Warmachine / Hordes General - /wmhg/

Reserved for Skorne.

So I'm looking to improve my Reznik2 list. Idea is to drop him into Hordes, Ret, and Cygnar (and maybe Khador).

My list so far is:

War Room Army

Protectorate of Menoth - Reznik2 Test

Theme: No Theme Selected
42 / 75 Army


Servath Reznik, Wrath of Ages - WJ: +29
- Madelyn Corbeau, Ordic Courtesan - PC: 4
- Devout - PC: 9 (Battlegroup Points Used: 9)
- Guardian - PC: 15 (Battlegroup Points Used: 15)
- Scourge of Heresy - PC: 16 (Battlegroup Points Used: 5)

Wrack - PC: 1

Choir of Menoth - Leader & 5 Grunts: 6
Daughters of the Flame - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10
Daughters of the Flame - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10


---

GENERATED : 02/01/2017 16:48:22
BUILD ID : 2034.17-01-07

What other models should I include for these matchups? I'd like more shield guards, but I also think blessed guns would help a lot.

Storytime.

>Be me, barely learned to play, just starting to git gud
>Suddenly Mk. III drops, local Warmahordes players all disappear off the face of the earth
>Fast forward 9 months, suddenly they all start showing up at the LGS again, no explanation as to why they stopped coming in other than "Life happened".
>No idea how to play Mk. III, barely remember Mk. II
>Ask people to help me learn the new rules
>Everyone says they will, nobody actually does
>This goes on for 6 weeks
>I've given up on Warmahordes completely
>Pressganger buys me a model, says I should magnetize it, etc.
>Still nobody will teach me to play
>Can't even get motivated to assemble the new model, because what's the point?

/rant

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>>51514826
>Pressganger
>doesn't teach you the rules
Isn't that one of the duties of a Pressganger?

>>51514882
Supposedly, but he's always too busy.

>>51514826
Even in your darkest hour, don't give up Anon! I believe in you!

>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGJqSUoJscU

>>51514826
>Can't google the official fucking tutorial that explains everything perfectly

Does anyone know if there's any benefit on the press ganger application to having 2 boxes painted for each system?

>>51514686
Take a Templar

Why do people like guardians anyway?

I feel like I'd rather have either an arc node or a melee heavy, not both in one. The revenger is perfectly serviceable and is faster.

>>51515174
Why not just bring like 7 Crusaders?

>>51515174

He's what you reach for if you want a second arc node and a heavy, but don't have 20pts for a Revenger and a Crusader. You can buy a lot with the spare 5pts, allegiants, maxing a unit, etc, just a nice option to have. Mat 7, reach and a high Pow on one war jack are also stellar selling points.

>>51515056
Didn't know there was one, but thanks for your help.

>>51514280
I think its alright, though the picture quality isn't great. (the painting threads have quick easy to understand guides for photographing models good.).

His face looks a little weird but I love the details on the lower body and dangly bits.

Getting back into minions after spazzing out over a perceived loss of faction identity with the merging of shoes and bacon.
Kinda loving it now, took a few games tonight with Helga, loads of posse and Gobber pirates slamming things towards me.
Gotta say, the despite Flying Circus getting murdered there's still plenty of shenanigans.

>>51515127
Well it's a prerequisite for passing.

>>51516685
No it isn't. It requires having two boxes painted of one system.

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So I'm planning on building up my trollbloods battle box, and this is what I've come up with so far
http://conflictchamber.com/#b70p_-0bfL0j0h0i9D6R0k0m

Trollbloods Army - 24 / 25 points
Theme: The Power of Dhunia

(Ragnor 1) Ragnor Skysplitter, The Runemaster [+30]
- Troll Bouncer [9]
- Troll Axer [10]
- Troll Impaler [11]
- Dire Troll Mauler [15]
Troll Whelps [0]
Krielstone Bearer & Stone Scribes (min) [6]
- Stone Scribe Elder [3]
Where can I go from here? Maybe some different warcasters I could consider?

>>51517501
Oh, and I've also got a unit of Fennblades if that helps

Hey, I like the Warmahordes setting, but I'm having trouble finding stories, and the setting doesn't lend itself to the community creating fun fiction.

I was looking through the NQ contents list, but my eyes kinda glazed over at the endless rule releases that are now years out of date, and few stories (which I imagine would still be just as fluff relevant).

Is there anywhere in particular I should be looking for fluff and setting stuff?

Finally, has any company had a personal special magazine for just their products that was actually worth the paper?

>>51517705
In any No Quarter magazines, the Gavin Kyle stuff gives a decent amount of story on some of the key figures in the setting from the point of view of an information dealer.

Outside of that, I'd suggest just looking at the table of contents sections of them and looking for the parts that sound like they would actually be fluff related.

>>51517501
You could add a bomber and a knot to that list if you want to keep the same theme

Failing that, if you want to use your fenns, Madrak 2 is pretty money with them on feat turn and he likes your mauler and axer.
Thee's also grissel 2 with the impaler and bouncer since she likes having snipe around and someone to help ferry her to assassination range

Ive got a few questions, guys.
First: what is better, warmahordes or malifaux?
Second: why did Confrontation die?
Thank you for your answers.

>>51518284
Conjurer of weak baits

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>>51518031
How's Madrak3? He looks neat.

>>51518351
Saves you a krielstone, doesn't do assassination runs as good as his other incarnations but would probably work pretty good in the champions and friends theme list so you'd want champions, warders and tuffalo

>>51518411
Does he really save you a Krielstone? I'd think the self aura would be nice, but is it really a replacement?

>>51518470
Depends on the enemy, what you'll miss is the elder as opposed to the stone itself
Madrak 3 is pretty unlike the other madraks, the other madraks supported, but were primarily assassination locks, madrak3 has it the other way around

>>51518284
1) One is a wargame, the other is a skirmish. Which of those do you prefer? Or in other words: What is better, Apple or Banana?
2) I hear it had pretty miniatures and shit rules. Then it lost the former and kept the latter.

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>>51517501
I'd recommend grabbing anything you think looks cool.
Look and feel dictate a troll army even harder than most factions imo due to their even more than most varied visually and thematically model line. If you like guns they have a guy or two who can rock those. If you prefer medieval combat you can run that. They even have a warcaster who specializes in circle-esque douchy movement shenanigans.

I'm a fan of Trollkin Champions
Part of the problem with trolls is that they love infantry in the edition where everything and its mom can kill infantry. Khador at least had their uniquely horrifying warjacks to fall back on.

Personally I'd like to run a brick with champs and some other infantry piece to anvil with em.

I feel like trollkin infantry is there to die and buy time for their beast to murder the important things and ignore everything else.

>>51518542
To be fair, Warmachine also runs skirmish level. And unlike GW games it actually holds up as a fun game at that level.

How does it compare to Malifaux? Does Malifaux also have singular defining leader models? Is it more freeform? Based on your answer it seems you feel the both serve very different needs as games. Care to elaborate on that difference? As they are both similar in that they are pulpy settings with stylized factions and the players choose to collect models of a given faction to pit their force against another player.

>>51518570
>Whoa bruh personal space
>I'M FUCKING PISSED

>>51518660
They do serve very different needs in that Malifaux is way more objective-focussed, while Warmachine has more emphasis on attrition. Malifaux also has no unit rules and activations alternate between both players. I personally think they have very different appeal though I consider both excellent.

Both do however revolve around a central miniature (WMH: Warcaster/Warlock, MA: Master), but there is no such thing as an assassination victory (usually).

>>51519474
See your post here has all sorts of tantalizing info. Gets me all hot and bothered thinking about alternating play. Only game I've played like that is battletech. And battletech has...issues.

>>51519505
What issues?

>>51519709
Rules for everything. So many modifiers. The two army balance systems don't really work. Oh the charts, so many charts. It's cool as a casual game that takes a day tho

Alright gents I haven't played since MK2, and I barely got 6 games in with it before people started getting salty around my meta. I've had the itch to restart recently but nothing is grabbing me thus far except for the alt ashlynn model.

What does she need to be good?
Are there definite weak points to her I should be concerned about?
Does she have a theme list this time round?

Also what's the deal with Karchev? His entire kit while still revolving around jacks seems to have changed since the last time I saw him.

>>51518351
He is a toolbox that asks no questions, has answers to everything but the answers are too weak to be called a counter and has no feat. You will need the krielstone anyway because he doesnt have elder powers and want to spend most of his fury anyway, so it means that a big chunk of his ability allowance is dead.

>>51517501
Anybody remembers the rumors that ragnor is going to be large based? Such a shame he turned out not to be. If he was he would balance out having three lights in the battlebox and would open an interesting list building possibility (considering how most large based casters have nonstandard gamestyles).

>>51516023
Thanks. I tend to not give a fuck about faces, but I was going for the horrified look, hence the mouth full of black shit. The highlights came out super well though. I posted it on a UK painting group and someone said they hope their own Willbreaker comes out even half as well. Aww yiss.

>>51518333
More like a noob actually.
But i was thinking of selling my WMH army as i find Malifaux rather more visually appealing. Lore-wise aswell.
Asked the question because i have 4 factions of WMH and yet i find it so hard to make my friends play a game or two with me in a 2v2 or at least 1v1.
While malifaux interested them very much. Also more balanced. Yet i like the wargames and want to play them.
>>51518542
Well i got your answer about Confrontation and you actually answered my question about malifaux and WMH. Thank you.

>>51521738
Wut

>>51521812
Wrong thread, meant it for a Chinese comic thread.

>>51517705
Few good sources for all the fluff:

- all the non-faction book releases going back to Mk1 have a significant amount of fluff. See if you can find em cheap used, or check out the OP for links.

- The RPG books are actually a great concentrated source of setting fluff. Books for both the old and new system are great, though obviously the new ones are more up to date with the wargame... Kings, Nations, Gods in particular covers all the WM factions in detail.

>>51518660
>How does it compare to Malifaux?
WMH and Mali have a somewhat different flavor, but they're very close relatives on the wargame family tree. The biggest divergence is probably that Malifaux is alternating activations. WMH tends to have more miniatures in the game at "full" size - 25-40 on average compared to Malifaux's 8-15. But they both build their forces around one superpowered leader model, both use unit stat cards, both use a "stat + random vs target number" resolution system, have units with a lot of special rules and moves, use points-scoring based scenarios, etc.

Each of them does some things better than the other. If you like one of the systems, good chance you'd find things to like in the other as well.

>>51521133
Why? Being on a larger base is only ever a negative. Easier to draw LoS, harder to move between models / terrain...

Not to say there couldn't be a large based version of Ragnor that worked, but it would have to look very different from the cards we got.

T-minus 6 days, where my Circle Christmas spoilers at?

>>51522867
I think we won't get them before Monday.

Tomorrow only if we are real lucky.

>>51522286
Just make him whoopass style like eKromac. Replace his spells with some battlegroup buff, control range infantry buff and shockwave stays. Crank his stats a bit up so he can go frontline. Gets less battlegroup points and six fury. Ability that grants a fluffy bonus to ff models with magic ability. Feat improves spellcasting and heals models within control range.

>>51522262
Malifaux is a true skirmish game, and is more heavily dependent on objectives. I often make the comment to players that you can build a crew that runs schemes and never actually have to play the killing game.

Warmahordes is still at it's heart a wargame where the objective is usually "Welcome to hamburger hill"

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>>51524171

Before, I would have said Warmahordes was a superior game in every aspect. Now, I'd say;

>Miniature Quality: Malifaux
>Theme: Malifaux
>Rules: Tie
>Balance: Warmahordes
>Unique: Malifaux
>Community: Malifaux

Warmarhordes probably still has the best balance but boy they sure tried to fuck that up with Mk 3.

>>51524410
Warmahordes is currently about spam lists so I don't think it's winning any awards for balance.

>>51524435
Except when said spam lists keep losing to Cryx, despite it being the "worst faction the game".

>>51524562
>Slayer
>10pts
>MAT7
>3 initials at PS16
>2 open fists
>SPD6
Name a warbeast that even comes close to this unmitigated bullshit.

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>>51514493

What's the community opinion on all-out kitbashes? I understand some people have an aneurysm at using the wrong colour scheme, so anything that's likely to get me kicked out of a tourney is bad news.

Pic related is Moros. Moros is very pretty.
Every other Ret 'Jack looks like ass. If Mk2 tactics are still a thing, I probably want to invest in a lot of Griffons.

Would it be acceptable to buy a whole bunch or Moroi, splice some spears/shields/helmets onto them, and run them all as Griffonspam?


Assuming that the cost of bitz is not an object, how workable is this for something like a large-scale Warmachine event?
Similar questions for using Imperatus as a heavy base.

>>51524611
Rotterhorn

>>51524626
That looks like a fuck

>>51524694
>Rotterhorn
>7 point
>2 intials POW 10
>light

Are you even trying ?

>>51524626
Depends entirely on your tournament organizer.
I TO locally and I don't care what models you use as long as it's clear what is happening.
No weapons that don't belong, if they have a shield rule, give them a shield on the model etc.

Have a player that plays Ret with a bunch of Wood elf models and another that plays tharn using a bunch of Beastmen.

Do not count on a TO being cool with it tho, I notice alot of asshurt from purists.

>>51524611
Yes but you are wrong, because Cryx players say that the Slayer is the worst heavy ever made in both systems, because it loses systems to shooting.

And you can't argue with a Cryx players now, can you?

>>51524611
Zuriel.

>>51524626
100% legal. Griffon is the only ret jack with a spear and shield, hell the only one with either of them, so there is no mistaking.

>>51524914
This. It'd be a pretty rad conversion since, yeah, most Warmahordes models are ass.

>>51525096
If they put half as much effort into their regular models as they did their character warnouns then they'd look fine.

>>51524410
>Quality
GW hands down. They are, after all, a miniatures company first and foremost :^)
>Lore / Aesthetic
Malifaux's lore is really all over the place and poorly tied together. A lot of it boils down to "it happens because mystery" which is shite storytelling.
>Rules
Warmahordes hands down. The movement rules on many Malifaux cards leave just about every model able to zip around the battle field, making positioning all but useless. Not to mention with the way the rules and objectives work, you might as well not bending models at all, since the actions and positions of your soldiers matter so much less than what's on their stat cards.
>Balance
Warmahordes.
>Unique
I mean, you got me there. It's unique but so is any other poor mishmash of genres.
>Community
"Not tabletop games" would be the right answer

>>51525164
>Quality
GW. No real comparison.

>Lore
Mostly who cares, but, honestly, GW. WHFB is bland as fuck, sure, but 40k's lore is actually entertaining because it doesn't take itself seriously.

>Aesthetic
Everyone does some things well and some things poorly.

>Rules
WMH no question.

>Balance
WMH no question. WMH right now is second only to 40k at the very start of 3e in balance (note to the gamers without grey hair: 40k 3e had army lists for every faction in the back of the main rulebook, and because it had rules for all factions, none of them had any special rules, so it was bland as fuck, but it was balanced). There are still problems, but it's still excellent compared to... just about everything else.

>Unique
Who gives a fuck.

>Community
We're cancer, they're cancer, everyone is cancer.

>>51519709
pretty much this
>>51520309
Its really neat the degree to which you track your mecha breaking down, and falling down, but everything has a chart it corresponds to. Also the army system is hyper freeform. Its literally just take the same tonnage of mechs. Also the fights can start to feel grindy as your forces both become increasingly unable to fight and turtling can be quite strong (Even more so than warmachine.)

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Wow is it just me or are those new Legion models really ugly.

Being the only person that not just likes wmh models but prefers them to GW feels weird. I am normally quite critical but outside of old models I cant think of anything with glaring issues.

>>51527608
I prefer WMH too, a lot of GW stuff just looks really samey to me, and space marines just look stupid also.

Trump will end competitive spam lists.

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>>51527608
>>51527663

>>51527832
Yup. Still like the model on the left better. It has nicely done hands amd face and the armor is awesome. The pose really wonky though. The mini on the left is well sculpted but the design has that oldschool vibe from times when nerds couldnt afford good artists (think 80s comic books or first entries in blizzard franchises). The thingy he is standing on is atrocious though.

>>51527832
The model on the right looks like straight ass to me. Way too busy with details, can't make heads or tails of it's face or head, and the base looks absolutely terrible.

The one on the left isn't amazing but is decent if boring. The pose is a little wired though.

>>51527960
>>51528762

Guys. Eyeless sight means you see better, not suffer blind.

>>51527832
I can't tell if that thing on the left is supposed to be a centaur or a retarded dragonspawn with a nyss for a head

>>51528938
Unironically it's both

>>51527832

The model on the right is a bit busy but ok.

The model on the left looks like a fucking awful conversion.

>>51527331
I think I see the problem here, anon. That's not a Legion model, it's a opossum.

Also, fuck you, opossums are adorable.

>>51529393
/thread

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>>51529393

That said, a giant opossum warbeast would be sweet.

>>51527832

It's weird to say but, I think GW models have become super over designed in a bad way.

Yeah, the actual quality of the models are better (better cast with finer details) but the design is not my jam.

I actually like Kallus2. He isn't something I would criticize as "bad." I would point to a lot of the Skorne "big head mode" models or the Animanterax model. Also the new Feora is just kind of boring and chunky. Then of course you have Brickhouse who, while not a bad model, has the weirdest ass pose.

Honestly, a lot of WMH models seem to have okay sculpts but bad poses. A lot of the basic infantry isn't great either. Honestly though, design wise, I think most of it is alright.

Worst offender for me is Despoiler and the sculptor of him basically said he was rushed through it. That said, I do find that a lot of WMH models are actually way better in person than on their website. I don't know if they have a shitty photographer or what.

>>51524754

Play Una2.

>>51530368
This. I mean, just compare these Age of Sigmar Khorne dudes with the good old Chaos Warriors.

One design is shitted to death with thousands of horns and evil faces, making it forgettable chaos-chaff in the GW miniature pallet, while the other is a classic that will forever hold up as a perfect design.

>>51514826

This isn't really an excuse or anything for that PG anon, but I've come to find that a lot of PG's really don't like teaching the game. Like, at local tournies and conventions, when the job for running demo's comes up, nobody ever wants to do it. They'd rather TO tournies, or run whatever various task there is, but for the most part they absolutely avoid teaching the game.

I don't really know why. I'm a PG, and I've always loved teaching the game. It's always satisfying to see someone process how the game works and slowly form their own strategies and testing them out.

Then again, I see the same attitude in a lot of games. Our local infinity meta is similar. Teaching new folks the game is low priority, it's all about having tournaments. Not really much to be done about it. Hell, journeyman leagues are fun, but I guess not when you're a veteran player. Not being able to field your own personal list robs all fun out of the game, so we have awful turn outs so journeyman leagues stopped happening.

We DEF skewing, BOYZ

>>51530791

That's a very good spell list...

Looking at her Feat, she might end up being an assassination machine.

I am glad she doesn't have any threat extension. Not that Circle actually needs it.

Stalkers with Sprint+Reposition [3"] are going to be annoying as fuck.

>>51530791
>>51530813
>>51530830
>>51530854

Kneejerk reaction:

We knew mounted, Repo 3, FM: Repo 3, Synergy, and basically what the feat was.

Mildly disappointed that she has heavy cav Reposition and speed but light cav ARM, but I spent a lot of Mk2 dealing with Morv2's 15/15.

Fog of War is great, given how much Circle shit has prowl.

Blood Spiller is... as good of a zot as could be expected, and with Fog of War bark nodes are a lot more survivable, so she'll get to use it.

Soothing Song is really good paired with Synergy.

Overall: Solid A/A+ caster. I don't think she's as good as Una2 (or Amon, for that matter), but looks to have enough builds to be a tournament pairing for most competitive Circle warlocks.

She is a love-child between Amon and Harkevich, only that she lost a speedbuff (probably for being in Hordes).

>>51531026

Circle does have Blackclad Wayfarers who have Hunters Mark. So, she has threat extension if she needs it.

I am more worried about her or her armies ability to feat and go through your whole army to kill your caster with +3/+3 Mat and Dmg.

At the very least it looks like they still can't declare charge targets they can't see like Testament can.

Still a good as caster though.

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>>51530854
>Circle gets 2 Una2s
you know what I think I'm done

>>51531149
>werewolves

>>51531341

I dunno, where?

>>51531229
Meh, she's weaker than Una2. Doesn't change much.

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Spitballing Kaya3 lists.

Ok, so I've never played, but have been thinking about starting up.

I bought a friend's Menoth collection (unpainted) on the cheap, and have started painting, but I'm still fuzzy on the rules and models. What I have is

Kreos
Feora
Repenter
Revenger
Vanquisher
Crusader
10 Daughters of the Flame
5 Exemplar Cinerators
10 Exemplar Errants
10 Flameguard Cleansers
10 Idrian Skirmishers

Good force or am I screwed?

>>51531654
>Kreos

Which one? I'm assuming 1; Kreoss1 is good. Very good. He's kinda boring, though.

>Feora

Crap.

>Repenter

Crap.

>Revenger

Ok, depending on the list.

>Vanquisher

Ok, depending on the list.

>Crusader

Solid cheap heavy.

>10 Daughters of the Flame

Very good now.

>5 Exemplar Cinerators

Kinda crap now.

>10 Exemplar Errants

Playable, but not as good as they used to be.

>10 Flameguard Cleansers

Good in the right list.

>10 Idrian Skirmishers

Awesome these days.


Step 1: Get a Choir.
Step 2: Get a Reckoner.

And then get some time playing. You've got *most* of a starting Protectorate set, but you need a Choir and Reckoner to make it really work.

>>51531842
Also, get the command attachment that goes with the Idrians (and the Cleansers one if you want to play them).

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So I just picked up these guys because all signs were pointing me to these being essentially required for Trollbloods, even though I'm playing Gunny. Should I run the full unit? Also is the UA a solid pick up as well? Thanks for the advice.

>>51532262
UA is, by conventional wisdom, required for them. He adds a lot of utility to the unit. Max unit probably isn't a bad idea, because with the UA the coverage of his additional effects is much better and it's already a pricey inclusion as a minimum unit+UA.

>>51532262
Let me save you some time and effort. The list of Trollblood essentials is as follows:
- Madrak-2
- Ragnor
- Grissel-2
- Calandra
- Mountain King
- Mauler
- Bomber
- Bouncer
- Rok
- Axer
- Warders
- Fire Eaters (2 units)
- Fennblades
- Fennblade UA
- Kriel Stone (Hey! You already have it).
- Kriel stone UA
- Whelps
- Swamp Gobbers

Then it really doesn't matter what else you get. Trolls have been the "aggressively average" faction since Mk. I. We are perhaps the most boring we've ever been in Mk. III and I don't see that changing any time soon. Oh, well.

>>51530261
well, now I just want a giant opossum model so I can use it as a colossal.

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>>51531619
>Meh, she's weaker than Una2. Doesn't change much.

Fucking cracks me up.

The game is so fucking unbalanced right now, that Circle, with Stalkers, get a Synergy Fog of War, Good Feat, Reposition Warlock and they say meh.

This game is just fucking dumb anymore.

>>51532877
>Synergy
>19 point model

Hits exactly as hard and moves exactly as fast as a 10 point model under Amon.

Kaya3 would be worth bitching about if Amon or Una2 didn't exist. In the world where they do, meh. She's an interesting caster that gives her faction new builds, but isn't going to shake up the meta, because Una2 already does what she does with a vastly superior feat and better spell list.

>>51524626

What a shit design.

>>51532591
How does this list look? I play 50pts fairly casually. Normally I'd be using Gunnbjorn because I already have it and have it painted, but of those ones you listed Grissel2 seemed the most fun.

Trollbloods Army - 49 / 50 points

(Grissel 2) Grissel Bloodsong, Marshal of the Kriels [+27]
- Dire Troll Bomber [19]
- Dire Troll Mauler [15]
- Slag Troll [10]
Krielstone Bearer & Stone Scribes (max) [9]
- Stone Scribe Elder [3]
Trollkin Fennblades (max) [15]
- Fennblade Officer and Drummer [5]

I keep the slag troll because all of my friends I play with play Warmachine armies. We can proxy anything but Gargossals so mountain king is out too.

I may keep playing Gunnbjorn just to try him out a bit more, but this list is not very ranged so I'll probably switch him out for Grissel2 or Ragnor at some point.

>>51532984
Circle having the option for any combination or potential of Una2, Wurmwood (even post nerf) and Kaya3 is gonna be a difficult scenario for some factions. Namely Skorne and Cryx due to the potential fuck you to melee.

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>>51533192

I run this;

http://conflictchamber.com/#b71b_-0b7e0r0r9D0k0m6n6n6n6nfJfJ6R

Trollbloods Army - 75 / 75 points
Theme: The Power of Dhunia

(Grissel 2) Grissel Bloodsong, Marshal of the Kriels [+27]
- Dire Troll Bomber [19]
- Dire Troll Bomber [19]
- Dire Troll Mauler [15]
Krielstone Bearer & Stone Scribes (min) [6]
- Stone Scribe Elder [3]
Trollkin Runeshapers [9]
Trollkin Runeshapers [9]
Trollkin Runeshapers [9]
Trollkin Runeshapers [9]
Northkin Shaman [0]
Northkin Shaman [0]
Troll Whelps [4]


Runeshapers are DEF 18 to shooting
Knockdown every where for Bombers
Grissel can knock down 3 targets a turn herself
You can remove a heavy every turn, reliably, from range
Dash lets Runeshapers move around models and Trembler

It rocks

>>51533328
My list:

http://conflictchamber.com/#b71b_-0b7e0rc6bL0jfp0k0m6n6n7d6R

Trollbloods Army - 74 / 75 points
Theme: The Power of Dhunia

(Grissel 2) Grissel Bloodsong, Marshal of the Kriels [+27]
- Dire Troll Bomber [19]
- Mountain King [36]
- Trollkin Runebearer [0]
- Troll Bouncer [9]
Dhunian Knot [6]
Krielstone Bearer & Stone Scribes (min) [6]
- Stone Scribe Elder [3]
Trollkin Runeshapers [9]
Trollkin Runeshapers [9]
Janissa Stonetide [0]
Troll Whelps [4]

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>>51533328
>It rocks

>>51532984
Always Bitching about Amon,
Menoth hasn't won a single tournament
git gud

>>51527832
The sculptor for left should rethink the pose. The sculptor for right should rethink his profession.

>>51535056
You should go to an eye doctor

>>51535279
different strokes fer different folks, friendo

>>51535289
you have the strokes.

>>51535279
Thanks but I can see all of the useless shit that some hack puked on the right one just fine. You do know there's such a thing as "too much shit going on", right? Design is not about adding more shit until it becomes physically impossible to add more shit.

>>51535462
aesthetic starts at form. The guy on the right is clearly shooting an arrow, what the fuck is Kallus doing? How the fuck does he move? Does he walk on his hind leg while the arms flail about? Is he legit centaur? Why are his beast arms so short then?

>>51535554
Prepping to mount you.

>>51535554
He is being threatening or perhaps giving an order. I would assume he can move normally or on all fours depending on the mood.

Is khador filthy GOMMUNISM?

>>51535794
No, it's more Tzar era Russia

>>51530409
Low quality bait.

>>51530921
Why? They can sprint or repo three whole inches instead. Woo.

>>51514882
Over half of the press gangers don't even know the rules.

My Mammoth arrived this morning.

>tfw tfw when you prime by hand

Suffering.

>>51535554
It is clear to me that Kallus is rearing up on his hindlegs in response to some action or threat.

>>51537692
I'll rearup kallus desu.

>>51535794
>>51535851
It's a bunch of russian tropes all into one. Baba yaga is in there, too. The 5th border legion is very obviously inspired by industrialized soviet military.

>>51537228
I never looked back from buying an airbrush. I'm by no means good with it, but it's stuff like that that it's still invaluable for.

>>51537228
I like priming by hand more because I feel I get it more covered and more even, but if I got a Gargantuan I might consider spray primer. Good luck! Hope it turns out good.

>>51538401
I used to do just that but with plain back paint. Needless to say I know better now.

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If I were able to get an extra beast from the battle box for free, which one should I get?
Bouncer, Axer, or Impaler?

>>51540422
Bouncer. There is no reason for a second Axer and the Impaler is border-line worthless right now for 11 points.

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>>51532984

Yeah, leave out the other parts. Like;

Stalkers have DEF 14
Stalkers have Sprint, she grants Repo
Stalkers have Warp Prowl, in Fog of War...

I could go on but either you don't know the models involved or you're just PP FanBoying.

Also, let's say she wasn't as strong as Amon or Una 2. Just stating that tells you how fucked up the game is, which was my initial point.

The game is so bad that unless it's Una 2 or Amon, players don't blink. Guess what will happen when (If) they fix Amon Crusader Spam or Una 2 Griffon spam.

Kaya will suddenly be an issue.

The game is so bad at this point, at their pace of fixing things, it will take years to make it right. Man, PP just fucked things up so bad it makes me sad.

>>51540422

If it's free, take a Bouncer. Then sell it for Infinity models.

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>>51541074
Nice Meme!

Chain Attack FB page has a lot of new spoiler :

Caine3
Loki
Brickhouse
Cygnar Theme
Kallus
Azrael

>>51541448
well at least Brickhouse is as meh as his pose.

>>51541051
You don't have to play
You don't have to post
You can leave
or git gud

>>51541051
Stop doom cycling.

I played Morv2 from release until the end of Mk2, I'm well aware of how well Warp Prowl works with Fog of War. It's not as good as having faster beasts that hit about as hard that have full-on Stealth natively *and* Long Leash.

You're whining that Kaya3 *might* be a problem after nerfs take out a couple of other casters. That's fucking stupid. She's playable but not top of the line -- whining that she's not weaker is specifically asking for new casters to come out that are bad -- because, hey, if they're playable, when the casters above them get nerfed, they might be a problem, right?

Fuck off.

Can we please sto whining about Una2 and Kaya3 to focus on caine 3 ?

>>51542651
He sounds cool.

>>51540448
That's so unfortunate, because I really Impalers.

Would they be good for 9 points? I think 9 would be fair.

>>51531229
Who cares? Nobody is going to pair these two, they cover mostly the exact same stuff.

>>51538025
Don't forget about Vlad and the Uhlans - apparently Russia didn't have enough tropes within its own borders for the Red faction.

>>51542708
The Impaler's cost is really its only problem, so probably, yeah. It's paying the old versatility tax that has rendered so many models overpriced over the years. You can still get some use out of it with the very shooting centric casters like Gunny and the Grims, but it feels pretty lackluster.

>>51542708
They would still suck for nine points. They cant crack arm past 17 and are only good at killing solos, for which they dont have range. Drop set defense, give them rof 2 and powerful attack and they will be just dandy for 11 points.

>>51541448
Post em for those of us who don't have kikebook?

>>51542708
The points cost isn't going to change unless Ragnor's warbeast points also changes.

The battleboxes are all costed so that they equal the exact same amount as the Warlock's warbeast points. So, unless Ragnor goes down to 27 or 28 warbeast points, the Impaler's cost will not change.

I think, if the Impaler is to change, it will get better to justify it's 11 point cost. Of course, it might not change and just remain as hot garbage.

>>51544076
They might also increase Bouncer cost to 10, just like they did with Skorne, Savage got cheaper and Gladiator more expensive.

>>51544027
Facebunk users generally aren't smart enough to repost anything. All they know is a stream of information that's impossible to find anything in after a day or two, and links that hide themselves under a "sign up" banner.

>>51544566
Wow, just like 4chan except fbi honeypots and keyloggers replace the signups.

>>51544903
Oooh, what's the lore here? Did Lynch kick the bucket and Caine talked the other two into leaving Cygnar?

>>51541802
>well at least Brickhouse is as meh as his pose.
"Look what I finally had a chance to build. It's my JUMP TO CONCLUSIONS mat."

Brickhouse isn't setting the world on fire, but he brings some interesting new mechanics to the faction... a MAT 8 reach heavy, magno fist, functional free strike immunity. I actually don't see the synergy with Maddox. For me, he's going with Darius or Jakes2 first.

>>51542692
Yes. Yes, he does. His feat is the Synergy spell for ranged attacks. I think a lot of people are going to see that as more than "cool".

Biggest question is obviously "Mercs or Cygnar"? I'm guessing his emphasis on ranged jacks means the answer is usually going to be Cygnar. He doesn't even necessarily need a large battlegroup, because his unit provides the full +3/+3 bonus on feat turn.

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>>51542026
>Pic related

>>51542457
You're a fucking retard. Or Jason Soles (both).


This community is cancer.

>>51545266
Caine killed Lynch, took his hat, his girl, and his bff. That's how Caine rolls.

>>51545658
He could be beast with Galleon too. I think he'll have a place with both factions, as he brings the high pow shooting that Sloan lacks in Cygnar, and the Stealth removal that Mercs lacks.

>>51545658
Cygnar has jacks that work better. Fireflies, Defenders, Chargers(!), Dynamo. You can crank Dynamo up to nasty levels with Calamity, a Firefly, and Feat.

>>51545689
Maybe SolesAnon is Soles, maybe not. Either way, he's right.

You're complaining about a caster that you haven't played, and haven't played against, who is (on first reading) worse than another caster that already exists in that same faction who does most of the same things. Nevermind that the other caster, Una2, is in her turn objectively weaker than other casters from that same faction that we all figured out how to beat already. Like Wurmwood. Or, I dunno, ANY of their power casters during all of Mk2.

I just can't wrap my head around it. You're speaking authoritatively about a caster's power level on first reading, so I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you're a serious competitive player with at least a few years of experience. Which means that you figured out how to beat Krueger2, Kromac1, Morv2, Wold War.. plus things like Gaspy2, Haley2, Saeryn, Lyl2, Doomy1, etc, each at the height of their respective bullshittery. The rest of us certainly had to.

Now, given all that, THIS is the thing that you think that's going to kill the game? Kaya3?? Are you joking? I'm looking at this card, and I mean, yeah, she's got some things. But there are some big holes in her game, too.

>>51545951
>>51546063
It's definitely going to be fun for a few months while we figure out what works best. +5/+5 with Calamity is in the "shoot colossals off the table" range. That's some straight-up Mk2 eLylyth level nasty.

Only thing that worries me a bit is the 2" teleport... he's going to be much more vulnerable to assassination than his previous iterations.

>>51545951
Going to be hilarious in mercs if you bring the other damage buffers too. "Let's see, with Aiyanna, and Rust bomb, Calamity, feat, my Mule's gun is now... POW 24? OK".

>>51546063
Dynamo, yeah, there's something. Even... oh, dear god. Minuteman swarm. Calling it now. "Unboosted RAT 9, POW 17's kill casters" is going to be the new Cygnar motto.

>>51514493
My google-fu is terrible, how do I use text uploader for the books?

>>51546850
To clarify - I go on text uploader and all I see is an option to upload text, not look at any files.

>>51546460
So, let's assume Calamity on a heavy target and Synergy feat are up and running at full. A Firefly with Ionization shoots at RAT 9 POW 17. Then Dynamo shoots for RAT 9 POW 19, 20, 21, 22, 23. It's gonna happen. Chargers get Powerful Shot on what may be RAT 9 POW 17. Minutemen, as previously noted. Defenders at RAT 9 POW 20.

>>51544964
How many models can Cain3 place with flicker? It sounds fucking op as it can be used on every model in play.

>>51547111
It only affects his unit, so 3.

>>51547111
>in the spellcaster's unit

>>51545565
>>51545713
Wait what; a boostable POW 26 shot that drags in for more POW 14 attacks?

What

circl pls

>>51547212
Ah, nevermind. Anon is an illiterate faggot.

>>51547212
POW26? Nigger what? If you warp STR it's POW17.

>>51547212
That's saying any bonus strength gets added on

>>51545266
I forget how Lynch died (it's in a book, somewhere), but I think the lore was that Caine is still loyal to Cygnar (hence Partisan: Cygnar), but can do more good by not being directly associated with Cygnar than he could by being a part of it's regular military structure.

>>51547556
It's the Asheth Magnus school of fighting for Cygnar.

>>51547076
Yes, yes, yes, and... yes. It's one turn of ridiculously OP shooting. Just like with the old Lylyth2, the trick is going to be making sure that one turn completely cripples the opposing list. A few thoughts:

- No threat range extenders, outside of locomotion, which he usually won't have the focus to use. You also can't count on Caine having focus to fuel jacks. So you want those that have good base range and are self sufficient.

- Caine's more vulnerable to assassination than he's ever been, doubly so if he comes forward to shoot a RAT 9 Mortality on to something. Arcing Mortality is an option, but not nearly as accurate due to FOC 6.

- Unlike previous versions, this Caine doesn't really want to do a ton of work himself. He'll harry the flanks a bit, and he wants to shoot SOMETHING on feat turn, but he's not popping in and out every turn like Caine1 and 2.

- No scather templates. Or auto fire. Few AOE's. It seems very easy to build a list that just crushes armor at range, but not having enough volume for infantry may prove a problem. Infantry spam isn't common now, but that could easily change.

>>51545266
It's covered in the book Hellslinger


Caine is tracking a wraith that has Caine's face and is framing Caine for murders while Lynch and crew are sent to assassinate Caine for other reasons. Lynch and co. end up accidentally following the wraith's trail and Lynch is killed by the wraith. Caine meets up with Watts and Ryan who realize that there are two Caines and decide to work with Caine to avenge Lynch's death. The team decides to stick together to rescue Caine's daughter from Cryx and also because Scout Master Ribald is an asshole.

Caine3 and a hurricane look like my new go to circle drop. Add eAlexia to stop stranglehold and it feels like it'd fit nicely into wormwood and una2.

>>51547556
After the civil war Caine retires/deserts the military because he realized how much of a colossal asshole his boss was.

>>51548054
> his boss
Rebald, Julius or both?

>>51548395
Rebald.

>>51545689
It's cancer to faggots like you who can't figure out how to win against these cookie cutter "power" lists.

>>51548705
>Dying to multiple MAT8 PS13 weaponmasters with 6 attacks that have nigh-complete immunity to the enemy for a round? You must be shit!

>>51548822

I don't know if you're the same idiot, but just in case you aren't, what the rational folks are mocking is >>51541051's autistic screeching that Kaya3 is bad because she's going to be game-breaking after Una2 and Amon get nerfed.

No one is defending Una2.

>>51548950
Oh that's retarded then. Kaya3 looks good but not ball breakingly stupid like Una2 and other spam casters.

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Guys, looking for some help.
Iron Kingdoms GM here, I need a good scan of the artwork of the Witch Coven and I've only been able to find pixelly rap. Pic related.
Can anybody help me find a better version?

>>51547753
For the anti infantry problem, I thibk he'd do well with a Grenadier or two.

I'm using a slag troll right now because all of my friends play Warmachine, but is there anything better I can be doing with the points? With the slag troll I'm at 49/50 points, so without it I'll have 11 points to throw around. I understand that a lot of y'all play 75 pt but my friends and I all play 50. I'm using Gunny, with Bomber, Mauler, and Slag, full Fennblades with UA, and full Krielstone with UA.

>>51532877
can you at least proof read your bitching?

>>51552339
no, because if PP can't keep their shit together, why should he?

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>>51546189

Your post makes zero sense.

>Nevermind that the other caster, Una2, is in her turn objectively weaker than other casters from the same faction that we all figured out how to beat already.

First, that makes zero fucking sense.

Second, Wurmwood had to be nerfed. Less than a year into the new edition. So no one 'figured out' how to beat Wurmwood.

Third, you start rambling about Mk2 casters that you also figured out how to beat. Almost all of which were nerfed too.

And I didn't say Kaya3 is going to kill the game. I pointed out how broken shit is if when Kaya3 comes out and she is OBVIOUSLY good, others say eh big deal she's not Una2 or Amon.

THAT tells you how badly balanced the game is right now.


>>51548950
Read above autist, that's not what I was saying.

I'm saying there are casters that are 'SO' broken that when Kaya3 releases, who is an A Caster, people shrug and say whatever.

>>51552339
It's 4chan, I'm not going to make my posts completely full of errors and read them over. Deal with it.

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Been working on Helios, my first colossal. Only got into the game when Mk.III came out and it's my first miniatures experience, never really did any painting before.

Rate my wip?

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>>51553486

>>51553486
Pretty good, get a fine brush to touch up your blue gems a little bit, and then give them a bit of wash or a bit of ink over them for colour depth.

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>>51553505
Current plan is to drybrush some white over them to make it look like energy is swirling inside.

Thanks for the advice. Only other big model I've done is the AFG and it doesn't have nearly as many details to worry about.

Do you guys have any recommendations for basing? All of my Ret jacks follow the same kind of gold/blue/silver color scheme and my casters and units use black for their cloth. Haven't based a model before and I'm wondering what would match the scheme of my force well.

>>51553551
Sounds good. You can get little cork sheets from the dollar store, which a lot of people use. Or you can use the hard pink insulation foam/ styrofoam blue and paint over that. If you score it in a pattern, and then put blue paint in the crevasses, then paint silver on the raised portions, it might look kind of neat.

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Current WIP

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>told the guy who runs the local gamestore I'd be around to run some demo games on Tuesday
Oh boy
I plan on using what I have, a Trollbloods battle box and a Cygnar battlebox. Any advice?

>>51553884
Sorry if this isn't helpful... but rethink your life...

>>51553980
Okay... faggot...

>>51554003
I'm just saying that the trolls box doesn't seem like it would make a fun game against the cygnar box

>>51553884
I don't think the troll box can feasibly stand up to the Cygnar one as is. maybe have it be 2 or 3 points instead of 0 and find a way to squeeze in a mauler. like a impaler, axer and mauler as the box. makes it a bit strong though maybe. but it also represents Trollbloods as a faction better.

>>51554105
I think impaler, bouncer, mauler would be a better choice.
That puts it exactly 5 points over, and I can squeeze a squire into the cygnar list.
Only problem is, I don't have a mauler yet.

(Baldur 1) Baldur the Stonecleaver [+31]
- Woldwrath [37]
- Feral Warpwolf [18]
- Loki [19]
- Druid Wilder [4]
Sentry Stone & Mannikins [5]
Sentry Stone & Mannikins [5]
Tharn Bloodtrackers (max) [16]
Gallows Grove [2]


Destroing you piece by piece.

>>51554003
>>51553884
Running one system is generally preferable to mixing both Warmachine and Hordes into one demo game (since you have to take more effort to explain both focus and fury to a new player).

Maybe pick up the Khador box and do a Warmachine demo (unfortunately the Troll box really is hot garbage).

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>>51550305

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>>51557853
Clean picture.

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>>51553486
>>51553493
Not too shabby! Keep it up, your efforts are paying off. You've done a good job thinning your paints, with the exception of the nodes. I would recommend looking into how to paint gem effects for the nodes. Image related, it's what I used to learn how to paint gems. There are youtube video's that may help you, but I have never seen one that is any good.

>My first list can fight my opponent's first list
>My second list can fight my opponent's second list
>Both of my opponent's lists can beat both of my lists
And there's nothing I can do but flip a coin. If I win the flip I get to play a fair game. I have roughly a 25% chance of beating this opponent. This is why skew lists are bad for the game; you're at a flat out advantage by playing one and forcing your opponent to play reactively.

>>51559937
Perhaps don't bring two reactive lists? When deciding your list pairing, maybe next time try bringing a generalist list and a "fuck your face asshole" list.

>>51560093
>Perhaps don't bring two reactive lists?
I'm not, I'm bringing a generalist list and a reactive list. My general list can't beat the spam, and my reactive list can't beat the general list.

>>51560175
Sorry, I was not clear. I usually view generalist lists and reactive lists in the same category. I don't think bringing in two generalist/reaction lists is a bad plan, but if you can ever force your opponent into a shit matchup, that may be a decent gameplan.

>>51560349
Then allow me to specify my problem. Tomorrow there's a Steamroller at my LGS, and my two lists are a Morghoul1 to deal with the two Amon jackspam players, and a Hexeris1 list to deal with everything else. Now, I'm confident that Hexeris1 can deal with a lot of lists, but I NEED Morghoul1 to deal with Amon. The issue is that one Amon player is also bringing a generalist Thyra list. Now, Hexeris is fine against Thyra, and Morghoul is fine against Amon. But Hexeris cannot beat Amon, and Morghoul cannot beat Amon. Both of his lists are capable of beating either of mine as Hexeris can't do anything to a wall of immune-to-spells warjacks, and Morghoul can't deal with a field full of weaponmasters. If I guess wrong I'm fucked, and if I guess right I have to play an even game.

Spam is just too fucking good.

>>51560630
>Morghoul cannot beat Amon
Morghoul cannot beat Thyra.

>>51560630
Have you considered spam or skewing one of your lists?
Spam has always been a thing and you have to deal with it.

Ok, so Trollbro here. I've been posting here a lot asking for advice for 50pts, and it has struck me that, because most people have been giving me 75pt lists in response, trying to get to 75 pts is probably the way to go. I don't have too many models, so the list I'm running right now is:

Trollbloods Army - 49 / 50 points

(Gunnbjorn 1) Captain Gunnbjorn [+28]
- Dire Troll Bomber [19]
- Dire Troll Mauler [15]
- Pyre Troll [9]
Trollkin Fennblades (max) [15]
- Fennblade Officer and Drummer [5]
Krielstone Bearer & Stone Scribes (min) [6]
- Stone Scribe Elder [3]
Fell Caller Hero [5]

This probably not optimal, but it is what I have. Upgrading to 75 pts, here are some lists I have come up with. Again, probably not optimal, but would involve less money.

Trollbloods Army - 73 / 75 points

(Gunnbjorn 1) Captain Gunnbjorn [+28]
- Dire Troll Mauler [15]
- Dire Troll Bomber [19]
- Dire Troll Bomber [19]
- Trollkin Runebearer [4]
Trollkin Highwaymen (max) [15]
Trollkin Highwaymen (max) [15]
Krielstone Bearer & Stone Scribes (min) [6]
- Stone Scribe Elder [3]
Braylen Wanderheart, Trollkin Outlaw [5]


Trollbloods Army - 73 / 75 points

(Grissel 2) Grissel Bloodsong, Marshal of the Kriels [+27]
- Dire Troll Mauler [15]
- Dire Troll Bomber [19]
- Dire Troll Bomber [19]
Trollkin Fennblades (max) [15]
- Fennblade Officer and Drummer [5]
Krielstone Bearer & Stone Scribes (max) [9]
- Stone Scribe Elder [3]
Trollkin Warders (min) [10]
Fell Caller Hero [5]

I'll end up filling the two remaining points in either army with swamp gobber bellows I think, just wasn't sure at the time. The kings are far out of my price range, although I'm sure I could find them cheaper. Any advice on either of these would be greatly appreciated.

>>51561220
Skorne can't spam effectively, and even then it doesn't solve my annoyance that spam lists are just too competitive and are impossible to play around on the tabletop, you need to play around them at the listbuilding process. What's the point of the tabletop when the game can be won and lost before you've even started playing it?

>>51561380
Then think outside the box and invent tactics to counter. A single person can't know what every model does, that's just too much information to track and as a consequence people miss combos all the time.

Pour over what you own and what is available, and what the opponent's army does and has available. Look at weak casters and bad units and break them wide open. Find the counters yourself.

>>51562422
Amon's warjacks 1) are faster, 2) all have pathfinder, 3) have parry, 4) have higher MAT, 5) hit harder, 6) have the same defensive statline, 7) have the same boxes, 8) cost much less than my warbeasts, 9) got strictly buffed by a theme list, 10) can't be touched by ranged attacks, and 11) can't be touched by spells.

I once tried to play Makeda3 against Amon to leverage the strength of Molik Karn dashing forwards to take out a jack in 2 boosted hits so he could spring back to safety and try to win through attrition. Know what happened? He just pushed everything forwards, I couldn't kill it all, then I lost all of my heavies. When your opponent's 10 point heavy is rolling straight damage against your 15 point Titan Sentry under a 6 point Agonizer bubble, you need to just stop bothering and blame the game.

Does Skorne have access to cloudwalls or something similar?

Because Amon can't do much of anything if you deny his charges.

>>51563268
Swamp gobbers?

>>51563268
The only clouds in Skorne are Rasheth who has an offensive spell that drops a 3" cloud but can deviate off to nowhere and needs a target (see: Choir shits on it), and Zaadesh2 who can drop 3" clouds in his control range. Beyond that it's the Bellows Crew who can drop a 5". The issue you face with Zaadesh2 is that realistically you're only dropping 2 of his 3" clouds, and 3" clouds aren't big enough to block LOS to enough of his jacks.

Skorne is a faction designed around melee beatsticks, which is why we're completely crippled against a caster that brings better melee beatsticks than us.

Hmm, I assume Skorne can't give the Gobbers reposition somehow, huh? Tough break.

If know that I have to fight Amon with Khador, I bring Harkevich with 3 Kodiaks. They can't create a 12" long cloud screen and reposition back out of it, allowing the entire Jack force to huddle behind the clouds and secure the alpha strike.

Would've been neat if other factions could apply this strategy too, but I guess it was a long shot.

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>>51563513
can*

>>51558808
>>51557853

You gentlemen are life savers.
Thank you!

>>51562658
Protectorate Army - 75 / 75 points
(Amon 1) High Allegiant Amon Ad-Raza [+29]
- Dervish [7]
- Dervish [7]
- Dervish [7]
- Templar [15]
- Crusader [10]
- Crusader [10]
- Crusader [10]
- Hierophant [3]
Idrian Skirmishers (max) [15]
- Idrian Skirmisher Chieftain & Guide [5]
Vassal of Menoth [3]
Choir of Menoth (min) [4]
Choir of Menoth (min) [4]
Vassal of Menoth [3]
Wrack [1]


So lets break down this Amon list probably not the most optimized list but it gets the job done.
The Dervishes are to get the synergy combo going.
The Crusaders are the big hitters and the Templar helps protect Amon

So the first thing you need to do is kill the Idrians screening for the heavies
then you have to take care of the choir, then you can trade heavies and really start brawling.

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>>51563529
You can easily copy any art from any of those official .pdf books and paste it in any graphics editor like Photoshop, Gimp or even Paint.

>>51563557
Kill the Idrians with what? My heavies are so expensive that to bring enough to trade with Amon's heavies I have to cut back on everything. "Bring a Cannoneer!" I hear you say. But the Idrian UA makes them immune to blast damage. And then we get onto the next problem: threat range. With Rush my Titans still only have a 10" threat range, compared to the 11" of Dervishes and the same 10" against Crusaders. But Rush costs 2 fury IT'S FUNNY BECAUSE MOBILITY ONLY COSTS 3 FOR YOUR WHOLE BATTLEGROUP AHAHAHA XDDDD, so now I need to spend another 4 points on Zaadesh1 just to cast Rush another 2 times. Then if I want to win the threat range war and ensure I actually kill a heavy once I get to it I need to use Morghoul1 for his Abuse spell and feat that prevents crackback. So now I'm using a fury 5 caster to try and spam a cost 2 spell, so I need to bring my spell slave, choking up even more points.

>(Morghoul 1) Master Tormentor Morghoul [+30]
- Despoiler [19]
- Bronzeback Titan [18]
- Aradus Soldier [16]
- Titan Sentry [15]
- Aptimus Marketh [5]
Paingiver Beast Handlers (max) [7]
Tyrant Zaadesh [4]
- Titan Gladiator [15]
Void Spirit [4]
Swamp Gobbers Bellows Crew [2]

So now I've got this list that MIGHT be able to beat Amon, but will probably struggle against most anything else. The Menoth player could easily be using Thyra and spamming small based weaponmasters.

Caine3 list y/n

Mercenary Army - 75 / 75 points


(Caine 3) Caine's Hellslingers [+20]
- Ryan 2 & Watts 2
- Mule [15]
- Mule [15]
- Mariner [14]
- Rocinante [18]
Lady Aiyana & Master Holt [8]
Idrian Skirmishers (max) [15]
- Idrian Skirmisher Chieftain & Guide [5]
Ogrun Bokur [5]

>>51564347
And yes I know I could go double galleon but I don't have galleons, mercs is like my fourth army

>>51564347
I think he's better with a galleon, but test this out if you like it. Caine3's the wild west right now, try out anything.

>>51541802
He can play keep away with anything that doesn't have reach. Like putting your hand on the forehead of a midget attempting fisticuffs.

>>51565093
>He can play keep away with anything that doesn't have reach
Unless you accidentally crit smite.

>>51530791
>>51530813
>>51530830
>>51530854

Soothing Song, Synergy, the feat, and FM Repo 3" are all great. That skornergy with Fog and Blood Spiller is going to be really annoying as the free charge is really nice incentive. 15/16 is going to be a bitch. She seems neat, but looks like our playing in the sprinkler time is temporarily halted.

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75 Points Legion of Everblight:

Thagrosh1 +28
-Blightbringer 38
-Scythean 18

Warspears (max) 15
-Warspear UA 5

Warspears (max) 15
-Warspear UA 5

What shall I do with the last 7 points? War chief?

I haven't played mk3. In fact i've never played Legion, wish me luck, my first game on tuesday

>>51566003

Forgot to say, playing against Cryx on tuesday, Asphyx2 I imagine, should I bring a Forsaken?

>>51565130
Crit smite is optional soooo

>>51566003
That Bethayne looks rad as hell

>>51563513
>Hmm, I assume Skorne can't give the Gobbers reposition somehow, huh? Tough break.
The task master can in fact. Not sure it's worth a 5p module though.

>>51566158
Acchually that's belphagore.

>>51563764
http://conflictchamber.com/#b91b4t5J6A6A6A6A6A5U5U

Skorne Army - 75 / 75 points

(Mordikaar 1) Void Seer Mordikaar [+29]
- Molik Karn [19]
- Titan Sentry [15]
- Titan Sentry [15]
- Titan Sentry [15]
- Titan Sentry [15]
- Titan Sentry [15]
Paingiver Beast Handlers (min) [5]
Paingiver Beast Handlers (min) [5]

Out spam Amon.

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>>51566158
Agreed. here's more candy (not my models of course)

>>51566414
But that list looks literally awful.

>>51566593
It is. There are casters that could benefit from spam, Mordikaar isn't really one unless you are focusing on Host of Shadows, which would then entail more usage out of Molik Karn, and Archidons.

>Firefly wields a electro glaive
>electro glaive doesn't do electric damage

>>51566387
well its both. Bethagore.

>>51566798
No melee weapon in the entire game has typed damage.

Turns out if you get smacked over the head with a mace that causes you to catch fire, being immune to fire wont make you immune to mace.

>>51567130
the electro glaive doesn't even do electroleaps.

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>>51567263
it doesn't bounce around because it uses static electricity.

>>51563764
To me it sounds you're trying to fight Amon on his terms and not yours. Why not bring an assassination focused list? Amon hates having to camp focus, exploit that

>>51566709
>>51566593
To be fair i meant to click on Morghoul1

>>51566593
>>51566709

(Morghoul 1) Master Tormentor Morghoul [+30]
- Mammoth [38]
- Molik Karn [19]
Paingiver Beast Handlers (min) [5]
Tyrant Zaadesh [4]
- Mammoth [38]

So I was think of why a mauler wasn't added in the battle box, and it occurred to me
Pulverizer+rage=two 21 p+s Weapons
And for a battle box that's honestly a little terrifying

>>51570306
yep, but hordes babies will insist they need that to be relevant against those big mean robots.

>>51570329
>yep, but hordes babies will insist they need that to be able to beat those big mean robots without recourse to anything resembling skill.

Fixed. So much whinging on the part of hordes players seems to boil down to "waaah our premium heavies cant favourably piece trade into bargain basement heavy warjacks without getting completely shit on" completely disregarding that premium warjacks have exactly the same problem.

The real problem in my thought is that Hordes factions by and large neither have access to an equivalent bargain basement heavy of any value, nor easy access to the counter; weaponmaster infantry on small bases.

>>51570897
How can you in one breath bemoan hordes players for whining about poor piece trades and in the next admit that hordes largely lacks both cheap heavies and the counter to cheap heavies?

Of course hordes players are going to complain that they can't easily kill cheap heavies when they lack the models to effectively kill cheap heavies! That's what they're whining about!

>>51570897
You can't can't call hordes heavies premium heavies when that's their base line for acceptable heavies. At that point it's acceptable level heavy beast vs bargain warjacks.

>>51570306
Without the mauler all three beasts using all their fury cant scrap the juggernaut while juggernaut can kill two trolls in a single activation despite costing two points more than the average troll.

>>51568354
>Skorne
>Assassination
I already tried Makeda3 and got rolled with ease.

>>51569917
>(Morghoul 1) Master Tormentor Morghoul [+30]
- Rhinodon [12]
- Rhinodon [12]
- Rhinodon [12]
- Aptimus Marketh [5]
- Rhinodon [12]
- Rhinodon [12]
- Rhinodon [12]
Paingiver Beast Handlers (max) [7]
Tyrant Zaadesh [4]
- Titan Gladiator [15]
Feralgeist [2]

This is the dream Morghoul1 spam list. Rhinodons go up to PS19, Feralgeist is a 2 point incorporeal way to sit on an objective.

>>51571096
>while juggernaut can kill two trolls in a single activation despite costing two points more than the average troll if the troll player is stupid enough to put them right next to each other.

Fixed.

>>51570972
I see a lot less whining about that than I do about hordes players thinking their expensive heavies should be 4x more effective than warmachine heavies in the same points bracket. The limitations of bargain heavies are that the focus investment in them is more constantly necessary. Amon jack spam cannot go full alpha strike because amon simply does not have the focus to feed all his jacks at once, so he plays the attrittion game, which I see many hordes players falling into his plan easily

>>51571849
>it is absolutely fine for hordes heavies to cost 50% more ans have 2 less pow on average than warmachine heavies because they can sacrifice their next activation for two additional attacks compared to jacks
kys

>>51571944
I will point out at this time that the stormclad and bronzeback cost the same. The stormclad might be more efficient, and have a better unaided melee threat range, but noone is going to be rooting for the stormclad in a 1v1 matchup.

>>51572002
They are the hardest hitting non-character beatsticks in their respective factions and could one round each other depending on who gets there first. Doesnt mean much. An fully loaded ironclad could probably one round the bronzeback if he got a free charge as well and the bronzeback is 50% more expensive. But once we are at premium heavies let us have a look at mulg and ol rowdy. They cost the same, have the same number and quality of attacks (both will always charge), mulg has a useless animus and a few negligible abilities. Ol rowdy has a crit you will benefit from more often, more mat, more arm, more speed and can drop two attacks outside of his turn. And nobody plays him, yet mulg is a staple because there are hardly better options for trolls.

Why is the new battle college so off putting? In the previous all models that werent hot garbage were praised for what they did and now they all get shat on. Pow 17 used to be high, now it is considered low. Arm 18 same thing. Mat 7 was elite now it is considered not enough. Makes me really unmotivated to buy anything.

What exactly made storm lances so much better this edition?

>>51571491
People want you to believe Mak3 is an assassination caster. She really isn't though.

>>51572339
1) +1 DEF
2) Better E-Leaps
3) America finally realizing they were already amazing without those two.

Why are beasts as a whole more pricy than warjacks?
Is it the animus?

>>51572850
Yes, it's animus and fury was the clearly superior ressource (it's still probably better as a basic rule, but nerfed max Fury on beasts and Power Up for Jacks evened the field)

>>51572850
It is PP having no idea how to balance the game. There is not a reality where troll impaler is worth a point more than a marauder.

>>51572850
Also if you don't outright kill a beast it can repair its crippled spirals and be back to full effectivness for basically no cost and from 12" away.

>>51573387
"No cost" is quite the understatement, as anyone who has ever played Hordes can attest to.

>>51573399
Sorry, a fury. Maybe 2.

Wow.

>>51573502
A third of my warlock's fury and some order of activations issues is not "basically no cost".

Thinking of starting the game again,
So during MK2, I played some mercs, with bartololol, but since moving out of my old city, I've sold my stuff and haven't played since.
I'm thinking of picking up the game again, but still torn between Cyriss and a horde faction.

so, the question is: what is the meta like these days?
I like steam punky jacks a lot more than beasts, so i'd prefer to stay in the warmachine factions while avoiding cryx (hate the undead)

frome what i understand:
Khador: big heavy shit that hits hard
Protectorate: fuck cryx
Cygnar: greece lightning
Retribution: gay elves
Cyriss: robocops.

any idea/input to sway my decision would be great! thanks!

>>51573719
You understand nothing
>Protectorate of Menoth not "fuck your spells and ask for permission to put that fire out"
>shaved head genocidal terrorists (GAS THE ROUNDEARS, END MAGIC NOW) being anywhere near the "gay" end of the elf spectrum
And Cyriss are robot Branch Davidians who claim to have invented everything ever and recently decided they had enough cultists to openly grab for more lebensraum

>>51573890
hahaha, i'm not making the mistake of going for a thematic army, this time. I'm going to attempt to kick people's dicks in, but still paint at epic level.

after reading some more shits,
cygnar and protectorates are looking pretty hard atm.

>>51571944
Yes, because Hordes heavies aren't dead as soon as they lose a cortex or main arm, you dumb fuck.

>>51571524
Sounds like it would poop on the arm 19 crusader spam.
>>51571944
Stop trying to play attrition against war machine

>>51574379
>Stop trying to play attrition against war machine
Not even that, but "stop trying to piece trade 1for1 with 10-12p heavies".

>>51573973

>Dead as soon as they lose a cortex

Y'all humans don't even play Helynna

>>51562658
At what point are we looking at the fact that alot this is dice rolling and strategy and not just flat stats??

I don't think that I'm a great Warmahordes players, but even during my beginning weeks of the game, I consistently bodied the top players at my game shop.

Luck is a broken stat, guys. If you ever find yourself in a pinch; just get lucky.

>>51562658
Why not try other units into the lists?

While usually seen as inferior troops, Venator slingers should be able to kill most if not all of the Iridians by using the corrosion AoE, and they'll do a good bit of work against light warjacks that Amon wants to use to build synergy chains. A thullug could be useful for keeping Amon from giving out mobility, Efaarits could take out any solos or UAs and with help absolutely dismantle a light warjack, and Immortals look pretty nasty when buffed up by all their UAs and Character solos.

More important than the pure stats and "strictly superior" options of other troops is making sure you can take things to surprise your opponent. Things he won't know how to deal with, even if dealing with them should be easier.

>>51571096
This isn't about khador heavies at all though. It's the idea of the trolls box (4 lights essentially, though the axer punches well above it's weight for a light.) doing at least ok against the Cygnar box (2 lights and a heavy).

>>51575956
The battle box discussions started because an anon was asked to demo the game, but the BBs he had were Trolls and Khador. The Khador BB includes a juggernaut.

>>51576060
>>51553884
It is, of course, Trolls vs Cygnar but keep on about the Juggernaut

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Una 2 just won the Las Vegas Open. He had played her only 2 times before.

He played her all 6 rounds of the event and won.

Why is PP so bad at balance anymore? Was DC that fucking important?

>>51577070
Nigga what happend when haley3 came out?
or WW
or MMM?

The first time something new throws a monkey wrench in the game people can't beat it.

So demo guy here
I've been running some small tests against the two, and an Axer can do some serious damage to the Ironclad if Ragnor gets the dream combo of Pulverizer on the Axer and Shockwave
If not enough to kill, at least enough to severely cripple it

>>51552540
>no one 'figured out' how to beat Wurmwood
Wurmwood just got nerfed in the year end errata. We had to deal with him in his released form for about 8 solid months. That's a lot of games. Everybody who plays had to "figure out" how to beat Wurmwood.

Same holds for all the S-tier Mk2 casters. Just saying 'well, they'll get nerfed eventually' doesn't do anything for you if you have an event next week. It was years of having to play in to things like Saeryn and Haley2 before they got a nerf. You knew they were going to show up at every large event, so yes, you damn well better have figured out how to beat them if you wanted to have a shot.

>Kaya3 comes out and she is OBVIOUSLY good
Yeah, that's the thing though, she's not "obviously" good. Anybody who's been around the block a couple times knows that first read of a caster's cards isn't worth much. She looks interesting, I'll grant you, but at the moment I haven't had a single game against her. How many have you had? What's your normal Circle drop look like? What is it about Kaya3 specifically that makes her scarier than Kaya2, or one of the Kromacs?

>>51577136
Oh, and the charge on the Axer

>>51567263
The electric is just there to make the little LED's work. It gets +1 POW over a non-electro glaive, because the enemy's armor is distracted.

>>51577136
You're going to have to throw the two strongest trolls into the Ironclad and throw one light at each of the other lights in the Cygnar box.

>>51577136
Wow that troll box is trash.
3 lights :< sorry I thought it had 4 lights.

>>51571491
>Skorne
>Assassination
>I already tried Makeda3 and got rolled with ease
Makeda1 probably builds a better assassination list right now than Mak3. Molik gets some real threat range with her. There's also this newly buffed Fan Man the kids are playing... supposed to be a master assassin or somesuch.

Worth remembering there are a lot of types of assassinations in the game - melee, ranged, magic - and Amon can be vulnerable to almost all of them. He's a 16/14 that likes to play forward and spend his focus. Steady and Reflexes give him a little protection against the dirtiest tricks, and he can bring devouts and/or vigilants, but that only goes so far. You don't need to kill his whole army, just the stuff directly protecting him. Take his alpha strike on the chin and then just find your opening.

>>51577123

You're a fucking idiot if you don't think she's broken.

And idiots like you ruin the game.

>>51577269
>>51577305
I mean, it's a difficult match up, but it's not vs Khador bad aka I literally can't kill your jacks

I'm a cyriss player looking to buy a real army and am thinking either Skorne or Legion.
Which faction is more "fun"?

>>51577123

Or Butcher3
Or Morvhana2

Not gonna argue that Una2 is probably too powerful. I think she probably is. I do however dislike people insane hyperbole.

For me, I think if they took Stealth away from the Griffons, Una2 would still be strong but manageable.

Though to be honest, the whole "can't be hurt in melee" feat that Mk2 Seryn had is a pretty over powered mechanic. Hence why she lost it. I don't know if it needs to go away but it's a big deal.

>>51577481

Do you like shooting or melee smashing more?

>>51575733
>Venator slingers should be able to kill most if not all of the Iridians by using the corrosion AoE
Worth pointing out that slingers have to hit to get an AOE... little tricky unless those Idrians stand conveniently close to some jacks. There are probably better choices.

>>51577513

Yeah, considering Idrians are typically pretty high Def, Slingers are probably a bad idea.

Actually, a Cannoneer might be a better option. Hell, Bloodrunners might be the best bet. Super fast and deadly, highly mobile jammer unit that can just keep the Idrians tied up.

>>51577136
>>51577269
Worth pointing out that you don't actually have to kill the Ironclad to win, you need to kill Maddox. It was very rare, for instance, to see Sorscha ever getting jacks totaled in battlebox games in past years, because that's not how you win. The battlebox is intended to teach lessons about the larger game, and this is an important one - don't try to play an attrition game against a list that's better at it than yours.

Not saying the Troll BB is a favored matchup or anything, but it's certainly got a game against the Cygnar BB. They essentially trade feats in most games, and each has multiple viable assassination vectors against the other.