Undead Thread Edition >What is /awg/? A thread to talk a

>>51345152
>Maybe this time we can actually hit the bump limit before the thread is archived.
unlikely. You didn't even put the title in, so nobody is gonna find it.

>>51346467
Yeah, I just managed to find it with 'find in page' but it could have been easier to find for the normals

Its been a while since I've seen any games with interesting takes on undead.

>>51348862
What are some interesting takes? As undead are generally just undead.

>>51350344
Most games take the standard Gothic horror approach to undead. Especially with zombies. Even games where they could be interesting because of how out of place they are just use run of the mill undead, like Nazi zombies in Weird War games.

An interesting take would be something like the old Tomb Kings from WHFB. They look like just Egyptian undead, but the fact that they are autonomous undead that either don't know they are dead, or pissed that they aren't in the afterlife and they list their old lands gives them an interesting take.

>>51351161
Not the guy you were talking to, but I don't really see how any of that makes them special.

Tomb Kings are basically skeletons let by Liches.
So it's not really anything different than the standard D&D stick, just with a different flavor.

As for WWW2 games, the pulpyness is the appeal I guess. Can't think of a way that you could approach it more seriously. Thematically speaking you could give it underpinnings of norse mythology, call them Draugr or whatever, but they are still the same thing.

The only recent example of undead that were interesting to me personally doesn't really make their particular flavor of undeath interesting, but rather their reason for being where they are.
In Frostgrave all the undead roaming the city are basically defunct security or servants.
It's like discussed in countless /tg/ threads, but the first time I've seen it used in a published setting.

Oddly enough the one area where I've seen zombies been used least, even though that is where they mythologically would fit in best is with Pirate games set in the Caribbean.

That said I like undead, but I'm having a hard time thinking of a way to make their actual state of undeath somehow feel original.
Deadlands had a few interesting concepts, but that's really all I can think of.

>>51351406
If that's all you look at, then yeah, any large scale undead are going to fall into the DnD schtick. Got to look at the small stuff, like how Tomb Royalty made skeletons better fighters through their sheer royal awesomeness.

And for the pulpy stuff, you can still make it interesting. A shallow aesthetics example, but look up the designs used in the movie Frankenstein's Army and compare it to how things like Konflikt and DUST handled it.

pumb

I have a concept for undeads I'll write down.

>>51355051
A society where your soul gets transferred into small soulstones you hold in your neck all the time. It was tied to you magically when you were born, so when you die, your soul automatically transfers into it. The priesthood is made up by necromancers (which is not considered evil in this setting/country/whatever), and you get buried with your soulstone - and when the time comes, and the king calls for an army, the necromancers wind up the soulstones and your body (or at least what remained of it, usually cleaned before the actual burial, haven't thought about this part too much) wakes from the grave and you get back your free will, it's not under the necromancer's control.
Each city have a large necropolis attached to them (which can be considered as a barrack) where the bodies are stored. Criminal offenses call for "service in the afterlife", where you have to work under the necromancer's influence and commands after your death, usually working on the streets, generally doing shit jobs. Particularly dire offenses call for execution, and work till eternity.
This way the state doesn't need a "standing" (hehe) army, and the citizens don't have to take arms when attacked. After X years of service your soul is set free, and your body cremated.

Not sure if this is viable tho, but had a bit too much free time and came up with this.

>>51355109
Nice idea, but unfortunately GW already does this is a way with the Eldar. Soulstones capture the Eldar souls to stop them getting eaten by Slannesh and can be put into wraithbone constructs to fight. Similar to yours, but as I read it this was all I could think of sorry

>>51355356
Well, that's where I got the idea of soulstones from, and the basis are the same - tried to do the rest different.

>>51355379
Lol no worries. It's really hard trying to come up with something new

>>51355379
But then again, it's the undead! The only good undead is erm a dead undead. Who needs different when they are just moving targets? As long as you blow their brains out (zombies, deadites) or even the trusty chainsaw, (Hail to the King, baby, gotta love some evil dead, it's all good!

For lots of skeletons is the best bet still a box of GW ones and a box of Mantic ones? I don't like the Army of Darkness style skulls on the Mantic skeletons but I have heard the GW box has like 25 skulls in it.

>>51355109
Suggestion:
How about if instead of being forced into service after death criminals have their bodies burnt and their soulstones broken. So when they die they have both the disgrace of never getting to serve their people in their time of need and also the punishment of having their souls connection to the material realm severed (which it seems this society views as a bad thing).
There's nothing wrong with your idea, I just thought this was a little less used than the idea of necromancers repurposing the dead for public works.

Whoever is in charge of the pastebin, please add Rogue Stars to the list

https://mega.nz/#!V99UATLZ!ANYg-JXDTUN1w-5h3ZuNyiUUvTOEiUfcTvC0UIPEFbI

Rogue Stars doesn't need it's own general

Has anybody bought the Frostgrave barbarians yet? Any thoughts?

>>51355999
Eh, Iunno...giving up their free will seems a bit of a bigger punishment than getting laid to rest, something which is reserved to those who served their country well even in the afterlife.

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>miniature game plays like magic the gathering

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>>51356130
As much as I love Rogue Stars, I think awg is the best home for it.

In related Rogue Stars news, I introduced some friends to it this weekend. One of these friends made a psionic-gestalt crew, which was basically five cheerleaders supporting a combat monster with a force sword, blink, and teleportation. The crew did pretty well until his opponent got to the cheerleaders.

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>>51357659
Seeing as the last RS thread died off after 40 posts, I'm just gonna ask here.

I've been going over the rules for making your own crew.
And I noticed a few things about the themes that seemed weird to me and were not addressed in the FAQ or on Facebook as far as I could tell.

The only theme that grants you access to Intelligence items at all for a single character only during creation is Star Cops.
That means all intelligence items have to be bought during a campaign, right?
Stuff like an Intrusion kit should be a no-brainer for Pirates, Crime Syndicates (as suggested theme for merchants) or even Star Cops.

Pirates notes the Quantum harness specifically as starting gear, but they'd have access to it anyway since it is rated as Military.
It's also rare, which means you're usually allowed to only take one during creation.
Does the explicit mention of Quantum Harness somehow play into that? Are Pirates allowed to take more than one Harness?

Last question is about Cybernetic Enhancements. Unless you are playing a group of Cyborgs the only way to get one is to have your limb blown off?
Sounds a bit restrictive. I'd like to take one to represent traits of bestial race in my crew, but I'll guess I'll have to settle for fast instead of bionic legs.

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>>51362164
Nah, the Quantum Harness thing was a misprint.
But yeah, no cybernetics unless you're a cyborg crew OR artificial

>>51362754
Ah, thanks. I must have read over that part.

I was a bit disappointed by how restrictive the themes feel. I mean you can still do most things I guess, but not add as much flavor as I would have liked.
Maybe that's just my impression though, I haven't played a game yet.

>>51362164
>>51362754
>>51362978
You guys kinda make me interested in the game. Do you have any photos of your warbands? Battle reports? Things to keep in mind?

>>51364440
Still trying to figure things out.
There's a battle report on YT though. Channel was called Guerilla Gaming iirc.

My first impression - only from reading the rules though - is that you basically are only supposed to pick one or two traits to characterize your dudes, otherwise you end up with dozens of special rules and exceptions.
The rules are kind of a drag to read cause it's just tables and no fluff to make it a bit of a lighter read.
I almost feel like it's too detailed. In practice you are probably only going to have to deal with a handful of the stuff the book lets you do though.

Basically what I want from a ruleset, when I read it is an overview before I have to read all the possible outcomes on a table and then put the whole thing together myself. Makes reading it a lot easier to digest imo.
That's just a formal complaint though, that is only about how the rules were written and not about the actual rules themselves.

Can't talk about much else yet though, since I haven't figured out how much I want to commit to the game.
I have loads of random odds and ends I could use for the game, but I had this idea for another crew I wanted to get together specifically for the game.

>>51364440
You can access the Facebook group without actually having to signup for Facebook. There's some battle reports and images of warbands. Downside, you might have to input a security code every few pages (at least I do on my mobile) cause Facebook are c#nts

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>>51364844
Thanks for the recommendation, the guy who does Guerrilla Gaming convinced me to pick up TNT and Malifaux, he makes great videos. I'll check it out.

>>51364989
I have a Facebook account, so no worries, but usually I trust /tg/ more on this. On FB folks are too biased, praising the game endlessly overlooking its faults - same thing with FG, but let's not go into that.

As for related content, have some Bronepehota Lords&Counsellors, a.k.a. the Russian toy makers realisation that 28mm sells well. Whole thing for approx. 16 Euros on eBay.

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Does anyone here play Flintloque? What's it play like?

>>51345152
why would the grave have a skeleton on it?
why would the shield have a skeleton on it?

>>51367806
I think the better question is, why is there a giant worm next to a skeleton that clearly has long lost its flesh? It makes no sense.

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>>51367806
Shield is vanCarstein heraldry and the tombstone is basically just medieval/gothic architecture.
The school I went to had a few plaques with skulls stuff too, even though that had nothing to do with gavestones at all.
There also was a mosaic of St. Gregor killing a Dragon.

>>51339417
Kromlech has a bunch that are modeled after the GW combat Gauge I think. Lasered from acrylic or mdf.

>>51365136
Ash may be a giant GW fanboy, but he does at least look into other systems all the time.

>>51362978
Yeah, the themes are little bit of a weak point in my opinion. Luckily, it's the theme of the game/author's intent that if you don't like a theme, make your own as fairly as you can.
>>51365136
The FB page is surprisingly decent. Just about every rules question has been personally answered by the author, and enough pictures/reps get posted to make it worthwhile

Anybody have any of the Two Hour Wargames books? I'm especially looking for the Lovecraft one, but anything is good.

Hey fellas, Crusader demofag who was worried about if I'd get in shit for sharing the new AVP:Unleashed wargame beta rules. Well I got the go ahead from the lead designer that yes, I can throw this in peoples faces as much as I like. So here it is again in case anyone missed it last thread.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/5n04hmma2bfqbch/AADzZ_mepng4nbL8gL8uEGnja?dl=0

>>51372579

Have you checked out The Archive?
>>51338556

You'll have to dig around for a while, but I managed to find a heap.

>>51372660
This is the latest version of the army lists, and as such are still in need of tuning, the Predators especially, holy shit on a combi-stick. I've actually got a test game with a friend set up for tomorrow so expect a battle report later tomorrow, I'll also have a draft of a story driven warzone battle report I've been trying to put together, so I'll probably share that too.

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>>51356167
Anybody?

Speaking of GW, how many miniature companies can trace their roots back to GW? I know that Warlord was founded by a couple of GW vets.

>>51373083
Warlord, Mantic, I'm not aware any more. Alessio Cavatore who worked for GW (IIRC) wrote Fireforge's Deus Vult, but the guys themselves who made the company had nothing to do with GW.

Wasn't Alternative Armies founded by some GW vets back in the 90s?

>>51367244
I've played a few games. It's okay. Some of the rules are interesting and it's fun, but there is way too much bookkeeping for my tastes and the rules have tonnes of grammar and spelling mistakes. Once you get past that they are a good bit of fun though

I've decided to try and design my own very silly /awg/ project in the vein of rules light theme heavy stuff like Rogue Stars, based on dumb shounen school fightan/JRPG cliche stuff.

The working title is "Don't Be Defeated By Your Friends" and the idea is you have 4-6 characters a side each with some quirks and gimmicks.

Units are 4-6 Students with optionally 0-1 Adults, who count as multiple students because mentors are always OP as fuck.

The main quirk of the system is Friendship, a mechanic where all units can transfer damage to represent motivational speeches and taking a shot meant for your waifu. If you get hit, you can elect to have a nearby model take up to its Friendship stat in damage to reduce the amount the initial target suffers.

I am thinking to deter just bunching everyone up the scenarios will be board control focused - so you might want to send 2-3 guys whose power comes from their bonds to the most contested objective while the loner edgelord sniper takes a different one (because he doesn't have friends, they just slow him down)

Unit "classes" are based on school clubs - bookish students have low defence but good magic and skills, sports club members get movement and fighting skills etc.

It's intentionally cheesy and stupid tonally, but I envision it as a kind of "Osprey version of Anima."

>>51374135
(cont).

I was thinking d12 + Stat vs TN for combat, with stats roughly capped at 0-5 and TNs 9-16.

Stats are Melee, Magic, Range, Defence, HP and Friendship. You get an array to divide up - 3/2/2/1 between Melee, Magic, Range and Defence (your final defence stat based on 10+the value assigned). HP is base 10, Friendship is half HP.

Clubs and traits further modify stats.

So for example (spitballing numbers):

John Doe
MA1 ME3 RA2 DEF12 HP10 FR5

Then he becomes a sports club member for +1 ME or RA and -1 MA

MA0 ME3 RA3 DEF12 HP10 FR5

Finally he gets two different Advances for free, either stats or skills. Sports club members can buy Movement, Melee or Range skills or get 2HP, 1FR, 1DE, 1RA or 1 ME for one Advance. John is a selfless type so he buys +2HP and +1FR, giving him final stats of:

MA0 ME3 RA3 DEF12 HP12 FR7

He's a tough but dim sort who takes punches for the weaker kids but needs a mage to keep him alive.

These are all very early draft ideas, but I want to add some kind of campaign system and points costs for skills, too.

>>51374135
>>51374279
It sounds interesting. Plan minis to go with them too?

>>51374305
I have zero artistic skill so for testing I was going to work with paper discs.

I still have stacks to do - spells, skills, ranges and LOS rules (I like true LOS) and proper campaign stuff.

I am working, admittedly, a lot based on how my nostalgia remembers Mordheim for skills and spells.

>>51374305
That said if I could find "magic school teen" minis it would be great.

>>51374361
>(I like true LOS)
I'd recommend doing it like Warzone. TLOS is all fun and games till you need to decide if the target is visible in the first shooting phase.

>>51374371
Hasslefree does some kids that might work.

>>51374377
How does Warzone do it? I rather like Infinity and Heavy Gear's system of a silhouette stat (or Malifaux's Height)

Tonight I will try and work out magic lores (White/Black/Time magic probably), some basic skill groups probably based a bit on Mordheim and then I'm able to start testing.

I definitely want a Mounted trait you can buy, so you can be That Guy who rides a horse through the window, or a biker chick.

>>51374415
Extend the base of the mini to a cylinder based on its height, and that's where he can be seen - so something like Malifaux if I recall correctly.

Oh, Warlord's/Wargames Factory's survivors also have a kid in them with various firearms.

>>51374443
That is the same as Infinity and Heavy Gear, too.

It works fine, I will steal it.

Of course, while I'm designing this as a hot blooded fightan weeb thing it could probably also work as a generic future gang fight system.

>>51374415
>How does Warzone do it?
Ooh! A question I can answer! Incoming copy/paste.

Every model has a clear view over the whole
battlefield unless something like terrain pieces block
the view. Models up to SZ(3) may obscure line of
sight (LOS) and thus grant cover but they can never
completely block the line of sight (LOS) to a target,
even if the model appears to do so. Terrain pieces, as
well as models of SZ(4) or above, may obscure and
can completely block the LOS to a target.

Models of Size (0) – (2)
Regardless of their pose, soldiers on the battlefield
are constantly moving around, trying their best not
to get shot. Players often use scenic bases or special
poses for their miniatures. Crouching snipers seem
cool until you find out the sniper miniature can’t
actually look over a small wall!
To support this idea, every model has a size-dependent
screen that represents the whole area ‘occupied’ by a
model. If LOS is in doubt, hold the respective screens
directly behind the bases of the models involved. If
you can see the target model´s screen from any point
of your model´s screen, then a LOS is established. Line
of sight is mutual, so if your model can see another,
then so can the other model see yours.

Models of Size (3) and higher
These models represent big monsters or vehicles. As
tanks normally don’t crouch, a screen is not required
so true line of sight may be established. If a smaller
model (using the screen, if necessary) can see any
part of the monster or tank, you have line of sight.
Line of sight is mutual here, too.

To paraphrase, it's true line of sight, but when circumstances are murky, use a profile screen sized for that models size category to determine if it is or isn't in LOS. source Warzone rulebook page 6, size screens are on page 70.

>>51367806
why wouldn't there be?
why wouldn't there be?

>>51374497
Definitely the best system, thanks.

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Got my Mantic Enforcers out of their box today, assembled a bunch of them, and with some leftovers I have 1391 points of them for Firefight. Anyone tried it yet from here? It seems Warpath gets all the love, but I'm more confident with lower organizational level games.

Also I should paint more, as only around half of my dudesmen are painted.

>>51378576
I've yet to play. But I'm impressed with both games and the universe. I think Firefight pushes more of my buttons, and I've pointed up my collections and there's a lot. I need to paint but I just don't know what to start. I've got Asterians and Enforcers in my painting area trying to work out colour schemes. The Plague and Forge Father's are shouting to be built and painted. Even the Marauders want in on the action!

I'd hope to Warpath as well.

>>51378866
I started my Enforcers as a Deadzone party but now counted all of them and since 1250 seems to be the standard game size, I think I'm fine. Paint 500 points or something, then 500 for another army and so forth.

I need to add some stuffs to my Enforcers, I got no Peacekeepers, Defenders, could use around 2 more Enforcer squads, maybe a walker or two, and finally their plane which seems fucking awesome. The more I look into this game the more I like it.

>>51378945
I've got a large Enforcer army, without any striders. I really want an interceptor jet. You'll really like the peacekeeper models they're great.

I'm the same, the more I see the more I like!

>>51379605
Have any of the plastics? I only have restic Enforcers and some metal upgrade parts I bought relatively cheaply plus the Pathfinders and jet bikes which are obviously plastic.

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>>51374279
>>51374135 Here

This idea seems to be going places. I've hashed out some basic rules, inspired by Frostgrave, A Fistful of Kung Fu and the Mantic Walking Dead game, and now need to sit down and work out weapon tables, skill trees and so on.

I am thinking to keep with the quite freeform nature of JRPG/anime combat boiling weapons down to "2H melee / 1H melee / Light melee" and some combination of "Heavy / Sniper / Rifle / Pistol" ranged.

Spells will be a bit more interesting, as any character with a casting stat gets at least one spell.

>>51381799
I have just realised I forgot to include a section on what happens if a character hits 0HP. I was thinking a system like Infinity, where they can be revived by healing magic or medic skills if they're at 0 (and have a No Wound Incapacitation-style "keep fighting despite being near death because THERE'S OXYGEN IN MY MUSCLES" skill), but if they're coup de graced they're gone for good.

>>51381825
That sounds good. Some skill for sports club members or some bitter kids (goths, emos, whatever) could have an "it will not die" skill that when they hit 0HP, on a succesfull test they gain back a single HP and fight on through sheer willpower or a "fuck everything, I won't go away!" basis.

>>51381877
Here stealing from Infinity works fine, it has two levels of "I'm not dead yet."

Dogged means if you're killed you don't die as long as you have actions left, while No Wound Incapacitation means you just run around on 0 wounds until you're shot again.

In my system I was thinking of changing this to a basic tenacity skill where if a character hits 0HP they may choose to activate one last time and then be removed from play rather than simply be unconscious, and an improved version where you ignore unconsciousness altogether.

>>51380157
I've got restic (early Warpath versions) Deadzone restic and the plastic (Enforcers, Pathfinders, Jetbikes and Peacekeepers) I still like the restic as much as the plastic. In fact the N7-117 newer PVC is really good

The Marionettes for the Asterians are amazing!

>>51381937
I wanted some Asterians too, but budget was tight - maybe later I'll pick up a starter army for them and when they have a nice sale, I'll buy some stuff. Wish they'd use either restic or PVC for anything that's not metal.

Have N7-117, Blaine on jetbike and the Piper still in their KS packet. Shit, I'm slow with these things. I have a /hwg/ related main project now, but will undercoat the rest of my Enforcers tomorrow and do one of them occasionally.

>>51381998
Do it! I had funding trouble with the kickstarter but managed to get a good deal off someone who was clearing out.

I've got that Blaine too. There are many who agree that they should do the PVC instead of metal. The detail is something, and way advanced of their metals.

I just need to get focused on a force and paint it!

>>51373942
What game would you say its most similar too? Also, do you have any experience with the larger scale version of it, Slaughterloo?

>>51372579
I think /hwg/ has Blue Sky Red Sand in its trove.

>>51365136
My only problem with the Guerrilla Gaming RS videos is Ash's opponent comes off as kind of a powergamer.

Game designing anon here.

I'm working on equipment lists, and was wondering if people felt I'd missed any obvious weapon types for cliche shounen characters. Bear in mind there's going to be skills on top of these to add more variety in combat:

Simple Weapon (1H): You're not unarmed but it's just a tennis racket, satchel, umbrella or something - removes unarmed penalty.

Hand Weapon (1H): Swords, knives, 2x4s, golf clubs, folding chairs wielded by people who know how to fight. You can choose not to push targets back, allowing them to be locked in melee.

Subdual Weapon (1H): You have a taser/reverse blade sword/truncheon/training sword because you ~won't kill~. You take a -2 to hit, but if you're attacking an unaware target or charging they have to make a save or get knocked out in one strike.

Heavy Weapon (1H or 2H): Big swords, staves, spiked balls on a chain, or just being extremely swole. +1 to hit one handed, +2 to hit two handed

Great Weapon (2H): Even bigger swords, street signs, desks, punching bags etc. You get reach of 1" and +1 to hit.

Polearm (2H): Also includes ladders, if you don't want any trouble, and whips. You get reach of 2".

My aim is in most cases you don't get locked in melee, you should be knocking people into walls, over ledges and so on with your mighty techniques - basically every attack moves the combatants around and with clever use of skills you can turn this into an advantage.

>>51391600
That's a cool concept, anon, I like it.

>>51387270
To be completely honest I can't really think of anything that's similar to it off the top of my head. It's D100 based with alternating activation, but models don't take wounds and die until the very end of a turn. Every model has to stay within 30 (I think) cm of its section leader at all times, and if the section leader dies you're in trouble.

I've never played slaughterloo, though

>>51391600
Back again with gunz, again keeping it generic and acknowledging that unless you're an edgelord, operator or tomboy guns aren't great in this type of setting.

Pistols (1H):
Light - 10" range. You can make ranged attacks without a penalty.
Heavy - 10" range, +1 to hit
SMG - 10" range, 2 shots, -1 to hit

Machine Guns (2H)
Light - 15" range, 3 shots at -1 to hit or 2 shots at no penalty, may only fire once a turn
Heavy - 15" range, 3 shots at +1 to hit, requires two actions to fire

Rifles etc (2H):
Shotgun - 10" range, +1 to hit, Blast 1
Assault Rifle: 20" range, 2 shots
Sniper Rifle: 30" range, +2 to hit, requires two actions to fire

Explosives:
Bombs (1H) - 5" range, Blast 2
Grenade Launcher (2H) - 15" range, Blast 3
Missile Launcher (2H) - 25" range, Blast 4, -1 to hit, requires two actions to fire

All Blast weapons push the target that number of inches. If you miss, the defender chooses the direction. If you hit, the attacker chooses.

Blasts only damage the primary target but push anyone within the blast radius. Because seriously when does a bazooka ever stop a hero?

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Robot bump

I have started on my last couple of Heavy Gear models making daft duellists.

Like this guy, who dual wields HACs and Pack Guns, here represented by a pair of miniguns Heavyarms style.

Get him within 6" and he can unload a stupid amount of firepower.

I tried to get onto the Dark Osprey mega link, but it said that it wasn't available, is there an alternative link?

>>51392685
That's a lovely robot, man.

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Does anybody know of similar miniatures in 15mm to the Ion Age Prydians? I already own a bunch of them and I'd get more variety for my 15mm space knights.

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>>51397006
15mm.co.uk have a small selection of 'Galactic Knights' you might like.

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>>51396382
Thanks!

It was a lot of fun to build.

In other new v0.2 of DON'T BE DEFEATED BY A FRIEND is now done, now with weapons, armour, the first set of gadgets, and rules for medics.

You can now create an OPERATOR loli with a minigun, kevlar jacket, night vision goggles and smoke to cover her advance, if you really like.

Or a slacker martial artist who don't want any trabble and fights with a ladder.

>>51399433
(also if anyone is wondering where the title comes from it's from this hype as fuck boss theme from Trails of Cold Steel)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jsfGVHAqwMc

I've got a battle report to share! Unfortunately I did not remember to bring my camera along with me so I was unable to get pictures, so you'll have to miss out on my unpainted xenomorph infants and predator proxies, boo-hoo.

The forces and mission parameters!

AVP:Unleashed Battle Report
Army List #1 (please include what units and options):
USCM
Major Dutch Schaefer. 110
Colonial Marine Infantry 1: Squad commander w/Motion tracker and Sentry gun, Marine w/Smartgun, Marine w/flame thrower, Marine w/med-kit. 117
Colonial Marine Infantry 2: Squad Commander w/Motion tracker and Sentry gun, Marine w/Smartgun, Marine w/Flame thrower, Marine w/med-kit, 1 extra Marine. 131
Wey-Yu Commandos: 6 Wey-Yu Commandos, 1 commando w/smartgun. 147
Total; 505

Army List #2 (please include what units and options):
Predators with Killers Clan distinction.
Predator Elder: Combi-stick, Plasma Caster. 210
Predator Youngbloods: 2 Youngbloods with combi-sticks. 100
Alien Infants 1: 5 Infants, no mutations. 45
Alien Infants 2: 5 Infants, no mutations. 45
Predator Elite: Power Gauntlet, Plasma Caster. 95
Total; 500
Total Points: 500 points per side.

Mission: The Advanced Base.
Battle line deployment (6 inch zone from the chosen table edge)
Deployment options; Regular, Flank Deployment, Rapid Deployment, Infiltrate, Stalk,
Pre-emptive strike.
Place an objective marker at the central point of the board and scatters it D20/4” randomly for final placement. Then roll for initial initiative as descripted in chapter 3.

MISSION PARAMETER:
Both players are attempting to claim that position as an advanced base. If at the end of any turn 4 or later any player has more than double the amount of models within 8” of the marker than their opponent, they score a major victory (10 MP). If the game ends due to ‘Disengage’, the player with the most units within 8” of the objective marker earns a partial victory (5 MP)

Continued.

>>51402066
The forces you see here are arranged using the Skirmish Offensive Organisation Chart.

Marine player (my friend Nick) won the initial initiative and deployment, infiltrating his Wey-Yu Commandos forward and arranging the marine infantry and Dutch to advance under their cover fire.

My plan was to use the Infant broods to screen my Young Bloods and pin the commandos and marine infantry squads in place to make an easier time for my Elite and Elder to clean them up in close combat and have the Young Bloods secure the objective.

The game went on for 4 turns, 3 of which the marine force were able to hold onto the initiative capitalizing on it by lining up in a solid firing line for 2 turns in which they whittled down my Infant broods as they advanced up the board to several panic checks(all thankfully passed). The Elder and Elite began the game infiltrated ahead of my main force and proceeded to engage the marine forces in their first activations, with the Elder charging, from my right hand side from a ruined building, into melee with the squad of Wey-Yu Commandos who had infiltrated ahead of the main force and were gearing up to lay some serious hurt on my Infants and Young Bloods. The Elite infiltrated into a building ruin on my left just ahead of and to the side of the Wey-Yu Commandos and within range and sight of Marine Squad 2, he engaged the marines after climbing down his ruin and spinning up his plasma caster.

In the initial charge, the Elder managed to take out half the commando unit with a sweep of his combi-stick, sadly the commandos made their morale check and were still in the fight. In return over 2 turns the Elder was worn down almost entirely due to the serrated combat knives of the Commandos. Exploit quality is some serious shit, doesn't matter the weapon, forced rerolls are amazing. By turn 2 I was able to get the surviving Infants of brood 2 into that combat to assist the Elder, the Commandos died much quicker once that happened.

Cont.

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>>51402291
The Elite spent this time peppering marine squad 2 with plasma fire and soaking up quite a bit of smart gun and sentry gun fire in return. Though with a bit of clever AP usage I got him behind some LOS blocking ruins and used the predator medkit and gained back a few wounds. Bad choices in target priority later saw the Elite get shot to bits in the bottom of turn 3.

Marine squad 1 advanced through the ground floor of a multi-storied industrial ruin infront of their deployment zone where they set up their sentry gun and dug in to prepare for the Infants and Young Bloods that were halfway up the table(they died horribly later, mind you, lousy Smartguns...). Bottom of turn 3 saw things really go against the predators, with the Elder and Infants cleaning up the surviving Commandos and, for the Elder, getting shot to death at range before his activation. A bad judgement of distance on my part saw the Young Bloods come up just short of making some charges into Marine Squad 1 and tying them up, and them getting shot and burnt to death in return. So ended turn 3, turn 4 saw the end come in a blast of muzzle flare.

Dutch had been making short work of Infant Brood 1 during the game from middle of turn 2 onwards; in turn 3 Dutch had moved up with a run to secure the objective and lay down more fire on the second Infant brood. Marine Squad 1 shifts position and brings to bare their smartgun and sentry turret on the Elder, who promptly caught 2 powershots(a result of a natural 1 on a d20 roll to attack in range or close combat results in an automatic wound with no save or heal/medic roll possible) on his last 2 wounds. Predators wiped to the last, marines secure their new forward base and some of those shifty Wey-Yu jerks bought the farm. Not bad for a day’s hard fighting.

Outcome: Total Victory for the marines (OOH-RAH!).

>>51402444
And there you go, a brief battle report of my game yesterday. I hope that was all coherent enough for you to follow. I must admit, I had my reservations about the predators being OP when I was reading their army list, but they're individually expensive, and still die to weight of fire even despite their fancy gear and special rules. They're very much a finesse army. I'm looking forward to more games of this, and even some crossover battles with my Warzone armies, that'll be pretty fun I reckon.

If anyone's curious, I linked to the beta folder of AVP:Unleashed in this post>>51372660, check it out, give it a read and try out a game if you'd like.

>>51399433
Quickly read through it. Seems like a functional enough base system (your mods all changing the targets DF is interesting. What made you do that?) on top of an amusingly silly idea, but then when I went to check lethality and maths I immediately got to

3 Starting Melee
+1ME from Sporting Club
+1 Melee from free Sport Advances (if I can take "+1 ME or RA" here despite having it from Sporting Club above.)
2H Heavy Weapon -> +2 to hit
Average d12 roll is a 6.5
The lowest starting DF is 11, but the avg is likely 12, before armor, so I'll use 12.

6.5+3+1+1+2 = 13.5. 13.5-12 = 1.5
I'll cause ~1.5 average damage to an unarmored person from a single attack, when people have 10HP.
For the initial charge you'll do 1 more damage, as it's -1DF on their end. And this is on a dude trying to be as hurty as possible.

Is this correct?

Barely related: double attacks for only -1 to hit is iffy. I'm looking specifically at the SMG. IIRC this game idea was sourced from Rogue Stars and I'd like to comment there, in you're using its Hail of Fire as inspiration: In Rogue Stars, Hail of Fire is probably overpowered and also probably always a good idea to do over everything else...so don't use too much there. Also, can you not dual-fire guns? Like 2 pistols or 2 SMGs? With Operator Lolis, that doesn't seem out of genre.

>>51402066
>>51402291
>>51402444
This game is based off Warzone Res 2.0, isn't it? How closely tied is it to the actual Res 2.0 guys?
I remember some threads back we had plenty of praise for Warzone but it was said that after a while flaws become evident in its design. I only ever played 2 games of Res 2.0 and I saw no glaring errors (in fact it played well enough, despite being slightly irritating having to check mods+fire for every single model), but I'm wondering if you know what Res's problems were, and if this corrects them?

I'm glad to hear predators are finesse-y elite types; that's my favorite kind of army. I'll check it out, if only for the entertainment of reading an AvP wargame.

Also why does Army List #2 include predators AND aliens? What's up with that? It looks to be an ability of "Killers" clan, but does that have any basis in established "lore"?

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It appears that Flintloque will be getting a starter kit soon.

Popping in from /gdg/, what is /awg/ thoughts on D12's?

>>51403473
And new painters by the looks of it.

>>51403572
Like, the die?
I think it's fine. Better than d6s, probably. Simply because it allows for a moderate amount of granularity.

It's all about the maths though. I don't really have special attachment to dice types.

We have somebody making a d12 based game in the thread above, as posted >>51399433 here.

>>51403465
It's the same game, Warzone and AVP:U are both using Prodos' W.A.R system.

>>51403714
I'm working on a game that does pools of 3-4 dice and count the successes, with right now D12's and '12' counts as 2 successes. The reason I'm using D12's is because weapons' power increases the chance of 2 successes; a power 2 weapon needs '10+' instead of '12'. The granulation of the numbers help a bit more than something like D10. But I have noticed D10's are a lot more popular now and more plentiful.

>>51403465
>>51403920
>I remember some threads back we had plenty of praise for Warzone but it was said that after a while flaws become evident in its design. I only ever played 2 games of Res 2.0 and I saw no glaring errors (in fact it played well enough, despite being slightly irritating having to check mods+fire for every single model), but I'm wondering if you know what Res's problems were, and if this corrects them?
AVP:U uses the same system as Warzone: Resurrection 2.0, which was a marked improvement over the 1st edition of the game. As for what that fixed, it was a range of things, interactions of the special abilities and cutting down ability bloat in favour of the big list in the book with a scattering of faction and unit specific ones(the game doesn't need 5 different ways of saying infantry squad can get a smoke screen, for example), terrain interactions and cover modifiers being simpler, the removal of the squad special actions and weapon damage types. It was all just streamlining and tightening up the writing and formatting.

>I'm glad to hear predators are finesse-y elite types; that's my favorite kind of army. I'll check it out, if only for the entertainment of reading an AvP wargame.
I'm glad to hear that, the Predators were fun, even with my sloppy play.

>Also why does Army List #2 include predators AND aliens? What's up with that? It looks to be an ability of "Killers" clan, but does that have any basis in established "lore"?
Go into the dropbox link I linked to in the bat rep and have a look at the predators army list, you'll find on special rules and armoury page that there's a selection of Clans that you can assign to your army to gain different bonuses, abilties, and in the Killers case, additional unit choices. As for how backed up by the lore? The Killers and their usage of Xenomorph hunting beasts is well covered in the AVP comic Three Worlds War, published in 2010, it might also be mentioned in some novels, not sure though.

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>>51403653
Oh come on, its not like their other work is that ba-

>>51404099
Oh dear, that is special.

>>51397006
Honestly not that many, most 15mm these days are super near future/modern/hardscifi based

>>51405270
>Honestly not that many, most 15mm these days are super near future/modern/hardscifi based
I bet a lot of that has to do with that there really isn't as widespread 80's nostalgia anymore, at least not as much as there was in the 90s/00s.

A good and cool battlereport of a 40K game played using a historical ruleset: https://govgensectorsix.blogspot.co.nz/2017/01/trying-donnybook-for-40k.html

Notes on converting the rules: https://govgensectorsix.blogspot.co.nz/2017/01/donnyk-mods.html

They're pretty good rules anyway, but the 40K battlereport is a great read.

(donnybrook rules, fresh from the /hwg/ archives: http://www.mediafire.com/file/9o59f6dbrqjuv9j/Donnybrook.pdf )

>>51405925
I swear to god, /awg/, I know that "battle report" is two words.

>>51403349
This is exactly the sort of feedback I'm looking for, thank you!

I will admit I have lowballed numbers at first because I still haven't written the proper skill list or magic rules and I envisage those being a very important factor (as my inspirations do include IHMN, Rogue Stars etc). I think base defence could stand to be lower based on what you identify, though, and will focus on that in the playtests I have upcoming.

I was thinking the fact people you shoot get a free dodge to cover would mitigate the advantages of rapid fire if you were using a terrain dense board, but that's a potential issue I was going to look into with in depth testing.

Dual wielding I want in but like with a lot of skill and trait stuff I need the basic universal rules down before I look too much at that.

>>51406272
Update: subtracting 5 from all defense totals seems to make the maths work a lot better, giving an effective range of 4-16 DF. If someone is a full tank with max starting DF (8 +2 advances +4 Armour) you can't hurt them with less than a +3 To Hit mod, but that doesn't seem unreasonable.

And a combat master (3ME +2 Weapon +1 Advance) can do up to 4 wounds on that ultra tank and one shot an unarmoured guy on a 10+, making transferring wounds more valuable.

>>51404099
Shit, I'd offer my painting services for free just to have better pics in the gallery.

The worst is when the owner thinks he can paint, and only uses his own pics instead of something like white undercoat+wash.

I wonder, how many people here were introduced to wargames through Warhammer? Especially for those 25 and under. Because I feel like GW is the only company out there that actively tries to get young people to get into their games, and that for most young people nowadays it's their only way of getting exposed to wargaming.

>>51407529
I got into it via BrikWars. Was aware of Warhammer before that, but BW was the first wargame I've played.

Shit, I think I played more with that than with Warhammer.

>>51407529
>wonder, how many people here were introduced to wargames through Warhammer? Especially for those 25 and under.
I know I sure was, There was also the brightly uniformed Napleonics stuff that my dad's friends played, but that was more just nice to look at than to get into playing. I was a kid, aliens and space marines were more exciting than history for me.

>Because I feel like GW is the only company out there that actively tries to get young people to get into their games, and that for most young people nowadays it's their only way of getting exposed to wargaming.

They're also the only tabletop games company with their own retail arm, everyone else is pushing their games and product through conventions(for most youngsters they're hard to get to or find), third party retailers(again, sometimes hard to find, and /sometimes/ also not a very encouraging environment), or online.

GW's got market presence on lock down, it's little wonder why little Johnny and his friends will pick up Space Marines and Tau and play an abortion like 40k when it's pretty much the only thing they're going to actually see until they hit that wall of an edition change and find out there are actually other games out there!

>>51407529
There are three main means of getting introduced to wargaming:

>Get into it through a friend
This is maybe the most common and widespread way. Since GW is the most widely played, many people get into it through GW properties.

>Get exposed through a store
This is the other big way. But since most people don't just randomly wander into a FLGS and pick up a wargame, they are a much worse avenue for this than GW stores. Say what you will for GW stores, they are bright, colorful and make people curious. Their express purpose was to introduce new people to the game and to build loyalty.. That's why everything about them went full retard when somebody decided that the brick and mortar retail arm should not only recruit and, if possible, keep itself afloat, but post a good profit.
Regardless, GW is the only fish in the pond that has stores and I'm not sure any other company could even support one. So, GW gets all the exposure there.

>Get exposed through secondary media
Comics, books, games and merchandise has always been the third big way to get introduced. I got into wargaming because of DoW back in the day and I know people that picked it up because of Shadow of the Horned Rat. The White Dwarf (used to be sold?) is sold at big vendors, their books in mainstream bookstores and they get games made. Most of which are shitty shovelware, but they still give them exposure. Most other games don't even have a fracture of the secondary shit that surrounds GW games.

So, yeah, GW often acts completely retarded, but nobody but them has a proper strategy or even idea of how to grow their market or recruit new customers. They all just drift in the wargaming pond and at best try to ponder to one specific demographic of existing players, like Warmachine did with disgruntled hardcore 40k players back in the day.

>>51407821
>Regardless, GW is the only fish in the pond that has stores and I'm not sure any other company could even support one.
Warlord just opened theirs.

>>51407529
I'm not quite 25 and under anymore, but I certainly got into the hobby via GW.
It all started as a grade schooler when I saw my friend's older brother's beautifully painted 2E Blood Angels and Tyranids.
From there it was constant visits to ogle minis at the stores until I was old enough to buy some. (The manager at the store told me that I should wait until I was 12 before I got started).

I didn't break out of GW's grip until fairly recently, three or four years ago?

>>51407846
Is it connected to their head office?

>>51407529
40k as a kid and dabbled in fantasy, but the games were always kinda shit imo. Even the older editions I played back in the day that people get nostalgic about were always clunky and awful.
I can't imagine getting invested in a game that requires a specific line of miniatures any more, now that i've played much better games.

>>51409053
The specific miniatures and the universe associated with them is half the point, surely you realise that.

>>51409053
I like ranges that have a good sense of background with their own figures. I don't mind games that don't require own models, but I'm more invested if a game has nice figures.

I started with D&D, then GW (they still have a spot in my dark gaming heart and the 40k setting is amazing if not fully the same can be said for the game) I have always liked all things gaming. Rackhams Confrontation was good because of the figures! That's why I was invested in that game!
I even played and collected 2nd ed Warzone and Chronopia, was gutted when they collapsed. But got into Warzone Resurrection because of the lore and the figures. I like beyond the Gates of Antares and the figures (sue me) and Infinity, again great figures. Love Warpath/Deadzone. Guess what, because I like the lore and love the figures.

>>51410059
Old GW was basically DnD - tons of different figures with such distinct names as "male cleric" and such.

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>>51412103
Except when they decided each sculpt needed a name. Half of the time they were obscure pop-culture references (I'm pretty sure the halfling from McDeath was named for a character from a niche soap opera).

>>51412131
Like Macbeth?

>>51412131
Brother Angst? Ex Brother Marine?

>>51412131
Their naming conventions were arbitrary to a point where I'm convinced that it was just random names that the sculpters gave the models while sculpting them. Like, why the fuck does Brother Sheer have a neme, yet CAPTAIN doesn't? Or Brother Angst and HEAVY LASER?

What are those weapons the advancing/firing/guard marine are holding? Grav? Laser?

A quick terminology question in wargames:

What does "platoon-level", "Squad-level" etc generally mean?

Like, for a platoon-level game, would it mean one side deploys a force that is equal in power to about a platoon (and thus likely uses several squads to organize itself in-play), or does it mean the smallest unit in the game is a platoon, and thus it only "goes down to" a platoon level?

What would I call a game where the smallest model represents an entire infantry squad of ~8-12 guys or like, a single tank?

>>51412795
I'm not entirely sure, but when I say platoon level I mean the basic unit you buy is a squad, and the game's roughly platoon sized - 30-40 infantry with some support weapons.

The game you described would be squad level.

>>51412463
>I'm convinced that it was just random names that the sculpters gave the models while sculpting them.

This is almost certainly the case. Old School GW wasn't dominated by the marketing dept like it is now.

Hell I dunno if they even had a marketing department.

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>>51412795
>What does "platoon-level", "Squad-level" etc generally mean?

It's about the total number of models. The organisation of those models does not necessarily factor in.
Games that use multibases and count wounds rather than using casualty removal will have you effectively playing with 12 or so abstract 'units' in the same way a skirmisher does when you use individual models.

~8-12 single guys would be squad level.

Which means you should be looking for rules of skirmish games if you are looking for something around that size.

>>51412379
The Ex Brother Marine is probably a play on Monty Python parrot sketch. The dead parrot is referred to as an ex-parrot, hence this dead marine is an ex-marine.

I also have another question. Is miniature wargaming stagnate population was? As in, it doesn't really decrease in number but it doesn't increase either?

>>51414523
Well, boardgames get more and more recognition, but it'll take time till it gets to wargaming as well. There are some games that are a bit of both (like FFG's Runewars, or the Command&Colors series), so I guess in the coming years, we can expect some interest in the hobby.

>>51412795
Squad or Skirmish level refers to up to fifteen models per side, usually.
Platoon refers to anything between fifteen and a hundred usually, though the higher numbers are often pushing the definition and "anything between 25 and 50 models per side" is the common ground for most platoon level games.

>>51414523
We only have estimated numbers in the US through voluntary FLGS reports. According to those, at least, it's slowly growing. Sales for GW games have been shrinking slowly over the last years, other games have been slowly growing but faster than GW has been shrinking and X-Wing pretty much exploded into the scene and shot straight to #1.
That's only reports for US stores, though, and doesn't take online shops into account. All in all I'd say the market is stable and slowly, very slowly, growing though. Pretty much as it has ever been, outside of that one bout with LotR.

Another update from the guy trying to design the shounen skirmish game. Apologies if this belongs more on /gdg/.

I actually playtested it tonight, using some Walking Dead and Infinity figures.

Jimmy Parmesan and his gang were causing a ruckus at the malt shop, and it fell to the Super Star Sailors to punish him.*

On one side there was Jimmy Parmesan with his football pads and Louisville Slugger, and Frank Ricotta with his Super Death Ray (a HMG).

On the other, Bunny Lunette with the Moonlight Arrow and Amy Waters with a gun and a sword.

The Parmesan Gang were specced full on for combat, while the magical girls obviously had more support stats. The idea of this test was to see how deadly minmaxed combat characters were against balanced and support characters.

Initially things seemed OK; the girls put some wounds on the greasers at range, the dodging into cover worked well. And then Frank Ricotta opened up with his death ray, rolled shit-hot dice and killed Bunny in one turn, while Jimmy Parmesan killed Amy (who had already been wounded by the death ray)

Things I learned:

- DF10 is way too high a base, but DF5 is possibly too low. I'm going with 6 for now.

- When big guns come out having a buddy nearby to transfer damage, and preferably a medic to heal it, is vital.

- The HMG/minigun was way too strong with the accuracy bonus. I've got rid of it. It still fires 3 times at 15" range.

All told the system seems to work well in a "do the moving parts do what I want them to" sense, it's very much just a case of tweaking numbers now.

*Battle report provided by 4Kids

>>51416448
Keep us updated anon, this seems like fun. Told about the system to my brother, and he really liked the idea, and inmediately proposed "we should only use 2d figures for an anime game", so I'll probably draw some characters and use those instead of figures.

>>51416530
A great idea!

I'm currently deep into writing skill lists, and will put up a new pdf when they're done.

My favourite skill combo so far is probably Nothing Personal (if you charge from 5" or less out you can teleport behind the target) and Basic CQC (ignore penalties for Subdual when making back attacks).

Although as both are Melee you can't get the combo at character creation by RAW...

>>51416448
/gdg/ doesn't like miniature games anyway.

ding

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Posting my horde of fallen for KoW, just to try and give this thread any sort of life.
Empty base at the back with a little niche to fit a spindown d20 as the wound counter.

>>51421161
Looking really nice. Like the bases as it sets of the figures. Great idea with the spin down good show

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A Quick reference sheet for Rogue Stars that doesn't look like ass

>Beasts doing Wrath of Kings week next week
Oh, nice.

>>51394680
https://www.mediafire.com/folder/yhn9r8j2dq9nd/Dark%20Osprey

What happened to the Twilight Kin for KoW? Has their official army book/supplement been out already? If so, then does anyone have a PDF for it?

Also, does anyone have a PDF of the latest Clash of Kings rules for KoW?

>>51424377
Saw that mentioned, should be interesting!

>>51397006
http://www.slapminis.com/space-knights---15mm-sci-fi-28-c.asp

>>51424552
There's beta rules on Mantic's website, which are tourney legal (though check with organisers)
AFAIK there's a supplement coming out late this year with new units for existing armies and possibly the full TK list?
If nothing else, and you have Dark Elf models you really want to use, nothing stopping you just running them as Elves.

http://wizkids.com/deep-cuts-unpainted/

There'll be some pretty nice figures here.

>>51426280
Too bad it's Wizkids
I still salty how they "silenced" D&D attack wing. even more they deny everything or delete posts in forums so make sure no one brings the issue ever again.

>>51426280
Well it's typical 3d cad designing. Let down with fucking atrocious 3d render paint jobs. Will need to see what they are cast in, hopefully the same PVC that either Mantic are using or SteamForged are using for Dark Souls boardgame.

Why can't these companies print out and get models painted. Prodos are as guilty of this too. Great figures with shitty Photoshop paint jobs, that look worse than not painted!

>>51426333
Yeah I noticed that D&D Attack Wing had gone quiet. I still don't understand why Wizkids are realeasing these. Or why FFG think that there's a market for Runewars. My FLGS cannot either.

Warpath Firefight - how low can it go for a good game? I looked at the example force photo in the rulebook, which is 1500 points or whatever of scrunts, and they call that a mediumish game - it looks way too busy for the rogue trader kind of scale I want. Is the game worth shit down at a third of those figures?

>>51428002
Page 76, size of the game - 1250 points seems to be the average value.

>>51428002
Like, 500 pts? Judging by how things look (with HVA in particular) at that scale skew lists will be at least a little "damaging."

Like the lowest point size group is 1-1250 (on pg 76) and you have 2** for HVA at that level. So if you do something like take a 2** vehicle (Say, a Veer-Myn Tunneler or Asterian Force Platform), I could see lists being built that are not equipped to handle it. Seems like you'd have to modify things at least a bit - like maybe only 1* of HVA at 500-750, or no Def8+ vehicles.

I haven't actually played it though, so it might work just as well.

>>51428403
Yeah, that's what's got me iffy - 1,250 isn't much smaller than the army shown, and I'm not sure I trust "1-1,250" to mean that 500-650 is any good.

I just like my smaller scuffles, with a couple of squads and one or two fancy bits and a couple of characters or equivalent.

I play 28mm SF games. I want some trucks. Some wagons. Something I can build a convoy out of. Lightly armed, maybe, but that's unnecessary. Something that wouldn't look too out of place in the grim darkness of the far future? Something (or a selection of somethings) I could reasonably put down 3-4 of as a project, but not a bank-breaking one? Flatbeds, shipping containers, wheels preferred but tracks OK.

I have wagons for my historical stuff and fantasy stuff, I just don't have an equivalent for guard-the-convoy/ambush-the-convoy/raid-the-base-as-the-convoy-unloads games in the future.

Puppetswar do something nice and ludicrously expensive, while most of the other stuff I've seen is too wasteland/orky or more like a small van than anything useful.

Tempted just to buy a few of the Mars Attacks trucks, or some Hiluxen from one of the modern companies and slap some SF gubbins on, but that'd look too... modern.

>>51428844
Laser Cut Card, and there was an aussie company doing laser cut shit but I can't remember their name.

>>51428844

http://www.daemonscape.com/contents/en-uk/d5.html

These guys have some, they're a touch small though, closer to 25mm than 28mm.

>>51428844
>>51428996
https://www.miniaturescenery.com

Found them! They have some of the things you've described.

What's everyone's favorite line of elfs?

I love the Russian alternative one, mantic ones are too skinny, and gw is dead

>>51429167
Reaper Warlord

>>51426668
>Great figures with shitty Photoshop paint jobs, that look worse than not painted!

I don't think that's Photoshop. Looks more like author just used single colours for each object and rendered them in CAD like this. With no lighting work or applying correct textures. Basically extreme laziness or colour and texture incompetence.

>>51430500
Yeah, I put a full stop instead of a comma. I ment that Prodos make lovely figures but Photoshop paint their models and they look shit because they are to tight to get a contract painter. Christ I'd do it for them if they shipped me early, paid for return to Poland and paid me a little and in toys.

But those Wizkids models I agree look lazy rendered, bit like their shitty machine painting for the Star Trek ships, click,etc

>>51430635
Actual painted miniatures almost always look much better than their renders so it would definitely be an improvement.

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>>51429028
Yeah, they're based on GZG, but too small for my tastes, I'm afraid.

>>51429074
I weep at their site, because fuck shipping MDF from Australia to the UK. :(

>>51429167
If you like things a bit cartoony and very shirtless, Brigade Models sell the Celtos ones.

http://www.brigademodels.co.uk/Celtos/The%20Sidhe.html

Thunderbolt Mountain elves are beautiful, although the Ballerina Fairy Princesses in the kids section are more hardcore than the more serious sculpts. Pic very much related.

http://www.thunderboltmountain.com/collections/all/30mm

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>>51431433

>>51429167
>favorite line of elfs?
>gw is dead
I like the LotR elves from GW. Pretty nice sculpts.
If I were to do only a warband though I'd likely use Spellcrow ones. They have a charmingly oldschool GW feel to them.

What are your guys' opinion on limited edition models? As in, models that are only sold for a certain period of time, or have an artificial cap on production?

>>51432450
I hate them. "Can't afford it at the moment? Fuck you, you'll either never get it or for thrice the money from a reseller who bought fourty."

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I have a question about Rogue Stars.
The Rulebook says a character may use a two handed weapon in melee as improvised weapon.
I can't find stats for improvised weapons in the book though, so what does that mean?

>>51432450
I wholeheartedly endorse the comments made by >>51432489

I think it's abhorrent and artificially increases the resellers ability to make money as apposed to the manufacturer which is bollocks. I include kickstarter exclusive models in that too

>>51433216
Improvised weapons are -1 to your melee roll. Theses a cheat sheet a few posts up, it's on there

>>51433216

This post, it's further than I thought!

>>51423735

>>51433248
>>51433266
Thanks!

When I'm done with this squad I'll post it here for feedback.

>>51433296
Good stuff. Glad that Rogue Stars is finding a home here!

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Well, if anyone wants to have another look over my WIP wargame, I've rebalanced the defence stat based on initial playtests and simulated dice rolls, written skill tables and tweaked a couple of bits of equipment.

Spellcasting is still not in because that's going to be a big chunk of work on its own.

I am thinking of having spellcasting rolls be "roll a number of d12 equal to your casting stat, try and match or beat the target number with as many as possible" with some spells having levels of success.

For example:

Magical Healing: Range 5", Target Number 6
1-2 Successes: Target heals 2HP
3+ Successes: Target heals 1d6HP

Or

Unlimited Sword Rain: Range 15", Target Number 8
1-2 Successes: ROF1 ACC+0
3 Successes: ROF2 ACC+0
4+ Successes: ROF3 ACC+0

Not all spells would have that, some would just need a fixed number of successes:

Arriving On Time... Range 10", Target Number 7
2 Successes: If the caster is not in Line of Sight of any enemies, place them anywhere within 10" that is also not in Line of Sight of any enemies.

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>>51433463
A long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away...

>>51434260
Looks nice and characterful. Would have been funny if you could give Fett a skill called 'tastes bad to Sarlacc's' like the additions of photos. Should be a good team to use. Hope you have fun!

>>51434260
>>51434367
Mandalorian Poser
Models with this trait suffer a -3 penalty to all models subject to the affected by the blind rules.

>>51434260
Good luck getting a hold of the Boba Fett mini though, it's out of stock everywhere

>>51435362
Mh... I found all of the minis, the Boba Fett one costs twice as much as the other ones though.
Buying four FFG quality plastic minis would cost me about 50€.
Is that the regular pricing, that Boba is more expensive than the others?

Not sure if that is worth it to me, though. I'm on the fence about the quality of the FFG models.
From what it looks like you can make them look really nice with a bit of patience when painting them, but out of the box they don't really blow me away.

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>playing any of FFG miniature games

>>51436209
X-wing is a fine game, snobbery about painting aside.

>>51436209
nobody was talking about FFG games, only the minis.

Anyway, do you have an issue with the rules or the minis?

>>51436244
You can still paint them, you just don't have to.
X-Wing has a format where that even works well without taking away from the quality of the models.
Dust and the like suffered from the preassembled and built thing more than it benefited the game.

>>51428539
Have you thought about this any more and come to any conclusions? Or maybe willing to test it and report back?

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What size do you think is ideal for a skirmish/rpg warband? The only way to buy 6mm is in big packs of 25-40 figures (understandable), but I want to keep my figures compact and organized. Right now my plan is to have 15 figures to a "theme"; I just glued together a viking band with 15 figures, but I'm not sure if I should go bigger. Maybe 20 or 25?

>>51437210
Multiples of 6 will make your life much easier. 24 is good. Splits into two units of 12 or four of 6.

I'd suggest 20 done as regulars, 4 done as minor leaders who can fight in the mass or lead smaller units, and then a separate overall leader character.

>>51437210
>skirmish/rpg warband?
~12 models imo, but I'm into 28mm primarily.

>>51437319
This also means if your game works well with 12-figure forces, you can run a small game with two opposing forces out of one unit. I'd do this by including some minor distinction in the paint scheme, but still making them unified enough (despite being a chaotic warband) to look good together.

>>51433841
>1-2 Successes: Target heals 2HP
>3+ Successes: Target heals 1d6HP
Wouldn't it be better as 1+d3?

Hey guys anyone on here have experience with MERCS? Really looking for a skirmish level wargame for me and a buddy. Doesn't matter how weird.

I need something with good minis and good rules folks.

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>>51437319
>>51437343
>>51437362

Thanks for the advice. I ended up basing two sets of 9 soldiers with a flag bearer, two elite soldiers, two heroes, and a leader. I painted up enough so I finally have a Dungeon Scum warband, although I still have to build some monsters or enemies for them to fight against.

>>51438660
You're quite right, that was just a case of me being tired and making a dumb error...

>>51439221
>I need something with good minis and good rules folks.
From what I hear Malifaux would fit that bill, no first hand experience with it.
I also like the Deep Wars/Shadow Sea miniatures and I heard the game runs on a variant of the SoBH engine.

>>51424507
thanks for that

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Mecha bump!

>>51439368
Shit those vikings are adorable.

>>51442557
Speaking of mechas, what good lines of robots and mechas are there?

>>51444132
Well Heavy Gear has some nice mechs. Though they are supposed to be mostly APC sized.

Russian Technolog has several lines with a little crazy art direction (Think old Heavy Metal cartoon). Among them is ZOD (supposedly 15 mm scale but it is not very strict) with some mechs (average size around 50 mm).

Anyone here play saga? how is it?

>>51444516
That is more of a /hwg/ thing

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>>51444516
It's alright, not the deepest of games but very cheap miniature wise and it irritates infinity player for some reason.

>>51444576

Ahhh shit sorry, just really wanted to see the opinion on some skirmish games.

>>51444626
I'm sure they cover historical skirmish games in hwg. We cover the not historical stuff

>>51444626
Ask /hwg/, but generally they like it. One guy there plays it alot, maybe he can give you details if you have specific questions.

>>51444606
Why would it infuriated Infinity players? It's totally different and I can't even find the words for how stupid that is!!

>>51444773
>>51444761

Well can you guys recommend some alternate skirmish games?

Just need good minis and good rules is all.

>>51444781
I'm also trying to work out why saga did that to them?

Mostly becasue it wasn't infinity

>>51444792
Dead mans hand (wild west)
Freebooters Fate (fantasy pirates)
Malifaux (victorian steam punk setting, lovely minis)
Guild ball (fantasy football, but medieval football, not american football)
strange aeons (lovecraftian)

Since i'm at it; musket & tomahawk is another great historical skirmish game which gains popularity these days.

>>51444606
>not the deepest of games

It has some really neat mechanics though. I also wouldn't rate a less complex game lower just because of that. These type of game has their place as well.

>>51444792


Dragon Rampart (or Lion Rampart if you want it historical).
Frostgrave
Broken Legions

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>>51444870
>Dragon Rampart (or Lion Rampart if you want it historical).

>>51444870

Frostgrave looks pretty fun. Can you describe it some?

>>51445118
A wizard leads a group of soldiers into a sunken city to gather riches and knowledge.

The wizard (and his apprentice) can gather exp and gain new spells.

The game is big on campaign play, so leveling up your wizard and hiring more and different soldiers has an effect on your next missions.

Its great fun if you play it with likeminded people because there are some balance issues and if some people powerplay while others want to roleplay it can take away the fun for both sides.

Nice game though.

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>>51444132
>Speaking of mechas, what good lines of robots and mechas are there?

There are several manufacturers out there, and a couple have more than one line.
Dream Pod 9 -
• Heavy Gear - 10mm, Votom scale (light tanks/APCs), with various armies inspired by different mecha designers. The Southern armies are more VOTOMS, while the Northern hew closer to a Gundam aesthetic, and Caprice does quads with arrow-head bodies. Some tanks and a lot of infantry. There's a free set of PDFs up on RPGnow if you want to investigate.
• Jovian Chronicles - Heavily-Gundam-inspired, mostly kind of ZZ-era. Intended for space combat, and the basing reflects that
• Mekton (these minis are OoP) - Again, heavily Gundam-inspired. Jovian Chronicles was originally a Mekton setting, later adapted to the Silhouette system.

Palladium
• Robotech RPG Tactics - Minis are a bit overcomplicated, but the only way to get Macross designs legally right now. Plus they're cheap. Palladium is a shitty company, but whatever.
• Rifts - a couple "western" mecha designs with some Super Robot stylings coming out.. well, sometime.

Reaper -
• CAV Combat Operations and CAV. Officially 1/144, but several of the minis on the top end are usable as 15mm light 'mechs, and the bottom end as 6mm 'mechs. Tanks work from 6-10mm.

WizKids -
• Mechwarrior: Dark Age (OoP). 10mm. Restyled Battletech designs. Cheap, prepainted Clix-quality stuff. Still available online in quantity, and only LE minis are actually pricy. Also has good tank and infantry support (too good, really, it's part of what killed the game).
There was a 28mm limited line, which only included three designs, as well as a 1/144 dropship (the Aurora).

Iron Wind Metals/Catalyst Game Labs
•Battletech. The old granddaddy. 6mm, with limited-availability 15mm and OoP 28mm models. Originally included some Dougram and Macross designs (this is a gross oversimplification, ask in /btg/ if you want to know more).
(continued in next post)

>>51445402

Woah who's model is that?

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>>51445402
<Cont>

EM4 Miniatures -
• Makes a line of 6mm-15mm-usable mecha. Cheap, plastic, swappable arms. Not the best quality but at $5 who gives a shit?

Takara -
• Made 2 Dougram-based wargames with a really cool mechanic (a periscope used to check for LoS), as well as a large number of low-end pewter minis.
• Eventually released a set of Gashapon (trading figures). Set 1 is in 1/144-scale, while the remainder are 6mm

Bandai -
• Gundam gashapon. There's a wargame published for the 1/400 Gundam Collection miniatures (it's loosely based on the SD Gundam Generation video games). They also make a 1/350 line, as well as the Strategy of Gundam 1/200 line. Note that Gundam scales are exaggerated compared to most other moanufacturers.
SoG 1/200 = ~3" tall, works decently with N-scale mecha from other manufacturers
Gundam G-sight 1/350 = slightly big for 1/385 (6mm), but mixes acceptably with them. Also comes with a mini terrain feature or vehicle in each box, which are great for 6mm gaming but a bit small for 10mm.
Gundam Collection 1/400 = About the same size as 6mm minis. There are a few tanks in the line, but no infantry in any of them.
Finally, there are the "true" 1/144 action figures and models. These are decent for 10-15mm gaming, depending on whether you're using other mecha; there's also a few lines of Dougram action figures (and Macross, for that matter) in 1/144 if you're interested.

All but Strategy of Gundam are out of print, although Bandai loves flogging this particular pony..

I have a pdf somewhere with some more manufacturers, give me a bit to drag it out.

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>>51445485
>Woah who's model is that?
That's a 1/200 upmodel, but I don't know the creator, and the site I downloaded it off of is dead now. It's definitely a Kunio Okawara mechanical design (see: the legs and arms, plus that sensor block on the head that's ripped straight from a Blockhead), and possibly from Patlabor (cloth joint protectors, spotlights, scale). A lot of the upmodels swipe parts from half-a-dozen lines, though. That's got the general torso profile of a Female Powered Armor from Macross, a Dougram sensor pack, Archer/Spartan lower legs and arms, and Patlabor styling..
Did a cursory search on MAHQ, but couldn't find it under the Patlabor section. You might have better luck.

>>51445402
>>51445542
>>51444132
Found the pdf. It's out-of-date by a bit, but has some useful links. You should probably also search John Bear Ross; he does excellent "modern" mecha designs, by which I mean "He has a hard-on for the Stryker matched only by his massive mechaboner"

>>51445679

I was about to say if that was a model for a wargame I'd get into that one but nevermind.

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>>51444870
>Lion Rampart

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>>51445118
>Frostgrave looks pretty fun. Can you describe it some?
Wizard and his apprentice (the only real characters) buy assistance to go into a monster-haunted magic city and snag dosh. Only the wiz and his little buddy advance, or suffer real injuries; everyone else is expendable.
Treasure tokens are the ONLY victory condition, which can make things weird.

After game one, you can buy and kit out a base, which gives you various special abilities.

The expansions add new soldiers, spells, and win conditions (as well as base decorations).

Wizards and apprentices serve as squad leaders, and warbands are size-capped, which helps reduce the effect of outnumbering. It also incentivizes you to buy better troops as the campaign progresses.

It's relatively easy to powergame, but it's hard to have a single "campaign-ending" game the way Mordheim used to - everyone's replaceable. Even your wizard can be swapped out for his apprentice if he dies, and your apprentice can hire a new one (the apprentice's stats are based on their master's, and they share spells, so this is less bad than it sounds). Also, one high-level guy can be easily mobbed by a couple faster low-level ones, so a good tactician can often take out a sloppy power-player.

Like any skirmish game, it is far and away better to have more than 2 warbands participating. From what I hear in other groups, five to six is ideal, preferably with a game-master matching up groups with similar-costed warbands.

Guerilla Minis Games and the rest of their co-op have a whole shitload of batrep videos up.

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>>51445746
>I was about to say if that was a model for a wargame I'd get into that one but nevermind.
Found it, it's an OoP garage kit from Kaiyodo. So.. yeah. Probably not gonna be accessible anyway. My apologies for linking something ye can't get :/

In atonement I post more size comparisons from my collection

>>51446028
>headless warhammer dude
Warzone Imperial Regular.

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>>51446085
Yeah, I know. Made the pic for /btg/, and it was the closest 28mm I had to hand.
I also have a pretty solid 1e Capitol force and two of the Bauhaus/Imperial plastic boxes, plus Mourning Wolves, some Highlanders, and Etoiles Mortant. I got into Warzone 1e instead or Warhammer 2e, mostly because the WH40k players in my LGS at the time were insufferable twats.. and then Warzone died. Three times. Never been able to bring myself to unload the rest of the models, mostly because they were my first paint jobs and I like to keep them around to remind myself that I've progressed.

...when I actually finish painting something, anyway. Most of the scale-shots are me grabbing things out of my work queue in response to a question on one thread or another and snapping a shot off with my phone, which is why the quality is so ragged..

>>51439368
Nice job painting those tiny men so well, where did you get them?

>>51445542
>T-34/75
You fuckin wot m8

>>51446263

T-34 with a 75mm gun.

>>51446289
N....No

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>>51446219
Microworld games, the four swordsmen are from the Hirdmen pack and the rest are from the Viking Command pack.

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>>51445542
Thats a tiger innit.

This is a t34/76

Note the turret

>>51446415
>>51446289
>>51446263
>Is a git
>Got it inna box at PAX and miight have mixed up the labels.
I stand ashamed, sirs.

>>51357659
It's definitely a fun game, or at least it looks like one. Some of the Infinity players at my FLGS are giving it a go, and tonight's my first game. Playing my Kazaks as a gun-crazy band of Space Cops with Heavy Firepower.

Captain Orlov - 63
+Alert (2), Leadership L3 (18), Veteran (6)
+Light Power Armor (25), Assault Rifle (8), Vibroblade (4)
K-9 Officer Mosvin - 54
+Alert (2) Ambidexterity (10), Big (1), Danger Sense (2), Fast L1 (4), Martial Arts L3 (6)
+Force Shield (14), Submachine Gun x2 (12), Martial Arts
Officer Koronev - 45
+Alert (2), Medic L2 (6)
+Light Power Armor (25), Assault Rifle (8), Vibroblade (4)
Officer Sokolov - 38
+Alert (2), Difficult Target L1, Stealth L2 (3), Marksman L2 (12)
+Stealth Suit (12), Alpha-Class Needler (12)

>>51446517
You're lucky this isn't /hwg/ miss-identifying a t34 would require you to commit sudoku to remove the stain of such dishonour.

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>>51447325
True, and I lurk there as well. I plead being an historical linguist - my area of expertise is weapons evolution, 16th-17th century land warfare, and all-period naval and aerial. I don't know too much about land armor, beyond playing Squad Leader and ASL a bunch as a kid. I wasted all that brain-space on mecha anime and armored cars..

>>51447118
Get some pics (or not, if this step is too hard) and give us an AAR?

Your mans look pretty good (and hail of fire is a hell of a drug), so I imagine you'll do well.

>>51447441
Hail of Fire + Ambidexterity just seems... Well, comical. 4 attack rolls for a single order with only a -3 penalty.

>>51447634
Yep. Seeing Mosvin's statline is what made me particularly interested in hearing how it goes.
I bet he's not even going to want to use his Martial Arts skills.

If we wanna talk abusing Rogue Stars (I mean, meh), I made this pretty damn quickly as an experiment, but didn't bother testing it because that'd be rude.

Squad: Merchant. Discipline: Probably Heavy Firepower
-Light Combat Dress [7 XP]
-Ref Field [5 XP]
-Ambidex [10 XP]
-2x SMG [6 XP]
-Marksman L3[12 XP]
Sum: 40XP.
Then you just get 5 of them and Hail of Fire at people for base +0, and hope to not die with your cheap 3/3/4/4 armor.
Not good for much outside bloody murder, though. And it's also obvious nonsense for any kind of "theme."

Yeah, my general idea is to have Sokolov stay Hidden and harry the enemy whenever he can, Orlov and Koronev to actually do things while backed up by a solid medic and a pair of Hail of Fire Assault Rifles just waiting to get used, and Mosvin either hunt cheerleaders or take out the biggest threat. Might go for butchering weaker units since Reactive actions are a lot less clusterfucky than Infinity's.

>>51447994
>cheerleaders
Infinity player indeed. Do you expect a Psionic Gestalt team, or anything? I dunno if the small size of rogue star really incentivizes throw-away garbage, which is all I can see cheerleader referring to here. You can't even properly rat-spam given the nature of activation.

>Reactive actions are a lot less clusterfucky than Infinity's.
Speaking of, do you have any opinion on RS's activation+reaction system versus Infinity's? Mostly on the apparent (relative) infrequency of reactions, and the 1-3d20 for activation rather than an order pool.

It seems you haven't played RS, so maybe just pre-game thoughts, then?

>no real mech combat games with good minis and good rules

Fuck me.

>>51451974
You can play battle tech and use alt-minis.

Aside from being made by a company that seems to be somewhat unreliable Heavy Gear doesn't look bad either model and rules wise imo.
Not a detailed as BT tough.

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>>51447821
Make these guys artificial or insectoid and and add a megalomaniacal and/or insane leader and you'll be golden. Pirate captain, crazy military major or someone similar would be just right.

Something like 1 leader plus 3 of these guys, plus maybe some semi-non-combat specialist like medic.

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Bumping with my finished viking warband. Not sure what I'll put on the banner men's flags, so I left them blank for now. Other than that I'm satisfied, the only thing I might add is a druid or priest but I could probably just use my Odin figure as a spellcaster.

>tfw darkage minis makes some of the best minis
>decides to supply it to no one
>limited quantities.

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>>51451974
>Real mech combat games
Do you mean "real-robot" in the anime sense, or "games that are actually in production right now"?


>good minis
Define "good" here. Are we talking sculpt quality? Appearance (and whether that's "western", modern-military, or "anime" aesthetics)? Detail level? What scale? How much are you willing to spend?

>good rules
Well, what do you like? I can point you at modern skirmish, classic anime, chartbloat naval wargames with robutts, cinematic, skirmish, whatever.
Most mecha systems are pretty hackable, and there are a LOT of fan-conversions out there to accommodate your particular robofetish. God knows I've played enough of them to give you a head start.

But I can't just fling any more poo at your No True Scotsman wall unless you give me a lead.

>>51447441
Completely forgot about pics. Derp. It was my Intersol Critical Response Team attacking a band of Merchants. The mission: Steal Values; the location: Superfood Laboratory; the complication: VIP. Essentially the Merchants had established an illicit orchard of outlawed GMOs, and the CRT was there to capture the scientist responsible and collect all of their experimental data scattered across the facility.

The game ended about as many of my Infinity games have with this particular opponent, where I won the day and gained no experience while he limped away with a measly 3. His CC monster managed to down K-9 Officer Mosvin and nearly took down Koronev when the squad's medic went in to patch up his wounds. And then I realized that First Aid is very, very different in this game, and thus the squad's medic ended up beating the Merchant's monoblade alien to the ground with his Vibroblade. Koronev was probably the all-star of that round, though he failed to get me any points when he tripped running through terrain to get to the VIP and then failed THREE attempts at CC to arrest her. A lucky Reaction from my opponent let her Sprint away and leave her uncontrolled by me at the end of the game.

Meanwhile, my Sniper managed to peg his Heavy Power Armored leader with his needler and drop. Orlov managed to cross the board and climbed up to one of the tokens -- one of the fake outs, of course -- after winning a firefight with a teleporting psychic who then fled once the leader was dropped. And between the Psychic who ran off the board in a Rout, the Techie who just left, the two bleeding captives, and the VIP who slipped out of Koronev's grasp at the end, I managed to seize the board only to get no experience for doing so, while his dropping Mosvin netted him three xp. My medic was able to save his leader, though the CC monster bled out on the field. Next time, a Rescue to free the 76 xp Leader.

>>51453891
Heavy Gear has pretty nice rules. And their rules for mission objectives are worth stealing for other games on a regular basis.

>>51448565
>cheerleaders meme
I mean, less disposable garbage and more the fact that his team was two 60-76 point elites and then a pair of 30-something guys. Amisingly enough, I ended up bagging the two elites and a 33-point CC monster ended up giving me more trouble than anything else he had.

>Reactions
I sort of like it, but given my play with Infinity, I find it a bit odd. Especially the fact that failing an Activation on one side of the board leads to a successful Reaction that does shit on the other side of the board. I was used to a more regular, well... reaction that Infinity gives where there's cause and effect on everything. Got a handle on it in the way, but it still feels weird that my opponent's shitty rolls trying to Activate a techie in a gunfight on the other side of the board allowed Orlov to cover twelve inches.

There's a lot of jank in this game's rules, even without the garbage-tier editing. We'll still likely use it for a while and feel it out better, but some of the Missions are just actual garbage in regards to an overwhelming advantage to either Attackers or Defenders.And apparently the guys that started playing Rogue Stars here have decided to just completely axe the inclusion of Pin and Wound markers on Take the Initiative, and I can see why. That shit would become obnoxious quick. And the fact that you can't deploy Hidden, even as a Defender with a Stealth Suit and levels in Stealth, is just weird. Actions in general can be pretty fucking obnoxious. In the Steal Valuables game I played, there were numerous markers that required climbing ladders or on top of stacks of crates. The one I ended up at requiring getting into B2B with the ladder with an action. Climbing with an Action. Moving into BSB with a marker with an action. Examining the marker with an action. If it was one of the 3/6 that I could use for xp, picking it up with an action. And now I was free to go climb another building.

I'd rate it 7/10. Will keep playing it.

>>51454186
IMHO the idea of action/reaction duality is nice but I don't like how many things are weaved around them. The stress markers, the reaction activation roll, the sitting ducks and so on. Just why?

Simple alternative: Roll activation, failed activations are reactions. Opponents either use reactions as normal actions or get penalties due to some negative traits. You must apply at least one reaction to the model that is closest to the one that failed activation.

So a civilian or non-reactive will do any action through reaction at -4.
Green at -2.
All others at 0.

No need for additional rolls.

>>51454437
>Roll activation, failed activations are reactions.

Eh, I prefer having to roll for reactions as well - it means that a failed activation roll isn't necessarily a guaranteed reaction on the part of the opponent. Rather than it being the sort of game where Your Dudes do what they're told every time, it's feels like a game where you're trying to push Your Dudes to doing what they can, and adapting as best you can to it.

Got my Terminator Genisys game today, the figures look nice - tho there's a significant detail loss due to the moulding of the weapons and the faces, hopefully I can fix that easily. Worth 20 pounds for sure, but not anywhere near 70.

>>51444132
Kitbashed hi-mocks. They're plain and stupidly cheap and adorable.

>>51454032
Nice. Sounds like a right clusterfuck. Pity about the no-XP thing, and yeah I remember seeing some slight oddities with XP, although I haven't played that mission. Surprised Mosvin got destroyed so hard. What prevented you from SMGing the CC guy to death? Interest in seeing melee go down?

Also, how many arms were crippled? In my few playtests, almost every attack resulted in crippling arms up until several mans were effectively armless. Of course given that we were messing around with the rules, and that it was kinda funny to shoot arms over torsos, we may have over-done it.

Dropping Pin/Wound markers as modifiers for Take the Initiative is interesting. I did note that after they had piled on, it was excessively easy to just yank the initiative away before they could do anything about those markers, so it's probably fair. It does slightly weaken that discipline that removes Pin markers (Cool Under Fire?) but ehh it still does a lot.

>>51454437
Like the other guy said, I think the game is supposed to be a lot more luck-pushing than not, which is why you have to make rolls to act /and/ react - especially because even reacting gives you Stress.

I don't think making it guaranteed will quite break anything, though. Just changes the tone of the game slightly. I suppose it also makes more guaranteed action happening - I've had rolls where I miss all 3 activations, then they miss all 3 reactions. Good rolls. Something to think about, I suppose.

>>51456384
Well on one hand it should make more actions happening but on the other it will also make initiative faster to change hands. Especially if active player tries to push his luck with multiple activations.

The big plus that I see is that civilians and non-reactive characters get to make some actions even if at a penalty - civilian may be hard to activate but a lot of time reacts to things happening around and sprays everything with fire (at -4).

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>>51345152
has anyobdy here tried the one page games? i am specially interested in war stuff reviews

>>51454766
Did you read the rules yet?
Kind of curious how the game plays.

>>51456468
Ok, I haven't played it so feel free to toss this out.

But from my examination of them before, they didn't appear hard to learn/play at all and looked simple enough - true to their line.

WarStuff, looking at it now, is even simpler than the rest because it doesn't attempt to make army lists (because it's "whatever you got, yo") and weapons aren't things, so it puts it into the realm of stuff like Song of Blades and Heroes - but far simpler. Hell, "Quality" being the only stat strengthens the comparison even more (although Song also has Combat, so...). Also melee pushing and knocking over.

Alt Activation is solid - if it was full IGOUGO I would've tossed it out flat, to be honest. Having to move then shoot (as in, you can't shoot then move) seems meh, but whatever. Combat is very quick with just 2 rolls - Quality on the Attacker, Quality on the Defender. Some Special Rules might influence this, but there are not many of those. Melee always results in something happen, even if it's just shoves.

I don't really see anything that should prove to be too bad (except maybe the flat ramping cost for Quality. Why.) It appears to be a far less complex (less Special Rules, simpler activation, not even a Combat stat) Song of Blades and Heroes. SoBaH was popular for a fair while until people got tired of having JUST 2 stats with a ton of special rules everywhere. I imagine this will hit that wall even quicker due to less stats and less special rules, but it can still be fun.

>>51456468

>>51457018
>SoBaH was popular for a fair while until people got tired of having JUST 2 stats with a ton of special rules everywhere. I imagine this will hit that wall even quicker due to less stats and less special rules, but it can still be fun.

This, IMHO.
I haven't tried WarStuff - but played a lot of 1pFB (and some 1p40k) mixed with Two Hour Wargames' reaction charts instead of morale, which made it much more hilarious.

Still, it gets boring as you realise the only thing that matters is the Quality/Reputation.

People can talk all they want about WHFB, but it's Combat system had a Soul, y'know?
Who tries to hit first (based on Initiative)
Then did he actually hit (based on Skill)
Then how hard did he hit (Strenght/Toughness)
Then did any Armor/Terrain/Ward saved the one hit ...

Here's just
roll to hit based on Quality.
roll to defend based on Quality.
maybe roll to save - and that's it.

At least 1pFB add some more flavour.

>>51457254
IMHO in Mordheim it worked much better. More organically.

WHFB is more like a skirmish system that didn't knew when to stop and tried to become a full blown army level wargame.

>>51456743
I got it only today and I'm in a bit of a zombie state - been tired all day, couldn't sleep very well. But I'll read them, and then try them and report back.

>>51457630

Looking at the Mordheim rules off the 'net - it's just about exactly the same as WHFB - except no bucketfuls of dice ...

>>51457734
>except no bucketfuls of dice

Yep I consider the fact that you don't need a literal bucket to throw your dice a definitive plus in this case.

>>51453891

I would like a game in production right now or coming out within the year. Good sculpts with a western aesthetic with a good amount of detail on the minis. 10-15mm nd maybe larger sounds great.

Rule wise I don't want I go U go turn order wise. Something say rolling for iniative or some akin to bolt action would be ideal.

Skirmish would be great.

What do you people think of the upcomming "The Other Side" from Wyrd?

>>51458108

Looks really interesting. Love all the factions so that's a plus for me.

Gonna wait to see if it takes off in my area before throwing money at it. Like the multibasing as well.

>>51458133
I do also. what I don't like is that for some reason 1 damage is equal to one model out, this is appliable even to giant units and commanders.

>>51458108
Too expensive for me.

>>51458163

Oh one would only models? Do they at least balance it out with say armor or skill saves or some weird thing like that?

Also anon how is the turn order?

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>>51457973
I'll recommend Heavy Gear.

Scale is 10-12 mm. A lot of different mechs with somewhat differing aesthetics including four legged mechs. While mechs are one of the mainstay units they are actually not the be all end all thing. Tanks, artillery and infantry can be used too. Similar to Battletech. But most of Heavy Gear mechs are somewhere around light mech Battletech class.

Basic mechanics Roll xd6 take highest + bonus. Turns are alternative activations by combat groups or sub squads. It works pretty okay with around 12 mechs on each side. There is also Arena variant where gladiators fight in mechs.

Heavy Gear also sports Mission objective rules that I really like. Basically players can have asymmetrical objectives depending on how elite and powerful are their forces. In theory you can even play games where armies are created on different number of points (Though it is not recommended). The normal way to get your objectives is to make a roll before combat for each player. So you not only must to carry out your mission but prevent your enemy from completing his and in fact even your own objectives may sometimes conflict. For example if you must Recon (get a lock on an enemy combat group) and Survive while your group with best sensors is the one that must get out alive.

>>51458108
Not very impressed from the videos. It looks like a dumbed down version of Malifaux, which failed to hold my interest. The point of Malifaux is the many intricacies and the interactivity which this game lacks. It doesn't help that the figures have soft detail and the cheapest entry point is $120. Also the designs just aren't up there with Malifaux's. You don't have anything as crazy as Death Marshalls, and are opting for much more standard cultists and steam punk British dudes instead.

Despite that the local henchman likes the game, so when people inevitably dump their pledges on ebay for cheap I will probably get one of the sets.

While we are with Wyrd what can you tell me about Malifaux? I mean I like the idea of instead of rolling dice you use a deck of cards and also if required you can cheat fate so you can score a bigger hit or deny someone to hit you.
but for how long has the game been running? I guess there's already a very sizeable amount of minis around so I don't know what to pic or where to beggin.

>>51458602
They have a free rulebook on their site, also they have a pretty good starter with plastic minis. The starter boxes are also good.

It plays a bit like a card game IMHO - lots of things can happen at the same time, you need to pay attention to everything, and keep in mind your, and your opponent's skills and triggered effects.

>>51458672
>starter with plastic minis
so the minis often comes in other materials? I like in metal for example?

>It plays a bit like a card game...
you sold it to me already then. I'm a sucker for card games and the interaction this might produce with certain units/effects/spells/etc.

now plead to any dark or insane god for Wyrd try to translate the game even just the rules and the fluff regarding the game in spanish...

>>51458799
Their old minis were metal, not everything is plastic.

Also: https://www.wyrd-games.net/news/2016/2/4/spanish-translation-of-malifaux

>>51458799
The models are 100% hard plastic. Old ones are metal, but they aren't sold anymore.

>>51458827
HOLY MOTHER OF ALL FRUIT BASKETS

>>51458846
Noted.

I can't believe it, something finally is going well in my awful life!

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>>51457973
>I would like a game in production right now or coming out within the year. Good sculpts with a western aesthetic with a good amount of detail on the minis. 10-15mm nd maybe larger sounds great.
>Rule wise I don't want I go U go turn order wise. Something say rolling for iniative or some akin to bolt action would be ideal.
>Skirmish would be great.
You're basically describing Heavy Gear, as >>51458346 notes.
I recommend checking out the CEF, Peace River, and Northern factions if you're into a "western" mecha vibe. CEF has heavy gravtanks that work in tandem with power-armored infantry and a smaller number of mecha (compared to the other factions). Peace River is an arms manufacturer that's got a smattering of several factions' gear. The North is really cheap to start with and has a bunch of options, including a "wild west" subfaction. Rules are up for free on RPGnow.

You could also try out CAV Strike Operations, from Reaper. It's also 10mm. That uses an initiative draw deck, with suits indicating the player who activates next. Uses a d10-vs target number mechanic, and it's pretty fast and flexible. Some of the older models are a little scraggly, but the newer stuff looks great.

>>51459198

Those minis look fucking awesome. CEF and NuCoal look fucking sweet.

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>>51459509
I like their a little more rounded designs. CEF mechs have a little too sharp edges.

>>51456384
Two temporarily Crippled arms, but it happened when it was basically inconsequential. I don't think I ended up crippling anything of his, but I did Stagger his guys three separate times.

And to be fair, some of the Disciplines are already fat garbage compared to others. The game requires a lot of work to get it less retarded, and we've already agreed to a House Rule that the Teleport psychic ability works like the Harness and 1) can blind jump as per usual, 2) is interfered by the Quantum Scrambler thing, 3) without a critical success, your opponent gets to place you within 4'' of your target location. That ability is just merrily fucked as written.

As far as Mosvin, I actually unloaded on the guy that killed him to the point that he was Prone, 1 Wound, 6 Pin, and Staggered. But then his teleporting medic popped up and did a range Heal to get rid of Staggered. And then he Stood Up, Sprinted into B2B, and Attacked with a crit to the head.

>>51459568
So tiny. So cute.

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>>51459568
>>51459509
I personally prefer the South (I'm a Shirowfag), but I gotta admit that the CEF are pretty. Ironically, the only models I actually have are a pair of Wyverns from JC and that big Caprice mount with the twin PPCs. Saving up for a plastic starter box once my wife and I finally finish paying for Christmas.

>>51459745
Well yeah. Mech is around 45 mm. If you want Battletech style robots they do exist in Heavy Gear but play more a role of heavy support or breakthrough machines.

>>51456743
Okay, flipped through the rulebook, and it's pretty nice. Contains a mini-campaign, a painting guide, a how to build your board section, so it looks pretty nice. Lots of pictures from the movie, but little to no pictures of actual miniatures.

There's also a "quick-start" leaflet included, I'll probably try the game with that first.

Folks, anyone have the Skirmish Outbreak rules by any chance?

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>>51457018
>Song
Whats the problem with 2 stats? Im playing ASoBaH for quite a while now and im not getting tired of it. Its a welcome opportunity to play with my fantasy and aos minis. Build a whole table and 5 warbands already.

Also: Is there a compendium for scenarios or something like that?

>>51460851
More stats could have cut the special rules by 75% at least. While retaining all their effects. Saves space in the books, streamlines mechanics and reduces the need to printout character/rule cards or carry books with you and flip through them if you need to check the rules.

>>51460851
Very nice table. What'd you use on the foam to get that texture on the inclines?

>>51461714
A mix of filler, sand and paint.

>>51460851
What did you cut the foam with? That is some good stuff.

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>>51462847
>What did you cut the foam with? That is some good stuff.
You can see it in the fourth pic - some kind of small paring knife. Looks a lot like a woodworker's marking knife.

>>51456384
Also, actually I might get experience? Talked to the creator on Facebook, and he said that since the enemy had no-one on the field to contest, that means that there is no-one to stop me from getting the objective tokens unless there was a prior mention of oncoming reinforcements or the like to make time an issue for my victorious troops. Definitely wouldn't say that I had control of the VIP since she was still up and running, but at least I should get 9 xp from it if my opponent's okay with that.

I mean, that only makes sense because otherwise there's really no incentive for them to do anything but play around baselines, maybe complete a relevant Complication, and book it at the first sign of losing a man.

>>51465987
That's pretty cool and makes sense from an in-universe/non-gamey perspective, but it should definitely be stated more in the rules if that's his intention.
I'll keep such stuff in mind if I play more.

>>51467412
Yeah. Though at the same time, I could see discussing something like that before the game is started. For instance, trying to Steal Valuables from Miners as Pirates seems like you'd have to get them off yourself since even if the Pirate raiders managed to defeat the Miners, it's likely the mining colony's other defenses would be mustered after someone retreated and warned them of the attack. Whereas trying to Steal Valuables as Space Cops against Merchants would be the initial strike-force of an official Space Cop raid to shut down and seize a facility.

>>51465987
I generally assume in most games that both factions are competing to get the objectives, but once the game's over everyone else in the region shows up to the party, drawn by the conflict. Get your objectives during the game or not at all.

>>51469371
Well, in the case of this mission it was Star Cops busting an illegal laboratory and trying to capture a VIP and get the illegal research from the Merchants that ran it. The merchants ended up either taken into custody or escaped into the wind alongside the VIP.

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>>51457630
>WHFB is more like a skirmish system that didn't knew when to stop and tried to become a full blown army level wargame.
That is literally its design arc.

>>51445874
>>51445118
>>51445193
>>51444870
So, I'm interested in trying Frostgrave, but can't find Breeding Pits, Sellsword, Alchemy, Arcane Locations, or Golem Hunt lying about (Trove has Lick King and core, so we're good there). I'm mostly interested in Breeding Pits and Sellsword, to be honest. Anyone have a copy to share, or am I stuck waiting for a couple more paydays? Kinda wanna break out my poor, abused Mordheim models and do terrible, terrible things to some Perry billmen.

>>51470978
>Lick King
Yum

>>51470978
>Sellsword, Alchemy, Arcane Locations, or Golem Hunt
These ones you should be able to find if you check the archive for the old Frostgrave Generals.

>Breeding Pits
The book adds rules for Gnoll encounters and the ability to mutate your wizard into something more feral for the offtrade that hiring human henchmen becomes more expensive, i.e. you'll have to hire Gnolls.
The other big thing it adds is rules for using a dungeon set up.
So if you got some D&D maps Warhammer Quest tiles or something similar you can use those to play as well. The Osprey page has some pdfs with dungeon tiles you can print yourself as well.

Unless you really, really want to turn your Wizard into a Beastmaster or use Gnolls you'll be fine with the other stuff though.
Don't get me wrong Breeding Pits adds some really cool ideas, but Lichlord added more to the setting I think. Maybe because it had more missions, I dunno. Just felt bigger.

Just FYI the new piratey expansion means we'll get another two plastic kits. Crewmen, i.e. probably pirates and Snakemen.

>>51462847
I used a 99cent kitchen knife.

>>51470994
Like everything, chilli or BBQ sauce makes it finger licking good...

>>51471340
>The other big thing it adds is rules for using a dungeon set up.
>So if you got some D&D maps Warhammer Quest tiles or something similar you can use those to play as well. The Osprey page has some pdfs with dungeon tiles you can print yourself as well.
If you like 3D, painted dominos or jenga blocks make excellent cheap, fast dungeons. Just glue a few together. For the bigger blocks, cut out little card oblongs and glue them on to give you a basic stones effect that looks way better than you'd expect given it costs like £5 and an hour to do.

>>51471340
>pirates and snakemen

They just keep throwing out these great plastic kits don't they.

>>51471340
wait is snekgrave confirmed? I'd assumed pirates, but my god, north star, you're mad geniuses.

It's pretty neat actually - Frostgrave went with the underserved Gnoll demographic rather than orcs or some shit like that, and Rumgrave going with Snakes over Lizardmen would be similarly good and cool.

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>>51474995
Gonna get some gnolls 'n barbarians. Possibly their first two kits as well, I only have a single sprue of them.

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>>51474995
The GA cover (filename (sic) from the guy's blog) makes them look snakey as hell, which is good. They have legs, but, well, tails was a long shot.

>>51475042
I hope the models are good. If they can come close to the art they will be amazing. A different approach to the last great snake-men models - Rackhams Ophidians, they were brilliant!

>>51475740
If they they'll be done by the same artist who did previous models they should be at least passable.

And clearly I need to kill several people so that I can get all the boxes. But where to hide the bodies?

Any heavy gear guys awake? Want to get into it and need a couple questions answered.

>Average model count for an army?
>Are the factions distinct game play wise on the tabletop?
>What's the scale of the game?

>>51476357
Oh, I hope someone else will be able to add but I didn't read new rules though the scale stayed the same and they mostly just cleared rules not changed them outright.

In old rules standard was around 1000-1500 points. Which could get you from 8 to maybe 15 mechs depending on how elite you want to go (you can do even 20 probably especially with southerners). Heavy tanks, striders and other costly options of course can change that.

Minimum battle scale that is pleasant to play is two combat groups on each side which is 8-12 mechs for each player and around 500-700 points.

Infantry and light cheap mechs or (for some factions) drones can change that. CEF for example run less mechs and use hovertanks, FLAILs (power armor basically) and gengineered soldiers a lot. So their army size in bodies can fluctuate pretty significantly.

>>51476725

Sounds fucking awesome. Other factions got special for me or are they pretty much the same outside of point cost?

Woh woh woh.... Frost grave is getting a tropical spin off WITH snake men?

Please tell me we get a snake wizard or a voodoo doctor...

>>51476883
The most similar are probably Northerners and Southerners but even they differ in army composition pretty heavily. North relies more on mechs and heavy coordination between units while South is okay with throwing bodies at the breach and has pretty large gaps in status between different parts in their society and army.

CEF are guys from Earth who are trying to get the colony back and roll out with new tech toys and genemodded soldiers.

Utopians use drones. So one mech can have a couple of drone followers. Somewhere around 1 to 5 ratio on average.

You can download rulebook from the drivethroughrpg - it is free. Also has the army lists and some fluff for each faction. If you want more fluff get their old RPG book for Heavy Gear - there is at least 200 pages of fluff for the world, nations, military and so on.

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>>51471340
Thanks for the info.

>Dungeon setup
Got one of those.

>Snakemen
Fucking sweet. I've got some Forge of Ice Histath, serpent priestessess, and Sleestacks already. Love me some snakemen.

>Pirates
Well how 'bout that? Guess my 17th-century stuff is ALSO gonna be useful. Between that order from Firelock last year and my current pirate ships this oughta be fun.

https://www.mediafire.com/folder/1e68645496dga//Frostgrave
Found on foolz. Missing Arcane locations and Breedign pits.