/CofD/ &/wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness

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first for best tribe

>>51605528
>Has anyone here done a game set during the World Wars?
I haven't, but I've always wanted to give Mage Noir a try. But in 2e, so I don't have to handle that dumb Quiet Legacy.

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>>51605542

>>51605565
Theres so many great things about this picture

>>51605535

The Death Lords aren't rank 9, they're rank 7. No one has ever met a rank 9 entity before. Sol and Luna are rank 8.

If she exists, Gaia would be rank 9. The Exarchs, God-Machine and The Principle would be around her level as well.

>>51605578
The exarchs are rank 10 in my opinion. They're hard wired into reality.

>>51605599
Some anons have made the case that they aren't all that if they're dependent on the Fallen World somehow.

An interesting angle, if you ask me.

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>>51605555
Nice quads, and I played in a game set during/after WWI in Wraith, I was a Solicitor attache to a group of Loyalist Legionaries who was responsible for Requisition, Press-Ganging and all of the stuff that Styia's finest couldn't be seen doing themselves. My Shadow was ambulatory whilst I was in slumber and was making deals with the party's Castigator in exchange for information on my Guild's doings and disposition. Unfortunately it ended around four or so sessions in.

It's not that I think Mages need to be nerfed it's just when a Mage can basically do everything any other splat can do better, then it practically invites Magefags to jump into any conversation/topic unrelated to say https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WO23WBji_Z0

I mean is there literally anything another splat can do/do better than a standard Mage with preparation?

Not even talking an archmage although if there's something there, than I'd be interested to know.

>inb4 hurr they're better at being lawnchairs, doing stuff without fear of Paradox or some other insignificant and/or garbage answer

>>51605577
Right? It's like the gift that keeps on giving.
>>51605578
So they're the same rank as the Old Gods of the Thistle then? I mean, that does lend more credence to the idea that they may be protected by the Pax. Also, what made the Mummies and what rank would they be?

>>51605636
Use their magic in front of people without having reality try to fuck them? Not have to worry about summoning the stuff of unreality from fucking up their dice?

>>51605619

Except Supernal Truths and Ascension is the thickest form of immortality in the entire setting. You need the highest possible Omen to even counter/undo it. Nothing else will work.

They're not dependent because they already won their right to rule and are completely absolute in their personalized symbolism of tyranny and oppression.

>>51605653
The Sorccerer kings of Irem? ersonally I'd guess at rank 5-6 level beings, maaaaaybe seven since they're behind a splat and are basicly immortal even if they only exist in a private underworld realm....

>>51605636
Magefags are just shitposters. Mages being stronger doesn't make them shitpost. It's just their preferred angle of attack.

>>51605653

The Gentry/Gods of the Thistle are comparable to lesser-mid range Archmasters.

They never actually stated what rank the sponsors for Mummy would be. My guess is 7.

>>51605619
It's a matter of perspective. What's the point of being the ultimate tyrant if you have nobody to rule over? Then again trying to understand the political philosophy of an exarch is an impossible task.

>>51605668
Honestly you could get a lot of mileage simply by making other supernaturals count as sleepers for the purposes of Paradox. I also have toyed with the idea of a Hunter Conspiracy made up of Proximi that understand what Paradoxes are and knows how to manipulate them to fuck over Mages, a sort of Banisher Junior.

>>51605703

>What's the point of being the ultimate tyrant if you have nobody to rule over?

They DO rule over humanity. Their the ultimate tyrants because they ARE tyranny. They're not corporal beings, they're the living symbols of oppression. They're all around us.

>>51605668
>Use their magic in front of people without having reality try to fuck them?

Not saying that it isn't a step above but don't most other splats except maybe hunter shy away from 'showing off' in public anyway?

>Not have to worry about summoning the stuff of unreality from fucking up their dice?

Dem's just the breaks of a mage though. Bad stuff generally happens to all splats when fucking up a dice roll for something major/important

>>51605705
Having other splats ping as sleepers would be a good way to fuck with a party or as a mystery if it was only a small group of them.

>>51605696
I realize that, what i'm talking about it is beings which are covered under the Pax Arcanum, which the Death Lords are (Rank 7 as I was corrected), which means that the Old Gods could be as well. It would explain why they're still you know, around.
>>51605687
Weren't they implied to be from the Lower Depths? I may be confusing them with something else.

>>51605723

More or less this. The Exarchs are impossible to confront by any means without crossing the Threshold. You can't exactly punch the concept of greed in the face, now can you? As a previous Anon had once said.

>>51605742

The Death Lords and the True Fae are their own sponsors. The Archmages won't attack them because why would anyone want a cataclysmic war of the gods?

>>51605736
True most supernaturals don't just go around flashing their shit, but it they also don't get hard coded in the rules "Fuck you" roll to not have your power A) not work, B)hit you or C) summong some horrible monster along with various amounts of tainting your very being.

I'm more going for that most supernaturals can get away with doing their magic at someone in a enclosed place/if they know they're going to be killing them in a fight. If a mage is fighting a lone gunman in a room most of his spells are going to make the sleeper ping paradox.

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>>51605749
>You can't exactly punch the concept of greed in the face, now can you?
Y'all Niggas need Exalted.

>>51605742
I'd have to check, my dood, I have all the mummy books because I'm a faggot that likes the game in theory... But well, we all know that shit ain't getting no play.

>>51605773
But you can punch the concept of greeds face in, along with at least 10 diffrent kinds of greed personafied spirits, demons or what have you.

>>51605749
The tyranny exists on multiple levels.

For example The General is the exarch of Forces. He is violence, conflict, and blood shed made manifest. But he's also the tyranny of gravity pointing down, friction slowing your car, etc.

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>>51605778
I was the Anon about a dozen threads back asking people to explain exactly how the fuck that game is supposed to be played, the best I was able to settle on was Cultist time with Flashbacks for chaser. I prefer the more Stale Beer flavor of D:tD or cold coffee of H:tV in nWoD, but I can't get any one to play those with either.
>Picture related.
>>51605762
...Aswadim.

>>51605817
The Aswadim are too stupid to live.

>>51605749
You mean Ascension? A 'mere' archmage is nothing compared to the Exarchs.

>>51605769
I get what you're saying but I guess my question is more "is there anything another splat can do that a Mage is incapable of under the right circumstance?"

Like for instance I thought someone was pointing out a few threads ago that it's literally written in one of the Werewolf books that a Mage can do a bunch of spiritual magic that the best Werewolf cannot. This just makes me think that if I wanted to save the world as a Werewolf shouldn't I devote my time to making buddies with a mage and have him/her fix everything?

Paradox is just a part of being a Mage.

>>51605805
I always thought the best way that Mage ever put forth to explain everybody's favorite Exxies was in the Seers book, where the explained the concept of the Iron Seals and how they were th literal supernal representation of that Exarch essentially chaining the particular Arcana to a bevy of symbols which exceed the capacity of High Speech to convey and drive you mad if you study them too long.

>>51605636

Mages are the strongest supernaturals around in terms of potential, this is all very true.

The key word here is "potential"

>>51605528
>Has anyone here done a game set during the World Wars?
I'd kinda like too. IIRC, the traditions and technocracy both worked together in ww2 when they realized how many Nephandi were working with the nazis, and I just kinda love the idea of a The Man From UNCLE style teamup.

>>51605822
I mean, yeah, that's why they're trying to unmake themselves into the Abyss.

>>51605837

Ascension isn't the Threshold.

>>51605636
Werewolves can eat your face in melee.

>>51605852
Not only that, but that's also when the Virtual Adepts crossed the lines and joined the Traditions, forging them for the inauspicious 8 into the sublime 9 once more. It's a great time for skull-duggery and just straight spycraft.

>>51605862
But is it impossible for a Mage in a specific build under the right conditions to eat your face in melee better?

>>51605840
They define the High Speech which is in part why it's such a mess now.

>>51605845
>Potential

Once a Mage becomes a Master it's game over for the other equivalently statted splats.

>>51605542

>'I'M POOR NIGGA LUL'

Seems like a stupid premise for a Tribe, but I do love the idea of ghetto werewolves.

>>51605817
Yeah, the only ways I can see mummy working is with cultists/the semi-immortal cultists infused with mummy power and having the mummy pop up as the heavy or for DRAMTIC scenes. The other way is to play it in the Sothic turn where EVERY mummy is awake and the mummy community is vibrant and alive for the next... year or so I think. Honestly I don't mind playing a cultist, infused cultist or a ghost cultist which is possible in that game, but that reeeeally doesn't look good for a game.

>>51605839
Ah, yeah I don't think there is, I could be wrong but... Well Master mages are able to create and uncreate things at will along with every other thing they can do between initiate and master. But I've never really played assuming that every supernatural splat is represented in each games world as they are in their own line, kind of like how vampires, witches and werewolves in hunter aren't -really- those splats unless you go hard and convert them as such.

>>51605879
Yes. Someone back on the OPP forums made three Mage PCs designed to be better than Werewolves at melee. It worked out. It's just not every Mage is going to do it.

If you want, I can try to find the page for you.

>>51605879
No. A Thrysus can shapeshift their face to do it, although I doubt they would because I'm pretty sure they might get stuck with a taste for human flesh. Possibly.

Transformation spells are neat. There's a grimoire in the book of grimoires that can transform you into something called a Vyrd, essentially an albino, completely hairless, completely carnivorous humanoid with pointed teeth and enhanced agility and flexibility. You also become nocturnal. The changes are permanent too, and you'd have to use Life magic to temporarily regain your normal form if you wanted to go in public.

>>51605874
No, they didn't change sides til Turing was executed by the brits, which was after the war was over.
>>51605879
I suppose a Technocracy space marine might stand a chance, but that's mostly cuz space marines get really fancy magic armor. My money would still be on the werewolf tho.

>>51605925
Oh man I love that book, the uh... Whatever, Tales of the Vyrd or romance of the sun and moon. Just some stupid book about pre-historic alternate forms of humanity FUCKING a human that sometimes turns people into this fantasy(?) race.

>>51605542
I always kind of thought it was weird that Werewolves wield weapons while transformed

>What did you fucking say? Say it again. Then I'll transform into a hulking mass of muscles and rage, with deadly fangs and claws that can rip out your guts and carve you up real good.
>And then I'll cut you with this knife

>>51605965

Klaives and fetich knives have a purpose, usually that being silver weapons for killing other werewolves or werecreatures.

>>51605845
Mages can do quite a bit. they've got a large metaphysical tool kit. they got to deck themselves out

The specific splats can do their stuff more reliably and consistently

>>51605965
Why not? A weapon is a force multiplier, and werewolves have a lot of force to multiply. I'll admit that a knife is probably not much of an advantage over claws, given how big their claws are.

>>51605981
I know, that's just what I think when I see art like that. It strikes me as incongruous.

>>51605965
The Klaives are mostly used against other Werewolves and BSDs, that's why they're usually Silver.
>>51605927
You're also thinking of just the Wolves, go look at like, what Khans or Mokole can do.

>>51605858
By working for the Gate. The exarch that other exarchs think is a fucking nut. That's oWoD Tremere stupid.

>>51605965
Klaives are for killing werewolves with silver, which is technically a sin but you know. Their fetish weapons on the other hand can do JACKED UP shit, aka spirits of pain that make it feel like you got that tripple edged knife stabed in you or whips made of gold nuggets that channel true sunlight that cause mad damage to vampires.

>>51606004

Ananasi are hands down the most powerful if you're allowing any kind of white room build.

They can cheese their blood pool REALLY hard.

How about this, could a Mage under the right circumstance/with the right build make themselves into a Demon/Mummy/etc identical in every way but better/without the downsides?

>>51605991

It also depends very much on their Ruling Arcana.

They can be just as (if not more so) reliable and consistent then.

>>51606022
Not really. Though It depends. It's a silly question to ask. An Archmaster can specifically do everything a lesser Template can do though. The Practices of Entities and Excision.

>>51606022
That would take a LOT of Arcana at high levels, a lot of high duration spells and... Like it MIGHT possible man, but that would take autistic min/maxing that would get through out by ANYONE who saw it.

>>51606022
No.

>>51606022
Demon/Mummy is harder to do because of 'going loud' and whatever the mummy thing is called. But you can mimic most of their powers with magic.

The real question is why play a Mage if you're tailoring your character to be a Super vampire/werewolf/geist. It's not what the game is about.

>>51606018
IIRC Khans get an auto-hit gift and some of the highest Strength in the game.
>>51606009
I thought that once you hit Aswadim you're beyond the Gate, since you already got into the exclusive club when you hit Master and got you Diadem.

>>51606059
Sure, I know it's not feasible but most of the arguments on this thread don't tend to revolve around the 'how likely' as much as they do the 'could it be done'

>>51606070
Yeah, again this isn't a question of 'why bother' more a question of 'could it be done'

Like if I were given the choice to wake up as any splat tomorrow, would not the answer be "mage, duh because worse case scenario I could choose to become any of the others with my mage powers"

>>51606075

That's nice, but werespiders can do something retarded like, upwards of 150 actions/attacks in a single turn with the appropriate build.

Sure its not Mage-stupid, but its up there.

Swara can also get kind of cheesy when done right, but nowhere near as abusive as this.

>>51605528
Anyone got a good program, website, or something to whip up a M20 character?

I have interactive PDFs, I don't like them because they're so limited.

Something like a non-shitty Mythweavers would be ideal.

>>51606114
>more a question of 'could it be done'
This right here is why Mage is talked about more than any other game.
It allows the autists on /tg/ to do their theorycrafting/e-peen stroking because they don't actually have a game to play in. You see the same thing in the pathfinder general, people masturbating about mechanics but not playing the game.

>>51605965
Rite of Dedication makes the object in question grow to match the Crinos form. So knives grow to the size of swords.

>>51606143
That's more or less my point back here >>51605636.

If there's no, "Well a Mage cannot succeed in a Werewolf or Vampire or Mummy story/let alone better than a Werewolf or Vampire or Mummy" then you'll never be free of the
>Mage supremacy
Shitposting

>>51606108

Great, thank you, shame we were talking about OWOD, Masters of the Art and it's implications. I guess you lose again.

I just thought of something. Why bother turning into a Lion or whatever with Life 4. You'd be way more dangerous/harder to kill if you turned into a sentient cloud of the plague or small pox.

>>51606239

Did you come all the way over here just to post this?

>>51606239
You're no better than the magefags at this point.

>>51606075

Blood Pump + Tick Body + Hydraulic Strength is a pretty standard and powerful Ananasi gift combo. Add in Pincers if you're playing a Myrmidon.

>>51606143
More than that, they don't even read the fucking books they exalt. You can hear a pin drop everytime someone mentions that - shock horror - Archspheres in OWOD *actually* cause Paradox!!! More than that, you *actually* have to make a dice roll instead of just declaring yourself king of the universe!!!

It offends them to their tiny cores. Even now, one of them is searching his folders for "except_thats_not_how_it_works.png" in lieu of intelligent response.

In any case, spamming the 2 word phrase "mage supremacy" apropos of nothing is a breach of global rules. I recommend such people simply be reported and ignored. It has the added bonus of hiding the shitposting from view.

>>51606248
I don't know. If Life spells aren't permanent, wouldn't the infection end with the spell?

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What are the differences between oWoD and nWoD in setting and in overall game mechanics?

>>51606264
If I really, really, *really* strained hard, I *might* be able to care even less about your opinion than I do now.

But I doubt it.

>>51606304
nWoD is better.

>>51606286

We're talking about CofD here. Excuse us while we disregard your baseless accusations.

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Sorry about the wait Anons, but here's the Sphinxes.
I'm not too buzzed about it, after the first attainment it just kinda peters out, even the section in the Legacy book acknowledges that many just don't care after they can see a hidden meaning in a coffee stain someone passed them.

Didn't bother with Yantras, they're usually pretty meh once you've chewed out a bunch
- Succeed on a skill test related to the spell subject
- Do some Legacy thing which is related that takes a bit of time
- Act in a certain detrimental way for a minor boost, or a bigger one if you get a condition
- Do something quick and easy which is still related to the legacy

Ultimately however, now that there are 5 bloody Attainments, and a lot of spells which just don't bloody work well without a load of reach/potency, or which are so damn easy there's little point having them as attainments, I honestly expect if they did put out a bunch of official ones, they'd have to break the own rules they established, or they'd be decried as being very "samey".

Got to say though, it's a glorious fucking thing writing the 5-dot ones.
Just go for ritual speed, and revel in the fact that you can point at a guy, tell him he's going to get hit by a car, and BOOM, he is.
And it's not even an Act of Hubris.
Guardians probably stay up late at night drinking because of Legacy Masters.

>>51606300
The infection would end but the after effects are lasting. Sort of like if I set a piece of food on fire with Forces. It's kind of pointlessly sadistic though on second thought.

>>51606248
Because sometimes you don't need to wipe out half of the population of Africa, you just need to kill that "White Witch", a pesky spirit with a highly specific Bane.

It's a niche example I know, but honestly Mages have enough things to do without getting into murder-dick-measuring competitions.

>>51606239
Good to know you're primed and ready to move goal posts, thanks.

>>51606286

You're honestly just so fucking pathetic. I'm sorry.

>>51606304
oWoD has a meta-plot which was shit nWoD is a 'toolbox' to build your own mythos. nWoD is a dice build system where a single success on your roll grants the effect. oWoD has a target number of successes.

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>Power level arguments

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>>51606286
How triggered are you?

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>bitching about magefags
Congratulations. You're part of the problem.

Every time you reply to them, you sink to their level.

Every time you post and whine about them when they aren't even here, you sink even lower.

Even now, as I'm posting and whining about you, I'm sinking to your level.

Just shut the fuck up you massive hypocrites. Stop throwing fuel on the fire. Fucking making me throw fuel on the fire. Assholes.

>>51606393
Okay but can I make your asshole into fire with forces and life? The answer is yes.

I would still like to know this.

Mage is the most powerful gameline, but how does that mean anything when you don't even have to apply them to your Chronicle?

Why do people ignore the obvious? I'm convinced that magehate is due to them being stronger rather than them being an issue in crossover.

>>51606331
This is sweet. I love you.

Do Daksha next pls.

>>51606410
Same thing happens with Exalted. White Wolf/Onyx Path can't help but make power tiers in their games.

>>51606428

Solar Exalted OP as fuck pls NERF

>>51606410
>Why do people ignore the obvious?
Because they want to be mad. They want to whip out their dicks and try to do pissing contests with the Magefags, and then they get salty when they can't fucking beat them because they're just shitposters and the only way to beat them is to ignore them.

>>51606321
After the retardation of ascension I'm coming around to this viewpoint

>>51606410
Because this is 4chan man, people come here to bitch and moan under the protection of being anonymous. I do it sometimes, I'm sure we all do to some degree, but the 'magefags' have this meme and they're attached to it, either cause they think it's funny or because they know it's a potent form of cancer.

>>51606075
>I thought that once you hit Aswadim you're beyond the Gate, since you already got into the exclusive club when you hit Master and got you Diadem.

Not sure actually. But collapsing reality into the abyss thereby expanding the abyss which would grow the power base of the only crazy bastard to ever control it. Seems like a really bad idea.

>>51606399
Prime unveiling. See the supernal truth of butt-hurt.

>>51606366
You don't need to be sorry, Anon. I'm the one who should be sorry - you see, I don't care in the slightest what you think of me. Your opinion is utterly, utterly worthless. You're not even a person to me - you're just words on a screen. In ten minutes that screen will switch off, I'll go back to my life, and as if you never will have existed at all. That's all you are - nothing. Utterly meaningless nothing.

I should be sorry... but I'm not. I'm also not a powerwanking feeblemind who clings to Imperial Mysteries like it was a lost book of the bible, so I guess I'm not invited to your birthday party. Gee, so sad.
>>51606391
"Triggered"? Is that the word? I just fucking had it with smug assholes who think they're clever for repeating the same shit a million times. Toddlers can do that. Hell, a trained parrot can do that. I guess that's the level of brain power we're talking here. Good to know you consider yourselves amongst their number. Keep aiming at the floor, kiddo, I hope you achieve your dreams of one day graduating high school.

>>51606389
Can we not? I'd rather read werewolf erotica or Martin Elricsson's fiction at this point than have one more conversation about how somebody's imaginary friend can totally beat up everyone else's imaginary friend. In my country we grow out of that a decade before we're allowed to drink.

>>51606399
>>51606472

Magefags do make me laugh sometimes. Like, a lot.

>>51606410
>>51606449

Hey, it's not the mages, it's you. It's all you. We hate you. We want you to fucking die. We actually like Mages, we actually like the games. We just. Hate. You.

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>>51606476
The Mage supremacy meme never gets old because of people like you.

You are your own worst enemy, Anon.

>>51606479
Oh I'm not even a mage fag, I was just teasing the guy. Really, mage is a fun time with the powers! Like this is simple and dumb, but if I had a claymore, a guitar and matter 3 I could A) Make a guitar that cuts like a fucking claymore and would be close enough to a true 'axe' or B) I make a fucking claymore that you can play like a god damn fucking guitar!

It's stupid and I just stole the idea from a Tenacious D music video, but come on! That's so dumb it's dope! Or at least I think so.

>>51606492

Hate is a pretty big word

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>>51606399
Yes, but so can a good curry or chilli.

>>51606304
oWoD has a pervasive metaplot (for good or ill), a big theme of impending apocalypses (Gehenna, Oblivion, Apocalypse, etc.), a very 90s-derived world with lots of cynicism, and a lot more options/bloat.

nWoD has no metaplot (for good or ill), no real theme besides paranormal mystery, and Beast: the Primordial. In other words, nWoD/CofD is garbage.

>>51606508
but I really really don't like them.

>>51606514

Chefs are naturally more hubristic than Mages. I thought this was obvious?

>>51606410
I'll admit, I don't know why you'd ever need or want to get Mages involved in anything that's not a Mage game, since every other kind of supernatural has at least one magic-focused wizard- or shaman-styled archetype and there are always mortal magic wielders that aren't necessarily reality-shredding Supermen.

>>51606492
>hate
That's pretty harsh, man. Why do you hate me? I'm not a magefag.

Also,
>We

We are literally getting cancer from all this magshit

>>51606521

I don't like haters.

>>51606549
You could always start posting homo-erotic werwolf fanfiction.

>>51606517
>no real theme besides paranormal mystery
You what? All the games have their own themes. "Paranormal mystery" is like a secondary theme of Awakening, at best.

>>51606566


No. Please don't. That will only piss off the Magefags even more. They hate smelly mutts.

>>51606331
Thank you for your continued hard work, Hieromagus-anon

Relevant poll:

http://www.strawpoll.me/12287228

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>>51606566

The Children of Gaia revised tribebook has an actual gay werewolf couple.

The catch? One of them is a Lupus, and he becomes 'straight' in wolf form. But is otherwise a gay older man in his Homid form. Go figure.

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>no one will ever run an all-Bastet game

Why even live?

>>51606601
That's fucking hilarious.

>>51606601
http://projects.inklesspen.com/fatal-and-friends/kurieg/tribebook-children-of-gaia/

For anyone that wants to see just how bad oWoD can be, espically werewolf.

PS. I still love this game, I just cut parts out of it like a doctor cuts shrapnel out of a soilder.

>>51606615
>Why even live?

Because all of the Bestat are currently lawn chairs.

>>51606577
Fine a Changeling who's durance was getting fist fucked daily by Grug the large armed. His mein is an anus like a bag of holding.

This is sadly not that much of an exaggeration from the kind of fucking sob stories people put together for changeling games at my game store.

>>51606601
Jesus wept.

>>51606630

Liar. I bet YOU made that up.


You sick twisted fuck.

>>51606630
Obviously overblown, but yeah it's technically possible as a back story since the writers made a note that gentry do the fuck and that the gentry will latch onto mortal fads. So you could have a Gentry that has his realm based on the BDSM Leather daddies culture (He saw the Free council parade and wept tears of inovation)

>>51606619
That's the only way to play

>>51606615
We did that once.
Well, kind of. We also had a rokea for some raisin.
In the second session the rokea jumped off a building, popped chasmus and wailord body slammed a dude.
The game fell apart after that.

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>>51606776

That sounds great though.

>>51606615

No one likes cat people. Go away.

>>51606304
The actual World of Darkness is the "oWoD" you're referring to, whereas "nWoD" is Chronicles of Darkness of CofD.

CofD is more in the vein of the Vampire Diaries, True Blood, and Twilight. It's all about "personal horror" which really means teenage angst.

I don't think anyone but the most tumblr-tier SJW fanatics actually prefer CofD's various splats to the WoD equivalents, which is why the average person has no idea what CofD is like whereas they've almost certainly at least heard of WoD.

WoD is inherently interesting and, in play, guarantees some fun for the players, whereas CofD requires you to be in a specific mindset to possibly enjoy, and even then, it's just doesn't measure up against WoD.

>>51606798
Nice bias.

>>51606798

You're a bit of a bitch, aren't you?

>>51606798
So what's the difference between the teenage angst of CoD and the very abundantly clear angst of WoD?

>>51606790
Oh it was awesome.

>>51606798
>CofD is more in the vein of the Vampire Diaries, True Blood, and Twilight.

I sometimes contemplate the many different ways of utterly destroying Edward Cullen using Forces and Space.

>>51606872
In WoD you may have angst if you're a neonate vampire or a Changeling or something, but beyond that, you become a powerful, confident, upright person whose internal struggles are more ideological and philosophical than emotional.

In CofD you are basically playing Monsterhearts.

>>51606798

Do you enjoy sucking Elricsson's penis?

>>51606905

Wouldn't you suck Dracula's penis if commanded to?

>>51606903

100% accurate.

>>51606894
What are the best Arcana to use when countering Celerity?

>>51606903
What about the angst of werewolves knowing the world is fucked (And that they're partly at fault), the angst of demons from being stuck in hell for who knows how fucking long, or AAAAAAAALL the angst in wraith.

>>51606894
That came up in a game once, but with a different method.

>Sunlight might not destroy that sparkling faggot, but c4 just fucking might

>>51606798
For all of WoD's retarded material like >>51606601 & >>51606619, at least it's memorable.

>Spirit nukes
>Hobo werewolves
>Necromancer mobster vampires
>Sam Haight
>Wyld, Weaver, and Wyrm
>Thin-blooded vampires
>War of Rage
>War of Rage 2: A European Werewolf in The Americas
>War of Tears

CoD doesn't have anything similarly interesting.

>>51606983
Oh don't get me wrong, I love that fucking universe it's got so much good shit for all the dumb shit.

>>51606964
Those are rational, sensible forms of angst, expected in a healthy adult exposed to those conditions. They are existential and meaningful, not just "abloo-abloo I'm not a human" bullshit that a teen would find compelling - the entirety of CofD.

>>51606903
>you become a powerful, confident, upright person whose internal struggles are more ideological and philosophical than emotional.
This has been exactly my experience with CofD. I haven't seen any "woe is me" bullshit, let alone actually have any in my games, barring Changelings. Those wimps.

You're full of shit.

>>51607013
>Changelings don't have reaosnable angst
>Prometheans don't have reaosnable angst
>Demons don't have reasonable angst
>Mummies don't have reasonable angst
>hunters don't have reasonable angst

Like Werewolf, Mage, Vampire and Geist? Yeah sure, whatever they don't have as much ground to stand on, but the majority of the non-big 3 splats have some dark shit that'll haunt them for good god damn reasons.

>>51607034
The secondary splats hardly matter. Vampire, Werewolf, and Mage are what shapes the entire franchise.

>>51606961

Fate, Time and Space work wonders against speedblitzing enemies. Forces can also be used to cast the dreaded Curse of Friction.

Yup, trying to get the surprise on a prepared and observant Mage is fucking suicide.

>>51607013
Don't the Demons of CofD not have much angst going on beyond the understandable mental stress of being hunted constantly by a pseudo-omniscient pseudo-omnipotent computer god?

>>51607041
>The parts that disprove my sweeping statement don't count

Hmmm...

>>51606983
But CofD does have hobo Werewolves. Ghost wolves. And necromancer mobster vampires are totally viable. You can also make a Bloodline with the same concept as thin-bloods.

CofD is more about enabling you to come up with your own interesting shit than just coming up with it for you. Not that they don't also come up with interesting shit for you to use.

>>51607069
I don't really have much of a problem with the new Demon or Hunter lines, I still prefer the WoD versions, but it's not a colossal fuckup like CofD Mage, Vampire, and Werewolf are.

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>>51606411
There you are, one Daksha Legacy, complete with perpetual biological spell effects, crazy time powers, date-rape foresight, and self-impregnating action.

God I wish I didn't have to read that.

>>51607091
What is exactly wrong with CofD Mage, Vampire, and Werewolf?

>>51607082

>enabling you to come up with your own interesting shit
>by not writing anything at all that might inspire you
>or having any centralized theme or antagonist

>>51607091
I'll accept that, I still prefer old Vampire and werewolf to the new stuff, mage I'm more sold on new since... Well, I've read new and I haven't read old mage.

>>51607111

You aren't missing much. Its like The Matrix for neckbeards; complete garbage but still regarded as a mind blowing masterpiece by a large majority of morons.

>>51607103
Well the whole end of the whole thing is kind of limiting. Mage is bullshit rules lawering. Vampire is all judeo christian allegory. Werewolfs are eco terrorists but they suck at their job

oh wait

>>51607108
>I'm a lazy shit who can't write a plot worth crap

>>51607136

>le ad hominem

ha ha good show sir simply epik =^) i'll be sure to upboat lul

>>51607103
>Vampires go from having a rich history and incredibly engaging cosmological implications to being generic bloodsuckers with hardly any culture
>Werewolves go from being furfag bait to full on ERP nightmare material
>Mages go from reality warpers who are masters of high truths to Atlanteans

>>51607097
You're great. This is good stuff, and funny too.

You should keep going and compile the converted Legacies into a whole pdf book, like the Vampire Monster Manual guy did.

>>51607148

Mages are still reality warpers of high truths

>>51607108
Except they do? The books are full of settings, concepts, plot hooks, and characters, as well as details for antagonists, in addition to the standard info.

If you don't find that stuff inspiring, that's really just your opinion.

>>51607148

doesn't WtF literally have otherkin and bestiality sex splat with literally no excuse or reason for it?

at least wta wrote it off as making soldiers for the war to end all wars..

>>51607182

So does owod material.

If you don't find that stuff inspiring, then that too, is really just your opinion. =^)

>>51607184
Sssssh, we don't talk about Changing breed (nWoD)

>>51607148
I don't know enough about Requiem to say, but I do know that Werewolves are still furfag bait and that Mages are still literally reality warpers and masters of high truths. That is literally how their magic works. The impose the laws of realms of high truths onto the normal world to change it.

>>51607196

Nah, we gonna talk about it.

Because for how high and mighty you faggots act, especially about WtF to WtA, the latter never went out of its way to make a product like that.

At least Freak Legion is humorous..

>>51607194
>So does owod material.
Never said it doesn't.

>>51607199

Changeling is actually the furfag and otherkin bait splat.

That and WtF's Changing Breeds book.

CofD is actually much more heavy on the furfaggotry than owod ever was.

>>51607201
Hey man, I like WtA more than I like WtF, don't bind me in with those guys... I'm still supplying a link to it though!

http://projects.inklesspen.com/fatal-and-friends/kurieg/changing-breeds/#15

>>51607201
oWoD fags are actually the high and mighty acting faggots.

>>51607244
Again, "oWoD" /is/ WoD. Literally.

Your fanfic-tier 'sequel' product is CofD.

>>51607261
Case in point.

>>51607201
No, the latter has plenty of shit built in that it didn't need a splat book for it.
No one defends Changing Breeds as a good book because even without it's terrible fluff, the mechanics are just as bad. It's a flat out badly done book in all ways.
In comparison, people usually try to defend everything in WtA rather than call out the shit for what it is.

Why can't we all just be happy to have two amazing settings? Jesus.

>>51607280
oWoDfags can't accept that their time has passed.

Like rednecks with tattoos of rebel flags who say shit like "The South will rise again!".

>>51607297

I don't think their time has passed. I just think fighting over old and new is retarded as all hell.

I prefer variety and am happy to have two different and unique settings.

>>51607216

>Bruccato wrote Changing Breeds
>it was does as a peace offering for people who liked the Fera
>Bruccato was basically insulting anyone who liked the Fera at all

This book just gets worse and worse.

>>51607297
>CofD i-isn't tumblrshit!
>proceeds to lambast WoD as if its fanbase are redneck Confederates

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I FUCKING LOVE PHIL BRUCATO

>>51607297

Is that why they're pushing oWoD again as the true WoD and have deals in the works for video games and etc based in oWoD?

>>51607323
>>51607297

What's wrong with being a pro-Dixie southerner? At least they got good food and a culture. I don't know what to call New England culture except 'cunt who eats shitty seafood' and west coast is full on 'smug libcuck marxist faggot'

>>51607349
That was largely my (>>51607323) point. That, and CofDfags are the 'smug libcuck marxist faggots'.

>>51606983
Who is Sam Haight?

>>51607323
Sorry I couldn't come up with a metaphor involving niggers. Maybe something like "niggers who can't accept Tupac is dead"? No, that doesn't work.

Maybe an angle on spics?

>>51607280
becasue that means people we'll never meet or interact with in any meaningful way might be having fun WRONG!!!

>>51607375
See >>51607328 faggot. Your fanfic shit is dying, WoD is on the rise again.

>>51607297
oWoDfags can't accept that their time has passed.

Like hipsters with black rimmed glasses and starbucks mugs who say shit like "He's not my President!".

>>51607387

You will be the same once the newer-newer WoD comes out.

>>51607371
A mistake in oWoD where they put all three of the major templates onto one charecter, possibly because they thought it was cool or helped the metaplot. In the end he's killed and turned into a ashtray for the rest of his time as a ghost.

>>51607383
>WoD is on the rise again.
>South will rise again!
See they're doing it right now.

>>51607402
He's also considered non-canon by the writers.

Apparently.

>>51605778
>we all know that shit ain't getting no play.

disagree strongly

>>51607402
All three major templates? So what, he's a vampire werewolf mage?

>>51607399
This. It won't be a return to Old World of Darkness. More like a bastardization. And hipsters will be drawn to it and they'll pretend like they were fans of the original World of Darkness too, like what's happening with comic books and superhero movies.

>>51607438
>tfw you will never get michael bay to direct a AAA summer blockbuster of Geist

In the latest Monday Meeting, there is a mention of Dark Eras Companion being contracted for art.
Doesn't that mean they haven't even started working on that book's art yet?

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Looking for a player for an online, text-based Demon the Fallen game. Probably solo, |maybe| two players.

Reply to this post with some contact info, preferably Discord username, if you're interested.

>>51607467

Eeewwwww, Demon the Fallen.

I would rather suck Bastet penis

>>51607431
Oh so you're playing mummy? Glad to know you found a group

>>51607506

We're waiting for Dark Eras Companion before I do Mummy, but yeah.

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>>51607487

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>>51607527

Now I feel bad

>>51607460

There's literally art from it in the same post, as they've done for several weeks now.

>>51607548
Oh, yeah. You are right. I thought it was just from the core book.
What does that contract thing mean then?

>>51606615
Then you must run one, and post full details here. The haters can suck the knot and lick the spiny raspberry.

>>51606662
It's true, all the oWoD stuff needs varying degrees of triage to make it work.

The best way to play CofD is to sell the books on ebay and spend the money on drugs. There's far less regret that way. Dick eggs, sidebars errywhere, YOU ARE BEING RECORDED, sparkly Daeva.

>>51606798
This is 100% true and more than fair.

>>51607641
You're a bitch

You know, this would be a perfect summary of the Arisen Stereotype of Demons.
>"Mind your tongue impertinent youth! I was doing this before you were even built!"

>>51606905
I would get down on my knees and suck up every drop of that concentrated blood-spunk from his full-assrape -stiffness as long as he kept talking in that beautiful norse accent, Anon.

Afterwards, as we lounged on the stained rubber sheet and shared a joint, we would idly talk about his vision for One World of Darkness. "You know what really needs to be nerfed, Drac?" I'd whisper as I kissed my way slowly down his lean, pale ribcage. "You need to kill off those damn Archmages once and for all...."

"Suck my balls, my little Teddybjorn," he would growl in his lilting Nordic accent, "...and I'll crank that goddamn Avatar Storm so high it makes Phil Brucatto bleed from his ass..."

"Mmmmm.... vampire supremacy..." he moans as the taste of him covers my tongue....

>>51606983
>>Spirit nukes
Is in CofD
>>Hobo werewolves
Why would you want this?
>>Necromancer mobster vampires
A whole clan of Necromancer mobster vampires is silly.
>>Sam Haight
Why would you want this?
>>Wyld, Weaver, and Wyrm
Why would you want this?
>>Thin-blooded vampires
Why would you want this?
>>War of Rage
Why would you want this?
>>War of Rage 2: A European Werewolf in The Americas
Why would you want this?
>>War of Tears
Why would you want this?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93lrosBEW-Q
Let's face it, Tamatoa is a Beast done right.

>>51607025
CofD was the one with the book that focused entirely on Vampire Romance, correct? The one with the Beasts struggling to be accepted for the special snowflakes that they are against those meany Heroes? The one with Prometheans wishing upon a star to become a real boy?

You're running out of legs to stand on, Peg Leg Pete.

>>51607062
>trying to get the surprise on a prepared and observant Mage is fucking suicide.

It's a good thing pride and overconfidence come before crushing defeat, then.

>>51607184
>doesn't WtF literally have otherkin and bestiality sex splat with literally no excuse or reason for it?

No?

If you mean Changing Breeds, that's not a WtF book, and is a sad example of a bunch of oWoD lovers inflicting their bullshit on the nWoD in inadvisable ways.

WtF has body horror nightmare swarms that eat your flesh and then puppet your corpse around instead of otherkin.

And as for making soldiers for the war, WtF 2nd has pushed Wolf-Blooded even further from kinfolk. Forsaken doesn't treat them as breeding stock, unlike the poor fucking kinfolk in Apocalypse.

>>51607082
So I can use OWOD that already has all that stuff written for me, and come up with my own stuff as well

OR

I can use my own stuff with CofD and then have to do twice as much work filling out the world because "mah toolbox"?

WHAT A FEATURE!!!!!

>>51607097
Doesn't work for me, won't load for some reason.

>>51607704
>WtF has body horror nightmare swarms that eat your flesh and then puppet your corpse around instead of otherkin.
That reminds me...are there Toad Hosts?

>>51607716
No, but there should be.

>>51607103
No-one has any real reason to team up or do anything. Atlantis is real, no it isn't, yes it is, no it isn't. Clans are meaningless compared to Factions. Werewolves are thematically boring versions of spirit-chasing Minutemen. Mage pays lip service to gnostic ideals and the Platonic cave without exploring the concept to it's logical extension - that by "ascending" and binding into the source code of the universe, Mages aren't free of the prison, they become the prison. Finally, and worst of all, less than half the world is created for you, and this laziness is advertised as a feature.

Actually, every time someone on the OPP forum says "it's not a bug, it's a feature", take a drink.

>>51607125
There's no need to be sour because it went over your head, Anon. Simply accept that you lack the intellectual and artistic capacity to grasp it, and move on.

>>51607692
>CofD was the one with the book that focused entirely on Vampire Romance, correct?
I have no clue because I don't into Vampire in either game line, but I assume you mean the Daeva book? Daeva aren't so much about romance as they are envy of humanity, but they do embody the more romanticized aspects of vampires, like Gangrels do the more bestial. Not really enough to condemn Requiem as the equivalent of Twilight or Blood Diaries or whatever.

>Beasts
Beast is universally condemned here, aside from Heroes. Heroes are tight. Are you really going to tell me that WoD has no tragic embarrassments? Because the whole special snowflake shit could be applied to Dreaming.

>Promethean
Couldn't care less about Promethean, don't know much about it. Even still, it's not enough to condemn all of CofD as being chock full of whiny drama bullshit.

So either go through all the games, point out all the themes that focus excessively on emotions and melodrama, with references to where you found them in the books, or get lost with your reductionist generalizations.

>>51607136
If I pay top dollar for a game book, I expect the game designer to actually do their job, and not leave it entirely up to me.

If you don't, just mail your credit card to OPP and be done with it.

What you're suggesting is the height of brilliance is just insulting laziness. What's next, sell you a branded OPP blank writing pad as an "adventure module toolkit"?

>>51607182
Are you saying you find Conquering Heroes inspiring?

>>51607759
>Y-you just don't GET IT

>>51607736
Indeed, Maybe their thing is related to water on both sides of the Gauntlet? by polluting water in the Flesh with eggs from people they've possessed they start impacting the Spirit side of the Gauntlet into the real world.

This is an incredibly bad thing. And they're only trying to do it everywhere because their Pangean was killed by Father Wolf halfway through his cycle of drinking all the water in the world before spitting it back out again.

>>51607199
>The impose the laws of realms of high truths onto the normal world to change it.

You mean, they view the "source code" of the universe, and you know, "hack the Matrix".

What was that >>51607125 said again...?

>>51607772
If the way Exalted 3e is going is any hint, yes. That game wants you to homebrew like no other game before it.

>>51607790
Supernal Realms aren't the source code of the universe. More like just a kind of code.

>>51607201
It's really sad that the Horned God in CofD's Changing Breeds had his cock airbrushed out. If they'd left all two feet of it in, it really would have spelled out the underlying theme of WtF in general:
>What the Fuck?

>>51607763
Promethean is about dragging yourself through shit to get to the light at the end of the tunnel. While the tone is dour and moody it is one of the few games in both Wods that you could get any sort of real happy end. So I don't really see it as whiny.

>>51607746
>No-one has any real reason to team up or do anything
Yes they do. Each major splat has different groups with different goals and different philosophies. Try reading one of the books sometime.

>>51607244
Maybe that's because our product actually sells, has computer games, a TV show, comic books, action figures and is being negotiated with Hollywood producers and Netflix.

Meanwhile, you have.... dickeggs. Oh, and Null Spyder.

>>51607807
Changing Breeds are not WtF supplement

>>51607280
Because we don't have two, we have one, and the other is just pressed photocopies of Rose Bailey's asscheeks with sidebars telling the reader how progressive they need to be to play.

>>51607821
I haven't seen anything new in the works aside from the new Werewolf game.

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Supremely cute mages

>>51607297
It's really kind of sad and ironic hearing a CofD fan saying someone else can't accept their time has passed.

I'll just be over here, watching White Wolf Publishing option the IP across multiple media formats, while you eagerly await another of Rose Bailey's sidebars.

>>51607675
>>51607830

It's because of comments like these that I prefer /tg/ over the OPP forums.

>>51607746
>without exploring the concept to it's logical extension
Don't have a dog in this race, but this shit right here is hypocrisy of the highest order. Speak to me of 'consensual reality' and the the writers unwillingness to follow it through and explore it's fucked up implications out of laziness, cowardice, incompetence or all of the above.

>>51607830
No we have two, no matter how much you don't like the other.

What's really hilarious is that if WoD actually gets put back in the spotlight and gets all those popularity boosting media platforms like shows and movies and games, then it'll be one with the asscheeks and progressive sidebars.

Can't wait for that.

>>51607326
>PLEASE DONATE TO MY PATREON
>THE RENT IS DUE

>>51607849
See>>51607861

>>51607861
Like Constantine without smoking that got axed after single season any way

>>51607830
Just wait until Dracula shoves his bloody junk in oWoD and tells you how much of an angsty bitch you need to be.

How would one make it harder for Mages to reach? I mechanically it means that Mages to spend one more reach then they would usually for controlling their spells.

>>51607432
He was a Child of Gaia Kinfolk whose brother and father got to shift, he didn't. Upset, he joined the Verbena, who taught him Hedge Magick, but his Avatar wouldn't awaken, so he tore a chunk off the World Tree and used it to fuel True Magick. He learnt a Rite that allowed anyone to become a Garou - a Skin Dancer - if they flayed five other Garou and sewed their skins together like Buffalo Bill, so he started his own Tribe. Next he went to New Orleans to get some Vitae so he could learn some Disciplines. Then he went further south to the Amazon and used an ancient artefact called The Conquistador's Sword to literally assrape an Archmage in their own Horizon Realm, no less, and steal their power. Finally he went to Mexico to awaken Shaitan and kickstart Gehenna, in the epic adventure module "The Chaos Factor". The World Tree staff is his great weakness, you see - such a thing should not exist in this world, and it was basically a paradox nuke set to go off when the Quintessence within ran out (a.k.a. "ten rounds from now").

It was when Richard Dansky published Wraith 2nd Edition that the devs finally cried out "no more!" and threw a tiny sidebar in that claimed he'd been soulforged into an ashtray.

But that was before the great Maelstrom...

Now, I haven't read the SAS adventure module "Skinner", but it's supposed to be about his legacy, because the Skindancers are still out there, and so is their Rite, and there are always men willing to kill for power, anon.

>>51607941
Maybe add a Havoc pool? Like yeah, you can Reach, but you're spell will be harder to control and won't do exactly what you want. On top of normal Paradox.

>>51607438
Oh no! No-one will believe you when you say you liked it before it was popular!!!

Why are THEY the hipsters, again?

>>51607487
Okay, if you insist
>*flop*
here comes the lipstick, bitch...

>>51607964
I didn't like it before it was popular.

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>>51607956
>Finally he went to Mexico to awaken Shaitan and kickstart Gehenna, in the epic adventure module "The Chaos Factor". The World Tree staff is his great weakness, you see - such a thing should not exist in this world, and it was basically a paradox nuke set to go off when the Quintessence within ran out (a.k.a. "ten rounds from now").
I don't know most the words you said but now I'm worried
Everything about V:TM is about impending armageddon, and apparently that's all kicked off by a Mary Sue?

>>51607681
This is why you will never work in the industry, Anon. You don't ask why the people want it, you just supply it. "Give the people what they want".

>>51607984
>"Give the people what they want".
Sounds like the kind of thing that ruins ips.

>>51607682
I doubt a musical number could soften the blow of dickeggs, anon.

>>51608001
Never seen Rent, huh?

Musical numbers can soften the blow of everything.

>>51607763

I'll just leave this here.

http://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/97127/Strange-Dead-Love

You pick any page, any page you want, and you start reading. And if you really want me to, I'll hunt out every embarrassing little morsel of teenage crap I can find in every CofD book I can pirate, and post it here in this General over the next 18 months. Is that what you want, Anon? Is that what you really, really want?

>>51607786
Well you obviously don't. It's okay. Just go back to your crayons and glitterglue.

>>51607804
A kind of code.

Like a kind of.... source code?

>>51608083
And you enjoy being strung up high on that horse, buddy.

>>51607989

It is. That's why you give people what you want and then convince them its actually what they want.

>>51607850
Honestly, they are the reason I prefer the OPP forums.
This is just people shitting on the games, with never any actual discussion happening.

I'm just here because the OPP forums are practically deserted, and thus only updates once in a blue moon.

>>51608074
Eh, still not very swayed to your perspective. It's just a supplement book. And romance isn't always as bad as Twilight. Again, hardly grounds for dismissing the whole game line. WoD had its bad eggs too.

>I'll hunt out every embarrassing little morsel of teenage crap I can find in every CofD book I can pirate, and post it here in this General over the next 18 months. Is that what you want, Anon? Is that what you really, really want?
Yes. I would love that. I mean it. Do it. I would absolutely love for criticisms of CofD to made with cited examples, because it hardly ever is. You go ahead and get started.

>>51608092
No, really just another kind of code in a universe full of codes. The books actually say that the universe doesn't revolve around the Supernal Realms, and that most magic isn't of the Awakened variety. Vampires use their own kind, Changelings use their own kind, and Werewolves use theirs, and so forth.

Demons are more about reality hacking, truthfully.

>>51607813
I did read one. Let's look at Requiem, shall we?

First, we have Clans that are meaningless. Utterly, utterly meaningless. They grant mechanics and nothing else, because they have no Clan culture, nothing past a shtick and crass stereotypes. "GOD, he is being SUCH A DAEVA" etc. Once you get into Bloodlines it gets even more pointless, because suddenly Nosferatu don't have to be ugly, Gangrel don't have to be living in the wilderness, etc. They lose what little cohesion they once had.

Next, we have five groups that have no reason to work together under any circumstances. Invictus are "the man", so why would they work with Carthians? Why would the Lancea Sanctum ever want to associate with the ultra-pagan Circle of Crone? How do Ordo Dracul experiments ever require contact with the other four factions? If "touchstones" allow a person to hold onto their Humanity - a "good thing" if I read it correctly - why ever associate with monsters at all, especially if they keep dicking each other over? There's no reason to do anything except go hobo and stay in touch with Touchstones, stay fed and try to wile away Eternity in a way that doesn't impact on anyone else.

We're not even given any information on how any of this fucking happened. What's the history of the Carthians? What are their victories, their losses? When were they founded? No-one can fucking remember, because dirtnaps come with free amnesia and no-one thought to write anything down. No-one even knows where vampires come from.

Blood Potence seems like something to strive for, except WAIT it limits your feeding options until you're nearly starving, forcing you to dirtnap it back down again, so there's no real reason to build that up either.

The Strix want everyone dead, and they're a bunch of goofy owls. But why? No-one fucking has a clue. Broad hints they may have started the whole shebang, but again, no-one wrote anything down. No reason to go wilderness.

>>51607831
>What is a non-disclosure agreement, Daddy?

>>51608201
So there actually isn't any proof that WoD is getting shows and movies and more games aside from the one?

>>51607824
Uhhh, yes, it is. It's CofD, not WoD. That makes it Forsaken's problem. Have fun sharing your games with alcoholic crocodiles.

>>51608227
It's not a problem at all, actually. You can still ignore things you don't like, and not have them in your games.

A common WoD approach, I believe.

>>51607856
What implications? The mass of humanity chose the Consensus. It's the reality they wanted. Take it up with the other 7.2 billion people.

>>51607861
Only if OPP continue to write the books.

>>51608192
>What's the history of the Carthians? What are their victories, their losses? When were they founded? No-one can fucking remember, because dirtnaps come with free amnesia and no-one thought to write anything down. No-one even knows where vampires come from.

Where we came from: In 1779, an apostate from the Parisian
Lancea et Sanctum published a pamphlet on a private press
entitled Contre Les Vampires Patriarcals. Like much of the best
literature of France just before the Revolution, it was a subtle,
nuanced text, rich with hidden meanings. Presenting as an
allegory the idea of the aristocrat as bloodsucking monster, the
pamphlet was in fact a call to arms for the neonate to throw
off the shackles of the elder.
The treatise was published under the name of Emmanuel
Baptiste Carth. This wasn’t the author’s name. His name
was apparently Eric Giraud. Giraud met Final Death under a
midnight guillotine in the 1790s, but Carth lived on; and as
revolutionary fervor gripped France, Carth took on a life of his
own. Across Europe, east and west, pamphlets under the name
of E. B. Carth appeared, each offering a political message for
the dead coded under an apparent tract for the living. Neonate
movements and reformers had existed before, but now they
had a name and banner under which to join, a shared identity.
By the middle of the 19th century, vampires who followed the
pamphleteers were calling themselves Carthians.
E. B. Carth is still publishing, mostly on the Internet.
Everyone knows that Carth is a fiction, but then, that’s the
source of his power. He is an idea, and the Carthians are
those who will kill for an idea. It is the power of the Carthian
idea that created, in the second half of the 20th century, the
phenomenon of Carthian Law, where the Blood itself obeys
the ideology of the vampires.

>>51607897
DON'T YOU TALK SHIT ABOUT MY WAIFU'S CONCENTRATED BLOOD-SPUNK, HIS CENTURIES OLD SEXUAL ORGANS REACH GREATER LEVELS OF FULL-ASS-RAPE-STIFFNESS THAN YOUR PITIFUL SECOND BELLYBUTTON COULD EVER HOPE FOR

>>51608260
Which they might. Even if they don't I doubt WoD will emerge entirely untouched by the atmosphere of progressiveness in modern media, especially in "nerd" hobbies.

>>51608249
The implications on thought-crime, racism, relative intelligence, your culture, the culture of others, the past, the future, fucking everything.

>>51608221
Elricsson gave multiple talks at Grand Masquerade where he stated they were in negotiations with directors and producers. It's the whole reason they're writing a style bible. He also said, and I quote, "a netflix series by 2020 or we will have failed." The same meeting they unveiled an interactive game based on Orpheus, the first of many such planned interactive games. Elricsson also stated that he has the entire compiled assets of the failed Vampire MMORPG's on hard drives waiting for an unspecified project. In the last year, two of the three major devs from Troika were taken on under a provisional retainer from White Wolf for an unspecified future project, and White Wolf renewed various IP protections for Bloodlines and it's related terms.

You should know better than to ask about "proof" when it comes to this industry. Things can die in development hell, plans can drop through, companies can go under. But if you read the writing on the wall, the intent is there, Elricsson is pushing hard and the momentum is building.

>>51608246
I don't understand, what have you got against alcoholics?

>>51608353
My dad was one and he beat me when he was drunk.

>>51608318
We chose this.

The monster is us.

Next question.

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>>51608318
Consensus reality is underpinned by earthly foundations, aka the shit that the cumdumpster YHWH set up. It's not the /only/ source of structure, it's just the most significant hurdle for mages.

>>51608343
>Things can die in development hell, plans can drop through, companies can go under.
Which is why I asked for actual proof.

I'll believe all of that when I actually see solid signs of it, not just hopeful words.

>>51608227
They are CofD. They are not WtF. Same as Inferno or Hurt Locker

>>51608367
That was your father's choice, Billy, it wasn't the alcohol. A drug can't "make" people do things, that's called "voodoo pharmacology". The drug may have impaired his ability to reason, but that was still his decision to drink that night before it all happened.

I suggest we pray.

>>51608378
Build a time machine then, you picky bitch. Nothing happens without the intent to do so first. I've stated the intent, and cited where you can confirm it. Everything else I stated - TV show, action figures, merch, comic books - already exists. There will be more. Elricsson doesn't pay for an IP with a briefcase full of Kroner unless he gets his goddamn due, and don't you forget it.

>>51608425
>Elricsson doesn't pay for an IP with a briefcase full of Kroner unless he gets his goddamn due, and don't you forget it.
I'm even less inclined to believe fanboyism.

>>51608074

>I'll just leave this here
>Drops a kind of OK but kind of dull latter-day White Wolf suppliment like it's a truth bomb

>>51608388
Oh, and where is WtF set again?

TORG?

AMBER Diceless Roleplaying?

FATAL?

D&D: Planescape?

It's.... why, it's CHRONICLES of DORKNESS, isn't? The EXACT SAME SETTING, hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

Game set match, Mr Dickeggs.

>>51608439
He did pay with a briefcase full of Kroner. Do the research.

Or you know, keep sitting there repeating "the earth is flat!", whatever, Mr Francis E Dec.

>>51608449
Guess that makes Keys of the Supernal Tarot a VtR supplement.

>>51608473
The way you all bleat about crossover, it kind of does.

More "caviar"?

>>51608463
Skepticism is kind of the opposite of flat earth logic. And what I meant was I'm even less inclined to believe your statements when you suck off Elricsson like that.

>>51608473
I'm reading about those Invictus Archmasters and True Fae Iron Masters

>>51608491
As opposed to what? Shitting all over him? Are my arguments only valid when I chime in with the chorus? You're saying you like to join in with the crowd, join the mob mentality without thinking for yourself? Good to know.

>>51608480
>The way you all bleat about crossover
Nice generalization. Beast is really the only book that operates under a pretense of crossover, and it sucks. Nobody likes it.

>it kind of does
Not really.

>>51608518
I'm being skeptical. Kind of the opposite of having a mob mentality. Again.

>>51608001
I dunno, I was thinking of him a Beast from the time where their lessons where actually relevant. His being "Don't let your sins consume you."...though, to be fair, his way of hammering it home is a bit weird.

>>51608518
>You're saying you like to join in with the crowd, join the mob mentality without thinking for yourself?
Seer's are like that, especially the ones that follow Unity.

Holy shit these threads are useless now. They hit bump limit in less than a day, and nothing of value is gained. Just the same old vs new argument everyone has had a million times I've since new was first made, and arguing about Mage. No wonder the devs don't come around anymore.

>>51608814

If you want to discuss stuff regularly, you have to either join SA for their thread, or try to post on OPP and just learn to live with the glacial pace. You can still do it here, but there's not enough material coming out fast enough to justify a general these days, so shitposting about the same old things is going to take up most of the post count.

This should be the last general, but it won't be.

Is there some asshole supernatural who can make a virgin conceive and see how her world spirals out of control when no one believes her that she's a virgin?

>>51608892
Mages, obviously. I imagine others are also capable, though.

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>>51607467
Please respond!

>>51608814

Eating a well done steak while shitposting about Mage supremacy is one of life's many great pleasures.

Stop being a total bitch and learn to accept it.

>>51608814
>nothing of value is gained
That's not entirely true. There's that guy that's converting Legacies to 2e.

>>51608964
Nobody wants to play Fallen, guy.

Sorry.

>>51609149
There was also guy who made bestiary for VtM and I think one of the WtF devs chimed in recently. So it's not all all piss and vomit of supremacy and edition wars.

But it is still grim

>>51609172
>I think one of the WtF devs chimed in recently
Yeah, Chris Allen popped in for a bit yesterday and chatted some about spirits and Soul Cage, if that's what you mean.

>But it is still grim
The truth is that it's only going to get worse.

/v/ will start to flood in as the Werewolf game gets closer, and they'll bring with them all the Vampfags who go over there to have their covert Masquerade threads.

The vampfags will renew the Caine v Archmages pissing contest, and the Supremacy posting will get worse than ever because /v/ will either join in with the magefags and troll or with the reactionary morons who can't ignore shitposting.

And then there's always the chance that they'll also inflame WoD v CofD arguments because they'll see what's posted here and assume that CofD is nothing but tumblr sjw garbage like the WoDfags want everyone to believe.

But I'll still be here, for whatever fucking reason that compels me to stay.

>>51609265

I'm here because there tends to be more newbies than other WoD places and I like giving ST advice.

>>51609273
That's neat. What games do you usually run?

>>51609292

Pretty much CofD, I think I've run something in every line except Beast. I've run some WoD, too, but not as much as I'd like even though I prefer CofD's ruleset. I'd love the Translation Guides to get updated to 2e and for a Lost/Dreaming guide. Maybe a Geist/Wraith one even though there's no real "translation" there.

>>51609377
>I think I've run something in every line except Beast
Even Mummy? What do you even do in Mummy?

>>51609273
I for one am a fresh VtR ST 10 games into my campaign and I've came here interested in other people stuff.

Was a bit disappointed.

On an unrelated note I would like to ask people about some nosferatu look ideas. How would you make nosferatu look disturbing/off but still passable for a human? I'm talking less body horror and more uncanny valley

>>51608964
>>51609165
Just today finished reading Fallen cover to cover, but it doesn't seem like a game I want to play. Looks like most of the game would be roleplaying personal interactions, and that just doesn't sound like fun to me.

>>51609437

Mummy's very high concept but it has a clear "arc": retrieve Vessels, deal with Cult/Guild drama, discover the character's past and how it ties in with the overall setting and its secrets, set over the generations in a potentially non-linear means of storytelling. If anything, it might actually suffer from too tight of a narrative path compared to other CofD games, which like to be a bit more open about gameplay. If you're not going to seek the Mentaar and you're not entirely up to speed with Mummy, a campaign can risk spinning its wheels.

Despite that, it's harder to figure out what to do from the surface level because Mummy doesn't really fit into what I call "The Campaign", which is your archetypical Prelude/Origin and rise to power story that almost all CofD and WoD games do. Even Promethean follows the Archetype, though it replaces "rise to power" with a more picaresque narrative. Beast seems to as well, but there's so little to Beast that I couldn't quite say for sure. I'd need to run it to be sure and well, I can't say I'm chomping at the bit to do that.

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>>51608074
I mean, if you want to go there man, we can talk a lot about all the teenage crap that can be found in WoD.

>>51605542

The peasants are getting uppity again

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>>51609787

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>>51607467
>>51608964
Fallen's rare enough, so sure I'll give it a shot.
Discord username is Erlkönig
ID is #8320.

Now that the dust has settled, can we agree that nuWoD is shit?

>>51610028
>Now that the dust has settled

Oh, the fucking irony of what comes next.

Shots been fired for the 100th time now.

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>>51610028
Tell me about it.

>>51610069
>what comes next.
>Shots been fired for the 100th time now.

Damm, M20 is the gift that keeps on giving with those little sidebars.

So anybody got a link to that Forsaken 2nd edition cheat sheet? I am wanting to do a version of it in Spanish for one of my players but cant find it.

>>51607182
> "full of settings, concepts, plot hooks, and characters"
>sidebars that try to limit you by telling you that you are a racist for not voting democrats and being progressive
>bland stereotypical writing (with some memorable exceptions like Mage, Mummy and Demon) that even more blatantly copycats than oWod
>books like Conquering Heroes exist
seriously, anon?

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>>51610121
I think this is 2nd edition Forsaken:
https://i.yuki.la/tg/1457154642256.pdf

>>51609439

Play up and exaggerate slight body imperfections. A lazy eye that never falls on you, but you can always feel it on you when your back is turned. Arms that are just slightly bulkier than the rest of the body. A nose broke in several places that never quite settled down right. Stuff like that.

>>51608268
Contradicted in their own book
Just shows that the Carthians are a major fail, all the bad part of VTMs Anarchs and none of the good (instead, you have ridiculous things like Carthian laws. I dread the day that some heck at OPP uses Carthian law to "fix" the wage gap or some similar crap)

>>51610186
>>sidebars that try to limit you by telling you that you are a racist for not voting democrats and being progressive
Ironically the only sidebars I've seen in this vein come from WoD 20th edition books. See above. Mage Noir touched on the sexism and racism of the 40's a bit, but only to say "your characters don't have to be racist or sexist if you don't want them to be".
>>bland stereotypical writing (with some memorable exceptions like Mage, Mummy and Demon) that even more blatantly copycats than oWod
This is really a matter of opinion. For all it's outlandish shit, WoD strikes me as more bland and stereotypical than anything in CofD. Also, kind of weird that you shit on CofD and then say that it copycats WoD. If that's not what you meant then you need to learn how to use parenthesis.
>>books like Conquering Heroes exist
Yeah, because WoD never had a bad book, right? Throwing out shit you didn't like was something that never happened ever?

Hypocrite.

>>51610292
>books like Conquering Heroes exist
Montreal By Night

>>51610292
Give it up anon. I have Masquaradefag in my vtr and he insists only brujah makes sense as a vampire biker. Even if vtr brujah makes no sense in setting we are playing in. There is no helping this people

>>51610368
VTM was a mistake

>>51606331
You copypasted the ruling arcanum from the Celestial Masters. Otherwise pretty cool.

>>51610439
VtM was one of the biggest things in tabletop rpg fandom here where I live for most of the 90s and half of the 2000s. Along with Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay and Call of Cthulhu it shaped at lot of people opinions about rpg and gaming in general.

This were dark times indeed,

>>51607097
If you're still going, can we get some Orphans of Proteus?

>>51607034
>Havin to struggle to keep clinging to the last bit of your human nature not to become a cold, uncaring beast, while everything around you from your supepowers to how you feed to how you experience pain and pleasure to how long you can live keep reminding you you are not in fact human anymore and you might as well give up yourself and become that mindless beast is not reasonable angst.

I'm not familiar enough with wtf and mtaw to do a similar run out

>>51610277
>Contradicted in their own book
Ah, do show me where it says the origins of the Carthian Movement is unknown then.

>uses Carthian law to "fix" the wage gap

This isn't oWoD. Vampires aren't the cause of any wages.

>>51608192

>Rant of clans
The clan is the race of the vampire. You expect every person born of a certain race to have the same history or opinion as everyone else of the same race other than a generic stereotype?

>rant on covenants
You mean like republicans and democrats? Huge news, in life you have to deal with people you hate because you would lose too much in a war. Many vampires go hobo and have to fight to find somewhere to feed without being hunted away, others use covenants.to find a purpouse or a comfy chair. It's a personal choice.

>rant on history
That's plain false. There is a lot of mystery before the camarilla, who would have fucking thought that history before the roman empire would be vague. But the covenants have a generic history, also because every city has its own events that shape its own politics

>rant on blood potency
The fact that you like your elders to be overpowered mary sue with nothing to fear from time or enemies, doesn't mean any other idea is bad.