Are Dark Angels are the most shit first founding chapter? They

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>>49776007
>fists
>get challenged by perty to try and crack his fortress
>decide to scale the walls with the sheer numbers of dead fists
>literally autistic

In fairness, still plenty better than Linkin El'Johnson's emos

>>49776007
are you literally just one of the salty anons from the Rock vs Phalanx thread i swear to fucking god

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>>49776007
Yes.

>>49776007
I don't really "get" the Dark Angels, I'll admit. Their color scheme is drab despite them being a very balls-out chapter. Their Fallen lore is weird and nonsensical, and their special characters seem kinda crap.

I'd love if a Dark Angels fan could explain to me exactly why they're so well-liked, but most Dark Angel fans seem to respond with
>you're not fuckin smart enough to get it faggit, its fuckin poetry references, its all so deep, now fuckin kill yourself
OR
>because fuck u all the other chapters r fuckin faggits, especially fuckin Space Yiffs, btw fuckin kill yourself

Thereby I have not yet cracked the secret to enjoying Dark Angels.

>>49776007
basically yes

>>49776007
>no noteworthy achievements
That's the Pisshands

>muh plasma
That's not their specialization

>color scheme is dull
Fists' is the color of piss

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>>49776358
I'm unlucky enough to know several DAfags, and I asked them the same. Only responses I got were:

>I just do, lol

and

>muh spess knights

Aren't all the mehreens spess knights?

>>49776358
The Fallen lore is what they kinda cling to, because "ZOMG DEEP DARK BROODY AND NO TRAITORS AT ALL WE SWEAR" is clearly a more sophisticated and mature theme than the SW who they seem to be constantly shitting on.

As for the poetry references... Lionel P. Johnson, English poet/writer. Author of "The Dark Angel". HURR DURR ZOMG SO DEEP!!!11!1!1

Like, the Rock is literally the only remotely cool thing about them.

>>49776358
Watching autistic threads like these are one of the reasons I enjoy Dark Angels desu senpai.

can you fucking believe that the Dark Angels are supposed to be destroying the Space Wolves?
And all the other chapters are on board with it!

Bullshit I say
Bullshit

>>49776500
hahaha nice meme

>>49776007

I have a feeling they're going to get a lot of love lore-wise once their respective HH book gets released by FW.

I mean, the Rangdan Xenocides (of which there were 3) alone were apparently hardcore enough to kill tens of thousands of marines and were possibly an existential threat to the Imperium itself. They're the reason the Dark Angels went from the undisputed largest and most well-equipped Legion to barely remaining in the top 5.

>>49776457
>Corvus Corax, Primarch of the Raven Guard
>Last known words: "Nevermore"

40k is 2deep4me

>>49776358
I personally find the Dark Angels a very funny, and ironic chapter. Infact, a lot of the Dark Angels themes play on the topic of Irony. They are considered by the public to be one of the most loyal chapters, when in reality, half their legion became heretica. They are considered strict adherents to the Codex Asartes, when in reality, they are legion building sons of bitches. They are the oldest legion, yet also the most advanced.

One of their big tennets is basically, by trying to hunt down and keep their heresy quiet, they are, in reality, only making it worse. But, you have to keep in mind one factor:

The Dark Angels are the single most powerful chapter in ALL the imperium, while also being one of the most heretical. They have Xeno servants, they with-hold STC's from the Admech, they basically fill their casualties with the sucessor chapter, and are at fault of legion building.

But, at the same time, due to their inner circle, and their constant monitering of their activities, they are one of the most loyal chapters around. Their STC's allow them to basically turn the tide of a thousand battles. They also can attack with the force of a full, heavily armed Space Marine legion.

They are both the greatest heros of the imperium, while also being fucking huge hypocrits. And that just plays right into the Imperium

>>49776445
>Marines Malevolent is the color of piss
FTFY

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>>49776358
>>49776447
It may not answer your questions, but as a Dangelfag, I love them for the same reasons I love the Enclave in Fallout, they are a perfect blend of crazy US government spooks.

Think of it this way, the Dangels are the "Men in Black" that, while they fight alongside you, have another objective in mind, one they do not want you to know. They run around cutting off all knowledge of the Fallen, even if it means killing thousands of innocent lives in the process. They have secret branches that are so hidden, even their own chapter may not realize it.
They're that one agent in your strike team that your commander was eerily quiet about, you don't know why exactly he's there, only that he's "here to help."
They're the guys that, when asked about conspiracy theories like the Illuminati or Chemtrails, will instantly and vigorously deny any truth to them, then quickly exit the scene.

>>49776457
Apperantly the Rock is named after a gay bar that was near the old GW shop when it was still small.

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>>49776674
Interesting points! I never really recognized the parallels.

It's also a bit of an unfortunate parallel in itself, that so many Dark Angels fans "ironically" buy into the supremacy and denying of hypocrisy, only to actually start being hypocrites in denial.

I had a similar problem with liking the Dark Eldar, as I viewed them as just playing second fiddle to Slaanesh, until I saw the aspects of them that held lots of that Fair Folk influence, as well as their kinda anarchist/Ayn Rand-up-to-eleven craziness.

>>49776723
Sounds a hell of a lot like some real Tzeentchian shit to me.
Or like the Alpha Legion.

>>49776674
>But, at the same time, due to their inner circle, and their constant monitering of their activities, they are one of the most loyal chapters around.

This, they are probably the most vigilant chapter against inter-corruption.

>>49776774
Not really.
Tzeentch is all about plotting, change, and influencing events, the Dangels want everything exactly as it is, keepers of the Status Quo.

The Alpha legion is all about subterfuge and infiltration, the Dangels go in loud and proud. You know exactly what they do and how they did it, but you will never know why.

>>49776799
Exactly. Name me a single Dark Angels chapter that has gone rouge aside from the fallen.

>>49776723
>fallout
/v/ please leave

>>49776674
the black templar are about as big, but they are a lot more spread out, so dark angels still win

>>49776825
Apperantly the Astral Claws, now Red Corsairs, were either descended from Ultramarines or Dark Angels.

>>49776358
I realize this is a bait thread but I can at least give you my reasons for liking the DAgels. Mostly I really like their Knights Templar in space and secret society vibe that they have going on along with their Gothic aesthetic. But also there's:
>Status as the first legion, with all of their rare and secret tech
>Badass specialized units in the Ravenwing and Deathwing
>Wealth of lore and major conflicts to read up on
>Interesting primarch who is deeply flawed but in a way that makes him and engaging
>Unique psychic disciplines
>Close enough to standard marines to avoid confusion but plenty of variation
>If Age of the Emperor happens they will mostly likely go back to being a legion led by their primarch and be major players

Literally the only things I dont like are their color scheme and how much their lore focuses on the fallen. Thats why I painted mine up as my favorite successor, The Guardians of the Covenant

>>49776897

This seems likely considering the unforgiven involvement ending the Nova Terra Interregnum.

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>>49776905
REPRESENT

Though comparing GoC to DAngels is a bit like comparing Lamentars to BAngels.

>>49776905
>asshole who can only solve problems with his fist
>interesting and engaging

Oh dear Chaos. My sides are on the other side of the Eye of Terror.

But let's be fair here. As much as I shit on the Lion, and as much as he deserves it, he's better as a character than "I care about people, I'm so deep and dimensional" Vulkan or "I spent the Heresy doing fuck-all" RawButt GirlyMoon. He had potential; if only he could have been less tsun-tsun and more dere-dere towards senpai.

>>49776991
Admittedly. They dont really do much Fallen hunting and other Unforgiven shenanigans but that's part of their charm for me. They are still true sons of thr Lion

>>49777000
Wasn't the Lion just off blowing Guilliman during half the Heresy and off blowing Luther and Caliban the other half?

>>49777000
>I skin people alive and do spooky punisher shit
>Daddy and my brothers never understand me why can't they just accept me flaying innocent people
>I hate everying but not as much as I hate myself and every day is CRAWLING IN MY SKIN
See, I can do it too

>>49777000
Guilliman is actually a pretty interesting character when people aren't sucking his dick. He was an empire-builder, and did a damn good job of actually stabilizing the shit he conquered rather than just tearing it all down for show.

Vulkan needs more lore, but in a setting like 40k anybody who displays selflesness and compassion has my instant respect. Especially when they support said compassion with a giant fucking hammer and a legion of pyromaniac africans.

>>49777030
>I don't have evidence to back up my claim that the Lion is interesting and engaging, so I'll just insult Curze instead
Truly your gene-father's son, I see.

>>49777000
You know, I wonder what it was like to be a rememberancer for the Night Lords.

Like being chained down in room with Ayn Rand, for eternity, until she randomly decides to kill you with a tire iron one day.

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>>49777119
I can't imagine your life expectancy would be very long
>>49777074
You want me to suck off Jonson? Fine. I'll suck off the Lion.
>Survived most of his early life Tarzan style on a chaos infested shithole
>Described as being the foremost tactician even among his brothers
>Despite all of his martial skill, he had very little in the way of interpersonal graces
>Gonna have to chalk that one up to his less than stellar formative years
>Ruthlessly ambitious
>Yet unshakeable loyalty to his father
>Stoic, yet dangerous when brought to anger
>Has a cultured and disciplined air about him, but still has a savage beast inside of him that sometimes lashes out

That is why I say he is flawed yet interesting

>>49777200
Well, at least you admit you want to suck off the Lion.

Careful of the barbs.

>>49777229
Take the knot!

Dark Angels manage to salvage the otherwise worthless Space Marine concept.

>>49776527

>Konrad Curze's name

>>49777310
>Ferrus Manus of the Iron Hands
>Corvus Corax of the Raven Guard
>Rogal Dorn of the Imperial Fists

If anything, senpai has one of the better primarch names.

Someone really needs to post that comic of Johnson flipping out on Guilliman for not having a shitty childhood.

>>49777363

I just think it's funny. Especially since he gets assassinated after spouting a bunch of wannabe Marlon Brando quotes.

I can't tell if GW was brilliant or completely on the nose with Konrad.

>>49777363
all of a sudden starting to realise why DAfags cling to El'Johnson as the pinnacle of depth and sophistication

>>49777363
I like Rogal Dorns name, especially when said in a deeper voice, or a loud guttural shout.

>I would totally have an imperial fist army if I could paint lighter colors...like yellow.

>settled for iron warriors.

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>>49777390
Looking at him, I'd say brilliant. But an entirely different kind of brilliant.

>>49777483
Nice; looks like he just stepped off the pages of Warhammer Armies: Undead 4th edition.

>>49777466

Ferrus, Corax, Lion, and Curze are probably the most blatant 2deep4u Pimarchs in terms of names

>>49777018
Not anymore. The Horus Heresy series really expanded on the happenings of the era.

The Lion was kinda out on the brink of space so had to make his way back which took a while.

During that time (like a few hundred years I think), he became the great defensor for the Imperium Secundus (AKA Warmaster of a mini Imperium founded by Sanguinus and Guilleman that was cut off from Terra), had something to do with a crazy ancient time machine device, and was the general bane of Curze's existence.

>>49777524
Corax, despite the emo Poe BS, yet again gets my respect by virtue of being a decent human being. Social Darwinism and "tactical genius" don't much impress me in a setting like 40k, where everyone and their servo skull has perpetrated at least one genocide.

Which loyalist chapter has the worst fanbase?
http://www.strawpoll.me/11424847

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>>49777479
>>49777524
Dorn is Celtic (IIRC) for fist. The guy's name literally means "regal fist." Hence, his inclusion alongside Iron Hands and Raven Raven.

>>49777547
I'd argue otherwise on the "decent human being" point. He still earns my respect for... other reasons.

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Dark Angels Pros:
>OG Marines, Legion I. The template the others are based off
>Phenomenal strategy and tactics. Their gene-trait inherited from the Lion, the Unforgiven are nearly unmatched in their execution of war, rivaling the Luna Wolves and the Ultramarines in getting shit done during the Crusade
>Preservers of Archeotech. Jesus christ, all that Terminator Armor and Plasma. One of the best equipped chapters in the Milky Way because they've kept their shit in good condition and know how to replace losses.
>Zealous focus on fighting the Great Enemy. No other chapter, with perhaps the exception of the Black Templars, is so dedicated to their cause as the Dark Angels are to fighting Traitors, and through them, Chaos.
>The Lion. He's alive, with his gene-sons, and definitely not Alpharius Omegon. That's more than literally any other Loyalist can say.

Dark Angels Cons:
>Secretive. With their past, they rightly fear persecution by the Imperium as a whole if the Fallen were brought to light. Better to be kind of a dick about it and be free to fight the real fight. They also don't like sharing their STCs.
>Willing to abandon Imperial allies in pursuit of Fallen. Like the above, a serious dick move, but if successful, most likely worth. The Chaos gods don't scatter you across time and space for no reason, the Fallen have a purpose. Even if it is just eternally trolling the DAngels.
>Kind of autistic. Another inherited trait from the Lion, who like all the Primarchs but a very few exceptions, was incredibly handicapped socially. Unlike the other Legions, this wasn't bred out in the gene seed.
>The Fallen. Kind of a big deal, but here we see a rare thing in 40k; a group has acknowledged that they fucked up hard, and is actively working to fix it.


All in all, they're one of the top tier Legions with god tier ascetics.

>>49777544
>and was the general bane of Curze's existence.
Until Curze tried killing Vulkan.

>>49777609
Decent by 40k standards. He's no Vulkan, but he reformed the Raven Guard from Night Lords II to "power to the people" guerrilla badasses.

>>49777524
how about vulkan? forging, and...shit

>>49777739
Vulkan, while an obvious rip of the Greek God, isn't name Forgey McBlackface, which would be his Corax/Dorn/Lion/Curze level name.

>>49777594
Dark Angels defense force in full effect.

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>>49777773
>Forgey McBlackface
That is glorious. Totally using it from now on.

>>49777773

>Greek God

Vulcan was Roman. He was analagous to Hephaestus, the actual Greek forge god.

And you're right. Vulkan's name is pretty obvious but nearly as on the nose as "Lion El'Jonson" or "Konrad Curze".

>>49777816
>Well we were originally going to go with "Vulkan" but we figured we'd up our game, so we named him Tumaal Nigrum.

>On that note, we felt "Konrad Curze" was also a bit blatant. But the design team seemed pretty confident in "Dominus Nocte" for the name of the Night Lords' Primarch.

>>49777874
Still less blatant than the Iron Hands' primarch not only being named "iron hands" but literally having... wait for it... IRON HANDS.

>>49777921

I always found Lion and Curze the most amusing in terms of their names.

Yeah, Ferrus Manus literally is Iron Hands, lord of the Iron Hands. But that's just kind of it. I mean, when you think about is it any different than say, "Batman"?

But Lion and Curze are funny because it's obvious GW think they're really fucking clever for it.

>>49776674
The imperial fists have the last wall protocol which instantly rebuilds the legion
The smurfs aren't even hiding their legion building and have a shitton more successors
So, meh

>People want space knights
>don't go for black Templars
What're you, fucking gay?

>>49777200
>Suck off the Lion.
Canadian scum!

>>49777524
Perturabo actually has a legitimately deep name, that's either a happy accident, or a moment of coolness by GW.

>>49776358
I just like the cloaks

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>>49776007
>They have no noteworthy achievements
I'd consider being the original space marines, spearhead of the entire Great Crusade, the prototype for the Legions themselves, and savior of the Imperium by stopping a Xenos invasion from the North pretty fucking notable.

> their specialization is boring as fuck
I wasn't aware that having over 100 Terminators armed with plasma cannons and special maces able to BTFO Abaddon were boring, nor the best Space Marine bikers in the galaxy. And that's not counting all of their shit from the Great Crusade like Dreadwing, which was basically killing everything that ever led using Weapons of Mass Destruction like nobody's business. Hell, the Crusade-Era Dark Angels WERE the prototype for all other Legions, and thus had everything everybody else had. CQC longsword squads, tank spam Iron Warrior style, aircraft specialization, etc. on top of that they also have other areotech weapons, like volkites.

>their color scheme is dull
What kind of cuck doesn't like green or black?

>they are just all around garbage.
Oh I get it, you got sodomized by somebody's Ravenwing List.

>>49777609
Dorn is German for thorn, his chapter is pretty fucking German and so is his homeworld, it also sounds cool

Chances are that the Celtic meaning is coincidental

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>>49778108

> the best Space Marine bikers in the galaxy

>>49778133
Technically the Ravenwing IS a top contender by virtue of it being an elite club within the legion.

Every Scar, regardless of actual skill, gets a bike by virtue of being a Scar.

Outside of crunch, however, I'd still put that a White Scar captain could whip any member of the Deathwing, otherwise shit's just not right.

>>49776358
They were what came with Dark Vengeance and I dig the cloaks n plasma.

Fluffwise is probably like wolves most.

>>49778133
White Scars don't get re-rolling Jinks. Ravenwing are hands-down superior, and Black Knights are the best bikers period. White Scars get one shitty jink, Dark Angel Black Knights can get a 2+ jink which they can roll again if they fail. So they're far more durable than Scars.

On top of that, Ravenwing all get scout, and with cheesy MSU lists you can basically start right on top of objectives.

>>49778182
I agree crunchwise Ravenwing is superior, there's no arguing that. But from a fluff perspective I find that to be bullshit. It one-ups the White Scars hat by an army that doesn't even wear said hat. It would be like if the Fists got better melee than the Wolves.

>>49776747
The thing I like about Dark Eldar is that one bit from the codex, where it has a Craftworld Farseer talking about how much of a facade their Commorrite kin put on. They have amazing beauty, affect an air of supreme lordly arrogance, and claim to murder, rape, and torture because it is their right as lords. In actuality to anyone with witch-sight, they are hollow emaciated wraiths, are batshit terrified of dying, and are basically controlled by their passions so they can keep denying death.

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>>49776358
I like Dark Angels because they're a very serious, humorless Chapter themed like Medieval knightly orders with Arhturian elements thrown in to boot, along with truly being knights unlike Templars (because Templars aren't exactly known for Bikes). Plus the Dark Angels are more interesting, as unlike other Chapters they have a PLOT. They aren't just some Chapter with stories slapped on like everybody else, the Dark Angels on a whole have a narrative that moves and changes.The only downside is that most of said books are written by Gav Thorpe and Gav never picks up a codex to do fact-checking, but it's OK if you just turn your brain off like for any BL novel.

On top of that though there is a LOT of shit to differentiate them from other Chapters. While Blood Angels frankly feel like a normal Chapter with some stuff bolted on to make them unique, Dark Angels feel unique because they are truly different- like Space Wolves. Only unlike Space Wolves, the Dark Angels didn't go full retard in their model line and aren't riding giant space horses. Plus Dark Angels are FANTASTIC if you want to make your own OC Chapter, because they have a lot more leeway than anybody else. Dark Angels have easy access to areotech, and Chapters like the Consecreators never even wear MK VII Aquila armor. It's even conceivable for them to use volkite guns in small amounts.

Finally, the Dark Angels are truly the First Legion, and thus have a lot of coolness added from the Great Crusade. They were one of the few Legions to participate in the Unification Wars' end, and were the prototype for all other Space Marines. Like the World Eaters, they were awesome until their Primarch fucked everything up.

>>49778232
The difference is that Dark Angels have 100 of the best bikers in the Galaxy.

White Scars have like, 500 of the second-best bikers in the galaxy. 2nd best only sucks if you don't outnumber the guy who is best 5:1.

>>49778255
I've always excused Gav Thorpe's Dark Angels novels as having unreliable narrators. So it's not too bad, but I see what you mean.

>>49778255
>because Templars aren't exactly known for Bikes
Neither are knights
>inb4 horses
The application, status or pretty much anything else except "lel we aren't walking" has fuck all to do with horses

>>49776171
What thread was that?

>>49778295
It has everything to do with them. Space Marine bikes act pretty much like ye olde cavalry, only with .75 caliber autocannons strapped on top of the horse's head. The idea of the knight derives entirely from mounted combat anyway, not walking.

>>49778255
Not arguing against your points, but just trying to get clarifications. I've never had civil DAngels fans to discuss with.

>unique motif
Aren't ALL Space Marines, unless stated otherwise, humorless knightly warriors? I will say they play the Arthurian theme more subtly, unlike other factions which are more forward with their gimmicks.

>fancy gear
I guess if you're looking for a more conventional reason to use FW bitz. I could come up with a reason for any chapter to have old gear if I really wanted those FW bitz. Also with a few exceptions aren't all DAngels successors all just DAngels by another name? If you want to fluff a truly unique chapter from Lion gene-seed you need to deal with giving the finger to the parent chapter and their Fallen hunt.

>model lines and great crusade
No arguments there. What a fucking shitshow with the wolves. Goddamn, all I wanted was to play vikings. Also were the DAngels really the template or just the first? I was under the impression the Legion numbers were kinda arbitrary.

>>49778318
You have no fucking idea about cavalry, Jesus Christ.
Space marine bikers are dragoons at best, you also don't need steeds for charges if you're a walking tank
And a knight was somebody able to afford a horse and fight in combat, not necessarily ride one, cavalry wasn't always the big hammer it ended up being in the nifty parts of the middle ages and knights were a thing long before that

Hell, the Romans had knights already and they stopped actually being part of the cavalry before they even had significance as a social class
Cicero came from a knight-family for example

>>49778362
They look cool and are kind of sinister. Nice color schemes, and their termies and bikes have variety.

>>49776858
>the black templar are about as big
Not anymore.

>>49778362
>Aren't ALL Space Marines, unless stated otherwise, humorless knightly warriors? I will say they play the Arthurian theme more subtly, unlike other factions which are more forward with their gimmicks.
Not really. Dark Angels are mostly cynical and cold. While many Chapters (Space Wolves, Blood Angels, Ultramarines, Imperial Fists, jump to mind) are kind to some degree- Dark Angels sure as hell ain't. Hell it's actually shocking when you find a Dark Angel who is kind and compassionate, as they stand out from their number. Compared to the Crimson Fists or Ultramarines who will actually sacrifice a space marine to protect a baby, it's a jarring difference.

>I guess if you're looking for a more conventional reason to use FW bitz. I could come up with a reason for any chapter to have old gear if I really wanted those FW bitz. Also with a few exceptions aren't all DAngels successors all just DAngels by another name? If you want to fluff a truly unique chapter from Lion gene-seed you need to deal with giving the finger to the parent chapter and their Fallen hunt.
They're not a single Legion anymore. Azrael, as Supreme Grand Master and commander of the hunting of the Fallen, can call any Chapter to his side in time of need, but otherwise they are free to manage and run themselves. The Angels of Absolution for example do not even believe they carry the sin of the Fallen anymore, and only hunt the Fallen to help out their brothers, but otherwise consider themselves absolved. Plus Dark Angel organization is very... open. We don't know if they actually just have 1,000 space marines. Deathwing and Ravenwing officially only have 100 space marines each, but these numbers could be easily falsely reported. The Consecrators are also weirdos, because they horde relics and areotech and their Grand Master is an Interrogator Chaplain who managed to get his hands on a Heavenfall Blade.

>I was under the impression the Legion numbers were kinda arbitrary.
They were the first.

>>49778373
>Space marine bikers are dragoons at best, you also don't need steeds for charges if you're a walking tank
You do if you want to get into melee. It's why bikers all wield chainswords by default (along with a special weapon or bolt pistol), and why the Black Knights all have cavalry hammers.

And Romans didn't have Knights, they were a later thing resulting from the formation of feudalism in Europe. Romans had Cataphracts, which were different and behaved differently in combat due to lacking stirrups.

>>49777046
>salamanders
>africans

Oh boy

>>49778577
Salamanders are actually more greek than anything else with their whole PROMETHEAN CULT and VULKAN'S FIRE BEATS WITHIN MY BREAST.

>>49778584
I'll admit I was just trying to play up the "don't piss off the scary black men by being an asshole" trope.

>>49778553
More of a fluff than a crunch thread, but does anyone have ideas on how to get more defensive ability out of a fast-attack force? Bikes aren't so good at holding objectives, but I want to shore up the gaps in my White Scars. It's really hard to be BOTH the hammer AND the anvil.

>>49778622
Don't try being an anvil.

>>49778622
>More of a fluff than a crunch thread, but does anyone have ideas on how to get more defensive ability out of a fast-attack force? Bikes aren't so good at holding objectives, but I want to shore up the gaps in my White Scars. It's really hard to be BOTH the hammer AND the anvil.
Scouts. Scout scouts scouts. Stick 'em in a land speeder and watch them seize objectives and hold them for a while with their camo cloaks. Most people underestimate them too despite them having BS 4 WS 4 now. Honestly they're flatly superior to normal space marines in terms of points.

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>>49776007
/tg/ has made me hate every single chapter in turn. I can't think of a single chapter that isn't the worst, the shittiest, the most idiotic. There are no good chapters at all.

>>49778676
Also if you want something more durable, there's Centurions with a libby.

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>>49776358
I like the old Native American themes, and there's not really been any other chapter to pick up on that, so...

>>49778809
Deathwing was retconned completely. Also there's probably some Raven Guard chapter that is pretty native american-y.

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>>49778818
I've never heard of it being retconned. If nothing else, the Tale of Two Heads Talking is still considered canon, even as just a story that's told to young neophytes. Who's to say it doesn't have a ring of truth - that there's a Plains World out there with native-themed tribesmen?

And trust me, there's no Native American themed anything else in 40k.

>>49776815
We know why though, dark angels suck at secret keeping compared to the alpha legion who what we all know about them is probably the top layer of immense amounts of deception and fuckery

>>49778120
youre also wrong, the fists are prussians. their successor chapter black templars are germanic though.

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I'd rather people focused more on the DA successor chapters. The Guardians of the Covenant have gotten some nebulous fan fluff out there that some people have mistaken as real, but the actual lore for them is solid, and they aren't solely defined by the hunt for the Fallen. Similiarly, the Angels of Vengeance are more defined by how stupidly stubborn they are. So they both feel distinct from the Dark Angels.

And then there's the Angels of Vigilance, who aren't confirmed Dark Angels successors but their lore makes it obvious, and they're badasses who do their best to fuck up anything that comes out of the Eye of Terror. They'd be cool if you wanted a DA successor that it's reasonable to assume have nothing to do with the Hunt at all, since they aren't acknowledged by their parent chapter.

There's a lot more variety to the DA than people give them credit for, and a lot of their worst excesses are more stuff for chapters like the Angels of Redemption.

>>49778807
I'm just so damn indecisive about what I want in an army. I love surgical strikes and focused power, but I also love shrugging off damage.

>>49779050
I can also recommend a Contemptor Dreadnought with an assault cannon. When it fails it fails, but rending can allow it to more than make its points back. Same with a Sicaran.

>>49778028
canadians suck off lions?

>>49777020
I want to believe.

>>49779079
I wish there were more mecha options for Space Marines besides cripples on life support. Not that I dislike dreads, it just seems cruel from a fluff perspective to have a Chapter who's specialty is "dreadnoughts"

>>49777483
>Entirely different kind of brilliant
That's where GW thrived, anon.

>>49779110
It's only a cripple if you view it as damnation, like the Scars. For the Iron Hands it's an honor they will try to get even if they are healthy.

>>49777951
Hey, there's a difference between 'think they're really fucking clever' and 'heck, we all chuckled, throw it in'.

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Who is the hero the Dark Angels and Imperium need and why is he Cypher?

>>49778506
>Not really. Dark Angels are mostly cynical and cold. While many Chapters (Space Wolves, Blood Angels, Ultramarines, Imperial Fists, jump to mind) are kind to some degree- Dark Angels sure as hell ain't. Hell it's actually shocking when you find a Dark Angel who is kind and compassionate, as they stand out from their number. Compared to the Crimson Fists or Ultramarines who will actually sacrifice a space marine to protect a baby, it's a jarring difference.
Iron Hands also fit under this description for obvious reasons. The trans-loyal Dork Angles are retarded edgy teenager tier anon, still isn't furfag fruit cake tier like Space Yiffs or The Hanged, but you're basically one tier above them if you are a DAfag. With all the lions and ravens in DA lore one could argue they they too are animal fuckers like the aforementioned chapters, still, Dork Angle fans generally are slightly less autistic than Space Yiff fans but equally as insufferable, every son of Russ I have met is a fat socially inept faggot who most certainly faps to furries and anime.

>>49779253
Really killed the mood of the thread there, anon. Is this OP trying to steer the thread back into bait?

>>49778846
When the hell was the decision made to jump from Native American to Arthurian? That's a damn big leap.

>>49778120
Mate, you really think the Imperial Fists having a primarch with a name that is a translation and letter away from being Royal Fist ... is a coincidence?

GW is a British company, not exactly unlikely that they'd have someone on the staff who knows a word of celtic/cornish/etc

>>49776358
Or the third response: "I bought the starter set with a friend and didn't have the heart to paint them differently from the bos art. Also robes on my vets sounds cool."

>>49779485
They're a Prussian Legion, with a stiff-lipped British Primarch, who grew up on an Eskimo planet.

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>>49779253
Are you retarded, or have even read DA fluff? They only have a couple lion motiffs ever mentioned, typically the names of swords, bolters, and ships.

But of course, why am I bothering with a degenerating /b/ poster like you? Do us a favor and go knot yourself.

>>49779614
*degenerate

Fucking autocorrect.

>>49779614
What about the Raven motif? They have more Raven stuff than the Raven Guard - Ravenwing, Deathwing (originally related to the Thunderbird motif, but still a wing), Dark Talon...

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>>49779632
Oh, I forgot the Corvus Hammers.

The only thing the DA did that was good was BTFO of the edgy teen Night Lords.

Other then that, they are pretty shit.

>>49779632
They name stuff after certain animals. Why aren't you bitching at the US military?

>>49776445
>Fists' is the color of piss
You're doing it wrong. Yellow urine means you need to drink more water.

>>49778910
>youre also wrong, the fists are prussians.
Prussian duchy founded by Teutonic Knight, majority of population spoke German, capital in Berlin for 300+ years out of 490, united with Brandenburg Germans to form Prussian kingdom, but still not Germanic? What exactly about the fists marks them as Old Prussian?

>>49779485
>GW is a British company, not exactly unlikely that they'd have someone on the staff who knows a word of celtic/cornish/etc

Actually, at the time the primarchs were named it would have been very unlikely.

>>49779230
IT'S CYPHER, WHACK HIM!

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I'll explain how Dark Angels are cool

Its 1995, your mate is playing Genestealers, a few plebs and a Carnifex

You rock up with a Marine Squad, a Dreadnaught, a landspeeder and THESE.

This is considered a big game, Terminators in white armour are still considered a big deal. This is the definition of nerd cool in 1995

>>49776358
I think I like Lion El'Jonson more than the Dark Angels, really.
>I like his backstory- the man of the forest shit, never seeing humanity etc is very mythical.
>I like the idea that he's such a genetically-engineered super-general that he was raised by a carnivorous pyscho jungle and came out of it as one of the best strategists and tacticians of all the primarchs.
>I like that he's immensely gifted and immensely flawed in that edgy way.
>I like his contrast to Leman Russ- Leman jumps around screaming about how much of a wildcunt he is, how everyone's gotta be careful because he's such a loose cannon
>"omg what will I do next what an animal"
>Leman had a sort of family and grew up on the outskirts of human society and is objectively a boastful showoff that isn't half as good as he thinks
>Meanwhile Lion pretends to be normal but he's legitimately disturbed, is concerned with the trappings of civilisation but next to Kurze is one of the least human of the primarchs
So edgy reasons, as I said.


DA themselves, I ignore a lot of the shit about them that I don't like
>arthurian knight/knightly order theme, very monastic
>perfectionism leading to their specialist wings
>ironically hyper-competent, yet constantly distracted by their own paranoia and insecurity
I would like the Fallen lore if it was a more foreboding thing in the background, but instead it's beaten across your face constantly. Every DA story, every DA equipment, every mention of them is about the Fallen.

They should be called the Dark Johnsons.

Johnson Wing, prepare to deep strike!

Is the Sarosh complance their first engagement after finding Lion or it just the first thats been in the books

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>>49776674

I agree to this.

As time passes I find myself more and more attracted to the Dark Angels.

They're one of the coolest chapters around.

Not to mention their great fallen history, which still sparks doubts and leaves room for speculation.

>>49777663
>phenomenal strategy and tactics

such as?

>>49777663

>Implying the highest echelons of Terra and the Inquisition dont already know about the fallen and are not purposefully forcing the Dark Angels to hide the shameful secret so they stay competitive and active as a military force

>>49778120
>IF are krauts

stopped liking them to be honest

>>49781356

And Crimson Fists are mexican and Howling Griffons spanish

>>49781384
I'd rather have mexicans than krauts. But it explains why IF is so autistic.

>>49778299
Last night. Got pretty salty

The thing that turned me off Dark Angels was when this one DAfag insisted Lion El'Jonson was one of the strongest primarchs and that Luther had all 4 blessings and was equal to Horus. Still leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

>>49776007
>not liking the one massive gay joke the chapter

GW is retarded and clearly couldn't decide what DA are even supposed to be
>knights in space
>but at the same time they are very shooty
Black Templars fill that niche better

>>49781537
>A stupid thing a stupid person said once continues to cloud my viewpoint

Anti-DAfags are the worst. They turn a hobby that's supposed to be about collecting your favorite color of fantasy space men into an autistic shit-flinging contest.

And DAfags that reply with "At least we aren't space-yiffs" are just catalysts.

I understand friendly banter, but this shit is bordering on mental illness.

>>49776447
I don't find the Dark Angels hugely interesting, but Lion was pretty cool. Anyone who made Russ look like a bitch is pretty cool in my books.

How did such a shit Primarch father such a cool Legion?

>>49782165
It's because Space Marine fanbase in general is mental.

>>49777390
Can't it be both?

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>>49782256
And thats why tau are the best

>>49779614
>only a couple lion motifs ever mentioned
>lions all over primarchs armour
>lion blade
>lion helm

Go get barbed some more anon

>>49776007
Dark Angels have a tonne of achievements. I won't list them all, but here's a short selection:


>Have passed two Inquisition inspections. How many other chapters can say that? Imperial Fists have never even passed one.

>Have done more to punish traitors on an individual basis than any other chapter

>Mentors other chapters on how to interact with their peers, such as the selfish Black Templars and the mouthy Space Wolves

>Were a legion first, which means everyone else owes them

>Cleanest First Founding Angels

>Name is actually a reference to 19th century author Charles Dickens

>Lions are better animals than wolves. They're the king of the Jungle and they don't even live in jungles.

>Homeworld is a reference to Shakespear play "The Iliad"

>Defeated an entire Tyranid hive fleet once, and that was just with their terminators

>Most color schemes of any single chapter

>Biggest functioning ship in the Imperium

>Also built their own ship, not just fucking awarded it as a consolation prize because you can't be trusted to leave Terra without wiping yourselves out

>Canon confirmed living Primarch with two hands

>Chapter Master totally beat Grey Knight absentee leader Kaldor Draigo in a fight. He didn't even throw a punch he just asked a question. If he did throw a punch it would have had the genetic power of Lion El'Jonsons punch and decked him. He just decided not to do that is all

>Best Chaplain

>>49782905
>selfish Black Templars
>implying Dark Angels also known as ''HURR GONNA FUCKING DITCH EVERYTHING AND CHASE THE FALLEN BECAUSE WE CAN'T GET OVER OUR SCHISM'' are the ones to talk

>>49782937
Dark Angels help other chapters all the time. They've just dropped everything to fix a struggling chapters homeworld.

>>49777547
I agree.

Corax was baller.

>>49782905
The rock is a reference to a gay bar, their Primarch to a gay writer who committed suicide and their name to a book made by said gay writer.

>>49780725
I was 6 in 1995.

>>49782905
>Have IF's ever needed an Inquisitorial inspection
>Do you mean the Fallen
>Source
>True
>Apart from that big chunk of legion that fell
>?
>True
>Tempest*
>Which one? (Honest question)
>True
>Or the Phalanx, no-one here can be sure
>Inwit built the Phalanx. It was gifted to Emps then returned to Rogal
>Does being locked in a stasis field counts as dead?
>Grey Knight informed him they know about the Fallen. Bricks were shat anon
>Ultramarine best evreything

>>49776358
I *like* that they remain technically legion-strength while nominally split into chapters. It makes them likable that they realized organizationally big>>small

I look at their Fallen hunt as a sort of comedic tragedy. Literally no one would have cared if they came back and said "yeah, some of our guys went crazy," every single chapter had a few heretics in it, and you don't see the White Scars trying to hide that shit. But instead they kept it a secret. Then people found out so they had to kill them to keep the secret. Then people found out about the killings so they had to do even MORE shit and so on and so forth.

It's clear that these days the Dark Angel's real sin is all the crimes they've committed protecting their secrets, and that if The High Lords DID learn everything there was to know about the Fallen, they'd probably be unimpressed and unwilling to declare the Dark Angels heretics, but if they learned about all the dark shit done to suppress knowledge of the Fallen, they'd definitely declare the Dark Angels Traitors.

>>49777363
>>Rogal Dorn of the Imperial Fists
eh? what's this one a translation of?

Hey guys what's going on in this thread can we join?

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>>49783137

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>>49776991
That's the reason I play GoC.
Screw the first founders.

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>>49782905
>Best chaplain
Cassius, Ulrik, Grimaldus and Lemartes are each infinitely more interesting than that emo kid Asmodai.

>>49783341
To be fair, even the DA think Asmodai is psychologically disturbed.

>>49776007
>something a 15yo metalcore fan could come up with they are just all around garbage.

Except it was a english poet instead.

>>49782905

>>Lions are better animals than wolves. They're the king of the Jungle and they don't even live in jungles.

You don't see Wolves performing in Circus for our enterteinment either.

Lions are bitches.

I'm sad that I missed this thread, but remember that our primarch is One Punch Man.
Also, Lion el'Jonson greentext, ect.

>>49783461
Poets are the most overrated people right after philosophers literally just spew a bunch of artsy shit with no actual meaning.

>>49783846

I dunno, poetry can be kinda fun sometimes.

>>49783846
Both suffer from the issue that you have to put in effort to decipher any meaning, which means that it's real easy for shit poets and philosophers to disguise their bullshit with flowery prose. And then you feel cheated because after you put in the effort to look into the poem/essay you notice "wait this is one of the crap ones" and you feel you've wasted your time.

>>49783487
Adding on to this, when you hear a wolf howl in movies they use a wolf. When you hear a lion roar, they use a tiger.

Lions are bitches.

>>49777921
>Still less blatant than the Iron Hands' primarch not only being named "iron hands" but literally having... wait for it... IRON HANDS.

You looking at it from completly wrong angle. You got it all backwards. He gaines IRON HANDS from fighting spooky necrontyr beast. People start calling him IRON HANDS in their language. Then his legion comes about names STORMWALKERS but to venerate him they decide to be called IRON HANDS after him.

>>49784409
From an in-lore perspective it's somewhat justifiable, but from a meta perspective its incredibly stupid design.

>>49783487
No one pays money to watch wolves perform in the circus either.

>>49783047
>>Have IF's ever needed an Inquisitorial inspection

Yes, for incompetence and on multiple occasions.

>>Source

Black Templars had a useless ship that they probably couldn't even man properly. Then they incorrectly used the cells on that ship. Dark Angels tried to stop them, but the Templars ended up losing both the spacecraft and a traitor they had captured. Ungrateful Templars didn't even say thanks afterwards.

>>Which one? (Honest question)

It's a joke about the old Deathwing origin story that's been retconned to a myth the Dark Angels spread among their own ranks.

>>Does being locked in a stasis field counts as dead?

Not locked, waiting.

>>49784767
You're the most delusional DAfag I've ever met, you must get barbed all day long.

>>49784544

>Hey guys, we have a legion called the Dark Angels. We'll call their leader Lionel Johnson.
>Hey guys, we have a legion called the Raven Guard. We'll call their leader Corvus.
>Hey guys, we have a legion of angsty renegades. We'll call their leader Konrad Curze

Much of 40k is ridiculously stupid from a meta perspective.

>>49784915
As a 40k fan I agree with this statement, even the tiny goofy webcomic gone with the blastwave setting is better at the futuristic and grim theme, 40k is a comedy gone autism.

>>49784900
>Get barbed

What is this? I saw you mention it earlier in the thread.

>>49785088

He means he thinks the guy should go take a lion dick. Barbed cat penises, and all.

>>49781537
>Lion El'Jonson was one of the strongest primarchs

That's always arguable bullshit. At best you might be able to argue he's one of the more balanced strategists, but Gulliman probably has him beat overall for his relative flexibility.

>Luther had all 4 blessings and was equal to Horus

At best that's half true. Most lore about Luther is vague, but some of it depicts him as something of a mini-Horus - after he defeats the Lion, the powers of the Warp leave him and he regrets his mistake, as Horus did when the Gods stopped pouring power into him.

>>49784976
40k was never "comedy", it had a satirical edge to it but took its own setting and rules seriously.

>>49785164

I always saw original 40k as similar to movies like Total Recall, where it was an otherwise serious sci fi setting interspersed with dark humor and on-the-nose satire.

>>49785164
It was comedy in the same way watching one of the Rambo sequels is comedy.

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>>49785122
>Space Wolf players can't even call people furries without exposing their yiff level

>>49781384
>Howling Griffons spanish
lolwut

Their heraldry is literally Welsh.

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>>49785315

Personally, I think this whole DAfags vs Space Yiffs "rivalry" is one of the most obnoxious, forced excuses for shitposting I've ever seen.

>>49785362
No fucking shit, anon.

>>49782905
Am I the only one that gets the sarcastic humor in this? Well played, anon.

>>49785362
Somebody keeps starting these threads anon. At least they've learned not to use that same Russ image anymore, though.

>>49785506
There is no limit to how trivial and silly you can be about 40K lore. They will take it seriously.

>>49785315
I'm not a space wolf player, everyone hates the dork angles, and everyone knows canines and felines have knotted and barbed dicks.

>>49781537
I posted something like that once.

It's frankly saddening that I even have to clarify that it was a joke.

You need to stop taking this so seriously.

He did take a hit hard enough to destroy a planet though. The one that killed the Emperor didn't even destroy the ship he was on. Just saying.

>Dangles are caught with a Fallen
>Crimson Sabers a nobody Chapter beats them so severely and kills so many Dangles, the Dangles flee the sector in terror
>Crimson Sabers become the Crimson Slaughter and decide to slap the Dangles a bit more, kill dozens of Dangles, steal all the geneseed, Dangles lie there and take it

Why are the Dangles the worst fucking Chapter EVER

>>49786075
The Crimson Slaughter are the most powerful chapter to have ever existed. Had anyone but the Dark Angels attempted to fight them. they would have been wiped out.

The fact that the Dark Angels still managed to overcome the odds and kill the Crimson Slaughter Chapter Master just proves that they are the true sons of the only real Primarch.

>>49786020
That'd be cool and all, except it was a dead-serious guy at my local shop. I honestly don't mind that much, considering I have a DA army myself, but it still annoys me.

>>49783846
I can tell you've read 0 literary works from any poets or philosophers besides what you have read in High school, assuming you've even graduated.

>>49786301
There's a part in that book where a dangle gets btfo'd by 2-3 chaos cultists

>>49786977
Alright, well don't antagonized him, anon. The only thing worse than ignoramuses who've never read poetry outside of English class are snobs who scare people off of good reading by being pole-rectums.

>>49787220
Cultists are underrated.

We don't know who cut off Dorn. It could have been cultists.

>>49787738
I thought it was khornate berzerkers

>>49786301
>kill the Crimson Slaughter Chapter Master
But Kranon is still alive.

>>49788079
>be Khornate Berzerker
>cut off hand instead of head

Khorne is not amused.

>>49788479
HANDS FOR THE HAND THRONE!

>>49776007
Imperial Fists are the most shit 1st Founding Chapter though. They're the only one who were killed to a man and had to be replaced

>>49788460
It was a bit up in the air for a while, since GW seemed to go back and forth on what exactly happened to the Crimson Slaughter. At one point, he was just killed off - at another, he survived. Sort of like how the jury was out on if the Crimson Slaughter were damned by Khorne, if they fell willingly to his service, or whatever.

>>49776358
The problem I have with the Dark Angels is not their dirty little secret, but rather how it's handled. Them trying to cover up the Fallen is fine, and hell, so is even the obsessive extent to which they take it, including killing other loyal Imperials.

The problem is that they show absolutely no remorse for it, nor do they even seem to notice the hypocrisy. Not a single one of them, based on the codex and stories I've read.

It's made even worse with the Horus Heresy showing that other Loyalist legions had dissidents as well, and yet for some reason, the Dark Angels see the Fallen situation as far worse. Hell, didn't the White Scars have something like 1/3 of their legion go rogue during the Horus Heresy?

I know it goes against what's stated, but I apply the theory that the Dark Angels are actually the Lutherites, who won the war over Caliban, and the Fallen are actually the remnants of the original Loyalist Dark Angels. The Lion is a prisoner in the Rock, Luther is running the chapter from the shadows, and Cypher is trying to present the evidence of this to the Emperor/High Lords of Terra.

Again, I know it's not really supported by the canon, but it's the only way I can buy the Dark Angels being as OBSESSED about keeping their secret, to the point of murdering other Imperials, as they are, despite the secret really not being all that bad, nor unique to them.

>>49788692
>Again, I know it's not really supported by the canon,
It's not "really not supported" by the canon, it's completely against it. We've seen Luther specifically in the Legacy of Caliban series, and he isn't running anything. Plus the Fallen are in bed with Typhus.

>there are still people so jealous of how awesome Dark Angels are that they must make threads to whine about it with fellow beta fags
Fells good to be the First.

>>49788692

>but I apply the theory that the Dark Angels are actually the Lutherites, who won the war over Caliban, and the Fallen are actually the remnants of the original Loyalist Dark Angels.

Personally I like the idea it's the other way around. Luther was the true loyalist, and went CIVIL WAR on Lion because he was tired of the latter's flaky, fence-sitting attitude.

I like the idea the modern DAs are the Lutherites, and they're keeping the Lion prisoner because even if Lion gets out and decides to stay loyal it would still cause a huge shit storm.

I really wish GW rolled with the DA's ambiguous loyalty better, instead of leaving it as a footnote which basically amounts to little more than ">implying".

>>49777951
>clever
Nah, it was just tongue-in-cheek fucking about, it was all the rage in naming things back then

>t.Inquisitor Obi-Wan Clouseu, writing from the asteroid Minogue K, orbiting Birmingham, the Black Planet, Wheel of Fire sector (also known as Zit)

>>49788760
Is what I say.

>>49788794
I like that way of looking at it, too.

And yeah, GW wiping over the Dark Angels and making them and the Lion unambiguously loyal, if questionable, ruined a fair bit of their fun, IMO. The implication that Lion intentionally held back his legion until the tail end of the Siege of Terra, along with a few other situations that showed a potentially shady dedication, made both him and the Dark Angels more interesting.

However, the Horus Heresy outright shows that Lion El'Jonson was not only loyal, but SUPER loyal, and the Dark Angels' delayed arrival to Terra was all a JUST AS PLANNED by Kurze. Dropping that mystique and ambiguous loyalty makes the Dark Angels rather boring, in my opinion.

>>49788692
The Dark Angels have become so obsessed with hiding their shame it has gone beyond the original reasons for covering it - shame that the 1st Legion might not be the purest. Their pride in themselves and their history is an integral part of their identity, as can be seen by how unready Dark Angels react to learning the truth about the existence of heretics from their Chapter.

Basically, the Dark Angels are just self-obsessed enough that they can't bear to be seen as worse than anyone else - even if other Space Marines have gone through similar or worse things than them. They see themselves as the best of the best, not barbarians like the White Scars or Space Wolves, and not as inflexible as the Ultramarines. They're pricks.

If I were to quantify why I like DA it might come down to almost solely aesthetics. The Fallen, Cypher, and they're dubious loyalty are all side dressing to the Catholic themes, bone robes, incense burners, even the fact that they have green armor. Ayup, Da is my favorite chapter because green is my favorite armor, second is Salamanders because they're total bros.

That and they have cool units, access to gear other chapters don't get, and plasma is hell of cool. They are unique in the fact that they have the Darkshroud, the Nephilim, and they're special units like the Deathwing and the Ravenwing.

Probably repeated myself more that once so:
>the Fallen are a cool secret
>Cypher is an interesting plotline if it will ever get continued/resolved
>Green and plasma are both sweet
>I like the secretive pseudo-catholic cabal atmosphere of their whole chapter

Speaking of Dark Angels, why is Azreal so fucking useless for them ? I know it's funny when people say they will take him for some cheap mob but in pure Dark Angels army ?

>costs almost as much as other Chapter Masters but no Eternal Warrior or AP2 weapon, making him a chump in close combat that will die if he eats a power fist
>is a Lord of War so he can't be fielded in a Ravenwing or Deathwing Strike Force, which is like 2/3 of Dark Angel Armies
>gives LD10 to an army that has LD8 at a minimum, Stubborn and in some cases even Fearless
>picks a Warlord trait from a mostly bad table
>grants 4++ to his unit but is too expensive to keep him in a shooty unit, Terminators meant for close combat will already have either 3++ or at least 5++ with 4++ doing nothing for either at his points. The only unit that would benefit from this, the Honour Guard (good fighters that come stock with power weapons but no inv save) IS NOT IN THIS CODEX

Am I fucking missing something ? It's like they purposely gave him abilities that do nothing for his fucking army. The only thing that's useful about him is the +1 to Seize but for 200+ fucking points ? When for only 50-60 points more Calgar is better at buffing his army AND has power fists that strike at initiative ?

What the fuck were they thinking ?

>>49788775
People make the same sort of threads about the space wolves, does that mean they're the best too?

>>49790094
That's because you stick Azrael and a Master of the Forge in an Achilles Land Raider.

File: 896a4732fe03811896db14cd862022cd.jpg (55KB, 415x599px) Image search: [Google]

55KB, 415x599px

>>49776457
I always imagine a scottish savvy Dark Angel welcoming new recruits to the base.

"Welcome to The Rock"

During training he will remind them that winners get to go home and fuck the prom queen

>>49780682
I GOT HI- WHAT WHERE'S HE GONE TO?!!!

>>49783031
I was 7.

>>49790094
I think that GW would rather just Black Templar them, but they're one of the Big Four chapters and probably sell well.

They keep them around but they're not going to put the effort in to fix them up from their half-finished 4th edition state.

>>49790532
Cypher never left. He was in your heart all along.