awesome?

File: Yvry.jpg (385KB, 1478x574px) Image search: [Google]

385KB, 1478x574px

>>52225002
Nah, she is worth him.

File: Screenshot_2017-03-17-12-14-00.png (283KB, 1280x720px) Image search: [Google]

283KB, 1280x720px

Lol

Did someone nuke the novel folders? The links don';t work (one asks for encryption key)

>>52225022
To make them more human and because it was easier.
>>52225029
>coal
>no people
There you go.

File: mfw sanguinius is cooler than me.png (661KB, 1164x547px) Image search: [Google]

661KB, 1164x547px

>>52224897


>>52225022
Daddy issues

>>52225029
I guess a face is pretty important to the website coding.

>>52225062
JUST

Who the fuck in GW has bald and topknot fetish? Fucking magical realm insertion...

File: 1445579363666.gif (903KB, 300x200px) Image search: [Google]

903KB, 300x200px

>>52225113
Crippled primarch and his eldar wench are better than supposed "perfection".

>>52225143
John Blanche and Jes Goodwyn.

>>52224630
What's that gun he's holding? Just the regular Reaper Autocannon, or something else?

Thinking about starting my Mechanicum with some ViV models, since it'll be fun. 20 of each Secutarii and some heroes, plus Thallax.

File: Screenshot_2017-03-17-12-26-37.png (277KB, 1280x720px) Image search: [Google]

277KB, 1280x720px

>George Lucas

File: image.jpg (1MB, 2592x1936px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 2592x1936px

WIP very messy Thousand Son and Emperors Child(ren)

Plus the 3 I most recently completed.

I know it's weird doing mk 3 EC but I picture them up armouring to mk 3 when breaching and doing ship clearance etc.

File: worst bearers.png (603KB, 1903x669px) Image search: [Google]

603KB, 1903x669px

>>52224723
Out, out, out!

>>52225216
What the fug?
>>52225249
>Judgement Day
>word bearer tossing was made into a legion wide sport

File: UItraboring.png (655KB, 1196x550px) Image search: [Google]

655KB, 1196x550px

>>52225249

>>52220693
9 thallax seems like not enough scoring unless it's a mission that scores at the end and you can afford to be really evasive. also no upgrades on castellax seems really dumb, and if you're doing LC why are you even taking ursurax? the models are cool but arlatax would do the job better.

>>52225231
>sister of silence skirt on ts

scandalous. what's your thousand son recipe?

novels folder isn't working

>>52219228
I like how there's no possible way that topknot had that much hair seeing how she shaved her entire head save for that tiny spot

File: traitors.png (5MB, 1170x5065px) Image search: [Google]

5MB, 1170x5065px

it's Primarch time!

File: Pepe defends his fish from a skelly.jpg (148KB, 800x599px) Image search: [Google]

148KB, 800x599px

Thanks for the laughs guys. Take this pic I got from /pol/.
>>52225598
>Perturabo is at the bottom
The AI just hates him.

>>52225598
>6.7

PERT

I'm not really liking the developments in 40K so I'm thinking of jumping ship to Horus Heresy.

Can you play a Legion with no rules? Kind of like you can pick a Space Marine chapter with no chapter tactics, can you do this in HH?

>>52225592

She's half horse, that's the tail.

File: 1486384862453.jpg (354KB, 567x790px) Image search: [Google]

354KB, 567x790px

>>52225610
>mfw it's a tadpole
Darn.
>>52225619
>Can you play a Legion with no rules?
They almost all have their full rules.
>Kind of like you can pick a Space Marine chapter with no chapter tactics, can you do this in HH?
It's been a while since I checked but maybe.

>>52225619

You can play Blackshields. Read the Age of Darkness: Legions book for more info.

>>52225619

No. Your army is defined by what legion and rites it takes. It needs a legion identity.

>>52225619
If you don't use legion specific rules, you can either give everyone furious charge or stubborn.

>>52225669

Thanks, I'll have a look. How do the Blackshields play exactly?

File: loyalist.png (5MB, 1176x5101px) Image search: [Google]

5MB, 1176x5101px

>>52225598

>>52225619
I mean, there's ways to do that, but why would you want to? There's Legions and other stuff like Blackshields that make any possible tactic you would like better for no real downside. What do you want your army to do?

>>52225702
Oh no! My bird boy.

Should I try out any battle automata in my head of the gorgon? They look fun but don't benefit from some of my advantages like the -1 str to shooting or the blessed autosimulacrums

>>52225674
>>52225690

One shall stand... one shall fall.

>>52225710

I want to play Blood Angels but I want to play them like they were in the 2nd edition when they were less close combat orientated.

>>52225619
Normies get in, you're ok!

If you don't want to make any of the existing legions, do Blackshields.

>>52225571
> retributor gold basecoat, liberator gold drybrush, Tamiya clear red spray paint, red wash into grooves ( this can be done before the spraying if you like)
> the gold is just redoing the liberator gold over the red.

>>52225740
That's perfectly doable with the current BA rules AFAIK, they have the ability to take a bunch of assault cannons on stuff and be shooty too. Also you'll want to use Sangy when he turns up, right? Don't deny yourself your Primarch and toys for no real reason.

>>52225740
Good thing you can go full dakka with BA then. Assault cannons out the ass.

>>52225690
That's not true, you could use Furious Charge or Stubborn for a legion that didn't have rules, but now all 18 do, so you can't.

>>52225807
there are still 2 legions without rules :^)

>>52225598
>Alpharious/Omegon
>Spooky, Mystery, Abstract
Noice, 10/10

Is there ever a reason to use terminators not as full on melee? Their guns seem somewhat pointless except to make a couple more save before an assault.

>>52225742

Well I have always had an interest in HH. Not to be a hipster but I can remember buying Galaxy in Flames on the day of release.

I just couldn't bear another Space Marine army, now though it looks like my Imperial Fists might be retiring.

>>52225791
>>52225800

Yeah but... but... muh tactical squads?

>>52225863
CSM the only way is the combi-way
Normal marines the only way is TH/SS
ass cannons and CML are nice, espcially for ddark angles, but outside of that its melee all the way

File: 1488511573867.png (1MB, 639x946px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 639x946px

>>52224479

I'm actually thinking about do some Crimson Sons myself, though being a bad Saturday morning cartoon villain is fun, too.

>>52225874
>I just couldn't bear another Space Marine army

So do Army, Daemons or Mechanicum.

>>52225863
Combi weapons are useful

>>52225883
>CSM
>Normal marines
>TH/SS
>ass cannons
>CML

I think you're in the wrong general.

>>52225863
>What aretyrant seige guard

>>52225925
I post in both, got my tabs mixed up there

also
>CML and ass cannons
>not in HH
talk to the iron warriors and then blood angles and the alpha legion

File: IMG_20170317_125019.jpg (70KB, 610x559px) Image search: [Google]

70KB, 610x559px

All this talk about my shitty legion hasn't slowed me down. They're shitty, and I know they're shitty. However, who can't love these helmets?

>>52225931
You mean Fulmentarus prototypes, right?

>>52224479
There's a short story, The Value of Fear, about a loyalist NL with some Raven Guard.

>>52225968
Prefer the NL raptor helmets myself, less goofy, unless you like goofy of course.

>>52226102

You can't take NL too seriously, so goofy works. The Raptor heads are sweet, though. Wish I didn't have to pay at least $25 per set of raptors even from recasters because you can't just buy the heads. Still, I'm only putting them on my Sgts, so they're supposed to be more ornate because Artificer Armor.

>>52225948
>CML and assault cannon
>Normal marines

Don't try to save face, anon.

>>52219482
Chaplains were like high school guidance councillors or hall monitors. They existed to inspire the lads, but also to make sure they weren't up to any funny bidness

>>52226156
I bought three raptor heads on ebay, just for some characters. Paid about $2 for each head, but fuck it I needed them.

So, Secutarii can't be taken as compulsory troops (no I'm not taking a Titan, I like having opponents), but can Axiarchs be taken as compulsory HQ choices? I didn't see anything that said they couldn't, so I'd be building an Onslaught list with one as the HQ. Can I do that?

>>52222114
What? How does that even apply to Szaserhk or Cegorach?

Also why is existence as a human in anyway objectively more informative than existence in an indefinite potentially infinite shifting reality of infinite possibilities.

The only 'yeah, nah' here is your bizare comment which makes assumptions about the level of phenomenal experience a human live provides.

>>52226163
eh? i already said i posted in the wrong thread you fucking retard

File: IMG_20170317_145632.jpg (86KB, 699x505px) Image search: [Google]

86KB, 699x505px

>>52226293

I paid $7 for an old school upgrade kit, which is 10 heads, 10 shoulders, and a sword arm.

Embrace the silliness!

>Brother! How's my aim?

>>52226449
Szastak just spent 65 million years in the void between the galaxies, not exactly a realm of infinite knowledge.

>>52226537
In-universe what's the wings made of?
Are they extensions of the helmet, or made of some fairly squishy rubber or what?

>>52226537
Seems like a good deal to me. The heads are full of character, I'll have to admit that!

>>52226554
Well we know he met Sanguinius, so who knows what else he did? Nowhere is it said 'and then he did nothing for 65 million years' so still not seeing any point.

Besides he had all the time BEFORE he left as well. He has had so much time that if he isn't potentially the smartest character in existence it'd just be strange.

>>52226537
'WHAT DO YOU MEAN I AM YELLING?"

>>52225216
>Plastic
>Robot
It's like they can see the future.

>>52226623
>Well we know he met Sanguinius
Wait, what?

>>52226470
And then you tried to save face claiming I was saying assault cannons and CML didn't exist in HH.

>>52226576
Chaos.

File: lol.jpg (180KB, 517x768px) Image search: [Google]

180KB, 517x768px

>>52226691
>Realize i made a mistake
>make a little rye joke
>"HERF DURFF ANON DONT TRY TO SAVE FACE"

Autism at its finest

>>52225968
So smug

>>52226733
>[maximum damage control] at its finest

>>52220342
I'd argue the inaction of tzeentch could be his want to simply observe and consume the knowledge of his enemies rather than destroy them. Maybe seduce their intellectuals to his side but id say that it should be noted he also represents "hope"

File: IMG_20170317_150830.jpg (116KB, 891x613px) Image search: [Google]

116KB, 891x613px

>>52226576

I would imagine the same thing as the helmet. Likewise, I'd imagine they're more ceremonial, whereas the Night Raptor helmet is much more practical. Well, much more practical when considering space Marines.

>>52226578
Couldn't pass it up. I got them as my test order from LF. Very pleased. Same with my glaives.

>>52226740
Nuthin personel

>>52226664
>Sir! Allow me to exchange weapons with you. You look uncomfortable.
>NO! I am the commanding officer. I get to use the missile launcher!

File: 1404298654391.gif (2MB, 400x201px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 400x201px

>>52226752
kek okay anon, (you) have fun

>>52226760
They need to be modeled next to each other on the same base, with missiles and shells flying, and high-fiving each other while doing it.

>>52226760
Ha i almost forgot how absolutely retarded night lords look

File: IMG_20170317_152118.jpg (122KB, 857x587px) Image search: [Google]

122KB, 857x587px

>>52226805
>Sir I-
>Dont leave your SO hanging, brother...

>>52226901
It is something when you can't look where you're pointing your missile launcher because the bat wings on your helmet get in the way.

Anyone ever modelled two dudes from the same unit on connected bases?

I was modelling Genestealer Aberrants out of savage orks, and after setting up a unit of 8 had the two guys with one huge spear left over. I put the two guys on seperate bases, but gave them the spear and I'm trying to start green stuff and bit modding it into a drill thing.

>>52226925
And so began the adventures of Batler and Nightorf.

File: Angelus contents.png (1019KB, 1277x863px) Image search: [Google]

1019KB, 1277x863px

This may be old news, but has anyone seen the Angelus press conference video?

>>52226997
Used to do it in Warhammer Fantasy, but the circle bases don't really make that practical.

>>52226954
Even batman is chuckling at how dumb their bat theme is

Why did Blood Angel Chaplains wear black?

>>52227050
Please let the next HH box be set around the DA and come with MkII, I need a bunch of cheap MkII helmets.

>>52227091
I cast MKII sets if you want some.

>>52227075
Cause they have style.

>>52227050

Yeah, it doesn't seem all that practical, but those are the parts I had left over.

Also whoops, this is the heresy thread.

Kinda annoyed they went on about working on angelus honestly when I play both admech and tau so you know full well what I've been waiting for over a year.

>>52227050

>Daemon units

Oh fuck.

>>52227050
It's quite a good move of them to put out darkmech before any Mars book. Hopefully means any whoopsies with the rules (poor wording, or things just being completely under/overpowered) can be straightened out later in the "main" mechanicum book.

File: taufags.jpg (15KB, 267x188px) Image search: [Google]

15KB, 267x188px

>>52227122
But they're doing Dark Mechanicus.

What, were you expecting them to go on about Tau at the Horus Heresy Weekender?

>>52227050
Baal was sieged?

>>52227050
DG diabolists for daemon allies, please.

>>52227050

>Night Lords

Seems rather ambiguous. Are we getting new units like Atramentar, or are we actually getting new astartes rules?

>>52227091

Plastic assmarines when?

>>52227142

Nah, just a bit annoyed that they're already working on the next Heresy novel rather than finalising Cyraxus.

Unrelated: Has anyone here actually bought a dreadnought drop pod from FW, as opposed to just leaving the gun out of a normal pod or getting a recast?