Hello. /lit/ is useless. Tell me good fantasy books. Also, I

>>50091027

Sanderson is fucking trash. Useless fat fuck. I truly regret reading his shit book about magical armor, storm beads, and whatever the fuck else it was about.

Anyway - fantasy, fuck if I know.

Sci-fi - Neal Stephenson is king. Neuromancer is great (rest of Gibson's work is meh). The Foundation series was pretty good for a book with shit char development.

Malazan Book of the Fallen. That'll keep you occupied for a while. And it's amazing.

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>>50091048
those are some pretty strong opinions. Can you perhaps give a reason why you believe the author is bad rather than just spouting vitriol?

>>50091027
Joe Abercrombie is a pretty awesome author by my reckoning. Great characters. /lit/ can be pretty pretentious when it comes to books at times.

I like the wheel of time series by Robert Jordan, but some people find it to be too rambling and long for their tastes.

The Dagger and Coin series by Daniel Abraham is pretty awesome- it's not as much about awesome fights as it is about fantasy economics and societies. If you like character development in a fantasy setting it should be a good read. otherwise, if you like awesome battles, maybe skip it.

>>50091027
Gormenghast by Mervyn Peake.
The Worm Ouroboros by E R Eddison.
Fafhrd & The Gray Mouser by Fritz Lieber

>>50091174

>Can you perhaps give a reason why you believe the author is bad rather than just spouting vitriol?
>spouting vitriol

You might like it, given your penchant for corny outdated phrasing.

Anyway, the book I read was "The Way of Kings" - it dragged on for 1200+ pages (I just checked, somehow it didn't manage to make it to the trashcan). For all of those 1200 pages, there wasn't a single original, or even good, idea. He memed and memed over and over again - it was readily apparent that he does not understand any sort of reality of life - strategy, fitness, or even what it means to be an intelligent human being. Now, you can argue "Fantasy has nothing to do with reality", but not that both Tolkien and fat-fuck GRRM were both former soldiers. They also obviously understand human nature to some degree and draw from experience. Sanderson is the direct opposite - he writes to write. If you are into tripe like The Dresden Files, you might enjoy it.

>>50091027
Malazan Book of the Fallen nigga

It's chunky enough to keep you busy for a decent while, and maintains a high level of quality throughout.

>>50091027
If you have to ask if you should re-read LOTR, you should re-read LOTR.

Mistborn is aight. It's not high literature. It's about wizards who gain powers by eating metal bashing their powers against each other. If you want wizard fights, there you go. I got through the 3 books in 3 or 4 days, so it's a pretty good way to kill a few afternoons.

In a similar vein is Brian McClellan's Powdermage trilogy. It's about wizards who control gunpowder fighting other wizards who are typical non-vancian wizards, so power over fire, earth, wind, etc, and also gods.

I like Powdermage because there just aren't many high-fantasy settings in that era.

>>50091027
Promise of Blood and the rest of the Powdermage trilogy by Brian MacClellan is decent. Setting's pretty decent, but the gunpowder magic and the characters are decent.

Lightbringer by Brent Weeks is good so far, same with Lies of Locke Lamora by Scott Lynch. I'm not sure if they'll be good all the way through because I haven't finished them.

Beyond Redemption by Micheal R. Fletcher was decent. Interesting mental illness based magic.

I really liked the first Malazan Book of the Fallen book, the second wasn't as good, in my opinion, and I haven't read the rest.

There's a few guys on here who've got some kind of hateboner for Sanderson, but he's pretty decent. The Emperor's Soul was actually really rather great, and its way of presenting a message on creating artwork has stuck with me.

>>50091027
>it's not as much about awesome fights as it is about fantasy economics and societies
i need this shit right now

>>50091552
whoops, meant to quote >>50091174

>>50091467

>There's a few guys on here who've got some kind of hateboner for Sanderson, but he's pretty decent.

Only me in this thread - to say I hate him is to give him too much credit. Just really plain and a waste of time.

>>50091820
i don't know man, really seems like you think he's a bad or stupid person just because he wrote a book you didn't like.

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Is is that time of the month again?

>>50091910
Skub a shit.

>>50091820
I've gotta say, from what you said about Way of Kings, it feels like we didn't even read the same book. The vitriol you're willing to espouse and the denouncement of character you make before presenting anything against him and his writing just make me dismiss your opinion out of hand. It also makes me not take the statement that you don't hate him with a grain of salt.

Paul Kearney's Macht trilogy - Ten Thousand, Corvus and Kings of Morning.

It's a gritty war series based on the military expeditions of the Greeks in Persia, but placed on an alien, John Carter of Mars style world. It mostly follows a bloke called Rictus of Isca, a mercenary from a fallen city-state.

the kingkiller chronicle :^)

>>50091242
>fat-fuck GRRM were both former soldiers
He got conscientious objector status. He never went to Vietnam.

>>50091242
GRRM never served in a war.

Robert Jordan was a two tour Vietnam veteran though.

I've read just about every big fantasy series out there, and lots of small lesser known ones. My top picks for fantasy novels/series are

Malazan: Book of the Fallen
Kingkiller Chronicles
Black Company
Song of Ice and Fire
The Wheel of Time
Coldfire Trilogy (This one isn't actually that good, sort of a guilty pleasure :3)

>>50091027
Depends on what you're into?

Ken Liu- the dandelion series. Longer books that focus on world building. Definitely not for everyone buy solid reads if you don't need nonstop action.

Mishell baker- borderline. Urban fantasy, but main character is mentally ill, which gives a different take on things.

V.e scwab- a darker shade of magic. Parallel dimensions, with differing levels of magic/tech.

Ilana meyer- last song before night. Basically a world where bards are all powerful.

Mark Lawrence- broken empire. Edgelord character done right. Most fun antihero.

Myke cole- shadow ops. Fun modern series. Us military and magic.

Brian staveley- chronicle of the unhewn throne. Just really fucking solid/good.

Daniel Abraham- the dagger and the coin. Fun sprawling series. Everyone compares it to GoT, because guy has a connection to the author, but doesn't really rival it.

Idk. There's tons of good books out there. What are you into/hate?

>>50091027
>>50091910

We should set some kind of base rules for these threads.

>If you recommend a book or series, give a short blurb why
>If you dislike a book or series someone else has recommended, shut your goddamn mouth and post about a book you do like.

I really don't care for The Kingkiller Chronicle but I'm not going to bash it.

Instead, I'll recommend The Black Company, which, to me, is some seriously well-done dark fantasy that isn't bogged down by shoddy writing.

>>50092064
>If you dislike a book or series someone else has recommended, shut your goddamn mouth and post about a book you do like.
No, see, I prefer to hear mixed opinions, since I don't have unlimited free time. I want to hear why someone disliked a book so I can give it proper consideration. Nothing but praise can give a false image and have me waste a couple hours reading trash.

I made that mistake picking up a Sam Syke's book based on a gushing anon. Never again.

>>50092064
bashing is fine, as long as you don't overdo it and actually provide reasons for disliking it
it's the "X sucks. wow, you like X? you must be a retard with shit taste" stuff that makes the threads a pain in the ass to get actual advice from

>>50091467
Malazan gets much better from book 3 onwards, except for a minor rut in book 7, i'd strongly recommend it.

>>50092064
>shoddy writing
Writing style's dry as fuck though, so if you like more purple prose or more meat to the actual writing, then look somewhere else.

>>50091467
>Promise of Blood and the rest of the Powdermage trilogy by Brian MacClellan is decent. Setting's pretty decent, but the gunpowder magic and the characters are decent.
I keep seeing people fellate this series. I picked it up and regret putting money down on it. The writing style is dull and the plot has zero pull.

For a similar-ish kind of story, Jonathan Strange and Mr Norrel is better value, better quality.

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>>50091027
the Clash of Eagles novels are pretty good if you're not overly autistic about historical accuracy

Col Buchanon is preachy but decent

>>50092167
It was middling for me. I meant to say the setting's kind of boring, but my brain was on the decent train for that line, as you can see.

>>50092107
>>50092123

That's fair but a good portion of the time you get Anons sperging about how some books are "objectively" bad or insulting people who like them.

I suppose something like:

>If you dislike a book or series someone else has recommended, calmly and concisely explain why.

I suppose for The Kingkiller Chronicle, the writing style is quite "dense" and makes it annoying to push through. The pacing has an odd tendency to just rub me the wrong way. Yes, he gets to a lot of the events that are alluded to but it's always in a oddly meandering way.

Also, everything about the Ademre strikes me as incredibly dumb.

>>50092162
I have a personal preference for dry writing, I suppose.

>>50091027
The Black Company by Glen Cook

>>50092192
That's cool. I've seen it get a lot of praise just based on the premise of 'zoh my god, fantasy with guns!'

But beyond that the whole thing felt super hollow as a setting and a story.

>>50092167
Jonathan Strange and Mr Norrel struck me as an incredibly meandering and dull story. I couldn't get through the first few chapters and had to put it down.

Could you explain why you liked it so much?

The Bas-Lag Cycle by Herman Mieville is I guess mixed quality. Every book reads like a walking history book of the admittedly interesting setting with decent prose, so if you're into heavy worldbuilding then you'll love it, I know did.

The walking history book part bogs down the plot though. Plot of the first book doesn't even kick into gear until halfway through.

>>50092230
>Could you explain why you liked it so much?
I liked the scope and 'density' of it. The world felt very real to me, as well as the characters that existed in the world. I'm also a fan of 19th century literature like Thomas Hardy and stuff like that, and it felt like Susanna Clarke was consciously evoking that era of literature as well as the society of the day.

The characters and their world views felt very much of that era, rather than modern people dressed up in period outfits, like a lot of modern fantasy and historical writing.

>>50092228
I felt the gun magic was truly what pulled it along. That and the general character. It could have been better, but I didn't hate it. It wasn't unreadable for me, like The Way of Shadows by Brent Weeks. But it wasn't mind-blowing and didn't cause me to do a bunch of soul searching, like "The Emperor's Soul" by Brandon Sanderson.

>>50091027
Cry of the Icemark was pretty neat. The Not!Roman Empire is a warmongering technological powerhouse poised to stomp all over Generic Viking Land, but rather than try and beat them head-on with sheer manliness they decide to go out diplomancing through every nation they can reach.

Net result: vikings and giant intelligent tigers with druid support do battle against Roman pike-and-shot formations while witches help hoards of vampires fly against ballista-armed airships.

And somehow all this shit manages to fit, without looking like the literary equivalent of a tossed salad.


Also good is Inkheart. Guy has the power to bring things into reality by reading their story aloud, accidentally yanks the BBEG out of a book. BBEG fucking loves it here, sets up a mafia, reads the loot out of Treasure Island.

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>>50091027

If you haven't already, take a look at Thomas Covenant. You will either love the books or despise them, but it's a punch to the gut either way. It's one of the most compelling psychodramas I've ever read, but at the same time, the protaognist is disgusting, and watching him shamble on from wreckage to wreckage is either going to enthrall you, or cheer on his road to self destruction.

>>50092391
I read the first trilogy of those when I was 13. It was really depressing as a young teen. I've wanted to go back and read them as an adult to see if they hold up to my memory.

I greatly enjoyed Six of Crows and Crooked Kingdom even if best husbando dies

I already really liked The Waking Fire. Part Uncharted, part Bond, and part Master and Commander the book was enjoyable for me from start to finish. I loved the setting of a world on the cusp of the modern era, about to hurdle head first into its first world war because of a shortage of fuel and the actions of a few people to try to stop it that blows up into something much more.

Lies of Locke Lamora is probably my favorite "pure fantasy" book. Books two and three are above-average, but a little lacking.

He's been pushing back the release date for his fourth book for over a year at this point, maybe he'll actually release it someday.

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I really enjoyed Johannes Cabal the Necromancer. It's a black comedy about an evil scientist trying to win his soul back from the Devil. The audiobook is very well produced. There's a decline in quality as the series progresses but it works just fine standalone.

>>50091027
Instead of re-reading LotR read Children of Hurin, then decide if you want to re-read LotR with a better understanding of Tolkien's intent with his stuff on Middle-Earth. It's pretty short. It's good to read some of his other work to "clean your palate" of Tolkien's image on pop culture, which was distorted by adaptations and derivative works into unecognizability

>>50091027
If you want something funny, try some Terry Pratchett. I find the Death series pretty humerus.

>>50091237
I can never find a print version of Fafhrd and the Grey Mouser

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>>50091027

I'm not sure if it quite counts as fantasy, as it kind of blurs the line between fantasy and sci-fi, but really, read Lord of Light.

lies of Locke Lamora, the Gentlemen Bastards series.

Kind of a mix of fantasy with Ocean's Eleven.

>>50093213
Very this.
It's a great mix of Sci-Fi and psychic powers with bits of Hindu mythology mixed in, along with a great main character.

This is the book that got Neil Gaiman started on his "modern gods" kick.

I'm gonna hijack this thread for my own request. What books might any of you recommend if I wanted something with the feel of, like, The Princess Bride, or Ladyhawk? Something that would resonate with your inner conception of a hypothetical "generic" fantasy?

>>50092044
These are shit.

>>50092234
>Herman Mieville
You just combined China Mieville (the author you mean, though yes, he's a dude) with Herman Melville, the Moby Dick guy.
That's actually quite impressive a fuck up.

>>50093013
I appreciate your pune, or play on words.
And yeah, Pratchetts good for funs and characters.

>>50091174
Also seconding Abercrombie, bretty good series, lots of nice action and assholish characters

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>>50093213
>zelazny

One of the most amazing science fiction and fantasy authors. He's done so much for the genre that most people will only ever feel echoes of, and that's a bit of a shame.

>>50091027
>Hello. /lit/ is useless.

You know they have a thread dedicated to fantasy and sci-fi you useless retard.

>>50091027
The Traitor Batu Cormorant.

Fuck that was so good.

>>50097977
Baru* Cormorant.

>>50097977
Why was it good?

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Chapter 2 alone is worth the price of the entire book.

>>50098017
The writing's extremely solid, and when you look past the prose (which is something I generally don't do, because plots are generally relatively uninteresting), there is actually some depth to the novel. It's both a book looking at imperialism from economical and ideological standpoints and a character study of the titular character, with small personal dramas and larger-than-life consequences to her choices.

And it's a complete story in one book (it's very sad I have to say this when it comes to fantasy lit).

Also, if you can read French, 'Gagner la guerre' by Jean-Philippe Jaworski is supremely rewarding to read.

>>50091027
I wouldn't know quality literature from a hole in the ground, so I'll just recommend you some stuff I enjoyed reading.

The True Game by Sheri S. Tepper
The Chronicles of Morgaine
The Rose of the Prophet trilogy
The Sovereign Stone trilogy
The Redemption of Althalus
Chronicles of the Kencyrath
The Spellsinger series (at least the first 6 books, I haven't read the other two)
The Barbed Coil
The Bartimaeus trilogy
Heroes of the Valley

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>>50092579

I've been looking for more high seas piracy, any suggestions?

>>50098082
Alright, that *does* sound good. Thanks for the recommendation!

I have a friend who's enthusiastically been trying to get me to read the "Gentleman Bastards" books for years now. Never had the time, but this seems like the right thread to ask if I should bother actually making the time one of these days

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>>50091027
Wheel of Time

gets lot of hate, but it is excellent if you have patience to understand longer plotlines and are capable of understanding that some characters evolve and grow over +10 books instead of instantly starting as likeable. Lots of politics and prophecies, you cannot have action non-stop. The first 6 are action filled, then comes a "winter break" of ~4 books with more plotting and talking, until the last 4 start rolling towards the big final encounter; and it's worth it

>>50098991
Why does the Discworld one fade out?

>>50098898
Yeah, they're worth a read, they're quite fun (the ocean's 11 comparison anon made is good) but still fairly brutal and grounded, if that makes sense. Fairly low fantasy, and I thought the setting (psuedo-venetian merchant city) was interesting, we don't see that much.

If it helps, the first book doesn't end on a cliffhanger or anything (in fact most don't, instead being self-contained stories) so you needn't feel you're committing to having to read the full set like with some fantasy series. I'd say read the first one and see how you go.

>>50098991

WoT for me was funny. I thought they were fucking AMAZING when I was reading them. Now, looking back, I'm not so hot on them. Some of it was the author dying and the last books being by Sanderson whom I don't like nearly as much, but I think a lot of it is that one of the things I really liked about WoT was the cleverness, the wordplay, the mythological references. I remember calling to my friends back in high school that Rand was going to lose a hand somewhere down the line because RJ has spent too much time building the three of them up as Odin, Thor, and Tyr, and of course, Tyr has to lose a hand. I loved the puns about the "Fischer" king, and the parallels to Australian aboriginie myth and the wolf dream.

But it's hard to keep attached to that kind of cleverness, and it compensated for a lot of other weaknesses.

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>>50099192
the worldbuilding, prophecies, "good people" opposing the heroes left and right, "bad people" often aiding/guiding/pushing them towards certain paths, "grey" characters everywhere who are pissed at the idea of Dragon coming to "save" them.
WoT is next level political bickering compared to the plotting people find alluring in ASOIAF.

for example, the worldbuilding; out of the starting continent, we have POVs from almost every nation and every important city or so. It's actually odd to have a large fantasy world, with most nations actually serving a purpose in the story that we can witness firsthand through POVs.

I too wish Jordan had lived long enough to finish the series, but Sanderson was definitely good enough, Jordan was getting too caught in the worldbuilding at times, not advancing fast enough and it showed. A lot worse authors could have been found to finish the series, I think Sanderson wrote it to end as well as possible for someone who was not Robert Jordan himself.

>>50092201
>I suppose for The Kingkiller Chronicle, the writing style is quite "dense" and makes it annoying to push through. The pacing has an odd tendency to just rub me the wrong way. Yes, he gets to a lot of the events that are alluded to but it's always in a oddly meandering way.

I had the opposite reaction. I found his writing style to be the best part. The plot was okay, basic but overall competent, but the writing style just grabbed me and refused to let go.

This is why /tg/ needs to lay off speaking about books in absolute terms, by the way. Sometimes the thing you hated a book for is the same thing that someone else recommends it on.

>>50099192
>>50099320
I tried to like WoT, but I couldn't get over how fucking stupid every single aes sedai character was. They were all written like shallow, idiotic high school girls, yet apparently we're meant to believe they're the paragons of wisdom in the setting.

>>50099320

Disagree about Sanderson being good enough. Again, he lacked that cleverness, the subtlety that made WoT work for me. I almost threw it down in disgust when he had Perrin forge a new hammer and name it "M'hallanir" or however you modified "Mjolnir". That, and well, he completely eliminated some rather key things that Jordan was building up, most especially that it would be the three of them and their ta'veren natures that would be the key to winning at the end, not Rand's dragon powers or Mat's battle luck.

>>50099347

>yet apparently we're meant to believe they're the paragons of wisdom in the setting.

I never got that vibe. Every source about how they're the paragons of wisdom come from the Aes Sedai themselves.

They're magical bullies, little more.

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>>50099347
>yet apparently we're meant to believe they're the paragons of wisdom in the setting.

That is the official White Tower stance when promoting themselves to the general public. Don't trust the witches, listen to the Whitecloaks.

Jordan imagined how feminism would work in a wizard fantasy setting where women get to call the shots and have all the power and influence; the resulting infighting and internal plotting is just fantastic.

then again, it serves as a plot device, so that our heroes can "fix" things

also not sure how deep you got into the series; even Aes Sedai have been falling to Dark Side, and many of them are fucking things up on purpose from the inside. It's a conscious plan by the baddies to make the Aes Sedai hilariously incompetent.

>>50099347
Isn't that the whole point? They're spoken of as paragons of wisdom and power but they are in fact bickering idiots just like everyone else. Their wisdom is a myth perpetuated by themselves to keep them in power.

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>>50099386
>.
pretty sure Sanderson was following Jordans quite gigantic amount of notes when writing the last 3 books.
Perrin forging "M'ahalleinir" or whatever it was, definitely Jordan trying to borrow from Nordic mythology. Also that chapter was pretty awesome as fantasy writing about forging magical weapons go.

Jordan might have tried to weasel in a dozen more minor subplots, which would not likely alter the actual outcome in any way.
then again, Jordan and his war experiences would have written an even more awesome Last Battle chapter.

>tfw we will never get to read the WoT the way it was meant to be

>>50099417
>>50099420
I got that there's an element of satire to it, but it made the books really annoying to read whenever there was an aes sedai on screen. They're THAT fucking stupid.

As for how far I got, the chaps across the ocean had turned up and slightly invaded. I think the last thing that happened in the last book I read was a wall fell on Matrim. Can't remember which book that was though.

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>>50099499
end of book 7, Seanchan invade Ebou Dar, a building collapses on Mat

Aes Sedai are modelled a bit after Vatican. The original purpose of religious communes was to offer aid, help and religious healing to those who are needy, poor and suffer.
2000 years later they have gilded churches, abuse kids, participate in political corruption and who knows what.
Yeah, the original White Tower ideals have been altered over 3000 years, and now they are stupid as hell and barely a remnant of their former might and wisdom.
Which only makes for a more interesting plot, instead of having wise helpful women solve everything for our main heroes.
(Reds putting Rand in a box and torturing the Dragon who is supposed to save them... probably not what the ancient Aes Sedai would have expected to happen when the prophecies come finally true)

>>50098991
I had a completely different experience when reading Wheel of Time. The writing was very shallow, constantly using repeating mannerisms (tugging braids anyone?) and the characters started running into an indistinguishable blob after four, five book. I seriously could not have which one of them was talking without them being called by name, they were all so samey. The worst problem was that the books had tons of padding, just walls of text with nothing happening and people being vaguely annoyed at each other for no particular reason. And the world wasn't even original, the writer just shamelessly put in whatever tropes he could get in his hands and called it "foreshadowing". It's a long series but that's not a good thing when it's a tedious slog.

>>50092391
Getting through those three books was a fucking test of endurance, but the ending of the first trilogy was so good I actually cried. Does Thomas become a fuckup again somehow in the next two trilogies? Because I really, really don't want that. He was the most damaged protagonist I've ever seen, and yet he clearly didn't want to be a monster. I felt so bad for him.

>>50092160
The minor rut in book 7 is more than made up for in the latter half of book 8 though. Holy shit.

I'm surprised that nobody has mentioned The Deepgate Codex by Alan Campbell. Three books-- Scar Night, Iron Angel, and God of Clocks-- the series is an amazing read but it's some grimdark shit of the highest order.

Zimiamvian Trilogy & The Worm Ouroboros by ER Eddison.

Other than that, the usual stuff - Malazan book of the fallen, the black company (only the books of the north though, imo),

>>50092162
>dry
I'd argue that the setting is the reason why Glen Cook's writing seems dry. It's written like a soldier's log, about men and women who endure shit as a matter of course. It's supposed to be dry.

Yeah, you could art up the idea of war and conflict in a fantasy setting - God knows thousands of writers already have - but few series have made me consider what it must be like being in the shit of a brutal magic-fueled war like The Black Company did.

It's not perfect, but what series ever is?

>>50100698
>the books of the north
Same. I didn't mind the others, but the North series is the best, in my opinion.

>>50091027
The Chronicles of Amber, bur Roger Zelazny. Preferably just Corwin's cycle, but Merlin's Cycle is... alright, I guess.

>>50098991
>That Discworld
Whoever made this char is a fucking asshole.
>>50099015
Alzheimer's.

Anyone read The legend of Drizzt? Are they worth reading?

The Well of Echoes series by Ian Irvine was good back when I read it.
Interesting magic system, magic potential is stored in mineral deposits and crystals mined from veins underground, and they rely on fields of magic produced by Nodes deep below the earth. Casters suffer after effects dependant on the spells, even for simple spells.

>>50101075
The series that came after was serious bad tho. Nish was a fucking chode.

How about the Edge Chronicles? Fuckin' airshiiiiiips!

>>50099802

Yes and no. He has issues, but he's much more put together than he was in the first trilogy. He's not all happy McFunFace everything is going to work out great, and he does some more questionable things, but it's mostly about how the new protagonist is the wreck and Covenant tries to help her out.

The Wizard Knight
Book of the New Sun
Chronicles of Amber
The Fionavar Tapestry
The first three Earthsea books
Viriconium

>>50091027
Honestly, Tolkien's non middle earth writing doesn't get nearly the exposure it should. Of his other works, I would particularly recommend Farmer Giles of Ham.

>>50091242
>To be a good author you have to serve in the army.
t. Heinlein

>>50091820
Depends on the book. The first Mistborn trilogy was tolerable, Stormlight Archive is just too long to be worth reading, and the second Mistborn trilogy compensates for bad writing with cowboy wizards(it's worth a read, honest), but Elantris was actually a genuinely good book.

>>50092008

The first book was actually pretty based if you wanted a better thought out Harry Potter for older audiences, but then the second book happened.

>>50092207
A thousand times this.

>>50092905
Definitely this. Children of Hurin was serious, humourless and generally darker than LotR, and that really helped the whole 'Scandinavian tragedy' thing Tolkien was aiming for.

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>>50097729
>Black company
>shit

>>50097793
Have you seen /lit/? It's all hipsters who hate everything 'mainstream' and love YA 'novels'.

>Fritz Leiber, the Fafhrd and Grey Mouser books
>Guy Gavriel Kay's stuff (start with Lions of Al Rassan)
>Elizabeth Moon's Paksenarrion books

>>50097977
It was truly a fantastic book. Although I expect some people might get pissy about its content.

>>50102061
Is it? Last time i checked they were college freshman/sophomores who despised any type of genre ficiton.

>>50092376
That sounds fucking rad.
I'll check it out right now.

As for the Brian Sanderson hate, I did read the mistborn trilogy recently.
It was ok, /tg/ would like it because of the well thought out magic system.
The first book is an interesting heist story, overall it was pretty cool. If I stopped there I would have been happy.
The second two were ok, and a little unnecessary.

Everybody recommends Dune and for good reason.
But it is technically scifi.

A good friend of mine recommend Prince of Thorns.

>>50101942
>but Elantris was actually a genuinely good book.

Not him, but a book in which someone is told to convert an entire country to a new religion in 3 months, and all the people involved seem to think this is a reasonable timetable has a real stretch to being called a good book.

Elantris is probably the worst insofar as it's "Sanderson tries to write a non-earth based medeivalish fantasy where everyone actually thinks and talks like middle class Americans".

>>50091118
seconding this anon. Malazan is a journey.

>>50100791
No.

>>50102106
They've become even worse since I last visited.

>>50102126
I don't remember the actual character expecting to convert the country. It was more like " you either convert or we invade".

>>50102126
It had a lot of problems, but it was Sanderson genuinely trying to write what he wanted to and not churning out several multi-volume series in order to make money. It had a whole lot of promise, and Sanderson didn't really deliver on it.

>>50100791
The books aren't that good. unless you read them for the setting. Also those calling him a Mary Sue are overreacting, since he consistently fails in most things not combat.

>>50102198
If you want a single book story I'd say The Emperor's Soul is much better.

>>50102115
Some people find the Prince of Thorns kinda edgy.

>>50102115
>>50102280
>Prince of Thorns
Jorg had a hard life.
Also dont believe the people that say the books are "edgy". There are indeed some disturbing scenes, more so in the first book, but overall the trilogy is a journey i would advise people to take.

>>50102180

It's been a long while and I gave my copy away, but I seem to remember Hrathen thinking his task was doable, and giving an honest effort to try to convert at least the aristocracy.
>>50102198

Oh, I don't dispute that, but tone aside, Sanderson actually reminds me of Moorcock. They both really excel on the "stuff" of fantasy. They make really cool magical systems, and items, and powers. Characters are weaker but still pretty good, and the world as a whole is mostly slapped together after that in order to create opportunities for more cool shit to happen.

It's not really how I like things styled myself, which is probably why I'm not a huge fan of either author, but I will give credit where it's due. To be honest, I think Sanderson would be a GREAT RPG setting writer, and I think one of the reasons he's so popular on /tg/ is because of that.

>>50102076
Well, it's ultimately about politics, of course it will going to anger some people. But I think it's nicely handed enough not to make the more level ones just throw it in the bin.

>>50102322
>They both really excel on the "stuff" of fantasy.
Man, this is exactly that. Though I disagree with Moorcock being all surface appeal.

I like the Temeraire series, although it only barely counts as fantasy. In essence, its premis can be summerised as "How would the Napoleanic wars have played out if dragons were real?"

>>50091027
Book of the crow

I feel sort of weird about recommending Kingkiller Chronicles, but the reasons I feel weird about it haven't come up in this thread so I figure I'll mention it.

The first book is pretty good. The main character is telling the story, which immediately made me assume that half of what he was saying was horseshit - and that really eased off the Mary Sue problem a lot of fantasy protagonists fall into, for me. It was fun, it wasn't exactly heavy, and you kind of learn to hate the Generic Love Interest Girl really fast because she's an obviously awful person and Kvothe apparently wasn't ever taught not to stick his dick in the crazy among all the other shit he was taught as a child.

The first half of book two is alright. It's not great, but it's not bad. In general, the insane Magic teacher is easily the most fun thing in the series; he's like if Dumbledore didn't give a fuck about morality and just wandered around saying and doing crazy shit. The problem is that midway through Book Two there appears this incredibly stupid Asian culture that has superior karate and enlightened free love and nobody has ever beaten them in combat and a bunch of other shit that made me roll my eyes so hard they almost fell out of my head. Don't get me wrong, I'm okay with Asian cultures and awesome martial arts, but they're presented in such an obnoxiously self-righteous way that it's hard to remember that Kvothe is the one idolizing them. You wind up going "ugh, how incredibly pretentious" every time any of them talk.

Also at one point he fucks a goddess of love so good she wants more of him. That was just (no pun intended) fucking terrible.

But aside from that stuff it's pretty interesting, and it has an interesting narrative *outside* Kvothe's story that's kept me reading - specifically, just what the fuck is happening in the world around them while he's telling this story, which gets touched on every so often. I can't say it's good but I've certainly read worse.

>>50091027
Nausicaa of the valley of the wind.
it's a manga but it's just about better than anything else mentioned here except LotR

>>50103447

I'm also deeply in love with Roger Zelazny, and not just Amber, but Lords of Light and his little-known Wizard World (Changeling & Madwand). Zelazny is just good, imaginative fantasy that dances around the line of what fantasy should be. It's neither hopeful nor grim - it just is, and lets you make what you want of it, which I respect immensely. Amber is the only fantasy book series I've ever seen with an apocalyptic battle where no chosen prophecy happened and nobody stepped up to save the universe, it just sort of happens accidentally and then everyone shrugs and goes "yeah okay" and goes home. It's unique. I actually think I liked Wizard World even more, wherein he does a Technology vs. Magic thing, and the guy who has to save everybody from the evil machinist with an army of robots is the exiled son of the prior dictator.

Scott Lynch's Gentleman Bastards, at least the first book. The most creative fantasy swearing I've ever seen, set in Fantasy Venice, about Fantasy Mafiosos. It's not deep or anything but it's fun and the world is pretty.

>>50103502
Not to be a weeabo faggot, but he's not wrong

>>50100698
>>50100724

What did you guys think of The Silver Spike?

>>50091027
Reposting a decent review of this someone gave last week.

The magic system (there are actually several inter-related magics in the series) is interesting in so far as it possesses well explained concrete rules about how it functions and the costs associated with it which makes for very tense drama that allows the reader to always have a pretty strong grip on what characters can or can't do with their abilities but still be surprised when someone thinks of a novel way to utilize them. Or to recognize when someone is clearly breaking the magic rules somehow.

The second point often raised is that the society of the setting integrates the existence of this magic into its structure fairly well in every aspect from religion to architecture to warfare and politics.

The story itself is pretty good too, if a little predictable. I'm never sure if Sanderson is really good at foreshadowing and I just read it too well from being genre savvy or if he overplays his hand too early in all his books.

Also, some of his characters are fairly one-dimensional. He got a bit better in some of his later books.

>>50103811

This is pretty accurate. Sanderson really is more about the world than the characters. He's a good worldbuilder. His characters leave a bit to be desired.

>>50102322
he though that he had been given a shitty, nigh impossible task, but that a 'headshot' conversion of the aristocracy might be a way to pull of a hail mary win.

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>>50091027
im still working my way through the first book, but iv got to say I like His majesty's dragon so far, it does a nice job of worldbuilding, answering almost all the questions iv come up with, its fairly realistic, well as realistic as a setting with dragons can be, and the characterization is pretty good as well.

>>50091995
Yeah, that one was quite good, you felt the gritty combat and desperation of it all.
One series than I liked was the Traitor Son be Miles Cameron. The setting seems rather meh at first but it has some pearls, but the battles were awesome. The characters are decent and the Rythm is quite good, but some points of view are boring as fuck.

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>>50091027
The Codex Alera by Jim Butcher.
Butcher's an amazing writer, in my opinion.

I wanted to like Lies of Locke Lamora so much, but it's just so aimless, badly paced and inconsistent in tone.

Also, is Terry Brooks supposed to be good? Because I've read a bit of the High Druid's Blade and I'm honestly baffled how this was ever a bestseller. The writing is terrible! The main character has no personality, almost every action is told instead of shown, it has the most predictable Chosen One narrative I've ever seen... god, I could go on and on. If it wasn't for the fact that the main character's sister almost gets sold into sex-slavery within the first three chapters, I could almost believe that this was written for pre-schoolers, it's so bad.

Anyone knows any fantasy book with a Conquistador like setting? A bunch of adventures stumble into uknown lands and conquer it and stuff.

>>50104615
You hate that? DO NOT read Lightbringer by Brent Weeks. The main character is so ridiculously overpowered that literally NOTHING is capable of posing them any sort of threat. And they're railroaded into the Chosen One thing really, really quickly. It uses a fucking cliché to do it, too.

>>50104626
The first thing that springs to mind is the Maztica trilogy, from the TSR Forgotten Realms line. It's literally the conquest of not-Americas, with a mercenary unit sailing off to fight jaguar and eagle warriors.

>>50104670
Yeah I read it already. IT was a bit meh tough.

>>50091118
>>50102134
Thirding this. Best thing is that it will last you an extremely long time.

>>50092107
>Nothing but praise can give a false image and have me waste a couple hours reading trash.
I feel your pain, anon.
I got rused into getting Free the Darkness, and it turned out to be the absolute worst book I've ever read, and that's not hyperbole.
Admittedly, I usually have a low tolerance for shit books, and this one, to it's credit, managed to string me along before revealing the height of its wish fulfillment powerlevel

>>50092064
>>If you dislike a book or series someone else has recommended, shut your goddamn mouth and post about a book you do like.
Nah, I come to /tg/ because it's not a candy-coated hugbox.

>>50092201
>>If you dislike a book or series someone else has recommended, calmly and concisely explain why.
This.

If hate a book. I'll explain that it's because it used the phrase "excresences of horriplilation" and was unabashedly just one book in a serial, with little attention paid to giving it any real ending.

>>50100738
I agree with this post entirely.

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>>50098991
>mfw finding out Paolini's writing a new one

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I just spent the last week of my life slogging through this slow paced waste of time. I just wanted a damn modern fantasy setting that didn't involve vampire boyfriends, paranormal investigators, or retarded "I'm just a normal kid but my daddy was Zeus" plots.

Is the next book of The Magicians even worth it? There was only one or two likable characters in the entire first book.

>>50097793
>You know they have a thread dedicated to fantasy and sci-fi you useless retard.
>>50102061
>>50102106
>>50102170
>/lit/
I'd only ever been once before.
I just checked it out since you guys got me curious.
You know what really helped my appraisal of their fantasy and Science fiction thread?
Lovecraft.
/tg/ has had a Lovecraft thread for a while now and so does /lit/.
I stuck my head in the Lovecraft thread before checking out the fantasy and sci-fi.
It was very /b/ in there.
I was just grateful that a quarter of the fantasy thread actually had opinions and discussion after seeing that trainwreck.
I don't remember any decent opinions, but there were much less posters deserving of immolation, pretentiousness aside.

This is why I don't go out into other boards.


Magic of Recluse is good, but I haven't read all of the series.

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>>50091027
Every "recommend me a book, /tg/" thread until you like it.

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>>50104498
FUCK the Codex Alera. An interesting world with an interesting cast of characters and an interesting magic system that gets absolutely SHAT ON by a completely flat and unlikeable mary sue (in the actual, factual definition of the word and not just the 'character I dislike' definition) main character and his emotionally retarded mother.

I don't hate the Codex Alera because it's poorly written, I hate it because it's so much pissed away potential. Literally every other character is reasonably well-rounded and written in a pretty believable fashion, but Tavi and Isana fuck all that right up.

>>50105164
Dresden Files?

>>50097740
Thirding Abercrombie, if for nothing more some of the best quotes.
"An open mind is like an open wound, painful and prone to infection."

>>50104626
The waking fire is largely set in fantasy Africa where the main characters are looking for a mythical white Dragon that will hopefully solve the looking world energy crisis by using it as what is essentially a living oil rig.

Abhorsen and Discworld?

>>50092230
Not that annon, but I listened to it as an audio book, which always makes it easier to get into denser works. Though I also liked it for most of the reasons the actual annon said >>50092288
Actually having a complicated internal history always makes me more interested in historical fiction.

>>50092903
The third is better then the second, and the fourth is at around the same level as things seems to be leveling out. The second felt a bit rushed and didn't really work. I am hoping it is an outlyre. The first book is definitely the best of the four I have listened to though.

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Whenever these threads come up, I always recommend the Chronicles of Ethshar by Lawrence Watt-Evans, if you can find it.

It's a bit old and in some ways outdated, but still good. Particularly if you like magic systems and world building.

It was the first fantasy series that I read by myself when I was very young and it really influenced the way I think about magic in fantasy and the way I build worlds for my games.

It might not be all that well written, but he does a good job of setting up the magic system rules without it feeling like a slog to read through, and then he manipulates those rules in clever ways to solve problems. I think he's one of the better people at writing interesting protagonists who are magic users of some sort, possibly owing to his rigid magic rules.

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The Ketty Jay Adventures, /tg/. The best "action"-books I've ever read. It's about a bunch of lowlife, misfit fuckups crewing an airship, the Ketty Jay, getting by on odd jobs, some legal and some not. They get tangled up and in over their heads with various conspiracies, evil plots and daemonic curses, and with luck, determination and desperate crazy plans somehow survives.

The action is great, but it's biggest selling point would be the main characters and their development. Over the course of the first book they go from being a bunch of strangers running from their pasts together, drinking and working together but not really caring about eachother, to a close crew that has each others backs. Many of them have tragedies in their past (generally their own damn faults, too) that they come to terms with over the course of the books.

The setting is pretty decent. It's some sort of late 1800's with airships and a bit of mysticism (One of the crew is a deamonologist, and he brought a golem with him). It's far from very original, and clearly built for the purpose of housing high adventure plots, but I enjoyed what whats shown of it.

Tldr; Airships! High adventure! Interesting characters! pirates! Daemons! Evil conspiracies!

>>50104498
Butcher is garbage, and once you get out of middle school and actually read beyond the young adult and paranormal romance sections of Barnes and Nobles, you'll appreciate that.

>>50105026
I have the cycle sitting on my shelf slightly above and to the left of my computer. This is not praise, not a token reminder of some halcyon days of youth or any such. No, the cycle is their to remind myself that I was a stupid shit when I was younger. That was the first series were I realized how shit it was as I was reading. It was around the point I noticed the third book wasn't the end because he needed to rap up the shiton of hanging plot threads. From there I started noticing all of the bullshit from which the story was made. I still read the fourth book, finishing the cycle. By the end I could clearly see all the cliches and plotholes. I may have started to pick up on such in Harry Potter at around the same age, but I still came out liking the overall story.

The inheritance cycle sits there on its shelf, reminding me that some fiction can be shit. Even popular fiction can be really, immensely, horrifically bad. They remind me that I now know better.

So, finally, I can resist my impulse to buy whatever that asshole shits out. Fuck that shit, fuck that shitty movie, and fuck that man's lack of an editor.

>>50105825
With a single spell and the winged girl are in the same setting right? Both great books.

>>50106032
>With a single spell
Yeah
>the winged girl
You mean Taking Flight?

Also, I just checked up and it turns out Watt-Evans is still writing Ethshar books. I'ma get right on that.

>>50091242
Now, i have never read The Way of Kings but the Mistborn series have, in my opinion, one of the most original magic systems out there. It is really quite good.

>>50091242
>Tolkien and fat-fuck GRRM were both former soldiers

GRRM was an objector. He did some sort of service work instead.

>>50091932
FUck you you ingrained degenerate, Skub is the fucking best shit and you fucking know it. The way it appeals to the people who are good from the deepest part of the heart is the one true way for Skub to attain godhood and you fucking know it. Anti-Skubbers are holding us all back, think how amazingly far we would have gotten without them, there is truly no limit to what we could achieve. Instead you insist on acting like a good damn monkey opposing a system for merely existing. How would you like it if people opposed you for no reason, hmm? Although i admit to Skub having a few weaknesses it does not deserve the godawful amount of poison it gets from you guys, and its positive aspects far outweighs the negative ones. I fucking hate Anit-Skubbers you are all a fucking waste of space.

>>50106179
Ironically, the Way of Kings is Sanderson's epic fantasy novel series that he loves more than anything. It's riddled with horrible choices like tons of flashbacks, four unrelated plots in tandem, extremely slow pacing, and a hard wall of weird phenomena in this strange world you have to pick up on as you go. It it suffers a bit from his outline writing style where he has important plot landmarks to hit and character motivations are written after the fact to suit the needs of the plot manifesting as lots of internal dialogue and rerationalizing and reframing views on the parts of the main characters.

The story itself is actually decent and his writing style is pretty cinematic. You can tell he likes action. I like his character writing better in this book than in Mistborn and several of the miniplots are quite interesting and the slow discovery of the magic systems are way better than being told lecture style how everything works. But the pacing is all over the place and makes it really hard to follow, constantly jumping from character to character AND having lots of flashbacks and dream sequences.

Also, the second book in the series commits one of my personal pet peeves in having a character backside on their development from the first book. And while some plots pick up the pace a lot the ones you'll actually be interested crawl along at a snails pace before wrapping up super quickly all at once. But it is nice to have all the characters come together and connect the plots and start to answer some of the bigger setting mysteries.

Third book is not out yet.

>>50105731
I would actually rate the series 1>powergap>2>4>3. I really didn't care for The Fear Institute. I actually just this moment realized Book 5 is out on audiobook. Neato.

>>50091027

Lies of Locke Lamora, The Last Wish.

>>50091027

Berserk

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>>50091027
Recently finished Malazan Book of the Fallen and I would heavily recommend that if you're looking for a super chunky fantasy epic. Weighing in at 3.3 million words, it has some pacing issues at times but overall it's a wonderful trip through a well-thought-out fantasy world full of interesting, larger-than-life characters.

As a warning, you aren't going to know what the fuck is going on until about halfway through book 2.

>>50105363
The books kinda go down in quality though, you can tell when the author was going through a breakup.

for fantasy I like Brent Week's shit

The Night Angle trilogy is great and then his new one the Lightbreaker series or some shit is good new one is coming out this year I think, if you want mindless endless fun I like the R.A. Salvitore stuff, the 8 million some odd Drizzit books he has that you can read for ever

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I like the Ahborsen series. Pretty YA Fantasy for the most part, but a very unique take on Necromancy.

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Finished pic related a while ago. It was good for a first fantasy novel.

His other two series are good. The Monster Hunter books were Correia's first published books, the first one is kind of clunky but they get better as the series progresses.

His alt history/noir series felt like it was more planned out than the monster hunter books. Didn't have the same problems as the early monster hunter books. The ending of the trilogy was less than it could have been, but I think he had to do that to leave the world open for the next trilogy so certain characters/their children could return and the two great powers could face off.

>>50106425
Drizz't is basically baby's first fantasy for half the people I know. It's archetypal fantasy nowadays.

As for Brent Weeks, I like him but his writing particularly in the night angel is... underdeveloped, it's interesting reading his books and seeing his writing style grow. In saying that I own most of his books, and enjoy them because they read differently from my usual fair.

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Don't read Mark Lawrence if you want to be satisfied at the end. I've enjoyed the beginning and body of each of his trilogies but the man can not write a satisfying ending to save his life.

>>50105868
This. Butcher and his books are the cheesy 80s action movie of fantasy literature, enjoyable and occasionaly awesome, but it folds quickly under any sort of scrutiny or criticism.

>>50106581
Fun reads though, you can't deny that.

>>50092053
>staveley
>good

Read Earthsea, Book of the New Sun, The Black Company and Malazan, OP.

>>50098991
*tugs braid*

>>50106581
Biggest problem I had back when I was reading them was that they all felt like the same book. I read three or four of them and they all followed the same pattern so closely it seemed pointless to pick up another one.

>>50106441

The Old Kingdom series (Technically what it's called. Especially since Nicholas Sayre and the Creature in the Case basically was Abhorson free) is fantastic.

I've basically stolen how Death works wholesale from it for a game I run.

>>50106620
You can deny it easily, because you essentially have to be unbelievably tolerant and permissive to actually think any of the shit he writes is "awesome", rather than just "things that people consider awesome stapled together and then mangled until anything that could have once been awesome is now just a distorted ruin of lost potential."

He's the worst kind of author, the kind that has no shame and tries to pander, but is just so inept at the craft that he can't even follow through with the easiest of tropes without dashing them against the rocks.

He's a bad nerd writer who writes for bad nerd readers.

>>50106650
Yep, that's true. Hell my problem is i lack the ability to properly criticize literature while i'm reading it. You could hand me Twilight and if i didn't know how bad it was beforehand, i wouldn't notice even the most obvious of flaws.

>>50106627
I forgot Zelazny's Amber.

To recommend something that hasn't already been suggested, Cecilia Dart-Thornton's Bitterbynde Trilogy.

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>>50106503
>'Excellent - on a par with George R.R. Martin'

>>50106817
i wonder how much having a quote from GRRM on your book, or even just his name on your book, is worth nowadays.

>>50106303
I listened to the audio book of way of kings since I do a lot of driving and I can honestly say I think having it read to you, Michael Kramer and Kate Reading so its quite well done, really helped my enjoyment of it. I think being able to just kinda zone out and listen helped not be bothered by the pacing and multiple different character stories all changing around. Plus the action scenes have much more tension this way.

Though I personally I do find many characters to be bordering on sue territory, its a damn fun read(or listen).

>>50106846
I don't know, but I hate how he's become 'the' mainstream example of fantasy fiction that normies flock to like fucking sheep. You can talk about Game of Thrones all you like, but if you mention say, Tolkien or Pratchett people just switch off on you. God help you if you mention anybody even less mainstream.

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>>50106846

>>50106686
>"things that people consider awesome stapled together and then mangled until anything that could have once been awesome is now just a distorted ruin of lost potential."
Can you give specific example please? Genuinely curious, since I've read the books and I'd like to see what you find horrendous.

And can you give an example that isn't Butters leading the zombie T-Rex?

Wish I hadn't used the skub pic earlier

>>50106859
Though I agree that many characters are very unrelateable and their motivations seem odd.

Honestly to me its just really fun and creative fantasy anime without the japan cringe factor. Like I would love to see a Ghibli movie based on the series or something. Or any studio that wouldn't add japan tropes like making everyone 16 or boobs everywhere and edgy unecessary armour designs and sephiroth villains.

Also side note. I originally was mad because I thought Kaladin was way too mary sue(I still think he is to an extent. Like making him such a skilled surgeon was un-necessary). But I was originally bothered by how young he was. Until I realized the series uses a different calendar than ours and in reality he would be around 26 in the series. Which is still young, but much better than 20.

>>50106919
I like the books, and I agree it's a bit tiresome. The constant chatter has kinda killed my interest in the forthcoming sixth book.

>>50106931
You can scale up and down as much as you like.

Wizards are cool, detectives are cool, combining them should be great, but all Butcher accomplishes is highlighting that being a slave to the detective story structure while also using a "it's whatever I need it to be" magic system leads to endless ad-hoc revisions in order to try to stamp out the endless amateur plot holes that come from such lazy world construction.

Or, we can go down, and consider the idea of vampires being arranged in courts, only for Butcher to use it in a nonsensical manner of organizing vampire species with one as a designated sacrifice to this main character's ego and the rest highlighting that Butcher's research tends to go not much further than reading a Wikipedia page.

It's like everything that could be a cool idea gets turned to crap by his touch.

>>50106650
If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

besides, it's more like they run an arc for a couple of books, and then things go fuck-crazy, and then he settles into a new arc

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>>50106920
>look down
>my sides are gone

>>50091118
Anomander Rake remains one my favourite characters from any fantasy novel, and you don't find out exactly how great he is until like 8 books in when you find out just how heavy Dragnipur is, both metaphysically and literally.

>>50107091
More like "If it's already done, don't do it again", I'd say.

>>50107091
It needs fixing.
Really, almost any book series listed in this thread comes from a better author.

>>50106961
I don't even mind GRRM's work. I wouldn't say he's a great writer, but he's kept me relatively entertained for many hours. The fact that he's going to go down as one of the most influential fantasy writers of the 21st century, though, is what grinds my fucking gears. There are so many better authors out there who didn't luck into that mainstream following despite deserving it more than the fat bastard.

>>50107161
What irks me is his voice.

His books are good, or at least the first one and the promise of what it could have been was.

But his voice makes me want to punch the man.

anything by K.J. Parker

Just don't expect it to be happy and life affirming. I read the Engineer trilogy back to back over the course of a couple of days, and while it was gripping I did feel somewhat emotionally drained afterwards.

I'm not talking about some edgy shit, nor is it the G.R.R. Martin tactic of 'which beloved character am I going to kill off next?'. It's just, well, okay at first but then the more you get into it and the more you think about it the more bleak it gets.

Perhaps better in small doses - I quite enjoyed Sharps (although again, not exactly happy).

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>>50107112
Best sword

BEST SWORD

>>50106375
>As a warning, you aren't going to know what the fuck is going on until about halfway through book 2.

I disagree. I thought Erikson did a good job of providing exactly enough context to let you know what you need to get on with the story. Sure, he doesn't explicitly tell you the Imperial Claws are the empire's group of elite assassins, but it's a fantasy novel and they're called the Imperial Claws; what the fuck did you think they were, a goddamn volleyball team? He doesn't pause to note that Warrens are extradimensional realms where magic is drawn from, but you can infer that by about the fifth time they're mentioned.

He doesn't give you enough understanding about the universe as a whole to write your own fanfiction by the end of the first book, but I think the "Malazan is really hard to get into, it's really confusing til the Xth book" meme is overblown. Erikson just does not infodump. That's what makes him a good author.

can someone explain the basic plot of Malazan to me?

I've been reading Michael Moorcock's stuff lately and I'm probably the only person on earth who hasn't already. I'm not a critic or a salesman but from a practical standpoint the individual books aren't very long so if you aren't having a good time you can just bail but there's plenty to read if you are into it.

>>50107355
I'm not saying it's a bad thing, I'm just saying it's something to expect. You don't get the context needed to fully grasp what is happening until you get a certain way into the series, and then everything begins to fit together in a very pleasing way. It's a good thing, but it can be jarring to people who are used to extreme exposition in the first few chapters of a book.

>>50106308
I can understand that. I happen to like lovecraft, so the fear institutes had a bunch of stuff that was pretty much written just for me.

>>50107438
That's a hell of a request given how overwhelmingly huge it is.

>>50103546
>Scott Lynch's Gentleman Bastards, at least the first book. The most creative fantasy swearing I've ever seen, set in Fantasy Venice, about Fantasy Mafiosos. It's not deep or anything but it's fun and the world is pretty.
It's often said Tolkien wrote novels to give the world he'd created something to do. I half suspect Scott Lynch wrote Gentleman Bastard so he'd have a place to put his profanity.

>>50105940
>Even popular fiction
Is it even still popular? It seems like it got big in Harry Potter's wake and people forgot about it once Pottermania died down. I hardly hear anyone talk about it anymore and even fewer people seem to have anything good to say

>>50107082
I disagree.
Outside the first two books, it's explicitly stated that magic is malleable to a great degree when used in rituals, but the evocations rarely fluctuate to a degree that violates internal consistency. Evocations tire him out, and what changes is his ability to make them more efficient, not his power level.

>only for Butcher to use it in a nonsensical manner of organizing vampire species with one as a designated sacrifice to this main character's ego and the rest highlighting that Butcher's research tends to go not much further than reading a Wikipedia page.
What does that even mean? The Red Court are the foremost antagonists for 7 books and are repeatedly stated to be escalating the conflict, of course they're going to eventually go too far. Are you saying you're not allowed to kill something off because you find it interesting? Are you saying that it was too OP?
I'm asking because I genuinely don't know, because it doesn't make sense when you consider it was a hoist by their own petard moment that nearly ripped the character apart, and nothing to do with ego stroking.

And as for the research, again, what does that mean? Pick and mix vampires deliberately intended to be distortions of public perceptions are naturally going to look somewhat derivative; that's the entire point. How the fuck did you even miss that?

>>50111297
I think he went the way of Myer, but since he wasn't stupid enough to alienate all his fans in the process, he might have more success in his attempt at revival.

I'm looking for nice classic fantasy YA fiction.

Some of what I like are:
The Hobbit by J. R. R. Tolkien
The Dark is Rising by Susan Cooper
The Chronicles of Prydain by Lloyd Alexander
Lone Wolf gamebooks by Joe Dever
A Wizard of Earthsea by Ursula Le Guin
Belgariad / Elenium and their respective sequels by David Eddings
Old Kingdom / Abhorsen by Garth Nix

Any recommendations similar to the above?

>>50112008
Pinocchio. And original collections of fairy tales. I'm not even joking.
>>50091027
Have you tried reading ancient mythology and epic poems? <most fantasy draws from those sources, go straight there.
If you don't mind poems go read Orlando Furioso.
How about books that aren't fantasy, but can gie the same feeling that fantasy books give off while being better written. Due to the presence of fantastical or supernatural elements, real or just perceived by the protagonists.
"To a God Unknown" and "The Pastures of Eden" by Steinbeck, The House of Spirits by Isabel Allende, One Hundred Years of Solitude by Marquez.
Check them out if you haven't read them already.

The fantasy trilogy Our Ancestors by Italo Calvino is a nice read too.


The Clan of the Cave Bear by Jean Auel is not fantasy ad has no fantastical elements but it's structure and narrative elements make it very similar to a fantasy story.

>>50112008
Check out David Gemmel.

>>50112166
>>>/lit/

>>50112462
w-what?

>>50092162
>>50100708
The first book was dryer than my late uncle's specia recipe crouton-and-beef-jerky trail mix that he used to make, before he died on that camping trip he went on due to dehydration. It was with subsequent books that the subject matter got so engrossing you didn't mind anymore, as well as Cook getting more comfortable with Croaker as the narrator and revealing more of his sardonic wit, and also varying up his narrators in even later books, that things got a bit more readable.

>>50107438
It's a 3.3 million word series that covers events in the lives of about as many named characters as in all of Shakespeare's plays combined, over a span of time that, in the case of some plots, stretches some 300,000 odd years.

No, anon. We cannot explain the basic plot of Malazan for you. Mortal summary cannot accomplish such a thing; it's a task more suited for Synopsus, Greek god of condensing stories.

>>50112595
>that things got a bit more readable.

I love the Black Company, but Bleak Seasons was an uphill struggle with the "unstuck in time" narration.

>>50112166
>narrative elements make it very similar to a fantasy story.
Yeah, her Mary Sue nature makes Ayla similar to the protagonist of the worst kind of wish fulfillment fantasy story. She's an incredibly gorgeous ingenue admired and wanted by everyone, and she was personally responsible for the domestication of the horse and dog as well as the invention of the travois, the sewing needle, and the flint-and-pyrite method of fire ignition. Also, the bra. And she's co-inventor of the atlatl. And also she's the first Cro-Magnon to intuit that fucking causes babies rather than spirits randomly making women pregnant.

Honestly, after the Plains of Passage I was just reading for curiosity to see if she'd wind up inventing crucible steel and moveable printed type. She was not a very believable protagonist.

>>50112841
I mentioned only the first book or a reason.
The others are good for the setting and atmosphere, but the main character does get unbearably marysueish

>>50107881
>>50112763
oh, okay. it's just that every time I want to get into it, and try reading a summary or something, it just seems like a bunch of gibberish and I lose interest.

guess I'll try to push through the first book again and keep reading until it starts making sense.

>>50097695
>The Princess Bride
>Generic fantasy

It's a comedic pseudo history. Not very much like a typical fantasy.

Just read Dragonlance.

>>50097695
Dragon Lords: Fools Gold is fairly generic.

Light hearted book about a bunch of people who get together to rob a dragon and accidentally start a rebellion.

>>50091910
>.gif
>So I can't zoom in

Why?

>>50112008
Can't forget the edge chronicles, anon.
You especially can't forget them at 2am, when the childhood trauma makes you wake up screaming.

>>50091576
Don't get your hopes up, it' aggressively mediocre.

>>50118189
aw, I was excited
how involved are the economics? has the author done their research and applied it to the fantasy genre in creative ways, or is it just 'yeah man there's like banks and stuff dude'?

>>50091467
I'm right there with you. None of the concepts he presents are novel enough to forgive his self-indulgence in Way of Kings. Mistborn is by far more readable thanks to more concise plotting and an understanding that the audience is there for an action-packed spectacle, not something thought-provoking. This plays well to his strength: thinking of things, not thinking them through. Over the course of 1,000+ pages ideas that are just "cool" rather than engaging spread thin, and since the audience must commit to memory a bunch of Sanderson's terminology to follow it, it becomes more chore than flight of fancy.
This is all to say that, while I've recommended Way of Kings to a friend, it was knowing full well they could enjoy the view without questioning their footing. I sampled his body of work after enjoying Mistborn, but haven't really liked a book of his since.

>>50118502
Meant to reply to: >>50106303

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>>50091242
>it dragged on for 1200+ pages

Oh goodness all of my friends love Brandon Sanderson, and where I can see where they're coming from (yes, it can get very clichéd at times), the biggest gripe I have with any of the books they try to throw at me is how long they are.

Don't get me wrong, I understand that sometimes you just can't leave anything out because it provides the book with artistic unity, but every five seconds you overly describe something so the book is super long (pic related), but COME ON. If it's commercial fiction, just grow a pair and leave crap out.

>>50102322

That's something I hadn't thought about. It all makes sense now.
Thinking about it, both of them created large multiverses full of several different fantasy worlds, with the same overarching themes and metaplot.

>>50103936
The only Sanderson character I ever thought was particularly well done was Kaladin the Paladin. He wasn't very realistic, for several reasons, and he should have been a bit older, in my opinion, but if Sanderson manages to bring his other characters up to that standard, he'll be a great author eventually.

>>50104615
Terry Brooks is really bad in general. I actually enjoyed Eragon more than I did Shannara.

>>50105601

The one thing you have to remember with Abercrombie is that he can't write women very well (he acknowledges this and is trying to get better), so avoid him if you hate unrealistic female characters.

>>50106650
It's kind of deliberate. It's aimed at fans of the old detective films, which were very cliched indeed, on the whole.

>>50106846
Nothing. It's on every book.

>>50119288
>it's bad on purpose!
That just means its purposely bad.

>>50098991
Firstly whoever decided to fade out the Discworld books is a prick of the highest order.

Secondly, this will be an unpopular opinion, but for all the clumsiness of world building and prose, I quite liked Paolini.

>>50112008
>Belgariad / Elenium and their respective sequels by David Eddings
>>50112008
This, Eddings wrote mental chewing gum so don't expect too much but they're very readable. The one thing I'll say is that if you compare the four trilogies you'll notice that they're the same in significant ways, he basically write one six book story twice.

>>50119120
>>50106953
Holy fuck this clears some things up.
Also, I really liked the idea of Kaladin being a skilled surgeon. It's in his name: Kaladin = Paladin and what makes paladins interesting is that they have both the power to hurt and the power to heal, but they're beholden to moral codes in order to ensure proper use.

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>>50119308
>bad

>>50112166
>>50112008
At least the fairy tales bit was good advice.

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>>50117924

>>50102321
The second book is fucking hilarious, Jorg is such a prick.

>>50119308
Because it's aimed at people who like bad things. Don't we all have guilty pleasures?

>>50119333
At least Paolini tried to be good. There's some authors who are far worse.

>>50091027
The Blue Sword and The Hero's Crown are both great stories.