/btg/ Battletech General!

First question for 500 C-bills:

>This clan has the best waifus.

What is a good combat role for Quad mechs? Where to they shine vs bipeds?

>>51904441
If you're using it for indirect, who cares? LOS should be blocked anyways.

>>51904605
What's hilarious to me is just how close the CC capital is to the Marik border. They could basically pop a fleet over and glass the place any time they feel like it.

Of course, what the FWL should really do in this scenario is just absolutely faceroll the LC. The Lyrans were busy losing big time to the Dracs, and the FWLM has habitually rekt the Lyrans anyways. If you are allied with the Dracs you can at the very least pass intel back and forth, like "Hey they just launched a big attack and we killed a bunch of them and we're about to throw a counter-punch, go for the other hole."

>>51904807
>Wasn't that because Janos knew the Free Worlds might have had something to do with Katrina, one of the most politically astute and dangerous Archons ever to grace the fast of the Sphere, gaining the Lyran throne?

What are you actually trying to say?

>>51904842
Yeah in terms of the history of the IS, the Lyrans should be seen as a much bigger threat to the FWL than the CC

>>51905242
Turrets, turrets everywhere. Directional Torso Mount if you don't have the tonnage.

>>51905074
False
Inner Sphere fags have waifus
Clanners have real women

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>>51905074
>First question for 500 C-bills:

>This clan has the best waifus.

Wait, wait, wait here. We have a long time with genetic engineering. Why didn't they engineer every clan member with extra awesome genitals? I mean you can have some small chicks for the loli pervert fetishists and other DFC types, but if you had the chance to make the next generation a series of Angie Veronas or Chad Thundercocks, wouldn't you?

Also Clan Wolf. Natasha comes from decent stock.

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>>51905074

clan snord

>>51905252
>Yeah in terms of the history of the IS, the Lyrans should be seen as a much bigger threat to the FWL than the CC
They are in canon, though successive writers may forget this. In the FWL there's an expression that goes "Never trust a Capellan, but shoot a Lyran on sight."

>>51905326

Still cant get over how close he got to winning just because he was the first to do the obvious thing and get an ally. And then just the pure raw strength. No samurai honor, no lofty concepts, no super tech, no wunderwaffe. Just a shit ton of mechs and going around pummeling enemies one by one.

I really wonder why other other successor states never allied before. Even the lowliest street thug knows the value of allies.

What if in some AU other combinations happen and get in a similar gamewinning position? What combinations are even possible? Capellan Combine? Draconis League? Federated Worlds? Lyran Confederation? Free Worlds Hegemony?

>>51905622
>What combinations are even possible?

Literally any of them? It's all in how you set it up. Although ever since Muninn posted his take on it ages ago I've been conviced that the FS and FWL should have been the original team-up. I also enjoy the Dracs and Taurian combo and their tsundere hijinks

>try to play other factions
>/btg/ starts going on about the purple bird
>go back to playing Marik

Why does it keep sucking me back in? FM:FWL seems like the gift that keeps on giving.

I just discovered the fan TRO 3063 too. /btg/'a opinion of it?

>>51905622
FedLeague would be the other big one, though DracLeague is a not-too-close second
Hell, even FWL+periphery woud be enough to beat up the CapCon without having to pull anything from the lyran front

>>51905680
Isis is best waifu

>tfw no Isis/Omi

>>51905680
Is that the LYRANS STRONK one or the HA HA TIME FOR JUMPTANKS one? Or were those the same thing?

>>51905724
>tfw katherine never tried to one-up victor's thing with omi by seducing isis

>>51905674

>Literally any of them? It's all in how you set it up

The more I think about it, the more I want an IS version of Diplomacy to play. Nothing but cold, hard realpolitik and betrayals.

>>51905777
I started working on one a while ago, but it's on one of about a thousand back burners.

>>51905259
but what if you're an introtech grognard?

>>51905736
I actually thought it was kinda "Drac tanks stronk" because they got a bunch. Everyone else got mostly support vehicles and stuff.

Is the Cheetah an interceptor or just a reconnaissance bird?

If the latter, what interceptors does a Marik force have access to?

>>51905242

If you're the Quad guy from the last thread, putting one behind partial cover only blocks the legs. The torsos can still be seen, and shot at/used to shoot.

>>51905622

>no super tech

Among their many, many best-at hats the Suns' schtick was super tech, including FTL communications and building the first new WarShips.

>>51906024

>Is the Cheetah an interceptor or just a reconnaissance bird?

Both.

>If the latter, what interceptors does a Marik force have access to?

MUL. But since so many ASFs are 6/9, anything that moves at least that fast should qualify, and that includes the Stingray.

>>51906170
>If you're the Quad guy from the last thread, putting one behind partial cover only blocks the legs. The torsos can still be seen, and shot at/used to shoot.
But they super easily hull down for full cover from a L1 hill, which may have been his point all along. Also I seem to remember that they can do stuff while hull down, but that might be the rum talking.

>>51906170
What's a MUL?

>>51906192

Master Unit List.

>>51906170
Not quadguy, was just trying to figure out if they had enough benefits to outweigh the areas they are lacking in. I know they can sidestep and they have reduction to PSRs. Just trying to figure out what roles they would make sense playing in.

>>51906245
Is it a book or is it on the main forum?

>>51906261

They do well in city fights thanks to the -2 on PSRs, and putting them in partial cover makes them a pain to deal with since all arm and leg shots will hit the cover instead of the 'Mech.

I think they're better as lighter, faster 'Mechs where the loss of crits doesn't hurt them as badly than as heavier ones where heat can become a real issue since there's not enough space to mount as many DHS as you could otherwise and you can't fit ES too easily either.

>>51906290

http://www.masterunitlist.info/Era/FactionEraDetails?FactionId=30&EraId=256

>>51906303
Wow, thank you!

>>51906319

It is weirdly restrictive, a lot of units I would consider generic, or have seen in novels and scenario packs are verboten for a number of factions because reasons. But it's a place to start.

>>51906630
So it's like secondary canon?

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It's been awhile.

Randall Bills is still FB friends with Toymaker. You'd think at the very least he'd drop that shit.

I have no idea what any effect has been behind the scenes.

>>51906725
No, it's official, but as always, it's more of a guideline than a flat out "you can't have this."

>>51906730
>I have no idea what any effect has been behind the scenes.
Let me sum it up for you: fucking nothing. Nothing's going to change, CGL doesn't give a shit what we or anyone else thinks and neither does Topps care what CGL does or doesn't do. Just learn to live with it.

>>51906725
Ehh, not really. It's more a meta-source. Some of the folks who've worked on it (MadCap, Roosterboy, AK) aren't dependable on fluff. So yes, you could treat it as a secondary source. Go with it unless you find something that contradicts it.

>>51906725
>>51906743

Be prepared for some serious side-eye if you dare to show up at a game with units outside what you "should" have though.

Honestly it's mostly stuff like the various House models that piss me off. Like sure, the Suns have more PHX-1Ds than anyone else and the FWL has more WVR-6Ms than anyone else and the BNC-3S is Steiner-only, fine. It's not like removing two MGs for extra HSes or using a Large Laser instead of an A/C should be state secrets, but according to the MUL they're flat exclusives. Which is fuckin' retarded, but hey. It's a CGL project, I don't know why I expected any different.

>>51906923
>Be prepared for some serious side-eye if you dare to show up at a game with units outside what you "should" have though.

I've heard that here but never encountered it in RL.

>>51906939

I have, multiple times.

Most recently it was for an Omni config- I was running a Firestarter F and my opponent flipped their lid over my showing up in a 3067-era game using a 'Mech the Dracs had, equipped with weapons the Dracs used, because at that time it was listed as FWL only. He actually packed up and refused to play.

The MUL has since been amended to make the FS9-OF an IS General 'Mech. Sarna still says otherwise though.

DESU it's mostly something I see effecting Drac players, pre Xin Sheng Cappies and FWL players who have selected something they could either reasonably have as salvage or which actually showed up on their side in a scenario pack or novel, and mostly against FS players. I've played in four different groups over the years but that's what I've seen ever since the first version of the MUL showed up in Combat Ops back during the day.

>>51907062
>He actually packed up and refused to play.

You're so full of shit it's coming out your mouth.

>>51907070

I wish. He's the reason I haven't played IRL in almost two years. That's the only local group going and he's a fixture. I'd rather only play the odd MegaMek game or ATB campaign than deal with players like that.

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>>51905024

So who the hell is Battle Pope? And does it have anything to do with a story about Harrassers with SRM Infernos taking out a union by driving up its ramp?

Does he also have something to do with a peasant company taking out another drop ship due to a golden BB?

>>51907062
Sorry you've had to encounter that kind of weapons-grade autism. But it doesn't sound like you really missed out.
I don't get how they can be like that in a game that's had mixed forces and battle salvage as part of it since day one, but I'm not a shrink or whoever it is that handles screeching autists.

>>51907121
And playing with the other players without him is not an option?

>>51907062
Call him a faggot and slap Atleast Itsnot on the table. Or go full retard and bring a company of Mackies and call him a faggot anyway. That shit wouldn't fly at my table, and most of the stores I've played at have the same rules.

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>>51905024
>Pencil drawn torso bomb edition

This is the closest thing I've got. I guess I never drew a proper Crud.

>>51907238
>and bring a company of Mackies
You are a man of excellent taste
The mackie is awesome and never should have gone extinct

>>51907215

He yelled at me for a good five minutes straight and for a while it looked like he was literally going to flip the table and come at me. If they'd told him to knock it off then maybe but the vibe I got was that everyone went along with his autism to avoid him sperging out at them rather than addressing the problem.

My life is full enough of fucksticks already and I game to relax in my limited free time. I like BT, but not enough to go back to a group like that.

>>51907280
I just don't believe that anyone cares that much about an omni config. MadCap doesn't love Xin Sheng or little girls that much, ffs.

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Have a mook tank /BTG/. Becomes really annoying when you get access to special munitions.

>>51907364
It's not about the omni, it's about the autism

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>>51907409
I like it. There's something charming about cheap ass tanks and vees and 'Mechs in general.

>>51907465
I don't believe that anyone capable of getting themselves to a game store is that autistic.

>>51907476

It was a group that played at another guy's house.

I've seen worse in game stores.

Shit, I've seen worse when people discussed sports teams. Doesn't mean I want to hang around with people like that.

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>>51906261
>Just trying to figure out what roles they would make sense playing in
Problem with Quads vs. bipes is, they need more maneuverability and planning (or careful use of terrain and blocking elements) to make up for their severe firing arc restrictions. They also have severely restricted critspace for a mild increase in armor. It's basically the same tactical considerations as you get with self-propelled guns and tanks.
Quads do best with jump jets (for better positioning) with something to compensate for the jump inaccuracy (see: the Tarantula), a few very large guns (Barghest, the HGR quads) or a solid sniping array (the Gauss/LRM Goliath comes to mind). Turreted quads are great fun, but you lose even more critspace so whatever you have in there needs to HURT when it hits. The Stalking Spider II is a good example of this strategy, with its iHLL and twin Streak-fours. It's a fast, nasty little brawler that hits like a truck.

Oh, and never underestimate the utility of a Quad's mule kicking ability. I've knocked down so damned many Bugs with a swift kick to the groin because the other player set up a backstab and forgot I had a quad..

The sidestepping ability is mostly useful in cities (where enemy movement is constrained, which means the quad's restricted firing arcs are less of a problem) or to save a few MP on those stupid zig-zags that litter hex maps. Hull-down is a TacOps rule and frankly most of the time it's more bother than anyone actually gives a shit about.

>>51906730
>>51906855
They should, he hurts sales all around and worst of all loses potential new customers that try these "great price minis" and get them and they are garbage.

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>>51907156
>So who the hell is Battle Pope? And does it have anything to do with a story about Harrassers with SRM Infernos taking out a union by driving up its ramp?

He's part of the Cincy group, and yes, in like the very first campaign we ran (circa ~2005), he somehow managed to run a hovertank up a hostile DropShip ramp and asked, "I'm demanding they surrender or I'm firing my Infernos at pretty much everything I can see inside the cargo bay. What happens?"

Do note that he actually was loaded with Infernos. IIRC he was playing a more or less suicidal former Comguard vehicle driver (insane b/c he got kicked out of C*) who'd taken ludicrous chances all through the campaign and come out of them alive.

Anyway, when he asked "what happens", there was ~30 minutes of looking through assorted rulebooks, with the answer of, "I have no goddamn idea." So Pope contacted Ben Rome and basically relayed what had happened and asked FanPro if they had any plans for creating rules to handle this situation.

And lo! A few years later, TacOps had rules for shooting at shit inside DropShips. This incident was, to my memory, the very first instance of weird shit happening in or to the Cincy group which caused rules additions, rewrites, and retcons to happen.

>Pope, if you're reading, forgive any detail errors. It's been like 12 years, man.

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>>51908097
Note that I still have shots of some of the Anchorage drop. Shit warmed my heart. Especially that poor insane RWR fucker in the Spider.

>>51908130

What the FUCK is that big box-looking thing in the middle of the table?

>>51908152
It's a Rattler.

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Rattler

>>51908130
>no artillery tokens
Have you people learned nothing from Normandy? Shell the fuck out of the beach and the surrounding mile or so.

>>51908259
No shit. My first thought was: show them the effects of grouping up. FASCAM and Swarm that shit. Make them pay for bunching up.

Shipfag, if you're here, this is a second vote for Hard Truck Apocalypse. Just make see to get the patch, either through Google or Steam's community pages.

>>51908245

>the WoB actually built Hitlers Landkreuzer Ratte, the absolute madmen

>>51908457

Terran Hegemony built them first, WoB just re-activated some and built a few more.

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>>51908152
>>51908245
It's a pretty amusing kitbash.

>>51908259
>>51908410
I'm not with Cincy, but as someone who's run a game about half that size I'd say it's probably just to keep the turn time limits something reasonable. If I ever do another one I'm going to make it just be ToT ortillery strikes that resolve at the end of designated turns.

>>51908097
shit like this is why I miss rome

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Le Inferno up the BUM(p)

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>>51909976
Oh, oh man. Dat comic.

>>51908097

>>Got semi-guided LRMS banned

Shit, I've heard about that from my own campaign group's 3025 grognard. According to him, the story goes that for operation Bulldog, these guys just brought like maximum longbows all loaded with SGLRMs and each turn would basically just choose a clan mech and drop like 1200 fucking missiles on it. It got to the point where the event coordinators decided that they couldn't do it any more because they had shot all the semi-guided LRMS in the Inner Sphere and they needed to wait for the factories to make more.

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>>51911061

It gets funnier and more outlandish every time I hear what we supposedly did.

We were playing WoB at GenCon 06-09. Generally speaking, every year we ended up with ~4-8 missile support units on a board with ~40 Mechs on it. Given that we're always playing the same faction, and the event runners were Bones and Chunga from 06-09, we usually ended up with the same Mechs each year, because that's what was already painted in WoB colors. So we're generally running a support force of 1-2 Longbows, a Shogun, a 1-2 of Legacy -02s, a Dragon Fire and a Devastator for direct-fire, and depending on the specific day and scenario, between 0 and 4 of the LFE-model LRM carriers.

Being WoB, we almost always had at least 2 TAG-capable units on the battlefield. What set us apart was that we went out of our way to pick one unit per turn that needed to go away, and then deliberately concentrated mass fire (~120-300 LRMs/turn) on it. We were willing to work as a group, while the people playing us were not. That was the difference. Throwing 1200 LRMs/turn would have been glorious, but it's unfortunately not true.

The part of that story that *is* true, however, is that the writers were more and more frustrated by the fact that the WoB kept winning games while being the Bad Guys (and thus were supposed to lose). The Demo Team *was* told that SG-LRMs were no longer a legal munition for the WoB to take, and that if anybody asked, the profligate use of them in previous games had "run the IS out of the ammo type". The writers also did things like "rewrite the scenario the day before explicitly to make WoB lose" (see pic for battlefield, we started with a medium company against an assault company, a company of "Davion" Purifier BA, and a lance each of dug-in Alacorns and Demolishers), which didn't work either. Eventually they just made the table leadership into Demo Agents, which in the long run didn't seem to work out for anybody involved.

>>51911235
>how to completely destroy your community in three simple steps

Yay, CGL.

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>>51911235
>(see pic for battlefield, we started with a medium company against an assault company, a company of "Davion" Purifier BA, and a lance each of dug-in Alacorns and Demolishers),

Before you ask, the pic is not showing the medium company. It's showing a reinforcement group the WoB retasked from another table, plus Fisk's personal command lance (the blue/white Lyrans) which was also committed to this table from reserves. Everything from the starting medium company was wiped out...except for a Beowulf which inexplicably survived, made it into the base, lost a leg, and provided C3i targeting data so we could shoot the base for many, many turns.

Naturally, because what happened was funny and stupid in equal measure...Battle Pope was driving the Beowulf.

>>51911235
Watching how you guys fucked up their Fortress Dieron campaign was delicious. Even in the Turning Point, the Blakists had to lose the final battle offscreen.

>>51911293
>Fisk's personal command lance

Aw shit, so this was Odessa?

>>51911309

Indeed.

>have to go teach german longsword. back in a bit

>>51911235
You guys did the WoB fights with the Coalition dropship downed by an infantrymen right? And the urban fight where you dropped a building on civvies so the Coalition couldn't win?

[desire to know more intensifies]

>>51911273

Actually, having the Cincy guys as demo agents was a good move. They know their stuff, they have a large collection, they know how to run and balance campaigns.

The dumb move was then losing them all over bad treatment between AK bullshit and the edgy stalker shitting everything up.

>>51911833
Yeah, if CGL were run by competent people that could hold on to and develop one of their greatest assets instead of driving them all away over asinine bullshit...

Can someone post Shimmy's Wolverine, Griffin, and Shadow Hawk? Plus maybe the Crusader is he's done it?

For Xotl, when you're around next:
In a post on the OF, you said that rules for creating TAG infantry are on the same page as the specialized infantry types, 341 of TacOps. I checked TacOps and the errata and there's no mention of TAG infantry at all. Was that a goof or is it somewhere I'm just blind to?

>>51911964
If no one else does I'll post the Shad and Wolverine when I get home.

>>51905024
I want to get into Battleteh, I have already played the Demo ruleswith paper cutouts but I want to paint some Mechs, what should buy? I want to play a Lyran Military Unit or some Lyran associated Mercs bbefore the clan invasion if that helps (don't like the newer designs visually)

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>>51912922
>don't like the newer designs visually
You can't be serious

>>51912994
I like boxy humanoids. My favorite Mech is the Commando

>>51912994
>Implying the Zeus isn't great

Plus he also might mean the Dark Age stuff which a lot took from the CMG toys and look pretty goofy.

Anyone got TtS: Iron Land yet?

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>>51908097

You're relatively close on the details but you've got a few muinged. I actually have some details of that fight in notes back from that era.

Game was literally 10 years ago based on my notes. I don't remember what you were driving back then, but I had the ex Comstar lunatic, the Harassers were modified 3025 Pegasus (Ripped out the ML for a third lancher and another round of ammo, and I was running a mixed load)

The main line of battle was going reasonably well, but the flankers were way up field and were getting good luck of of 36 SRMs a turn. Somethng happened (But I cannot remember what to save my life) and the two Pegasus determined the best course of action was to Duke Boys it up a dropship ramp - during the shitload of house rules on the fly that followed it was determined that Bo passed his PSR to get up the ramp at full speed, but Luke flubbed it and ripped the fans off, and pinned the other one to the wall - and there was a very confused Orion in the bay that two little hovertanks should have been easy prey.

And the hovertanks won. Those two tanks actually had more kills than the entire 'Mech core for the first dozen missions.

And along the way, the escapades made their way up to the TacOps design team and rules were made.

Simultaneous unplanned stupid hilarity (But effective) is kind of my thing apparently.

>>51912922
See if you can find the introbox online or at a LGS for a reasonable price.

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>>51911293
>Before you ask, the pic is not showing the medium company. It's showing a reinforcement group the WoB retasked from another table, plus Fisk's personal command lance (the blue/white Lyrans) which was also committed to this table from reserves. Everything from the starting medium company was wiped out...except for a Beowulf which inexplicably survived, made it into the base, lost a leg, and provided C3i targeting data so we could shoot the base for many, many turns.

You're close, but the actual story is even more...well, me.

You were busy driving the heavy elements and getting into that strange Longbow/Stalker punching match.

I didn't have any elements to spot so I was busy bring fast and annoying to let the heavy elements regroup, and was told that if a unit with a BAP could get to the base we could find out how much HP the buildings had left.

Pop masc, failed the roll, but only lost two MP.. go for it, run right next to the base and fall...next movement two lances of Sorensens Sabres shows up next to me, and outside of some potshots mostly goes by me (But now I'm down an arm, a hip, an acutator in another leg, and a gyro...I'm good here!) ...leaving me free to scan the base for the entire rest of the game...

>>51913034
True. Derp Age really has some hit or miss aesthetic.

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>>51913628
>>51913034
Funny you say this since DA is usually less silly than the originals, including Zeus. Zeus X is amazing

Picture very related. DA Panther is ugly as hell, but the original Panther is leagues worse than it

>>51913047
Nah. I'm not shelling out for a product whose premise is a ridiculous pun, and is just another weird worthless world.

>>51913766
>DA panther better than original

That's wrong. Same thing if you said it about the Centurion, Hatchetman, Firestarter, Black Hawk or Atlas

I could give you the DA Spider. It looks more like an LAM than a spider but it's pretty cool.

>Zeus X is amazing
Zeus X is literally a regular Zeus with some silly fins on it.

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>>51913766
And, of course, the 4th edition rendition is the best.

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>>51913819
>That's wrong. Same thing if you said it about the Centurion, Hatchetman, Firestarter, Black Hawk or Atlas

now THAT'S wrong. I can give you Atlas and Black Hawk, but every other mech you mentioned is FUCKING UGLY. Not even an opinion here, Loose was horrible and DA simply manages to be less ugly

And the Zeus X art is better than the original Zeus art

>>51913900
Ridiculous. The only way I could tell that the DA Centurion wasn't a Cyclops was by reading what the base said.

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>>51913900
>And the Zeus X art is better than the original Zeus art

The original Zeus X art is the cover of Maxtech. The Zues X mini is the regular Zues mini with a fin pack. And the original DA Zues X art is this.


>DA simply manages to be less ugly
I dare you to flip through Technology of Destruction and say that again with a straight face.

>>51913766
What is that thing supposed to be better than?

>>51913900
>not an opinion here
One of the more cancerous claims we find here on /btg/.

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>>51914527
He claims that thing with the sixpack of pipes sticking out of it's chest is better than this.

Does anyone have a download of Heavy Metal Aero? I have not been able to find it in the pastebin or online.

>>51915083
Check the more goodies pastebin link. There's an archive of it in there that should contain HMA.

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>>51911964
>Can someone post Shimmy's Wolverine, Griffin, and Shadow Hawk? Plus maybe the Crusader is he's done it?
In order, as requested.

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>>51915565

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>>51915579
Griffin mini prototype visible on top of the building in center.

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>>51915599
Griffin glamor shot behind Nasty Kay.

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>>51915612
Shad mini prototype

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>>51915622
Shad lineart-render.

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>>51911964
>>51915631
Kellies Shad glamor shot.

AFAIK there's no art for the Crud yet, but I've been out of the loop on the shimmyseen (and BT in general) for about three months dealing with RL shit and teaching myself to make furniture. If anyone has any news about new products and/or pics I'd deeply appreciate it.

>>51915675
No shimCrud or ShimOsts (aside from the scoot) yet, and for that matter no ShimBow or shimmarauder II, unfortunately, and he is unable to tell us anything about them

Because I'm an 80s whore I am not fond of many of the redo's Shimmy did a really good job I think the Shad and Wolverine are his best.

>>51915711
I really like his Marauder and Shad. I like the thud, aside from the arm gun being too small, but that'll be very easy to kitbash

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>>51912922
>I want to get into Battleteh, I have already played the Demo ruleswith paper cutouts but I want to paint some Mechs, what should buy? I want to play a Lyran Military Unit or some Lyran associated Mercs bbefore the clan invasion if that helps
First off, grab the Introductory box (you want the newest one, with the shot-up Atlas on the cover. Pic related). There are a couple other boxed sets floating around, but this one is by far the best in terms of quality of models. In addition, the Alpha Strike "Battle Lance", "Pursuit Lance" and "Support Lance" packs all contain signature Lyran 'Mechs as well as several common Mercenary machines (I'll break them down in the next post). Each box gives you four good-quality plastics for about the cost of buying and shipping a SINGLE metal mini from Iron Wind Metals.

Third, look up this page for a concise explanation of some stupid legal shit and decide if you like anime and/or BT fluff enough to spend a healthy chunk of change. http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Unseen
If you're impatient and willing to deal with shitty plastic, pic up a frame of the 3e boxed set models. Runs ~40-75 on the Bay of E, and has most of the most-popular 'Mechs of the era on it.

If you can wait, in theory there's a boxed set for Alpha Strike coming out in the next year or so with many of the same models in it.

Alternately, you can buy a box each of the Robotech RPG Tactics "Tomahawk/Defender Destroids" and "Spartan/Phalanx Destroids". Those are some of the most common and beloved machines in BT, and unlike the rest of the RRPGT stuff are actually pretty easy to put together and use.


Fluff and force construction stuff in next post.

>>51915850
<cont>
So, what do you get for Lyrans and mercs in the boxes I just mentioned? Well, you're going to have some stuff left over - especially from the Intro Box, which has 26 models in it - but the extras can be traded, sold off to your buddies, or used as salvage/opfor.
Intro Box (Super-Lyran)
BattleMaster, Banshee, Zeus, Commando

(Universal/Mercenary)
Atlas, Hunchback, Trebuchet, Whitworth,

(Rare but everyone has a few)
Spider, Assassin, Clint, Grasshopper, Catapult, Cyclops

(Presents from Allies)
Enforcer, Dervish, Jaegermech


Battle Lance:
Hatchetman, Zeus, Banshee (super-Lyran), Orion (common/merc)

Pursuit Lance:
Wolfhound (super-Lyran), Centurion (ally/mercenary), Jenner (enemy, uncommon), Clint (rare but universal)

Support Lance
Firestarter (Super-Lyran), Charger (common but shit), Awesome (Uncommon universal), Vindicator (enemy unit that turns up in Merc hands sometimes)

Tomahawk Destroid Box:
2 each "Rifleman" (allies, support design) and "Warhammer" (Common/universal badass)

Spartan Destroid box:
2 each Archer (universal and dirt-common) and Longbow (Uncommon but allied-made).

Don't know if someone screencapped it but can anyone repost that excerpt of the Alshain Avengers attacking Alshain and running into galaxies of Bears and a Nightlord?

That whole thing was hilarious.
>"haha we'll fuck these clanners up!"
>"why didn't they issue a batchall? Arghh!"

Those Dracs were seriously fucked.

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Slow day on /btg/, I guess.

Have you bowed down to your Capellan Overlords yet?

>>51917024

In the moment they retcon everything from the moment Candace rekt Romano.

I want sneaky electronic warfare light companies, not wank.

>>51917110
Why not both?

>>51917241

Cause I want to be a sneaky, cunning little yerrow devir outsmarting and defeating a vastly superior invasion force through speed and stealth and gloriously recapture Sarna and Liao for the Capellan Confederacy, not land on planets the fedrats arent even bothering to defend. Also, Guerrero? What in the FUCK they were thinking, allying with the FWL? I'd rather attend three more weddings of Hanse.

Besides the Sirian Lancers, what are some units that originated with the Terran Hegemony specifically that survived to be the 3025-3067 period?

And are there any BT books, short stories or scenario packs that deal with the Sirian Lancers?

>>51917024
>Capellan Overlords

Ares makes shit Overlords. I'm buying one made at Galax instead.

>>51917627
Shipil makes best Overlords, Outbacker bloatpig peasant.

>>51917704
We don't want no woman Overlord!

RARE footage of a capellan light lance in action!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fW2YU3ce-_Y

>>51903941
Late reply but no, the Andurien worlds are historically Free Worlds despite Liao propaganda to the contrary.

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>>51917939
10/10

>>51917979
ACtually the entire FWL is traditionally ancestral Capellan clay.

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Eras that are bad
>Succession Wars
>Clan Invasion
>Civil War

Eras that focus on Steiner-Davions
>Succession Wars
>Clan Invasion
>Civil War

Coincidence? I think not

>>51918049
>implying dark age wasn't shit

>>51918049
You're right, the Dark Age is better, just because there's more Steiner-Davion factions.
>Marik-Steiner-Davions fighting against Clan Steiner-Davion
>Both the Steiner-Davion Commonwealth and the Steiner-Davion Suns are striving to stay alive
>Finally the Kurita-Steiner-Davions are on Terra, ready to sally forth with the rest of the RotS to reclaim their nation

>>51917979
Andurien is all made of stuff the FWL conquered in the Succession Wars. A good chunk of Oriente too. The FWL ate into the Capellans more than any other state until the 4th Succession War.

That being said, Anduriens really didn't give a shit about where they came from. They liked being FWL and they liked being Anduriens even more than that. They have nothing in common with the Xen Shengers.

Here's hoping CGL doesn't forget that when they have to finally write how the whole Humphreys/Centrella/Liao thing shakes out in 3150.

>>51918049
>Succession Wars
>Clan Invasion

>Bad

>>51918159

Thats how it should have been from the start. A gorillion interrelated noble houses and cadet lines trying to get their heirs on the thrones no matter what. Sort of like Crusader Kings 2 but with mechs instead of levies.

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>>51918049

>>51918239
It was always that way. The difference is the habit of people super-hyphenating their names in more recent material.

They even pick at in the Dark Age. Like Harrison Davion just went classically by Davion even though he was a Steiner-Sandoval-Davion. But his son wanted to leverage all the Fedsun ruling lines in his blood so he went by Hasek-Sandoval-Davion (his mother was a Hasek and technically a Hasek-Davion).

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7cufG2Dlxvk

>when you realize the dracs would do the same retarded dance in celebration after defeating your clan

THE SPHEROIDS CAN'T GET AWAY WITH THIS, SIBMATES

>>51918331

Yeah but with MORE backstabbing and inter-house rivalry. Like a successor lord claiming the throne of not just the star leage but another successor state based on blood relations. You could even write up a snafu like the one with the nigger dragon society and Omi Kurita, having a Davion in the line of the draconis line of succession

>>51918339
>clanners

>>51918386
Well, most of that was contained in the smaller houses who ruled the various Marches/MilitaryDistricts/Commonalities/Whathaveyou. You get it, just not across Successor State lines.

>>51918339
go back to >>>Chatterweb tubebaby

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>>51917303
>What in the FUCK they were thinking, allying with the FWL? I'd rather attend three more weddings of Hanse.

>>51918386
>nigger dragon society

DINDU NUFFIN! WE WUZ CLANS N SHEEYIT

>>51918202
Andurien was FWL loooong before the Succession Wars. The first war was reclaiming Andurien from the Cappies.

>>51918339
>>51918536

Now I think about it, why dont IS commanders constantly taunt and talk shit to clans? They would be hillariously overreacting like the battle autists they are, maybe even turn on eachother.

Just imagine, opening up a commlink and start a fake batchall in the name of the Amaris Empire or Clan Wolverine, how pissed they would get?

>>51918709
If you have the breathing room to throw taunts, you have the breathing room to press the advantage.

If you don't, you're poking the bear that's going to rip you apart.

>>51918783

>If you have the breathing room to throw taunts

Its not like, you have up to a week to talk shit between entering a system and landing.

>If you don't, you're poking the bear that's going to rip you apart.


Thats the entire point of taunting, make them charge in like retards and get punished for it.

>>51918709
Because when clanners go full autismal rage, they stop taking prisoners and start warcriming it up bad.

Just look at how even somebody normally chill like that one Spirit Cat Star Commander went all Death Wish on that RotS local militia when he thought they broke a promise when he won a trial against their Knight.

>>51918907
Pretty much this. If you taunt clanners you get fun and inventive new warcrimes.
Although we should definitely see it happen more often, because when has sense ever stopped things from being fun in Battletech?

>>51918907

And thats good, everyone unites aganist someone who commuts warcrimes, just the how much the weed jags came to regret turtle bay.

Or you can even falseflag. I could totally see some Capellans landing light companies in FedCom colors and doing the exact same thing in Jade Falcon space.

>Despite their preeminent position the warrior caste is not the largest of the five castes: as of 3062 there were around 115,000 Clan warriors, or just .01% of the Clans' total population. Members of the warrior caste also had the shortest lifespan, with an average life expectancy of 45.2 years.[4]

Goading them into stupid shit and warcriming eachother could deplete the entire clan warrior caste within years.

>>51918959
>everyone unites aganist someone who commuts warcrimes

Then how the fuck are the subhuman cesspits known as the Capellan Confederacy and Draconis Combine still in existence?

>>51919157
That would just cause them to lower their standards. Graduation rate of sibkos is only like 4%. That's a lot of spares to be able to pull from.

>>51919226

Well the dracs blew their chance to finish off the suns with kentares.

>>51919226

Writer fiat. They have more of it than anyone else.

>>51918907
Didn't a Nova Cat do the same thing to some Stewart militia during the Jihad? The militia commander offered honorable combat with a batchall and the Nova Cat sperged out and declared a trial of annihilation?

>>51919319

>dracs
>writer fiat

Now the Cappies I'll give you.

>>51919242

You just don't get it how infinitesmally tiny that number is. Raising sibkos takes time, even with 100% graduation rates they would need decades to build up their numbers. 100.000 warriors is laughable. You can't defend or garrison anything with such a low number. european minor countries have reserve armies about 30-50.000. North Korea, a little shithole that rules over one half of a tiny peninsula can field 4 million. The soviets fielded some 35 million soldiers in WW2, and they were not even in control of a single continent of a single planet.

There is like 1 billion clanners together from all the clans including civilians. Tharkad alone has seven billion.

In a proper slugging out to the death war the clans would simply evaporate. they were lucky the spheroids didn't want to just Annihilate them all.

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>>51919322
The Spirit Cat thing was written first even though it's Dark Age. What happened was the Knight lost the combat trial, and then some mercs falsflagged an attack that broke the agreement she made if she lost.

This was after the clanner was like "We rarely trust Inner Sphere opponents to keep their word, and so would not engage in trials with them, but I will make an exception for the reputation of a Knight of the Sphere."

Whereas the Stewart one was Bear-tier "BLAKISTS REEEEEEEEEEEEE!"

And by SaKhan Santin used-to-be-everyone's-favorite-Nova-Cat West, no less.

>>51919393

Numbers of infantry don't matter. Only Mechs do. If you can't process that, then you're playing the wrong game.

>>51919226

Same reason the Suns, Lyrans and Free Worlds still exist.

>>51919422

Even if you want fasanomics only, guess which faction will have more mechs, the one with the one billion total population or the one with hundreds of planets with billions of humans on each?

>>51919393

Dude, you don't want to go down this path. According to the numbers of conventional militia regiments that get tossed around all the time in SBs, literally none of the standing militaries should ever have been able to make any progress without resorting to heavy use of WMDs.

The Clans are nothing more than a symptom of the problems created along with the game itself. The whole idea of the setting is that it's one where 4 'Mechs can conquer an entire planet by themselves.

>>51919393
Taking a planet is just taking the drop port and the capital city 90% of the time. Plus a factory if they got it, which is usually in the capital city anyway. Yes clanners are stupid small, and them running any inner sphere worlds realistically has always been dumb. What has largely helped them hold control previously was Comstar help in the most turbulent transition and later the threat of their warships.

But large sections of their castes are failed warriors. What I'm saying is there is a large pool to draw from. It's the clan equivalent of the Dispossessed. In 3025, there were 5 times as many people trained as mechwarriors as machines for them to actually pilot. Technician Ted from Clan Furry Totem has infantry, mech, and tank training. Easy place to fill your ranks. Well, as long as you don't get the Blood Spirit treatment from the rest of the clans for doing so.

>>51919422

>Numbers of infantry don't matter. Only Mechs do.

The Horses and Suns might disagree with you there.

>>51919485

>arming lower castes

Thats so unclanlike the Blood Spirits got Annihilated for it when the otheres discovered it. Might as well declare a new Amaris Empire while they are at it or declare the Wolverines ilClan

>>51919465

The IS <did> have more Mechs.

But population has zero relation to Mech production. The only thing that has a relation to Mech production is Mech production, so whining that the IS should have had billions of Mechs because they had billions of people is the facile argument of a child.

The IS had more Mechs. It didn't matter as much as you think it did, because the quality of the machines and pilots from the Clans produced more combat power than the greater numbers the IS had. This held true up until Comstar managing to get the Clans to fuck themselves over while ALSO outnumbering the living shit out of them, and it's not like Comstar came out of Tukayyid in good shape either.

You can whine and bitch about how it should have been all you want. The facts state that the Clans qualitative advantage outweight the IS numbers advantage for the vast majority of the invasion. Fucking grow up and deal with it.

>>51919525
Depends on how you sell it. Failed warriors are not born lower caste. They're trueborn. If things got bad enough, I'm sure they would establish a sort of reserve system based around it.

Didn't someone do the math here and figure that the Soviet army in Germany in the 80s could have taken on the entire Clan invasion forces in a conventional fight?

>>51919542

>I'm sure they would establish a sort of reserve system based around it.

Who's not getting battletech now?

>>51919533
The amount of people has never correlated directly to technology in the real world anyway.

>>51919533
>the facile argument of a child.

Says the man arguing in favor of magic economics for an 80's beer and pretzel wargame universe based on giant robots...

>>51919550
Considering the Blood Spirits did it when things got bad enough for them, it's pretty reasonable to say if all the clans suddenly found themselves in the same situation, more than a few might try something similar.

>>51919533

>The IS <did> have more Mechs.

That evidently didn't mean much.

Assuming things were anything like the events portrayed in the cartoon (and that's a big assumption to make), one Clan machine destroying entire lances of their Inner Sphere opponents wouldn't have been uncommon.

>>51919533

>But population has zero relation to Mech production

Lol what? The what has relation with it? Hundreds of planets, trillions of population, thousands of factories. Numbers matter.

>because the quality of the machines and pilots from the Clans produced more combat power than the greater numbers the IS had

And lost that advantage in a whopping seven years while the clans have been training and building up the invasion for centuries.


>whining
>facile argument of a child.
>Fucking grow up and deal with it.

Someone sure projects a lot.

>>51918907
Precisely this. That's why I said "you're poking the bear" -- if you invoke the name of a truly hated enemy, they're going to try and kill you down to the last man. And they'll die trying. You /really/ want to fight an enemy that's going to those lengths?

>>51919546

Is that taking the fact that 80s tank weapons are, at best, light rifles, into account? And that 80s infantry wouldn't be able to damage mechs at all except via golden BBs? And that people who aren't used to fighting mechs all the time canonically run screaming or wet themselves when they see a mech stomping towards them?

Or is that just some idiot saying, 'the tabletop game rules are perfectly representative of the entire reality of the Battletech universe even when they specifically say that they aren't?'

>and then other idiots believe it and repost it to Mongolian cat-sculpting forums because it confirms their own biases

>>51919581

The Blood Spirits got Annihilated for it. Literally bombarded from orbit and killed down to the last civilian because of it. Thats how unclanlike it was.

>>51919595

No shit? They will die trying, they cant back off, they will be forced to suicide attack into you or become dezgra.

>>51919605
Pretty sure medium rifles (modern tank guns) have 0 damage to BAR10 armor.

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>>51919566
>Says the man arguing in favor of magic economics for an 80's beer and pretzel wargame universe based on giant robots...

If you can accept the existence of giant robots at all, you can accept magic economics. NEA posted this last thread, and it's totally apropriate.

Buy some rope and figure out how to suspend your fucking disbelief.

>>51919588

Even if that was the case(clantech is not that huge of a jump) it would be just Tigers vs T-34s again. Sure, the tiger is so superior it can take on 1v4 and win, but if they can outbuild it 1v10 they will win.

>>51919616
The Blood Spirits got Annihilated because they didn't put their heads down and get absorbed quietly like they were expected to. If everybody was in the crippled position the Blood Spirits were, then there wouldn't be any Annihilation like that since nobody would have the forces for it.

>>51919626

IIRC someone posted the RHE equivalence of mech armor at some point and it turned out they are absolute paperweights compared to modern MBTs,

>>51919631
>WAA WAA WAA I CAN'T HANDLE THINKING THINGS THROUGH

OK kiddo

>>51919641

But can they actually build them quick enough to stave off defeat against a competent opponent?

I've often seen it said that it was German incompetence that lost them the war in the latter half of the conflict.

>>51919641

It's a hell of a lot closer to Tigers vs Stuarts.

And what's more important, the IS COULDN'T outbuild the Clans 10-1. It doesn't matter why. They couldn't. That's factual.

Clusters killing regiments is also factual. It doesn't matter if the tabletop rules don't allow for it. It happened. Clanners and Clantech ARe that good. If you're arguing that the tabletop rules don't allow for it therefore it couldn't happen, then the problem is with you.

>>51919658

>everybody is crippled? they must be ALL weak except us!

This is how a proper clanner would think like.

>>51919670

Enjoy masturbating to your AU. I'll be over here actually playing the real game.

>>51919664
That's somebody comparing armor weights and thickness, not armor quality. A Battletech small laser can explode an Abrams in one shot with all the steel piled on it. That same small laser can hit a man in a powered suit of BAR10 armor thinner than an inch and the trooper just keeps troopin.

Battletech armor has always been one of the key magical points of the setting.

>>51919684

>Clusters killing regiments is also factual.

Not to dispute the point, but was that a quick destruction or was it a prolonged affair?

And why is a Cluster defeating a Regiment an oddity? A Cluster, from what I've been told, is the rough equivalent of an Inner Sphere regiment.

I can see a Cluster blowing through several Regiments given the right circumstances.

>>51919542
Some clans did.

>>51919684

>And what's more important, the IS COULDN'T outbuild the Clans 10-1

Youre right, its more in the ballpark of 100.000-1 give or take a few zeroes. The clans literally never fought together and never pooled their resources and they have the population of a single continent of a single planet of a single successor state.

>Clusters killing regiments is also factual.

You mean in 3050 when they encountered provisional garrisons and the cheapest mercs on backline duty?

Then they got shat on in every conflict up to the Great Refusal while also losing their technological edge.

>>51919605
Probably artillery.

>>51919724

RHE is the measure of armor quality.

>>51919631
Part of the job of the creator of a fictional story or universe is to create, maintain, and expand your suspension of disbelief.

For example, I recently stopped reading a book in which a 13 year old girl was outperforming Marines and SEALs in combat, and outdrinking them too. The book did a decent job setting up the zombie apocalypse and projecting out the aftermath and I could buy the world, but the main character kept breaking the illusion every couple of pages.

Battletech, for a lot of people, has a very thin thread to suspend things on. I'm willing to buy into giant robots. I ignore or handwave a lot of the rest of the fluff because things like the IS stagnating technically for hundreds of years, a society of refugees on dirt poor worlds that are busy killing each other within a couple of years of arriving can somehow have better tech and take on trillions of people with a bigger resource base, minuscule military sizes, etc.

>>51919762
Then whoever posted that was wrong. Modern tanks are BAR5 equivalent at best.

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>>51919422
>>51919533
>>51919631
>>51919699
>I am emotionally invested in attacking others for not buying into every bit of poorly written fluff for an 80's mecha homage wargame

>>51919727
>Not to dispute the point, but was that a quick destruction

Quick destruction, generally speaking. Read the various clan phonebooks. Most planets get secured in 2 weeks to a month.

And believe me, people go full autistic about it. It's even worse when you have Clusters taking down RCTs, which again, also happened outright.

Either you can suspend your disbelief, or you probably shouldn't be playing sci-fi. The production numbers compared to military performance will not, have not, and cannot ever make sense. Yet they happened. I simply cannot understand why people cannot accept this fact.

>>51919631
It looks like an Ogre.

>>51919808
Because some of us don't like the taste of shit

>>51919801
>autism

As compared to the person who is clearly unable to either use his imagination nor accept that some things will never, ever, make "sense?"

You'll want to stop throwing rocks, anon. That glass house doesn't look real stable.

>>51919747

>You mean in 3050 when they encountered provisional garrisons and the cheapest mercs on backline duty?

Didn't they also destroy and maul several RCTs and elite units as well like the 26th Lyran Guards and the 10th Lyran Guards?

>>51919773

Its just the execution. The "clan invasions" kept repeating through history.

>settled community gets attacked by nomadic warbands
>warband manages to conquer through superior in-group cohesion and martial skill
>settled community has an edge in population and manufacture so they hold out
>eventually the invaders cant maintain the losses and get crushed.

If they are lucky they get to be a shithole stuck between two great powers they once terrorized like the mongols. If they are unlucky they just disappear from history forever like the huns, hyksos, and ,many others.

>>51919836
Just quit now, autism-anon.

>>51919631

This should be what Mechs look like anyway. If the whole game was based around infantry, tanks, and maybe battle armor, it would be much better. Getting rid of the whole FTL thing would also help a lot. And the drone rules should be basic level and widespread, because why would you use a person when you can use a drone?

>>51919851

Yes, but that doesn't support certain viewpoints on how the game 'should have been', and so it is conveniently ignored.

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Gentleanons, please stop the fighting. Can we all just agree we're here for giant robots and the stereotypes of the factions?

>>51919894

No. Without hate I don't have anything.

>I also won't have anything until CGL stops sending checks for shitting up other communities.

>>51919808
Not him but I remember part of that stuff was supposed to be to reflect how fast omni stuff could be repaired and thrown back in the field. So you have a star take on a lance or two, get shot up pretty good. And then refits completely and for a different style of mission by the time any of the enemy survivors have maybe finished patching armor on one or two locations.

>>51919851
The phonebooks go full retard. The novels did it a bit better, but of course you still had people like Vic in the 10th Lyran get rolled up like a carpet.

>>51919852
Yeah, I'm not arguing against the fundamental premise of "Outsiders show up and cause trouble" but the execution. That's kinda my point; people can buy into a lot of things if the execution is done well.

>>51919919

I don't actually believe that. I feel that no matter how good the execution, if people want to be offended by it, then they will not buy into it. And the BT community likes nothing as much as being mad.

>>51919851
>lyrans
>elite

>>51919937
Some people might not, but then, I don't really get mid-20's edgelords suddenly buying into My Little Pony and stuff.

Also, if someone refuses to even look at something, then it's not really the fiction's fault.

>>51919546
>>51919605
It was a dude saying that a battletech-ified soviet MRD with the most cheap and generic gear (scorpions and thunpers ect) could murderize a couple of clusters.
That was it

>>51919724
>A Battletech small laser can explode an Abrams in one shot
Not anymore it can't. Modern tech is now canonically BAR6 armor.

>>51919937

Only if its completely egregious like a hundred thousand warriors divided between seventeen factions. somehow still being being painted as some big bads after their invasion failed.

>>51920021
Source? Not saying you're wrong.

>>51920003
To be fair, if you used the Citytech rules which were current at the time of the Clan Invasion, some fast mechs with infernos could have cleaned out the whole pack of them.

>>51920132
The artillery would still most likely have gotten them first

>>51919626

The 120mm Rheinmetall used by modern MBTs is a Light Rifle. The authors deliberately made it weigh 3 tons to hammer that point home; modern tanks can't do shit to 'Mechs, and even a small laser will melt an M1A1 into a pile of bubbling slag.

>>51919727

>Not to dispute the point, but was that a quick destruction or was it a prolonged affair?

Quick. As in a matter of hours, tops.

>And why is a Cluster defeating a Regiment an oddity?

Mostly it's less Cluster v 'Mech Regiment and more Cluster v 'Mech Regiment plus conventional support elements plus militia units defending hardened positions. If you slow down and think about it, much less play it out on a map, the IS has the numbers and artillery support to pound the Clans flat. Especially with the notoriously light-weight Toumans we have lists for in the early part of the Invasion.

>>51920076

MUH XTR 1945 REEEE

>>51920223
Artillery scatter was even worse back then. Plus you're forgetting hotdrops. You don't have to assault an entrenched position from where they want you to.

>>51920284

And then they told the RHE of the mech armor. It was so low that shitty russian knockoff RPGs would blow a hole in mech armor. Literal goat herding mujahideen would shit on entire galaxies of mechs.

I wish authors would stop comparing their shit to IRL if they have zero knowledge on the subject. Just keep ot completely separate and let the fans keep guessing.

>>51920292
>Plus you're forgetting hotdrops. You don't have to assault an entrenched position from where they want you to.
That is true, and that's even from the era where hotdrops wouldn't kill half your force on the drop alone, but that just brings up the issue of how laughable deficient battletech forces are in AAA, which the soviets were most assuredly not

I honestly think it's a dumb comparison, because all it actually shows is that the battletech writers couldn't into supporting units, but we already knew that

>>51919869

>because why would you use a person when you can use a drone?

Events like those seen on Necromo might be a good reason.

>>51920388

I'd really like a oneshot campaign of a RealTech setting. Complete hard realism in everything with comical seriousness.

>>51920388
>Clans try hotdropping
>pods get blown open by S300s, S75s, SA-15s, etc
>Clanners burn up in atmo or slam into the gound
>Russians drink up

Put that one in your gene bank, Clanner scum.

My super-simple personal solution to the scale issues is to slash populations by two zeros and upscale all formations by two levels (all regiments are now divisions, lances battalions ect)

>>51920476

Maybe if it was canon.

>>51920388
>couldn't into supporting units

More like they were purposefully built to be nothing but occasionally dangerous speedbumps in glorious giant robot on giant robot action. It's the backtracking on that, especially in the "muh combined arms" Dark Age that kinda muddles everything into this weird zone that still wants to make mechs good but not the dominating force on the field.

I mean hell, there was some section in a recent book labeled King No Longer. That shows the difference nowadays.

And it's fine. I enjoy the modern game. But applying it retroactively to stuff under different rules is where it gets silly. Kinda like how most people have to try not to laugh when they read the DA novels using CMG rules with running overheating a machine with double heatsinks.

My main point was just you have to view old stuff in the context of its time. A lot of us tend to forget how much nonmech combat has changed when the mech rules themselves are so similar to the original standards.

>>51920482
>I'd really like a oneshot campaign of a RealTech setting. Complete hard realism in everything with comical seriousness.


>Hell, if you're willing to play your game to the logical conclusion, why wasn't humanity exterminated by le fractional-C rocks as soon as the first intersteller war or at the most the end of the Reunification War? A bunch of butthurt peripheryfags with a single DS+JS combo could end human civilization on sheer spite if they felt like it, with no possible prevention.
>Clearly, the entire BattleTech universe should be an empty space devoid of life, where players get together and just stare at each other over a couple of Moonscape hexmaps with no active units because everyone's already dead.

>It's the only reasonable answer.

(stolen from a few threads ago)

>>51920508
>Not slashing populations by three zeros and leaving forces alone except on capitol and factory worlds

>>51920578
That'd make sense but saying so causes major screeching autism.

>>51920482

>clan arrives
>issues batchall
>tries to land near largest city
>gets bombarded by STA rockets nonstop
>they manage to land somewhere
>constantly getting harassed by artillery and rocket artillery from beyond the horizon
>airstirkes and tactical bombing 0-24
>aerospace fighters turn out to be useless junk because the lack of radar support and BVR capability
>every clan LZ instantly surrounded by airdropped mines
>helicopters taking potshots from behind hills
>unless the clanners try to directly march into a city they might never even see a land unit
>when they finally try to attack they get mown down by all the firepower the defeners dug in there

>>51920538

There was a huge change in tone from the Succession Era Mad Max to the modern tacticool fantasy. The game IS about the mechs but they are struggling to give them a "thing" now because once you get tactcool it gets impossible to get over fasanomics and the military worthlessness of mechs.

On the note of Clans taking out whole Regiments and their supporting formations, is it possible many of them folded because their leadership was incapacitated?

I recall Elemental "headhunters" being a thing that many Inner Sphere opponents learned to be weary of.

>>51920617

What doesn't?

>>51920578
I'm also one of the remaining handful of Battleforce players
How about 2.5 zeros and one step upsizing? As a compromise

>>51920617
The majority of the universe as you see it in novels is pretty much like watching an episode of Stargate already.

>Wow, look at this whole planet.
>Here's a single village/city
>Does anyone else think this looks like the Vancouver?

The population numbers are completely superficial and should be cranked down severely.

>>51920564

You think you're being funny, but I'd rather have that as a game setting than what we have now.

If a game setting doesn't make sense, then it can't be fun.

>>51920650
>Battleforce
Careful comrade. You don't want to be hauled off to an Alpha Strike Reeducation Center.

>>51920807
I thought battleforce was the next level up from AS in terms of unit size? Regular BT is for lance on lance, AS is for company on company, BF is for regiment on regiment

>>51920865
IIRC Alpha Strike can easily be scaled up and down.

>>51920865
No. Alpha Strike was made to replace Battleforce 2. You can play the mechs singularly or in groups, like Aerospace Fighter squadrons in Aerotech.

Regular Battletech is also fine up to about Battalion scale. Company games are extremely common. Not that there aren't examples of experienced people running much larger games.

>>51920628

Sometimes.

But then there's places like Chateu where 7 Stars (1 Supernova Binary, 1 Trinary) put a defending RCT and two militia regiments to the sword, with 2 'Mech companies and 3 conventional regiments escaping. The Wolves fought them in open combat and it was the militia breaking that triggered a rout.

>in b4 wolf fiat

All the Invaders did it, and the Vipers even threw out two of the FedCom's crack RCTs that had been fortifying Twycross for almost a year in the space of a few hours.

There were a few Regimental command wipes but for the most part Headhunters seem to go for Battalion-level coordination in the Invasion itself, and later focus on ganking the top slots like when Sharon Bryan decided that sitting in the middle of an open field with no AA was the perfect way to fend off the Clans.

>>51920956
No, BattleForce still exists, AS is supposed to be a simpler and faster Battletech.

Alpha Strike, BattleForce, and Strategic BattleForce all share the same rules principles, but differ in scale. See Interstellar Operations pg 230 for more information

>>51920956
>Regular Battletech is also fine up to about Battalion scale.

hahaha fuck no, I'd rather have a toenail pulled off than sit through 72 mechs playing by TW rules.

>>51920628
That's usually what it was.

>>51920620

>Then the Clan Warship nukes you from high orbit.

>>51920476
Because there is no honor in that and you might as well be playing a videogame.

>>51920223

Isn't Artillery vulnerable to being attacked by Elementals who can easily dispatch Field Guns and Artillery Vehicles?

>>51921249
Since it's Conventional Asset Masturbation Sunday, one can assume that the arty is defended by Artillery Cannon Field Gun Infantry, who massacre elementals by the gross lot

>>51920529
Happy to see that after 3 years people are still salty that NN is canon

>>51921215
>Then the Clan Warship nukes you from high orbit.

For a society obsessed with individual skill, tube-trash sure fall back on "muh technology" and "muh warships" a lot.

>>51921355

Well, it is fuckin' retarded and fits the canon poorly thanks to both actual AI and zombie plagues, so there's that.

>>51921215

Then the clan warship disintegrates as the ICBM hits it far before it even gets around the orbit of the planet.

>>51921571
It makes more sense than Hanse Davion, though

Battletech as both a game and a setting doesn't work with tacticool and doesn't work with total war, either. It really is beyond me why CGL and WizKids before them are trying so hard to push those things on it

>>51921124

We had battalion scale battles in my old campaign group. In a single game day, we would get one or two turns, and the entire match would take more than a year of meeting 1/month to play out.

>>51921816

This. Suspension of disbelief is impossible once you try to up the scale from "space mad max" or "nobles warring with armored knights" It becomes retarded when you realize every planet should have standing militias of thousands of mechs, tanks and aerospace assets

>>51921579
ICBMs have fuck all accuracy for hitting targets in space. They're designed to fall on their target, not intercept it.

>>51922252

This must be intentional bait.

>>51922236

>militias of thousands of mechs, tanks and aerospace assets

If they did, it would all likely be of very poor quality.

>>51922291
you tagged the wrong post
>>51922236

Battlemechs would be more realistic if the PSR for taking 20+ damage in a turn were much harder. This would also increase the viability of tanks.

We can take this one step further and make it so every time a battlemech is struck by an impact weapon, it either forces a PSR or increases the difficulty by one for the roll at the end of the turn. Suddenly, AC/2s and 5s suck far less.

>>51922724
>increase the viability of tanks

That's not a thing that needs to be done. In fact, it needs to go back in the other direction.

>>51922799
Don't bite the bait, anon.

>>51921704
t.ghost of Ian Davion

>>51922799
Nice bait.

>>51922814
Sorry, couldn't help myself. His bait was too strong.

>>51922407

>entire industrial planets of several billion people are producing less materiel than some random countries right now

Fasanomics are required to keep the scale small, otherwise every planet would be bristling in tanks and artillery. its ridiculous how some factories building only a couple hundred mechs are year are hugely important strategic objectives.

>>51921816
>modern Battletech doesn't fit in my headcanon

Fuckers like you ruin the game

>>51922895
It seems like smaller populations, combined with the original setting's concept of water worlds, marginally habitable worlds, etc would solve that.

CGL's leap to make every planet in the Inner Sphere a bustling Earth with all the amenities we enjoy and more stretches the setting too far.

>>51922895

Maybe most worlds don't want that kind of industry as it would make them a target.

>>51922895

You're forgetting the sheer damage the SW caused.

It *used* to be the division was the formation of choice for the SLDF. Mechs were produced in the tens of thousands yearly.

The SW destroyed so much infrastructure that the Regiment because the most common formation, and usually the largest.

It's a simple matter of industry never recovering to League levels, ever, it seems.

Battletech Movie - I was thinking about this the other day. Why, after Pacific Rim, Iron Man, Transformers, etc. couldn't a BattleTech movie be made? We seem to be having a bit of a scifi revival lately, and people are lapping up game of thrones...

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>>51922970
Maybe the House governments like their citizens to have happy lives but don't like them having access to military hardware in quantities that could threaten their stranglehold on said world. Water worlds work, as does a supply chain and dependence on said chain, but so does simple denial of military assets. It's not like any House couldn't put down a rebellion of a few companies of Scorpions and Vedettes; but it's useful as a speed bump in an invasion and a security blanket for fostering loyalty and faith in the state.

>>51923054

Stupid as shit. Quentin has the Independence Works despite its right on the border changing hands back and forth. Dont say a world a jump away from New-Avalon, deeply behind lines wouldnt want the sweet profit of arms manufactoring, or Independence Works shouldnt be shitting out mechs and tanks to protect itself.

>>51922970

This on the other hand is a really good idea. Just say "all the best worlds with the infrastructure and population got bombed in the first and second succession wars" and its golden. It would provide varied and interesting locations to fight over, explain why its so easy to take over worlds and create a bunch of hugely important and strategic "new earths"

We could even get a bunch of brush wars and planetary level independence movements to flesh out things a bit and help increase the scale of the setting. Little rebellions and such for the mercs to put down and not be bored, afganistan and vietnam tier neverending snafus, cultural rebels in the flavor of your choice etc.

>>51923281
Two words: Licensing. Issues.

The IP is literally split between like four companies right now, and I think someone actually already owns movie rights and is just sitting on it because there were rumblings of a film version something like a decade ago. Also a TV show/miniseries thing.

Personally I think Netflix should try to secure the rights to do a series. It's basically as good as you can get without going full HBO.

>>51923344
Well in that case the Successor States should be more balkanized than they are. Course, the setting would be a billion times more awesome if it had started out that way...

>>51923359
Any clue as to who owns the TV and/or movie rights?

>>51923335

Maybe even litle private wars between planetary nobles?

>>51923335

What storyline you could even make a proper movie out without heavily recutting it?

Gray Death Legion and the Helm Memory Core?
Hanse and Justin dicking the capellans?
Clan Invasion?
Phelan gets to play clanner?
Or just make a movie out of a single, self-contained book like Wolves on the Border?

>>51923381

I always had the headcanon that the Successor States should me much more disunited, like space HRE if we are really doing this whole space feudalism thing. Plenty of bickering little states and several tiers of fiefdoms

>>51923397
Saban did the cartoon and they got bought by Disney so Disney holds that portion of the IP. So the chances of a cartoon are gone, pretty much. I don't know how much leverage against a live-action TV show they could pull with those rights, but most people don't want to even try testing Disney, and I don't blame them.

>>51923397

Harmony Gold

>>51923429
>space HRE

The FWL

>>51923487
>most people don't want to even try testing Disney, and I don't blame them.

Ah Disney, what a gluttonous corporate demon you've become...

>>51923344

I thought Quentin was deep in Hegemony space before borders were redrawn when the Hegemony fell, which placed it in Combine space but closer to the Suns border.

>>51923499
I think he's saying that ALL the Successor States should be like the FWL and be made of loosely-confederated fiefdoms and principalities that all banded together under a feudal lord/family for protection, or were subjugated and summarily neutered thereafter.

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>we get a TV series
>its just a political show trying to waddle in GoTs wake
>barely any mechs are even shown
>stronk womyn OCs are added in to make the show "less eighties"
>4rd season is set in 3050 wink wink nudge
>canceled on season 3

>>51923543
>The Misadventures of Max and Hanse
Fund it.

>>51923543
>4rd

This is what annoyed me the most

Are flamers good for killing elementals, or just regular infantry?

>>51923907

Just regular infantry. Against BA they only do normal damage, and Fire-Resistant BA armour is a thing now.

>>51923907
Infernos are good for killing BA, regular flamers don't do anything extra.

Hey Xotl, question on a quirk for you if you're in the IRC.

Are there any Steiner units that use the Iron Cross?

>>51926118
I think I someone paint some old minis and had them in a game where a Marauder had an german cross-looking thing. It's been a while since I have seen it.

>>51926118

>wanting a hate symbol in your game

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>>51926338
That's not a hate symbol, this is a hate symbol.

>>51926421
>around Dracs never relax.jpg

>>51923335
Two of the House governments might be like that. Doesn't fit for the other three, though if CGL were to suggest it I'd at least credit them with mediocre damage control.

>>51926118
Steiner isn't really German, they're more American.

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>>51926421
>>51926843


you have disgraced your ancestors. Commit sudoku right now.

>>51926843
>Dracs are just slant-eyed rats dot jaypeg

>>51927903
>In 3067, Taurian mercenary Rafal Ganowicz was asked what it felt like to take human life. He replied, "I wouldn't know, I've only ever killed Capellans".

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>>51927889
>>51927903
>photoshopped mech cockpit with a picture of that short haired girl from Haruhi-whatever on the dashboard, with cheesy J-pop playing on the portable 3025 version of an MP3 player
>It would have to be a Grand Dragon mech as well
>vocaloid emblems on the torso of the mech
>Japanese body pillow with some animu chick in the seat with the pilot

Insert reference to that one Drac unit where they are into their version of otaku junk

>>51927927
>Put a cap on a crap, and all you get is a little Liao.

>>51927927
I really like this post

>>51927957
Two nukes weren't enough

Are there any mech lists or RATs for Clan Burrock?

>>51928509
Era Report 3052 and 3062
There's one for them/Dark Caste in WoR iirc
Golden Century and other early Clan books might have something too

>>51928592
>>51928509
Also, a quick search turned this up: http://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php?topic=218.0

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New thread
>>51928647

>>51928618
Thanks