What games do "social combat" well? Most of the time it's either attacking someone's Social HP using the same mechanics as standard combat or some esoteric wankery were socializing with someone is Grappling levels of bogging down the game.
I like the way Legends of the Wulin does it. Courtiers Arts use some of the standard combat mechanics, but inflict unique Conditions and have various fun secondary effects you can tie to stuff. And it's perfectly possible to build a character entirely around the idea of social-fuing your opponents into submission.
>>48818274
Burning Wheel and to a lesser degree Legends of the Wulin are the only systems I've ever seen that do social combat well.
>>48818318
>Julia takes 36 points of Embarassment!
>Julia is Humiliated! (status turns red)
>Julia goes home and commits suicide with pills!
>>48819049
aren't the optional rules for social combat in WoD games supposed to be pretty decent too?
>>48819212
Wouldn't know, haven't read WoD due to lack of interest in modern fantasy settings.
>>48819223
gaaaaay, honestly only Vampire games are entirely modern fantasy, mage, werewolf have high fantasy edges and Wraith is a really good dark fantasy setting.
>>48819351
Well, you tell *me* about the optional rules for social combat in WoD games then.
It's basically social HP, but (at least in theory) the bidding system means that the goal is to sucker opponents into throwing their resources at bullshit conflicts and ignore important conflicts to get an advantage over time.
>>48819049
>Burning Wheel
If two characters are having a social combat, I have them both suck me off and whichever does it better, wins. If it's a player vs NPC, I compare their jacking me off to me jacking myself off.
It's a great system that naturally gets harder over time.
>>48819511
>greentext
>>48818274
A Song of Ice and Fire has a good one. The disposition system is a pretty elegant way to reflect that if you despise someone they're not going to suddenly convince you of anything, but nor are you likely to make any headway convincing them of anything
>>48819511
Isn't dungeon world really narrativist? how does that handle social combatand what about Strike!?
A dirty world and a better angels (both One Roll Engines) have an interesting take on it.
Your stats are literally your characters virtues and vices. If you're trying to guilt someone into doing (say lent you money) you're attacking their greed and trying moving it into generosity.
Combat works the same. In a fair fight you're literally attacking their 'courage' stat and trying to push it into coward.
>>48819801
It's 'narrative' dungeon crawler. So you get your usual indie 'collaborative' mechanics but the game still about killing things and taking their stuff.
>>48819801
Doesn't have social combat, but it can do social encounters somewhat better than an average system
>>48819548
Sure you do.
>>48818274
>No option to knee her in the crotch
A swift kick between the legs is incredibly painful for both men and women.
>>48820153
Now that you know how to identify jokes, try playing along with them.
>>48821139
Hey. People have standards.
>>48818274
Plead for your life. She's obviously better than you. I mean, look at her. You're not half that hot. So grovel and maybe she'll deign to show mercy. Not that you deserve it, you worthless whore.
>>48818274
>rip her head off
>>48819351
Wraith is oWoD which doesn't really have a social combat system (to my knowledge)
>>48819401
They're fucking terrible. Genuinely shit for "social combat", they only work somewhat for politics.
This is if we're talking about the "Doors" system
Essentially with the "Doors" system, everyone's got a goal and a bunch of "Doors" between them and their social goal. You open "Doors" with rolls. Open them all and you get the cake.
It's dumber than it sounds
>>48818274
Early oWoD has lots of social encounters due to its structure and the way you're supposed to play it (and because the rules for combat and adventuring are so loose as well), but the actual social rules are pretty shit.
GURPS does a decent job now that Social Engineering is out, but it's still struggling to solve many of the problems you get in social encounters.
I've played many, many other games and pretty much the rest are all variations on "make a social check. ok, the encounter's over." Unless the GM explicitly decides to houserule it.
I think the issue is that social encounters more than anything else in gaming have a collaborative, improvisational theater element. Which either the players can do or they can't but really can't easily be reflected AS A PROCESS in a rules system. Meanwhile, very few social scientists with expertise in one-on-one persuasion write RPG supplements.
Economics has exactly the same problem. Everyone has an opinion, everyone thinks that reading The Atlantic makes them an economist... but very few people who write supplements actually know anything. (GURPS being the honorable exception here.)
>>48824427
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EecCEs6TK9Y
Narratively speaking, what actually qualifies as a Social Boss Fight?
- Courtroom trial
- Convincing the princess not to marry the BBEG
- Quelling (or inciting) a mob riot...
What other good examples are there?
>>48818274
Source please. Is this an actual game?
>>48828933
Convincing a /pol/ard that racism is wrong.
>>48829603
What's wrong about judging people by the general qualities of their culture, exactly? Do you assume not every lion is going to maul you until you're missing half your face?
>>48828933
>Courtroom trial
Unless it's against Winston Payne, then it's just the social combat tutorial.
>>48829603
>create a character
>pick a race
>all the templates are the same
>>48829603
Non-consensual retrophrenology seems more like plain old combat to me.
>>48828933
Job Interview, Court Case, haggling with a merchant for the price of the ultimate weapon +1, etc...
>>48825874
Was thinking more of Wraith's Harrowings, where you often had to psychoanalyse your way out of your character's imminent death.
>>48828933
Pulling a long con ought to require more than the bluff check
>>48819351
Why is Japan so good at hugs?
>>48830071
It's a cute thing. Japan does cute things well most of the time.
>>48829713
Simmer down antifa.
>>48829765
>Job Interview, Court Case, haggling with a merchant for the price of the ultimate weapon +1, etc...
Those seem like ordinary general social encounters. A "Boss Fight" would suggest the climax to a major narrative arc.
Maybe a job interview would qualify as a mini-boss if that's what the game is about, but there would have to be a significant build up.
>>48830112
I had a martial arts instructor back in the 90s who ran with a bunch of S.H.A.R.P.s, getting into gang fights with Portland Neonazis.
She had a whole closet full of leather jackets from skinheads she beat up, but I don't think she ever attacked anyone for just having problematic opinions.
>>48818274
F.A.T.A.L.
>>48830164
>Those seem like ordinary general social encounters. A "Boss Fight" would suggest the climax to a major narrative arc.
A Job Interview is the climax of a "trying to end my NEET ways" arc, a court case is the climax of whatever the court case is about, haggling for the even better than best sword is the optional super social bossfight.
>>48830258
>but I don't think she ever attacked anyone for just having problematic opinions.
>>48829603
Let's stay with the possible, anon.
>>48829638
Low quality bait.
>>48829638
>>48831607
>I can't argue against the point
>It's bait!
No, really. Stay with me here for a minute and learn yourself a thing or two.
We both agree that racism can be defined as the judging of others based on race, color, culture, or creed, without heed given to the individual, can't we?
You would consider a cab driver who avoids picking up blacks to be racist, would you not?
Now, theoretically, what if you were informed that blacks commit, proportionally, so much more crime than whites do, that a cab driver experienced a solid 50% higher percent chance of being mugged or killed if his passenger is black? The actual black crime statistics don't matter (though they're not pretty), let's just focus on our hypothetical here.
Who are you to tell that man that he should put his life on the line, that he should risk his children becoming fatherless and his wife becoming a widow, to avoid being labeled with whatever phrase the fashionable virtue signalers take a fancy to at the time?
This cab driver is a racist. Yet it keeps him alive and unmolested. Racism is, in fact, beneficial for him. As it is also "specism" that causes people to stay away from lions instead of thinking they're just misunderstood and oppressed by the zootriarchy.
http://www.frontpagemag.com/point/244734/black-cab-drivers-accused-being-racist-against-daniel-greenfield
Further, what if that racist cab driver were black? Is he some sort of self-hating racist because he recognizes common tendencies in cultures and creeds? Does he just hate money and work?
Or could it be that noticing trends help you form intelligent decisions?
I encourage you to step out of your 99% white suburbs and rub elbows with the people you so vigorously virtue signal for someday, friend. You're in for a rude awakening.
>>48830258
What if I told you there was a program in portland during the 90s where people getting chemotherapy treatment for leukemia were given complimentary leather jackets by the state?
>>48830258
>She had a whole closet full of leather jackets from skinheads she beat up
Your Martial Arts instructor is pretty badass.
>>48829603
>anon makes a joke
>>48829713
>>48830258
>anons prefer traditional combat
>>48831607
>>48831849
>anons cant into social combat so they shitpost instead
>>48831865
At least you tried. Any second now they'll be patting each other on the back.
>>48831968
>Violence is kewl.
Right on queue.
GURPS
The Star Wars RPG by Fantasy Flight Games is pretty great. Social and martial combat all work using basically the same rules, and many abilities carry over from one to the other.
>>48818274
>social boss fight
>only one actual social option, all others are combat