Warhammer fantasy general: Empire robot monsters edition

Has Total War Warhammer overtaken Age of Sigmar as fantasy's true successor?

>>50574504
Yes and no, simply because AoS was never a sucessor. It's more like what happens after you eat and digest a meal.

>>50574593
AoS was a mistake

So any advise on running a warhammer fantasy role play campaign for a GM bringing his players in from D&D, only one of the has much knowledge of the setting, he plays an empire army but the others have no experience with warhammer. I was planning on either running an urban based campaign on the streets of Marienburg, with the players uncovering various cults and various hidden factions running the city behind the scenes similar to a world of darkness game or a campaign set in the border princes with the players adventuring and having to take part in the intrigues of various princes while going adventuring and perhaps eventually ruling their own principality. I was wondering what advice you might have as well as general tips for a GM starting a wfrp campaign.

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>>50574593
I honestly think AoS would've been much better if it hadn't tried so hard to connect itself to WFB. The trailing threads of the setting they ditched kinda make it feel worse than it is, even if it's not for me already.

>>50574593
AoS is the lore continuation, but TW:WH is the true spiritual successor. The setting will live on because of t

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Has anyone played Skavens in WFRP 2E? Are they fun? I'm thinking about doing quick campaign using Children of the Horned Rat but I don't know if it's worth it.

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>>50574504
As much as I think Total War Warhammer does a good job at what it tries to do, it's ultimately a computer strategy game, and it doesn't come with the depth and semi-consistent fluff that a good successor would need. It's engineered a balanced scenario based on the overall world and themes, but it makes small sense beyond that.

That being said, I'd be more inclined to accept a blank sheet of paper as a "successor" to Warhammer Fantasy than I'd be to accept End Times/Age of Shatmar.

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>>50573752
>So any advise on running a warhammer fantasy role play campaign for a GM bringing his players in from D&D, only one of the has much knowledge of the setting, he plays an empire army but the others haven't encountered warhammer. I was planning on either running an urban based campaign on the streets of Marienburg, with the players uncovering various cults and various hidden factions running the city behind the scenes similar to a world of darkness game or a campaign set in the border princes with the players adventuring and having to take part in the intrigues of various princes while going adventuring and perhaps eventually ruling their own principality. I was wondering what advice you might have as well as general tips for a GM starting a wfrp campaign.

I'd advise sticking as close to the core rulebook(s) and it's assumptions if your group is more or less completely fresh. This means running it in the Empire and all that entails. Your ideas may be cool, and I'd love to play any scenario like that, but it also presents the unique challenge of both introducing the players to the universe and the main setting (the Empire) as well as all the ways this does not correlate or conform to the specific setting of Marienburg or The Border Princes.

My more general advice would be to impart upon the players that this isn't D&D; the system is built heavily around GM arbitration and many rules should not be taken at face value (no, you cannot carry 800 healing poultices just because they have no encumbrace, and yes, fire spells actually set things on fire when it makes sense). Furthermore, the system is potentially extremely deadly, and it's entirely possible to die in the first session with your first character - have backup characters ready just in case, although you should not forget that you have Fate Points, either.

>>50575967
They're cool. An ideal skaven campaign is at least one part Paranoia. Remember to download the eratta, the sourcebooks has a few unfortunate misprints.

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>>50573752
>>50576001

Warhammer FRP isn't like D&D, and the monsters don't automatically carry gold and magic items. D&D is about quests for glory and riches; WFRP pretends to be the same, but in fact is about the PCs' day-to-day fight for survival in a universe that hates them.

Also, new player's that are used to other systems will often have an instinct to start planning out their characters long-term. Curb that shit right away, either by sticking to the RAW of making them roll their characters from top to bottom and then make up their backgrounds and stuff based on that, or by making it clear that you will be strictly enforcing the rule of GM permission for Career advancement; they cannot count on being able to take a subsequent career just because it's an exit, they actually have to earn it or otherwise become said career.

Arguing that you're a Mercenary now or that you're a Sergeant as a natural progression after acting like a leadership-type Soldier may be easy, but becoming an ordained Priest, receiving the blessing of your god, or moving from a Journeyman Wizard to become a magister (Master Wizard), might take quite some effort, or you may simply fail, "forcing" you to take another career, branch out, and maybe try again later (if applicable).

Never, ever engineer excuses for your players to allow them to progress as they want. Master Wizards need two magic items for a reason, and it's natural for a Senior Apprentice/Journeyman of the Gold College to become a Merchant or Artisan, a Celestial Wizard to also be an Astrologer, or an Initiate to act as a friar before becoming a full Priest, or for almost anyone to become a Hunter to support themselves.

Many systems have purely vertical progression - Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay is not such a system or such a setting. Try to emphasize the lateral nature of progression, and the ephemeral and permutational nature of the characters and their lives.

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>>50576077
>Remember to download the eratta, the sourcebooks has a few unfortunate misprints.

Let's also not forget that the .pdf OEF:s re-published by Fantasy Flight Games once they took over the licenses from Black Industries are reprints of the original 1st prints, and thus contain no Errata, resulting in considerable confusion. One of the most egregious mistakes is pic related.

In the FFG-published .pdf:s, this section is all kinds of fucked up, suggesting that you can change career at any point with GM permission and your gear, and conflicting with another section that (correctly) suggests otherwise, but in the last actual prints, the section is fixed. This is a pretty major oversight, and a lot of people just assumed that the FFG .pdf:s would be digital versions of the last prints, but apparently, FFG couldn't even get that right.

Also, this tinyurl is super-helpful: jx448zz

I'd link it properly, but no matter what I do, 4chan is being shit and thinks it's spam, and the image is too big to upload on 4chan. It's uploaded to imgur, but I made it into a tinyurl for ease of use.

>>50576001
Hmmmmm, would it perhaps be better if I were to run a urban investigation based campaign set in Nuln rather than in Marienburg, to make it easier for the players to familiarise themselves with the setting? Perhaps I could use skaven and vampire backed cults and secret societies rather than just focus img on chaos as well. What would you recommend?

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>>50576077
>An ideal skaven campaign is at least one part Paranoia.

A good Skaven campaign practically requires good players, though, that are well familiar with the system and are very much aware that they're all going to be playing chaotic evil backstabbers that survive on instinct and barbarianism.

Some people get really personally invested in their characters unless they've had that beaten out of them already. The Skaven do have pack loyalty, but they are also a society that are practically 50% jewish caricature, 50% gypsy morals, and 50% nigger behaviour.

Show weakness, be usurped, if you can't hold onto what's yours, it's not yours anymore. It's completely legit for Skaven players to "borrow" from each other and, if push comes to shove, shiv eachother with a rusty knife, if they think they can get away with it. And that's before we even start with the politics, the hierarchies and the skaven tribes, major or otherwise. And they're both envious and scornful of other races.

Being herp-derp evil on principle should be discouraged, but getting into the skaven mindset could mean that it'll be very hard to tell the difference between a "legitimate" grievance or appropriate opportunism and the mentioned herp-a-derp chaotic stupid. To players familiar with alignment, it could help to emphasize "neutral evil" over "chaotic", maybe, but ultimately it comes down to having players that understand what's going on, what can be expected, what is appropriate, and won't throw a bitchfit when one of the other players goes must have-have give-take to mes nows and pushes you off the edge of a tower after stab-stab.

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>>50576298
Depends on how new you are yourself, really. If you're very new, my recommendation would be to set off with the starting adventures, but that takes you to the war-torn city of Middenheim, smack dab in the aftermath of the Storm of Chaos.

If you want to go for a major city with lots of intrigue, Nuln is probably a good choice, though, and it's (relative) proximity to Bretonnia, Athel Loren, at least 2-3 dwarven holds (Karak Azgaraz, Khazid Grimaz, Karak Norn) makes for a good cultural, political and mercantile melting pot, and it's also got solid access/proximity to Altdorf.

Warhammer Roleplay 2nd Edition has a "main" questline, with the starting adventure (Through the Drakwald) in the Core Rulebook tentatively tying into the first part of Paths of the Damned (Ashes of Middenheim). The third part of the Paths of the Damned (Forges of Nuln) has a solid guide to Nuln that you could probably use, too, that you could practically hand to the players as a foundation (ignoring the "Chapters" that relate to the actual quests).

The proximity to Altdorf would also make it easy for characters to say that they're from there, or anywhere in that area. The more I think of it, Nuln is a pretty good starting spot, really, since there's little need to come up with excuses in most cases (as opposed to, say, what the fuck is an Apprentice Wizard doing in Kislev?)

It might sound like a technicality, but simply moving from Marienburg to Nuln saves you the issues of having to explain questions like "So, is this the Empire.. but not? So, can I use spells openly.. yes? But the College.. oh, so no college, just a guild that is sorta-associated with the Colleges but not officially?".

>>50576678
Thanks. In that case I will move the adventure to nuln, there does seem to be a lot more resources available to draw from then for Marienburg as well. Do you happen to have any other general tips, I understand that downtime is allot more important in wfrp than in other RPGs.

>>50576077
>>50576276
Thanks for the info, I'll check those.

>>50576486
>A good Skaven campaign practically requires good players, though, that are well familiar with the system and are very much aware that they're all going to be playing chaotic evil backstabbers that survive on instinct and barbarianism
Well that'd be the issue. I'm doing the GM for my mates but they aren't familiar with WH's universe and I doubt they'd be able to roleplay Skavens properly.
Sucks because I know we'd have quite some fun.

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>>50576855
>I understand that downtime is allot more important in wfrp than in other RPGs.

Somewhat. It's easy to gloss over, but if you plan for them and time them, downtime are good opportunities to explain why characters have progressed and what they've been doing. It can be very hard sometimes to establish characters as integrated into the world and performing their duties or moving on career-wise without some amount of downtime here and there.

So I absolutely advise planning for it. It doesn't have to be major. Just a week or two there, where Ginny got herself a tavern and I hear she's a tavernkeep now, or a month there where it turns out that the harvest have gone bad and the city is now full of beggers, and the group's apprentice went to Altdorf to report his success in the mission his master gave him, and he became a Journeyman before returning to Nuln to ply his wizardly trade, and so on and so forth.

Try to make "breaks" in the narrative where stuff like this fits in.

This could mean that they have to research something before they can continue, or have to ask around the markets (a process that could very well take a week or two, regular life permitting), or that they're stuck in their investigation, or maybe they were simply successful in the last adventure and dot all the I:s and cross all the T:s and then time passes before something draws their attention again.

It's honestly a bit frustrating that some games (I'm thinking of Warhammer Roleplay 2nd Ed. here, but it also applies to the entire range of WH40kRP books) do well with downtime, and can even be hard to play without having "proper" downtime to help "make sense" of the progression(s), but the Core Rulebooks give zero help on the matter.

I think that the issue is that when they're written, it's with the expectation that it'll be used by experienced GM:s that "of course there's downtime at opportune moments" or something, but this is often very far from the truth.

>>50576908
The skaven book extensively talks about how to play skaven, if you want to give them a chance.

It can easily be summed up by saying that the Skaven are ratty Cobra if Cobra consisted of nothing but Coba Commander and billions of Starscreams.

>>50575259
Use a campaign module and model your attitude/descriptions/atmosphere after a CoC Keeper.

I recommend starting with Enemy Within and using the Winds of Chaos adaptations for 2nd edition.

>>50575967
I played in one.
It was fun. I survived.

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>>50577305
>the Winds of Chaos adaptations for 2nd edition.

What is that and why should you use it? I've been playing quite a bit of 2nd Edition, but this one must've passed me by (or I simply passed it by myself and dismissed it, and simply forgot about it).

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>>50577321
>I survived.

If the GM runs a WHFRP2 game *and* it's a Skaven game, if you survived, he's clearly playing it wrong. Should've killed you all at it's conclusion, on principle, if only because you knew about someone's plans or something.

Either that, or rewarded you with the right of siring offspring. Enjoy your Skaven-mother.

Noob WFRP-related question inc.

I know that when I change my career, I replace the stats of my primary profile by the values written on my new advance scheme unless the former are already equal or higher.

My question is, does it work the same way for the secondary profile?

E.g. if I start with 10 WP, roll Noble as my starting career which gives +2 WP, and then decide to become a Student which also gives +2 WP, how many WP will I have once I've completed my second advance scheme? 12 or 14?

>>50578766
Is this third edition? In second you replace all your advance scheme numbers with values that are higher, both primary and secondary.

>>50578766
The bonus isn't cumulative, in your exxample you'd still only have 12 WP. This is useful in some cases as characters with experience find they readily adapt to other careers. I.E a veteran will more quickly fill out bounty hunter than a student, he's used to fighting.

Also just to make sure, you fill the values into your advance scheme of your primary profile, not your primary profile stats itself.

Also your secondary profile refers to your stats such as attacks wounds, movement etc.

>>50578524
>if only because you knew about someone's plans or something.
That's a shitty generalisation of Skaven society.
I survived because I was playing clever and cowardly.

>>50578844
>>50578845
It's second edition. Thanks anons.

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>>50578766
>My question is, does it work the same way for the secondary profile?

Yes. Think of it like the entire profile. You replace all the advances of your old career with the advances of your new career. The only reason you really "keep" the ones that are higher is because it makes for easier bookkeeping, since that's how many characteristics advances you've already taken.

>E.g. if I start with 10 WP, roll Noble as my starting career which gives +2 WP, and then decide to become a Student which also gives +2 WP, how many WP will I have once I've completed my second advance scheme? 12 or 14?

You start with 10 Wounds (I assume you mean W, Wounds, not WP, which is Willpower), you start as a Noble, and you then *take* +2 W during the course of your career, and then later become a Student, after finishing Noble. Upon becoming a Student, the old profile is replaced by the new profile, except for the characteristics for which you've already taken more/higher advances.

This includes Wounds, so as a Nobleman, you *must* take +2 Wounds before you can move onto a new career, and as a Student, you *cannot* take +2 Wounds.

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>>50578959
>That's a shitty generalisation of Skaven society.
Yes, but it's also a good excuse for having you killed in lieu of other reasons.

>I survived because I was playing clever and cowardly.

Good, good. Cowardice is a social virtue in skaven society and being brave is probably considered a mental illness.

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Is there any reason why it's referred to as Primary and Secondary profile? As I was writing a response earlier I started thinking that I have no idea why the distinction is relevant at all, since it never really matters.

Unnecessary things lead to misunderstandings like these. Having not played WHFRP1, is it some kind of vestigial thing? Was it more relevant in 1st Edition, maybe?

>>50578478
The Enemy Within was written for 1st Edition. All of the stats for NPCs and items are meant for 1st edition.

Winds of Chaos adapts those stats to 2nd edition.

Bottom of this page: http://www.windsofchaos.com/?page_id=19

>>50578524
Skaven females aren't naturally like that, the skaven drug them up and fatten them using magic and Moulder science. At least once, in WFRP 1e material, a female skaven with white fur and sorcerous powers is mentioned.

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TIL that Grey Wizards, Shadowmancers, take a vow of poverty. Sounds like I've got a new character if I never get to play my Priest of Shallya again. Poverty 5 lyfe.

>>50579988
Ah, fair enough. I knew that The Enemy Within was for 1st Ed., I just thought you were referring to something separate with the Winds of Chaos, like some spell adaptation or homebrew or something.

>>50581136
>Skaven females aren't naturally like that
>in WFRP 1e material

The whole "no skaven females" thing wasn't there from the beginning, which is why it's a bit inconsistent. It's fairly well-established that females are breeders in Skaven society, and a white-furred female in a leadership position would probably be considered a major oddity.

That being said, this can possibly be handwaved/rationalized as white-furs being considered holy/leadership caste skaven, and thus maybe even white-furred females are considered "above" mere breeding.

On the other hand, a white-furred female just might be perfect breeding material, too, so I dunno.

Some anon once presented a theory that the Skaven females aren't actually retarded, and that they're just ruling from behind the scenes, a clandestine counterpoint to the council of seers.

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What is the "Night of a Thousand Arcane Duels"? I've found some references to it, but nothing on the event itself, only that Grand Theogonist Viktor Helmgart put a stop to it and that Alric (..no surname?) was Supreme Patriarch during it. It was supposed to have taken place in or around 2415.

It sounds interesting and it's taken place just about 100 years before Storm of Chaos and the start of Warhammer Roleplay 2nd Edition, but I can find fuckall about the actual event.

>>50579098
You need to take all the advancements for your Primary profile, not so with Secondary. If you don't want that extra wound before you change careers you don't have to.

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>>50582369

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>>50583021
Basically a storm of magic broke out over Altdorf and the colleges, whose relations were terrible thanks to the emperor putting them against each other, thought they were being attacked so started an all out war. Hundreds of wizards fought through the streets of altdorf until the grand Theoginist was able to put a stop to it.

>>50583066
>The way the golden order fought

Kek. Fucking gold wizards

>>50574042
Oh god, imagine looking out of the window one morning and seeing a parade of mechanical horrors marching by. That bear looks like Freddy Fazbear's fabolous but even more terrifying brother.

Also, gigantic dogryffon mounts for engineers when?

>>50582161
>Some anon once presented a theory that the Skaven females aren't actually retarded, and that they're just ruling from behind the scenes, a clandestine counterpoint to the council of seers.

This is vaguely hinted at as being a possibility in WFRP 2e, but we know that even in modern lore, 'fat immobile uterus' is not the natural state of females, but one they're put into.

I agree that if ANY female skaven escape being breeders, it's rare, and probably only found among white furs.

>>50583066
>beast wizards summoning monsters and riding griffons to fight wizards throwing lightning and summoning meteors
I need more of this

>>50582918
This is simply not true and I have no idea why you'd think otherwise.

So we're only a WHFRPG thread now, are we? I'm sad that this is what WHFB has come to, but as long as the setting stays alive I can be somewhat happy.

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>>50586418
I was thinking of the wrong thing. You have to complete your advance scheme but you don't have to buy the skills and talents.

>>50588355
Nothing wrong with that, plus WFRP offers a better look at the Warhammer world.

>>50588355
Not "only," but it's the only thing that continuously creates its own content, and RPG players mesh better with settingfags.

>>50588373
No, dude. To finish a career, you need to buy all advances (primary and secondary), all trappings (unless your DM houserules it), and all skills/talents (save ones marked off by 'or'). I think the devs themselves answered this recurring question on twitter.

The only exception is changing to a basic career. RAW, you can exit from one career into any basic at any time for 200 XP IIRC, though that comes with the caveat of DM approval.

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>>50588666
My book says otherwise. I can't find any of the devs tweets on this matter, but I have seen a few in these threads before.

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>>50583066
>gold wizards
Howdy imperial servants, check it out, I am made of gold
-t. gelt

>>50589906
How can fire wizards compete?

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>>50589906
Lore of Bling is best lore

>Your general, wizard AND BSB are in the unit? Ok, let's see what happens...

>>50588790
Your book is specifically only referring to the skills and talents with "or" of these you only need to buy 1. All other skills and talents are mandatory to class up.

Warhammer Fantasy RPG 2nd Edition:

What is the process for breaking down doors? I have not seen it explained in the rule book, but maybe I missed it. Say a Door has T5 and D15, I assume this means it has toughness five, which means it takes six damage to do one point of damage. Is D15 its Wounds? Does that mean fifteen total points of damage are required to break it down?

>>50590343
When you say D15, where are you getting that from? In any case, I'd rule one or more Strength tests, with various modifiers, for breaking it down. Either by throwing your weight into it or using an impromptu battering ram. Attacking it would be like damaging anything else, though I'd add increased damage over time as the door starts to splinter, or if you use the right tools like a wood chopping axe.

My players have a habit of using gunpowder to blow open doors, so other modifiers don't come up all that often.

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>>50583021
>>50583066
Thanks a lot, man, that's awesome.

>>50588373
>You have to complete your advance scheme but you don't have to buy the skills and talents.

Skills & Talents are part of your advancement scheme, dingus. The section you screencapped even outright states it, so you can't argue that you have one of the fucked-up pre-errata prints.
>Before you can enter the new career you've chosen, you must finish your old career by buying all available advances.

>>50588790
>My book says otherwise.

No it doesn't.
>To start with you *must* take one of the two, otherwise you cannot complete the career.

When there are options (such as the given example of Coolheaded *or* Street Fighting for the Agitator) for Skills or Talents, you *must* take (or already have) at least one to finish the career, but you *can* take all.

>>50590052
They don't, hence Thyrus Gormann getting BTFO by gelt in the fight for the supreme patriarch title. Bright college eternally Cucked

>>50590343
>What is the process for breaking down doors?

I'm not sure where you are getting the T:s and D:s here, because I can't find anything in the Core Rulebook or in the Armory at a glance.

But breaking down doors is usually handled by Strength Tests or some other narrative aspect, with a difficulty as determined by the GM.

I'm not sure if this is ever explicitly covered in the rules, but Crowbars explicitly gives a bonus to Strength Tests to open doors, and a simple Wooden Wedge increases the Strength Test to open a door by a full step.
(personally, I would start at Hard, -20, for what we would generally consider "full" doors, with a good lock, etc., keeping in mind that most doors in Warhammer Fantasy are probably flimsier than that).

Obviously, there are doors that simply will not be able to open that way, in which case you'll either have to tell the players no, have them find another way, or assign it an Armor, Toughness Bonus and/or Wounds you find appropriate.

>>50592216
To be fair, though, Balthazar cheated by being fucking metal.

>>50592360
>cheated by having a better understanding of magic than the current patriarch
>cheated by being better than his opponent

t. Buttmad Pyromancer

How does a metal wizard win a duel against another wizard?
Wizards don't wear armour, so Searing Doom and Gold Hounds wouldn't be able to hurt one. Did he cast Final Transmute until he got a 6?

>>50592216
7 foot tall hulking chad Wizard who was patriarch for 3 terms straight lost to a scrawny manlet who hadn't even become master of his own order yet. He literally never recovered because he's a fat fuck in the end times book he appears in, and doesn't do anything noteworthy. couldn't even become the incarnate of fire over a fucking dwarf. a dwarf! that can't even use magic! Can't make this shit up.

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>>50592602
For starters, the spells and the way they work in the rulebooks are just for game mechanics purposes, they can do way more than that in the lore. among the things mentioned in this passage alone are angelic wings of fire, summoning magical construct weapons, turning into a puddle of molten gold and heat rays.

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>>50592602
RAW (whether we're talking WFB or WHFRP) are always an abstraction of the fluff on some level or another. For example, in WHFRP2, it's outright stated that the strongest of wizards are not represented, and that Battle Wizards are straight-up beyond what players can become before it's time to retire the characters or start homebrewing.

So to assume that they'd be using spells from any game book is silly.

The best way for a Metal Wizard to beat another wizard is probably to turn his fists to a steel-gold alloy and pimpslap the shit out of the other wizard.

If we're talking Warhammer Roleplay in particular, though, I think a sorely under-used rule is the one suggesting that you make your own spells as appropriate. Personally, I'm fond of making College-specific magic missiles, at least partially matching the Bright Wizard's line of straight attack spells. There's no reason why a Gold Wizard wouldn't be able to pull ball bearings out of their pockets and magicnetically hurl them at supersonic speed at someone.

>>50592625
This is why we disregard End Times.

>>50575070
>>50574593
>>50575318

>TFW my game was so fucking terrible that after almost 30 years it was shit canned just so GW could viking funeral it on a garbage barge
>TFW GW is making money hand over fist again
>TFW they don't want me anymore.

I fucking love Fantasy players.

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>>50593004
>TFW warhammer is so good it took almost 10 years of abuses before dieing
>TFW GW reports aren't a disaster thanks to the game based on the old world and "new stuff" recycling concepts from the old world
>TFW AoSfags say they don't want warhammer anymore

I fucking love hypocrites
and putting the face when >TFW

>>50593151
Fantasy fags ironically memed AoS out of the grave with heir constant shitposting. its one of the most active generals on this board, even though here hasn't been a release in months. If people just kept shit to themselves, AoS would have quietly faded away into obscurity

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>>50592674
Considering that Balthasar Gelt reached through flames that "No living creature could go through without being destroyed", with his arm (or all of himself) turned into gold, it's just a little bit silly, because gold has a melting point at just north of 1000°C.

Meanwhile, a regular bunsen burner with a yellow flame burns at about 900°C to1600°C, and Magnesium burns at 1900°C to 2300°C.

Anything burning with a "white hot flame" or literally destroy living things would be capable of melting gold. If we're turning ourselves into precious metals to deal with fire, why not Tungsten (~3400°C), Platinum (~1760°C), Titanium (~1660°C) or even Iron (~1500°C)?

Not being fun at parties aside, however, a Wizard did it, so who gives a fuck? Gold is said to bind magic, while lead is said to repel it, so I guess he could've used the Gold to bind the magic fire and divert it. After all, he did fuck over a Patriarch by using his own flame to channel a spell.

>>50593325
>while lead is said to repel it
I thought obsidian repelled magic

but I guess a bullet to the face works too

>>50593225
>this board
yes. because warhammer's success is determined by /tg/ generals.

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>>50575318
>I honestly think AoS would've been much better if it hadn't tried so hard to connect itself to WFB.

I've said it countless times: If they hadn't done the whole End Times as a send-off to fuck over their own setting on some kind of principle, and simply made it an alternate universe in which Age of Sigmar was created, saying "this, this here is the point of Divergence; in Fantasy, this didn't happen, but in Age of Sigmar, it lead to the End Times", nobody would've minded in the least.

Age of Sigmar and End Times would've just been another loosely connected setting that could be freely ignored, and that wouldn't have interfered with any further development of the Fantasy setting, nor fucked with the established setting as countless fans already perceived it. Age of Sigmar, Warhammer Fantasy and Warhammer 40k would've all related to eachother in roughly the same way.

But no, they had to deliberately shit all over it in order to render the Fantasy setting a narrative wasteland, largely unsalvegable, alienating old fans and confusing the ever-living shit out of new fans.

I cannot help but to believe that the End Times was the result of some massive bitterness or resentful feelings within GW, and a very deliberate "fuck you" to people that actually liked Fantasy and disliked the newer fluff and the changes to key concepts (such as flanderization of Chaos, most noticeable in 40k, ever-increasing amounts of fantastical epicness, the loss of the stitched-together and thus un-copyright-able ideas and aspects pulled from a very wide network of fantasy sources and traditions with a veneer of awfulness, etc).

>>50593004
>>50593225
>pic related

>>50593435
>I thought obsidian repelled magic

Apparently both are used according to Realms of Sorcery pg. 39. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

>>50592625
Can't remember a source for this, but I remember it being hinted that Gelt and Thyrus cut a deal and the fight was just for appearances.

>>50593673
>I cannot help but to believe that the End Times was the result of some massive bitterness or resentful feelings within GW, and a very deliberate "fuck you" to people that actually liked Fantasy
You're right. They hated you. You never bought any models. If you had bought models they wouldn't have killed it.

Fantasy was dead by the time they rolled out the end times.

It was more than such a tiered, broken, bland setting still clung too by autists and shitlords deserved.

>>50593765
>You never bought any models.

Of course I didn't. I never had any interest in the wargame. As has been demonstrated, however, the setting itself is quite popular outside the wargame.

As opposed to Age of Shitmar, which lingers in obscurity, clung to only by a small sect of dedicated autists and beaten housewives.

To the average person in the overall target demographic - gamers, predominantly males in the upper teens or early middle-age (these days) - "Age of Sigmar" may, at best, prompt them to ask "Oh, Warhammer Fantasy, right?". And that's still a pretty big stretch. More than likely, they'll simply ask "What?".

>>50593750
Gelt gave him a big sack of gold. :^)

>>50593750
Any chance you could see if you can think of that source? I'd love to see it, even if it's just an in-universe theory posited by a grumpy bright mage.

>>50594166
>Gelt gave him a big sack of gold. :^)

Classic Gold Wizard. There's a reason they're called Gold Wizards and the Golden Order, even though they practice the Lore of Metal.

It's funny that Balthasar Gelt is considered one of the greatest Supreme Patriarchs in history, yet his ascendancy and the prominence of The Golden Order is threatening to topple long-standing principles of collegiate neutrality, potentially sparking strong and enduring anti-wizard sentiments, especially from a growing burgher class of merchants and would-be industrialists.

Gelt bringen uns den kollegiumtod!

>>50593819
Age of Shitmar has utterly stomped on the sales fantasy made.

You're delusional.

>>50594773
and the setting remains gigagarbage as fuck.
Total warhammer has stomped on the sales AoS made.

>>50594910
Especially if you factor in Vermintide, Mordheim, and that ship game.

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>>50594773
>Age of Shitmar has utterly stomped on the sales fantasy made. [citation needed]

Also
>As has been demonstrated, however, the setting itself is quite popular outside the wargame.

But sure, keep sucking GW:s cock as they piss down your throat.

>>50594773
the fact GW is only holding afloat thanks to jewing videogame developers proves you are wrong

and btw, the End Times, as badly accepted as they were, outsold any AoS release, guess the only thing WHFB needed was a bone thrown every once in a while instead of "here's another 40k kit"

delusion is holding on AoS as the lord and savior that WHFB needed

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>>50594910
>>50594926

Nevermind that sales has nothing to do with quality or interest, either way. It doesn't matter to any fan of Warhammer Fantasy whether Age of Sigmar is doing well or not (although it's not), because ultimately, GW shat all over the fans and End Times not only attempted to ruin the setting on some kind of principle, for no sensible reason, but Age of Sigmar holds no interest to fans of Warhammer Fantasy.

End Times/Age of Sigmar share some common themes, but in terms of fluff it's completely divergent, and in terms of concept it's completely different.

Age of Sigmar appeals to the lowest common denominators of flashy "epicness", gimmicks and low attention span, with no serious depth or ambiguity to it, whereas Warhammer Fantasy generally appeals to people that would be considered more "hardcore" or "purist", and actually enjoy the idea of a universe of ambiguous power structures, unclear motivations and metaphysical aspects, and mud-covered peasantry slogging it through fields that they will promptly die horrifically in.

These two things are completely incompatible, no matter what sales figures say. Some people enjoy lobster, while others are happy with eating Big Macs for breakfast, lunch and dinner, and can't comprehend what the fuss is about; it's just some kind of crayfish anyway, right?

My gripe is ultimately that there was no financial or sensible reason to shit all over the old fans just because you decided to stop catering to them. They deliberately and knowingly went in and gutted the entirety of the old universe, with wide-scale retcons and utterly nonsensical scenarios, and completely disregarded established tropes, concepts and aspects of the setting and it's fluff.

They could've established their new universe without doing that, but for some spiteful, scornful, bitter reason, they did.

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Woodelves soon

>be me
>be introduced to WHFB by my uncle
>watched him play a game in his friends basement and absolutely fell in love with the game
>start building my ogre kingdoms army somewhere near the midpoint of 7th edition
>play weekly
>read battle reports constantly
>love the lore
>love the setting
>move away from the area
>new area has zero WHFB players
>eventually move back
>ogres have a new codex
>"anon don't bother getting the new codex, as a new edition will be out soon"
>fall off the game for a while
>return to the game
>now there's this new thing called age of sigmar
Mfw I completely missed my chance to explore the lore and world that I loved more than any IP ever

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>>50594773
>Age of Shitmar has utterly stomped on the sales fantasy made.

Hahahaha, oh wow.

http://www.iii.co.uk/news-opinion/richard-beddard/games-workshop%3A-denial

>Games Workshop failed to report the one thing I was looking out for in the half-year to November 2015, an increase in revenue, although on a constant currency basis it did rise (by less than 1%). Operating profit was flat too, although it was rescued by royalty income from other firms, for example app and computer game producers who use Games Workshop’s fantasy worlds. Profit from the sale of miniatures and games, the company’s core business, fell 15%.

http://www.iii.co.uk/news-opinion/richard-beddard/games-workshop:-testing-goose-killing-theory

>I would have thought the company would be alive to the risk of killing the goose that lays the golden egg, but Games Workshop has an unusually strong internal culture. That’s usually a good thing, if the culture is open to criticism and capable of adapting. Reading Games Workshops annual reports over the years has left me with me a different impression though. In 2014 Tom Kirby, longstanding chairman, the former chief executive who ran the company during its rapid growth in the 1990’s, said it doesn’t do market research:
>"Our market is a niche market made up of people who want to collect our miniatures. They tend to be male, middle-class, discerning teenagers and adults. We do no demographic research, we have no focus groups, we do not ask the market what it wants. These things are otiose in a niche."

>You're delusional.
Yeah. We're the delusional ones. Pic related.

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>create Warhammer fantasy thread to discuss Warhammer fantasy
>faggots ruin thread by still sperging abkut AoS this late in 2016

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>>50595286
While it sucks that the wargame is practically dead, most of the old fluff is still there, and there's still lots of shit going on.

If it's your cup of tea, I can really, really recommend Warhammer Roleplay 2nd Edition. At first glance, it looks dated, but it's actually really fucking solid. Far moreso than the later 40k games, even (even if those did come with small improvements).

But if you're not into roleplaying, and really wanted to just have the lore as a backdrop for your wargaming hobby, I feel your fucking pain.

>>50595592
I'll bite. I hear about balance issues in WHFB. I didn't get to play very much but I liked it when I did and it seemed pretty good. What were some of these problems that 7th and 8th had? I only ever got to play 7th

>>50595611
I was a long time D&D player, that promoted my foray into Wargames. Got more into WH when D&D 4th edition came out. I like Rp but getting enough people together for a good game and having them committed to a continued game seems to be a lost cause

>>50595611
I'm currently finishing my search and acquisition of all WHFB books of 6th, 7th and 8th ed, I'm strangely happy that there is an "end" to the amount of stuff I want.
As for armies themselves, once my LM are finished, I'm going to build an empire one with historicals and a few GW stuff.
I'm actually OK with how things are.

>>50595663
This is a comforting sentiment, that there is finally an end to the collection. Unfortunately in my rural area having all that stuff and no one else who plays within 500 miles would be depressing as fuck

>>50595711
I haven't played in years but building and painting and having all that lore is something I enjoy in itself.
It really shows how bad the fluff has become since 6th ed, too.

>>50595750
Getting into the lore was something I was quite excited about. I just lost motivation having no one to play against. At this point I'm thinking I'm just going to start collecting lore, and build a second army so I can play the odd game with a friend here and there.

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THEY ARE OUT! RESTARD STEAM!

>>50596083
Please dump them all

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>>50596128

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>>50596148

>>50590440
>>50592336

The Ts and Ds come out of Shadows Over Bogenhafen and Death on the Reik.

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>>50596191

>>50596217
God bless you. Is there an ogre one?

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>>50596247

Not yet, /twg/ only do them for races that are out

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>>50596259

The reddit rats are a special case

>>50596259
Races that are out? Sorry I'm a newfag and not sure what you mean by "out"

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>>50596293

>>>/vg/162142639

>>50596148
>the skulls are spurdos
I'm dying here

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>>50596317

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>>50596334

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>>50596364

>>50596293
>>50596283
Oh for the total war game, gotcha

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>>50596388

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>>50596408

Just a couple more

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>>50596442

nvm that was the last one, have an extra

>>50596475
Glad you included this one. Thanks anon

>>50592734
>There's no reason why a Gold Wizard wouldn't be able to pull ball bearings out of their pockets and magicnetically hurl them at supersonic speed at someone.
Bro do you even Silver Arrows of Arha?
It's MAG number of magic missiles with S 3
Also collage specific magic missile is petty magic dart, it can be small meteor, claw, fireball depending on wizard that casts it.

So duel between fire and gold wizard is answering the question:
Who casts first?
As it is unlikely that a other wizard will survive 5 (4 form archmage + 1 form familiar) magic missiles with S of 7 (3 base * 2 due to familiar + 1 from mighty missile)

>>50596083
Kek

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>>50597106
See, this here was exactly what I'm talking about. I was referring to Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay, while you are referencing the Warhammer Fantasy Battles.

In terms of fluff, both are rather moot, since those are mechanical aspects, and when it comes to the mechanics, well, you are likely thinking of Battle Wizards, which are not covered in Roleplay at all, but Roleplay allows you to make your own spells, so it all still works out, potentially, more or less.

I think we can agree that Gold Wizards should have no big problems standing up to Bright Wizards, especially not on the Patriarch levels we're talking about.

>>50599393
>See, this here was exactly what I'm talking about. I was referring to Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay, while you are referencing the Warhammer Fantasy Battles.
No, they're talking about WFRP. Arrows of Arha is a Gold College spell in the core book.

>>50599393
>>You're up in the Emperor's court when this guy slaps your Shallyan Priestess' ass, what do you do?
>>He's a level 4 wizard and the Supreme Patriarch

>>50599480
Summon Gregor Martak to beat his pansy Marienburger ass.

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Are undead any better with age?

>>50602043
As far as I know, the relative age of the undead doesn't matter, but their live experiences and willpower do. Only especially fearsome and willful dead seem to come back as wights.

>>50599459
Oh, he was on about S-something and familiars (which most WHFRP wizards are unlikely to have for most of their careers) and something about college-specific magic missiles so I just assumed that it was WHFB.

>>50583066
>Horr actually used all 8 lores

Fucking impressive.

>>50595619
>balance issues in WHFB

>Cannons being incredibly OP, in turn, making most big monsters unviable outside friendly matches

>Magic levels being irrelevant, you either bring a level 4 wizard or you lose the game

>Elfwanking, EXTREME elfwanking, putting Chaos to shame (unrestricted access to all lores of magic, army wide ASF, Banner of the World Dragon...)

>Any "End Times" ruleset (usually disregarded, thankfully), from the Lore of Undeath available to every wizard from every race, to Khaine turning every wizard into a Loremaster from his school of magic

those were some of the worst

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>>50602775
It snapped his mind like a twig though. And that was just a glance at the knowledge.

Truly elves are the best wizards.

>>50603794
In before a Slann wakes up after two dozen threads and says 'no' and then promptly goes back to bed.

>>50603242
Man, 6th edition was SO fucking good.

Just out of the bullshit that was 5th edition, and before they started increasing unit sizes and started begging you to use units of 40 infantry and shit.

The saurus box had 16 sauruses in it, it was so cool. A unit of 20 or 25 was huge at that time! Only skavens used units of 30-40, and those were slaves.

Nowadays, whenever I watch some battle report on Miniwargaming I find that in a game of 2000 points those dudes are fielding 4-6 units of a thousand dudes with three million attacks each.

I started playing during 5th, and it was a bit clumsy, but 6th and to a lesser extent 7th editions were gold.

>>50604383
A mix of 6th and 7th, but mostly 6th, would be the way to go. 8th is pure garbage.

>>50603242
Thanks for the breakdown, I'm not familiar with a lot of these cheesy things so if you'd care to extrapolate i would definitely read it since any wargaming I'll be doing will be with friends. I didn't realize cannons were so powerful for one. What edition would you say is best in terms of balance and fairness?

>>50604484
I only got to play in 7th and enjoyed it a lot. Sure there were a lot of rules, but the amount of possible outcomes increases with every one

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>>50602775
>Horr
Isn't it Horx?

Where can I find all the most recent FAQs? Couldn't find them in any of the op links

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Is there an online simulator for Fantasy battles like the one for 40k?

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Can Lord Kroak's Deliverance of Itza inflict hits on units in close combat?

According to the rulebook, spells cannot TARGET units engaged in close combat, but the spell states that it DOES target all units in 12". Does this imply an overriding of the normal restriction?

Seems GW never put out an 8th ed Lizardman FAQ, so I fear it remaining subjective

>>50610804
>Where can I find all the most recent FAQs?
For?

>>50611417
8th and the latest versions of all the army books

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>>50596475

Kek, that one cut a little close to the bone.

>>50574042
Looking to start a Bretonian army... Since GW are impossible to find, Does anyone have any experience with fireforge games crusaders?

>>50600160
Beast wizards are the shittiest ones though. What is Gregor going to do, turn into a monster? Throw amber spears? That's all he really can do in a fight, beast magic sucks and I can't imagine a wizard of that order beating gelt or Gormann in a ritual duel

>>50615779
Turn into a great fire dragon and eat the fuckers.

>>50615779
Come to think of it, fire had a pretty hard advantage over most of the other Wizards. I can't see how any other wizard could have countered the things Gormann threw at gelt.

>>50616143
It's too bad he doesn't do this in any of the more he's ever featured in

>>50616647
There is a reason Gormann won that fight 3 times in a row

Guys, how would you make Warhammer great again?

I'm thinking of taking 6th edition rules (much less random crap, more tactical, less miniatures required for a 'full' unit, more interesting lore, hell, even (at least for me) better minis!) and converting them into something akin to KoW but not that simple.

KoW is TOO fucking simplistic, that's why I don't like it. On the other hand, 6th could be improved. 9th Age sucks balls, and 8th too. Maybe 7th is pretty good

>>50617493
I'm sure I read somewhere that most of the Supreme Patriarchs have been Bright Wizards. I can't find a source for it now though. The only thing Realms of Sorcery says is that none of them have ever been Amethyst Wizards because they all lack ambition as a consequence of the nature of Shyish.

>>50619667
Blanche draws much better backgrounds than he does people/monsters.

>>50613882
ORION THIRSTS.

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>>50613882
Wood Elves look good but they could stand to be a bit thinner with sharper features. The voices aren't great but that's a problem with all the races in TW:Warhammer.

>>50618328
The contest seems a bit rigged in favor of the bright wizards, they are well known as an almost exclusively offensive, which can't be said about some other colleges. Seems a bit odd that the supreme patriarch is chosen from the best fighter, and not the wisest or most capable to lead

>>50621966
From an elven point of view, that might be one and the same. Teclis set up the Colleges, but put into practise it might not have gone the way he intended. Plus I'm sure most of the Colleges are fine with the Bright Wizards taking the lead as they are most likely to serve in the Emperor's armies, when you have someone like Life and Beast wizards who like being in tune with nature, or Shadow wizards who are essential secret agents who don't want the spot light.

>>50622043
Elves can use the full spectrum easily, so a duel between 2 archmages would rely a lot more on skill and wit than the innate advantages certain magicks may have over others. Being really good at magic doesn't really elevate an elfs standing or indicate leadership though. I think Only one phoenix King was a mage, and the everqueen is a literal God incarnate. magic users tend to be eccentric even amongst elves

>>50622259
That's my point. Humans can't use more than one lore of magic without some serious consequences, so you get a 'rock/paper/scissors' effect that wouldn't come up with elven mages. You have to be cunning and wise in Saphery, but human mages can just hammer each other with their most powerful spells because Ghyran just can't properly counter Aqshy.

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>>50622259
>>50622325
Also to add on to my previous response, the Phoenix King isn't necessarily the best elf for the job, mage or not. Just look at Caledor II. He was the son of the Conqueror and a fighter, that was about it. Other than that he was a jealous prick with massive daddy issues.

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>>He could hear men screaming, shouting and trumpets sounding. Orders were made as best they could be. He blinked his eyes several times trying to get the filth out from them but one was nearly gone, all he could see out of it was red. The other saw only blurred shapes running here and there.
>>A shock went through him as he realized where he was and what had happened. His hands grasped for his weapon but felt cold mud in its place. A panic started to take hold that made him feel naked yet constricted at the same time, making him rip his helmet off. It clattered against a rock but the damage had already been done. A large dent had buckled the visor of the black helm that had rendered it largely useless.
>>Then a sound turned his head. A pained, pitiful sound. In looking towards it his eyes spied something gold and bronze lined with a blue that glowing blue in the dark. He ignored it, moving past it. Or he would have had his leg not given out under him.
>>More shouting, something 'broken'. Something tried to grab him but he shoved it away, crawling through the cold mud. His armour weighed him down, his lips were blue and his hands near white.
>>Finally he reached the source of that terrible noise. Still its form was blurred but he felt the hardness of its beak and the softness of its feathers. There was so much blood. He stroked them and its cry softened but was as constant as his own pain, mixing with the clattering of his armour as he lay next to the great beast. He spoke words of comfort, or at least he thought he did. There was so much noise he couldn't tell which words were his.
>>His eyes became dark. Red, white and silver seemed to surround him. A great feathered arm wrapped around his breastplate and pulled him closer. His leg was in incredible pain but he felt safe. The sounds of shouting and clashing metal subsided as the memory of a yapping chick took their place. A smile graced the Emperor's face.

>>50582161
>>50584403
>can't deal with a society where males and females aren't equal

Top fucking lel. Female Skaven are breeding machines, get over it phaggot.

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>>50621966
>Seems a bit odd that the supreme patriarch is chosen from the best fighter, and not the wisest or most capable to lead
Well, the colleges were created to train battle mages. It makes sense if you assume the colleges' role as academics is secondary to their role as the Emperor's pet human artillery.

Is there an easier way to search for archived /tg/ WHFB threads? Google brings up too many results to be accurate.

>>50622983
If anything that just emphasizes how evil they are - no one aside from the white-furred Skaven really get any sort of freedom. Strip off a few layers of fantasy and you have industrial society, with people limited by lack of resources and opportunity and such.

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how was 4th edition? I got a load of Chaos dwarves from The Russian Alternative and I'm not sure whether I want to use them for 4th or use the forgeworld rules

>>50621966
>Seems a bit odd that the supreme patriarch is chosen from the best fighter, and not the wisest or most capable to lead.

To the wizards, this is probably pretty much the same thing. As academicians within disciplines that rely on academic knowledge, they likely equate the two to a great degree.

Is that all there is to it? No, but academicians tend to get snowed in like that.

>>50622983
..wh.. what? I have no idea why you were referring to me with the top one there. I'm not only fine with a society where males and females aren't equal, I recognize such a thing as impossible.

>>50624067
>implying white-furs have freedom

>>50625092
>>Listen Hrorri, the Jew-thaggoraki did this!

>>50623026
Thats some sweet arte

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>>50625251

>GW release repacked Isle of Blood
>repack has both square and round bases

what the fuck is gotten into GW? are they trying to stop scaring away KoW and T9A fans? who do they think they are? a reasonable bussiness?

also, remind me, how much british euros did original IoB cost? I have a nagging feeling that new one is cheaper.

>>50622389
>the pointlessly tall
Kek, dwarfs so assblasted about being ugly manlets they had to make a grudge for it

>>50622389
>so many childish insults

and they keep arguing when I say Warhammer Dwarfs are a comic relief race, on par with O&G

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>>50621385
I can't believe I prefer the unit details from Warhammer mods of Medieval 2 (2006) than TW Warhammer.

>>50593765
>You never bought any models. If you had bought models they wouldn't have killed it.
They made it cost almost over 100 dollars for a decently sized regiment(25-30 models). They'd priced themselves out of the market with a ridiculous entry cost by the time they rolled out 8th edition and stubbornly refused to even acknowledge that they were choking the life out of it. They killed it with their own idiot decisions.

>>50626297
Trying to turn some cash from dead stock taking up space in warehouse, easier to just print some new boxes and toss in some round bases than come up with a fresh new starter kit with new minis.

At least that's my take on it, either way I can bulk out my Skaven and make a nice little elf force for funsies.

>>50626297
Hello shill.
>>repack has both square and round bases
[citation needed]
>what the fuck is gotten into GW?
They trying to clear the stocks.

>>50626297
>what the fuck is gotten into GW? are they trying to stop scaring away KoW and T9A fans?
Nah, in 2017 Runewars releasing.

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>>50627367
You are funny man.

>>50629416
>these normal faces
Disappointing.

>>50629021
>[citation needed]
you mean the actual product description on GW site, which in fact does say it contains both round and square?

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>>50629416
>>50629441
They just look too human.

>>50629501
i don't like Archaon, but I must admit, that's one fucking pimping hat!

>>50574042
What exactly are the empire robot monsters in OP? I don't remember reading anything about the empire having automatons

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>>50630041
They have clockwork horses at least.
I never liked that though. It crosses the line between automaton and robot. We can't even make things like that with modern technology.

Something like da Vinci's automaton or the Prague astronomical clock are a different matter though.

>>50630715
>We can't even make things like that with modern technology.
nor can we make wizards, lightning cannons and destructive hamsterwheels of doom. also, dragons and giants are mockery of square-cube law, and steam tank is impossible with medieval level of metallurgy.

tl;dr
your argument is retarded

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>>50630041
I don't know what exactly these thing are, or it it was ever elaborated upon aside from that image, but the Empire is rather fond of street parades.
Priests of Morr use hobby horses for example and stuff like that.

I figure it's something like that. Mechanical Menagerie sounds like entertainment to me.

>>50630810
This is the right thread for you:
>>50628751

>>50630715
I never fully understood if that was truly an automaton, or if it's just a vehicle shaped like a horse. If its the later, I have no idea why they gave it legs instead of just making a medieval motorcycle

>>50630852
>, I have no idea why they gave it legs instead of just making a medieval motorcycle
Because they can. Engineering school of Nuln is mostly pragmatic people, but every group of gearheads will have some impractical nutjob that the others will oblige in whatever project he has in mind.

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>>50630810
It's not magic though.
If it was a collaboration between the Engineers and the Gold College that would be fine, but it isn't.
The setting does have some internal rules at least.

>>50630852
That's how it was in the concept art, which makes more sense. Pic related.

>>50630715
I still find it a bit easier to swallow than if 40k made a vague mechanical creature and said that it worked because they slapped a human brain in it.

Is the 9th Age any good? I wasn't in the hobby when WHFB was around.

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>>50603794
>Truly elves are the best wizards.
No

>>50631047
It's warhammer 8th edition but fixed

>>50631214
What was wrong with 8th edition?

>>50631489
GW made the game progressively larger and less accessible for beginners since hordes of 40+ models would get boni over regular units.
This ultimately killed the game, in conjunction with GW pushing bigger 'centerpiece' kits.

Don't know anything about 9th but I figure those would be the things that needed to be addressed in order to 'fix' it.

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Are there any books other than Headtaker that mainly focus on a skaven perspective?

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>>50574042
>Playing Warhammer Fantasy
>Playing Dwarfs
>End Times has begun
>Mannfred keeps offering me 900-1500 gold for peace
>Kazador immediately calls on me to declare war on Vampire Counts with the offer of striking a Grudge out of the Dammaz Kron
>Mannfred sends a small force for Throgrim to crush
>Repeat

Holy shit, Mannfred is basically paying me to empty the Dwarf on Dwarf entries in the Book Of Grudges and level up Thorgrim.

>>50632157
Thanquol was in like two books, and you always get some from his perspective.

>>50633301
Manfred is a fucking cuck that steamrolls small nations that can't fight back and immediately sues for peace when real resistance shows up. I hadn't even fought him before he was offering me 10k gold to not make war on him, I'm guessing because the AI saw that I had six full stacks making a bee line to his territory.

>>50596083
What, the manlet jew miners get two, but we don't get one for Durthu?

>>50595076
Because you didn't buy any models.

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>>50633551

>>50594938
>Sucking GW cock
Implying I own more than the free sigmarine they gave me.

My models are so chinese they came with special fried rice.

>>50623643
this one's good enough

http://archive.4plebs.org/tg/search/text/whfb/type/op/

>>50633375
The other Vampire faction has steamrolled me before, all Mannfred does is occupy things after I've beaten him into submission.

>>50633551
I bought shitloads of models. New too, not just secondhand.

>>50634004
You also can't make shit models and expect people to buy them up like crazy. Or neglect some armies which people would buy like crazy if they ever got any attention.

>>50630883
I finding odd that we don't see more results from the cooperation between the gold wizards and engineers. They should be able to design mechanical creatures that can think without too much trouble

>>50634584
Engineers were more than likely trained by dwarves, and probably inherited some of their traditionalist mindset, or had that reinforced by the odd dwarf that would come to work for humans. Even if they were willing to experiment mechanically, they likely wouldn't want to work magic into their inventions.

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>>50631175
>>50603837
>>50603794
The prophecy has been fulfilled
Praise be onto lord kek, shaper of dreams
May the pools bring us dubz and the future hold no doubts

>>50634584
Human wizards tended to be loners to an extreme degree. They basically didn't work with anyone.

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>>50634584
>They should be able to design mechanical creatures that can think without too much trouble
The shy little magitech-looking senpai in the bottom right is probably related

I believe collaboration has happened in some fields, if not to explain engineers with magic stuff, to explain the engineering wonders the magic colleges drop their magics on (luminarch, hurricanum and other instruments)

are Darksword Miniatures 28mm? especially GoT ones? they look so detailed I'm afraid they are 56mm or something

>>50635483
The 'Daenerys with newborn dragons' miniature mentions being sculpted for 54mm and then shrunk down to 28mm to fit with the others in the range.
So yes, it looks like they are 28mm.
Whether they will fit nicely with other 28mm miniatures is another question. They look quite finely proportioned.

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>>50632157
Half of the Black Plague series focuses on the Skaven. It's great, CL Werner really knows how to write ratmen.

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Give me an interesting, yet for this career appropriate character backstory.

>>50639770
What do you mean interesting?
1) Former soldier
2) Guy from village

>>50639770
He's been through some shit.

>>50639770
Make him a new memeber of local Nurgle cult, and Dung Collector is his first step in cult hierarchy.
Or ex-student who was kicked out from Altdorf university

>>50640143
>What do you mean interesting?
More than "has enough of that shit and start becoming and adventurer"
>1) Former soldier
But he has to visit the soldier career at least once for that.

>>50639770
He comes from a long line of shit pickers, and his father wished for him to follow in the family footsteps.

He did not however want to become a dungcollector, and instead spent his day drinking and gambling in the local tavern.

Until the day the cute local peasant girl he had been enamoured with fell ill with violent diarrhoea because no one had cleaned the dung from their village.

With this call to action he picked up his father old dung wagon and set out to clean the streets.

>>50636046
remember that warhammer 28mm is more similar to 32mm due to "heroic" proportions

>>50639770
he became a dung collector because his marriage gift was lost between the feedstuff at the village's market and tried to recover it the most pragmatic way

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Why are sea elves the best elves?

Posting wet elves
1/3

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>>50641354
2/3

>>50640528
>But he has to visit the soldier career at least once for that.
How about, he was recruited to militia (these guys aren't big professional) and was hardly wounded in hist first battle?

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>>50641362
3/3

I like to think somewhere in the oceans of the old world there were lot of sky pirates

>>50641373
Sky pirates? From what race? i thought only the elves made flying ships

Does anyone have the 2nd edition fantasy roleplay books?

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>>50641462
I was thinking mainly chaos ships, undead wraith-ships, tileans with tech stolen from leonardo's scrolls and GOBLINS

maybe ogres too if they happened to learn how to use the flying vessels of the sky-titans

>>50641462
>i thought only the elves made flying ships
Surely you meant to say Dwarves?

>>50641362
2 spears?

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>>50641354
>That aventail
NOW we're talking.
I'm up for some more byzantine elves. They've already got the scale armour going on.

>>50641478
from OP's pastebin

>https://mega.nz/#F!pFgm0RKR!J06C1gVYcjzNGsF8YNLsjQ!JVw20QKC

>>50641354
>Why are sea elves the best elves?
Sea Elves are the sea-faring High Elves, right? As in, the regular working population of Ulthuan that lives in the outer coastal areas.

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>>50642118
In early editions, Sea Elves were a somewhat separate culture from the High Elves. Were more practical and cosmopolitan than the High Elves and did most of the trading with other races. The elven traders in Marienburg were Sea Elves.
In later editions they mostly got ignored and it was assumed they just got rolled into the High Elves.

I enjoy the distinction though. They allow you to have some more old-worldy elves. I like to think that they pick up on some of the fashion trends to fit in better, such as the puff-and-slash sleeves and floppy hats

>>50641354
>>50641362
>>50641373
>such great concepts
>resemblance to actual sea guard is just passing so we can look at minis and feel sad for concepts that weren't used

>>50633551
Deliberately. Enjoy throwing your bionicle ripoffs in the garbage when they keel over due to shares dropping when it comes out they're cooking their books.

>>50642222
>In early editions, Sea Elves were a somewhat separate culture from the High Elves.
Well I think High Elves colonies fit this niche.

>>50642222
Yeah, it also allows you to have the elves be a more living society rather than to have every last one of them be the embodiment of one out of three factional tropes.

The sea elves being flat-out rolled into the high elves annoys me almost as much as the homogenization of Bretonnia and the complete canning of the revolutionary era/three musketeers/sun king mish-mash that was replaced by full-medieval arthurian legend.

I've always liked the idea of having them exist all at once, with the grail cult being a noble/knighthood thing that sets them apart from the burghers and much of the peasantry, fueling a growing schism between the classes, with the ruling castes being reactionary neo-feudalists that have started reliving an age of chivalry and medievalism in a society that should've been just about ready to start entering an age of enlightenment.

In this context, the grail cult, possibly created by the elven court at Athel Loren as a means of long-term influence over the human Bretonnia, may have been a grave miscalculation, threatening to one day spark a civil war that may implicate them, ultimately pulling much of humankind into conflict with elvenkind, since it's unlikely that high elves, sea elves or even dark elves would accept such a war of extermination.

>>50642409
It does, that's just it. Sea Elves were always just another kind of High Elf, but maintaining the cultural distinction within the High Elves would help maintain the idea that this is true for all of elvenkind, instead of turning each elven faction into a single distinct trope. Bonus points if the dark elves could've been considered as having sea elves be a part of them, too, creating a cultural bridge for social overlap and natural exchange, with pirates, colonists, merchants, and neutral traders, instead of all high elves being in opposition and distinct from dark elves, and vice versa.

See what I'm getting at, or am I confusing dven myself here?

>>50642267
the actual sea guards aren't that bad, I think they retained the most important thing: seaweed ribbons

>>50642531
yeah, but they are most boringly monopose. yeah, starter kit models must be easy to assemble, but still. they don't look like guys who fight on boarding planks or on wildly heaving deck in a storm. they look like another boring plains-marching regiment.

>>50634584
Well to be fair, many gold wizards ARE engineers, too, and they have trade secrets and shit, son.

>>50642546
Yeah, I think I would've gone for light scales (such as from dragons or fish), bone, and leather. Fighting in any kind of metal, especially anything beyond a chain shirt that you can easily slip out of, would be retarded at sea.

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>>50642525
That would have worked if they ever brought them up again, but they didn't.

They do bring a bit more depth to the High Elves though, I agree. And I like the idea of them being a little more ambiguous on the High Elf/Dark Elf front.

One of the few things I liked about the End Times was bringing the Asur and Druchii together a bit more. They did it in a stupid, ham-fisted way, but the idea is sound in essence.
It makes both factions a little more deep. Dark Elves aren't just spiky evil dudes and High Elves aren't all sunshine and rainbows. Each have a little of the other lurking below the surface.

But then I'm all about bringing the elves back to their Melnibonean roots a little, and those guys were anything but nice.

>>50641354
>>50641362
>>50641373
>>50641373
Sauce on those Warhammer concept art?

>>50642884
Nothing End Times did make anything a little bit more deep. I like the idea of ambigious-i-fying (I'm on a tablet or I'd find a better word) the relationships, but End Times flattened it all with a massively forced ham-fist.

That being said, having instances where they do or threaten to unify for elvenkind makes perfect sense, and I think there's a lost opportunity in flanderizing them and pegging the factions themselves as opposing tropes. But this simplification of the fluff has been going on for an extremely long time, it's just that End Times shoved it all over the edge.

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>>50641362
>downward turned quillons

Anyone else hates how Ulthuan is situated in the middle of the not!Atlantic and doesn't at all fit in with the rest of the entire fucking world? How can the "New World" even be considered a New World, when it should've been discovered and colonized centuries ago, just by skipping from the Old World to Ulthuan and then to the New World?

The elves doing this isn't weird or anything, Naggaroth is a thing after all, but humans have had contacts with Ulthuan and the elves for over a thousand years.

I'm a fan of the idea of moving Ulthuan to be situated around the area of not!Mexico, it just feels like it'd make a lot more sense, with North America being loosely colonized by the elves, at least along the sea, with the Dark Elves having taken Naggaroth.

This also opens up the possibility of a 'west coast' faction of elves (not!Aztecs mixed with not!Indians?) and the idea of sea elves having colonies in the not!Pacific, not to mention contacts with Nippon. It's just that this was never relevant to the humans of the Old World and the Empire, so it was never relevant, and it'd mean that the elves might be dealing with things not!European humans have never even heard about, making the Wood Elves in the Old World just one facet of elven society, instead of elvenkind being focused on the same overall areas.

I am now imagining the high elves actually being in a long ongoing war with the Empire of Nippon, and it's going far worse than any human could've imagined, with the unified/neutral elven enclave at the Gates of Calith recently being burned to the ground, denying the elves access to the western seaway to the Kingdoms of Ind and the Tower of the Sun and the Tower of Stars.

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>>50643503
So, something like this?

I'd do it better, but I can only find low-res maps of the world, sadly.

>>50643503
atlantis expy > so-called logic

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>>50643632
I realize it's meant to be not!Atlantis, but I've never liked that idea. Had it just been a city out there in the sea, I think it would've been fine, but Ulthuan is enormous.

Stone by stone, it's larger than the entirety of the Empire, perhaps as large or larger than the Empire, Bretonnia and Kislev combined. Picture related.

It practically spans 1/2 to 2/3 of the distance between not!NorthAfrica and not!America.

And let's be honest - aside from it being vaguely circular and situated in the middle of the ocean, and that it's prophesized to sink beneath the waves, it shares very little with the Atlantis mythos. If the intention is to force an Atlantis counterpart, rather than to just pull inspiration from the idea of Atlantis (which could be done no matter where Ulthuan is situated), where's the circular districts, the robots and the orichalcum? Where's the pissing in the face of Poseidon?

Besides, there's the mayanist/aztec/inca connection anyway: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlantis#Impact_of_Mayanism

In this particular case, we can have the cake and eat it too.

>>50643737
>here be demons
I hate how they never made this are relevant or give any focus.

>>50643775
They couldn't, they had to give Archaon more screentime before they canned the setting for Smegmar

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>>50643775
While I do agree, it's implied to be Antarctica, so it's probably a frozen hell-hole.

On the other hand, there's no not!Australia, And it stretches up to the Hinterlands of Khuresh and the Southlands, and isn't far from the southern tip of Lustria, either, and they're all implied to be covered in forest or jungle.

In order for The Southern Wastes to be.. well.. wastes, I'm going to imagine that it's mostly a stone-and-sand desert, it's northern parts implied to have been covered in forest and jungle before, but has been devastated since then, much of it already being destroyed in raging continental wildfires already at the Great Catastrophe in approx. -5600 IC.

Remember that while it's huge, it might look a lot huge-er because of the limitations of the Mercator-projection. I mean, look at Greenland and Antarctica on a real-life Mercator-projection map. For reference, South America is 6.881 million square miles. Antarctica is 5.1 million square miles. Greenland is 2.166 square miles.

So while I would've liked something done with it, I think it's a lot more frustrating that we never really got anything on Ind, Cathay, Nippon, or the Southlands.

And there being Eastern Tribes of degenerate Lizardfolk would also have been awesome. After all, there's the Lost City of The Old Ones in the great jungles south of the Hinterlands of Khuresh (I imagine that would actually be Khuresh, as opposed to it's Hinterlands).

Or maybe it's all even overrun by Lizardfolk-based beastmen, the Lost City truly Lost, the Lizardfolk and the Slann periodically attempting to gain a foothold in Khuresh.

>>50644044
>degenerate Lizardfolk

>using stone weapons in age of steam, gunpowder and gromril/ithilmar
>walking on foot or riding stupid lizards when there're plenty of mounts, chariots, steam engines, and elves got flying boats
>not wearing pants
all lizardmen are degenerate, m8

>>50643503
The High Elves protect their island home with powerful enchantments that you have to be an extremely powerful sorcerer to break or incredibly lucky to sail through. Basically you get turned around even if you're making a straight line. They also have the world's best navy and sink ships that aren't authorized to get anywhere near Ulthuan.

Also, humans haven't had contact with Ulthuan for that long. They may have met elves for that long, but formal relations between elves and men only started two hundred years prior to the settings current date, 2523 I.C. The Great War was going on and Teclis founded the Colleges of Magic.

>>50644044
There should have been an age of exploration after the Storm of Chaos to be honest, it would have been the best way to keep the game alive.

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Let's play 'make the High Elves more nuanced'. I figure the Ancient Greeks are a good starting point.

>High Elves are racist at their best, but at their worst the sheer cruelty that typifies the Dark Elves becomes readily apparent.
>The High Elves keep slaves (human slaves) much in the same way as the Greeks or Romans. Human farmers and labourers support the small Elven population and allow them to maintain the lifestyles to which they have become accustomed. Slave taking raids have been frowned upon since Finubar opened up relations with the human nations of the Old World, but many of the long-lived Elves are set in their ways and a portion of the 'Dark Elf raids' are anything but.

>The Cult of Khaine is proscribed in the Empire for good reason. Elven ambassadors and merchants are granted immunity to the ministrations of Sigmar's Templars for diplomatic reasons, but most citizens of the Empire would be horrified to learn of the bloody rites High Elf warriors perform in secret prior to battle. Death Night is also an event celebrated on Ulthuan, albeit as part of an elaborate pantomime involving the simulated slaughter and consumption of a chosen victim. Usually the body is substituted with that of a deer, but in rural areas of Yvresse or the Shadowlands it is sometimes a slave.

>>50643775
I may remember wrong, but I believe archaon said there live the "true" beastmen, as in beasts that became humanoid, instead of humans that became beastly.

I like to think there are chaos penguinmen guarding the other broken portal to chaos

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>>50644155
>all lizardmen are degenerate
say that to my face and not on psychic communion and see what happens

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>>50644044
No, The Lost City of The Old Ones and Khuresh is obviously claimed by the Skaven, fighting a bitter civil war over the remains, with a renegade faction being led by a Slann of the First Spawning claiming the uppermost sections of the gargantuan city, the Slann itself being restricted to an immobile life-sustaining device.

Every time the Lizardmen of Lustria attempt to gain a foothold in Kuresh, skaven attacks surge throughout Lustria, as the skaven clans unite against the fear of the Lizardmen gaining control over the Lost City, knowing that the renegade skaven, servants of Rebit the Ever-Dreaming, would invite them straight into the deepest sanctums and the secrets and powers contained within.

Picture related, High Magus Shekkit of the White-Fang Cult.

>>50644233
I'd restrict the slaves thing outside of ulthuan as it would be considered elite/holy ground for all the protection it gets

>>50644304
>good skaven
pls, no

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>>50644261
I'm not sure what Archaon said on the subject, but yeah, it's implied that there's a breed of "True" Beastmen coming from the south, that supposedly "breed true".

>>50644310
I guess. The image of High Elf farmers never rang true to me though.

They're all very decadent and refined, but someone has to shovel the shit and wash the dishes.

>>50644501
They have a lower class. I imagine they live a much better life than most middle class humans, but they still plow fields and grow crops. It's specifically stated that the areas in Saphery by the White Tower there are farmers who don't have to do any work at all because eager apprentices show off their skills by doing farmwork with magic.

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>>50644346
>brainwashed servants of a Slann in a single city
>still universally reviled by humanity, as well as their own kind
>still idiots
>"good"

Eh, I dunno, I kinda like the idea. Not being a servant of the Great Horned Rat doesn't exactly make you good.

>>50644304
>White-Fang Cult
Burning Claw Cult.

>>50644501
>The image of High Elf farmers never rang true to me though.
probably because you associate the imagery and difficulty of human farmers to the elves

I would see elven farms as relatively less intended for mass production and more as personal hobby gardens that bear a lot of fruits

>>50644304
>led by a Slann of the First Spawning
>Rebit the Ever-Dreaming

Does he know that it was Lord Kroak that engineered the destruction of the gates of the Old Ones in a mad bid for power and an attempt to isolate the world and seize control of it, and that Lord Kroak was in fact not the first of the First Spawning, but merely usurped that role and claimed the title after all others of the First Spawning were wiped out as the plan spectacularly backfired and wiped out most of civilization and sparked the First Chaos Incursion and The Great Catastrophe?

Because I think he should know that.

>>50625092

Well, they can boss around other skaven, have mighty sorcerous powers, are semimmortal and snort cocaine for a living

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>>50644800
>that bear a lot of fruits
Just dumping the idea of the toiling north-european peasant, and instead thinking of French vineyards and Spanish orange orchards, imposing elven architecture on it, solves the entire difficulty with imagining high elf farmers, I think.

Think "fruits", not "turnips".

With the ideas suggested earlier in the thread, I imagine that much of this is done by the mainland elves, on the archipelagous west coast.

>>50644800
>>50644961
Would like to see a bogan/redneck version of an elf.

>>50644501
>>50644800
there're no serious High Elf farmers
there are some, and there are those in Saphery, but they are there purely for propaganda (or because they are weirdos)

you know how no matter the political relationships, there're always economic ties between coutnries - black markets, unofficial or extensaively long routes, etc.? officials either ignore them or pretend to fight them, but they know of them and keep the around because those are all useful?

So: all food production for Ulthuan is done by Dark Elf slaves.

>>50644991
wood elves?

>>50644863
They are also forced into doing all those things. They're semi-immortal because they are magic-users, and they're forced into being magic-users, which isn't necessarily a pleasant experience, and they're forced to lead, too. The only thing they aren't forced to do is to snort magical angeldust, but they do that to gain greater power or insight, which they have to do or they risk being usurped or outmaneuvered.

From day 1, the fate of white-furs is decided. It's like being born straight into a ruling family where everyone hates eachother but you need to keep up the appearances, or they'll hate you even more - not that it matters much, because they already want to kill you, and will do so if given the chance, just to retake what part of the shared power they had to cede in one way or another on the day you were born.

No layer of Skaven society is plesant. Is it better than being a brown-furred bastard? Probably. You get to mate and you're well-fed. But let's not pretend that they're "free".

I imagine that white-furs born without magic potential or that are too stupid to excel are killed while they are very young, which in Skaven terms probably means when you're less than three years old.

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>>50645032
Yeah, I can see that. They to run around shooting anything during hunting season and probably get shitfaced whenever.

>>50645067
And they fuck kids. The allusion is complete.

>>50645037

The fact is, for skavens this is not a "forced" thing, in fact, they relish it. Everyone fate is predetermined at birth, or close to it.

They're after all the chosen of their God, they have mating rights, they're the highest social position available, they can single handedly ruin a clan (grey seers get to declare heresy on warlords).

White Seers also have unlimited possibility for advance. Not only you get a quasi-immortality, but you can keep it (provided you keep yourself sharp or crazy enough to avoid all assassinations).

Look at Thanquol: he basically has his every whim done, he even has hobbies, and the only ones he's scared of is the Lords of Decay.

Also, a skaven adult life is around 8 years (natural, normally is prob around 3-4), and ALL white furs are withouth exception grey seer material. Albino skavens instead (which are apparently different from white furs) are temple-guard equivalent.

Plus, white seers are free. They are of course always in peril, as all skaven are, but they can be coherced only by the council of 13 or by a verminlord, no other skaven has the authority to do so

>>50645150
>this is not a "forced" thing
>Everyone fate is predetermined at birth
>Plus, white seers are free.
>They are of course always in peril

The mental gymnastics at play here are astounding.

>>50645389

It does not seem forced to skaven, because skaven, by default, do not choose their career.

Once they are adults, most of them will follow orders for all life, but the white furs do not.

Therefore, the white furs have a considerable degree of freedom over any other skaven save the Lords of Decay.

What is the best way to go about getting a starting army for the game? There are some guys at the local store who play Kings of War, and I really want to try it as I have wanted to play a miniatures game focused on line battles (Due mostly to Total War, ironic as I haven't actually played the Warhammer one yet). As it can use the same figures as WHFB due to it being a clone, I thought that this would be the best place to ask.

I am not picky about material, so whether it is plastic or metal doesn't matter as long as the price and models are decent. Manufacturer is not an issue, I see that there are a lot of them listed in the OP. I am not picky about factions, but I want to avoid a horde army like Skaven (I already made the mistake of collecting Soviets in Flames of War) or a army focused on ranged attacks (I like people beating each other up in close combat). I just want to see what options there are for a starter army bundle.

is there any guide for sculpting bodies? i can't seem to find fitting torsoes for Orion and Vermin Lord conversions, so I thought maybe I can sculpt them?

>>50645812
KoW starters are pretty cheap, although model quality is... debatable. Some love it, some hate it. They have some of the widest ranges for armies supported, so you might want to look into them in any case.

GW's Star Collecting! boxes are pretty good deals, though they come without square bases, so you'll have to find your own (or glue 'em straight to tray, since in KoW you don't remove casualties)

also, GW is bringing back the Isle of Blood, which will have square bases. You can try starting with that - would make a nice a elf army.

MoM Miniatures and Avatars of War make nice and reasonable expensive Chaos Warriors and Dwarfs.

>>50645812
>What is the best way to go about getting a starting army for the game?
WellI get it you want to avoid the horde armies, but anything else?
>>50645902
>KoW starters are pretty cheap, although model quality is... debatable.
Their undead skelitons and zombies are great (cavalry aren't so good, but still okay).
\>GW's Star Collecting! boxes are pretty good deals,
>sucking GW cocks so hard
I think you should go back to your thread.
>also, GW is bringing back the Isle of Blood
You mean they just repackaged IoB?
Also, Gamezon have some good models and Banelegions (for characters and monsters)

How long would it take a caravan from Altdorf to reach Grunburg? Need to know for a WHFRP game I'm running, and will be referencing this map: http://www.gitzmansgallery.com/shdmotwow-full.html

>>50646065
That is really it as far as my qualifications go. I generally want a faction that I can get a good starting set for at a good value.

>>50645902
I will check out Avatars of War, KoW, and the rest. The store even seems to actually sell those figures. Thanks anon!

>>50646065
Gamezone, Scybor, Mierce and others are on the expensive side though. I'd advise to get at least a small core army, try out various options with proxies, and only then invest into good-looking expensive models from Gamezon and the rest.

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What is in Ind, besides beastmen? That it is not!India, we know, but what age? What are the tropes? What's the lay of the land?

We know that there are pic related, more or less, and they may or may not be beastmen (but let's assume it's beastmen), and we know that these are revered or feared (or both).

But what else do we know, beyond that? And aside from what we know, what should we make it? What would be interesting?

I liked the ideas mentioned earlier regarding the Sea Elves, changes to Ulthuan, and the nature of Khuresh, but does anyone have any ideas to pitch regarding the Kingdoms of Ind?

>>50647978
>What are the tropes?
Poo in the loo and celestial wizards providing faulty tech-support to human end-users of dwarven technology.

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How true is Warhammer: Geheimnisnacht mod for CK2 to the lore?

>>50647978
Kind of how Brettonia is an almagation of French and English medieval poetry and literature and Arabia is basically all the stories of 1001 Nights, I'd expect a similarly fantastical/folklore inspired version of a romanticized India.

>>50648073

WE NEED TO BUILD AN AURIC BASTION

>>50648111
>I'd expect a similarly fantastical/folklore inspired version of a romanticized India.

Yeah, I just have no clue what that'd be. Keep in mind that what tropes are being played up and alluded to easily changes, too.

For example, the Empire is part medieval Europe, part Holy Roman Empire, and part 30 years war.

Bretonnia used to be a revolutionary era/three musketeers/sun king mish-mash, and only become 100% Arthurian legend with an elected monarch for some reason later.

So if we're talking Ind, I think it's obvious that we'd take India and just trope the shit out of it, picking iconic things left and right and skullfucking them until they're incredibly recognizable, hilariously racist, and adding a coating of mud and existential awfulness.

Obviously, we need Kali death cults and a holy river that is ridiculously dirty, but beyond that, what can we add?

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>>50648269
>For example, the Empire is part medieval Europe, part Holy Roman Empire, and part 30 years war.

Samefag here, what I forgot to add was that my point is that the Empire is all of these things, but it's not, for example, 1930's Germany, the Hanseatic League, Bismarck's Prussia, or the Germanic Tribes (although that last part fits into the pre-history of the Empire a little, but it didn't fight not!Rome, so it's very lost either way).

Picture unrelated.

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>>50581357
Speaking of Shadowmancers of the Grey Brotherhood, I was discussing the idea of a Grey Wizard gunpowder-using sniper type of character just yesterday, and I was wondering:

Is there anything in Warhammer Fantasy that prevents the idea of enchanting pistols and rifles?

I realize that enchanted weapons are incredibly rare, but assuming that someone custom-made a rifle, maybe even a Hochland Long-Rifle, and you shot custom-made gold bullets (because gold is a magic attractor/conservator, while normal lead bullets would be a magic deflector/insulator), would there be anything preventing the enchanting of such by sufficiently capable wizards?

I can't shake the idea of being a Shadowmancer Sniper, now. It sounds like something the Grey College would totally employ and practice. Getting the Golden Brotherhood to help enchant a rifle, as to fire smokeless and soundless bullets, all you hear is a gentle "flowmph" as the bullet exits the barrel, as if you just sucked a ping-pong ball into your vaccuum cleaner.

>>50648520
>I can't shake the idea of being a Shadowmancer Sniper, now. It sounds like something the Grey College would totally employ and practice.
Not really.
Grey Wizards are an Odin/Gandalf inspired thing. They're not operators or anything.

>>50648520
There are engineering runes which are put on pistols, handguns and warmachines, so it isn't out of the question for a wizard to do the same.

>>50648580
Grey Wizards act as spies/secret agents for the Emperor.

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>>50648580
>Grey Wizards are an Odin/Gandalf inspired thing.
>They're not operators or anything.

Haha, what? No, I realize that they were originally inspired at least aesthetically by Gandalf - I would consider it an oversight if you have Grey Wizards and didn't make them look like Gandalf - but they are totally operators.

If the Empire has such a thing as a secret service that only answers to the Emperor and that may one day go rogue and threaten everything in a spectacular noir special covert operations drama fashion, it's the Grey Brotherhood.

>>50649009
>Grey Brotherhood.
Grey Order.

Goddammit, how do I fuck it up when it's right fucking there?

>>50648774
>Grey Wizards act as spies/secret agents for the Emperor.

Which is a rather different thing.

>>50649081
>Which is a different thing

Different than what? Operators? I guess it all comes down to what you consider operator. I've always considered it special forces/snipers/secret agents/assassins/literary spies.

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Speaking of the 9th age, there's a company making a new line of Bretonnian miniatures that seems pretty rad.

They've pretty much nailed the concept art.

>>50648520
i just phonetically made that 'flowmph' sound and yea dawg i can feel that

>>50642267
That's because they cheaped out and made a single kit with Seaguard just being Spearmen carrying a bow.

When Seaguard got their own models, the look had become too traditional.

>>50643503
Its the "Old World" by human reckoning. Humans didn't discover the location of Ulthuan until very recently, or the existence of Naggaroth. They've known about Lustria for awhile, but it was uncolonized for obvious reasons.

So to the Empire and Dwarfs, those are the "new worlds".

>>50651200
>So to the Empire and Dwarfs, those are the "new worlds".

Exactly, and that's pretty ridiculous.