/anrg/ - Android Netrunner General: Everyone Loves Puppies Edition

Anon doesn't seem to be around, decided to put up the new thread; notably, we're over the character limit for the OP.Barely got anrsealed and emergency shutdown added, but I had to remove something. Ono-sendai and cardgamedb links here until we decide what to do with them.

https://github.com/shyndman/ono-sendai (requires build)

http://www.cardgamedb.com/index.php/netrunner/android-netrunner-deck-builder (not recommended)

Maybe it's time for an infographic or move up to two posts? It's probably safe to remove Self-Modifying Code, Nerdrunners and Netreadyeyes, but we'd still have to cull a little more.

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Dead game is dead.
On topic tho. Looks like Daedalus Complex has a street date of the 23rd.

>>51639224
I understand Nerdrunners since it's a dead link, netready eyes and smc got some good articles for beginners even if it isn't updated anymore. Should we cut them? We have little replacement in that regard with the others blogs.

>>51639224
Netrunnerdb and acoo have duplicates, you can probably merge the two sections. Does anyone really use ono-sendai and the cardgamedb deckbuilder? I usually default to a phone app or nrdb myself.

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Weyland seems to be getting a lot of fast advance tools, while sansan and astroscript are leaving for NBN.
Do you feel as though post rotation the developers are trying to shuffle around the main focus of some of the factions?

Regarding the books, the first one (Freefall) is a pretty decent introduction to the universe, and it's kinda like the original board game in novel form. Lots of its info can also be found in the Worlds of Android mega fluff book. Some kind anon scanned his a few threads back iirc.

No idea about the rest of the novels though. Heard the newer ones are decent enough at least.

>>51641511
Some people use the cardgamedb, I tried to keep up with a local copy of Ono Sendai, but couldn't. Imo It's still the best card viewer by far, what a shame.

>>51641752
Damon has said somewhere that he doesn't think mechanics "belong" to a certain faction, eg. NBN is best Fast Advance, but FA isn't specifically for them, it's just a mechanic that's in the game. Red Sands' Weyland might be an attempt to strengthen that view.

>>51641877
I don't think anyone has ever said anything bad about any of the Android literature.

>>51641923
Maybe put the rarely used/less updated links into a pastebin to reduce the clutter? Or shortening the ffg link somehow?

>>51641752
It still fucking pisses me off that I can't combo this ability with Oberth Protocol

>>51639097
I'm looking forward to Kakugo, a single card tax (two in PU) every time the runner passes it is pretty good. InstaParasite is a thing, but with Sifr that's true of any ice.

The Archivist seems like it could fire pretty often, so probably that. That said the balance is squarely in the Runner's favour at the moment, as they have incredible econ advantage over the corp. Not to mention any asset or upgrade play is effectively neutralized by Slums, among others. Corp side is going to need something really effective to swing the pendulum back to it, without being going so far to invalidate any Runner archetypes.

>>51642661
Why not?

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>>51642755
Yeah, that does look nice.

>>51642769
I think he means Jamison advancements don't count for Obererth's bonus advancemnt (which they don't), but it's still good:
Sac a 0-pointer for oberth and advance once puts 3 tokens on
Sac a 1-pointer for oberth and advance once puts 4 tokens on
Sac a 2-pointer for oberth and advance once puts 5 tokens on
Sac a 3-pointer for oberth and advance once puts 6 tokens on

Sac a 4-pointer for oberth and advance once puts 7 tokens on which kind of craps out

Really think this is an ID which benefits from "when you score" agendas.
Also the forfeiting reduces your agenda density nicely.

>>51643484
>Also the forfeiting reduces your agenda density nicely.
Untrue, you still have to have agendas in your deck, and still have to score them. Agenda density is not impacted at all.

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>>51644012
Yeah, phrased that badly - what I meant is that it means you go through agendas pretty fast, even if the points aren't forever, and sacrificing an agenda to score an agenda is a bad deal for the runner.

Reclamation Order and possibly Fast Track seem like good splashes.
Thematic too: Jamison recovering their delivery rockets makes a whole lot of sense, and as a Corporation they're dynamic and audacious enough that fast-tracking really works

While they're still in the game Atlas will be amazing, seeing as turning Hostile into Atlas gives you a counter on it, and False Lead can give a great way to score Government Takeover

Gangsign decks, like Iain and especially Leela are going to be pretty rough though - she's an enemy of all Weyland decks, bouncing advanced things, but she'll do horrible things to Jamison

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>>51642755
How would the meta evolve if we rotate SanSan and Mumbad instead of Genesis and Spin?

>What card are you most excited to see hitting the tables in Red Mars?

As I've been clamoring for a while now: Anarch Link decks with Persephone and Archivist. Definitely going to be fun to play.

Corp wise, while the IDs have been great and inspiring, Standoff takes the cake. Lovely design on that card. It's basically a triple operation that gives a zero point agenda and something under the runner's control whether destruction or gain. And then the possibility of both players going into self-destruct mode is just so much pure unadulterated fun. Not to mention the baiting + Stock-Buy-Back plays.

>what Red Mars card do you see threatening the Netrunner "balance" meta once again?

Balance between factions, or between corp and runner?

If the former, I'm thinking enough anti-trash protection and derrez support might turn the table on it and ICE destruction.

If the later,granted we basically now next to nothing of NBN and HB this cycle, I'm thinking the W advance* stuff has potential to be ridiculous.

*: I don't know how to call it, it's not just fast... "powered"?

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>>51644949
>SanSan and Mumbad
Why Mumbad in there? Wouldn't it be San San and Lunar?

San San and Mumbad though:

San San
Big Corp cards: Team Sponsorship, all the Renovations but mainly Oaktown, the Scientist ice, Batty, Tour Guide, Breaker Bay.

Runner side there's: Faust, Clot, Adjusted Chronotype, DDoS, Peddler, Career Fair, Drive By, Fisk Seminar, Hyperdriver, DaVinchi, Film Critic, Paparazzi

Looking over San San I think there's still a lot of uncovered ground there, especially on the corp side I think

Mumbad, well obviously you've got your political and alliance assets (and events, but most of those are fine), some ice that's more interesting than amazing and a couple of niche cards.
Really the Politcals and Alliance stole the show here, though a few things are really under-explored, like Harishchandra.

Runner-wise you've got Plop and Councilfam, the commercial-grade hardware (much like cybernetics, there's not been much done with that), Salsette Slums, Artist Colony, Patron, Sports Hopper and Guru, turning wheel, and last but not least, Rebirth.

Mumbad had a lot more moderate stuff for the runner - especially when it came to damage prevention

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>>51645176
>moderate
moderately-powered but interesting is what I mean

>>51642661

On the one hand, I get what you mean with the los advancement bonus, on the other, rezzing Oberth *is* the combo with the ID ability.

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>>51645170
>*: I don't know how to call it, it's not just fast... "powered"?
Given it's based around Jamison and Oberth, maybe Rocket Advance?

Stupid idea (yes, don't say it, it's not balanced);

Chain Malfunction
3 cost
Current

Usual Current stuff.
The first time each turn the corp rezzez a piece of ICE during a run, you may derezz another piece of ICE whose cost is equal or inferior to the piece of ICE just rezzed.

Criminal 4 influence

>>51645440
Absolutely ridiculous. It would be op even if it cost 6c.

>>51645440
Make it 2 or 1 cost, and require the runner to pay the rez cost of the ice (including any additional costs), then it would be fine.

>>51645471

I agree, but I do love the base idea.
Making it a run event kinda kills the whole chain reaction bit, and that was the fluff inspiration.

And I like the counter-plays left to corp with rez costs - the idea of having to plan and time your rezzes right..

>>51645480

Yeah, upping the cost for the runner definitely seemed like the way to go, just didn't know what angle to take. Credits? (Unpreventable) Tags? Self-damage doesn't feel really crim.

Oh, well; just a silly idea.

Some Runner
Faction TBD
>does it really matter whether they're natural, G-Mod, or cyborg?
45/15
0 Base Link
>You take your first turn before the corporation.

How abusable is this? I think the closest comparison is Andromeda.

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Miraju looks like pretty cool HQ protection.

>>51645558
Absolutely bonkers. Wanton Destruction, multiaccess, siphon...

>>51645558

There's been a lot of Gooru jokes with that "take the first turn" idea. Keyhole/Amped up alone opens disgusting possibilities.

>>51645598
Shit, I forgot about Account Siphon. You could never have a runner like this as long as that's around.

>>51645639
Maybe if you forbid running on that first turn, but it would still need heavy deck size and inf nerfs.

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>>51645558
>How abusable is this
Ridiculously so

Make them a 0 inf shaper and maybe it'd only be mildly broken (though NEXT would laugh)


AgInfusion + pic related would be brutal, especially if there's a trap in the Anson server - spaceport traps would be pretty nasty

>>51645550
Which is why "pay the rez cost" aka bribing is fine for me, and if you include additional costs it means you can't just derez an Archer for 4. Bad pub ice becomes terrible though, maybe add "remove 1 bad pub, if any". Personally I like it for enabling Muertos Gang Member shenanigans.

>>51645574
General central protection really, counters Indexing too, though Siphon is relatively unaffected unless Sub Boosted. Actually, Sub Boosting this would make the server immune to everything but Inside Job and Parasite. Funny interaction with Omar though.

>>51645654
You can always first turn Peace in Our Time if that's the case. A continuous benefit for the corp might be better, like 1 credit at the start of each turn or something.

>>51645944
Ah, never mind, you need to break the *printed* subroutine for the redirect to fire. Smart wording choice.

>>51645176
Why SanSan and Lunar? I mentioned SanSan and Mumbad because I believe SanSan was when Lukas went downhill with his design.

>>51646256

Because Lunar and SanSan are the next two to rotate after Genesis/Spin. Guess that's what anon thought the question was about.

>>51645973

Yeah, everyone raised an eyebrow at that wording.

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>>51646256
I was going to disagree on San San, then I remembered DDoS, Critic and Faust+Chronotype - though I think the corp side of San San was alright, and most of the cycle was fine.

For Mumbad the main issue was with the Museum-Temple-MCH trifecta - that enabled too much bullshit, and Faust meant asset spam became way, way too reliable.
Bioethics shouldn't have been too much of an issue, but again Museum and MCH made it OP while Hostile IG kept it around.
Exchange of Information was too powerful because BN is too powerful, but as a concept I like it a lot - non-kill tag punishment is never really a bad thing imho

>>51646333
Yeah, I was wondering why those when Lunar is next in line for rotation

>>51647258
I really wonder if they will be attempting to curb asset spam. Slums is a fine counter, but it hurts other asset and upgrade plays a lot more. So does just giving the runner more money. I like asset spam as a concept, but prison decks just seem not fun.

>>51647689
Asset spam was fine before Museum existed. Proof is NEH, even if the ID was broken with 17 influence imo, the asset spam was a viable and natural strategy. One that Criminals exploited with SecTest and Bank jobs.
When people complain about asset spam they are not talking about asset spam, they are talking about Prison decks and recursion cards bringing over and over the same assets. Even politicals are fine, just powerful assets with a weak trash cost, as it should be (ie melange, sundew).
But the recursion gimmick had to be countered, hence the Slums.
Honestly, I'd just put all the recursion cards in the MWL and see hell happen.

>>51647937
Yeah, I agree - I like using MCH, and I think it's a very valuable tool, but when it combines with asset spam it just gets obnoxious.
Not really sure how it could still work and not be, though being Unique helps a lot.
Maybe not shuffling assets?

Though it did get people to consider decks with more cards, which was neat.

>>51647258
>Honestly, I'd just put all the recursion cards in the MWL and see hell happen.

But then Anarch hyper trashing shenanigans...

>>51647937
>But the recursion gimmick had to be countered, hence the Slums.
Sure, but it still hurts decks that use assets and upgrades sparingly a lot more compared to asset spam and prison decks, which are probably what the card is targeted at (collateral damage seems to happen pretty often lately). I want asset spam/prison to be curbed so that Slums sees less play, which means the other deck types can do better.

All recursion cards on the MWL would make me sad, personally. I can live with just Friends on MWL I think, as long as Preemptive isn't.

Also, Friends in High Places vs Salsette Slums is pretty neat fluff wise.

If anything, I'd say what you want to hurt is mass install of assets/upgrades.

A crim card with a two credit swing (one lost for corp, one gained for runner) for each new server created? Current maybe?
Or one credit swing, but resource, and targeting install inside a server, indiscriminately? That way you can still benefit even against non asset spam decks...

>>51648342
I think a card that makes creating servers cost 1-2 credits would be good - non-spammy decks usually don't need more than 2 or 3 at most, while for Spam you have to keep re-making servers again and again.

Maybe in crim?

>>51648342
That's a pretty Criminal way of handling it, a current would be fitting since prison decks don't plan on scoring anyway.

Actually, here's a resource I would've rather seen instead of Slums:
"Unique
At the start of each of your turn, place a power counter on this card for each remote server the corp has. At the end of every run, remove a power counter from this card.

The corp has 1 bad publicity for every 2 counters on this card."

>>51648707

Unless I'm misreading, that basically means a scoring server and a single PAD Campaign will generate one Bad Pub every two turns if the runner runs once per turn? Way too good I think.

I kinda like the base idea of basically giving free trashes when the corp goes overboard with assets. Would have to work differently though.

Whenever the corp rezzes an asset, put X credits on Card0, where X is equal to the number of rezzed assets. Use those credits only to trash assets.

Also, given how often I can see people running 3+ assets in one turn nowadays, was Skulljack a missed opportunity?

>>51648951
Yeah you're right, I forgot that sometimes runners don't even run that much. Maybe an additional remove one counter at the end of the runner's turn, so that it doesn't do anything against single remotes, and 2 remotes would give a counter back? Or just remove 2 counters instead of only 1.

I like yours too, basically a reverse Tech Writer.

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>>51648951
>was Skulljack a missed opportunity?
Sort of . Really did not need to cost 2 and do a Brain.
A brain and free, 2 and 2 meat, but not 2 and a brain

The cybernetics/genetics seem just a bit of a missed opportunity - outside of chronotype, anyway, and that was pretty much just Wyldside

>>51642651

The fluff is pretty decent, and it's honestly surprising an RPG based on it isn't out yet.

>>51651090
I suspect the reason we haven't seen an Android RPG via the acquisition of Legend of the Five Rings. This also explains Worlds of Android.

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>>51651505
>I suspect the reason we haven't seen an Android RPG via the acquisition of Legend of the Five Rings.
Is there a word missing here?

This is amazing, NASX+Mark Yale and a scored Firmware Updates are 25 credits profit.

>>51651736
GRNDL First turn, Restructure, Bryan Stinson, Restructure. Start game with 28 credits.

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>>51651736

I feel there could be one of these with a weyland exec

>>51651736

Nice spot, two triggers per counter on Yale means twice the token numbers. You do need a bit of money in the bank, but that's one hell of a potential jump.

>>51651591
>Is there a word missing here?

Oh god I'm contagious.

As for why there's no Android RPG yet... well business side, RPGs aren't much of moneymakers, especially given the work needed to pull a good game.

Given how creative the scene has been in recent years, probably better to release a fluff book and let players chose and hack their systems of choice depending on what aspect of the campaign setting they want to explore.

>>51651886
Just 3 credits to rez them both. Not counting the setup to score Firmware Updates, one can install NASX, install Mark, rez both, use Mark to be rich, trash NASX to be filthy filthy rich.

>>51651505
>>51651952

I do wonder if there would be another volume of WoA in the future? Further expansion of details of events like the 23 seconds incident and presumably what's going to happen on Mars (Android Wars?) would be nice to have.

>>51652638
>what's going to happen on Mars
There's a pretty big section on Mars actually, and I think the cycle there will be more like San San or Luna - not based around an event like Flashpoint was.
Mumbad was somewhere between the two

>>51652935

It is indeed a short and sordid history regarding Mars. Still though, some of the revealed cards imply an upsurge of Martian resistance against Corp/FedGov rule, so it's a possibility the timeline might advance.

Whether the Martians actually succeed is hard to tell, considering the presence of both Clone and Warroid armies just waiting to be activated.

>>51652638

If it's of the same quality as the first, while updating/completing what's already in the first one, I'd definitely welcome a second volume.

One Mars card we didn't mention yet, Adjusted Matrix does look like it could make a big splash...

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>>51639224
>http://www.cardgamedb.com/index.php/netrunner/android-netrunner-deck-builder (not recommended)

While I dislike the growing number of small mistakes/errors that never seem to get corrected (see Apocalypse being an Anarch card still from D&D's release for one), I do think it's a useful browsing tooll with its search functions.

>>51645558
If you add the clause "during this turn you cannot make a run" I'd be interested.
Or maybe "You may only run once, and no run events may be played."
Basically make it so that it isn't disgusting with siphon or "on run" effects.

>>51651736
You'd have to defend NASX for atleast a turn to use up Firmware, but that is pretty neat.

>>51653805
It would depend on if you could use it without pumping strength or not I'd say. If not, it's at most saving a single credit, and would only really be used in Apex I'd say.

>>51656775
Well, you can install both NASX and Yale the same turn you use NASX ability to trash itself, well after Firmware Updates is scored.
No need to defend anything except HQ.

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>>51656775
>It would depend on if you could use it without pumping strength or not
You can't - normal breaker rules apply - but you can use it to break any sort of ice that way

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>>51658287
Wonder what happens if you tried that with an ice on Dinosaurus?

Speaking of, I got a very rare victory the other day, as the corp - total lockout.

Opponent was using Dino-Sage, but I had 3 advancable walls - I got them all above his max strength and it was gg

>>51658115
You can only use Firmware to advance ice once per turn.

>>51658660
Read Mark Yale.

>>51658672
Ah, so you're only using Firmware for money then, cool. Thought his ability only fired on the side for some reason, my bad.

>>51658574
Is that rare? I guess it depends on what are you aiming with your deck. Total lockout is kind of the purpose of my rig shooter and I managed to do it more than a few times. I usually aim at their decoders first, so my Wendigos and Wormhole canbdo all the dirty job.
This one game agaisnt Geist I trashed all his breakers, but he played a Gang Signs variation so he could still win.
In the end I managed to rez Corporate Town and trash everything he had, was a close game.

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>>51658740
That sounds really cool, didn't think rigshooter would be viable these days

HB I presume?
For Agsec, Lockdown and the recycling thereof

>>51658821
GRNDL, it was during summer, and my meta is weird, so I don't know how it compares with current Whizzards decks. Probably not that good.

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>>51658869
The 3 things that I would say hit rigshooter the most:
>The conspiracy breakers.
They're not the cheapest to install, and outside of Paperclip they don't have the best breaking ratios, but trashing them is nigh worthless.
>Ice destruction at an all time high
The gold standard for ice destruction was, iirc, big fuckoff sentries. Those are only slightly better than worthless right now, and if they do fire they'll probably only fire once. And the power of THAT is limited because:
>Ice destruction uses lots of recursion support
Parasite being elevated to godly levels of power has made Deja Vu and clone chip come back in a big way (not that any of the 3 were ever really gone) - sure, it eats influence, but the amount of recursion people pack to support the archetype also smacks rigshooter as side-effect

Honourable mention:
>Sacrificial Construct
With Baba Yaga and a couple of other cards (Tapwrm) entering the card pool, I've seen sac con come back a bit.
Tapeworm is brutal, don't underestimate it.
And if you are running Baba then know that 1 Construct is not enough - I've personally killed a full Baba who was only using one (which led to a ragequit over the way I did it - using Orion's "fire other ice" sub->Wormhole-> Orion's trash sub, but still)

Oh, and you'll occasionally meet people with Nexus-power tap, but that's less common now there's easier ways to ignore your opponent's stuff

That said, I'd love to see your list

And Lockdown + Blacklist helps a lot I would think

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>>51658994
>gold standard for ice destruction
gold standard for *program trashing*

Core set Anarch have no economy cards. What card would you pull from other sets and boxes to remedy this (don't worry about what to replace, that's on me)?

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>>51658994
Thanks for the summary, I was curious about how rigshooters were doing these days.
My list is from before 23 seconds, since then I have moved to BoN, so you won't see anything spectacular. I'll post it once I get home anyway.
As I mentioned, I didn't focus on big sentries (besides Archer and Nebula) or anything like that. Playing Chronos Protocol I identified that Runners without a decoder were more vulnerable than those without fracters or killers. So I moved to GRNDL and picked up Wendigo (sometimes as a barrier) and Wormhole to lock their programs, and then fire sentries like Rototurret and Cobra from afar. Followed by Blacklist or scoring a Chronos Project.
But really, Wendigo, Wormhole, and Swordsman for AI were key.

my group is picking up Netrunner.
I got some cards second hand. core set and some extra (no idea what data packs)

I came up with this deck for our upcoming newbie tourney event. is it any good?

id: Gabriel Santiago

+++events+++
2x Acc. Siphon
2x Diesel
3x Easy Mark
3x Forged Activation Orders
3x Inside Job
3x Spec. Order
3x Sure Gamble
3x The Maker's Eye

+++hardware+++
1x The Toolbox

+++programs+++
2x Aurora
2x Crypsis
3x Femme Fatale
2x Leviathan
2x Ninja

+++resources+++
3x Armitage Codebusting
2x Bank Job
3x Crash Space
3x Sacrificial Construct

deck size: 45
influence 15/15

>>51659256
It's ok.
You need more money cards, a lot less icebreakers (you can drop them all to 1x because you have 3x Special Order and 3x Sacrificial Construct), and the Toolbox is very overpriced.

>>51659282
can you suggest some tweaks?

>>51659031
Cyberfeeder and Stimhack are technically economy cards, so is Armitage. In faction though, notables are Day Job, Queen's Gambit and Liberated Accounts, of which I think Gambit would be best. Out of faction, if Noise, then Cache.

>>51659391
Swap the toolbox for desperado.
Sneakdoor Beta wins games on its own sometimes. I've won plenty of games as Gabe without drawing any cards because I had one.
Crypsis is not necessary in this deck, you have a normal icebreaker suite and Crypsis is sloooow.
Don't be afraid to import breakers from other factions (especially if you only need 1x because you can fetch and protect it).

>>51659256
Best core Programs:
2 corroder, 2 gordian blade, 1 Femme Fatale, 1 Mimic, 2 Datasuckers, 2 Sneakdoor Beta. 1 Deja vu.
Theoretically you could go Yog instead of Gordian. Riskier, but cheaper.

>>51659421
Cyber feeder and Stimhack save credits, they don't GIVE you any.

>>51659495
Are you actually discussing that? It seems a pointless difference when the relevant issue is gaining tempo over the corp.

>>51659517
Both of those cards don't get you money to set up, which is very important.

>>51659560
I'll argue that Cyberfeeder actually helps you setup, as long as you're Noise or playing many virus. And sometimes you don't have time to setup, you need 9 credits burst to break a Firewall and dont have time to get them fluid.
The great thing about the core anarch setup is that it uses a lateral way of paying the runs over sheer fluidity like Criminals and Shapers.
It destroys the ice, uses virus counters as coin, and the setups from Cyberfeeder and stimhack are enough to blast through.

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>>51659560
Rich anarchs were a mistake.

Or, as >>51659618 says, they pay for things differently - if you're custom-rewrite anon from the last thread, one of the anarch themes that has fallen by the wayside (and gone to shaper, who they shared it with) was the idea that anarchs run very cheaply, paid for by alternative methods rather than raw cash advantage. Which is also why scrubber and imp are things.

Actually, I tell a lie about it falling by the wayside - three of anarch's all time most OP cards emphasise this faction-theme: D4v1d does it, Sifr massively does it, and Parashite does it (along with their ice trashing theme)

Anarchs running things like Cyberfeeder, Spinal Modem and and Skulljack (and datasucker, but that's less cool, and moves towards OP) is much better than having them swimming in cash - those cards just need to be a bit better

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>>51659864
Yes, I'm the rework guy (working roject title Nyetrunner).
That's why I like Day Job and Queens Gambit: They aren't the most efficient things in the world, and they have interesting downsides (taking the whole turn, risking the corp getting value from advancements). I don't mean to make them rich, but a single money card wouldn't be too much, I don't think.
Besides, I want to introduce some minor way to splash econ in Core so you don't just take all your faction's and neutral econ in any deck and call it a day.

>>51659618

I'm generally one of the few defenders of CyberFeeder, so not dissing the card, but still, it is true, Anarch in core (and really up to at least Spin I'd say) were really hurting for set up econ.

That said, my hunch is that it was part of the balancing act of core, so I don't know that I'd want to "correct" it.

What rebalance would Hard at Work need to be deemed viable? More credits per click? Zero install cost?

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>>51659934
>so you don't just take all your faction's and neutral econ in any deck and call it a day.
That's literally FFG's advice for your first deck, except it's all neutral cards, not just econ.

Which is actually a pretty good idea, very simple, no worries about influence and things

Good luck with Nyetrunner, I am genuinely interested - though I don't agree with 100% removing parasite's trash, and I think Yog and Mimic should be str 2.
And Morningstar in WLA is the real breaker to complete the suite - it should be better, corroder not as good

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>>51659997
>Zero install cost
No chance, but lower than 5

>>51660024
>That's literally FFG's advice for your first deck, except it's all neutral cards, not just econ.
Oh sure, it would still be passable, but I want it to be a real choice even when you know the game well.

>removing parasite's trash, and I think Yog and Mimic should be str 2.
>And Morningstar in WLA is the real breaker to complete the suite - it should be better, Corroder not as good
All the changes I have mentioned are up in the air and not final even for the first pass. I am aware all of those need changing.

>>51660034

Had to dig an old post:

https://archive.4plebs.org/tg/search/text/Magnum%20opus%20kati%20jones%20hard%20work/

I don't think zero is that unfair to be honest.

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>>51660085
Cool, just airing muh opinions

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>>51660113
In raw power I don't think it'd TOO bad, but as an overall anarch card, especially an early one? [early being important for emphasising where factional weaknesses lie]
Yeah, nah.

That sort of drip econ, even with a click cost, shouldn't be free - I'd rate it at 3, maybe, 2.
Depending on how fast you want the general pace of the game I guess.

Random musing - with how rich runners are right now, is Monolith worth a second look? (first look being Big Girls Play)

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>>51659997
I do this thing where I take the core decks and "develop" them using new cards, but trying to keep the old feeling of the deck.
With Noise what I did was to replace Armitage with Day Job and Access to GlobalSec with I've Had Worse to speed up the deck. I also cut 1 stimhack and 1 cyberfeeder for some more fluidity (I think it was 2 Lucky Find at the time). These changes really helped.
At some point I finally gave in and included 3 Aesops and 3 Cache, because that combo for Noise is just that good. Thank god Cache is Lunar and won't rotate for a year yet.

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>>51660254
>Thank god Cache is Lunar and won't rotate for a year yet.
Outside of Noise, it's been replaced as the best crim virus though - "the runner gains 1/5 of your total money each turn" is BS unless you can jump on it straight away

Huh, after my changes to the anarch rig, they might be the most setup focused of all the factions. And crim becomes even more aggressive. Not sure how I feel about that.

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>>51660342
>And crim becomes even more aggressive
How?

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>>51660342
Huh, the idea I get from the anarch core set is that they are a very setup focused, but they get to that point by snowballing different effects together and being aggressive.

The Crims aggressiveness always felt wrong to me, all because Andromeda stole anarchs breakers for its snowballing effect. It made them more aggressive. And since they were paying with tokens and 0 credits, they were also richer.
I always felt the core Criminals were more planning and cunning. They Siphon you this turn so you can't rez defenses in the remote. They harass HQ for the extra credits and information on access, but they also have Lemuria Codecracker to checkout the servers and ICE without having to run on them. They can play Forged Activation Order on some problematic ICE after the Siphon to ensure access, or just to tax. They can harass remotes with Bank Job and the archives with Sneakdoor Beta to force the Corp to spread defenses. The word for them is misdirection. They play a trick with one hand while the other is picking up your wallet.

>>51660522

Definitely agree with this.

There *is* a side of strong aggression in Crims (I mean, Tenma would make little sense if there were no such side; and then Desperado), but the core of the faction always seemed centered around the idea of running less but running less wasteful: you run when you *know* you're going to hit; you make the corp suffer while waiting: you misdirect and dance around targets.

Just look at the breakers (and/or absence thereof).

>>51658994
Found some iteration of my list, this is missing the latest changes I remember (Chronos Project, Cobra, Rototurret, Blacklist) but I think you can get the idea.

GRNDL: Power Unleashed

Agenda (12)
3x Geothermal Fracking
3x Hostile Takeover
2x Oaktown Renovation
1x Posted Bounty
3x Project Atlas

Asset (9)
2x Aggressive Secretary ●●●●
1x Corporate Town
3x GRNDL Refinery
2x Project Junebug ●●
1x Shattered Remains

Operation (10)
2x Back Channels
2x Power Shutdown
2x Restructure
3x Scorched Earth
1x SEA Source ●●

Barrier (7)
2x Bailiff
2x Ice Wall
3x Spiderweb

Code Gate (4)
2x Wendigo
2x Wormhole

Sentry (7)
2x Archer
3x Nebula
2x Swordsman ●●

10 influence spent (max 10, available 0)
20 agenda points (between 20 and 21)
49 cards (min 45)
Cards up to Democracy and Dogma

Deck built on https://netrunnerdb.com.

>>51660187

I think the biggest issue with Monolith isn't even the cost -ok, not just the cost), it's the holding cards out to maximize profit from install.

If you get full efficiency install, you get 4 cards installed in one click at a 12 credit discount, making monolith 6 credits for 3MU and the damage prevention. The tempo swing is ridiculous.

How would Monolith Baba Yaga work, I wonder?

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>>51660593
I can, though I can't say I can see how you use shutdown?
Just for destruction?

Took me a moment to realise you lacked Our Lord and Saviour

My immediate thought is (sadly) to leave GRNDL and gain Lockdown/Jackson, though it might be a bit cash-strapped

>>51660187
>In raw power I don't think it'd TOO bad, but as an overall anarch card, especially an early one? [early being important for emphasizing where factional weaknesses lie]

But then you have to take into account the reduced utility from the card as the game enfolds. By turn 7, chances are you're not installing it, making it a dead card.
I do think there's has to be something that balances that risk taken at deck building level.

Armitage is better set up econ, and unless the game draws too long (which has been rare for reasons we won't debate again), it's just as good econ period.

>>51660763
>How would Monolith Baba Yaga work, I wonder?
I can only presume Awesomely

Baba, Yog and Breach would cost you 18 with it - Data Folding would be a good shout with the 3MU gain

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>>51660854
>18
20 - one from yog, one from Baba.
And Faerie is free

still saves 10c though.

>>51660784
I already moved to Potential Unleashed, trying to make something that makes me happy, but it's hard.

Some iterations included Jackson, but generally I had no need for him. Most of the time I just used it to get some more econ back in the deck. Power Shutdown is great to trash Faeries and Datasuckers. Also early Corroder, clone chip and Progenitor jank. It's more flexible in Weyland than Best Defense.

>>51660910
Makes sense - though I'd be loathe to trash off R&D without Jackson, I do see how it compares favourably to Best Defence here - though Paperclip is much, much rougher

>>51647937

It wasn't *just* the recursion that pushed Asset Spam into degenerate territory. It was the recursion combined with the increasing number of "must trash" assets. Old NEH, the only things you really *needed* to trash on sight were Jackson, Sansan, and Sponsorship which meant that as the Runner you could spend the occasional turn just moneying up and occasionally check remotes when you suspected the aforementioned assets. If you didn't find the right remotes, then the Corp typically got their shot to FA something out and set back up, but it very much allowed both sides to set up a back and forth. Now you have all of those *plus* the Politicals which even with lower trash cost than the rest you just cannot leave alone because of how quickly they get out of hand, plus the Mumba/MCH/Museum set *plus* Jeeves. Even outside of prison builds there are just too many high-value assets which need to be answered *immediately* these days. The recursion is definitely the biggest factor in there, but even that wouldn't be nearly as bad if there weren't so many different things *to* recur.

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>>51660987
Yeah, that's why Jackson was in and out so much.
During Flashpoint I played a Rigshooter BoN and Jackson was in there to recur the Prisecs. The Power Shutdown trashing? If an agenda was shot down I let the Runner steal it to later play Stock Buy-Back if needed.
You can already tell the Rigshooter core was already phasing to something else. Half the ambushes were gone and the code gates reduced. I couldn't make myself comfortable with a 44 deck, the numbers doesn't add up to what I expect in the deck.

Weyland Consortium: Builder of Nations

Agenda (12)
1x Chronos Project
3x Geothermal Fracking
3x Hostile Takeover
2x Posted Bounty
3x Project Atlas

Asset (4)
2x Aggressive Secretary ●●●●
2x Jackson Howard ●●

Upgrade (3)
3x Prisec

Operation (11)
2x Ark Lockdown ●●●●
3x Hedge Fund
1x Power Shutdown
3x Scorched Earth
2x Stock Buy-Back

Barrier (5)
3x Asteroid Belt
2x Ice Wall

Code Gate (3)
1x Wendigo
2x Wormhole

Sentry (6)
3x Archer
1x Cobra
1x Rototurret ●
1x Swordsman ●

12 influence spent (max 12, available 0)
18 agenda points (between 18 and 19)
44 cards (min 40)
Cards up to Escalation

Deck built on https://netrunnerdb.com.

>Account Siphon
>1 cost, 4 inf
>Make a run on HQ. If successful, instead off accessing cards, you may force the corp to lose up to 3c, then gain 2c for each one lost this way, take 1 tag.
Is this too much of a nerf?

https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/news/2017/2/10/the-impetus-of-evolution/

>>51661368
>makes a few game prototypes
>gets a job on a major company straight as the design lead
A true role model.

>>51661448
There's "was talking to a korean company about muh game", but yeah, he does seem a bit of an outsider and new guy to the industry.

On the other hand, Damon wasn't and we got Rumour Mill and Sifr, so...

>>51661503
All I'm saying is I'm extremely jelly, he's living the dream.
His interview seems promising, though.

>>51661503
At the very least Flashpoint (including the FAQ stuff) was a lot bolder and aggressive compared to the previous cycles, so I hope this guy follows suit in some way and not be so conservative so as to go back to advanced only when rezzed ice and Lycan levels of design.

>>51661661
I get the feeling that the balancing of new cards doesn't fully fall on the designer hands, as one of the latest interviews with Damon suggests that some cards were turned up or down more than he like.

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>>51661661
He's said he likes junebug and other hidden info, that's a start

He's also said there need's to be more diversity at the top, and that Weyland could do with a hand, so he's hitting all the right notes

>>51661721
I imagine that's part of the reason he wanted to not be lead designer any more

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>>51661147
>I couldn't make myself comfortable with a 44 deck, the numbers doesn't add up to what I expect in the deck.
Yeah, 44 in Weyland, especially with the amount of options the corp has now (and the threats they have to prepare for) may be a bit of a trap - you get consistency pretty good with 49, after all

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>>51660330
It's excellent to force a virus purge too.

>>51660330
Are you the guy that keeps up getting the new illustrations? Can you upload them all somewhere? Like mega or something. I think my collection is stuck in SanSan with just a few from Mumbad and Flashpoint.

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>>51664961
>Are you the guy that keeps up getting the new illustrations?
Yeah kind of, but only because I'll randomly look up the artists from time to time.

And there's a part of me that wants to ask artists who've put up like 1 of their pieces about the rest of them, but that's more effort.

And in some cases creating new profiles on things like deviantart

>>51664854
Yep - people using sac con for it is just obnoxious

...hmm, Imma have to try that in Geist

Will have to see, but Mr Stone leaving just as rotation hits is going to cold shower a lot of people I fear, and tip the scales as far as the number of people who'll stop upgrading post rotation is concerned.

Oh well, we'll see.

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>>51665505
>Mr Stone leaving just as rotation hits
Mr Stone is just coming into the game, he's in Terminal Directive

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>>51667547
He's an odd one Donut - 3c and 2 inf seems a lot for a card that hits you too - though Dr Lovegood can mitigate that.

Somewhen or somewhere I heard he's based on someone, but IDK any of those "somes"

Interesting flavour text though
>You can find Donut in the park on Thursday afternoons, playing backgammon. You want his attention, the price is always the same: a cup of coffee and a donut. That buys you a seat at the backgammon table, and you have until he beats you to talk business and set the price.

He'll always be around if you need to jack up the cost of operations though, seeing as he's H&P

>>51665667

Well, yeah, I have high hopes for that card. Probably just can't live up to the hype.

>>51668654

I liked him. Played him in a janky no event Reina deck taxing EVERYTHING. With Donut, Reina, Xanadu/Rook... silly fun.

>>51669707
Now I want to make that deck.
I always wanted to play Donut but I rely very much on events.

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>>51669707
>>51673051
Tax Everything! Does sound fun, though Donut makes siphon and vamp a bit less economical.

But you could forego them and use Cortez, his chip and Xanadu to make rezzing ice hell.

Also makes me wonder if there's a criminal deck rich enough to use the birbs for rez taxing.
Or if Running Interference will ever be more than just a big inside job

>>51669707

Forgot Chakana/Fester on the list.

>>51673051

Interesting training to make an event-less deck. Kinda like the reverse of playing Criminal program-less deck, I guess.

>>51673210
>Also makes me wonder if there's a criminal deck rich enough to use the birbs for rez taxing.

I believe between Los, Keros McIntyre, Temujin, and a London Library/LLDS Processor set up (not to mention Autoscripter in faction) there's probably enough support to attempt it. Leaving Sifr out of it for now.

I was thinking... would be nice to get more cards like the Caïssa suite (and the upcoming Egret) that gives the corp incentive for trashing its own cards. Well, the other way round we've got MCA Informant.

Anybody tried playing "Commander" in Netrunner? Not so much about the Commander bit but the restriction of playing with singles.

>>51674152
I don't think the 1050~ cardpool is big enough to make this viable.

>>51674152
30/34 deck size might be doable, regular 45/49 size might be a stretch. Plus there's always the problem of high agenda density in low card count decks corp side.

>>51660593
If you're taking GRNDL Id try to fit in some Dedication Ceremonies, maybe instead of restructure or Back Channels?

Can't wait for 42 to appear. It would be nice to have a much simpler game mode where Crims/Big W don't suck, and Anarchs/NBN are not in the picture.

>>51674378

I still think Crim "sucking" is way of an overstatement.

W has issues, but to hear people you'd think they were unplayable.

>>51674378
Crims aren't bad, it's just that most of their decks are less flashy compared to big Medium digs, trashing all the ice, long ass turns, and mid run shenanigans. As for Weyland, I don't know, they're not winning any tournaments but rushing out agendas is still winning games, if variable in effectiveness, and Titan FA is pretty cool.

>>51673210

Iain can get pretty damn rich with a full drip setup.

>>51675390
>>51675240

Crims has virtually no recursion compared to shapers/anarchs, which is especially serious when facing rig destruction decks (Batty is still around due to a shocking lack of space kittens) and/or any 1k cuts decks.

>>51675847
Sure, but having a bad match-up versus certain decks hardly makes a whole faction "suck", especially the faction that most often can win before you need breakers at all. Recursion is what you should be using your influence for anyway, if not ways to win faster.

Besides, be careful what you wish for, Anarch got to where they are because people moaned they were unplayable. Rather than getting more recursion I'd rather more varieties of Crim decks to be enabled instead of the usual good stuff builds with slight tweaks.

>>51676092
Crim I think has a couple of decent builds - you can hammer runs, or sit back and strike strategically. And then there's Geist as well

>>51677243
Why are you single out Geist? Isn't he from the second group?

>>51645574
Suddenly my dump shocks and Future Perfects into archives and rez Fumiko kill deck got a whole lot easier.

>>51677775
In between - with tem as a common include and his mad draw I don't think he fits as being as strategic as Iain and leela

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Man, I'm rebuilding my old Iain Stirling deck now that I have Sec Nexus and Quorum.
Long story short, I really want to add Tapwrm so the Corp is forced to choose between giving me money or a whole new turn of triggers from my money cards.

My Nexus Hopper (Quorum)

Iain Stirling: Retired Spook

Event (7)
1x "Freedom Through Equality"
3x Calling in Favors
3x Hostage

Hardware (10)
3x Dyson Mem Chip
2x e3 Feedback Implants
1x HQ Interface
1x Security Nexus ●●●
3x Sports Hopper

Resource (20)
1x Aaron Marrón
1x Citadel Sanctuary
1x Data Dealer
3x Data Folding
1x Drug Dealer
3x Fall Guy
1x Film Critic ●
1x Globalsec Security Clearance ●●
1x Kati Jones
3x Power Tap
1x The Supplier
3x Underworld Contact

Icebreaker (7)
1x Golden
1x GS Sherman M3 ●●
1x Mongoose
3x Overmind
1x ZU.13 Key Master ●●

Program (2)
2x Grappling Hook

10 influence spent (max 10, available 0)
46 cards (min 45)
Cards up to Quorum

Deck built on https://netrunnerdb.com.

>>51679703

I always enjoy those Stirling connections with loads of one-offs.

Golden/Mongoose... seeing that pair pop more and more recently.

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>>51680431
I know, right? Theoretically Mongoose gets replaced by Golden at midgame, but more often than not Overmind/Mongoose and the occasional Grappling Hook is enough.
And now with Security Nexus I suppose that one Killer will have to go.

>>51676092

Well, crims are also pretty bad vs glacier decks, which will probably still exist even with Sifr around, and thus by extension HB in general, so it's not just problems with Jinteki.

And if crims are at least the same power level as anarchs, then at least we will see *some* diversity in winning faction percentages.

I'm coming into netrunner after playing magic and I'm trying to get some people I know into it.
I personally enjoy playing slower, grindier games so I ended up using my core set to make a glacier-esque HB deck and a slow ass Kate deck.

I want to both get used to more newer cards and test out a wider variety of decks considering how different this game is from what I'm used to, so I was wondering if I could get suggestions for some up to date decks that are a little on the aggressive side that I could proxy up, to familiarize myself with newer cards.

If possible I'd also rather they have a relatively close to even matchup against each other, because I'm trying to get more people around me into the game and as I'm the only one with cards right now the decks will probably be played against each other frequently, and it'd be pretty shit to have a 70/30 matchup.

>>51682697
Sifr, Rumor Mill, Interdiction, Councilman, and PolOp are all valid for glacier match ups that use the usual Caprice + Ash combo. I guess I just can't really see where the how Criminals are weak since I'm used to seeing them find ways to hit hard at opportune moments. Perhaps because they can't be auto-piloted to a win?

And I don't know if the solution to faction diversity should be to pump up other factions, especially with corps at a low right now. I wonder if there's data somewhere that lists winning percentages for each faction. J-net used to have them didn't they?

>>51684092
There's a page that lists common and strong archetypes that emerged over the years floating around on reddit maybe look around for that? There are too many match up possibilities to list, so it's probably best to ask here when you find decks you're interested in.

>>51684092

The upcoming Terminal Directive box (aka '42') is arguably/hopefully the most newbie friendly purchase alongside the initial single core set, although only 4/7 of the factions are really supported. It can't come soon enough.

Does anyone have a pdf of The Worlds of Android?

>>51684786

Of these, only Sifr might see common use in Crims, since the others all have their own issues. Employee strike sees more use then rumour mill even in anarchs, and are hard to recur (need to burn a SoT), while councilman/PoOp can both be played around with.

>>51685513

There was a link in the previous thread iirc. Or the one before that. Good hunting.

Has anyone cubed in netrunner?
Was it an enjoyable experience?

>>51686224

It's pretty fun yeah, although it can take a while to actually get the drafted decks together before the actual games can start, which is something to take into consideration if playtime is limited.

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>>51684092

If you don't already have the big expansion boxes, I would highly recommend those. They all give each faction some relatively good cards and some cards in there are especially good cross faction *cough cough* clone chip *cough cough*. Since you're enjoying HB and Kate, you might want to pick up Creation and Control first, since it will give you cards for both of those factions.

As far as newer decks, check out netrunnerdb and look at some of the 2017 store champion decks. Even some of the 2016 decks will still be relevant for a little while longer.

>>51685513
From previous thread:

WoA:
https://mega.nz/#!KwklySAT!1Cyj-E2K4rVN-WvfLBzykoqACFeKHH6gPAUEsuQYbk4

Missing Pages:
https://mega.nz/#!bl0XkKoZ!5Jf4OyhUcYXLgiwjXS6MQkRskiQosPhhMFq8lBrfo_w

>>51685897
>while councilman/PoOp can both be played around with.

While I understand where you're coming from, the fact that we have to list "can be played around with" as a defect, and not see it as a good thing in design is saddening.

>>51687190

The worst part is that even if the crim manages to win all the psi games and get into that server, the Jinteki (or idk, HB?) player can always shrug and play friends to recur both Batty and Caprice to that same server anyway. Hooray.

>>51687693

But then timing: you can run only when you know you have to (expose), trash Caprice/Batty mid -run (PolOp), and the corp can sure recur it, but only to rearm the server after the deed is done, which I don't find totally unfair..

Feels bad when your deck concept fails and you have to acknowledge playing a different ID or choose different cards is the better choice.

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>>51689512
Why? Most of the time for me it happens because I need so many pieces on board that it's either too slow/expensive.
For example, Valencia with Itinerant Protesters. You need to keep giving bad pub to the corp, but the options are usually IJ, which takes a full turn, or Frame Job, which needs an agenda to forfeit, usually fan sites. And that's a lot of clicks.

>>51689512

While it does, there's still learning in the process (if only experience for use in sealed/draft)... not to mention hopes to get it back later on with new cards spicing things up .

My Underway/Student Loans deck was a failure (though some fun interactions), but I'm definitely going back to it once TD hits.

Also: I much prefer losing a an interesting game to winning a boring one.

Unrelated, but people role-playing their runners can be scary. I'm never looking at Geist the same way ever again... "We control the horizontal, and the vertical..."

God I love Populist rally when timed right ("hope you weren't expecting to purge, NA/FA that card now").

>>51689612
>Unrelated, but people role-playing their runners can be scary. I'm never looking at Geist the same way ever again... "We control the horizontal, and the vertical..."
Please, go on

>>51689702

Not going to be fun in text form, but Geist as the wannabe tough guy /fit geek with helium-high pitched voice, obviously fake german accent and overplayed super sentai body movements with definitely no gay undertones... is... well it's something.

>>51689809
Isn't he the leader of Los Muertos or at least a high ranking member? He's got the tatoos and is called "tech lord" as if he's either a big name black market merchant or the Los Muertos supplier.

>>51689597
Yeah, was more or less the same in my case. The original draft was a PU semi-glacier with Valley Grid, using it and Curfew to reduce the Runner's hand size. But in the end getting to the kill condition is basically a pipe dream, and the standard Nisei + Caprice is just better. Plus I don't have a lot of cards that can utilize PU's mill well. Probably going to switch to Palana, maybe with the meat grinder plan I had for my BoN deck. Definitely need something to bait runs though.

>>51689861

Didn't save the list, but I ran a rush Biotech deck with Nisei MkII, Improved Protein Source, and Genetic Resequencing (to rearm the Nisei), Caprice and Valley Grid. Cheap (relatively) gearcheck strict ETR ICE of all three types.

Base idea is that the runner can't run a three-deep Valley Grid remote twice without dying from negative hand.

At three points, with Clones Are Not People on the table, any NA card puts you at potential match point, the runner *has* to run.

Fun deck.

>>51689849
>Isn't he the leader of Los Muertos or at least a high ranking member?

Hence the fake German accent.

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>>51689849
https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/news/2015/7/2/viva-los-muertos/
IIRC, he's the quartermaster of the gang.

>>51689861
Valley Grid is pretty fun. Back in SanSan I used it to set up a bunch of cheap gearcheck (Quandary, Himitsu Bako) to stack up the kill condition. I needed 4 because then I'd use The Brewery to finish him off. Cerebral Overwriter and Edge of World were fun ambushes there.
Of course, no runner would run the server after it was set up, and Criminals were a bitch to catch because bypass effects. Parasites were expected, so I had a surplus of cheap etr to keep stacking.

Suggestions?
I only have 2 Hedge Funds for this deck because of reasons.
I started with the Mutate combo (the one from the Xmen Legends deck), but it looks like a pain to start when all ICE I keep getting are the expensive ones and I have nothing to mutate to. So I said "Fuck it, full econ" and went Mumbad Temple and Launch Campaign instead.

Bonsai

Jinteki: Potential Unleashed

Agenda (10)
3x Fetal AI
3x House of Knives
1x Philotic Entanglement
3x The Future Perfect

Asset (18)
1x Chief Slee ●●●
2x Jackson Howard ●●
3x Launch Campaign
3x Mumba Temple ○○○○○ ○
3x Shock!
3x Snare!
3x Sundew

Upgrade (1)
1x Caprice Nisei

Operation (5)
3x Celebrity Gift
2x Hedge Fund

Barrier (3)
1x Chiyashi
2x Vanilla

Code Gate (7)
2x Aiki
2x DNA Tracker
1x Mind Game
2x TL;DR ●●●●

Sentry (5)
2x Komainu
1x Susanoo-no-Mikoto
2x Tsurugi

9 influence spent (max 12, available 3)
20 agenda points (between 20 and 21)
49 cards (min 45)
Cards up to Quorum

Deck built on https://netrunnerdb.com.

>>51690142
Btw, all my Jinteki decks are called Bonsai while they are a WIP.

>>51651952
>>51652638

I would not be surprised if they repurposed the 40k RPG system for Android now that they lost the GW license. If you change out the Psyker tables for some hacking stuff, it's pretty much good to go.

>>51690239
I don't know, I see them more likely to couple it with the Star Wars/Warhammer Fantasy system, with all the fancy dice and stuff.

>>51690239

That would be pretty good for Dark Heresy style games, given that New Angeles is pretty much a proper Hive at this point.

>>51689957
>>51689991
Had pretty much the same idea, except Encrypted Portals and lots of cheap Code Gates helped make runs pretty taxing. I didn't have any good damage closers like Ronin or a 3rd Neural though, so getting the kill is pretty hard. Plus I guess I didn't really go all in with the Valley plan, which probably contributed.

>>51688678

You can't Pol Op Batty. He gets to trash himself in the same window he teases before Pol Op gets to fire. He needs to be Councilman'd. And even then if they see the Councilman they'll rez Caprice first. And I have yet to see a deck that has the deck space to run Pol Op and Councilman together, let alone in large enough quantities to keep up with recurred upgrades.

>>51691203

*Rezzes rather

>>51691203
>You can't Pol Op Batty

Course you can, he needs to be rezzed beforehand. That's what Interdiction is for.

>>51690142
I'm guessing you're working on a limited card pool? What's Chief Slee for? Just to benefit from TL;DR into 3+ subs ice? Straight econ might be better over Mumba Temple since you don't have any assets to rez, and they'll likely get trashed before you can rez ice with them. Seeing as your agenda is kill oriented, not having anything to close the game with is pretty eh too. If you have the cards, maybe Ronin + Dedication Ceremony?

>>51691446
I'm only missing Up and over, All that remains and Fear the masses.
Chief Slee is mostly for novelty really. I needed a finisher but I didn't want to deal with the setup of Ronin + Dedication Ceremony, and Neural EMP was getting old. I also thought of Georgia Emelyov.
I was considering TL;DR because anything it doubles it's going to hurt a lot. 8 subs Tsurugi, double Komainu, DNA Tracker. But I'm reconsidering it and thinking of Macrophage instead. TL;DR needs to puts the Runner in a lot of pressure to run blindly on something like that, just like Chum.
Mumba Temple can also pay for ICE, which is why it's there.
I also swapped Launch Campaign for Turtlebacks.

>>51692235
Turtlebacks, so you're going full asset spam then? Going down 1 or 2 ice, then getting Friends and Bioethics in would be ideal, unless you're intentionally trying to pull away from the most ideal build. You could maybe double down on the Slee strategy and get another Slee, Friends to recur her, currents to turn off Rumor Mill, and some more TL;DR fit ice. Macrophage is great for Slee, even more so with TL;DR. Don't think you have enough influence for a Data Ward. Maybe Neural for softening the runner up too. Singleton Caprice for those rare scoring moments I suppose?

Speaking of Chum, 1-of Chum, or 1-of Cell Portal?

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>>51692849
After these changes I still have 4 cards to cut, still with no currents though. I have to think this harder.
Yes, Singleton Caprice might be useful for that, and also it was a gift from a friend, the full art Caprice from the tournament pack.

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>>51695582
If Force of Nature costed 2-3 credits. Would you consider it? Cost-wise is similar to Keymaster, adding a single credit when the number of subroutines is odd. I know next to Yog just isn't worth it, but forget about Yog for a second.

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>>51695582
Logically, a 1 to boost, potentially 1 to break icebreaker shouldn't be as bad as that is.

I think it's the strength, more than anything, there's very few code gates that low, whereas barriers and sentries both do.

That and, as >>51695924 says, the install cost

It's kind of amazing how Aurora has almost the same stats as Sherman at first, but multisub kills it so badly.

>>51696011
I'm conflicted with Aurora in core because Corroder breaks Wall of Static for 2, while this breaks it for 4.

>>51687029
Thanks a lot.

>>51691314

That still comes back to the same issue stated above even if you do pull off the successful run. And if you do run interdiction (instead of emp strike), clone retirement is getting a lot more common in jinteki decks. So yeah, you steal one agenda at best, and then you are stuck unless you can pressure RnD like mad.

Incidentally, with macrophage a thing, mediums is getting harder to justify using over RDIs.

>>51697418
RDI is cycling out soon though

>>51697451
Thank fuck for that. Passive multi access you don't need to work for was bullshit

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>>51696630
Even with single sub ice, you'd have to get a theoretical piece that's 7 strength with 1 sub before it'll break more efficient than corroder.

The numbers in netrunner are surprisingly tight - generally, anyway.
Especially regarding strengths

>>51697579
HQI is staying in, but that 'aint so bad.

>>51697418
>That still comes back to the same issue stated above even if you do pull off the successful run.

Certainly. And as I said above, I find the "issue" is relatively fair. You can't really have it both ways and complain that Rumor Mill kills all upgrade plays, and then complain that the fairly balanced alternatives don't kill them well enough.

>Incidentally, with macrophage a thing, mediums is getting harder to justify using over RDIs.

If anything, I'd say with the high link/power tap builds, Crims can probably afford it better than other right now.

>>51697403

You're welcome. Some anon (who's more deserving of the thanks) put some hard work getting it to us, might as well make sure it falls into the right hands.

>>51697723
Huh? But HQI is in Genesis. Or is there a different version coming in TD or something

>>51697901
Oops my bad. For some reason I thought HQI was in honor and profit.

>>51697723

Cycling out too. The only hardware Interface staying is Archives.

Other than that, we'll have to make do with the event versions (Maker's Eye/Legwork - I guess Information Stifling goes there too) and Turning Wheel/Neutralize All Threats/The Gauntlets.

I also dig the non-strict replacements.like Maya, Top Hat or Equivocation.

>>51697992
Is there going to be an R&D version of The Gauntlet?

>>51698129

I don't know. But given aforementioned list of non-strict replacements (to which you could add Find the Truth/GlobalSec Security Clearance, I guess) , I'm thinking (hoping) no.

Just speculation though.

>>51697756

Power tap is pretty good until
you meet that MN deck with that Door kicking current.

Also, crims again can't really afford to lean on rumor mill when they are so tight on influence as it is. Being forced to rely on 'balanced alternatives' isn't helping their case much.

>>51697451

That is true, so that leaves turning wheel for semi-reliable multi-access once that happens.

>>51697579

Sadly, macrophage is far less of an issue to medium abusing anarchs (and maybe Shapers) due to that particular console everyone loves to hate.

>>51698253
I remember a Red Sand card that tackle the multiaccess topic. Trashable resource that access 1 extra card for each tag.
I'd look for it but I'm on the phone. Counter-surveillance maybe?

>>51698312

I'm not seeing how Door-to-Door+ Making News would hinder a power Tap + Link build, if anything it should help enable it. What am I missing? (just in case, no sarcasm here, if you're mentioning it, you probably met that deck and suffered from it, but as is I'm not genuinely not why you would)

>Also, crims again can't really afford to lean on rumor mill when they are so tight on influence as it is.

Which is beside the point. I'm not saying crims should use Rumor Mill. I'm saying if you're complaining about Rumor Mill but find the fair alternatives are not good enough, I don't know what you want. You said it yourself. The set up mentioned was good enough for that *one* run. And I don't think it should give anything more than that. It's fairly costed for what it does.

>Sadly, macrophage is far less of an issue to medium abusing anarchs (and maybe Shapers) due to that particular console everyone loves to hate.

Oh god yeah, with the gentleman's agreement here and no one playing it, I totally forgot to account for that one.

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>>51698557

Yes, Counter Surveillance.

I really dig that one. One time use. Versatile with some neat tricky use (selective server access for one - say Archives or ignore a PriSec in a remote). Seems fairly costed to me (though Mars for Martians might make me swallow that back).

>>51687190

You have to consider just how miserable the Caprice/Batty combo is though. Caprice by herself? Sure. Pol Op handles her. Just Batty? Councilman can be played around, but he's a one-shot and (and this is the biggest factor here) he's not *self protecting* Batty can do some degenerate things if you're good at Psi games, but neither Batty nor Ash really *require* a specialized card to deal with them. With Ash, I can at least trash him and even if he comes back I know to just money up before I try to get in there again (which often buys the Corp enough time to get a new scoring window anyway) and you can run the Corp out of Battys. Having things like Pol Op or Councilman *helps*, but isn't necessitated. Until you combine them with Caprice. Dealing with them both requires so many silver bullets that it's just not sustainable since you can feasibily deal with one, still get locked out, and just see the one you dealt with get recurred. It's not just that Pol Op and Councilman can be played around. It's that they can be played around with *nothing to show for it*.

>>51698609

I also don't see how he was complaining about Rumor Mill, it seemed more like he was observing that not a lot of Crims run it (Likely because they can't due to influence problems or because they need Strike more to nullify problem IDs.)

>>51698609

If door kicker can play the current on turn 1-2, it can grind you down a lot faster then the tap setup unless you get them all out yourself immediately, which incidentally makes you poor and sad, especially when a-tech appears and counters the same taps.

>>51699320
>I also don't see how he was complaining about Rumor Mill

I don't know that anon was complaining, but given *I* was the one to bring Rumor Mill in that sub-conversation I took anon's answer as addressing that. Maybe I was wrong.

As I said, I don't get the "Rumor Mill is bad because it nukes it all" complaints coupled with "PolOp/Councilman/Interdiction tri-fecta is bad because the other player can play around". I would hope so.

We players almost sounds schizophrenic at times.

>You have to consider just how miserable the Caprice/Batty combo is though.

It is. But then Interdiction allows you to force the corp to pre-rez both. You can trash Caprice before going, then at worse that's one more run needed.
I guess the best part of it for competitive players is that it has six months to go.

>>51699336

But then that's true of mostly any non-tag me deck beside the Link/tap one, and that one is better equipped than the alternatives - specifically so - to deal with the issue.

>>51699890

A set-up scoring server by Palana/RP is not something most crims can run multiple times without seriously draining their credit pool. Interdiction can be annoying, but it ultimately doesn't 'solve' that problem reliably enough to matter over a tourney for instance.

So yeah, in the end, crims generally still have a bad time vs Jinteki glacier.

>better equipped

IF it fully sets up first before doors get knocked in. Otherwise, which is sadly too often for comfort, it's advantages as such effectively does nothing.

>>51700167
>IF it fully sets up first before doors get knocked in

But then again, this is not specific to the link/tap set up. Mostly ANY deck that isn't tag me will suffer from it, and the Link/tap set up will make it easier to withstand/endure. Until it makes the whole thing counterproductive for the corp even.

See the original sentence I was addressing:

>Power tap is pretty good until you meet that MN deck with that Door kicking current.

I don't see how that MN/DtD set up hoses link/Power tap specifically. If anything, it impacts it less, doesn't it?

>A set-up scoring server by Palana/RP is not something most crims can run multiple times without seriously draining their credit pool.
>Interdiction can be annoying, but it ultimately doesn't 'solve' that problem reliably enough to matter over a tourney for instance.

And how is that not good? In our current debate of corp being "neutered" and struggling to cope and catch up with overpowered runner cards, of runner - and crims especially - being too rich , I find I much prefer the idea of cards that make things possible, but not certain. The equilibrium of the game is better closer to that that point.

Corps complain they can't play glacier without upgrades. They need to DOUBLE defensive upgrade a server to *attempt* a score in your example - it's not even certain here, and instead of thinking that it's good the runner has counter-plays, but ones that demand a perfectly fair investment on their part too - and still leaves the corp some leeway, the complaint is that they should be reliable too?

But then at the same when the runners do get that reliable solution - Rumor Mill - well all hell breaks lose and people are out with pitchforks to demand a ban.

As I said, it's schizophrenic to me.

>>51700695

The door knocker is most powerful if it gets the current and stuff going at the very early game, and much less so if the runner (including taps) has a chance to set up first. So yeah taps isn't particularly disadvantaged as implied, but even they don't enjoy their main trick if they get kicked down first.

>crims too rich

That has always been the case ideally, but now anarchs are rich as well, with the added advantages of not worrying if key components gets trashed, which remains the perennial problem for crims which again they can't solve easily compared to everyone else.

Which comes back to the original point of crims being, let's just say nowhere near as awesome as Anarchs and even Shapers.

Is there anything out there for comparing economy cards that's like ice.securitytesting.com is for comparing breakers?
I want an easy to access resource that compares credits per click ratios and shit.

>>51701719
ice.emergencyshutdown.net *
my bad

>>51701496

As I said in my recent... let's go with anarch problem recap: the positions of Anarchs and Crims have been reversed from first year and a half in terms of being able to abuse the other faction toys while keeping their best stuff close enough to the chest (don't mention Sifr)..

And trust me, as a dedicated Anarch player, I deplore it.

To which you have to add of course so much of Crim's color pie being ignored/neutered (though on that last point the Howard issue has been getting better... and well is going to be solved in a few months. I wonder how people will look at Fisk by then. With proper support, I don't see him making a comeback the way Whizzard did, but he certainly has potential to be *good*). But we've been through that already too.

Honestly, I don't think Crims are in that bad a spot right now.
I still think they *do* need some high influence power cards released. Not just in the so-called "tier 1" sense (though yeah in that sense too I guess), but also in that "I want to play the shit out of that" sense. Things like.. I don't know Encore? 4 influence, potentially real good, but not something you really want to import outside of faction (unless *very* specific plan), and something that makes you enthused about playing the faction. Most of the people playing Encore right now as far as I can see are are playing it in faction, and not playing it because it's tier1... they're playing it because the idea is ridiculous. It's fun. AND it's powerful. AND it *belongs* to the faction.

When was the last time the community as whole looked at a crim card that way?

As much as I love Information Sifting, as much fun as I got out of it, it's not that kind of card.

Even upcoming cards. You look at Exploit, you think "wow, cool... two influence".

To think that the highest influence crim card of Flashpoint is... Recon Drone? Makes any sense to anyone right now?

>>51701719

If this exists I've never seen it...

Acoo.net allows you to list cards by rez or/and trash cost. Do the later, then the former, and you'll have all assets in a decent order to evaluate - from cheaper to rez to higher, and then for each asset of the same cost, from the most expansive to trash to the least.

That's a decent start I guess.

>>51701917

Crims might be more favoured if their popularly stolen (lel) signature cards are limited to just crims alone. Or at the absolute bare minimum set to max 5 inf.

It also a nerf of sorts to Anarchs without the need for any (drastic) changes on their side.

>>51702256
I wouldn't want to see any runner cards completely limited to a certain faction

>>51698680

It's like a double-click version of makers/legwork, but evidently MUCH better assuming one is already floating a lot of tags and is moderately rich.

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>>51699320
Caprice/Batty/Ash are only really a problem for crim because their Deluxe came at the height of their power and FFG sucks at balancing cards, especially potentially powerful ones.

Reduce the click cost by 1, make it clickless and take a tag - maybe with a little money - and it could be usable.
But no

>>51702455

Just curious, why not if I may ask?

>>51705523

Their deluxe came at a time where they haven't actually been receiving decent cards for a while though. And not for a while after that either...

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>>51705896
No they hadn't - their cards around that time, including their big box, were kind of lame.

But they were still on top of their game

>>51705523
The entire point of this card is to say "click, click, boom" out loud. It's a joke card masquerading as a real one.

>>51706604
Tfw I never thought of that.

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>>51706604
Yeah but they did it properly with a real card that actually works and shit.

Would you play the gun if it was one click?
If it was clickless, but took 1c and a tag? (might be OP against caprice and sysops)

>>51705523

Frankly they're a problem for Shaper, too, as Shaper has *no* native tools that interact with Caprice that I'm currently aware of.

>>51707843

If you exclude Rumor Mill, what solutions do Anarchs have?

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>>51707843
Not directly, no, though bonus clicks and recursion help for both of them

>>51707926

Well I'm not excluding Rumor Mill. That basically *is* Anarch's answer. Beyond that... Quest Completed maybe? But I think that's rotating anyway.

>>51707933

Against Batty and Ash maybe but not Caprice, which is the issue.

>>51709181
Is Caprice still an issue?

She can only be in one place at one time, and she's at least fairly vulnerable - use econ-war if you really want to beat her (hence the extra clicks helping)

>>51707926
>>51709007

And actually as far as Ash is concerned Anarchs do have Singularity. Batty by himself as I mentioned before is self-trashing and ergo is far less of an issue when he's not lurking behind Caprice.

>>51709007

I was hoping you'd go there yourself by asking to ignore Rumor Mill (which is a problem card because it's too good, too wide)...

Counter plays Anarchs have?
Anti econ. PSI/Trace games mean nothing if they can't pay for it.
Central disruption. It's cool the corp has all those tools, but if they never reach the board, then it's all for naught.
Board destruction.

That leaves a lot of options actually when framed that way (Hacktivist/Hemorrhage/Wanton: can't rez those cards if you don't have cards in HQ, and if you want to preemptively -rez you need to install any sensitive card first to not risk it trashed). Singularity.

Things, Shapers have that helps? R&D deep dig. That alone has been the best Caprice solution to the game for a long while.

Seeing single cards as solutions is a problem in itself. It's asking for more silver bullets.

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NEWS!
https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/news/2017/2/13/your-clearance-has-been-granted/

Ken wasn't bullshitting too much!

>>51710624
Wow. Seidr is bullshit

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>>51710624
My hype train is accelerating with no breaks

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>>51710692
Gotta be the second best executive in the game?

>>51710624
Colossus is my jam.

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>>51710712
He's not so good, but cool AF.

Prisec becomes even better

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>>51710725
Looks nice - I'm especially loving the double bonus from advancing

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>>51710762
Soooo, given it's non-unique... Triple Black Level Clearance anyone?

Better than 12c worth of ice, that's for sure

>>51710762
Fucking nice. I hope there's more ice using the Mausolus template in future

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>>51710819
Hortum is in TD too

>>51710831
My dick. I know what my next weyland deck is gonna have in it

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This isn't a world-beater, but it looks like a cute little ambush.
Fires everywhere too

>>51710968
Honestly it doesn't seem to be worth the deck slot.

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>>51710993
Yeah it's not amazing, but I could see it in spam or something

Hmm, seeing as pic related is the background for >>51710791's text, I'm wondering about that big diamond chip in Hunter-Seeker's panel

>>51710968

Should add a tag, to match the honeypot definition

>>51709271

She's not all that vulnerable because of the aforementioned Batty plays. She's *self-protecting*. You invested resources with nothing to show for it explicitly because you lost a dice roll that was essentially 2/3 odds against you to begin with. And this is something that you have to go through every time you hit that server *just to deal with her*, forget what else is in the server for now. This is *just* to be able to interact with Caprice. Batty can do that, too, but he's a one shot. I can get bumped out with nothing to show for it, yes, but after that he's dealt with and I'm still burning resources to get back into that server. Same thing with Ash. Even if he can keep me out of the rest of the server I can still interact with *him*. And assuming I have the credits I'm going to have to trash him meaning I'm still probably not getting back into that server that turn. And make no mistake, a recurred Batty or Ash are still plenty frustrating to see, but I know if I still have a chance, though chances are the time it's cost me will hurt a lot.

Now with that in mind you have to pay through the ICE every time you want to go after Caprice's server. Now also consider that most times this is sitting at the end of a two-three, ICE deep server. Unless you get *extremely* lucky and get it right on the very first psi game that means that for every failed attempt there, that is resources funneled into absolutely nothing. Now realize that even if you *win* the Psi game, if anything stops you from accessing Caprice, be it losing a follow up Batty Psi game, an Ash, a Mk. II token... Anything at all, and that whole process starts all over again. Now if Caprice wasn't self-protecting (and by extension all the other upgrades behind her) that would be much less an issue. I'm fine with multiple upgrades each being their own run multiplier, but when one upgrade can do that by itself and still fall back on the others when it finally stops working, I see an issue there.

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>>51711091
Yeah, it's probably not good enough, but at least it's an attempt.
Also liking that it's totally free

Oh god, Skorpios + Housekeeping. That's going to suck so, so much

>>51711072
This one

>>51711224
5c says it's shaper hardware.

>>51711326
Nah, clearly going to be some weyland blood diamonds used for some fancy computing

Skorpios has me terribly hype.
Kinda disappointed in Stone though. More tag -sensitive damage (though looking at recent W ICE, they've been a bit more liberal with those I guess).

Seidr is *terrifying* in its own way.

Estelle... going to suffer the same fate as Alix T4LB07, isn't she?

I dig Black Level Clearance, you wanted your Rumor Mill-free defensive upgrade? (And now people are going to complain it's not a sure run multiplayer upgrade, of course)

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>>51711649
>Estelle... going to suffer the same fate as Alix T4LB07, isn't she?
Nah, the advantage of being an alive exec instead of a copy of one is that her trash doesn't take a click.

Comboing them, on the other hand, that sounds like fun.

Until Rumour Mill

>a sure run multiplayer upgrade
Whut?

Stone I think is another Weyland asset that'd be a bit more amazing if it wasn't both cheap and imperative to trash.
Awesome with Prisec and Zealous Judge though

>>51710624
Fuck, Skorpios is a 40/15, with THAT ability.
That's a bit bullshit.

I like it (and I have trouble building small decks anyway, so it likely won't matter) but that's scary

>>51711736
>Whut?

If, say, R&DI multiply the efficiency of runs by giving multiple access for one run expenditure, Caprice and the like multiply server efficiency by forcing the runner to make several runs for the same accesses.

Trouble with Black Level Clearance is it's interactive (not to mention costly), and if there's one thing the competitive meta taught us: interactive cards are obviously bad until/unless the interaction can be negated - if even.
That burst of cynicism notwithstanding, I'm thinking it's going to work much better on centrals than on remotes, which makes it an uncomfortable Ash replacement at best.

Is it me or is Paper Trail basically a giant FUCK YOU to criminals? With 5 out ot 8 job cards in faction, and 15 out of 46 connections (13 being neutral) not to mention the connection support in faction.

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>>51710624
He seldom does!

>>51710791

I really dig that trend of inserting the click symbol in art of cards that make use of clicks mechanically.

>>51711736
>Stone I think is another Weyland asset that'd be a bit more amazing if it wasn't both cheap and imperative to trash.

It's interesting, because I don't find imperative to trash, not good enough for that. Coupled with the cheap rez and cheap trash I wonder about it on World Plaza.

>no love for Mr. Stone

So, let me get this straight.

Now, all I have to do is do my Weyland thing and MAKE MONEY FUCK BITCHES and wait for the runner to steal an agenda.

Then I only need to Consulting Visit my Midseasons to KILL THE SHIT OF THAT DAMN RUNNER.

He effectively turns credits into damage with the right card. He still falls to Rumor Mill and the like, which is the greatest downside of anything these days. But I already want to hide him behind some Data Ravens.

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>>51712158
>is Paper Trail basically a giant FUCK YOU to criminals
Jobs yeah, Connections no.
Fuck you Critic, fuck you Beth, fuck you Kati, fuck YOU in particular Aaron Marron (okay, that last one is kind of a fuck you to criminals)

>>51712219
Where?

>>51712278
Sadly, you need to read him again
>When the runner takes 1 or more tags do 1 meat damage

It's not per tag

>>51712345
>one or more
Sad Christmas...

Here I thought it would be Green's turn to shine... Why do I have to fail at reading comprehension?

>>51712278

It's not so much I find him bad as much as I've been really digging Weyland finally having some more cool kill/damage cards that aren't tag related, and just going back to that (and NBN stealing because it has less of a hard time making it work) is kinda disheartening.

Midseasons/Stone would have been incredibly thematic... but then it's "one or more tags", not "one per tag". Midseason is going to do one Meat, however many tags it dishes.

Hmmm... Stone/Snare? Stone in those Old City Surveillance decks (Door to Door alternative I guess)? Thoth... Virgo, two triggers, two damages. Zealous Judge.

Don't you even dare mention Searchlight.

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>>51712396
Eh, a few people have made the mistake.

He still looks cool though, I'm going to have to squeeze him into my argus - he makes Prisec immensely good, and I love prisec anyway.

And if you get the Cleaners then you're a) really thematic, and b) doing a stupid amount of damage

>>51712345

Data Matrix.

Just in front of the eye of the guy in Black Level Security Clearance, I seemed to remember Bellamy having it, but I was misremembering him...

Probably just me seeing things.

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>>51712541
I'd say a solid maybe (I spotted it after I posted)

With this, there's just one ID left to go - Ayla "Bios" Rahim

>>51712158
Paper Trail makes my Iain deck incredibly sad

>>51712449

I now have a new purpose in life... I won't rest until I get that AWESOME! Mr Stone /Salvage kill.

Don't hold your breath.

>>51712600
I find it kind of strange that this guy is coming out in the exact same pack that Skorpios is.
>what's that crims, you wanted some in-faction recursion? well here you go. Too bad it's now not as good to have

>>51712707

Not everyone is going to play Skorpios... hell, given how little people have played Weyland competitively in recent memory, you might as well file that risk under "statistical anomaly" for now.

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>>51712707
Crims are getting recursion now you can't just rely on recursion forever.
Which is probably a good thing.

I think baiting skorpios to use their ID power will be important, especially seeing as they CAN use it for events

At least end-of-turn discards don't count, but boy do I feel sorry for MaxX

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>>51712760
>>51712760
I think it's safe to say that a 40/15 ID that slaps recursion around is going to see at least some play, and there's a fair few other cards that look nice enough to give the faction a boost.

And Red Sands looks good - Jamison, and Red Planet Couriers tell of a future with some serious green FA plays.

All in all (and my vote for the next OP pic), pic related

>>51712760
People are going to start playing Weyland again, I have no doubt of that. Lots of new fast advance options, Skorpios, probably some other shit I'm forgetting that's coming out for them soon.

>>51712884
So, who's going to be the next underdog now? Jinteki?

>>51712898
No idea.

>>51712898

Post rotation, that's not unlikely.

NBN. Once rotation hits, NBN is going to be basically virgin territory for a short while. At least competitively. All shells will need to be reworked to the core, basics and all.

>>51712864
>>51712884

As an old Anarch/Weyland player, I'm both hoping for some Weyland good times, and wary of where it could lead us if things get too good.
We'll see.

Talking about underdogs, I just realize that Palana is Corp's version of Fisk. Harvester and Agroplex forces the Runner to draw and discard, while the ID benefits from it. Then we have the usual stuff that forces whole grip discards like Chetana, Komainu and Psychic Field.
I think that's going to be my next deck, going asset spam with Palana Agroplex.

Trying to think of those cards in a Core + TD only context makes some of them weird at least without more data.

Mr Stone in card pool that has Biometric Spoofing, but whose most likely option to land a tag is Data Raven?

>>51713149
It's any tag.

Data Raven? 1 meat
Ghost Branch? 1 meat
Sea Source? 1 meat
Posted Bounty? 1 meat

Just pings of damage

>>51713034

Really dig Palana (and assorted support cards) from a theme standpoint. The whole "good" Jinteki until you *have* to go bad angle.

Played a version of it and I find it's very fun.
Hell, I think people underestimate Harvester as a way to thin the stack.

(Oh god, Harveter in Skorpios... let's weaponize agriculture... funny idea)

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>>51713149
And Colossus!
No doubt there will be more tagging options included.

>>51713197

I didn't say only, just most likely... almost tempted to bring back the old Chum+Hunter remote again.

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>>51713202
>Harveter in Skorpios... let's weaponize agriculture
I just checked, that's "discard", not trash (like the end-of-turn), which doesn't work with Skopios, sadly

Which is a shame, seeing as you could call the idea "Ploughshares to Swords" or something about scythes

>>51713338

Oh damn my addled brain misremembering.

That being, so obvious I should have seen it first:

Skorpios + Housekeeping.

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>>51713417
Yeah, that's going to hurt

Black Level + Breaker Bay will be pretty rough

https://pvplive.net/c/philippines-netrunner-player-business-weyland

>I know two-time World Champion Dan D'Argenio also designed a Weyland ICE that helps Weyland.

Color me interested.

>>51710624
Skorpios is good, don't think I can say anything that hasn't been said. Underway Renovation is a good splash with it I guess. Colossus is a pretty decent facecheck, though I'm not sure if it's worth the three advancement. Love that it has the strength increase too though. Not sure how to leverage Mr. Stone in Core42 outside of Data Raven, but he's pretty good with Prisec.

Seidr is pretty good at leveraging the bioroid abilities, and a surefire with Enhanced Login Protocol. Might be a decent match with EtF just from recurring Hedge Fund infinitely. Black Level Clearance is definitely a good Ash replacement, giving the runner a bad choice both ways. Brain Rewiring might be good in HB kill decks, though 5 extra credits is nothing to scoff at.
Estelle Moon is... eh. Wonder where they're trying to go with her.

Honeyfarms is cute but at this point we have better Ambushes for most factions (HB doesn't have a trigger-on-access card do they?). Might do work in the credit deprived environment of Core42 though. Paper Trails will probably need to be tested before judgement, but it does hit a decent amount of often used connection cards.

>>51710791
Triple might actually be a waste since they can jack out once and that trashes all three. What you could do is Advanced Assembly Lines one in right before the access.

>>51713470

Amusingly, you can only combo that in a remote though...

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>>51713533
Nah, any server can have regions - hence Crisium

>>51713518
>What you could do is Advanced Assembly Lines one in right before the access.

Am I misunderstanding? Can't use AAL during a run.

>>51713563

Yes, but Upgrades are not installed *in* central servers, but in the Root of central servers. And as such don't benefit from the BBG rez reduction.

>>51713572
Oh, my bad, didn't know that. Still works if you AAL one in at the end of the runner's click after the run I guess.

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>>51713518
>What you could do is Advanced Assembly Lines one in right before the access.
Oh that'd be beautiful if... AAL let you do it during a run.


>surefire with Enhanced Login Protocol
Doesn't work in Heinlein, won't work with Seidr

>>51713518
>Seidr is pretty good at leveraging the bioroid abilities, and a surefire with Enhanced Login Protocol

Given the click spent on ELP is an additional cost to make the run, I don't think it's spent *during* the run, and as such it doesn't trigger Seidr.

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>>51713602
I did not know about that interaction.
Not many cards that care about that distinction.

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>>51713673

Conversely, that's why I can't just remove from the game that defensive upgrade you have slapped on Archives with Archive Interface.

And believe me I tried.

>>51713650
>>51713673
True, didn't know about the Heinlein interaction either. Guess there's only the bioroid ice and maybe Strongbox then?

>>51713822
Enigma, False Leads, Troll (optional), Hourglass

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>>51713822

>>51713822

Ronald Five. We have a local player that did some amusing/cool stuff with Ronald and Heinlein against Anarch ICE trashing decks.

False Lead I guess, but that's kind of expensive for that trigger.

Enigma/Hourglass/Viper if it fires. Troll.

Bellamy too, doesn't he?

>>51713949

Actually, having checked, Bellamy does look like a surefire, couldn't remember the exact effect if what I googled is right:

>Every time an encounter with an ice protecting this sever in which the Runner broke at least one subroutine ends, they lose a click if able.

Basically put a hard ETR on central, and unless bypass, you have a surefire.

>>51713949
>>51714095

Bellamy + Heinlein server. Now THAT's not going to be fun.