>Fantasy setting >Aside from fantastical elements, things

>>50005100
>>Aside from fantastical elements, things behave consistently with the real world
Nice tautology, fag.

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>>50005100
>This is the worst shit.
Yes it is. Good luck finding anyone in this hobby who agrees.

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>>50005100
>"Why is that desert right next to lush forest?"
>"A magical disaster a thousand years ago"

Oh.

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>character described using the word "loli" who weighs 50 pounds uses a sword that weighs 500 pounds
>"it's magic lol"
>not affected by Dispel Magic or Antimagic Field

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>Player starts going on about his politics.

>>50008160
Do giants collapse in on themselves and die when they wander into antimagic fields, for lack of the impossible structural strength of their bodies?

>>50008218
The player said it was magic.

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>>50008076
ocean currents

>>50008076

I'd be cool with this if there was some backstory or adventure to it

Could be cool exploring some ancient underground lab to find out what went so horribly wrong

but nah

>>50008234
Can ocean currents do that?

I'm not being sarcastic, I actually don't know, and want to know.

>>50008238
Next time I do lazy mapmaking not only is that the excuse I'm going to use, but I'm also going to have a sidequest exploring why it happened and how not to repeat the disaster.

>>50005100
Dubs of vague.

>>50005100
>stop liking what I don't like!waaaah

Shit thread faggot, get fucked

>>50005100
If this was posted on any other board I would agree with you. People defending inconsistencies in published media with "it's magic lol" are the worst, but complaining about inconsistencies in someone's homebrew setting makes you a nitpicking faggot.

>>50008076
Doesn't that describe parts of Africa and Australia?

>>50005100
>Stop having the WRONG kind of fun

>>50008823
Truth. Cold deserts are a thing, too. Typically it just has to do with how 'dry' it is.

For example: Utah. Dry as fuck. Hot summers. Tons of snow in winter (at least until recently) but it's generally powder snow.

>>50005100
Could be worse, you could be posting in a thread where OP is being a faggot.
Shit.

>>50008076
That pretty much happens on Hawaii thanks to the Rain shadow.

>>50008218
>cast anti-magic on elves
>they cease to exist
Hm. Yes, this is interesting. Now let's test it on dwarves, typically not considered a magical species, and see what happens!

>>50008232
Do you typically allow your players to make super strong characters and justify it as "lolmagic" regardless of the setting and not found in any rulebook? Gotta say, that's a weird GM move.

>>50009147
Expand on the idea, write the novel, and I'll read it.

>>50008238
Well fucking ask why, I don't wanna jabber on about why theres a thing a bit off.

>>50008308
Salts not good for the soil.

Its why theres a spreading desert in Africa after all.

>>50009191
I can't remember one, but of it but one forgotten realms books (the magehound?) had a monster that ate magic and if it did this to elves it annihilated them and left behind ghostly silhouettes.

>>50009191
>gun wizard that uses bullets with basketball sized anti-magic field as weapons

>>50009638
Hmm, that gives me an idea. a 3.PF gunslinger/cleric could do all sorts of silly nasty things like that.

>>50005100
>Stop liking what I don't like

To the people/person saying 'omg it's just your preference' yeah no shit it's their preference people are doing something they dislike and they are complaining about it welcome to the human fucking condition.

But it's still pretty stupid if someone goes to all the trouble of making a setting that makes sense and has politics and money and maps and trade routes and racism and whatever, and then just puts big ol' glaring stupid shit because 'it's magic lol'. Better hope the entirety of all your players have that same 'magic = no sense' 1980's pulp fantasy blinker you do, because otherwise you just alienated one or more players and ruined their suspension of disbelief.

Going to all that trouble and then ruining it for some of your players is a waste of GM energy. I experience exactly the same thing as a GM when players try to argue with me about how it's 'fine' that they can do something incredibly stupid because 'magic' - guess what, those people don't get invited back, because they're ruining my fun, exactly the same as I don't go back to GMs who think 'lulrandumb' is a fine way to run a game.

Sure the opposite exists - some guy who wants to use some fake population metrics from 50 years ago in academic historical ethnography to try to poke 'holes' in some aspect of my setting - that kind of player totally does exist. Doesn't change that the 'derp magic lol' kind are far more common, and just as annoying.

>>50009638
That would be awesome actually, a called shot to the hand could render that hand completely useless for magic, and one to the head could instantly shut down a psion.

>>50009820

Sadly antimagic doesn't dispel effects that move through it, or you could 'shoot the spells out of the air'.

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>>50005100
>Build a large, deep, cohesive world for game
>Right down to the fundamental rules and interactions of magics A, B, C, etc.
>Players are aware from the start the characters are as new to this world as them
>There's going to be a lot of working this shit out

>Player 1 notices something amiss a few sessions in
>Hold back excitement, want to keep it natural
>Character rolls well enough, gets a sufficient amount of detail
>Eagerly awaiting the response of whatever the character can think of

>Player declares that it doesn't make sense OOC
>Agree, try to ask them what their character thinks of it
>Get interrupted with explanation why it doesn't make sense IRL
>Agree, try to shift conversation back to game
>Get interrupted with insistence that it shouldn't have happened
>Acknowledge their opinion, try to shift conversation back again
>Get interrupted with demands that it be retconned
>Other players start taking sides
>Night falls apart

>Get told a week later that they can't be expected to work things out with incorrect information

This kind of logic is always used to justify awful design choices like the Martial/Magic double standard. It's a plague on the hobby.

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>>50009949
Holy shit reading that made me angry.

>>50005100
>Fantasy: the faculty or activity of imagining things, especially things that are impossible or improbable.
>especially things that are impossible or improbable.
>things that are impossible or improbable
>impossible or improbable

>fantasy settings should be realistic

Do you see why you're retarded anon? Maybe with Sci-fi your complain is legitimate, but otherwise you're just being a nit-picky prick about some that is LITERALLY defined as being improbable or impossible. That's why fantasy exists, so we can have fun without having to worry about the rules of the real world.

>>50005100
>Fantasy setting
>Something happens that doesn't break any previously established rules of the setting
>But muh preconceived notions!

>>50008616
So its okay for something to be inconsistent because they did it themselves?

That's bullshit. And all you people actually defending this have low standards. 'Magic' existing does not turn a setting into a wacky free for all where non magical things don't have to be consistent and make sense.

>>50008076
Because the Rock are a scorpion after playing to Anubis.

>>50010016
Fantasy might not run on the same rules reality does, but it certainly requires internal consistency.

>>50009961
I don't see how lazy DM's and poor worldbuilding are used to justify that double standard.

Usually its used by retards to go 'Dragons exist so now nothing has to actually make sense and you should stop using your brain'.

>>50010052
>entitled faggot who's only responsibility is to show up wants to talk about standards

>>50008308
Well, the Atacama desert, the driest place on Earth (although the dry valleys of central Antarctica contest that claim), is located practically right next to the Amazon rainforest, which as you probably know is very wet. Both are next to the ocean, but on the side of the continent the Atacama desert is on, cold sea currents cause 99.9% of air mosture to condence into water far from the shore, so it never gets to the land. There's also a mountain range between the two, so no water from the Amazon can cross over, and any water in the air on that side rains down on as the air rises over the mountains and cools down.

>>50008775
There's usually transitional grasslands.

>>50010074
Yes, people are allowed to have standards and its absurd to act otherwise.

We aren't all so desperate to play any game at all that we will put up with shit.

>>50005100
>Magic exists
>There's a very specific spell book you can learn from
>Evil mages apparently do whatever the fuck they want with it

>>50009191
"The Magic Goes Away," Larry Niven.
A blatant oil allegory but thwere ya go.

>>50010016

'herp derp duck rainbow' is not storytelling

you're arguing everything needs to be nailed down to the last electron or nothing matters, which is about as true as any set of absolutes

>>50010074

It's people like you why I don't generally game with genpop.

The sheer cockgargling in that statement is immense. Fuck you for degrading my hobby.

>>50010228
Duck Rainbow is retarded.
Rainbow Duck is amazing.

>>50008218
Giants have metal bones, moron. Everybody knows that.

>>50009820
>a bullet to the head could instantly shut down a psion
It could shut anybody down, even without antimagic.

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>>50010559
you were saying?

>>50010565
Probably shrapnel or something.

>>50010043
>>Something happens that doesn't break any previously established rules of the setting
>>But muh preconceived notions!

>Nonsensical thing happens, inconsistent with established rules

Do you know how to read?

>>50010565
AK47s are like Samurai Jack's sword, only it works with all slavs.

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>>50010585
"Right between the eyes" is in fact the worst place to shoot a human being's head because that's where our skull's thickest. Couple that with the possibility that the bullet had traveled a great distance or passed through something and it would make sense that it couldn't penetrate fully.

Pic related.

>>50010585
whole bullet ricocheted

>>50009880
If that's not how your gun mage uses counterspell, you are a sad individual.

>>50010613
>"Right between the eyes" is in fact the worst place to shoot a human being's head

I dunno, man. In the cheek from the side seems worse.

Actually, I know a guy who got shot in the cheek from the front and lived.

>>50010589
He gave one example of a situation that happens, I gave another.

>>50005100
No wonder you assholes chased all the writefags off.

>>50010714
That's a good point, yeah.

Hell, the temple's not even a good spot if you're hoping to kill with one shot, since if you get the angle wrong you're just shooting through the visual center and blinding them.

>>50009949
I. Wow. I hope you killed them.

Not the PCs. The players.

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>>50005100

>All these fucking faggots who disagree with OP.

feels bad man.

OP is right you know. Just because its a fantasy setting doesn't mean you can just waive the internal consistency of the setting. Doubly so in a pnp game since a lot of the session hinges on the players being able to grasp and interact with their environment, which isn't very easy if you have no fucking clue how the environment is going to respond to your interaction.

A few practical examples of what I'm talking about:
>How do you sink a flying ship if its never established how a flying ship flies?
>How you stop the dragon from breathing fire if the source of their fire breath hasn't been explained?
>How do you know how you are supposed to cure a sickness when the conventional logic of using magical spells to cure diseases isn't working for no apparent reason

When world building, internal consistency and also a decent amount of GM to player transparency are two essential pillars of an enjoyable setting. Otherwise you end up with a setting like the one I played in, where the players were literally on rails all the game not because the GM actively stopped us from using abilities, but because there was literally no consistency or explanation to any of the magical phenomena or even the local cultures and economy of the setting, making it impossible to actually "grasp" the setting and using it.

>>50010616

Yeah that was my guess too.

>>50005100
If you should ever find yourself stranded in a far-flung fantasy realm, it can be helpful to consider your predicament scientifically. That is, approach situations with as few assumptions as possible, accept solid evidence when it is presented, and always be willing to admit you are wrong, and adjust your mindset accordingly.

This is actual science, which a tragically high number of strandees confuse with "acting like the world they're stranded in adheres to the exact same physical principles as their own". More than a few survivalists have been lead astray by compasses going haywire, several fledgling empires have been cut short when their founders discovered (too late) that their guns didn't work, and many, many would-be adventurers have gone to their graves saying "no dragon could fly with wings that smaAAAAAAAAAAAH!"

Don't be like those poor souls. Be smart. Be safe. Assume nothing.

>>50009949
Your mistake was putting that much work into shit that will never fucking matter.

>>50009949
I refuse to believe people are this dense, that they can't take a hint after several attempts and none other player just told him "Jesus, dude, answer his question and stop being an idiot".

I had similar situation when one player had a mental blackout and couldn't fit two simple pieces together, but the rest of the group (all of them) told him what's going on and we just laughed this off and continued playing. But I don't play with twats.

>>50008218
"Anti-magic fields" only work on some kinds of magic, and not others.

Have fun trying to work out what those kinds of magic have in common, and what separates them from magic that is immune to anti-magic!

>>50005100
>Aside from fantastical elements, things behave consistently with the real world
>Nonsensical thing happens, inconsistent with established rules

Gee, maybe it's a fantastical element that you've just never been exposed to before, you fucking moron.

>>50010788
GMs arent writing books m8.

Their only job is to make the game interesting or fun. Bitching about some detail not being consistent is just nitpicking.

Who gives a shit if the desert realitically couldnt be close to a forest? As long as it makes for a cool session, thats all that matters.

All you have to do is handwave shit in a decent way

Like the example from earlier in the thread where a guy mentioned impossible geometry and another guy suggested a neat back story for it that made it fit. You can almost always do that, and if you don't you can't complain when people think things are dumb.

>>50008160
Do dark elves turn into normal elves in an amf?

>>50010788
>Just because its a fantasy setting doesn't mean you can just waive the internal consistency of the setting. Doubly so in a pnp game since a lot of the session hinges on the players being able to grasp and interact with their environment, which isn't very easy if you have no fucking clue how the environment is going to respond to your interaction.
THHHHHIIIIIIIIIISSSSSSSSSSS
It's fucking crucial.

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>>50010990
A dark elf's skin is dark not because of magic, or even because of melanin, but because of chitin. That's also where their spell resistance comes from.

I very much agree with you.
Tolkien wrote an essay on this (on fairy stories) and i wish more people on 4chan read that shit because i see the "it's fantasy, who cares if something doesn't make sense" argument come up way too much on this website.

>who cares? It's a setting with DRAGONS xD
>t. 4e fags and ladyknightfags

>>50011024
>"it's fantasy, who cares if something doesn't make sense" argument come up way too much on this website.

Its because most of the time its a response to equally banal bullshit that makes as little sense and exists entirely in the head of some assblasted DM.

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>>50005100
>Fantasy setting
>Including fantastical elements, things behave consistently in a way that makes sense
>Apparently nonsensical thing happens, inconsistent with established rules
>Either a fantastic or magical explanation is provided that makes sense or it is left as a mystery because the PCs don't understand how it could happen either, "That does seem impossible, doesn't it?"

>This is the best shit.

>>50010788
>How do you sink a flying ship if its never established how a flying ship flies?
You roll for initiative then damage it til it dies.
>How you stop the dragon from breathing fire if the source of their fire breath hasn't been explained?
You don't. You fight it brute force head on by rolling for initiative then damage it til it dies.
>How do you know how you are supposed to cure a sickness when the conventional logic of using magical spells to cure diseases isn't working for no apparent reason
You don't. The dm wants you to leave but is too passive aggressive to ask, so he's killing your character off with bullshit and hoping you leave on your own.

It's like you've never had one of these DMs before. They don't want creativity, any more than they feel like being creative and thorough in worldbuilding. They want an endless slog of "I attack it. 18. It hits. It attacks you." combat interspersed with mostly non-interactive exposition cutscenes and the occasional spot check.

>>50011070
This nigga gets it.

>Thing works like this
>"Wait, why does this thing work differently? It makes no sense!"
>GM: "Yeah, it makes absolutely no sense. *grin*"
>a mystery in our hands

>>50011018
No its lolth.

>>50011082
lolith*
FTFY

>>50011070
The correct solution.

>>50011082
lolth is a spider, spiders have chitin, drow are black because of lloth, roflth imbues her drow with blackness by giving them chitinous skin that resists spells.

It's also why drow skintones don't map to humanoid skintones. Drow can be grey, blue, purple, black, all kinds of colors.

>>50011088
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lolth
That's no loli that's a THICC cougar.

>>50011100
Everything should be loli. Even Lolth.

>>50011096
>humanoid skintones.
Orc pink-green or human pale-jet black?

>>50008076
I'm glad we ran you out of the worldbuilding threads months ago.

>>50011105
But... nobody makes thicc lolis. There's no naturally occurring curves. The closest things are short stack adults...

>>50010052
No, it's just even worse for you to pick at it. I know social settings are hard for you, but you've got to understand there's more to it than "being right".

>>50011119
Mother nature does, sometimes. Holy shit am I not going to google for that, though.


Babyfat's a hell of a thing.

>>50011119
Then it is time to change this. Let's make thicc lolis.
Don't let your dreams be memes, Anon.

>>50011128
>>50011124
>>50011119
>watching twerk videos
>8 year old girl comes onscreen
>"wtf there's nothing for her to shake"
>"oh dear"
>"well now I have to register."

>>50009949
You probably handled it badly. It's just more likely that you as one person sucked, than that the entire rest of the group as a whole sucked.

It's a neat concept, so try to do better next time.

>>50011120
So Rowling going "the only rule of magic is it can't bring people back from the dead" as an explanation for why Serius was permadead, then doing it in her final book because "lol can't leave the protag dead, too sad" is fine with you?

This is not a "nitpicky" thing or a "must be right" thing, this is a basic necessity for functional storytelling. If you make rules then ignore them for convenience you simply have no rules. And things are defined by the rules that govern them. So if your follows no rules, you have no real setting, it's just whatever you capriciously feel like at the moment.

Dragons are worshipped as dieties? One of our players is a cleric of one? Ehhh, nevermind now they're just growly beasts with fire.

>>50011159
I don't think you've ever played an RPG with Rowling.

>>50011119
Its in the hips and ass, rather then all over.

>>50011165
If an author can flub up a neckbeard can do it stronger.

Also I included an example from one of my own experienced games.

>>50011174
Well that's where thicc counts most, so that's fine.

>>50011180
Great!

But we're talking about RPGs here anon. Not authors. That's the point.

Like I said, I know you don't fully understand social situations, so you'll have to take it on faith that it's not a good idea to stall a game so you can properly get your nickers in a twist about some detail no one else cares about. Yes, the original lack of consistency was bad, but you're being worse.

>>50009820
antimagic doesn't necessarily work on psions ya dingus

>>50010788
>le everything must be scientifically explained meme

>>50011195
>about some detail no one else cares about.
The cleric seemed pretty bothered. Had some pretty major ramifications for his character if his diety was retconned to a big nonsentient lizard that doesn't grant spells.

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>>50008076
I play the "a wizard did it" card to my players all the time when they point out something that doesn't make sense in my homebrew settings.

There's magical items scattered about almost everywhere in the world in the most insignificant places? A wizard did it.
Dragons are nearly extinct, even though they should by all means have overpowered every other species and become the dominant lifeform hundreds of years ago? A wizard did it.
One of the playable races are generic catgirls? Actually they're part of the core rules, but as far as the setting goes... a wizard did it.

It's beyond stupid, I know, but it's not a very serious game and most of my players are aware of that, so they just shrug, chuckle mildly and move on.

What none of them know yet is that every single one of the above occurences were all due to the actions of the same wizard, who is more important to the setting and the campaign than they could ever imagine.

>>50011288
So what?

It's worse to ruin the whole session, or if you're lucky -- only part of it.

What do you expect the GM to do? Do you think they'll suddenly retcon the retcon? They either specifically chose not to, in which case they either won't want to or your forcing them into a retconned-retcon will further fuck shit up, OR they're just retarded and your whole game's going to be full of this stuff no matter what you do.

So just don't return, if it mattered that much. Leave if it's that bad. Obviously ask about ramifications, and for clarification in case they're not actually retconning anything, but don't be an autist and get all self-righteously nitpicky about it.

>>50011270
They explicitly do given that magic Psionics Transparency is the default. There's an optional rule that says they don't but even the Psionics book warns you THINK LONG AND HARD BEFORE DOING THAT.
>>50009820
>and one to the head could instantly shut down a psion.
Why not just kill him at that point?

>>50011305
>Forgotten Realms.jpg

>>50011288
And before you try to defend him, no this wasn't a reveal or anything it was just him wanting us to fight a dragon and forgetting his own lore, then not being assed to come up with a decent explanation.

What annoys me most is he could have just gone eastern dragon vs western dragon and been fine, but instead he decides to redefine a player's entire character without asking just because he couldn't have some basic forethought.

>>50011310
>so what

Its sad you wrote this much in defence of being a pushover with no standards whatsoever. You are just justifying shitty GM's and poor world building, you should be ashamed of yourself. Especially since you are implying anybody who has more self respect than you is socially incapable.

>>50010565
To be fair, using a slavs durability and sheer willingness to spite whomever is trying to kill them is rather unfair, even to most fantasy creatures.

>>50011355
Don't bother, you expected your DM to be vaguely competent. That makes you the bad guy to these idiots.

>>50011361
This is what I mean. You think that being a pissy autist is "having standards", as if this bad GM has personally insulted you or something. You're not defending your honour or some shit. You're being a disruptive prick.

Nigger leave. No one cares about your butthurt. Don't shove it onto others. What are you going to do? You never answered that. What's the end game?

>>50011403
>pissy
>disruptive
>butthurt

Again, all we are doing is expecting the DM to have a consistent world. Its something any vaguely intelligent person should be able to do and its something everyone is entitled to expect. You are acting personally offended because other people aren't content to wallow in shit.

And stop assuming you are talking to one person.

>>50011432
>Again, all we are doing is expecting the DM to have a consistent world
No, bitch, that's not all you're doing. If you were, there'd be no problem with leaving -- right? After all, all you're doing is expecting decent standards. You're not futilely trying to vent your butthurt, right?

If it makes you feel any better, no one has been saying bad GMs are good, or that you should put up with them. They've just been saying you're worse.

>and stop assuming you are talking to one person

And, if you're part of this conversation, it's you they're talking about.

You can't ignore the annoyingly tricky parts of an argument and assume it's going to be all right.

>>50011453
What 'annoyingly tricky' parts?

The point here is this, some asshole came in here and declared it is NEVER okay to point out inconsistencies in homebrewed settings. Even when it negatively affects the PC's. And that to complain about it makes you worse than the person who is making an inconsistent setting.

If you cannot see why that is absurd and puts the blame on the wrong people you are part of the problem. A setting is never immune from criticism or expectations of consistency because of how made it, there is no excuse for arguing otherwise.

>>50011500
>What 'annoyingly tricky' parts?
The parts you avoided here, too.

What could you ever accomplish by "pointing out" inconsistencies? Nothing. So why are you doing it? To vent. You're making a bad situation worse.

This is why it's never okay to """point out""" inconsistencies, given by "point out" we mean "be an autist" (we've already covered pointing it out without being an autist). Inconsistent settings are annoying, but you're flat-out stopping the game. You're acting like this: >>50009949. Notice how, whether or not the anon speaking is in the right, the night falls apart?

Yeah.

That's why this:
>A setting is never immune from criticism or expectations of consistency because of how made it
is not the point. No one is saying homebrewed settings are immune from being bad. Of course inconsistency is bad. If you think something is blindingly obvious, it usually is.

Obviously how it's made has no bearing on this. How it's used obviously does. This isn't about worldbuilding or GMing. It's about playing. It's about your disruption for no reason.

>>50009949
Sometimes I'm adventuring and a DM appears to hijack my entertainment.

>>50011432
> plays a game where GM is supreme authority
> plays a game that doesn't have rules for the GM that enforce the setting
> butthurt the GM doesn't play like OP wants them to

K

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>>50011018
No stupid, Azura cursed them for being back stabbing faggots. Everyone knows that.

>>50011159
You are an idiot and I don't trust you to represent any situation or scenario.
I suspect the other anon is right and that you would likely be too busy nitpicking what you perceive to be errors to be able to play an actual game.

>>50008218
"anti-magic" isn't real. Magic is in everything. Magic makes the crops grow, the birds sing, the sun rise, the river flow. Magic is in every creature and plant, every man and god, every grain of sand.

What wizards call an "anti-magic" field is really just an anti-spellery spell. A wizard can't cast his fireballs, but he can still see, speak, dance, and perform any number of other innate, natural magics. A dragon can't cast his mind tricks, but it can still spit fire as naturally as you and I spit water.

>>50011647
You don't go far enough. Muscles move because magic. Arrows fly because magic. Fire burns because magic.

There's nothing worse than fantastic worldbuilders feverishly trying to work out plate tectonics.

>>50011146
This. When something like this happens in game, and a player claims it doesn't make sense, you look them in the eye and say:
>"Gee whiz, that sure is weird Player1. It's almost as if there's more to the story that your character doesn't know."

>>50011773
>my first setting I worked out what the core of the planet was made of
>solid magic, basically
>this is why dead people inevitably rise from their graves
>magic radiating up from the core
>it's why all the best evil lairs involve volcanoes and lava
>magma is inherently magical
>tectonically stable (and thus, much older) places are more magical than newer places because they've been exposed to magic from the mantle longer
>yet the most magical places of all are areas of tectonic rift or collision, where the crust is thinnest
>and psionics come from space

it was a fucked up setting.

>>50011873
I mean that's basically science-fantasy done horribly right.

>>50011879
Elves and dwarves don't age like humans and orcs do because they're displaced slave races from other dimensions. This is also why, unlike humans and orcs, they don't have a whole lot of ethnic diversity, the overlords who brought them to the world just brought the ones they thought they could use.

I think I also had some other sci fi bullshit about how magic worked, but it's been so long it's all kinda hazy.

>>50005100
Agree. This shit really bugs me, and you always hear it when you criticize any sort of fiction. Hell even Sci-Fi. Even fucking cyberpunk. Any sort of fiction with anything not known and historically documented to have occurred/existed, people pull that stupid cop-out.

Disappointed by how many people disagree with OP. I don't know why, I guess I shouldn't have, but I expected better.

Maybe we're the crazy ones and any sort of consistency or coherence in any work of fiction actually is stupid and unneccessary.

>>50011873
>>tectonically stable (and thus, much older) places are more magical than newer places because they've been exposed to magic from the mantle longer
That makes anti-sense.
If Magma is inherently magical, tectonicly active areas should be more magical.

>>50010126
Underrated comment.

>>50011873
I can't imagine living in that setting without being in a constant state of existential dread, knowing that everything can and will be fucked up eventually, even your own dead corpse.

>>50005100
How do you define the difference between fantasy and nonsense?

>>50011952
>Not reading the next line.

He immediately followed that by basically saying "The places that have a thinner crust layer, and thus have more volcanic activity are more magical than other places."

>>50009949
>>Agree, try to ask them
>>Get interrupted
>>Agree, try to shift
>>Get interrupted
>>Acknowledge their opinion, try to shift conversation
>>Get interrupted
Make a clear, decisive declaration next time.
Starting with subtle shifting is a good instinct, but you'll never herd cats by only gently cooing at them.

>>50011873

I had something similar to this where the Sun was actually a gaping portal to the Plane of Positive Energy and it was ambiguous whether or not the planet was actually a giant embryo for a nascent god, whose veins were leylines and the moon was the stillbirth "twin" kept alive by the sun's rejuvenate properties.

>>50011195
>insulting someone to cover up the fact that your argument sucks

Sticking up for yourself doesn't make you autistic. It doesn't even make you a bad person. The lack of consistency either has to be explainable through DM shenanigans ("oh, it was a cleverly applied use of ___!") or it's a mistake.

>>50011988
>projecting
Thinking anything described is "sticking up for yourself" does make you autistic.
>The lack of consistency either has to be explainable through DM shenanigans ("oh, it was a cleverly applied use of ___!") or it's a mistake.
Okay. And?

>>50011532
>What could you ever accomplish by "pointing out" inconsistencies?

Authors don't just sit down and write masterpieces. They go through a ton of drafts and help from editors. The process is laborious and difficult. Yet here you are, expecting that RPG settings can just be whipped up and be perfect right away? Hell no, everyone needs constructive criticism.

>>50011977
Yes. I read that part. But while that makes sense it immediately counters the previous statement.
>Old things are the most magical
>But new things are also equally the most magical

There's no reason, logically why the first would be the case though, according to the premise.

>>50011952
It wasn't perfect, logically speaking. Basically the idea was there's warm zones in tectonic interiors, but the hot zones are where the mantle is closest to the surface.

>>50011964
Well there's also weretiger overlords, and mindflayers from another universe, and I also hamfistedly tried to put like high tech ruins in the setting but they never really worked out how I hoped, so as I said before, it was a stupid setting.

I can't help overthinking this shit when I'm making my setting. My current setting just started with "steampunk, wild west" but I then had to go to great lengths to justify the setting by basically recreating the 1800s politically and culturally. Not exactly, but close enough that you could port over a character from historical fiction or fantasy and it would basically work.

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>>50011995
>le projecting meem
Not him, but you just ousted yourself, faggot

>>50012018

This, you should NEVER expect the first draft to survive.

Basically the first couple versions of the setting should only try and nail the setting feel and hard basics.

>>50010565
Ricochet; lost most of it's energy before slamming into his forehead.

>>50011912
Seems pretty good.

>>50012018
That's not what we're talking about at all though.

Did you read the previous comments?

>>50012025
>>50012027
>be me
>be kinda new here
>feel very proud for actually contributing to the discussion

>>50011988
>a mistake
So? Mistakes happen, keep going.
We're not going to restart the combat to round 1, because you forgot to add one of your +1 bonuses into your attack role.

Just keep going.

If it still bothers you at the end of the session talk to the GM about it then.

Honestly, I would rather a player point out a glaring contradiction in my world that I didn't notice so I can begin thinking of a way to fix it, rather then them just shutting up and dealing with it and it never getting fixed.

>>50010748
That would suck for both of you. Where's the brain part that kills you when removed?

>>50012051

This first (you) is free.

>>50012027
Yeah but criticism is really mean.

Someone criticized my homebrew just because ONE GAME (midway thru the campaign) I JUST VERY INNOCENTLY THOUGHT it would be sexy if I made all elves into naked 5 year-olds and made magic require sex with them, and you know what? I cried. I cried for months. Even now, I haven't really gotten over it.

How the fuck could you ever want someone to feel like that you fucking autist? Honestly, what kind of monster are you?

>>50012045
If I read correctly, the two camps are:
1: In the case of DM mistakes, it's not the player's responsibility for correcting them. If you consistently point out what's wrong, you're being detrimental to the overall gameplay.
2: As a player, it's part of your responsibility to keep the DM in check when it comes to their own storytelling. Any deviations from previous rules that were set in stone should be questioned, if not harshly criticized.

How'd I do, senpai?

>>50012018
>Hell no, everyone needs constructive criticism.
I agree with that but, mid-session in front of other players is rarely the best time to give criticism.

Hold it until after the game.

>>50012059
Honestly, I would rather a player point out a glaring contradiction in my world that I didn't notice so I can begin thinking of a way to fix it, rather then them just not shutting up about it and making a huge deal out of it -- and it never getting fixed.
>>50012071
How passive aggressive do you have to be to avoid talking to people who disagree with you on an anonymous image board?

>>50012053
I agree.

What I don't agree with is your using a minor combat example to contribute to a discussion about big worldbuilding issues. See >>50012059.

>>50012088
What are you even talking about? I pour my heart out and you call me passive aggressive?

Fuck. You.

>>50011930
There's a world of difference between not having consistent rules within which a story's drama plays out, and not bothering to explain stuff that has no bearing on the plot at large.

Most of the complaints itt are from people who don't give a shit about the plate tectonics of the world they're playing in, or the descent of goblins or the source of all magic, because that shit has no visible bearing on their character's story. Any influence it did have could just as easily be invented by a GM with even a modicum of improvisational skill.

These same people tend to get pissed off at autists who insist that the shit about plate tectonics and goblin lineages and magical physics be included in the setting, or else the GM is a lazy hack. No, that shit does not need to be in the game, nor will it make the game better through its inclusion. You are demanding the GM spend an inordinate amount of time and effort working on shit that is 99% unlikely to ever come up in-game at any point, when they could be spending that time producing a more dramatically engaging experience for you and your group.

>>50012066
The brainstem, it's sorta in the bottom near the back. The spinal cord connects to it once it's inside the skull.

Most any brain injury will end a fight, all things being equal, but not every brain injury will kill.

>>50012076
You forgot the copious amounts of wilful or accidental miscommunication between both camps.

Also re. 1: it's that correcting as a player does more damage than not, more than anything else. Doing is to a certain degree, or after the session, seems to be desired.

>>50010788
Verisimilitude. That's the word we're looking for. Not 'realism', but 'makes sense'. Flying ships aren't realistic, but if it's well-established that the ones in this setting float because the figurehead on the prow is enchanted, then you should be able to crash an ordinary ship by destroying the figurehead. If you do, but it keeps floating and the DM says "lol it's magic", then you can start getting fussy.

>>50012109
This issue has almost nothing to do with worldbuilding, and everything to do with bad GMing.

>>50012103
I think that you're right about not including minor details. What you're lacking, however, is the realization that we're talking about something that the DM has done, not that the DM hasn't done.
>>50012108
>miscommunication
sounds like 4chan
>>50012104
I always thought that a paralyzed psionic would be cool. Since (at least, from what i remember) psionics doesn't require somatic or verbal components, it wouldn't necessarily require anything except your brain to work.

>>50012109
But even then, in the ridiculously bad GMing example you gave, you getting fussy is worse for the game. You might WANT to do that. Don't forget all the meme greentext stories revolve around some anon crashing a campaign with no survivors. But in that best-case scenario it's still worse for the game.

>>50012121 is right: it's about bad GMs and bad players.

>>50012104
>Most any brain injury will end a fight, all things being equal, but not every brain injury will kill.
Yeah, that's the scary part. If I ever got a brain injury, I'd want it to kill me.

>>50012088
>Honestly, I would rather a player point out a glaring contradiction in my world that I didn't notice so I can begin thinking of a way to fix it, rather then them just not shutting up about it and making a huge deal out of it -- and it never getting fixed.
Pointing out some contradiction in the setting doesn't have to turn into a huge fight that ruins the game. It can be as simple as "Hey if there is a country with laser rifles just over the mountain range, how come nobody here has ever seen or even heard of them?". That's it.

>>50012147
In all the meme greentext stories, the anon tends to spout out spontaneously. I think that we can probably all agree that well-deserved criticism is a fine idea IF you dish it out once playing is over.

>>50012093
>What I don't agree with is your using a minor combat example to contribute to a discussion about big worldbuilding issues
I think it's a better example of an in game mistake to be honest. It's one with a quantifiable number and result.

A lot of perceived world building mistakes aren't mistakes but a matter of the characters and by extension the players not having all the information.

>>50012169
Yeah, this is then-and-there. It's pretty hard to worsen a game when it's done.
>>50012166
>Pointing out some contradiction in the setting doesn't have to turn into a huge fight that ruins the game.
Yes: >>50011310.

>>50005100
Source on that cropped porn reaction image please?

>>50005100

this is the reason why Game of Thrones is shit

>>50012066
>Where's the brain part that kills you when removed?
The brain stem, which is why a lot of people commit suicide by shooting themselves in the mouth. With the brain stem out of the picture, most fundamental bodily functions (like breathing, for example) stop.

So you have to aim at either the mouth (though that's more viable for suicide than actually trying to kill someone) or the back of the head/neck.

Just popped in to say fuck people who dont like details players may never run into.
That extra care and effort shines through, and some of my more enjoyable games focused around learning monster life cycles.

>>50012319
Don't be fucking stupid.

Game of Thrones and ASoIaF are shit for so many other, better reasons.

>>50012382
>That extra care and effort shines through
Extra care and effort shines through a lot more when you're putting it into the shit your players actually see.

>>50011310
>What do you expect the GM to do? Do you think they'll suddenly retcon the retcon?

I mean, yes. That or elaborate on why it's different this time. A good GM will be thankful their players are paying attention, and who cares what a bad GM thinks. You seem to think the worst of your GM, anon.

>So just don't return, if it mattered that much.
>don't be an autist and get all self-righteously nitpicky about it.

>The only options are to say nothing or leave!
>What?! "Talk to the GM about it?!" What kind of autist COMMUNICATES?

>>50010788
This. When you build a fantasy world, you have to have internal consistency and certain rules to be followed, even if the player characters (or the characters in general and the audience) don't know how they work.

When something deviates from established patterns of behaviour in terms of magical phenomenon that should be a sign that something is very strange and needs investigating. Not just handwave to have X, Y and Z occur.

>>50012394
Sometimes, when you actually give a shit about a setting or scenario, you add things people might not see. This makes actually finding it more rewarding.
See: branching paths, easter eggs, and optional secrets.

>>50012434
That's right, carefully don't quote the part telling you to talk to your GM.

>>50012448
>hey don't bring up the retcon
>but ask your GM about the retcon

>>50012446
If you get the idea to do it, and really want to do it, do it. Never focus on it. Focus on the point of your campaign. This will be much more gratifying than looking into bullshit no one is likely to find.

However, never do it as you have described.

Branching paths implies paths to begin with (huge narrative paths, that is; some railroading is always fine). Easter eggs treat the world as if it's a videogame -- impossible, in a good game.

Secrets work, depending on your campaign.

>>50012461
Congratulations, you have discovered granularity. We're all very proud of you.

>>50012470
You havent really thought your stance through if you suggest gms focus on things players will see, while at the same time acting as if preset paths are wrong.

>>50012493
It's more likely we have radically different definitions of "what the players will see".

This means "things the campaign will focus on" to me. Plothooks and everything relating to the tone of the campaign (politics, combat, slice-of-life &c.).

>>50012470
Fuck you for not considering monster ecologies.

>>50012514
Ironically I do. But that's only because I GMd a monster hunting campaign nigga.

>>50012480
>Congratulations, you have discovered granularity.
>But it's still impossible to bring up inconsistencies without it turning into a game-ruining argument

>>50012528
>But it's still impossible to bring up inconsistencies without it turning into a game-ruining argument
Who said that, anon?

>>50012506
It sounds to me like you are making a lot of content players might not see, yes.
I mean, you could borrow from videogames and re-use those assets until players see them, but the same can be said of all setting details.

>>50012520
Good. You should. You should also consider economy and geography based weather patterns, given your monster hunting focus.

>>50012535
>Who said that, anon?

>don't be an autist and get all self-righteously nitpicky about it.

If you dont know what people are eating and where it came from, you probably havent thought your game through.

>>50012546
I guess "don't make content players aren't likely to see" would be more accurate. If you're running a political campaign, don't give a damn about the particular bread-making techniques of the region -- unless you bring it into politics. People might say "but bread-making techniques are integral to politics!", but they forget that worlds are regrettably not real worlds, and campaigns are merely stories. You can be realer than real by not being "realistic".
>>50012559
In that campaign, economy was indeed a focus. Not geography/weather patterns, because magic doesn't have time for that shit. And I even considered bread-making techniques, because it was one method of capturing a monster.

Do you see the point?
>>50012573
Potatoes :^)
>>50012571
Doesn't follow.

>>50012573
Jockey Jerky. It's made from the losers at the track.

Now, I should be clear, it's not called Jockey Jerky because jockeys eat it, and it's not made from the losing *horses*...

>>50008308
It's mostly mountain ranges that block wind bringing in rain actually. It's why often times you'll have a mountain range with wet forest on one side and arid grassland/desert on the other.

>>50012622
How about

>It's worse to ruin the whole session, or if you're lucky -- only part of it.

Does that follow well enough for you?

>>50012648
Are you saying being "an autist who gets all self-righteously nitpicky about it" won't have that effect?

>>50012655
Are you saying "a major piece of background upon which my entire character was built has suddenly been changed" is an "autistic nitpick?"

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>>50012288
It's a slightly edited frame from "JINX Come On! Shoot Faster!" by Turtle.Fish.Paint.

>>50012685
Nope. This is about execution, not intent.

>>50012622
>Not including important political details like food production in a political game

Versimillitude lost

>>50012691
Very good, thank you

>>50012704
Eh, I'll say they eat magic.

>>50012695
I see, and the execution should be "don't ever bring up inconsistencies, it'll turn into a huge fight, instead you should bring up the inconsistencies."

>>50012716
I hope you accurately represent how drastically that changes society. It may even prevent the creation of society in the first place.

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Often these things come down to DM experience and ability to think on their feet.
Let's take an example I saw earlier.
"How can I sink a magical airship if I don't know how it flies."
A good DM in this situation would assess his players. If they grew up in the setting the ship is from a simple knowledge check could let them know there is a magical core or mechanical engine in the hull. If one of the players is an arcanosmith maybe they could roll for lnowledge on its actual innerworkings.

Thinking on your feet and giving just ENOUGH detail are keys to keeping that suspense of disbelief. Too many details and players get frustrated with inconsistency. Too little and players can't grasp your world and immerse with it.

Seriously read some DMing/fantasy writing books. They're great.

>>50005100
I agree fully.

>>50012818
That being said I do not know OP's situation and have been in a similar spot. However there is often times That Guy who gets mad his 6th level fighter from another continent can't figure out how a magical engine works that was the lifes work of a 18th level sorcerer.

>>50012742
No anon that's stupid.

>>50010107

"Right next to each other" might be a bit of an exaggeration; there are nearly 300 kilometres of altiplane and colossal mountains between the two (and even more if we're specifically talking about the Atacama, which is further down south).

>>50010107
Look at a map. Even going past what is usually called the atacama desert you get some distance in between. ( This does not help making any point i know )

Players have exactly one means of influencing the narrative: The actions their characters take. Every time you have an action's results have results that are determined by your personal whims and not by the actual action that was taken, you're either directly shitting on player agency by essentially ignoring their actions and producing whatever results you want and then saying "it's magic!" or indirectly by doing the same thing to an NPC, thus demonstrating to the players that there's no particular reason to think any of their actions succeeded or failed due to anything the PCs actually did.

The game world of a TTRPG needs *more* consistency, not less, than a single-author novel. In a single-author novel, the guy who's ignoring the rules is also the guy choosing character actions, so no one is cut out of the creative process. In a TTRPG, a GM who ignores the setting's rules is writing himself a blank check to ignore player inputs completely.

>>50012742
What part of bring it up AFTER the game is confusing to you?

>>50013100
>I've never played or run a TTRPG in my life

>>50011310
Holy shit, a GM shat all over an entire PC concept, a concept he already okayed to be usable in the game, and you are actually defending that shit. This is some next-level anti-player thinking.

>>50013139
Dip

>>50013100
Players are literally always trying to break the rules. It's a GM's job to wrangle their tards as best they can.

>>50013169
Most players are not, in fact, cheating assholes. Get better players.

>>50013130
The depth and nuance of your counterargument has been noted.

>>50013298
But most players are, in fact, selfish idiots, who will use any excuse to take a mile from any inch they're afforded.

>>50013139
My first tipoff to leave (other than the weebness) should have been that all dieties that weren't dragons were named after the DM in some fashion, Goblins style.

>>50013465
>But most players are, in fact, selfish idiots

I'll just go ahead and assume this is true for whatever community you're playing in, because my answer is still the same: Get better players. Selfish idiots you have to constantly fight with to have any fun at all are not worth the time or effort.

>>50013169
You do that via your own methods though.
>>50013314
Have you taken a look at this thread?

>>50013298
I didn't say they were cheaters. I'm saying most people will try to perform some action out of character or try and play with emmeta knowledge. TTRPG's don't have a dice table for everything. Gotta reign your PC's in now and again.

>>50013520
Fool, it's called "the tabletop roleplaying community." It doesn't matter where you are: online, offline, at a college club, at your FLGS, with a fox, in a box.

There is one truth to this hobby: it is a balancing act between one person who has to keep track of a setting, a story, an entire cast of periphery characters, the rules of the game being played, encounters, all while making sure the two-to-four people at his table who have to manage and only care about their singular character on their singular character sheet getting their chance to shine every session are kept consistently entertained and don't fuck off to play with their phones.

>>50005100
>PC notices inconsistency
>"Roll a will saving throw"
>whateverpcrollsdoesntmatter
>"you blink and everything seems nornal to your character now
>never bring it up again.

>>50013633
>the matter is pursued
>"roll another will save"
>whateverthepcrollsdoesntmatter
>"you notice the clouds/ceiling above you seems distorted and wrong as if shifting and swirling into strange shapes. You blink. Everything seems normal."

>>50013617
I am running a campaign right now with players who are neither selfish nor idiots. It is not the first such campaign I have run or played in. Your experiences aren't universal, and you'd probably have better experiences if you were willing to hold players to any standards at all.

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>>50011119
Are you familiar with Elin?

>>50013525
>Have you taken a look at this thread?

Mostly it's one guy equivocating between bringing up an issue at all and ruining a session with it, and everyone else getting baited into responding to him as though he were responding in anything like good faith.

So the lack of actual content in the counterarguments isn't surprising, but it has still been noted.

>>50013674
>the matter is pursued a 3rd time
>"roll another will save"
>Whateverthepcrollsitdoesntmattertheyvefuckedupthisbad
>"you notice the sky/ceiling again. It's forming into what looks like a hand?eye?both? It's horribly twisted yet strangely humanoid. Your character is now beginning to percieve the thin strand that balances reality. The weight of the frailty of the fabric of the universe is weighing on your shoulders. Your PC begins to scream"
>"Your party members turn around as you let out a scream but before they can react your head implodes."

>>50013714
The depth and nuance of your analysis has been noted.

>>50013526
>I'm saying most people will try to perform some action out of character or try and play with emmeta knowledge.

You'd probably have an easier time finding players who don't do this if you didn't cater to the ones who do. Good players don't like putting up with that kind of shit and they are plenty common enough to create groups of their own.

>>50013726

That's not how that meme works.

>>50013689
I'd very much like to become with this "Elin" thing. I don't suppose you happen know where that image originates from?

>>50013780
[Team Kihara (Mojarin)] Elin Peropero x 4 (TERA The Exiled Realm of Arborea)
https://exhentai.org/g/618019/447730091a/

ITT buttblasted DMs too autistic to be able to just casually say to their group before one of their sessions "i'very been thinking about X, I think Y is better oe makes more sense so that's the new way it works" or too lazy to plan that far ahead, or too lazy to think up a reasonable exception or two to their lore rules, even if that exception is "you're right that is weird. It's a mystery woooo~" and so are blaming the players for noticing their bullshit and correctly labeling it so.

>>50011964
Dying Earth, a key inspiration for D&D, was a setting built around existential dread.

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>>50013793
Thank you sir, now I will look into this Elin.

>>50013169
No, players are constantly trying to find ways to break things using the rules you create, not break the rules themselves.
They can't break the economy by setting up a mining operation on the elemental plane of salt if you don't first say that there /is/ an elemental plane of salt, and that the material plane has a demand for it.
They operate within your boundaries.

They may often test where those boundaries are. Tis the nature of humanity to explore. But to break the rules you make is to cease playing the game and to start playing in your own little make believe session while everybody else keeps going.

>>50013915
I'm talking about people trying to bend and test the actually flawed mechanics of rolling a die to perform actions

>>50008841
Yes, please stop.
You're causing cultural degradation.

>>50013954

So you are in other words talking about something entirely else than the rest of the thread?

Then start a new thread instead of being offtopic.

>>50010052
>'Magic' existing does not turn a setting into a wacky free for all where non magical things don't have to be consistent and make sense.
Of course it does.

That's how we know magic in the real world doesn't exist.

>>50010788
>Just because its a fantasy setting doesn't mean you can just waive the internal consistency of the setting.
The problem is that even the setting's creator may not be aware of consistency issues. Logic is hard.

>>50012319
>>50012383
There is nothing wrong with those. In fact, they are among the best fantasy ever made.

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>>50014645

>>50012319
I always felt like ASoIaF magic was more "there are rules, but no one in universe really know what they are" than that it breaks its own rules.

>>50013128
Because the problems are happening DURING the game.

>>50013679
>I am running a campaign right now with players who are neither selfish nor idiots.
Are they over 30?

>>50013720
Hello, Lovecraft.

>>50013915
How would you include portals in a setting without having them get stacked on top of one another and make a perpetual motion machine other than asking the players "I know that you could use portals to break the setting, but I don't want them used that way, so please don't."

>>50014794
Simple. Have it so they have to be built as stone rings or surfaces on which the portal appears, and require them to be built on leylines or other high magical areas.

Trying to stack portals on top of eachother is next to impossible due to how the construction works, and they won't be able to connect to the same spot on a leyline anyway.

At best, this could result in building one portal on a mountain and another in a valley and creating an artificial river, which could then produce energy from a damn, but that's on a big enough scale that it's easy to find some entity pissed off by that exchange.

>>50011873
I kinda feel ya. My current setting is a lump of dirt floating in space, basically just a flat planet's crust being held up and kept running by the gods, so they can have that sweet prayer fix. Everything is artificial, so geology is irrelevant.

Consistent physics was a nice, low-maintenance system, but it produced way too much atheism to be sustainable from a divine point of view. The only one who was getting any real faith anymore was that cunt, Yahweh.

>>50014794
Don't make them player-creatable.

>>50012691
Anon i searched that whole work and couldnt find ops image.

I think you got the wrong porn

>>50014794
>first player who does that gets sucked into the void
>roll a new character, guy

>>50014694
Yeah, and you're causing them.

>>50014794
If you try to stack them like that, they rapidly begin falling faster than terminal velocity due to netherspace between the portals.

If left to continue more than a minute or so, the dropped object becomes a fiery slag explosive that destroys one or both portals.

>>50015001
he said slightly edited
pg15, last frame

>>50008616
All fiction settings are someone's homebrew setting

>>50015045
No, the storyteller is causing them.

>>50015147
Hm, all i can find are ahegaos. Which sucks, because i love the tightlipped "oh, i am taking a dick now" look

What if you make your world not run on scientific rules?

As in anti-magic fields don't really exist because EVERYTHING is magic in some way. Blocking a Wizard's spell involves tying a knot with a lock of your mother's hair around your chest for protection; her love will protect you no matter how far away you are.

Or maybe the entire world is not run by atoms but by traditional elements. Or maybe its run by tiny spirits that literally paint all the leaves brown in autumn and pluck them off the tree when nobody is looking.

This is the core of what fantasy is.

>>50015462
All of that is great as long as it is consistent.
Don't say "Oh, this time the wizard's spell blows through your lock of hair and you die because fuck you."
But if there is some actual in-fiction reason for it not working that time then it's fine.

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I had an argument with a webcomic artist about this actually

>>50015693
>I had an argument with a webcomic artist
I don't know who wasted their time more.

>>50015462
Yeah, but that's not what OP's complaining about.

They're complaining about, say, having the knot-tying antimagic be a known quantity but then it suddenly failing to work for no apparent reason.

Or the world is run by spirits and/or based on the traditional elements, but then the GM introduces stuff that runs on IRL physics.

The thing is, all those things you mentioned are perfectly alright AS LONG AS THEY ARE CONSISTENT WITH ESTABLISHED RULES - or are the established rules, as the case may be. It's just when they're inconsistent that problems arise.

And when they're inconsistent, well, that's when you as a player should probably ask the GM about the inconsistency so they can at the very least improv an excuse for it - "oh, the knot failing is a sign that your mother's health is deteriorating" or "oh, these IRL physics things are literally from another dimension that works more like ours" or, well, whatever bullshit they can come up with on the spot.

>>50015693
What one?

>>50015358
Most likely it's the mouth that's been replaced. I imagine you'll be seeing some gaping, drooling, tongue floppimg mess where they put the frown.

>>50015693
Anybody of note?

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>>50008308
>Can ocean currents do that?
It can, but the edge between forrest and desert usually isn't very severe. Basically nothing is going to live near the coast because of the salt water. Also depending upon the geography certain regions can just be completely denied rainfall, but usually in these kinds of situations there will be some mountain or range of hills or something that's working in tandem with the coastal weather patterns.

Pic related, they do exist. The autistic thing to do is ask you DM to justify its existence by asking locals about the yearly weather patterns and then complaining about inconsistencies.

>>50015769
I should note that the pic related there isn't because of an ocean current, but because of the Dead Sea, but the point remains that the earth is salted and nothing can grow well near the dead sea.

>>50015748
Man, it sucks to like the progression from tight lipped to ahegao. I can never have it all.

>>50010887
I actually have a friend like that.
We had to kick him out of a campaign arround the same time we walkedinto a dwarven mountain village he DEMANDED TO KNOW HOW THEY SURVIVED WITHOUT ABOVE GROUND AGRICULTURE.

>>50015462
You've graduated from the worldbuilding kiddy pool. Congrats.
>>50015693
Sounds like the kinda thing Kaz'd get autistically right about.
>>50015819
Try being into fucking historically accurate princesses in their historically accurate clothing. Do you know how often you can find legit princess porn that ISN'T about some Disney shitter or Princess mcFucking Peach?

Not bloody often.

>>50015793
I like the salt explanation mixed with magic
>it was a place of an ancient battle against daemons
>salt is known to hinder forces of evil
>so the forces of good were summoning/shooting shitloads of it
>nothing will grow there ever again

I think often a DM just has to knuckle down and admit that he's a human with human weaknesses. I'm a casual preschool teacher who's read the source material and thought for a month or so and tried to ply together a world thats both engaging and realistic enough to get people involved, but im going to make mistakes. I dont know all the intracacies of sociology, meteorology, mathematics, the physical sciences, metaphysical magical nonsense, economics anthropology and psychology. I researched what I could but even with all the power of our modern civilization behind me I still dont think I could come up with a world with zero inconsistencies.

Leave ACTUAL world building in the hands of God, Im just going to try and help you guys tell a story.

>>50016113
This is fair enough.

Build as much of a world as you can, but everyone has to realize you dont have the time to go full dwarf fortress

>>50016197
Or the programming! One day, maybe, we will have the algorithms and fuzzy logic machines to crunch in settings and spit out consistency, but until then you'll just have to deal with my old meat machine.

>>50010860
Best yet underrated comment.

>>50016254
Yep.
Heck, not even my computer can handle dorffort

>>50016113
One thing that's useful is that you're not just one human with human weaknesses - you're a human with human weaknesses who also has a bunch of other humans with human weaknesses who are helping to tell the story of your game.

You might not know all the intricacies of geology, but maybe one of your players does. Ask them what makes sense. The players are your editors, so you can brainstorm with them more-or-less subtly during your sessions to help iron out all the holes in your worldbuilding.

If a player thinks that something is inconsistent and you don't think that you have an answer to it that's better than something the players could come up with, ask them what makes the most sense. Your world might be better off for it.

Also, of course, you don't have to go with that answer if you think it's inconsistent with other details the players don't know about.

>>50016197
No one has the time to go full dorf fortress!

>>50017025
Its true.
That is why it takes a group of supercomputers working in tandem to play it smoothly

>>50015819
>the progression from tight lipped to ahegao
I'm pretty sure this exists as a tag on boorus, I just can't remember the exact name.

>>50015322
>storyteller
No wonder your an ass

>>50010126
You might be looking for FATE.

>>50014713
One of them is either late 20s or early 30s (I don't know their exact ages), but not generally, no.

>>50010613
Depends on caliber and energy transfer.
Little piddly-shit rounds at distance maybe, but anything that fires a rifle caliber is pretty much going to give no fucks unless you get VERY, VERY lucky. Like "the bullet hit the skull and rotated around the exterior and continued off the side of it" lucky.

>>50013689
>>50013780
Elin peropero x 4 (i think)
from a free to play mmo called
TERA
i personally prefer x6
>when your doing it with a dog-type Elin, You've gotta do it doggy-style!
>I'm not ... Ellie is a wolf...!

>>50016113
I dunno if it's because I'm obsessive compulsive or just lazy, but this is the reason I never write, DM or really do anything creative and share it with people. I don't know how most things work and I'm afraid of being wrong.

I was always really good at math, but hated science, I think for this very reason. Scientists theorize and then throw shit at the wall, and if something doesn't work they figure it out from there. I find that really scary. I feel like you should know everything first.

>>50019716
>I feel like you should know everything first.
Go take a few improv acting courses.
It'll be a learning experience.

Alternately, play about twenty rounds of Mao.

>>50010788
>How do you sink a flying ship if its never established how a flying ship flies?
You make the magic holding it up stop
>How you stop the dragon from breathing fire if the source of their fire breath hasn't been explained?
You use magic
>How do you know how you are supposed to cure a sickness when the conventional logic of using magical spells to cure diseases isn't working for no apparent reason
You go on an epic quest to find the secret magic cure disease magic.
Dumb cunt

>>50010788
>>50005100
This.
Anyone that hasn't put hours upon hours of study into scientific data to reason out every little nitbit in their setting must be fucking hanged and shot.
If you cant explain the actual scientific formula for the magic crystals that hold the ship up or how giant insects or lizards can be real next to mamals of equal size you are a fucking cuck and need to die.

REEEEEEEEEEE

>>50022491

>being this much of a dull cunt

>>50022549
He's asking dumb questions for a dumb reason, he's getting dumb answers you obstinate cunt.

>>50022565

Nah, you're exaggerating what he said because you feel embarrassed, most likely you do that shit yourself.
So you spout memes, and not just any memes, /pol/ and /r9k/ memes - I wonder what you could be insinuating.

Fucking cunt.

>>50009001
>Live in Hawaii

Only on two or three islands, and in very small amounts. We also happen to live right in the middle of the G-d damn pacific, but I don't think your average grognard is intelligent or creative enough to apply his sense of geography to anything more than cookie-cutter Tolkien crap.

>>50011305
>It's not a serious game

See? I don't have a problem with this. In fact, I LIKE it when funny games have retarded settings. I like you, anon. I like you a lot.

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>>50010074
>>50011120
>>50014410

t. Lazy as fuck GMs

This is literally a case of "mad cause bad". You're shit GMs who don't know how to make a good setting that's not ripped off from the last thing you just watched or read, so when you receive fair criticism, instead of applying it to yourselves, you just get BTFO.

I'm a forever GM, I know when I've fucked up my setting, AND I can admit it. I've also played in a few bad homebrews, and though I'm socially competent enough not to bring it up to the DM's face, I cannot simply ignore bad story-telling.

This is what happens when GMs GM for so long that they've lost all sense of perception and self-awareness. Literally ForWhatPurpose-tier.

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>>50022749

I'm loosely in the same basket. It's horrifying because there's like a handful of GMs I can actually enjoy a game with as a player in my city, and even when i'm at that table, i'm playing into cues and pointing players at story development and effectively GMing a game where I only control one NPC.

And yes, if your setting doesn't make fucking sense, you're a bad GM. Most GMs are bad GMs, and weird nerd social problems means they generally stay bad GMs, plus the large pool of desperate players looking for a game.

>>50010016
Holy shit, this argument pisses me off so goddamn much.

"Hurr durr, it's PHANN-TUH-SEE! IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE UNREALISTIC!"

Nigga, it's not "SUPPOSED" to be anything. What it SHOULD be, however, is consistent and logical, you dumb, negro-blinded son of a bitch!

>>50010565
Not gonna look at all the responses to predict that the bullet actually ricocheted, lost all its energy hitting something else, or is not actually the whole bullet.

>>50010585
>>50012028
>>50010616
Freaking called it, my dudes.

Just as a heads up, in case anyone is interested. There is no such thing as "bullet proof hide". Stories about bullets bouncing off boars and rhinos are either wildly exaggerated or similarly bizarre exceptions to the rule.

No living thing on Earth is immune to a .22 to the head; EVEN an elephant. The bullet might not do much in the short-term, but it'll definitely go through the skull, barring a very extreme slant or angle, or unless the round is defective or otherwise voided null during its course from barrel to skull. You'd have to be pretty far too if you wanted the bullet to lose enough energy before being unable to penetrate the elephant (at least 30 to 50 meters, I think).

Bullets are ridiculously powerful, and there's just no organic body armor that exists in the natural world that's powerful enough to withstand even a tiny pistol caliber.

>Personally saw a .357 magnum take down a bull elephant at 75 yards

ITT: Lazy niggers telling you you should be lazy and effort is bad.

>>50022790
I think his problem is mostly that an overwhelming number of people who complain about internal consistency will immediately get mad at anything being any shred "unrealistic", with the term "unrealistic quite literally translating to "would not function in our current modern society's understanding of a similar concept". It would be internally consistent within the setting for most warriors to never wear shirts or any upperwear if they have been warring like that for centuries and armor never really providing enough protection due to them subsisting on dragon flesh, which makes your average warrior dramatically stronger than a normal human. Thus early armors would been considered weak because these powerful warriors could shear through them like they were non-existent, or would simply bludgeons armored opponents to the point where the armor simply became a hindrance. Fast-forward more centuries, and the stigma against armor would have been embedded in culture, so most people simply might choose against helmets or anything of the sort, even if it was detrimental, due to cultural armor stigma.

However, if you ask the same autistic person why he's wearing armor, and they start bringing up MUH INTERNAL CONSISTENCY despite there having been an explanation as to why armor would be wholly unrealistic and pointless in said setting, they would rant and rave that "real" societies would "always" develop armor.

Anecdotes may be the best I have, but I'm no stranger to these types. You make the slightest implication that this setting isn't literally historical fanfiction, and they will throw a fit.

>>50023451

A secondary problem when going for something unrealistic but internally consistent is that the new norm might be poorly explained.

I played in a campaign like that. The magic in the setting was presumably consistent, but it was so poorly explained that magic as a phenomena was trash to us players, because we had no clue what to do with it.

Basically, as soon as we figured out something was magic we just dropped it like a hot potato, because magic became synonymous to "useless" to us.

>>50022790
Actually, my issue with people like OP is that tey believe they have all the rules of the universe memorized, when it is literally only the GM who actually has to concern himself with that, and further, inconsistencies might not be a flaw, but an actual part of the universe you're dealing with and futher might even be a plot point. As an example, the novel The Shattered World, where the pieces of the world were held together by Runestones, and necromancy was a dead form of magic that was utterly feared and terrifying. "No one could use the magic of the dead" is a commonly occurring phrase. The runestones were all slowly dying, and no one could fix them except the power f necromancy. Smeone finally started to learn necromancy, and the rule "no one could use the power of the dead" was encuntered again and again.

What no one in the world knew, as no player in the settign could have possibly known, was that necromancy was the most powerful school because all the dead people in the entire world powered it, and no one could use the power of the dead because necromancy was merely the ability to let the dead act through you - the dead used their own power, through you, and thus no one could use the power of the dead because the dead were in utter control of the power they represented.

Just because there is inconsistenc does not mean the gme is fucked, if the GM is using those inconsistencies to a purpose, and there is no reason at all in a fantasy world all the rules should be known to everyone in the setting when magic might have seperate rules, the supernatural might have unknown rules, and there might be mysteries unknown to the characters and possibly the players as well.

Self entitled little shits that you people are.

>>50023499

That's not actually an inconsistency though.

>>50023451
I don't think that's true at all. Consistency and realism aren't the same thing at all.

>>50023530
But it would appear to be inconsistent to all other magic as perceived in the setting which is under the caster's power at all times. It is the only form of magic that does not have rules or laws and cannot be cast or controlled by the caster. It is internally inconsistent to all other types of magic.

More importantly, to a person in that world, it would be absolutely insane. Magic that cannot be harnessed, controlled, and used as the caster wishes? Impossible. Inconcievable and utterly stupid as a concept. Yet there it was.

Established rules are rules as known, magic behaves in these ways and these ways only. Nonsensical thing happening - wizard being possessed by the dead and used to empower all the runestones in the entire shattered world - was inconsistent with established rules. It's FANTASY, it doesn't have to be realistic.

>>50023558

Consistency in world-building is often referred to as 'realism'. Aka, 'it seemed real', as opposed to 'it seemed fake'. This meaning is often taken to mean 'the same as the real, existing world, in every respect' by idiots of all kinds.

The appropriation of a word, verisimilitude, to describe 'seeming real but being, in fact, a fictional world' doesn't actually stop these asstards in many cases - they keep acting like 'real in the exact same way as the real world' is the meaning of the word.

Both the people who scoff at things being 'unrealistic' because it's different from their (usually laughably wrong) understanding of society, physics, human nature (etc), and the people who try to act like any randumb stupid non-consistent fake-seeming crap is 'fine' 'because it's fantasy' misuse/refuse to understand how that term works.

>>50023573

It's not inconsistent though, because it's a book and the author had plenty of time to ease his readers into the new rule.

Unless of course he suddenly handwaves "lolno necromancy didn't count and now everything suddenly exploded" in the climax without any fucking foreshadowing. In that case the author actually committed a deus ex machina.

>>50023573

You're confusing 'heavier than air powered flight? Rubbish' with 'The spider can fly, despite not being able to fly earlier. Why? Because you're up high and i'm too stupid to think of a way to actually challenge you.'

The two things are not remotely similar. One is an in-universe belief. The other is shitty GMing.

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>>50009638
Well, this guy kinda falls in the description.

>>50009820

I think a bullet to the head would instantly shut down most people anon

>>50023640

Not in HP-as-wounds DnD-land. People might as well be made out of nanites or whatever the frequency with which they're gouged and stabbed and give zero shits. And 'wait until they have enough wounds' to cast a healing spell.

>>50023451
Going by your armor example, it's obvious that's not the kind of situation I would get miffed at.

In fact, I find that whole dragon-warrior concept very appealing. You KNOW what I'm angry about, m8.

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>>50020104
>play about twenty rounds of Mao.
>Mao

>>50023658
Most people are lvl 1 commoners, with 1d6 hd.
A medium pistol does 1d8. A forehead shot is definitely a crit... so.. minimum damage 2, max 16, average 8, and a 14% chance (9/64) to survive.
I'd say that's still pretty lethal.

>>50025775

1d6 hd? 5e? Does 5e even have a commoner class? I thought npc humans had their own weird statblocks.

Stuff doesn't die in dnd-land at 0, it goes into 'roll to live' territory and/or medical intervention etc.

But yes, I was referring to PCs, not NPCs. Still relevant (and stupid) when people play hp-as-wounds.