Now that 5e has the best-selling core rulebook of any edition

>>48804713
To be fair, Pathfinder has been more popular than 3.5 for awhile now anyway.

But yes, 5e is such a drastic improvement, it seems the only playing playing 3.PF anymore are the fetish junkies, hence why all their generals are full of Magical Realm and art from /e/.

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>>48804713
>best-selling core rulebook

No way it sold more than the Basic box sets in the early 80s.

>>48804713
>playing the absolute atrocious mess that is 5e
its like OP is a casual.

>>48804897

Of course it did. D&D is more mainstream now than it has been during the course of its entire existence. Right now is the golden moment for D&D. Regardless of how good the actual game is (I'm fond of it), it would have outsold every other edition easily, and it did.

Tabletop RPGs are enjoying a kind of renaissance right now. We're right at that moment where you can show people other than pitiful nerds playing it on TV (so just regular nerds, then).

>>48804713
>>48804871

Not until the asshole fanbase stops being assholes. Seriously, you guys hold the game back more than any gripes with the game itself. : |

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I was introduced to TTRPG through 3.5 but never played much of it due to the clunkiness of the mechanics.
I have played an absurd amount of 5th since it released so it is the definitive edition for me at least.

>>48804910
>posting this absolute atrocious bait
Here's your (You)

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>>48804931
>Of course it did. D&D is more mainstream now than it has been during the course of its entire existence.

That's some horseshit from a kid who wasn't around during the big D&D fad of that time. There were over 3 million copies of the Mentzer Basic box sets sold, at places like Toys R Us. Today's RPG industry is miniscule in comparison to that boom time.
Jim Ward said TSR were selling 100,000 copies per quarter, just in the US alone during that period.

Pic related, I got one of these from the toy aisle of our local department store, basically like a Target, where there was a whole section of D&D shit brought in. It wasn't some obscure nerd shit, it was a household name in 1983.

>>48805050
>>48804931
Well, to be fair, Mearls did only say that it outsold editions 3-4... Earlier editions were on the shelves for decades, instead of a couple years.

>>48805127

Yeah, Mearls isn't the one >implying, it's OP being a faggot.

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>>48805050
My first adventure. Ah, the heady days of figuring out what a +3 short sword and a +2 ST modifier needs to hit an AC of 4 when your thaco was 16.

The answer is 7. I do that shit in my sleep, son.

I run my homebrew 2nd ed game still and a 5th edition modules (halfway through Out of the Abyss), rotating between them. 5th is the beautiful child of 2nd edition that 3rd edition wishes it was. YOU'LL NEVER BE AS GOOD AS YOUR YOUNGER BROTHER, 3RD EDITION! 5TH EDITION IS GOING PLACES, STOP LOUNGING ABOUT AND SMOKING POT AND TALKING ABOUT HOW YOU'LL GO TO COLLEGE ONE DAY AND DO SOMETHING WITH YOUR LIFE, 5TH EDITION'S GRADUATING LAW SCHOOL NEXT MONTH AND YOU HAVEN'T EVEN PRINTED A RESUME TO BURGER KING!

>>48804871
As someone from /e/, it's not our shit. More /cm/.

Also, I'd like to see sales data for Mearls' quote.

>>48805581
>I'd like to see sales data for Mearls' quote.
Wouldn't we all?

But Wizards has been secretive about proper figures even before they were bought by Hasbro.

>>48805581
Also, what is the market share compared to previous editions? Does 5e have a bigger market share or has the general customer base grown?

>>48804713
4e outsold 3.5, but that didn't change anything either, did it?

>>48805968

5e has less direct competition than 4e did, that much is certain. Pathfinder did not do good things to 4e's sale by going 'We are the REAL D&D'. Harder to do that with 5e due to all the backflipping on 4e's changes.

Just ask what edition they are talking about.

/thread

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>>48805968
There are no real hard numbers. Best that can be shown is the Roll20 quarterly polls, which aren't indicative of every demographic but might be useful to estimate general trends. I don't know, I'm not a statistician.

>>48805968
>>48806054
There's also the ICv2 stuff, which can be found compiled here for the last decade: http://www.enworld.org/forum/content.php?1984-Top-5-RPGs-Compiled-Charts-2008-Present#.V7Fx6ygrKUl

3.5 was the most realistic , simulationist system with the greatest depth. 4e was a pure tactical gamist edition and 5e is a strange love child of them both that doesn't satisfy either.

>>48807133
5e is easier than 4e or 3e for a newbie to get into.
It's still bad at it, because DnD hasn't been good at that ever since competition first popped up, but that's what it is.

Also, calling 3.5 'simulationist' is fine but please don't call it 'realistic' in any way.

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>>48807133
>3.5
>simulationist

>>48807256
Simulationist in the sense that it literally tries to be rules-as-physics.
Hardness rules, aging rules, falling rules, drowning rules, weapon damage types, literally a rule for every situation that could happen.

compare to 'narrative' rules which are for "whatever makes for the best story" and 'gamist' rules which are for "whatever makes for the better designed/more fun game".
No game is only one of these, but they're often biased one way or the other.

GNS as a whole is outdated but the terms are still useful.

>>48805050
You're kind of stupid.

The number of people who played D&D doubled following the release of 3rd edition, and has continued to grow after that.

Your major mental issue is that you're counting small books (practically pamphlets) relative to larger and more expensive ones, rather than looking at things like convention numbers, worldwide statistics, and thanks to the internet, adventure downloads.

It's almost like you're comparing newspaper and magazine subscriptions before and after the internet, and then claiming less people read the news, when dramatically more people read the news than ever.

>>48804713
>tfw I have bought a thousand copies myself

>>48805471
>what a +3 short sword and a +2 ST modifier needs to hit an AC of 4 when your thaco was 16.
12 or better, with a +5 bonus to your roll, right?

>>48807133
>realistic
Lel.

>simulationist

Okay, but that doesn't make it good. Having rules entirely removed from reality, extremely complex, that you need several books to understand and several months to master is not good game design. Even worse when those rules don't make any sense, are unbalanced as fuck, and uninteresting.

5e is what happens when people start to think about making a playable game out of 3.5. I am extremely pleased with the new edition.

>>48804713
>dem self-applied shill parentheses

We finally got them to mark themselves.

>>48804713
>((()))

Is Mearls deliberately using himself as a meatshield for his Jew overlords, or is he actually a Jew?

>>48804713
3.5e is not the base because it sold the best, it's the best because the most people know it and it's the most iconic. When someone says DnD, the first thing that jumps to everyones mind, even if they did not play it, will be most likley either ADnD or 3.5

>>48808255
Virtue signalling. Gotta stick up for that poor oppressed minority group.

>>48808255
>>48808688
I'm completely ignorant. What are you guys talking about?

>>48808758
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triple_parentheses
Forced meme that's fallen into near-meaninglessness.

>>48808758
Someone made an extension that put ((())) around Jewish names. Jews found out and cried anti-semitism, jewlovers started bracketing themselves to 'throw off the racists'. Backfired because none of them realised that doing so actually helps the people using the triple parentheses, because they want to identify people as part of a Jewish conspiracy and marking yourself out as either a shill or pawn only benefits them.

>>48808758
You ever hear of the children's book "The Yellow Star."

It's kinda like that.

>>48804713
>((()))
>rainbow picture

Why am I playing a tabletop game made by these kikes

I was supposed to familiarize myself with 5e in the coming weeks since my group is finally making the switch and this isn't very reassuring

>>48805471
>Ah, the heady days of figuring out what a +3 short sword and a +2 ST modifier needs to hit an AC of 4 when your thaco was 16.

American math scores have continued to drop since THAC0 was removed from the system.

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>>48804713
Only played 5e, idgaf about the other shit.

>>48804713
>can we stop thinking of 3.5e every time people say "D&D"

Yes. Already happened.

>and consider 5e the de facto edition?

Yes. It is.

Probably half the current real-life players in this hobby already consider 5E to be "the D&D".

When I think defacto D&D, I think Game of Thrones.

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>>48807356
>The number of people who played D&D doubled following the release of 3rd edition

And it also plummeted all through the late 80s and 90s, which meant that doubling after that long, massive decline was easy. 3E sold a ton of books, but it was nothing like the nationwide craze that ran from 80-83, which was downright ridiculous. (pic related) The stigma of being "one of those D&D nerds" appeared in the post-boom era. Prior to the boom d&d wasn't even a blip on the public's radar yet, and during the boom everyone was talking about it, with bits on the nightly news and TSR profits going through the roof.

And if you think the Red Box set was "practically a pamphlet" and therefore doesn't count when we're talking about copies of D&D sold, then you're the one who's "kind of stupid."

>>48808903

Why did you post a Hydra plant instead of the gay-loving, illegal-protecting, black, CANON Captain America? What kind of racist shitlord are you and when do you go back to /pol/?

>>48804713
I did awhile ago

>>48804713
I'd love to play 5e, but I haven't had a group in a couple years. Game looks good.

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>>48811061
what

>>48809097

Consider yourself fortunate.

can we stop correlating sales data with superiority and just maintain personal favoritism?

>>48811557
there's two captain Americas because Marvel wants to be diversity and make money.

Falcon is now also Captain America and is super liberal and is fighting robot policemen designed to harass black people.

regular Cap has been mindcontrolled into thinking he's a hydra agent because Red Skull adopted a kawaii cosmic cube that identifies as a little girl

>>48812151
There are four Captain Americas running around. Steve, Sam, the Amazon musclegirl Captian America of 2099 who is a demure housewife in her secret identity and is hanging around the present with the third Spider-Man everyone also forgets, and Luke Cage's daughter from the slightly less future in the upcoming USAvengers.

>>48811557
>He dont know about the new cpt murica

>>48812148

No, because the people who play 3.5 and 5e DnD equate popularity with quality.

>>48806024
In all honesty, 4e was more of a complete reboot and 5e feels more like they're just continuing to develop forward from the old branch.

>>48812151

Except nobody buys the diversity comics and their only moneymakers are the movies.

>>48806054
I'd be interested in comparisons between each game's organized play programs.

5e's certainly the safe bet because of representation in new media, but it'd still be interesting.

>>48806054
There's probably a lot more WoD being run than that, for example. You don't really need a virtual tabletop for it at all, and most people have skype or discord.

>>48810625
>the nationwide craze that ran from 80-83, which was downright ridiculous. (pic related)

This "craze" underperformed and lead to a series of financial difficulties for TSR, ultimately leading to the company to have to restructure itself in '83.

Basically, Gygax and the Blumes overproduced cheap products hoping that the D&D name would be enough to sell them and that flooding the market would help spread the name, but this business strategy fell apart because of an insane overestimation of the power of the D&D brand. That, and TSR trying to branch out into arts and crafts shit like needlework for some ungodly reason.

Basically, it was less of a "boom" and more of a short fad, a fad that was milked for all its worth.

And no, doubling as in doubling the highest number of players previously accounted for. As in, the release of 3rd edition brought in more players than their had ever been previously, and this trend has continued with 5e.

There are considerably more people playing now there ever has been.

>>48818877
>And no, doubling as in doubling the highest number of players previously accounted for.

[citation needed]

I won't deny that it was a fad, but it was still huge. The reason they overextended was because their sales of the core product were phenomenal, and they thought it would keep snowballing.
We have fairly reliable sources from TSR that they were selling 100k red boxes every quarter for several years, leading to estimates of 1.2 million boxes sold in the US alone during the "short fad," and perhaps 3 million sold worldwide. That's colossal.

>>48819206
>leading to estimates of 1.2 million boxes sold in the US alone during the "short fad," and perhaps 3 million sold worldwide.

That 1.2 million figure isn't for a short fad, but for a very long print run.

That might have been impressive 30 years ago, but to put things in perspective, 3rd edition sold 1 million core rulebooks in little over a year, one of the last times WotC announced any sales figures. Of course, that's divided by the three books, but the crazy thing is that the rate of sales were reported to have increased after that point.

As far as 5e, the core rulebooks topped and hovered around the top of the Amazon book sales charts for the first few months after its release. Not RPG book sales, but ALL book sales, with estimates of 3,000+ books sold A DAY, or something to the tune of 300,000 in the first 100 days. And, the scariest thing is that number isn't divided by the three books.

And that's just Amazon sales.

>>48820082
>That 1.2 million figure isn't for a short fad, but for a very long print run.

This is approximately a 3 year period, not the whole print run.
Still, good to see some actual numbers to back up the claim of 3e/5e outselling it, though, I was afraid we were going to be going down a rabbithole of trying to extrapolate player numbers from convention attendance or something from the other guy's spiel about "accounting for" players. As hard as it is to figure out sales figures, figuring out how many people are playing is far worse.

>>48812650

I'm not saying you're bullshitting me, but I am saying that I hope that you're bullshitting me.

>>48814834

Possibly not because 5e's organized play organization is a goddamn dumpster fire. You could replace the entire admin team with bobbleheads that say "buy our shit" or "ask your DM what the rules mean" and not only wouldn't it change anything, but people would appreciate the increased transparency.

>>48820372

Nah. Remember when there were four Supermen? This is the kind of shit comics companies pull when sales start flagging, to get people talking about the book again.

>>48804931
>Of course it did. D&D is more mainstream now than it has been during the course of its entire existence.

Hence why D&D 5e has sold more. Not because it's better, because it's becoming more mainstream.

>>48812928
>No, because the people who play 3.5 and 5e DnD equate popularity with quality.

It's the only upside D&D has because it is already objectively worse than Dungeon World.

>>48820532
Perhaps it is more mainstream because it's better.

>>48820573
>objectively

Oh god, it's one of these faggots.

Shoo. Go away. Go away with your "I don't know how to argue so I posit my opinions as facts." Shoo.

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>>48820573

wew lad

>>48807133
>4e is pure tactical gamist
Fuck, all /tg/ ever told me about 4e was "It's shit". If I'd know it was the gamist edition I would never have even looked at Pathfinder

>>48804713
No, and there's a very simple reason why.
On /tg/, the main reason one would assume an edition of D&D would be because someone asks a question. Here, it is safe to assume 3.5 (being, as far as I can tell, the second-most popular D&D edition after 5e) because anyone retarded enough to not understand 5e surely cannot be smart enough to read English.

>>48821248

You are literally the fucking worst type of person then.

Listening to /tg/

>>48821353
>anyone retarded enough to not understand 5e surely cannot be smart enough to read English.

Were you not here for the endless horse-casting debates?
Wait, those were retarded after all. Carry on.

>>48814658
Weirdest part is, DC has all kinds of diversity and has for a long-ass time and nobody cares because their comics are good but their movies are shit.

>>48806054
>Other Listed Games
> 10,000 games 50,000 players.

I really wish we could have the numbers on those.

>>48821542
Nobody cares about DC because they reboot all their shit every two years in order to make everything hip and fresh again, only to find out that people don't like the changes so they change everything again just when everyone's starting to get used to it.

Honestly, cape comics are just shit in general, there's just different flavours of shit to choose from.

>>48825029
>No one cares about DC.

No one cares about comics in general. Especially marvel.

>>48804713
>Now that 5e has the best-selling core rulebook of any edition and the most players of any edition,
The guy noting that TSR's books sold more was correct, if a little fast-and-loose with the figures. The boom in the early eighties didn't fade out until the 90s, and TSR was able to clear over a million boxed sets as late as '89, six years after its launch. By comparison, 3e was clearing a couple of hundred thousand PHBs a year. (Source: https://www.acaeum.com/library/printrun.html )

So there's simply no way that 5e is the best-selling core rulebook of any edition. It's just the best that WotC has ever done, and that's not saying very much. I doubt that the total sales of all core rulebooks since Wizards took over the IP exceed the sales for Mentzer's boxed set.

>>48825155
Reminds me of Square Soft saying that the adding women enemies into Deus Ex 4 for the first time. Ignore in the frist two games.

Or the 'new' option to play as a woman in fallout 4, ignoring every single game before including the previous ones by their studio

That's great devs, but could you please return the ability to kill children back?

>>48804713
>"What's popular is always best!"

No.

I still play OSR, and only OSR. You can have your broken newfangled unrestricted poly-classing. I'll stick with my tried and true systems.

>>48804713
How does one read that mess of a post?

>>48805050
You might be underestimating the internet.

>>48825632
>I still play OSR
It's been established that TSR's rules were the most popular (look up to >>48825155
). You're just on the biggest bandwagon, rather than evaluating the editions by their actual quality.

>>48806054
5E on Roll20 is hilarious broken though, 80% of all games never start or don't survive more than a couple of sessions.

>>48825696
Isn't that true for all of the roll20 games?

Pretty sure 3.PF statistics are similarly bad.

>>48825734
No, look at the chart, If 5e really had 40% of the total games played on roll20 is should have a much much higher percentage of the playerbase.

This means people aren't sticking with 5e and the people running Pathfinder and 3.5 are much more experienced and run their tables for much longer.

>>48825029
Rebirth has acutally been surprisingly legit so far. However, like you said, because they reboot so regularly it's still hard for me to get too excited.

Of course, they've only actually reset a few times, all in recent history too. Ideally, now that the 52 debacle has been concluded, they'll slow their roll, or cut it out all together.

>>48825632
> You can have your new shit, I'll stick to the old shit.
I'm not a huge fan of D&D in general, but it's both frustrating and hilarious that there are people who think OSR/TSR systems are legitimately superior, and not equally riddled with a different set of flaws.

>>48825757
The solution your conundrum is that players participate in multiple games. Most of the players playing 3.5 also play PF and most likely 5e.

And yet wizards still can't into caster/martial balance.

I love me some dnd, bit this is a fundamentally flawed game.

>>48826526
This isn't even a question of ineptitude anymore. The basic premise mames it near impossible and the fans are against the changes necessary to balance it. You just can't balance a fighting man and the limitless DnD style reality bender.

>>48826619
Sure they could. Introduce feat taxes or skill taxes for spell use. Introduce skill monkey features for non casting classes.

>>48805050
Horse shit. Dnd was obscure except to the nerdiest nerds and 12 year old nerds in training. Now even the most clueless normie knows what dnd is and a lot of them even own a book or two. Dnd has never been even close to what it is now.

>>48807980
Yup. Subtract AC from THAC0 to get the number you actually need to hit, then roll with any modifiers.

But while I get peoples' nostalgia coloring their view, honestly, modern AC is a much better system. There's no reason to add complexity just to have complexity, and wanting a lower AC is just plain counterintuitive.

>>48808922
Maybe people shouldn't be relying on a nerdy fantasy game to teach their kids math?

>>48804713
We have similar phenomenon in our country - brass music has the most sales across all the genres of music. Does that mean it's the most popular? Hell no, it just means it's most popular with people too old or too technically impaired to download all their shit for free. But hey, good for WotC, keeps them in the business and stuff.

>>48825155
Those numbers don't really seem to add up. None of the books listed in your source sold more than 200,000 in the entirety of their run, and the million per year number figure in your source was never substantiated and was admittedly an estimation. I understand core rulebooks are expected to outsell all the rest by a large margin, but a million in one year is already more than 7 times the number of the entirety of the sales of the Faerunian Campaign setting, which is quite odd.

Compared to the confirmed selling of over a million core books of 3rd edition in its first year and the fact that TSR was posting losses during years it was supposed to be selling large volumes of books, there's something curious about the million boxed sets in '89, though ultimately we're still talking about largely speculated figures.

I think a firmer display of number of players might be seen in gaming convention attendance, with Gen Con in 1992 breaking all previous records with a whopping 18,000 attendees.

For a comparison, the 2016 Gen Con only saw a measly 200,000,

>>48827104
>brass music has the most sales across all the genres of music
That is an interesting observation. Do you have the source?

>>48827031

Sounds like you weren't there when Gygax was in People magazine and being interviewed on the nightly news programs. Everyone was talking about D&D for a while there. What do you think a fad is, anyway?

>>48827123
TSR was posting losses in the late 80s, but during the fad years was posting profits of 15-22 million dollars, which is pretty impressive for the era and industry.
Setting books and things didn't take off for a long time. Most of the "normal" folks who bought D&D bought the Basic Red Box set and figured they were done. I knew plenty of folks who had that box and nothing else, because why would you need other stuff when you have an imagination?
Also, TSR's monetary problems had a lot to do with mismanagement by the Blumes.

>>48828073
Were you around when the 5e books topped the books sales chart on Amazon?

It's around that point where it's no longer an oddity to air right before the weather.

>>48828073
What 'bout those convention numbers? That's a pretty impressive difference.

>>48828185

Yeah, but you also have to try to account for the mainstreaming of conventions over the years. Going to a convention in the 80s was, to most people, something that businessman did. Maybe Shriners.

The SF conventions had been around for quite a while, but were seen by subset of people who even knew about them as hyper-nerd things, like that was what you turned into when you evolved past a regular nerd. Going to conventions was super weird back then.

Now the atmosphere is different. When the news covered, for instance, a Star Trek convention back then it was with a kind of faintly snide, disdainful attitude that you don't really see on the news today.

>>48828294
Almost like it wasn't as mainstream as it is now, right?

Like nowhere even close, right?

Like, if we needed to draw a straight line between the two points in order to illustrate the shortest distance between them, it would be so long that we'd have to take the curvature of the earth into account, right?

>>48828353
>Almost like it wasn't as mainstream as it is now, right?

Don't try to play word games, man. Going to conventions at all wasn't nearly as mainstream then as it is now. That means going to D&D conventions wasn't as mainstream then as it is now, even if we presuppose that D&D itself was exactly as mainstream then as it is now. My whole point is that conventions have become far more socially acceptable over the past thirty years, and you need to control for that change if you want to use convention attendance numbers as a substitute for D&D player numbers.

>>48828406
We're talking about more than 10 times the amount of attendees, but whatever.

At the end of the day, the raw numbers are an estimated 3 million players in 1982. By 2007, that number became 6 million, with the overwhelming majority playing 3rd edition.

And, according to Wizards, 5e is selling better than 3rd edition.

>>48820532
D&D hasn't been good since BECMI days, tho.

>>48828819

Okay, so:

>3 million players vs 6+ million
>so probably somewhere in the range of 2-5 times the player base
>yet more than 10 times the number of convention attendees

Like I said, going to conventions is a MUCH more common and mainstream thing now than then, so you can't just use convention numbers as a substitute for player numbers like the guy upthread was trying to suggest we do.

One thing I know is that the playerbase is WAY older now. When I was a kid in grade school we had two separate D&D groups running at recess, and I heard there was another group that played after school. Parents were buying the box set for their kids at Toys R' Us and shit.

>>48828908
We're trying to illustrate to you that the game is more mainstream and more popular now then it ever was. A dramatic rise in convention attendees is a good show of that.

A similar convention that also saw similar numbers (10,00 in 1980, 170,000 in 2015) is Comic-con, and it's well documented that the number of comic sales by unit and comic readers has consistently increased since the 80's, as well as their mainstream appeal.

Ultimately, the bottom line is that there are more players now then there ever has been. Though D&D is no longer marketed with substandard toys and pottery kits, that doesn't mean less people have heard of it. People know it as a roleplaying game, and ultimately, it not only has a broader reach, but a larger reach in regards to the population.

Every day, the record for the most players is broken, as D&D is now more popular than it ever has been, and roleplaying games in general are more popular as well.

>>48828852
This guy gets it

>>48829063

And all I'm saying is that convention attendance and fanbase are just loosely connected, not directly correlated.

>>48829266

This

Most con-goers these days don't even know what the con they're attending is for. They just hop into the most convenient cosplay and head on out to preen and peacock while shitting on the people building our culture.

>>48829574


calm your tits bro

gencon is great

GIVE ME STRONK FIGHTERS OR GIVE ME DEATH WHY ARE FIGHTERS STILL NOT AS STRONG AS THEY WERE IN THE VERY FIRST RELEASE REEEEEEEEEE

>>48829266
There's a correlation, even if it's not direct.
And, while correlation does not equal causation and all that, it's not a bad way to illustrate that it has grown in size and mainstream appeal.

And, while it's not 10x bigger, it can often feel that way, largely because of the improved communication, cooperation, and ability to assemble that the community has.

But, I think the key thing to take away is that yes, it's bigger.

No we can unless we are someone too young to have played 3.5e.

People over thirty are playing Pokemon Go because it has first gen pokemon on it and because is Fremium.

That's just how nostalgia works.

Now later gonna look for my N64 and play Pokemon Snap at it because I don't have a Wii U.

>>48804713
>Now that Justin Bieber has had more simultaneous top 100 hits than the Beatles Michael Jackson and Elvis, can we just agree that he's the de facto pop icon and what everyone should measure all other pop against?

This is what you sound like, call up your mom and tell her you're sorry for everything.

>>48826779
>Introduce skill monkey features for non casting classes.
Until they prevent casters from utilizing these features with equal power, it'll never work. The closest you get right now is having them key of different stats, but this does nothing to stop Paladins or Clerics who will tend to have decent physical stats anyway.

>>48804897

It only outsold 3, 3.X, and 4, but not combined. They're also referring to units sold, and not total profit.

It's simply the best selling D&D edition since 2e, but it still hasn't beaten out 2e.

>>48829800
Bieber is popular. Therefore, he is a pop star.

Because that's what "pop" music means. Popular.

>>48825632
>>"What's popular is always best!"
that's not what OP was saying at all, though

What exactly are the selling points for 5e, anyway?

>>48834715

It's simple

>>48834715
http://scibbe.com/?p=3699
http://scibbe.com/?p=3752

>>48832392
No, "pop" in that context refers to a genre of music.

>>48827123
>Those numbers don't really seem to add up.
The biggest-selling TSR products (the boxed sets) were aimed at children. They moved in large numbers because they were popular birthday and christmas presents. TSR lost huge amounts of money thinking that they had those same kids "for life" and could endlessly sell them derivative products.

>I think a firmer display of number of players might be seen in gaming convention attendance
Not really. 12 year olds don't generally go to cons.

>>48828819
>At the end of the day, the raw numbers are an estimated 3 million players in 1982. By 2007, that number became 6 million, with the overwhelming majority playing 3rd edition.
Source?