EDH/Commander General

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Moving this over from the other thread

Post 'em boys

Help me pick my first commander lads
Mostly play legacy, kind of hate creature combat, don't really want more than 2 colors

>>49280212
Mizzix Storm.

>>49280173
>Zurgo's uninteresting voltron shit
>Tariel's shit in general
>Oros is boring
>Kaalia is a gimmick engine
>Alesha would be okay if she could do better than revive small shit
>Marchesa just draws you a card

Why are the mardu commanders so boring or gimmicky? Jeskai was just as bad until Narset was released.

>>49280212
I play jihoria and Braids, Conjurer Adept

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>>49280205
A-anon I just made a thingie and this one requires way too much information about myself that no one cares about. Why would you do this to me?

Who is the more fun goblin commander, Zada or Krenko? I wanna try monored because I hate myself and if I'm gonna do it, it has to be gobos.

>>49280279
We all care about you, anon-kun~

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>>49280205

SON OF A BITCH I forgot to order a Skyline Despot for Feldon.

>>49280323
Don't lie on the internet, no one cares about anyone else, let alone some they don't know. The real reason I don't want to fill this out is because I don't really have friends or a meta.

>>49280284
Krenko, Lord of never having to enter combat.

>ordered an Eldrazi Conscription off of Ebay two weeks ago
>still hasn't arrived
>ordered an Enchanted Evening from TCGplayer like four days ago
>it's already here
I don't know why I ever use anything else.

>>49280255
>Jeskai was just as bad until Narset was released.
>Narset isn't just a gimmicky commander

Also, it's because Wizard hates RW.

Any useful B or G recursion enchantments or effects like Rancor?

>>49280945
Narset escapes that because you can literally build anything non-creature with her: Voltron, pillowfort, tokens, enchantments, artifacts, whatever.
And she's nowhere near the level of the other jeskai commanders like Ruhan or Zedruu where there's really only one way to play them.

I can believe that about RW though. At least Kalemne is sort of fun. But that's because I like dropping big creatures without green.

>>49280205
I'm not autistic enough for this

How viable is Shirei? cool card

>>49281354
I ran a Shirei deck for a long time. It's fun when it gets going and there are a lot of toys, but at the end of the day it's dependent on a pricey general that's very easy to kill without protection.

>>49280205
I'm not narcissistic enough for this

>>49281354
Define "viable." Shirei is a cool card but you're not exactly going to be winning tournaments. The deck's major downfall is that without the general you're largely running a bunch of shitty 1/Xs that don't do much.

>>49280284
New Grenzo.

Can any of the currently available UMPCs play Borderlands 2?

>>49281475
Wrong thread?

>Borderlands 2
GET OUT

>>49281500
Ah, that's what went wrong. Also,
>GET OUT
>>>/reddit/

Is Xiahou a meme or legit?

>>49281551
He's arguably top 3 for monoblack commanders, so he's legit, I guess?

>>49281551
Very legit. Easily one of the best mono-B commanders.

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>>49280205
Don't feel like filling this out, so I'm just going to post my commanders

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Since I caught this one early, I have a few stupid questions that I'm struggling to find additional answers to.

I've got a deck revolving around a Lab Man combo, but part of the combo needs to involve instantly getting him onto the field as soon as I draw him. So far my solutions to this have been Vedalken Orrery, Leyline of Anticipation, Savage Summoning, and Flash (the spell). Are there any other ways to do this? I have ways to pitch him to the yard at instant speed, so instant-speed reanimation is also possible (I already have Necromancy, but I have no idea what else exists for this). Any card is viable - this combo is part of a 5c deck.

What are some other ways to get this twat onto the field at instant speed after I draw him? Again, it's looking like Flash-enablers and Reanimation are my two best avenues, as the deck he's in is spell-heavy, but frequently draws the entire deck in a single turn (in pieces that can be responded to, hence the need for him at instant speed). What are my options?

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>>49281568
>arguably top 3
>>49281574
>one of the best
Not that anon, but doesn't that mean Gonti is bound to be pretty good? They both have the same cost and both give +1 CA, but Gonti leaves behind a deathtouch body and replaces Regrowth with bizarro-Impulse.

>>49281628
Just do Doomsday Lab Man like the non-retards.

>>49281653
Stop. Just stop.

>>49281653
Not even close. Gonti relies on using your opponent's cards which is incredibly unreliable and consequently is virtually impossible to combo out with. That said, he looks to be pretty decent, but nowhere near the best. I especially like the fact that you can cast the card even after Gonti bites the dust and the fact that he can be used to deny opponents useful cards, but meh.

>>49280212
Dralnu control

>>49281658
But you see
I am a special snowflake
So I cannot do that

How does something like Deflecting Palm work with Gisela? If a gisela swings at me for 5 damage that would be 10 and then I deflecting palm it back to her controller, do I deal 5 or 2.5 damage?

>>49280212
Toshi Umezawa.

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Are they at all playable as a commander?

>>49281857
5

>>49281975
I wish, but no, they're pretty much awful

>>49281975
It is a legendary creature, and not banned, so yes, you can use it as a commander.

>>49282063
(You)

>>49281857

Gisela swings for 5 at you, you decide the order of the replacement effects, you decide her damage doubles first, then you prevent 10 with deflecting Palm

Deflecting Palm then creates another instance of 10 damage, gisela replaces that with 5

If you choose replacement effects in the wrong order, instead deflecting Palm prevents 5 damage, gisela can't double damage that's prevented, then the deflecting Palm damage is halted to 5

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>>49280205
Omnath master race and friends coming through.

>>49280755
I thought the beard was his teeth

>>49282077

Any combo that needs more than 2-3 cards is almost impossible to implement in a game.

>>49282119
Stax

>>49281975

If they were 2cmc WB, and the abilities cost only taps and no mana, they would still barely be playable

They need haste and untap shenanigans to do ANYTHING faster than once every 2 turns starting 2 turns after you fucking cast them

They are atrocious

>>49282131
Stax is more of a powerful synergy deck.

>>49282119

Not necessarily, it depends on how specific the cards are, if most or all the pieces of the combo have redundancies it becomes much easier

>>49281975
Man, I really wanna like this card. It's flavorful and toolboxy. It's just too damn slow.

It's not my area of expertise, but anyone know of some untap stuff you could use to abuse it or even just make it more playable?

>>49282185
Thousand-Year Elixir is the first one that comes to mind

>>49281975

Remove the first ability and the fate counter clauses on the other two abilities

Now it's viable

>>49281975
Be better to run them in Abzan with Seedborne Muse, but obviously they're not the commander.

>>49282217
At that point, it's busted as all fuck.

>>49282119
Sorry, why did you quote me with that? Because of Marchesa? Because all I need for her is her and Big Black Mike. That or Mike and Trike if I wanna just win.

>>49282261
See Gwafa Hazid, Profiteer for something similar.

It would be amazing, and I'd run it, but I don't think it would be completely busted.

>>49282317
Gwafa isn't nearly that good.

>>49281653
Gonti would make a fun commander. Likely nothing more, and nothing less.

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We're pretty chill.

>>49282745
Tell me more of boardwipes.dec

I must know its secrets

(and, more importantly, if it's fun to play with/against)

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>>49280205
I'm too damn lazy to do this but here's my generals
Also I just made Nü Elf-fu, felt great busting our resident Derevi player's skull with a 204/204 Omnath. Anyone want to help me trim the fat from the deck a little bit? More so on the land I'm already planning on putting a Mosswort Bridge and a Dryad Arbor but other than that i'm at a loss.http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/selvala-heart-of-the-wilds-g/

>>49282745
>Trashdrazi
I like that man

>>49281975
Remove the tap symbol from the first ability and you have a solid, but not great commander.

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Never Forgetti

-Love Daretti

>>49281704
Is that the take away from gonti's text? That you can cast the exiled cards even if gonti is not on the field? If so that makes him super cool to me.

>>49282993
>him
Gonti is AGENDERED YOU SHITLORD

>>49282993
>For as long as that card remains exiled

>>49282185
Magewright's stone
Sword of the paruns
Illusionist's bracers
Puppet strings
Thornbite staff
Umbral mantle

>>49281704
>>49282993

The card remains i exile but you cant cast it once gonti dies, if xhe is not on the field the abiliry is not active

Its like saying hey i cast a felidar sovereign 9 turns ago, im at 40 life so i win the game because thats what the card at the time said

Creatures need to be on the battlefield for their abilities to work unless specified otherwise

>>49283156
Gonti allows you to cast that card for as long as it remains exiled, because of how his ability is worded. The duration and allowance is tied to the exile, not to his presence. If he had a separate ability that said
>You may cast cards exiled with ~ and may spend mana as though it were mana of any color to cast them.
Then yes, he'd have to be around.

See Kheru Spellsnatcher and Fiend of the Shadows for their rulings.

>>49283156
"For as long as that card remains exiled..."

>>49282261

Is it? It's like barely better than roon at that point

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>>49280205
Heres our squad...

>>49283156
How does it feel to be this incredibly wrong?

>>49280255
>Alesha
>not tight as hell

Alesha is the best Mardu commander. She pops off quickly, has multiple wincons, and she can play fair if need be.

I can't find where to ask a judge, so I'll ask you guys,and hope for a judge:

If player A controls a fellwar stone, and players B, C, and D only control lands which can provide colorless mana, and colorless mana only, can Fellwar stone provide mana?

>>49280205
>tfw I don't have photoshop and mine will never look as nice as I want it
Also, where do I get images of the commanders that fit the template?

>>49283340
10/1/2009: The colors of mana are white, blue, black, red, and green. Fellwar Stone can’t be tapped for colorless mana, even if a land an opponent controls could produce colorless mana.

Source: Gatherer

>>49283340
Is "not a car" a type of car?

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>>49283248

Whats the best/most fun Grixis commander?

>>49283868
>What's the best?
Jeleva, followed by Nekusar.

>Most fun?
Lord of Tresserhorn, followed by Thraximundar and Sedris.

>>49283868
most fun:

Sedris for OTK and ETB unearth shenanigans
or
Thrax for "Legendary Zombie Assassin"

>>49282954
Balls are sweaty
Memes already
Artifact-heavy
Oh shit whaddup
Here comes Daretti

NEVAR FIVEGHETTI

>>49283868
Most fun is probably Jeleva. Best I dunno, probably a really ruthless Nekusar build. Or just Thraxi over a an optimized Grixis control build that just uses him as an extra threat.

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>>49283947
Long live edh's lord and savior wheelchair pope, making red relevant again since 2014

>>49281628
Why do you need him instant speed? Do you expect to combo the second you cast him?

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>>49283947
Come on anon, you could have at least tried. 10 million years in this stupid text box:

>In the pallor of the pale moonlight,
>our hero rides atop a striding wurm,
>battling evil, and fortune, for the right
>to make your opponents lands squirm.
>He is forged from a fire so fierce
>that even garbage becomes gold,
>and with his mastery, he doth pierce
>through the mana rock threshold.
>"How will you win without any lands?"
>he asks with a sheepish grin,
>"Maybe you should draw better hands?"
>as his Blightsteel swings for the win.
>His name is Daretti, Scrap Servant
>and he's here to feast to his fill
>on your spaghetti scraps, observant
>enough to swoop in for the kill.

>former member of my group is trying to apologize to me so he can play with people again
Like I would ever let his stupid ass back in after the way he acted. Blog post aside, I need a new commander but can't figure out who would be better. My choices are

>Tajic, Blade of the Legion
> Atarka World Render
>Jace, Vryn's Prodigy
>Skullbriar

>>49284064
Skullbriar.

Red and white a shit, red and green has better commanders, and
>le blue deck
is done better with Memnarch.

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Is Brago just fun, or can he actually be competitive?

>>49284108
Yes.

As a brago player both statements are true. Either brago comes out and you're almost unstoppable once he connects, or your opponent removes him, and you're left durdling while casting him for 10 mana.

>>49284126
>Casting him before protection and countermagic

This is the difference

>>49284092
Alright Skullbriar it is, what is some spicy tech for him?

>>49283983
>>49283905
>Jeleva
>Good

I always found it to be shit

>>49284126
Obviously, I want a lot more Blink enablers other than Brago, correct?

Should I be focusing more on adding a lot of ETB permanents, or Blink-enablers?

>>49283340
You can tap the Fellwar Stone for it's ability, but it won't produce any mana, just like with Exotic Orchard.

>>49283868
Mishra/Mishra

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>>49281415
Love the deck. Even without the commander, you can get solid removal with edict effects. I locked out a board with Ashnods Alter, Dictate of Erebos, and Reassembling Skeleton.

Was funny, but I took the Skelton out because it was a little too mean for my playgroup which consists mostly of creature based decks.

Here's my list.

http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/garden-of-weenies/

>>49284174
I said fun for Jeleva. She is that.

>>49284174
Jeleva is definitely the strongest of Grixis commanders. Even if you don't feel like swinging with her, you can just exile all libraries with infinite mana and a sac outlet.
Just watch for Necropotences and Abundances, so you won't lose.

>>49284152
You never know, opponents have crafty ways of removing things. I remember getting hit with an Aetherspouts, and having to Aetherize my own guys so I could save my combo pieces. No shroud/hexproof would have saved me from that.

>>49284177
No, god no. You really only need brago if he's going to survive, with deadeye navigator, and maybe eldrazi displacer. You don't necessarily win just by flickering, though quite often you do win as a result of whats flickered.

The reason brago is good is because he flickers almost anything. Run good artifacts with ETBs over just stuffing more in there. Really, at least in my experience, he works best as a value engine once you have your strategy in place. I personally run hard-lock stax as my wincon, but in general control can work well if you build for it. Heck, I theory crafted a br-aggro deck, and I run part of it now as a late game wincon.

Long story short, abuse artifacts if you want to be competitive, though Bant pretty much has a monopoly on competitive flicker commanders, and Brago is either the best, or kind of meh.

>>49284177

Competitive Brago means you've got them feeling some sort of stax and won't able to respond properly.

The deck needs to lockdown the board, and then you hit them with a hasty brago. Ideally, the deck only needs to hit once and you've won.

>>49284064
What did he do?

>>49284155
Scar

>>49283344
The rectangles are made to fit Gatherer's card size minus the border

>>49284064
Skully-B is fun as fuck

>>49284155
Depends on what you want to do
Vigor is fun for counter shenanigans

>>49284155
That new thing from kaladesh that gives things extra +1/+1 counters.

Kalonian Hydra
Desecration Demon
Doubling Season
Hardened Scales
Varolz

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>>49284390
>gatherer's shitty scans of everything pre-Lorwyn

>>49284464
Nevermind their shitty scans, why the fuck are the scans so tiny?

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Threw this together last night just pulling from what I own. Went 1/5, but the one was pretty devastating, so I'm intrigued. Anyone got any tips and secret tech? I think I need more good sac outlets and an overall lower mana curve.

http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/undercity-slickers/

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>>49280205
Half the decks are highly tuned and half are crap, but all of them are fun. my favorite deck to play is either Maelstrom Wanderer, Sidis, or Aurelia. I have two play groups my college friends are casual and my friends from back home are highly competitive, with one of my friends we go 1v1 narset vs azami to see who can combo out first and those games are really intense, usually win about half the time.

>>49284590
There was a reddit post before when we were discussing proxies, they had links to hq and some 4k scans of cards from all sets till khans, i dont have the link at hand and i cant upload the archive (on phone) you can find it pretty easily if you google "mtg foil proxy" they will have the links

>>49284680
Post Azami list

Is it the Labman wincon?

>>49284650
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/maziwreck-the-directors-cut/

If you wanna compare lists, my meta contains more LD which is why I have more land recursion than creature recursion.

>>49284703
yeah its the labman win, but I can also win with master of waves. I haven't updated the deck in awhile some notable additions are cryptic command, mox diamond, chrome mox, jace the mind sculptor. I also gave it a super weeb name hope it doesn't trigger anyone. http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/azamimanga-daioh/

>>49284387
>>49284425
>>49284435
Thanks, I'll order a few of those.

>>49284338
Does it really matter?

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>>49280205
;-;

>>49284780
>Does it really matter?
Yes

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>>49280212
Do you like miracles? Add celestial dawn for best result.

>>49284807
I don't think so.

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>>49284711
Alright, this is a good starting point, thanks. I have an enchantment fetish, so I probably need to cut those down for some more useful spells.

Question: I have a Deathcloud that I almost included, but it scares me. How useful do you find it to be, and has it ever bitten you in the ass?

>>49284793
You should call around to your LGS and see which ones run an EDH night.

>>49284793
MODO
O
D
O

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>>49284862
>yfw the lgs only caters to standard and sometimes modern because they are the only formats that make money

>>49284862
Neither of them do
I was actually recently invited to play EDH on Monday by a friend I met recently, so things are actually starting to look up

>>49284849
Death Cloud hasn't come back to bite me yet. I usually use it only if I have the game, if its the only thing left in my hand, or if I am behind on creatures. I've been thinking about substituting Damnation in its place though

>>49284904
Well yeah, EDH players pretty much just take up space and rarely buy anything

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>Keranos player tries to Obliterate the board so he can win 40 fucking turns from now
>Boros Charm
>He looks at his hand and just sighs

>>49284957
Alright, thanks.

If I ever shell out for a Damnation, it's going right into Marchesa, though.

>>49285004
He misplayed and deserves to lose.

>>49285016
Just proxy cards you already own but are rather expensive to buy again. If your playgroup has an issue with that tell them to stop being pantywaists.

>>49285060
Eh, we used to allow proxies, but a few people wouldn't police themselves and made degenerate millionaire decks that kinda killed the fun. We kinda agreed not to after a while and it's really improved the experience.

That's not saying that there aren't broken, expensive decks in the group, but somehow it's less salt-educing getting beat by the real card.

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>>49285004
>playing a commander in blue
>not leaving up a counterspell before you play anything
Its like he was not even trying

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I need a creature in WRB that draws me cards on ETB. Are Vulturous Aven and Phyrexian Gargantuan really my only options? This deck plays very few creatures so Disciple of Bolas isn't much of an option

>>49285346
Phyrexian Rager

>>49285346
>needs a creature
>deck doesn't play many creatures
What deck is this for?

>>49285346
Wall of Omens

>>49285367
Eh, I dunno, 1 card feels like too little, to be honest. It is Sun Titanable, though.

>>49285398
Creatures are easier to recour in the colors than spells, is all. I run a few, but not enough (or none big enough) to justify Disciple.

>>49285346
Do you really need a creature?

Sounds like your deck isn't too creature heavy, why not just run spells or enchantments?

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>Realize I can reanimate Erebos

Never mind

>>49285439
I mean, if you're running the proper black card draw spells I don't think you're going to need to recur card draw. You should be focusing on creatures that have a major impact when they come into play.

Regal Behemoth spiked from 0.2 euros to 1, wierd.

>>49285508
It's pretty amazing for Xenagos, at least.

>>49285508
MTGLion plz go, nobody wants your $4 narwhals

>>49285346
Bedlam Reveler draws you three cards but you need to discard your hand prior to drawing

Phyrexian Rager draws you a card and you lose a life

Wall of Omens draws you a card

Viashino Racketeer loots on ETB

Sandstone Oracle draws you cards equal to the difference between an opponent and you, as long as they have more cards than you

>>49285528
>Sandstone Oracle
So long as you have lots of mana acceleration, oracle's pretty dope.

>>49284108
My buddy plays Brago and made the grave mistake of forgetting to put protection spells in the 99. I remind him of his mistake every time I mop the floor with him.

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>>49285439
>Recurring creatures for draw power

You're in black, you can draw all of the cards.

No need to recur anything.

>>49284830
Then why did you mention it in the first place Christmas Itux?

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>>49280205
Didn't feel like filling out the template thing yet.
Overall our group is somewhat high power, but nothing super degenerate. Closest thing is probably my Ezuri Renegade Leader deck that I rarely play anymore for that reason.

>>49285522
>MTGLion
His video titles are super clickbaity

>>49285583
>no Esper deck
>no mono-white deck

Mono white I understand but why no Esper?

>>49285508
6 Mana for a 5/5 body with trample that doubles mana and draws you a card almost guaranteed at end step

How the fuck would that stay cheap?

>>49285570
>>49285499
I run a bunch of draw spells, but I like having at least one form of recurrable card draw. Creatures are usually the easiest one.

>>49285605
My friends already have a Sharuum and Oloro deck and none of the other Esper legends ever caught my interest or were too expensive to make.

>>49285608
>6mana
You answered you own question

Also its frim a set hyped to hell and opened en masse in the first week now the prices crashed so much not even vendors will touch this toxic set, supply is still there but stores have cancelled their second orders maybe in 10 years it will spike to $5 but thats a big if

>>49285639
Well it sounds like you deck does not have that many creatures to start with

I wouldn't try to force recurring draw that badly with creatures if your main game plan isn't to reanimate creatures in the first place.

In black you should not have too many issues with draw power.

>>49285561
Protection spells being counterspells or auras/equipment?

I see where you're getting at, but I don't want Brago to turn into Voltron.

Is there any particular reason that cards from both Conspiracy sets don't show up as legal in Commander in Gatherer?

>>49285579
>Why mention it in the first place then

Because it upsets you to deny you the answer you seek and that is funny to me

>>49285818
Is there any particular reason that you're using Gatherer over magiccards.info or magidex.com? Gatherer has been a disaster from the very start.

Are the ~$35 premade commander decks any good? I have no cards (sold em all in 2010) but my gf wants to get into magic and I remember EDH being awesome for casual. Just don't wanna spend a lot on cards (I know, I should turn back now)

My choice is buy two premades or a bunch of $3 grab bags at the local game store and building decks from that. Alternatively buy the premades and supplement them with the grab bags over time. I just don't wanna waste the $35x2 though if the decks suck or could better spend that cash on singles.

As an aside, I was a landstill and combo player in vintage and legacy way back when, played tournaments, netdecked, etc. Advice for playing against a completely new player?

>>49285852
Never really had any problems with it before, so I never looked into other sites.

Sorry I used the wrong Magic Card database. Can I still eat with the cool kids?

What's the best way to play magic over the internet? Ideally free.

>>49285892
no kys

>>49285874
Some are pretty good and some are pretty awful. Some are kinda in the middle. Look into the deck lists of each, maybe play some games in Cockatrice with them first to see how well you like them, then get those.

All of them have some good cards in them, mind you. Come of them just don't come together well straight out of the box. For instance, the Daxos one is a hot fucking mess.

>>49285874
The premade are a good start, but they do vary in quality.

>>49285874
Yes
But i would wait for commander anthology next year

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>>49285923
For real, though, anyone know?

>>49285852
Doesn't gatherer have the official card rulings on every card page?

>>49285874
There's a new set of premades coming out this year, so wait for those first.

>>49285874
Nothing wrong with the premades, maybe start you gf on the mono green one from 2014, chicks love elves right? And with the addition of a few more lords and dollar cards its not bad

As for yourself the 2015 GB and UG decks are ok at this stage you probably dont want to jump right into 3 color unless you want to spend $1000+ on the manabase alone

>>49285874
They can vary in powerlevel

Stay away from the Commander 2014 decks
Stay away from the RW and BW Commander 2015 decks
Any older decks may be tricky to find at MSRP

>>49285977
Just like the sites I mentioned, minus the bloat, hideous interface, and the addition of more robust search options and TCGplayer prices.

>>49286005
>Stay away from the Commander 2014 decks
The red and white are pretty decent IIRC

>>49285948
>>49285950

Any recommendations, especially two that would play well against each other? I tried looking up a few but I don't recognize most of the cards since I haven't played since Time Spiral saga or whatever came after that (the first one with planeswalkers?)

>>49285996
>As for yourself the 2015 GB and UG decks are ok at this stage you probably dont want to jump right into 3 color unless you want to spend $1000+ on the manabase alone

Man don't trigger me. I had 4 FBB underground sea that I sold for, wait for it, $50 each. Not to mention 10 other FBB duals, plenty of whiteboarder duals, full set of fetches, etc. I'm not going down that road again. I still hate myself for selling my cards.

>>49286013
Yea but isn't Gatherer an official Wizards website?

>>49285963
Commander anthology is $160rrp so about $250 in stores thats if they print more than 10 copies and your lgs gets one

>>49286018
Not sure about the white one (lol monowhite) but the black one is pretty solid.

>>49285874
>landstill
My nigga.

>>49285996
>1000$+
>Chinamen counterfeits are 2,5 dollars each
You an idiot or what?

>>49286027
Wizards is fucking awful at online stuff

>>49286055
Yea but its an official source
If you showed me rulings on Magiccards.info I'd call a judge

>>49286027
Yes, and? Do you not remember the official forums also being a load of shit, or MTGO being a load of shit? WotC is terrible at all things digital. It is known.

>>49286047
>My nigga.

I know right? I still think BHWC 4 color landstill was the best deck to ever see play in legacy.

>>49286068
And then you'd look like a goober because the rules text on magiccards.info is pasted word-for-word from Gatherer

>>49285874
The 2014 ones are mostly a trap with pretty planeswalkers. The red one is decent, but the others need some serious upgrades.

The 2011 ones have good commanders, but they're horribly overpriced now. The GB and UR 2015 ones are good, and the Prossh one is good with some upgrades.

>>49285963
That shit has a Kaalia reprint it won't cost $160.

>>49286091
still not an official site
I need verification for all I know you just made some shit up on a fake website

>>49286025
I know the feels, i started in revised, quit at mirage then started up again for urzas then quit and started again in theros, so much value sold off years ago

>>49286103
Was the Kaalia precon deck actually good? I know she's pretty bonkers as a commander but what about the rest of the deck?

>>49286025
The UR and GB ones are a good start. The UR does as does UR does and slings spells, which can be good with a couple upgrades. GB has a lot of grave shenanigans and value creatures.

That being said, I'd wait until later this year to see how the new 4 color ones are.

>ask for recommendations for my Daretti list
>running a lot of token generators, Pentavus, Thopter Assembly, Myr Battlesphere along with Squee
>someone suggests I cut Skullclamp

I honestly can't believe how bad some people are at Magic sometimes.

>>49286171
She's not really that bonkers as a Commander.

Her precon was hot garbage, but they all are anyways.

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>>49286103
>Your lgs charges more than msrp
Your lgs is shit
Change of store or kill yourself

>>49280794
Because ebay sometimes has lower prices

>>49286177
Thanks, yeah I was just looking at those. Seemed pretty good. GB was always a favorite color combo of mine.

>That being said, I'd wait until later this year to see how the new 4 color ones are.

Do you know offhand when they're gonna be released?

>>49286171
It was 3 cards + 97 jank

Kaalia
Path to exile
That red enchantment that makes people not draw cards and skip extra turns rest was total kaladesh

>>49286194
This. You might get somewhere if you're in a game where nobody has ever faced a Kaalia deck before, but otherwise she's always eating removal and the deck runs slow as shit.

>>49286194
>She's not really that bonkers as a Commander.
That ability is pretty hardcore. Most decks I've seen pretty much can't function without her though. Why is she so expensive? Underprinting?

>>49286212
I believe that they're scheduled for this November.

>>49280794
>>49286205
Also good for hard to find cards, I found a vendor with 6 copies of my favorite foil basic which is sold out everywhere else in NM

>>49286194
I always figured that Kaalia must be good if shes $40 alone.

>>49286241
Awesome, thanks. I doubt I'll wait until then, but if we have fun in the meantime another deck or two come november won't hurt anything but my wallet.

>>49286233
Most decks i see her in have an opening hand of 7cmc+ creatures, they cast her she gets removed, repeat this for 10 turns and the player is usually dead, like clockwork erry game

H
Shes expensive because people thing you will always have a magical christmas hand and always swing with her and put huge creatures into play asap also shes only seen 1 reprint

>>49286194
t. someone whose never seen a Kaalia pushed out on T2/3 shit out an Avacyn into 'Geddon

t. someone who's never seen Kaalia shit out Master of Cruelities

t. someone who's never seen Kaalia put Iona in

t. someone who's never had Kaalia push out a Rune Scarred Demon and get MORE ANGELS DEMONS DRAGONS

Honestly you need to kill her sight a few times and the deck will do nothing. After a few deaths it'll be easier to hardcast those demons angels and dragons

Oh yeah, I guess I can ask here. I quit right before they stopped letting you put damage on the stack (the big 2010 rule change).

Did anything else change with that that I should know about? All I remember is my korean mogg fanatics became worthless.

>>49286312
That's a stupid hand
A good hand have 2 lands, maná vault or sol ring, defender grid, tutors and card draw

>>49286313
Unless you are playing with potatoes its pretty much arch enemy soon as she is revealed and before you draw your opening hand, at least their death is quick and they can go back to playing modern while you have a 3 player game

>>49286025
I recall all of the Monocolored ones being fairly well balanced against each other. I bought the Black one and enjoyed it, the Red one might be a bit complicated for a new player, not sure. In my experience, chicks love elf decks, so there might be something there.

>>49286409
Its called magical christmas land hand because it only happens once a year, even then its just some fat guy coming down your chimney

>>49286433
I bought my girl the elf deck all thre way from hong kong while I was living in China; she loved it

>>49286433
>>49286455

Am I crazy and reading this wrong or did they reprint fucking Sol Ring for the elf commander deck?? I know it's not crazy OP but I didn't think that one would see the light of day again.

That said, Priest of Titania+Wellwisher was one of my first ever decks. Might have to share that experience with the gf.

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>>49286217
>total kaladesh
Jesus Christ

>>49286418
Or you're playing against other people with powerful commanders and tuned decks. People always assume that balances itaelf by making an Archenemy but in my experience its never the case that everyone can just go "ok kill the Kaalia player" because there will also be someone playing Karador, Daretti, and other huge threats with strong decks.

>>49286433
True, made my wife a mono white equipment cats deck and a mono green elfball deck and she enjoys playing them, recently made her a RB vampre tribal

>>49286538
Oh man, you're in for a treat. EDH is Commander, Sol Ring, 98 cards. They've reprint it in every commander precon deck. It's the very definition of a staple.

>>49286538
>Sol Ring not crazy OP
Anon, it's quite possibly the second best card in the format.

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>be me, a new magicfag

>decide on Rafiq as my Bant commander

>can't decide whether to max out on my exalted creatures; or use only a few Exalted creatures to save up slots for other creatures

what do, guise?

>>49286577
My definition of OP is still Yawg'sWin in vintage.

(Is that shit banned in commander??)

>>49286577
Is Mana Crypt number 1?

>>49286584
Don´t use creatures. Turn him into Voltron.
Or infect.

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>>49280337
holy shit that guy in your group who runs red/blue I do the same but have Niv-Mizzet, the Firemind as my commander and one of my super combos besides the one you friend has is to draw the majority of my deck to my hand with no max hand size and deal one damage with each card drawn. I rarely win but end up fucking over one or two people at the table before I go down.

>>49286584
http://mtgsalvation.gamepedia.com/Voltron

>>49286570
I just realized that I probably shouldn't use that joke for a new person. Sol Ring isn't actually required as part of the deck. It's just so good that there's almost no reason to not include it.

>>49286584
If you did exalted itd be more of a theme deck. Rafiq is mostly Voltron backed by control magic if you're building the most tuned version of him.

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>>49286549
True diplomacy is convincing everyone else that your deck is less degererate than the other guys deck

>>49286606
No, it's not banned, and it's still completely bonkers. I run it in a MBC shell and it either pushes me back into the game or puts me so far ahead it's not even funny.

>>49286607
I think so.

>>49286538
Has Sol Ring ever not appeared in a Commander Product?

>>49286642
Nah it's required. A friend of mine excludes it in green decks and I want to slap him for it.

>>49286577
Sol ring is bad, it doesnt even produce colored mana

>>49286666
Misreply, meant for >>49286623

>>49286674
wtf i hate sol ring now

>>49286648
Don't think so.

>>49286645
>No, it's not banned, and it's still completely bonkers.

Wow. That card was instant win in vintage to the point where we wouldn't even play it out sometimes if the opponent didn't have a force of will.

>>49286674
trigger warning

I dont run sol ring in a few decks

>>49286691

I think it appeared in the recent Orzhov Constellation deck

>>49286674
:CCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCC

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>>49286682
Don't tell the new guy bad info. It is not, by the rules, required to be in your deck. You'd just be foolish to not include it in literally any deck I can think of.

>>49286697
Only reasonnits not always an instant win in commander is because you have 3+ other people to shit on you for opening it.

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>No one ever talks about my wydfu
ok

>>49284810
Chromatic lantern does it all for sen triplets now.

What am i building next tg

Marduchesa prison/superfriends
Meren Degeneracy
Or Daretti Stax?

>>49286745
I've looked at her before and I can't really think of anything interesting to do with her. What's her deal?

>>49286745
Should we? The card doesn't do anything noteworthy

>>49286697
Well, to be fair, a lot of what makes YawgWin so ridiculous in Vintage is fast mana combined with severely undercosted spells. Most of those cards are banned in EDH.

On the other hand, you can generate boatloads of mana in the format so in some ways it's even more degenerate. In my deck it's not uncommon for YawgWin to read: "Draw some cards, wipe the board, and tutor for a win condition."

>>49286767
Never forgetti

>>49286773
>>49286770
It's basically an option for commander damage voltron where you won't often be paying commander tax on recasting her. Always seemed like a fun voltron option to me but never got around to building it.

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>>49286705
MOM'S GONNA FREAK

>>49286828
Hmm. Basically Derevi, then, without White for equipment shenanigans. I can see it being interesting.

>>49286767
Daretti 9/11 deck
>2 towers grim/basalt monolith, a smaller tower that catches fire and falls over despite not getting hit by a flyer and all other artifact flyers dont forget brown people from kaladesh to blame it on

>>49286770
>>49286773
I just play her as voltron control. No one ever really notices me until it's too late, she has multiple swords attached to her, and everyone is already hurting. I play few creatures or any permanents so I have no board presence and I'm left alone. Sometimes I'll just Hatred people out of the game too.

>>49286874
An inferior Derevi, yes. Blue has some artifact stuff at least.

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>mfw just discovering the power of Sydri
>mfw I have enough of the cards listed on edhrec to bring the price of the deck I want to build down to around 80 bucks

I mean, edhrec pretty much lists most of the combos that go with her. Any secret tech any of you have before I start building this thing?

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>recently been getting focused hardcore by resident Timmy player
>most of my decks are very creature-light
Time to start packing Crawlspace and Silent Arbiter into everything

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>>49282745
Same desu, we have many other players at the LGS, but these are the "core" group

>run UW auratron
>the whole point is to built up one huge unblockable dude and try to wreck shit with him
>as such, if I lose that one guy, I'm more or less fucked
>my group is convinced I'm the villain and my deck is "degenerate and overpowered" because once in a blue moon it works and my dude gets giant
>say they don't want to play against it anymore and refuse to play if I'm using it
They're fucking AURAS, people. How can I make them understand that my whole deck is based around the shittiest card type of the game and if they can't manage to remove one creature then that's their own problem and not my own?

>>49286439
>I'm bad at deck building and cannot have consistent good hands when mulliganing to 6

>>49287677
By telling them to fucking grow up and let you play with them until they learn how to improve their decks.

>>49287677
Try playing with people who dress themselves.

>>49287693
Maybe you should stop playing then, or try a different format that lets you have more than 1 of a card

>tfw 3 people in my playgroup have died since May
We don't even have enough people to play anymore. I don't know how to make Magic friends either. I haven't done that in almost a decade.

>>49287738
They didn't actually die did they?

>>49287766
They actually died. Don't get old, anon.

>>49287738
Did you take their decks? Not like they need them anymore

Tell their wives and they promised them to you when they doe then contest the will

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>TCGPlayer somehow couldn't find a card in their inventory for new deck
>shipping directly from the seller
>no idea when it's going to get here
SHIT

>>49283920
>Zombie Assassin
>Not even sneaky
>Entire playstyle is to smash face

>>49287781
Damn dude that sucks. Sorry to hear it.

I'm dumb. can someone explain what makes pepe so good? he pops up here and there when looking for child of alara recs

>>49287738
>tfw I'm wasting the prime years of my life doing literally nothing
>tfw I don't even have friends, and haven't for 10 years

>>49287896
Who do you play edh against?
Please dont say modo or xmage because i cant handle that much sandess in 1 post

>>49287866
Maybe I should have made it more clear
>LEGENDARY
>ZOMBIE
>ASSASSIN

>>49286648
>>49286538
>>49286577
>>49286607

>Sol Ring produces colorless mana
>I run a number of low CMC decks with very little use for colorless mana and don't even bother to include it

>>49287717
>>49287724
To be fair the last game we played was pretty brutal.

>T1. Plains, Sol Ring, Felwar Stone
>T2. Island, Heliod's Pilgrim (tutor Felidar Umbra), Hero of Iroas
>T3. Plains, Sovereigns of Lost Alara, Attack with Hero and tutor out Spectra Ward with Sovereigns
>T4. Island, Felidar Umbra to Hero, Attack with Hero, tutor Sunbond with Sovereigns

So by turn four I already had a creature that was gaining +1/+1 counters exponentially each turn and had protection from all colors. But like I said, that was a once in a lifetime thing, especially with the Sol Ring into Felwar Stone jank to have five mana by turn 2.

>>49288019
Also its banned in french so stats maybe a little askew, some people only play duels

>>49288062
Does anyone actually play with the french rules? I've never seen a single person that does, and for good reason honestly.

>banning a staple card that's used in every single EDH deck
It's like they don't want their format to be taken seriously.

>>49288028
>Every degenerate play in every example on tg is t1 sol/crypt into t2 combo piece
I cant quite put my finger on what the cause of this is, hmmmmm

>>49288082

I haven't actually played with French rules but I can tell you after playing duel commander against a Derevi prison deck, I feel that its banning in that format is entirely justified. It's essentially being forced to watch a smug fucker play solitaire.

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>central deck strategy is cheating things into play and almost never hardcasting anything
>new deck averages like 4.3CMC because mondo fatties

This is going to bother me now

>>49287896
these times are rough, anon. hope you've found or can work towards something. don't be too concerned about not having friends; i'm a literal autist who didn't understand how to properly become acquainted with strangers until a couple years ago when i turned 22.

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>>49288082
If im playing 1v1 i insist on french, its designed that way
>mfw i turn 7 emrakul im my jhoira duels deck and the opponent calls for a judge

>>49288082
>banning an overpowered card that ruins every game when its played t1

Fixed that for you

>>49288130
>implying I'm going to carry around extra cards to sub out ones that are "banned" in 1v1 just because people like to bitch and moan about the format
Honestly, I wouldn't even care that much if it weren't for Sol Ring being on the banned list. And I know it's just one card to sub, but it's the principle of the matter. That card is in nearly EVERY SINGLE commander deck, and they have the audacity to ban it in their rules set? Nah senpai.

>>49288091

Yeah, though I can give you a genuine example I've encountered without Sol Ring, albeit a bit Christmaslandish luck of the draw...

t1: forest, exploration, forest, Utopia sprawl
t2: forest, Oracle of Mul Daya, topdeck mountain, Temple of the false god
t3: Xenagos (commander), mountain
t4: Vorinclex

>>49288091
That's because Sol Ring is literally busted and anybody that says otherwise is outright retarded.

>>49288168
Sure let me play your standard deck with my legacy deck cos fuck format rules right? They are just like opinions anyhow

>>49288019
Sol Ring ramps better and harder than any low cmc mana dark

>>49288170
Thats pretty sweet

>>49288168
>show up to Legacy event with my EDH deck
>no command zone
>several of my cards are banned

it's like they don't even want to be taken seriously

And no, this isn't a false equivalency. EDH and Duel Commander are entirely different formats.

>>49287923
>Who do you play edh against?
I don't. I spend all day theory crafting and stacking cardboard. The last game I played was almost two months ago at the flgs where I spend all my money.

It was against a woefully under-prepared narset one of our local standard star players built, and I wrecked him. It really wasn't close. At first I brought out my finely tuned Maelstrom Wanderer, that I keep in a special box because I know it's stupidly strong, and I was excited to show off make new friends by being a good competitor. The first game went 4 turns before I popped Maelstrom and shat out a winning boardstate, the second went 6 turns before parallel lives, into feldon, into giant adephage.

The third game I realized that I was playing against a barely assembled jankfest, and I swapped to my god-awful Jeleva deck I built to play against complete noobs, if I ever made friends. Instead of durdling forever like I thought it would, I was the god of hand rape. Just discard spell after discard spell into Jeleva casting his nonsense against him. The deck has a fucking sea monster and goblin subtheme with every draw card being blue, every discard card being black, and it's barely better than a precon pillaged for its good parts. I won off a flipped thing in the ice and deep sea kraken.

Since then, people at the shop wont even talk to me anymore. I'm now labeled as that tryhard spike there to ruin everyone's fun and I hate it. That's the exact opposite of how I try to play. I'm so mad because brought fucking Brago stax and Memnarch artifacts with me, but didn't play them because I didn't want people to hate me. I still haven't had a chance to test out my Memnarch upgrades...

>>49288201
The difference is Duel Commander is a made up format. The others are not.

>>49288244
Congratulations, this is the dumbest post I've read in a while.

>>49288266
Duel Commander is the equivalent of creating a completely different "format" for Standard multiplayer because the game plays differently when there are more than just two people.

No. Commander is commander. You can't make up extra rules because you don't like how it plays in certain circumstances.

>>49288295
but that is exactly how EDH started

>>49288126
Thanks anon, I appreciate it. As a literal autist as well, I'm struggling a lot at the moment. While I was in school, I at least felt hopeful that the future might be better. After getting fucked over by both jobs I worked while going to school, and every single other job I've had, I'm just really jaded and bitter. My family has been fucking with me too and I just feel really alone and worthless.

But it's not all bad, I recently snagged a FtV: Lore, and bought one for a Christmas present for my brother. Since he's been a massive fuck to me, I now have two Jittes I can use, and a spare Memnarch for my Brago deck.

>>49288338
No, EDH started as something completely different that standard with fundamentally different rules and playstyles. Duel Commander is literally Commander except with more bans and less life, because WAH EDH ISN'T FUN ENOUGH IN 1V1.

>>49288238
Ouch, that hurts

>>49280255
Alesha is like aggro Maren of Nel Toth and is a bitch.

>>49280255
There is some small shit that can hit like a fucking bus, anon. Don't underestimate them hatebears

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>>49288362
French was edh designed to be more playable by 2 people instead of 3+ because there are some absolutely format destroying cards still used today that sheldon wont ban because he owns stacks of them

>>49288362
Nothing is fun about Sol Ring, Mana Crypt, and Divining Top.
There are no decks that aren't better with them and they lead to blowout games.

>>49288082
I play 1v1 commander all the time and I have never used the french rules, because they're dumb. Seriously, the banlist is retarded. It's pretty much ban every form of cheap ramp possible, while allowing all the same degenerate nonsense to permeate the game. Also, the reasoning behind banning Top is absolutely retarded.

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>>49288437
Ok, I keep hearing the name Sheldon. Who the hell is Sheldon?

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>>49288465
What's wrong with Divining Top? Go on, I'm interested in hearing your explanation.

>>49288471
Glad I'm not the only one who feels this way.

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>C13 printing of Arcane Denial is between $4-5
>both Alliances printings with delicious RKF art are like 50 cents

The fuck is happening here

>>49288484
The guy who along with his playgroup single handedly control the rules and banlist of edh

>>49288518
Modern (black) border = superior

>>49288535
But Alliances had black borders

>>49288535
>Playing a mono blue deck with non matching white border islands from core sets
The sodium levels are high

>>49288518
nothing, vendors just being retarded as usual

>>49288557
They are not modern frame
There are some white border modern frame cards but these are even worse than old black border cards

I.e blood moon hierarchy
>8th/9th/mm1 foil only modern frame
>mm1 modern frame black border
>the dark old frame black border
>chronicles old frame white border
>8th/9th modern frame white border

>>49288489
The way it works leads to annoyingly slow games.
Its impact over the course of a game is huge because it dramatically increases your chances of getting what you need when you need it.
It's a ridiculously cost-efficient artifact that outshines every other card in its niche.
It can't be easily destroyed.
It was designed in a dumb way for a dumb purpose, to enable that cycle of goddawfully shitty Kamigawa cards that cared about your top deck. The amateur idiots who designed it were "surprised" it ended up being such a big hit.

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I haven't played with my "competitive" playgroup in a while because of work.
It is less of a playgroup as it is more I go to my LGS and play in the free commander tournament since it is a ten minute walk.

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>>49288524
And do we, as 4chan, agree on his idea of balancing the format?
If we do, what had worked so far for it?
And if we don't, why have we not advocated for a different arbiter?

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>4 player game
>value frog deck
>pull lord of extinction
>literally a 70/70
>mono red deck top decks replicant and kills me with my own creature
fuck you cameron

>>49288692
duplicant, sorry

NEW
>>49288722
>>49288722
>>49288722
>>49288722
>>49288722

>>49288637
>The way it works leads to annoyingly slow games.
Subjective, not really a substantial argument. More to do with playstyle than deck construction.
>Its impact over the course of a game is huge because it dramatically increases your chances of getting what you need when you need it.
Which is something certain decks are extremely awful at and need help with. Mardu and Boros are the first that come to mind.
>It's a ridiculously cost-efficient artifact that outshines every other card in its niche.
Can't really argue with that one. But, dies to removal.
>It can't be easily destroyed.
This guy. It can absolutely be easily destroyed. Certain decks struggle against it, but it can absolutely be removed, destroyed, stolen, milled or otherwise disrupted.
>It was designed in a dumb way for a dumb purpose, to enable that cycle of goddawfully shitty Kamigawa cards that cared about your top deck. The amateur idiots who designed it were "surprised" it ended up being such a big hit.
That sounds like a lot of bitching about nothing in particular.

So, according to you, the only reasonable argument you've made is that it's very efficient, and very helpful, therefore should be banned. I can list staples in just about any deck that are the exact same. The major problem with Top is that it's colourless and searchable. Any deck can use it, and the decks that abuse it in the shittiest fashion often don't really NEED it in the first place. That being said, any deck that lacks card draw and tutors desperately needs one to make up for the inherent structural flaws with the colour pie design philosophy. How is it fair that you can ponder/preordain/brainstorm/serum visions all day in anything with blue splashed in it, but a mono red deck can't have access to anything even comparable? Its not. Top covers a major design flaw, and that's why it should be fine.

I'd argue the same point with sol ring, but I know it's an unpopular one.

>>49288614
Autism

>>49288740
>it can easily be stolen
Look, I'm not him, I'm actually on your side in this, but unless you're using a split second card to deal with it, you can't.

>>49288768
Shit, I forgot you could tap it in response to just about anything. So I guess you can't steal it as easily as I implied, but you can do a lot of other nasty things to it.

>>49288740
>subjective
Nothing subjective about it. Having to sit through your opponent fondling their library and pondering their next draw every time they have a free mana is teeth-gnashingly aggravating.
>need help with
WotC has been printing a lot of excellent cards to help red and white with deck smoothing--Sigiled Skink comes to mind--but they'll never get any attention in eternal formats as long as lametop is around.
>it can absolutely be destroyed!!!!
Well, you've really discredited yourself here. Not much to say.
>nothing in particular
It "slipped through the cracks" in the same way as Skullclamp and Umezawa's Jitte. There wasn't some grand R&D scheme behind it where they were thinking long term. All three of those cards have elicited mea culpas where THE OFFICIAL WOTC DESIGN AND DEVELOPMENT TEAMS frankly admitted "Yes, they're awful cards and shouldn't exist. Sorry we goofed."
>i'd argue the same for sol ring
Spikes are the worst game designers. I bet you think Mana Drain is "fun and dynamic."