Let's have a chat about Planescape and Spelljammer. How

I converted the planes from Planescape into planets for Spelljammer. Ended up using them in a Fading Suns game...

>>51693743
Really? How'd that work out?

>>51692491
Why do people lump Planescape and Spelljammer together? The former is infinitely more popular in my experience, and I've played it. I don't know anyone who's played Spelljammer.

>>51693845
They're both settings which introduce Multiverse elements into D&D.

Spelljammer didnt have a popular video game, so it isnt much of a suprise its the lesser played of the two.

>>51693929
I also think, though I could be wrong, that both setting cores reference each other a few times.

>>51692491
Planescape is interesting while Spelljammer seem lukewarm and beg the question of why don't use just play star wars or another space fantasy instead?

My main experience with Spelljammer are the Giff (fucking stupid creatures, IMO) and the giant space hamsters (also fucking stupid creatures), and then the 3rd edition minigame in an issue of Polyhedron that ditches the crystal sphere and phlogiston stuff in favor of a vaguely more realistic implementation of space. I vastly preferred the 3rd ed stuff.

Planescape is one of those settings where it's great to read about, and it's great to play high level characters, but at low level you better get used to being a nobody and constantly being outshadowed.

>>51692491
>How many of you have actually played either of these?
I have played both, though neither extensively.

>What were your experiences like?
Good, for the most part. They're very different games, as that anon above noted.

Spelljammer is basically high seas adventures, but in space. It works best as an interesting naval adventure with cooler ships and more interesting places to visit. I've jammed in Realmspace mostly (fuck H'Catha incidentally). I found it works best if the PCs don't do more than steer the ship and/or fire the guns, having a PC actually wear the jamming helm is kinda boring for that player. Still, a very good time and well worth experimenting with.

Planescape is more my bag and I've spent more time there. I'm something of a local expert on the Great Wheel (though nothing like that one anon who makes the Planescape General around here). Unlike Spelljammer, Planescape is more about the setting than the PCs and what they're doing. I've found it works best with a strong environmental focus and a deep involvement of the players in the core conceit of the setting: that philosophy of the planes matters and is fundamental to them. If you have lots of "fuck alignment" players, you may struggle with Planescape.

>>51694074
>that both setting cores reference each other a few times.
Both settings referenced EVERY setting quite a few times. Except Dark Sun.

Ravenloft and Spelljammer each have ONE (1) reference to Dark Sun, and I'm pretty sure Planescape has none.

>>51694120
>and beg the question of why don't use just play star wars or another space fantasy instead?
Spelljammer *isn't* space fantasy, it's Age of Sail.
It's a pretty gonzo setting, that it happens to be in space is just tongue-in-cheek.

>Not learning the cant purely to bob some chummy Clueless out of that shiny jink

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I own most the spell jammer books and got pic related a few months ago(pro tip get this box, beautiful maps/presentation and is cheap on ebay). Planescape i feel handles high level dnd really nicely. The multiverse feels very fleshed out and it has become my favorite setting. I would argue you need a good understanding of the planes to get make a good campaign out of it though, not something for new players.

What is great about planescape is it gives you somewhere to take your group after they become minor gods (hero's) . My current group is about 50 sessions in on there characters over the past year, They have faced huge elements, lich's and gone through the whole princes of apocalypse campaign (in 3.5) . At this point they can destroy entire regions,heads of there former guilds, and are kings in there own right , normally this is about where a campaign would stop. Once we finished the book they were 17th level, so i sent them to sigil. My players instantly loved it and liked being the small fish in the big pond again. If you want a quick overview i recommend the manual of the planes in 3.5 , or 2nd edition. Both are good to just sit down and read.

As for spelljammer i have never achieved getting a group together to play it, the setting is kind of weird and goes way beyond just the adding of ships. The books are a great reference to steal parts from though.I decided to convert the ships to airships for a campaign and it went great. It offers a lot of customization and has nice rules for vehicle combat.
But i would recommend traveller to be honest if you want a real space campaign. Or d20 starwars if you kinda want the same dnd feel but in space .

>>51693777
pretty well actually, one of my best run scenes was on a planet based on Stephen King's The Mist, lol.

The Lady of Pain is really lame. They shouldn't have gone with something so anthropomorphized.

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>>51699084
Quit rattlin' your brain-box, berk, you'll get us all painted up and mazed.

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>>51696382

Athas is repeatedly mentioned in a number of planescape books - the core setting book and Planeswalker's Guide mentions Athas in the list of how various "prime worlds" (read: regular campaign settings) fit into Planescape, the Athar section of the Factol's manifesto mentions that they literally TOOK THE NAME "athar" from the world of athas, and the Faction War book has a little anecdote about this one time a halfling prime from Athas visited Sigil and was mistakenly introduced to the "halfling" area of the Lower Ward - and how many hardheads were needed to stop him during his cannibalistic rampage through the burrows of what is essentially hobbiton-upon-sigil.

Now, what I think your misconception might be based upon is how 3e never reintroduced or updated Dark Sun for 3+e, so it's not mentioned in WotC's 3e Planescape books.

but the TSR AD&D books mention it where appropriate (even giving rules for how Dark Sun clerics work on the planes, where the "elemental" forces are different from those presented in Dark Sun)

>>51696382
>Dark sun
>I'm pretty sure Planescape has none.
Heck no! Planescape has one of the best line (almost mechanical lore!) about Darksun that I've read.
States that people from Dark Sun are so resourceful that many Sigilian are awemazed that Arthasians can do many things with Wood that "Normal" folk require metal to do.
Also goes into details about jerks from Arthas often pick up water easily from other places and live like kings selling it back home.

But the metal wood thing? I've used that in one game I ran when a player's home world was dark sun.

>>51699664
>awemazed
Wow. Phone typing. Great

>>51698378
How flexible is the Planescape setting? Can my Sigil be different from your Sigil, can I change things about it without breaking it?

>>51699742

Yup. Part of the core assumptions about the setting is that belief matters, and that strongly held beliefs can actually alter the multiverse, so things are different all the time.

>>51699742
It's tabletop gaming bro. Do you think someone's going to call the D&D police on you? Not only can you change it, you should change it. Make it fit the stories and players as much as they fit it.

>>51700642
Sure but with existing settings you should be conscious of how the world fits together and what changing something effects.

>>51701007
I get that but of all settings Planescape seems the most flexible. After all, it doesn't just deal with one infinitely large world, but an infinite number of them.

>>51702098
Doesn't it try to evoke a particular kind of tone?

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PLANESCAPE:

fuckawesome planar roving best idea for DnD: the party can actually do all kinds of shit, including die from being overly stupid and underprepared. at best, you can have world-spanning exploratory adventures and shit-tons of story/scenario specific magic that allows you to go at it.

Spelljammer is an X and Y and Z makes my Concept style game, literally. it's mishmash, poorly thought out, and adds dumb shit instead of gold.

>>51701007
>Sure but with existing settings you should be conscious of how the world fits together and what changing something effects.
Planescape is probably one of the few settings where you don't have to worry about that as much as others.
One of the core concepts of Planescape interacting with other D&D or fantasy worlds. Is that when there is conflicting elements from one setting to the next. (Example: Forgotten Realms there is no Arcadia) Planescape allows you to go: "No-no-no Berk, that's what Primies THINK, and they got it all wrong. XYZ is how it really works." XYZ being how the DM wishes to run it.
This is encouraged right out of the PS DM guide/pamphlet.