MTG EDH/COMMANDER GENERAL

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Imagine there's a new, alternate EDH format where only cards that have been printed in the new, post-M15 frame are legal.

What would be some good generals to build and why?

Anybody else can't stand when people throw tantrums about stax-oriented decks? Its just another way to play the game. I also think it changes the game to something of a puzzle. obviously stax decks arent invincible, so you have to figure out how to use your limited resources most effectively to break their lock. It's just frustrating that so many edh players get flustered whenever they can't cast their random 8-drop jank.

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>>51698168

>>51698015
[DISCLAIMER: WINTER ORB IS NOT FUN]

>>51698192
It's an emotional response. People want to play their fancy decks and have fun, and stax makes sure no such things occur.

>>51698192
>Its just another way to play the game.
and this "way of playing the game" is preventing everyone else from playing
i mean if you want to play solitaire why don't you just go play solitaire?

>>51698168
Even in an alternate format where he is the only legend, Noyan Dar would be unplayable

>>51698192
Yeah, played 2 games yesterday with my kozilek deck. In the first one I cast him turn 3 with haste and peoplr were like "wow", but nobody saw it as cheap, it was just ramp.

But when I got a shit hand in the second game and dropped a winter orb to try and catch up, and everyone lost their shit. I don't fucking get it.

>>51698235
>>51698268
But is it any worse than say, a removal spell? A stax generally stops you from casting the thing in the first place, while a removal spell still says "fuck you" but lets you spend the mana first. Interaction is part of the game.

>>51698268
Stax allows you to play the game just fine, if your durdle deck is too shit to dismantle a stax lock or disrupt it before it goes online, that's your fault.

>>51698268
It's not banned, therefore it is implicitly allowed and considered a legitimate strategy.

>>51698294
As I said, it is perceived as being worse, and that's the thing that counts the most.

>>51698268
>"I only ever play mono-5+ drops.dec"

>>51698294
>But is it any worse than say, a removal spell? A stax generally stops you from casting the thing in the first place, while a removal spell still says "fuck you" but lets you spend the mana first.
yes, it is worse
removal is saying "you started doing your thing, but i planned for it and prevented it and you can do the same to me"
stax is saying "none of you get to play at all, watch me play instead"
>>51698325
>hurr just make your entire deck into counterspells and artifact/enchanment hate if you want to play
>>51698326
where did i say it wasn't allowed
i said it was dumb

Anyone here ever get truly fucked by their lgs but still do it to help them? I sold 150 worth of cards yesterday to my shop and got 30% cash price. theyre a small shop so its the best they could do.

>>51698291
Because the first one I would assume you won the game shortly afterwards, correct?
Whereas the second game you just made everything take considerably longer without actually doing anything interesting.

>>51698281
I just picked him randomly, desu.

Honestly, in a M15-frame format, I think the precon commanders would dominate even harder than they do now.

>>51698353
>i play only control and stax decks which makes me qualified to understand how hard it is for other decks to fight stax

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>>51698015
Funnest card comming the fuck through

>>51698369
I sometimes do this with a local player who buys/sells singles, but only because I'm too lazy to sell it online.

Still, 30% is a really bad deal regardless of whether you want to play charity for your LGS.

>>51698015
I play this in Yisan with lots of dorks.

Everyone gets angry when it drops.

>>51698401
I have lost to this card quite a few times, but I guess that is the price to pay for hermit druid being an almost guaranteed win...

>>51698424
I was really hard on money, and needed it badly or else i wouldnt have.I mean I sold him a fucking foil godless shrine in mint. that alone i could have gotten thirty EASILY for selling it myself. cool shit is since its such a small shop he runs credit on a tab, and will loan you decks for free to play in tournaments if you dont have a deck for it.

>>51698389
>becoming good at playing a style of deck makes you not know how to beat that deck
I hope for your sake that's meant to be bait.

>>51698424


This is me
>>51698463
He also sells eternal master packs for 14 a piece.

>>51698367
If your deck has any amount of interaction at all other than "play one shitty, overcosted threat every turn" then you really should have a chance against most decks anyway. Obviously sometimes nobody has anything and the stax deck takes control, but at a table of players with even the most basic understanding of the game that shouldn't happen every time.

>>51698441
Birds, noble heirarch and green ramp counter this card pretty well. Are you just trying to ball out too fast?

>>51698463
The guy is taking advantage of you and pretending he deserves it by being nice so you don't feel bad about getting robbed.

If he can't give you a good deal, he shouldn't get any deal at all.

>>51698216
I recently obtained a Tamiyo, field researcher and a winter orb and now I'm tempted to go all in with stax Derevi. Please help.

Alternatively I was considering clues as a theme.

How are you supposed to choose who to attack when playing voltron and getting big early?

>>51698589
He literally lives in the back of his shop. and thinks a turnout of 8 is huge to an fnm. Im not denying that hes charging too much to live but the dude is trying to live comfortably too.
I can't hate him for that.

>>51698629
>Please help.
You mean, help as in help build your deck, or help talk you out of building it?

>>51698667
The guy who will be the most salty if he loses

>>51698168
90% of the legendaries older than M-15 are already unplayable. What possible reason could you have for making "frontier" EDH other than your group is a bunch of faggots who think older cards are unilaterally broken

>>51698667
Go for the guy with most chance to blow your voltron. Alternati8vely go for the salt mine and laugh when he produces more salt.

>>51697726
>>51698252
Lel I got friends and was accused of samefagging, what a way to end a thread

>>51698675
Jesus that kind of dedication is right on the line of depressing, do you live in the backwoods of Australia?

>>51698721
It's not Frontier because it would include supplemental products.

The main reason is that I was interested in building a deck with only the new frames as a potentially interesting deckbuilding restriction.

>>51698371
For the first one, yeah, but in the second game we just played lands and I played artifact ramp and passed for 5-ish rounds (took less than 3 minutes), then it got destroyed (the turn after I played kozilek). But still for the entire game they whined about unfun stax and how they couldn't play the game, all in all winter orb didn't even survive for five minutes.

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>>51698401
>playing this against a 4 color deck and a 5 color deck
>playing Vandalblast against artifact decks

best red feels

>>51698401
Contamination is better.

>>51698667
if you have a mature group who can play the game without being piss babies you attack the player who you know will be the biggest threat late game or the player who is getting close to going off himself

If your group is a bunch of pissbabies attack every player once then rotate, perhaps roll a die to "randomly" determine who gets hit first so their fees fees remain unhurt.

>>51698792
sounds retarded, hardly any of the old stuff is played anyway other than legacy/vintage tier staples, and most of that has been reprinted in the Commander precons.

>>51698731
Tripfag acting entitled, what a way to start a thread.

>>51698769
Nah, Middle Tennessee. He genuinely is a good guy, hes got like four cats and he's always got some hilarious shit playing on his shop tv. Hes rad as fuck. Shop opens at 12 allegedly but its usually 1230 or 1 because he was asleep. He also smokes weed and allows it to be smoked in his shop if all of the players agree to it.

>>51698684
Probably the latter since I'm not sure if it's the kind of deck that can be balanced between challenging and sadistic.

>>51698872
>sounds retarded
That argument has never stopped me before.

It's also mostly about aesthetics. I like how consistent the unmodified precons look.

>>51698888
So you're also fueling his degenerate lifestyle and drug addiction.

Okay.

>>51698827
Everyone plays black. People think red is the weakest color and refuse to play it.

>>51698827
>Not playing Infernal Darkness + Eon Hub

It shuts down Cabal Coffer and similar land users too

>>51698948
I mean, we can get into an actual debate on marijuana if you want, i'm plenty drunk for it. I cant use the stuff myself as it gives me panic attacks. But Im also not worried if a dude uses his business profits to buy some bud.

>>51698015
>There has been a constant stream of 40+ people Duel Commander tournaments in my city since the change to 20lp
>Standard, Modern, Frontier, etc. barely gather 8-12 people.
>Want to discuss and strategize to better my chances at winning
>Nobody fucking talks about this format online, Salvation is shit full of fags and slower than /n/. Goldfish has fucking Tiny Leaders metagame analysis but no DC, and other sites ignore it completely.

Why don't more people want to play and discuss the best eternal format?

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>>51699070
>little fags who want to play competitive 1v1 """commander"""
Kids these days.

>>51698168
My LGS was doing this long before the Frontier craze started and even have a league for it.

Since most of out meta's post-M15 cards are already registered in LGS database, it is quite simple process of making a deck.

>>51699167
Stop.

>>51698168
This is retarded, manabases alone would ruin the format unless masterpieces count
>No shocklands
>No enemy fetchlands
>No filters
And even if masterpieces legalize these we have
>No ally painlands except UB
>UB, BR and WG Odyssey filters but no WU or RG
>Rocky Tar Pit but no other Mirage fetchlands
>BR, GR, GW, UW but not the other Checklands
>Enemy Manlands and GW but not the others
>No Tainted Isle or Tainted Peak
>No Temples
>No Tribelands except Murmuring Bosk.
>Not all Shardlands
>Not all Signets

It'd be super shitty and even more imbalanced, not to mention M15 onwards is the peak of the "uber OP threats with the shittiest answers possible" design, if it wasn't for FNM promo Path to Exile, EMA and MM15, we'd only have Fatal Push for good removal to deal with rhinos, eldrazi, gearhulks and fucking Breya.

You went full retard.

>>51698192
I'm not playing EDH to figure out how to break out of a prison lock. I have vintage for that. EDH is an inherently shit format that is only saved by people who also understand that fact but choose to not take advantage of the brokenness, or by noobs who love magic for cool plays. If you want to play competitive, go play something where everyone has the same desire. Not my fucking casual table/room on cockatrice.

>>51699098
It's the closest to Vintage/Legacy you can get these days. Modern has been neutered so hard that fucking Cheerios is Tier 1 now, and Standard is for the slow kids.

What should I put in the Kynaios and Tiro of Meletis MLD deck?

>>51699248
Blood from your wrists. And ruination/obliterate/jokulhaups.

But seriously, play something fun.

https://www.mtggoldfish.com/metagame/commander#paper

how come the top decks listed here are so cheap?

>>51698792
Then why not just do that for a commander deck for yourself? Not every restrictive deckbuilding concept needs its own format.

>>51699199
Fuck you guys for shitting on my LGS. It is still booming every FNM.

>>51698878
What exactly is he acting entitled to? Do you actually read anything Animal Brollective says, or do you just see he's a tripfag and start foaming at the mouth?

>>51698168
My store does "standard commander" on mondays. Unfortunately I got a job that makes sure I never have Monday night off but I enjoyed playing it during khans.

>>51699300
other than the manabase they're just the existing precon with 2 or 3 win conditions slotted in. The Atraxa deck there is almost entirely composed of garbage energy cards from Kaladesh

>>51699013
Infernal Darkness does not shut down Cabal Coffers, but Contamination does. Contamination changes 'the type and amount' while Infernal Darkness only changes type

>>51698015
Who is more based? Mono black players or mono red players?

>>51698792
How sweet and innocent.
Cutthroat competitive Meren would have to change 13 cards including Overgrown Tomb, Bayou, Verdant Catacombs and Woodland Cemetery.

You're not suddenly gonna find you in a new, open and fresh metagame. So rather than asking for a new format just convince your group to do it as a casual deckbuilding challenge, emphasis on CASUAL or you're gonna get anally probed by the local Spike.

>>51699590
Mono black, they have more than two commander choices and don't whine when you gain 4+ life.

>>51699590
>Le tutor for my infinite combo
vs
>I am going to blow up your lands you UBX faggot

Mono Red Players.

>>51699590
Mono-red players, they know true suffering and thus are the only ones capable to spreading it to other players.

>>51699167
How many camera's does your lgs have?
Are you allowed to criticize the store while inside, or will men in suits take you to the island then?

>>51699353
Prisons are booming too, Dracula.

>>51698168
The format would go from people playing the same 50 commanders to people playing the same 10 commanders
>There is no arcumm dagson or zur so therefore the format is better

>>51699622
>hidetsugu
>feldon
>ikki jikki
>krenko
>purphoros
>zada
>norin :^)
>zirilan
>kurkush
>daretti
>slobad
>bosh

>>51699799
Kurkesh* whoops

I want an obscure commander that isn't shit. I really don't want to bring the same commander as someone else.

>>51699662
Play MUD, then get back to me

>>51699863
build ruhan of the fomori

>>51699863
Tobias Andrion

>>51699590
Mono red, they know how to have fun while the tutor and reanimator babbies start crying when they dont have their cabal coffers and a full grip.

>>51699799
>>krenko
>>purphoros
>>daretti
Oh I'm sorry it's not two, it's three commanders for monored.

>>51699863
Anything from Legends.

>>51699863
Who has phelddagrif?

>>51698441
just pack an all is dust

>>51699879
Colorless you whiny vintage turd

>>51699739
Most LGS have camera's, even in the west. Thousand dollar cards are easy to steal you know. I live in a rough area.

>>51699746
We choose the follow the format. Where on earth does the notion of force come from?

>>51699919
I run Gwendlyn. She has power!

>>51699863
Define isn't shit

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>>51699965
https://youtu.be/953PkxFNiko

>>51700021

Viable wihtout drawing instant and unanimous hate. Interactive without just comboing off. Maybe with an ability that can be built around but also useful by itself.

>>51699879
>MUD
>not being as broken, if not more so than UG

top tier mono red decks are pretty much mono brown in disguise

>>51699863
AtogAtog

>>51700062
Volrath the Fallen

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>>51700009
You choose to follow the format, just like how people with stockholm syndrome "choose" to defend their captors.

I can't believe police state LGS anon is posting and he isn't getting more flak.

what enchantment hate can i play in red?

>>51698168
My group used to have a rule where nothing older than Theros could be used. I gently persuaded them to rethink this, as deck choices would be horribly limited.

By "gently persuaded" I mean I built whatever the hell I wanted and destroyed them, making them step up their deckbuilding.

Arbitrary cutoffs for non-rotating formats are a bad thing.

>>51700204
>police state LGS anon is posting
WHERE

I am new to commander and pretty new to magic in general

I heard the prebuilt decks are pretty good, which one is best in terms of upgrading it over the long-term to be a good deck?

>>51700443
C14 red

>>51700443
Don't listen to >>51700453, he's a fag.
What you want is C16 WURG.

>>51700225
You can't punch enchantments, so generally 0.

>>51700436
Right in front of you.
>>51700009
>>51699353
>>51699167

>>51700443
Go with any of the C14 decks except Derevi.

>>51700443
Commander 2015
Meren - good out of the box (attracts hate)
Ezuri - needs upgrades but decent
Mizzix - one trick pony (attracts hate)

Commander 2014
Red - upgrades are cheap to make it good
Green - good starter package for elf ball

>>51700225
Reb and pyroblast

>>51700436
Nah, nowhere near the police state LGS anon, but still pretty bad.

>>51700409
Shit, I've met this russian guy a few times who has a huge collection that he keeps trading away because his playgroup refuses to play with old border cards as they are "broken".

They apparently ignore what the card does if it has an old border, even if it has gotten reprinted with a newer border or a strictly better version has been printed, they don't let him use it.

He has completely given up convincing them by now and just trades away old border cards like blood moon, onslaught staples etc for large stacks of crap standard and new border jank.

Think I managed to trade away $200-300 in $1-2 cards for fetches and other good stuff.

>>51700225
Chaos Warp and it will be the only one ever made because it triggers MaRo.

>>51700491
>calls me a fag
>posts C16 Unambiguously Gay Duo

Nice try faggo

>>51699214
>No Tribelands except Murmuring Bosk.
Ancient Amphitheater and Flamekin Village are fine.

>>51700557
I think it is him m8.
http://archive.4plebs.org/tg/thread/48993430/#q48995958

>>51700557
That's a fucking bummer for him. I don't know what I'd do if I couldn't play with fun old pre-Mirrodin bordered bullshit, that group sounds like a bunch of assholes

>>51699167
>Since most of out meta's post-M15 cards are already registered in LGS database
> registered in LGS database

IS THIS WHO I FUCKING THINK IT IS

>>51700628
yeah we couldn't help but feel bad for him and ask him if he really was sure about trading away such good cards for crap standard cards, but he had truly given up.

>>51700676
Why not play with him? Could have been a good addition to the group if he had good shit

>>51700699
he's only come by the LGS like 3 times in 5 years, and doesn't play commander.

I'm trying to build Saskia as a tokens deck since I've already got decks that just ramp into general good stuff in their colors, wanted to try a different strategy.

What are the best token enablers out there? Right now I've got Hero of Bladehold, Elspeth, Suns Champion, Assemble the Legion on my list, wanted to know what other good ones out there I need. Not just token producers (looking for good, repeatable token producers there) but stuff to help me allow them to punch through

>>51700733
Bitter Blossom.

I feel like I should really build a SMASH SHIT deck, but pure Timmy isn't at all my playstyle. What's a good commander that lets me cheat in huge shit?

>>51700733
M13 Odric would be great in the 99 to help get stuff through

>>51699240
Not that guy, but maybe I play stax in EDH because I can't afford to into vintage, and because nobody I know can either?

>want to build Rafiq
>all the shit required to make him good is expensive

Dammit

>>51700557
Tell him to go draft Homelands with them, you can get a box for around 150 bucks. I'd normally recommend fallen empires, but hymn to tourach exists.

>>51700768
How do you feel about hexproof, unblockable krakens?

Who is best Hatebear commander? Saskia actually looks super good for it, if only for the colors. Teeg and maybe Sisay also

>>51700827
That sounds kind of awesome. I assume you mean Tromokratis? 8-drop in blue seems super risky.

>>51700857
Then you can rest easy, because Tromokratis costs 7, not 8

>>51700857
Tromokratis is secretly amazingly versatile depending on your playgroup. Craw Wurm tier? Sea monster tribal is for you, don't forget your Quest for Ula's Temple.

Want something with a little teeth? Arm Tromo with toothpicks of fire and ice, feast and famine, etc.

Need something meaner? Time for mono-U stax with a wincon that isn't "frustration". Winter Orb, Static Orb, Tangle Wire, Ice Floe, whatever flavor of tappening you want that also guarantees commander damage.

Oh, and you can even go mono-U infect. Grafted Exoskeleton is your new best friend.

Worst thing Tromo can do is spellslinging, but even then Twiddle effects, Telekinesis, or Turnabout do work.

>>51700878
Less risky but still risky

Today I was able to test out my hidetsugu deck without hidetsugu ( I order the cards on tcgplayer about a week ago, and everything but him, crawl space and platinum angel came ) and I noticed that I really don't have many ways to protect myself, The first game i kept getting pinged and aggro'd until I ended up just blowing the whole table up including myself and making the game a draw. And the second one The resident blue nigger kept countering hidetsugu all game and I just ran out of gas and died. What are some good ways to stop from getting aggro to death or getting disrupted so much?

>>51698897
It can and it can be really fun. I play derevi food chain and man it goes off like made. Those two cards alone is just not ok

>>51701010
How does that work? Derevi's ability cost 4 and needs 3 different colors of while food chain with her would only produce 3 mana of only one color

>>51700768
Jhoira of the Ghitu is your gal. How would you like to play huge eldrazi, krakens, dragons, take extra turns, and wipe the board all at the same time and it's all for 2 mana? I'm a super Timmy though

What's a commander that will have everyone at the table trying to kill me before the game has even started?

>>51700142
That actually sounds pretty interesting tbqh

>>51700225
Enchantments are mono red's Achilles' heel

>>51699863
Lim dul the necromancer

>>51701069
>go for commander damage with Volrath
>reanimate stuff after you discard it

>>51699919
That anon said that isn't shit.

>>51700827
You just reminded me that I have a Tromokratis, so I think I'll make a deck out of him.

>>51699056
D E G E N E R A T E

>>51700225
Spine of Ish Sah

Ugin

Scour from Existence

Universal Solvent

Karn

Basically be prepared to pay out the ass for it

>>51700225
Mycosynth latice and artifact destruction.

>>51701067
This anon had the right idea. >>51701065

Jhoria is fun, absolutely, but only works once against an inexperienced playgroup. Otherwise the only way you don't become the archenemy is if someone else is even more degenerate. Like Derevi Food Chain, I suppose.

>>51701132
The world can always use more Tromokratis decks floating around out there. Good luck to you, anon. List when you have it would be cool to check out.

>>51699056
>>51698888
Seriously, if he is so damn broke he has to rip his customers off, maybe he should quit smoking.

>>51700546
The mono black one is also pretty decent.

>>51701202
It's probably going to be voltron/control with whatever I've got lying around, don't get your hopes up.
But it'll be fun

>>51700768
Oddly enough Timmy himself would fit the bill.

>>51701061
Not that anon, but it doesn't seem like it's infinite. Just efficient ramp. It would actually work for infinite mana thanks to Derevi's untap ability, if not for Food Chain's clause: "Spend this mana only to cast creature spells."

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I love me some red. What is the funnest mono red deck?

Also, post favorite Mountain. (non-red weaklings can post their respective basic lands too)

>>51701114
The problem with this strategy is that if you can afford to cast Volrath, you can probably cast whatever it is you're discarding too.

>>51701297
Reanimation is a thing in black and hes basically the first vehicle.

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>>51700768
The real trick is getting decent token production in blue to cheat out your fatties.

>>51701297
That's why you discard Eldrazi.

>>51698168
This sounds fucking retarded

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>>51701294
Purph is the most fun. You'll either get hated off the table or you'll kill everyone.
Daretti is a close second.

>fav mountain
I know Avon is such an easy answer, but it's so good.

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>>51701294
Champions of Kamigawa

I have two mono red decks, Zada Hedron Grinder and Kari Zev

>>51698369
You should always get at least 50% of SCG prices, before conversion if your canadian. My LGS does 60% cash, and 75% store credit.

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>>51701398
can't go wrong with Avon.

this one by Rob Alexander is very underrated, but the Shuler one in the original post is dearest to me (not that I was playing back them, but my uncle gave me his cards and those were the first mountains I used.).

>>51701411
how is the Kari deck? good art pick btw

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>>51701294
How do you feel about rings of brighthearth?

>>51701294
Zada is best Mono-Red

>>51695868
Not that guy but how bad is izzet if you cheap out on cards like the expensive jace, cryptic command, and blood moon?

>>51701466
It's pretty fun, it's a voltron deck with some stax effects that help keep you from getting blown out. A few sac outlets for the monkey since it gets exiled at the end of combat. Can also run mirror gallery and sundial of the infinite for endless monkeys

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>>51701294
I dislike most Mountains that I have, because I think usually pretty ugly. Anything that tries to break out of the red/brown/black color scheme is fine by me.

>>51701510
Cryptic Command's actually down below 20

>>51698963
Aren't there a few mono red decks that eke out wins in tournaments here and there?

>>51701568
yeah but no one cares about competitive edh

>>51701574
Jesus christ we had this discussion last time.

Food Chain only works for casting CREATURE spells.

You can't use that mana to activate an ability.

>>51701609
different guy but ahh i see that. rats.

>>51701599
If they don't care about being competitive then why would they care that red is supposedly the weakest color?

>>51701654
Because sultai a best, boros a shit.

>>51701654
casual spikes are dummies

>>51698963
The only color I don't play is black.

Because black is dumb af

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>>51700225

Alright I need help making my group upset, we're way too happy and carefree at the table.

Whats the most bullshit anti-fun deck you guys can think of?

>>51701838
Augustin, Hokori...

>>51701838
Leovold, every time

>>51701336
Intruder alarm + aphetto alchemist + acorn catapult + ashnod's altar= infinite mana and tokens
Intruder alarm + aphetto alchemist + summoning station =infinite tokens + ashnod's altar for infinite mana

Alchemist, station, altar, and catapult are already good in the deck, the only situational card is alarm.

>>51701838
That red deck that makes you take damage for doing just about anything

cheat out a big guy on turn 3 decks

>>51698192

There's probably some variant of THE RACK and lantern control in edh but I wouldn't know

>>51701838
leovald

>>51698168
New Selvala,play big green,have fun.

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JUDGE??

if I enchant an opponents commander (say, oona) with this enchantment (vanishing), if i activate the vanishing, can she respond by using her activated ability before she phases out? Thanks guys!

>>51702172
Yes

>>51702172
Do you not understand the core principle of The Stack?

Question.

What program or website do you guys use to play EDH online? My friends and I have been using Untap . in, but the whole website is just ran on the shittiest server. Getting kicked constantly from games and can't log back in.

I've seen anons talk about x-something? or is Cockatrice good?

>>51702313
Cockatrice is what I used, it's ok. Xmage is the other big one

>>51702242
Alright, thank you!

>>51702294
I'm pretty new, learning though!

>>51702346
Oh k, cool. Most people don't tend to start with Commander. I recommend reading up or watching primers on how the stack and priority works.

>>51702380
Starting with commander has only become easier and smarter with time.

Standard is cancer, and the other formats are far too expensive for a new player.
Draft is probably the best route but that requires a lot of people.

I assume he already has most of the ground rules in place through some 1v1s with a starter deck equivalent though.

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How can we make this glorious blind bastard work? I think voltron may be doable with the swords but I havent tried this yet. Help me /edh/ I want him to work so bad.

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>>51701294
Best mountain.

>>51702492
dismiss into dream

>>51702410
Kitchen table with friends/family seems to be the most popular introduction.
Standard is pretty bad for new players, especially when half their deck rotates out.
Draft is good for learning card evaluation after you know the game, but it's a steep learning curve. Also it can be rough if you're the least experienced at the table. Sealed is a lot nicer. Pre-release sealed events are still my favorite way of playing magic. I'm probably playing all 3 days for Amonkhet.

>>51702529
It seems someone has flipped your image turnways.

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>>51702551

>>51702545
I played for the first time during RTR and I've only every done draft and sealed, except for a couple shitty budget standard decks on MTGO. No real friends or family who play, and I don't want to pay out the ass for a constructed deck I'm not sure I'm going to like. Going to join an EDH group tomorrow... I need better friends.

>>51702529
Silly Australian

>>51700225
Liquidmetal coating and artifact removal.

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BAN WHEN???

>>51703371
right after sol ring
seriously why does anyone defend that shitty auto-include card

>>51703411
BAN WISHLIST TIME BOYS

1. Cyclonic Rift
2. CYCLONIC RIFT'
3. Sol Ring
4. Mana Crypt

What about you guys?

>>51702492
Douse = 4 manager counter target spell on a stick, heartstone and training grounds cheapen it to 3 mana and are auto includes in a deck all about using an activated ability more than once

Flashflood, blue elemental blast, and hydo blast become vindicates and the later also become cancles

Hibernation, washout, llawan, and inundate are one sided board wipes with enough mana. Don't forget you can change the color of lands.

Will breaker becomes steal creature on a stick

King crab becomes put target creature on top of library for 4

>>51703444
Mana crypt is fine.

I personally hate tooth and nail, and most of all fucking defense of the heart

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We need to make an EDH iceberg chart based off of legendary creature choice

>>51703444

Serra Ascendant and Felidar Sovereign. I don't like people abusing these cards just because the format happens to start at 40 life.

>>51703569
One is a life link flyer with no other abilities, the other you deserve to lose to if you can't deal with a creature on turn fucking 6.

>>51703568
Bug sidisi 4 horsemen

>>51703651
>T1 plains sol ring
>T2 plains mana crypt, felidar sovereign

>>51703568
that thing isn't big enough

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Demon tribal commander when? I just want it to reward me/punish opponents when i cast demons

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>>51703568
Where do I fit?

>>51700225
Steel hellkite. I use it in monoblack

>>51703651
>One is a life link flyer with no other abilities
a 6/6 lifelink flyer
that power and toughness alone makes it immune to a lot of early removal besides reprisal

>>51698168
God this card is so bad.

>Hello Wrath type effects, oh you're also Armageddon now?

Amazing

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>>51703444
I am actually in favor of unbanning some cards. Unban sylvan primordial, balance, biorythem (its 8 fucking mana sorcery speed ffs), braids (I don't even think she should have been banned as commander), emrakul, reoccurring nightmare, panoptic mirror, sundering titan, gifts (maybe, idk on this one), upheaval (we have similar effects in other colors, this is blue segregation), trade secrets (you can just say no), and primetime.

>>51702492
Pic related

>>51703672
Can't fit them all in, but put in the usual suspects, oloro, Slobad, narset, nekusar, zirilian

>>51703672
>magical christmas hand
Fuck off, that's not even the best 4 card opening hand plus it wins on the upkeep so you get a whole rotation to ping him for any fucking damage at all or remove the creature.

>>51703735
Swords to plow shares, FoW, tragic slip or bolt or shock while its ability is on the stack, abrupt decay, fucking doomblade. That's not even any of the three mana good removal.

>>51703769
Protip, put counters on same land repeatedly. Preferably an inkmoth nexus

>>51698489
That's not what he said or implied.

>>51703672
>mana crypt
>sovereign
50/50 chance to shoot yourself in the foot oh boy

>>51703833
>tragic slip or bolt or shock while its ability is on the stack
none of those will help you if the serra player goes beforehand
otherwise you just named the black version of reprisal and two good removals, good job
>That's not even any of the three mana good removal.
why should you have to waste three mana removals on a 6/6 1 drop that shouldn't be allowed in the first place

>>51698192
Yes absolutely.
Everyone has the same pool of legal cards to use, it isn't my fault that you didn't plan on someone using the resource denial strategy.

>>51699863
Aboshan

>>51698216
For you

>>51703775
I think Trade Secrets is rightfully banned, but the rest of them I totally agree with. 3 mana for draw as many cards as you and a buddy feel like while simultaneously locking the rest of the table out of the game through sheer card disadvantage is a bit much.

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>>51699863

>>51703911
Ehh, he needs to get balance off the list to, that shit is busted AF. Agree with you otherwise though.

Hey guys, what are some good cards that might be frequently overlooked? As in, easily and cheaply acquired. Much emphasis on the cheap. I'd prefer not to break the bank on my first constructed EDH deck.

So far I've only played precons, but all colors and all card types may apply.

>>51703859
You do realize you can stack the triggers so you win before you take damage right?

Not saying the felidar is too strong, just that you don't realize how the game works.

>>51703879
>none of those will help you if the serra player goes beforehand
>otherwise you just named the black version of reprisal and two good removals, good job
Its an 8 turn clock, maybe you won't be able to deal with it on turn one or two, bummer it happens sometimes. But you you seriously can't either remove it or win just win outright in 8 fucking turns, there is something wrong with your deck.

>why should you have to waste three mana removals on a 6/6 1 drop that shouldn't be allowed in the first place
No reason to ban a creature that just turn sideways and hits things. Its a good cheap beat stick and nothing more, it isn't even on the same level as snapcaster mage or goblin welder or mother of runes or deathrite shaman or stoneforge mystic or Bob or well you get the idea.

>>51703968
Its good but hardly broken. Would give some fairly weak decks in the format a nice push to deal with midrange and control.

>>51703976
People have mostly picked the format clean and "generic good cards" are either expensive or Commons. You could tell us what you are building though, each general usually has great interactions with a small number of cheap cards that no one else can use as well.

>>51704020
Can you tell me why stronger decks can't use it (and better). Most of the time I don't think weak decks can actually use balance, since they don't plan to stax out and create a deck that could create false parity.

>>51704061
By weak decks I was talking about weaker archetypes like voltron, stax, even agro; my mistake for not being more clear. Really anything to disrupt the throne of combo (which I am basking in all of its glory)

How much targeted removal do you guys run?

My friend managed to lock us on meren, jarad, terrastadon, dictate and no amount of cyclonic rifts stopped him.

>>51704002
>Its an 8 turn clock, maybe you won't be able to deal with it on turn one or two, bummer it happens sometimes.
i never said it was an insta-win card, just that its stupid. white shouldnt get a 1 drop 6/6 card just because commander starts at a higher life total
>Its a good cheap beat stick and nothing more
its literally the best 1 cmc beatstick
> it isn't even on the same level as snapcaster mage or goblin welder or mother of runes or deathrite shaman or stoneforge mystic or Bob or well you get the idea.
why are you comparing good support cards to the objectively best 1 cmc beatstick as if that somehow helps your point

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>>51703769
If you put this on board it would be less shitty

>>51704136
His point is that beatsticks suck in EDH, even a 1 mana 6/6 flying lifelink isn't good enough.

It will hit one guy for 18 damage before it dies, leaving 102 damage remaining, get killed, then make you a target because of your early aggression.

>>51704136
Its literally just a beat stick. Its not even a good card its just a good beatstick in a format where beat sticks aren't very good. I can see why you have problem with six damage a rotation in a multiplayer game.

>>51704160
>His point is that beatsticks suck in EDH
not everybody plays your degenerate combo decks

>>51704022
Honestly I'm just looking for some cards that veteran players would consider a staple in their collection. Finding a hidden gem would be cool too. Anyway, for my first deck I'm thinking Gisa and Geralf seems like a commander I'd probably use, but Nekusar seems good too. U/B zombie tribal is looking like the cheapest at the moment for me.

>>51704127
Gotta run good removal, if youre bouncing run wheels, if youre killing run exile. Its not the amount of removal its the quality and flexibility. I do run 10 boardwipes in my control decks, so if you want to remove things about 1/4th of your deck should be able to get rid of things.

>>51704177
>waaaaaa baby rage

>>51704184
Rhystic Study

>>51704173
>its just a good beatstick
no, its the best beatstick
we're literally talking about a 1 cmc 6/6
using the defense of "well i guess it can't kill everyone turn 3 like all the degenerate combo decks my meta plays so its not really dumb at all" isn't very convincing

>>51704127
Every good destroy/exile target permanent in my colors plus one or more of karn, lux canon, score from existence, or spine of ish sah. This is JUST for spot removal and is in addition to wipes, counter magic, and other kinds of removal/control.

>>51703775
I'm glad you're not in charge. Some cards deserve their ban.

>>51704101
I don't know why you think this hurts combo and somehow helps aggro. Combo players usually only need lands (if that), graveyards (commonly), and in the case of the strongest combo decks in the format, enchantments (food chain) this card gets rid of stax pieces like winter orb, ramping Timmies, and fields full of creatures. Some stax decks will build around it, but as far as just slapping it in a deck goes? It's best for combo.

>>51704220
Dude, I get you don't like combo I don't know why you keep bringing it up. A one mana 6/6 flyer with a key word is defiantly not worth banning, fuck its not even worth running in 90% of decks even if combat damage is the win con. Its just not very good, I don't know how else to tell you that.

>>51704263
Enlighten me

>>51704274
Fair point. I always saw the card as a way to come back from an unfavorable position rather than as a way to secure a victory. But you make a good argument, I still think it would be OK in the format and not cause to much trouble.

>>51704315
>Its just not very good
it doesn't have to be a silly ultra-broken game winning card, its not like anyone in commander actually cares to ban that shit anyway
> fuck its not even worth running in 90% of decks even if combat damage is the win con.
the fact that its a 17 dollar card and has solid synergy with a bunch of commanders proves you wrong

>>51704393
>it doesn't have to be a silly ultra-broken game winning card, its not like anyone in commander actually cares to ban that shit anyway
Yeah because we should just ban cards that are good right? That should be the only qualifier to whether a card should be banned I guess.
>the fact that its a 17 dollar card and has solid synergy with a bunch of commanders proves you wrong
Dude its $17 because of modern not edh. Its good in modern because of soul sisters and marter and you know it kills in 3 or 4 tuns instead of fucking 8. Its "synergy" is that it deals damage reliably for not much mana, Jesus how dense are you?

>>51704485
>Yeah because we should just ban cards that are good right? That should be the only qualifier to whether a card should be banned I guess.
thats why other cards are on the banlist, why not this one?
>Its "synergy" is that it deals damage reliably for not much mana
or its free damage with alesha
or its ridiculously easy lifegain for ayli
or you can use one of the many ways to give it double strike including rafiq and cut that 8 turn counter in half assuming you do nothing else
and thats just off the top of my head

>>51704554
>>Yeah because we should just ban cards that are good right? That should be the only qualifier to whether a card should be banned I guess.
>thats why other cards are on the banlist, why not this one?
That's the fucking problem with the banlist. But I am not going to go into detail about that with (you)
>>Its "synergy" is that it deals damage reliably for not much mana
>or its free damage with alesha
Oh boy free six damage! Way better than a duplicant or mentor or going infinite with revilark/fiend hunter/karmic guide. You have way better things to be doing than reanimating a 6/6 beater.
>or its ridiculously easy lifegain for ayli
Life gain as an archetype is bad. You will still lose to infect, commander damage, combo, and even fucking mill.
>or you can use one of the many ways to give it double strike including rafiq and cut that 8 turn counter in half assuming you do nothing else
If you have a rafiq you should be swinging with rafiq, anything else is fucking autistic

>>51704634
>b-b-b-but these things are BETTER!
it doesn't matter, faggot
the fact is you're still getting a 1cmc 6/6 flying lifelink that can be used in several ways
its more useful than it should be for its cost
also you should read what ayli does instead of assuming shes just lifegain, stupid

>>51703651
>One is a life link flyer with no other abilities

That happens to be a one mana 6/6 with no drawbacks and an absolute autoinclude if you're in white. It needs to go and stay go.

Felidar is more justifiable due to cost and the fact that it will be targeted by everybody.

>>51704315
>A one mana 6/6 lifelink flyer
>Its just not very good
>A one mana 6/6 lifelink flyer
>Its just not very good
>A one mana 6/6 lifelink flyer
>Its just not very good

That's literally the best creature in the format by far. A ONE MANA creature with evasion that deals 12 point life swings. No fair strategy is better than that. Only thing better than that is some degenerate combo.

>Dude, I get you don't like combo I don't know why you keep bringing it up
That is why. Only degenerate combos can possibly be better than a fucking ONE MANA 6/6 FLYING LIFELINK WITH NO DRAWBACKS.

If you seriously think that's "Not very good", either something is wrong with your brain or your local meta.

>>51704818
This is advanced shitposting.

>>51704704
>>b-b-b-but these things are BETTER!
>it doesn't matter, faggot
Maybe not to your sub optimal decks, I am saying its not worth the time and not worth the slot in the deck and defiantly not worth banning
>the fact is you're still getting a 1cmc 6/6 flying lifelink that can be used in several ways
Used just like any other creature in the game. It has the creature type so what? It doesn't do anything. No "enter the battle field" ability, no "when this creature dies" effect, no activated abilities. Its just a body that flies with lifelink tacked on. That isn't good in enough edh, just like how tarmagoyf isn't very good in edh.
>its more useful than it should be for its cost
Not really, it does more damage than it should for its cost but its no more "useful" than any other body. The best thing on the card is the key words and they aren't good enough to make the card worth running outside of aggro and very specific decks like karlov that care about the words "gain life"
>also you should read what ayli does instead of assuming shes just lifegain
I know what the card does ass, its not a very good deck. There are other commanders that do what she does far better (like karlov or the new bw partners or oloro), her only real appeal is the "cleric" subtype and conditional utility. She is OK as a 99 in a better deck but that isn't really what my point is

>stupid
No u

>>51704770
I wouldn't include her in any white deck other than one specifically built for agro or the words "whenever you gain life". I would always rather pack more removal than a generic beater no mater how good. In a 4 player 40 life format a 6/6 is chump change.

>>51704818
No its not, infect and commander damage are far superior to a regular beater. Also combos aren't degenerate they are efficient and effective, unlike regular combat damage.

>>51698192
>you can't untap permanents
>you can't produce any mana except black
>you can't use any mana except white
>first spell cast is auto-countered
>casting more than one spell per turn automatically ends your turn
>you skip your draw step
>you discard your hand at the beginning of your upkeep
>why can't you find a way out of my fair puzzle?

>>51704770
>>51704818

Jesus Christ you are dense, the card gives you a reasonable advantage if you cast it within the first turn of the game or so and then quickly falls off, both because if it kills someone it's taking 8 goddamn turns and the fact that if you draw it turn 6 it's a fucking 1/1 lifelinker in EDH.

The way you guy freak out about getting it in your opening hand you should talk about how gemstone caverns needs to be an autoinclude in every deck or something. The card is so bad when your below 30 I don't even include it in lifegain decks, let alone every single white deck.

>>51704979
If you let it get that far you deserve whatever hell you are in. Run. More. Removal.

>>51701453
That Alexander one is my favorite

>>51705013
it's turn 2

>>51705037
If one guy jerked off that much shit by turn two while you did nothing but watch then you would have lost even if it wasn't a stax list.
Swan song
FoW
Vandleblast
Caustic caterpillar
Dispellers capsule
Natures claim
Aura mutation
Abrupt decay
Dramocas command
Golgori charm
Hide//seek
Mother fucking hull breach
And the list goes on. No excuses. More removal.

>>51705013
To be fair you only need the contamination lock (which can start turn 2 without too much trouble) to get too fucked to remove any of the other pieces, since they are artifacts and enchantments, and black mana can't really do anything about that before turn 7 or so. Then they have plenty of time to do the rest.

Only other way to stop it is to luck out with a mana rock that produces the mana you need I think.

>>51705137
I noticed that none of your removal only costs black mana. Unless you are saying to roll vintage style and only keep hands with force of will.

>>51701896
Does lightning fast ramp count as cheating out, or is that fair game.

>>51705138
>relying on luck for colored mana from colorless sources
>2017
Coalition relic
Chromatic lantern
Talismans
Signets
Commander sphere
Dark steel ingot
Mox opal
Mox diamond
Chrome mox
The other diamonds
Run. More. Rocks

>>51705150
.......black doesn't have artifact or enchant removal, its a known weakness. Instead you should be the one doing all of the horrible stax things or not playing mono nlack

>>51705150
Also the vintage FoW thing is a meme, the only deck that mulls that hard is dredge for bazaar of Baghdad.

>>51705169
Why would a monogreen deck want to run any of those except for maybe Mox diamond? Just on the off chance that they get fucked over by contamination?

You and I both know that's not good deckbuilding.

It's OK to admit you are wrong. Not every general can handle stax, and it's part of the format. If color identity weren't a thing I'm sure plenty of decks would run some of the "free" spells that other colors get to handle it.

Also all of your answers Don't save a monoblack deck from the rest of the lock pieces

Can someone redpill me on monored artifact commanders like Daretti, Slobad and Feldon? I was under the impression that you generally want blue and maybe white for artifacts.

What are some staples of these decks? What's the general gameolan besides value?

>>51705318
Don't make Daretti your commander. It's pretty degenerate gameplay and people will hate you off the table because he is so strong.

>>51701388
>>51699214
>>51699610
>>51699322
Holy shit, I should have been more careful with my wording. I never wanted to imply that I'm forcing anyone to build anything, or an actually making new format.

I just wanted to build a weird deck for myself to play in my regular playgroup.

Why is everyone so triggered by this. Did I hit a nerve?

>>51705318
The tend to be stax decks that use the commander to break parity. Red has a lack of tutors so it plays out as a worse Teferi walker.

>>51705289
Look, there are pitfalls to playing mono black and mono green, you build around them or accept them. Also mono green has mana dorks and enough removal to stop stax in its tracks, I would run coalition relic (because its 2 mana sorcery speed mana if you need it), commander sphere (because you can cycle it for a net cost of 2 colorless late game), and MOX diamond in a Mon green list no problem. Again black is fucked but that's part of mono black, you have to rely on colorless sources like karn, ugin, lux cannon, scoure from existence, all is dust, Nevinyrral's Disk, ect. To deal with shit.

What are some spicy reanimation targets? I'm currently running the usual stuff like dead eye, palinchron, void winnower, terastodon, elesh norn, and iona.

>>51705318
Don't listen to this schmuck >>51705348 Daretti is fantastic and can easily take on the table even if they focus on you. Gable becomes a red entomb as you just pitch whatever you find with daretti if fate doesn't do it for you. Have fun and enjoy reking scrubs with a well timed scrap mastery or a goblin welder cheated blightsteel

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>>51705438
Boonweaver giant. Then you can put every creature in your deck on the battlefield all at once

>>51705426
Anon, that shit comes down too late, you are already stuck in the lock by then. Am I still talking to the guy that said
>Run more removal

Because you fucking can't use 7 mana removal and shit to get out of the lock, you need cheaper stuff before they cement it.

You can't have it both ways anon. IMHO stax being as strong as it is is because of color identity rules. But honestly I like those, it gives the format some diversity. You can't victim blame and tell people to run answers they don't have access to. Might as well call everyone retarded if the don't run food chain tazri if you go down that road.

>>51705522
Tough shit. Mana ramp with artifacts to get the colorless answers or play something different. Its not my fault wizards decided black is good at killing creatures and not able to interact with artifacts or enchantments. But thems the rules. Besides he told me he was mono black after I came up with suggestions. Also how does black get stuck in the contamination lock when that just makes land produce black mana?

>>51705580
>Tough shit

That's what you should have said in the beginning instead of telling people it's their own damn fault for getting stuck in stax locks. This is why people don't like stax, sometimes decks can't be built in a way to counter them. Which is what we were arguing about in the first place.

Also
>Artifact mana
Is null rod not a common stax piece?

>>51705638
No, every deck can fight stax. Some decks are at it better than others but everyone (even strait colorless) can deal with it at some capacity. But sure, if a stax player gets a magical Christmas hand and locks the game turn 2 and you are stuck playing a janky mono black deck, yeah you lose. But realistically if you know its coming and you both get OK draws it should be fairly even. Its about deck building and calculated loss. If the black (contagion lock) stax deck is counting in locking out his own black lands (like with a winter orb) in addition to mister mono blacks lands then a null rod fucks him too and no one is getting ahead.

>>51703411
some mana cards are real expensive but none are as good as sol ring.
So it's good that every one can have the 'best mana ramp' if you're old or new

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>>51705638
This or preators grasp in every deck ever. Pull out the pieces that are a problem.

>>51705802
Null rod is already on the field anon :^)

>>51705856
Good thing preators grasp is a spell ;)

>>51705865
I don't see how that is stopping a null rod already in play

>>51703569
>>51704818
nigga have you ever played a Serra turn one?
Thing gets ripped apart so quick and leaves the target on your head because people need some one to throw the hate at.
If this was pussy ass standard or constructed a one cost 6/6 in the air with life link is AHHH.
But this is EDH.
A 8 turn clock is shit compered to a card could be helping to gain a board state where you win on turn 3 or that every one else isn't able to win at all.
I mean it's good removal bait?
Just what are you scared of? 18 life gained in 4 turns?
Nigga i've had life totals hitting 5000 turn four with elf shenanigans and lost next turn to a single rakdos charm.
Ive seen guys stroke of genius where x was 200 and actually draw that many cards and not completely mill himself because he had played spawn sire and dumped a fist full of eldrazi on to the field.
He LOST that game.
This is E D H. If it's not degenerate then you're not doing it right.
A one mana 6/6? With an elvish piper ANYTHING is a one cost.

>>51705740
>No, every deck can fight stax. Some decks are at it better than others but everyone (even strait colorless)

That's a bold claim. Let's test it. You are playing Karn and I am on the play. I play underground sea, dark ritual, sol ring, null rod, entomb a blazing archon, reanimate it. I have a force of will and mindbreak trap in hand. The rest of the deck is packed with counterspells (including more that exile), land destruction and other stax pieces.

You have allies in your quest, two other drooling retards playing Karn. You have convinced them that you can break this stax lock together, they will do anything you say.

What do.

>>51705958
I play a Serra ascended and make you scoop with how powerful it is.

>>51705958
>magical Christmas hand is an accurate example of a game
Fine, concede. Game 2, I get my magical Christmas hand and exile anything you play with turn one karn after I eat your force, trap, and Sol ring (because fuck you). What's your point? I am talking about a normal fucking game, not some theory craft bullshit on a Korean basketball forum

>>51705958
>get a perfect 1 in a million hand
>NOTHING CAN BEAT STAX
>implying there aren't a million other decks that cant win turn one with a lottery hand

>>51705994
>tfw you serra ascendant into a sfm and cheat out a sword of feast in famine against a prossh deck

>>51706106
>TFW blasphemous act

>>51706123
>tfw sword of fire and ice

>>51706140
>tfw beast within

>>51706148
He doesn't even get the beast and it kills the sfm.......dude that's so mean

>>51706148
>tfw feast and famine

>>51706168
>tfw hunger and hamburgers

>>51706168
No no no he beasts the sword of fire and ice. Serra dies, the beast dies, sfm dies and you lost a sword

>>51706173
Maro said he wasnt going to finish the cycle, tough luck.

>>51706177
>tfw lapse of certainty

>>51706008
Bruh, it proves my point. You can be wrong on the internet. Not every deck can handle stax.

Second off that was just one stax deck. There could be more than one stax deck in a game, all with non magical christmas land scenarios and you won't be able to fucking fight it, because you don't have the right tools at your disposal (like cards with colored costs).

Not every Commander can fight stax. People hate what they can't fight off (especially because they can't stop it even if they make their deck as perfect as can be).

>>51706179
good, swords are fucking cancer

>>51706220
swords cure cancer

>>51706189
>TFW duel caster mage

>>51706197
i could have a 99 land deck with a omnithopter as a commander and that could beat stax.
All it takes is for stax to draw unlucky and not get the mana for like 40 turns.
Any thing can happen in your magical dream world were you can draw a perfect hand always.

>>51706197
It proves that a stax get can get a turn one win just like anything else. I never claimed that a deck can win every time, just that any deck can have the tools to fight it. Sometimes it won't be enough sometimes it will, the point is that any deck can do something about it.

>>51705923
>5000 life turn four
Bullshit

>>51705856
It's like you're fucking whining about someone locking up the game with arcane laboratory and forbid, and how you can't get out of it. If they have such an enormous stax lock that you literally can't do anything anymore, then you've lost, shuffle up and try again.

Also, gate to phyrexia.

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>>51706197
Okay, so if I have an Erebos deck that can ramp to infinite mana turn one through artifact shenanigans, and then draw until I get exsanguinate and nuke the table, does that mean that not every deck can handle monoblack?

No, that's retarded, it means that if you get a magical christmasland hand, then you can win.

Wow, how insightful.

>>51706455
With a well wisher, two parellal lives out, and a ezurri and a rys redeemed anything is possable freind

>>51706302
a white deck would be able to do something about it though. Two white decks would dismantle it handedly. A blue white deck would not be worried in the slightest.

The reason the stax deck "lock" worked is because the deck didn't have access to the right color answers, not because thats a "nuts" turn 1.

Literally 2 low cost removal spells and no reliance on artifacts beats that board and leaves their hand empty. Stax takes advantage of color identity in order to win games.

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Any one here ever built Ooma?
Faerie tribal with a bunch of cheap faeries in a blue black sort of rush deck hybrid control seems fun.
if not too compeditive once the table is sick of the cut throat decks.
Any thoughts or tips?

>>51698015
my play group banned this card because they think its cancer and i dont think thats true

>>51706674
just make infinite mana and mill everybody out

>>51706554
It probably means not every deck can handle combo, which is something a lot of people hate too.

>>51706741
No retard, it means that a turn one magical christmasland hand involving a fucking 8 card combo will win you the game without your opponents being able to do something, besides force of will or something along those lines.

You can't take a specific example of a turn one play and then conclude that it's impossible for some decks to handle that entire strategy, that's both retarded and a logicak fallacy.

>>51706674
My girlfriend built no infinite-combo oona, made it faerie tribal with all the big $$$ faeries. Honestly, it's a cute deck that can sometimes sneak wins, but she's getting the worst of both worlds. She still gets focused at the lgs for playing oona, and being a tribal deck with no infinite mana tricks, she has no chance after being wrathed twice or so.

It is a beautiful deck though, all lorwyn swamps and islands , foiled oona and foiled bitterblossom.

It's very flavorful and interesting to play against, but it's power level is average

>>51707136
I never under stood the "no infinite combo" rule. Literally why purposely gimp your deck and then spend a shit ton of dosh on it?

Reading this thread made me realize what an ugly community this is for a very ugly game. It takes a special kind of cancerous autist to turn a casual format into something where a 6/6 1 cmc flyer is underpowered, turn 3/4 infinite combos are considered normal, and shutting the game down so you can play solitaire is considered enjoyable for everyone involved.
I hope one day you can all actually try having fun again, but I doubt that will ever be the case.

>>51706621
>certain colors are better at doing certain things including being better at playing against certain archetypes
>some people take advantage of this fact
Wow its almost like its a fucking intended game mechanic or something

>>51707252
>my version of fun is superior
>how dare you have fun differently
Some people actually ENJOY that competitive aspect you know.

>>51706777
>You can't take a specific example of a turn one play and then conclude that it's impossible for some decks to handle that entire strategy

I can and I did. Are you going to tell me every deck can handle every other deck right now? Because that is just you being retarded. Karn isn't going to be able to handle food chain tazri at all and I don't think I have to post any hand examples to prove that. I also didn't need to make the example a hard lock, realistically a null rod is all you need to shut down a colorless deck for the first 6 or 7 turns of the game. Turn 1 null rod isn't unbelievable in the slightest, and most tuned lists can punch the baby it has become to death in the meantime.

>>51707274
>Some people actually ENJOY that competitive aspect you know.
stockholm syndrome is a horrible condition, I agree.

>>51707261
You don't need any blue mana sources in your deck in normal magic to play force (or pact for combo heavy lists). But in EDH you literally can't play them at all because of color identity rules. If that wasn't a thing I do believe stax would be a weaker archetype. I don't see how that's wrong.

>>51707319
Again you mistake a difficult or unlikely win for complete helplessness. Any deck can be smart and run a bit of removal and can slow down or occasionally stop even the most tuned decks.

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>>51707252
>Stop having fun the way I don't like

ok

I'm odd man out at my playgroup but I'm pretty sure I'm right, so let me ask you, since we're lacking an ask-a-judge:
>Player casts boom pile
>Player floats a mana from commander's Sphere
>Player activates boom pile, flips, he calls it right and a boardwalk occurs
>After flip, before wipe, he sacs commander's sphere to draw

I said activating abilities during a single ability's resolution is illegal, priority only exists between spell effects, my table said it was okay, because it was "in response"

Who's right here?

>>51707383
*boardwipe occurs

Autocorrect

>>51707383
You are correct, he has to sac the sphere before the boom pile starts to resolve. You can't do anything until it ends.

>>51707383
He cannot sac and draw during the resolution of Boompile based on the result of the flip.

>>51707383
He can flat mana before he activates boom pile, active the ability, pass priority, once priority gets back to him he can sac the sphere in response to boompile ability resolving.

>>51707467
>active the ability, pass priority, once priority gets back to him
Priority won't get back to him, not until Boompile has completely finished resolving.

>>51707352
>I'm having fun
No you aren't.

>>51707484
No no no I mean before he flips and it resolves

>>51707497
Then he can't pass priority after activating Boompile.

>>51707565
>You don't need any blue mana sources in your deck in normal magic to play force (or pact for combo heavy lists).
Correct
>But in EDH you literally can't play them at all because of color identity rules.
Correct
>If that wasn't a thing I do believe stax would be a weaker archetype.
Arguable, stax gets this stuff too but I don't see what this has to do with anything
>I don't see how that's wrong.
Maybe it is maybe its not. As it stands some colors will be better at it than others, but every deck has a way to at least interact, it may not be great but it is something. Now quit complaining and make do with what you have around the rules as they are.

>>51701067
Derevi, Kaalia, Narset, Nekusar, etc

>>51699863
Surrak Dragonclaw

>>51707231
Well its not a rule for us, she just has more fun making a bunch of faeries and buffing them up with anthems, and eventually overwhelming opponent through control and too many 3/3 fliers.

She doesn't do infinite because she doesn't enjoy "winning at all costs" as much as playing an interactive match.

>>51707319
Okay, then I can conclude that it's impossible for any non-blue deck to deal with Erebos control.

Seems rational.

>>51707252
>implying we don't have fun with infinite combos

whatever you say scrub. Most of us like to play a bunch of 20 minute games instead of one game lasting multiple hours

>>51698015

NEW THREAD
>>51708015
>>51708015
>>51708015
NEW THREAD