Pathfinder General /pfg/

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I recently bought the Pathfinder Pawns box 4 for about $17 at a local game shop, and am wondering if the Pawns box 3 is worth it at $20.

I don't have very many miniatures so I'm trying to broaden what I have, using pawns to represent lots of different things, and I don't have a big budget for lots of miniatures. Unfortunately they only have box 3, no NPC codex or Box 1, which would give me the broadest range as far as basic monsters go.

Anyways, anyone have the Box 3? Any good? Box 4 is awesome, Godzilla and Cthulu in one box, hard to go wrong.

>>47747971
>Buying Pathfinder shit
Anon, no.

Look in the OP. Make paper miniatures. Use tokens. Use virtual tabletops.

E6 Mythic Gestalt game, fellas. Knowing in advance there are many many many ways to make such a game explode, and aside from capping Mythic ranks and such, what are the best quick-and-dirty limits for Mythic?

I know it's an inherently broken bungle et cetera et cetera Mythic cloudkill, I'm not asking for the miracle of balance, just some mitigation. Cap how much mystic power you can spend? Anything else?

Why has /pfg/ been so full of shit posting this past week?

>>47748135
Paid shitposters and shills, or some forum found the board and is trying to 'raid'.

Which is better, a flavorful fighting style (guns, throwing, unarmed) or a functional one (two-handed, archery)?

Is it wrong to reflavor something like archery to be a gun if you could do it in-system through alternate means?

>>47748135
The DM's Guild for 5th Edition is spinning up, so most of the "muh meaningless trap options" freaks are migrating to a system that actually rewards their experiments. Those were the last actual players on /pfg/.

>>47747987
Was thinking of making my own miniatures, however with the thick cardstock and it only being like $20 for 300 or so monsters made it seem worth it.

Also the mega link in the OP doesn't have the Bestiary boxes in it, so I couldn't make my own from 3.

I appreciate the suggestions though. I like miniatures better than tokens, helps me keep track of things and looks better.

>>47747971
I'd buy it. The LGS's already given Paizo money for it, you're just supporting your store. The pawn boxes are actually pretty useful, I have Bestiary Box 1 and Iron Gods box.

>>47748176
Function, but

>reflavor

Do this. Just say your bow is a rifle.

>>47748111
Give it only to martials, never to casters.

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Hey /pfg/ I'm working on a luchador class and was hoping to get some feedback from you guys. I'm trying to make a tough combat support who can lock down enemies and control the battlefield. Here is a link https://docs.google.com/document/d/1PuHwR9uNL9zL2AGqUhYzOd47IJb22l1IK4aU1GxyYuU/edit?usp=sharing Let me know what you think.

>>47748224
I see
>jumps into escape pod and sets co-ordinates for symbaroum

>>47748315
Reddit already told you it wasn't good. Do you think people here will be any dumber?

>>47748376
>Dumber than reddit
IMPOSSIBRU

>>47748315
I think it's shit but I'll be sure to correct your oppressive pronouns for you.

>>47748243
Why does having high strength boost my rifles damage?

>>47748481
Because pulling the trigger harder makes the primer go boom better, of course.

>>47748481
Obviously it helps you pack more powder in tighter

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>>47748111
The biggest issue with Mythic frankly is that it makes Schrodinger's Wizard a reality. Also Amazing Initiative, while a cool concept, can be a massive pain in the ass to deal with. Getting a proper scale for measuring Mythic is nigh impossible since you have weak shit like Mythic Alertness, and then there's goddam Wild Arcana. While Mythic has one or two neat toys for martial characters in addition to mechanics that actually make them reasonable functional, it simply filates casters to no end.

Mythic can be a barrel of fun, but it requires a lot of diligence on the GM's part to sculpt encounters for their players that are both fair and challenging. I can probably dig up a few examples used in the game I'm playing in, but it may take a while to get a few good examples out the gate. However, I really wouldn't recommend Mythic either way unless you're that bored and have a really solid grasp/feel of what you're doing.

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>want to make racial archetype for kitsune be all about the racial magic and magical tails
>the magical tail feat is locked to specific SLAs, all of which are only 2/day
>Fuck that noise, time to remake that shit

What are some good spells of the Illusion, Enchantment, and Necromancy schools to use as abilities?

>>47748498
Then how come it stops hitting hard if i hand it someone not as strong if I load it?

Why isn't my ammunition ruined by water?

Or spell that fuck with gunpowder?

How come the guy who took Weapon Focus:Longbow gets a bonus when using my rifle?

Why don't I have a buckshot option for my blunderbuss?

Why is my gun so quiet when I didn'[t modify it?

How come I'm so good with a Long Bow despite literally never having touched one.

>>47748555
Because your DM is stupid and didn't patch those rule holes

>>47748530
Take a look at the beguiler spell list for the first two.

>>47748481
Since it's the "composite" bonus you've grabbed, your higher strength allows you to handle a slightly larger caliber and/or +P rounds with the same ease as a weaker person could use a normal weapon.

>>47748569
But we're just re-flavoring anon, just like how the Wizards clockwork familiar can still be poisoned, dominated, sneak attacked, bleed out, be unaffected by shit that affects constructs, and can't be healed with repair skills.

It's almost like re flavoring shit falls apart the moment you get into things that really should be functionally different and that it's a terrible argument that /pfg/ should stop using.

>>47748605
look, if you don't like the arguments, just reflavor them.

>>47748555
Better question is what happened to make you so autistic?
Was it those aids injections you had as a kid?

>>47748555
Early Firearms are now the Bows.

BAM.
Not only does it make more sense because of how long and difficult archery was to learn, but there's now actual reason for them to have eventually been replaced.

>>47748605
Flavour _always_ takes a backseat to mechanics.

Why do I fight at full strength until I drop unconscious?

Why can my rogue strike at the vital organs of a skeleton?

Gaming abstractions and rules holes exist, and you can either address them and rip yourself out of the story, or you can work around them and call it a day.

(In this case, I would give guns bow mechanics, and just say that anything that specifically refers to bows has a duplicate version that specifically refers to guns. No interop, being good at bows doesn't make you good at guns, and being good at guns doesn't make you good at bows. There's still some weirdness, but it's of the "easily avoided if the player isn't an autistic prick" variety.)

>>47748736
That still requires every gun user to be Arnold Schwarzenegger. It's a poor fit.

>>47748241
So is Paizo a shit company? I haven't been DM'ing very long, just playing as a player in games so I haven't really encountered them much.

>>47748736
Unfortunate... but fact.
In many systems, and Pathfinder is a prime example, the fluff finds itself fighting the mechanics at every step.

And it can't win.

Much like the social, awareness, thrown and other charms made Exalted's 'Usurpation' impossible in 2nd edition, Guns taking over can't happen in Pathfinder (even at 10% "guns everywhere" it's more expensive than a longbow, no easier to learn, still weaker, and, because of the crafting rules, still harder and longer to craft!)

Likewise, commoners being in charge of kingdoms when every two-bit faction at *least* has charm-person on hand...

The more you have to fight the mechanics, the more handwaving, excuses and holes you end up with.

>>47748803
Doesn't archery really only pull ahead of guns when iterative and multi shot come online?

>>47748771
Alright, so, imagine the most stereotypical Tumblr user you can come up with.

Paizo keeps firing their good writers and hiring those in their place, leading to shit like random transgender people shoehorned in everywhere, lamenting the aching struggle of being trans in a world where it costs like 400gp to make an item that changes an infinite number of people's genders permanently, or at worst, a low-DC alchemy check to make a free item that changes it temporarily.

They're pretty vocal in their disdain, hate even, for the audience, the hobby, men, white people, and so on.

When one of the tiny handful of good authors left manages to put together something actually worthwhile, 99% of the time, the guy in charge chops chunks off of it to squeeze in more of his useless overpowered shit.

>>47748605
So why then it a bow faster and more damaging than a gun, let alone a revolver

>>47748803
Actually, at Guns Everywhere, they're Simple weapons, which means even a commoner with their one measly simple proficiency can know how to fire a gun.

>Make a Cavalier to join a campaign
>Can deal 3d6+12 damage on a Challenged target and charging, at a bonus of +12 at Level 4
>Have to create an entire companion for my horse
>Order of the Hammer characterizes my character and allows him to fistfight
>All of this and the only backstory my Cavalier has is that his name is Edward
Holy shit, does Pathfinder always have this much shit in chargen?

>>47748875
Oh.

>>47748875
There are like 4 transgendered characters.

>>47748875
>When one of the tiny handful of good authors left manages to put together something actually worthwhile, 99% of the time, the guy in charge chops chunks off of it to squeeze in more of his useless overpowered shit.

Hey now, that's not fair.

You've got a 50/50 crapshoot between it being overpowered or underpowered shit.

>>47748762
And we have wizards who rip open portals to different dimensions.

I fail to see how guys that use guns needing to be strong is the thing you take issue with due to realism

>>47748979
But because one thing being bad doesn't excuse everything being bad. Not everything needs to be realistic, but should at least try to make sense and gun users needing to be strong shits on other character concepts involving guns.

>>47748871
Actually, vs Early firearms it pulls ahead with an earlier rapid-shot and 12 or 14 strength. Soon as you have both, you'll always be ahead of the curve.

Without Gunslinger 5 (and archers don't need to be gunslinger 5) the gap widens quickly and brutally as stat items start to appear.

Then someone gets manyshot while the other guy has to buy rapid-reload just to be able to get his iterative shot. By this point even hitting against Touch-AC does not compensate despite its increasing value accuracy-wise.

Eventually, the various Bow-Only magic items come into play as well.

The entire time, despite being a small factor at any given moment, there has also been another compounding issue: the base weapon has been and remains more expensive, and the ammunition is equal to dozens of arrows every single shot. By the time you can afford infinite ammunition (harder to get/do than with bows, and more expensive as usual) you *are* probably 1-2k (more if you get an advanced firearm) behind the archer for that too.

>>47748875

To be more fair than the situation probably merits, the one-and-done sex-change elixir that really should mean any compassionate alchemist could easily treat every dysphoric individual seeking to transition easily isn't WBL "affordable" (ie, less than 50% of WBL) until level 7 for basic NPCs.

So yer low-level dirt farmers that are living off what they make on their Profession check each week probably can't afford the Elixir of Sex Shift, but on the other hand 2000 GP is a party favor for PCs and "heroic" NPCs alike so there really is no good reason why most adventurers or really anyone that's wealthy and trans in the setting hasn't knocked one back. Sharda presumably hasn't because she's assumed to be level 1, but by level 4 or so easy and perfect transition should be on the table for a paltry bit of her loot.

Hell, I slashed the price of the Elixir still further at my table, mostly because they explicitly point out the elixir has no mechanical benefits except negating that -2 to disguising yourself as the opposite gender and it allows the baseline assumption that in the game setting everyone can easily live as the gender they identify as rather than trying to preserve a struggle that wouldn't be a struggle in real life either if magic gender-change potions existed.

>>47748995
Then shift the composite damage bonus to a mental stat. We're changing the rules a bit so why not go a little farther. or just give them dex to damage.

>>47748926
And he will never afford one at the mere 10% of its usual cost.

>>47748948

I don't see what you're complaining about?

>>47748926
And since lots of monsters rely on armour bonuses rather than dexterity for their AC, it makes hectopeasant tactics more viable.

>>47749005
Who cares about the Elixir, the Elixir is literally pointless. The Girdle of Opposite Gender can be had for 200gp, or maybe it was 400gp, is an instantaneous permanent change with no downsides, and ISN'T consumable.

A couple hundred GP to solve every trans person's problem isn't much of a price.

If you somehow can't get hold of one of those belts, fine, thanks to Crystal, you can use Craft (Alchemy) and take 10 (as long as you don't have a penalty) to make a temporary sex change item. Just make a new one every week and you're set.

>>47749073
This, guns are handy for the masses and the level 1-3 smuch but not necessarily adventurers expected to murder fuck gods.

>>47748948
>I have no point to make, but I'm definitely mad about something and I'll be damned if I don't let everyone know.

I was thinking of running some sort city based campaign. How can I make my players feel attached to the city besides having them create there own reason for doing so in their backstory and developing relationships with NPC?

>>47749005
Low-level dirt farmers have more to worry about than not getting to be what gender they identify as. Like being attacked by an ooze monster that is larger than their entire hovel.

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Alright /pfg/, I want ya'll to give me the scoop on Radience.
The entry on ArchiveNethys is kinda bare-bones, and I'd like to know a bit more since I'll be playing a Paladin in WotR, but I had already had plans for him to wield his ancestor's greataxe and bond with it in the future instead.
Seeing as I'm the only Paladin (the closest is the party's Harbinger, who'll probably be NG or CG), I want to be able to properly weigh my options, and see if it would be worth it to stick to the my axe instead for RP reasons, or if doing so would cause me to lose out on too great of a boon.

>>47749450
Most people can learn to love themselves as they are, or at least tolerate.

As loud as they may be, it's a very percentage of the population that wants to change genders.

And many of them probably have so many other larger worries - such as dirt farmers in orc-infested lands - that that particular "this is why I'm unhappy" probably never crossed their minds.

>>47749458
A Good GM should change loots to fit the party.

>>47749458
What?

Antipaladins are so fucking retarded, how many DMs do you think would say yes if you asked to play a character with antipaladin abilities but no assfucking code? Or even an antipaladin with Smite Law or Smite Chaos or even Smite Evil, instead of the default Smite Literally Nobody You'll Ever Fight Even In An Evil Campaign?

>>47748926
Guns Everywhere makes commoners an actual threat actually.
Wealth is not an issue, especially if these commoners were drafted as an army, meaning their weapons are bought for them.

Imagine your typical firing line.

You have 2 or 3 rows of gunners in the back. Two in reserves, loading or fixing their gun, while one of them fires, rotating their roles in concert. And then you got pikemen at the front to protect the gunners at the rear.

Mechanically speaking from a gameplay POV:
You have a row of commoners capable of dealing damage by ignoring your AC.
You cannot make a charge attack against those gunners because you'd be poked by a Brace weapon.
Take note Brace weapons are very effective against charging opponents (-2 AC) and against horsemen (Unless your mount is wearing heavy armor or you have an insanely high ride bonus)

And don't bring in the casters argument either. Those guys are more likely to get shredded by firearms because their go-to spell against arrows don't work against shot.

>>47749515
What part is confusing you?

>>47749512
Its not the loot part that is the problem, it's that I don't want to trade out my family's heirloom axe.
Unless you are suggesting the DM should homerule that it works for the Harbinger instead, in which case I could try to ask him to homerule that, since he's okay with DSP, he should also be cool with that homerule.

>>47749522

TYRANT
Y
R
A
N
T

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>>47749522
I tell anyone who picks a Paladin to come up with a strongly-held moral code/crusade for their character, show it to me, and then pick their own alignment and whatever they want from Paladin and anti-Paladin features at each level as long as they can justify it. No further restrictions - even a LG Paladin can tell me they need Smite Good if they're a character dedicated to correcting a faltering church (in their view) or something. Or training to save heaven from Iomedae.

But I think of classes more as approximate representations of a character concept and not the definitions of their character, which I'm not saying is normal or even better, just the way I go.

>>47749524
Rather the main magical counter to these would be a simple flame-orb or fireball.

Here's the problem though.
If we follow these same mechanics: For every musket, you can have three heavy crossbowmen, who can start firing at three times the distance, and where the vs-touch-AC only finally comes into play in the last volley before melee (within 40ft); which is 1/3 the base range increment of the crossbow. The ammunition is cheaper still, of course; even with guns everywhere, less than 10% of a single bullet and powder charge for 10 bolts.

If you don't mind having somewhat shorter range, you could have 4 LIGHT crossbows with enough ammunition to keep them all supplied for the cost of every single unloaded musket. These have 80ft instead, but that's a *lot* of peasants. These can fire every round though. For peasants, that's twice the RoF!

At this point if you're looking at it from a "budget" rather than "individual" point of view, the crossbows are cheaper, faster to craft, less vulnerable to bad weather (not much better IN bad weather but the powder won't cake and be ruined), and more dangerous at all but "they're impaled on our pikes" range.

>>47749524
> touch ac
You can still dodge those bullet yo!

Common have 10 DEX with no precise shot. Anyone with decent DEX (+3 or +4) and 3 rank in Acrobatic can Total Defense (+6 Dodge AC) and walkthrough that shit.

>>47749694
Don't worry about the touch-AC. It gets used maybe once, and if it gets a second shot it's against things already being skewered.

A musket's touch-AC range is 40 feet. -5ft per row of pikemen, -5ft per gun line in front of yours as well.

A very thin pike hedge might be only two deep, so that's 30/25/20ft for the guns to touch.

>>47749694
Remember that +4 dex isn't 'decent'.

+4 Dex is an unbelievably agile person.

Secondly, three ranks means having at least three levels, and having put ranks into acrobatics means this guy isn't just agile, he's specifically trained to be as dodgy as possible.

Also, you don't know the commoner has 10 dex. They could quite easily have 12 dex. And fat lot of good this guy's doing if he's spending all his standards on defending himself.

>>47749689
>Rather the main magical counter to these would be a simple flame-orb or fireball.

if you're bringing artillery into the equation, then the other side gets the same treatment and have their own magical artillery as well.

If not, a swift horse cavalry will still make short work of your casters from the flanks while the martials are being skewered out in front.

>>47749732
And +4 AC to target because row of pikeman give soft cover

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Personallu, I've always felt that guns targeting Touch AC was kinda dumb, especially since Fullplate was invented afterwards and "Bullet-Proof" plate was very much a thing.
Maybe it should have targeted Flat-Foot AC instead, or maybe just be made completely different.

>>47749694
+3-4 dex isn't in the npc array.

>>47749764
Well presumably, the magic-users are what's being defended by these pike/gun lines.

>>47749775
Cover only applies if the cover is closer to your target than you. The gun guys are RIGHT behind them.

>>47747725
She tries new and exciting blends of coffee and poisons.

TFW still no game.

>>47748315
Read it over, did some suggestions which you saw. I actually kinda like it. I suggest some more armor-like bonuses, since it's losing out on armor- that or give the extra Second Wind abilities as part of regular progression. Not sure. It's not spectacular, but it's playable, and especially interesting as a one-level dip.

>>47749764
No, was just explaining that if there is a mage facing that kind of grouped bunch, he should just nuke'em rather than laugh at them from behind a wind wall.

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I'm bored and tempted to start making more characters that I'll never play! What are some classes or concepts I should look up? 3rd party, first party, homebrew are all open game!

>>47749800
Consider the caliber of people you've got to work with. To be able to nuke that emplacement, the mage has to have a good amount of levels on those guys. And he can do it maybe once or twice, then he's tapped for the day and may as well go home.

>>47749811
Eldrich Scion Magus, try dipping a level into some other charisma-based classes like Swash or Sorc, see if you can do anything interesting.

more like assfinder

>>47749800
My Hunter can wipe out those guys with less effort and level than a fireball.

Just gotta take my Roc up above and beyond firing range and drop Feather Token: Trees on them.

>>47749828
Hmm paladin 2 would give good saves, eldritch scion has issues with not getting spell recall or something, right?

>>47749787
It'll apply when they're engaged in melee.
It'll also apply at range if they're behind non-halfling pikemen: Partial cover at the least.

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Are Undead immune to morale bonuses? Or is it just negative morale effects?

I-i'm not asking for any particular reason... rattle rattle

>>47749811
You could try making a vigilante warlock

>>47749870
Yeah, no spell recall, but being Cha-based and Spon-casting make it really flexible both for multiclassing and for general purpose stuff

>>47749900
both.

>>47749900
>Immunity to all mind-affecting effects (charms, compulsions, morale effects, patterns, and phantasms).

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/rules-for-monsters/creature-types#TOC-Undead

>>47749900
Be an Archivist bard

Any Idea's for a Party face who does decent in combat no 3rd party stuff.

>>47749945
Be an Empiricist Investigator with Student of Philosophy to make Diplomacy pure Int

>>47749787
Source? Because I don't think that is how cover rule work.

>>47749886
In melee you only get the -4 for shooting into melee.

And you have to be CLOSER to the cover than the person shooting you to get it. If they're either side of the guy in between them, that's equal distance.

>>47749979
> Creatures, even your enemies, can provide you with cover against ranged attacks, giving you a +4 bonus to AC. However, such soft cover provides no bonus on Reflex saves, nor does soft cover allow you to make a Stealth check.

Pikeman provide cover.

> To determine whether your target has cover from your ranged attack, choose a corner of your square. If any line from this corner to any corner of the target's square passes through a square or border that blocks line of effect or provides cover, or through a square occupied by a creature, the target has cover (+4 to AC).

Nothing about your "having to be closer" thingy. As long as the pikeman is blocking your LoS, your target get softcover. Don't bring your houserule into conversation.

>>47749979
Cover is determine by the attacker's LoS/LoE not the target.

>>47749963
which book is the source for Student of Philosophy?

>>47750147
Pathfinder Player Companion: Quests & Campaigns © 2013, Paizo Publishing, LLC; Authors: Amanda Hamon and David N. Ross.

>>47750047
>>47749978
>>47750065
It depends if the DM rules the pikemen are counting as low cover.

"A low obstacle (such as a wall no higher than half your height) provides cover, but only to creatures within 30 feet (6 squares) of it. The attacker can ignore the cover if he's closer to the obstacle than his target."

So you can shoot over a guy in a crouch with no issues.

>>47749963
You can also consider Bruising Intellect, to get intimidate off int. Unfortunately, RAW you can't get both because they're social traits.

You can't quite get every mental skill to key off int, but you can get alarmingly close.

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Does Greater Unarmed Strike from PoW benefit at all from a Monk's Robe? Is there other sources of making unarmed damage scale up that I could use if it doesn't?

>>47750195
There was some other trait that let you do it but I don't remember what. It might not have been specific to intimidate but maybe a chosen skill?

>>47750228
Child of the streets lets you choose Wisdom or Intellect for all Bluff rolls.

Intimidating Prowess lets you Strength to Intimidate.

>>47749900
Yes, but there's precedent for undead barbarians still receiving their bonuses from Rage basically just because.

>>47750181
There is no rule for creature crouching. Like I said, don't bring houserule into conversation.

>>47750307
There's a difference between houserule and extrapolation.

There's no rule forbidding dead creatures acting either.

>>47750368
That's because they CAN act. The condition specifically says their soul leaves their body- said soul is still technically under player control, and afterlife shenanigans ensue. But the body, of course, now being a dead body (an inanimate object specified elsewhere) it of course cannot perform actions.

>>47750181
If they were crouching there's an argument to be made for partial cover, but that's it.

It's one thing if there's a single line of pikemen crouching and the FIRST line of musketeers is aiming it with their shoulders as a rest or the like. But the second and third line? Definitely cover.

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>When you're just trying to make a Dragon Dogma mystic knight but the DM doesn't allow PoW

>>47750879
Mystic Archers were SO FUN too.

>>47750924
Christ the plot was bad but the combat was absolutely fucking delicious.

>>47750879
>When you're trying to allow PoW, but your players won't use it because (insert one of several reasons)

>>47750942
I was lucky enough to avoid a certain... problem, after seeing it happen to my friend.

my friend...
and his true love the Weapon Salesman.

>Character is a second son that called for a gap year after his brother died
>He's essentially a frat boy trying to milk one more year of leisure and zero responsibilities before he's forced into handling the stuffy minutia of courtly life
>He's also hoping he can find some magical bullshit to resurrect his brother and put him back in charge so he can go back to the wine and whores.

How does this sound for a backstory and motivation? The shockingly lazy and charming bro-tier nobleman that's secretly terrified of losing his lifestyle, and allusions to it brings him enormous amounts of anxiety?

>>47750879

Magus

>play a nobleman
>fifth son of a baron
>not even good enough for a knighthood
>given a horse, money, and told to make my fortune with a commission in the military

Life is pain.

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>>47748530
I have a level 5 Oracle with Wrecking Mysticism who dumps all his feats into Magical Tail. It's actually quite strong. Misdirection is the only tail I haven't found useful. Seriously, the spell is so darned useless. I can think of some uses against PCs, but I've never had an NPC ever detect my alignment or had someone who I knew could cast detect magic I needed to scam. And I'm playing a merchant!

>>47751005
>Fire Sword Combo!
>Fire ~*SPELLS EXPENDED*~
>*click*
>*click*
>What the fuck do you mean I'm done for the day?

>>47750976
They patched it so the affection rating of merchants rise fucking slowly now in Dark Arisen. But that means romancing Madeleine is an issue too.

>>47750965
I fucking know right?
I'm recommending PoW and we have a fucking cavalier of all things.

>>47751005
Magus can't nearly be as cool as a mystic knight though.
A mystic knight is more 'magically augmented fancy sword blows and magic orb cannons + sick magic shield', more than 'i deliver my spell with my sword'.

>>47751031

That's what you get for being the disappointment in an era that practiced primogeniture.

>>47748135
Examples?

>>47750965

>When you wholeheartedly suggest it but they relent and insist on playing a CRB Rogue because its 'simpler'.

>When the other party members are a battle Cleric, a heavily focused built shadow conjuration Wizard, and Mystic

Well I tried. Their own damn fault at this point.

>tfw gestalt
>tfw I want to play a Black Blade Magus
>tfw the Sword is going to be your typical "kill them all, Peter" and the wielder is either too unaware or dumb to notice.

What should I gestalt this concept with for maximum laughs? Cavalier?

>>47748169
Balls, people shit talk 3.pf all the time. Just because people are doing it in /pfg/ doesn't mean they're getting paid. If they were I want to know the link where I can sign up at.

>>47751083
Being dumb is probably not the best character flaw for an Int based class.

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>>47747725
So, how would one narrate that a sneak attack didn't deal damage against something immune to precision damage like an Elemental? I want my players to have a vivid picture when their class skill doesn't work and have to fall back on something else for once.

>>47751134
Describe it as you developing a better DMing attitude, you piece of shit.

>>47751166
no u

>>47751134
The elemental has no visible weak spot that he can exploit?

>>47751122

Just because you're book smart doesn't mean you're good at reading people. Or things.

>>47751134

Imagine like, stabbing your knife or rapier into running water, or a clay statue, or something like that. It goes in but it doesn't have any sort of resistance, no clicking into place where their murder skills, honed over years of practice, would tell them a vital organ should be and how it feels to rupture them.

Instead its just .. nothing. Like striking jello with a claymore.

Which bloodline is better for a fullplate Steelblood Bloodrager?

Arcane Bloodline give me auto Blur (or Displacement at later level) when I rage.

Destined bloodline give me a scaling luck bonus to AC and saving throw. Starting at +2 (via fated favor trait).

Bonus question: what happen when I use blue together with mirror image. Which miss chance happen first?

>>47751134
>your knife bites into the elemental, displacing some matter that quickly reforms. The beast does not seem phased from the blow.

>>47751241
You only ever use the larger miss chance. You'd use the miss chance from Mirror Image until the images are all gone because even with one image the miss chance is larger than Blur's. Only once all the images are gone will Blur's miss chance ever be rolled.

Playing my first PF campaign as a Wizard. I used Color Spray today and knocked two of our melee users unconscious for 7 rounds because they were in the cone.

I didn't argue, because I can see the logic behind it, but does that mean basically any spell that says "every creature" also targets your allies if they're in the radius? a la: Black Tentacles, Stinking Cloud, Hypnotic Pattern

>>47751314
Yes, everything in PF has friendly fire.

>>47751314

Yes. Every creature means every creature. If it was enemies only, it would specify enemies only.

>>47751264
I thought only miss chance from concealment don't stack?

>>47750307
Well, there are, sort of. There are AC modifiers for kneeling or sitting (see Table: Armor Class Modifiers in the Combat chapter); -2 AC vs. melee attacks and +2 AC vs. ranged attacks.

There aren't any rules for entering or leaving that stance, though, unlike being Prone.

>>47751241
I guess I will go with Arcane. Bonus to saving throw is nice, but auto Haste + Mirror Image when I enter rage win the action economy war.

>>47751264
Mirror Image isn't concealment, they stack just fine- though nothing's stopping an attacker from noting what square you're in, closing their eyes, and then just dealing with 50% miss chance- other than that their defenses will suck if someone readies an action to hit them while their eyes are closed during their turn.

>>47751321
>>47751325

Interesting. So at lower levels, wizards are all but useless in combat lest you run the risk of destroying your melee friends? Then, at higher levels I assume they should be able to shrug off most of my stuff. Or am I thinking about this the wrong way? I say this knowing now that casting through party members is less than ideal, but it's what I've been dealing with.

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>trying to play a Path of War character as an Orc
>ohgodithurtsithurts

>>47751479
Learn how to position yourself for cone or just cast sleep (10 feet burst is easy to position behind your melee)

>>47751479
Selective spell metamagic. Or actually use your brain like you are playing a war game.

>>47751092
It's not shittalking PF, it's shittalking 3pp stuff for PF and shitposting a ton, suddenly.

>>47751479
You kinda have the wrong idea. The Wizard job isn't to directly kill everything in the fray. What you should do is to control the battlefield.

Like Black Tentacle or Stinkng Cloud, you don't just cast them onto your melee. You either win initative and cast it before the melee move in or you use it to prevent more enemy from joining in the fight (ie cast black tentacle to make an uncrossable terrain so you melee fight only 1-2 enemy at a time, instead of all 5).

>>47751567
Fuckin' bollocks. PoW got a bunch of talk because it was based off of ToB, much like Spheres of Power got a bunch of talk for not being vancian casting. There are no fuckin' shills on this board, nobody would get paid enough to post on 4chin.

>>47751613
It's been proven that people do indeed get paid to shitpost on 4chan, as evidenced by /pol/, /int/, and /v/ and /vg/ a shitload of times.

>>47751613
No people shill, and get paid to shill on 4chan.

However, I doubt there are people shilling in this very thread. I do think Paizo people steal shit from

>>47751633
Yeah, go ahead and find me any proof, any at all, of people getting paid to shitpost/shill on /pfg/

>>47751567
I shit talk PF and 3PP. I hate all of it. I just shit talk 3PP mostly because it is what gets advocated around here. Luckily I've actually been able to convince people of a few of DSP's flaws.

>>47751643
An appreciated service. Hard to improve without negative feedback.

>>47751701
What you mean to say is "Wargabrbl how dare yo ucriticze us you gosh darn stormwind posters!"

>>47751701
I'd shit talk psionics more if I played with them more. I've done it a bit because I have a friend who loves psionics and knows their flaws better than me.

I've looked through DSP's other projects to, like I had a buddy who played a true namer. Dear christ that was a necessarily jankey class.

>>47751701
Ah, Gareth, my man.
What's DSP working on as of late? I was cut off lately due to finals.

>>47751241

Arcane is just ridiculously bullshit good comparatively speaking as bloodrager bloodlines go. Aberrant and Destined are both great, but Arcane's got a lot of free buffing and caster punishment and you want to punish the fuck out of casters.

Plus, people don't bitch about the Arcane Bloodrager doing his thing the way they will if you take Fate's Favored on Destined.

>>47747725
Uses her max ranks in craft: Alchemy. She's proud to announce she's only exploded twice.

>>47751735
Define 'as of late'.

>>47751733
Early psionics has...difficulties. And a small amount of the modern stuff suffers from the bossman having a random attack of 'we don't NEED playtesting, right?' which has been thoroughly beaten out of his soul.

>>47751749
...Two months?

>>47751749
I mostly shit talk PoW, talked a lot about why the Zealot does its job too well and why the mystic's recovery mechanic is bad for everything but in person play (and even then is clunky).

I've spoken out against skill to X maneuvers and about discipline glut (which I believe is a problem people still can't see, but one that is quickly taking a strangle hold on the system).

Don't get me wrong. I use PoW, I'm just not some kind of fanatic like /pfg/ seem to be. It's a flawed system, as flawed as most of the others.

So I'm putting together an oracle of life the is level 8 going into the 3rd book of mummy's mask. Anyone got aa good build?

>>47751804
> Hates discipline bloat
My brother.

>>47751756
The last two months have been an awful lot of getting stuff FINALLY FUCKING RELEASED MERCIFUL GODS THE NIGHTMARE NEVER ENDS but we've also been playtesting Lords of the Wild. I started the playtest for Lords of the Mists, only for it to get sidetracked by Secret Project, which I/we are also working on. Forrest started the playtest for Fool's Errand, Elric is doing the Medic, we teased a pair of races for Bloodforge's sequel, aaand we released April Augmented on a 'pay what you want' basis, including 'nothing'.

I probably missed stuff, I'm tired as fuck.

>>47751837
Buddy, do you want to be an overpowered piece of shit?

Of course you do.

Hungry Cursed Lunar Oracle with Fate's Favored. Be a Changeling with the Hulking Changeling alternate class feature. Pump strength up to a decent amount, grab the natural attack revelation.

Have you nice 4 nat attacks and an animal companion while enjoying being a full caster. Maybe grab power attack as your 1 real combat feat and MAYBE 1-2 teamwork feats for your cat. For the rest just focus on a school of magic, I suggest transmutation.

>>47751856
>My brother.
What I see is you guys have to keep releasing new content or you don't turn a profit. Because of your small team and limited community this means less play testing. This in turn means stuff has to get turned out that is relatively similar to old things to have any sort of balance.

However this means you're getting carbon copy maneuvers. While balanced within their own discipline this causes multiple copies of near identical maneuvers to exist. This screws up a lot of the balance for PoW classes as "recovery" is a main assumption you think you need before you can duplicate an effect.

As well with the tightening design space there are less interesting things to do with maneuvers. Really all you haven't covered is a pure battlefield control discipline.

>>47751908
Anon, I'm the guy fighting to release less disciplines and focus on doing literally anything else. You are literally preaching to the cardinal.

>>47751928
What would YOU like to work on personally?

>>47751976
Secret Project, Mists, and I lust to write PsiAug: Cryptic with a powerful will.

>>47751737
Heh, I can actually see that happen...

"OMG +1ac and +1 saving throw from a trait? OP! OP! OP! Your munchkin piece of shot!"

"Btw, auto displacement+mirror image is totally fine"

What were the examples of shitposting?

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>>47751991
YES!
Once Disrupt Pattern is weaponized, we'll put an end to the federation in no time!

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>>47751928

Seeing as your here, hi I was asking about writing a Str/Cha 'evil champion', probably uses Black Seraph, blah blah etc etc.

But actually, what I'd like to ask you about is what other disciplines would you take a ZweiSent Ordained Defender using Black Seraph, and angling toward becoming a Hellknight (with the PrC!)

>>47749576
Why would you trade out your axe in the first place?

>>47752179
> With the PrC

Um. The PrC that kills your maneuver progression?

>>47751443

I've seen this happen before a few times actually - but the ruling has always been you are flat footed until their next turn, not just on their turn (similar to averting gaze). This is also the recommended ruling for PFS IIRC --- there was a dev post on it.

>>47752232
Yeah. That's how I prefer to run it too (otherwise it's a no-cost maneuver)- I just try and comment based on standard rules unless people are already talking about house rules.

>>47752204

Yes. I'm talking with the DM about having it give continued progression, maybe in exchange for something else.

So, any suggestions?

>>47752179
>>47752296

Eternal Guardian has good synergy, and Fool's Errand is also good.

Part of the issue with asking for recommendations is that they are based upon more than just classes, PrCs, and the like. What sort of fighting style are you thinking of using? What's your role in the party? Are you going to be mounted?

How do I make a dark souls esque pyromancer? Some re fluffing of alchemist bombs?

The tl;dr on their lore is that all life with 'souls' (except for the dark soul) came from "fire" which has since died down into mere sparks in most. Pyromancers know the trick to nurturing these sparks into actual flames, but it takes time and its quite taxing to do; in combat this allows them to fling gouts of fire or fireballs, create explosions and even enhance themselves in limited ways. (It could run off either vancian casting or mp/power points). They are functionally wielding part of their very soul as a weapon, and in the dark souls games most pyromancers come from the great swamp.

They like others seek to try and rekindle the first flame, via throwing shittons of humanity at it; staving off universal entropy and other badness.

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>>47752318

Two-handers are a given as its a ZweiSent after all, i'm leaning toward greatsword or an earth shaker. The role is being a melee brute - defending also, yes, but putting out the hurt is part of that. And making the most of that hellknight armor i'm paying for.

I was angling toward the Order of the Gate or Order of the God Claw. Mounted.. might be an option but I'm uncertain given the nature of the module we're playing (Hell's Vengeance.) The only PoW stuff I know of that supports mounted things are a few archetypes, like the Omen Rider, so I didn't really bring it into consideration.

If story motivations help, he's an knight who's forsaken his order and become strictly on the Lawful Neutral axis in thinking. He eally hates dissidents, chaos and (surprise, its related to the module) violent rebellion - or rebellion at all - after riots resulted in friends and family being killed or disenfranchised, and his minor household tarnished by the senseless violence of the unwashed masses.

He's a little Machiavellian, I suppose, but not full on Judge Dredd about it yet.

>>47751749
>'we don't NEED playtesting, right?
You talking about the monster books? I never saw a playtest thread for those.

>>47752389
Question One

Including third party, or no?

>>47752296
Ask him to trade out the smite? Smite with PoW is silliness nobody wants.

>>47752435
Doesn't matter to me but I'd prefer to avoid spherecasting (personal dislike).

>>47752447

Yeah, that's my plan. Even if it was just staggered progression that'd be fine.

>>47749776
Dreamscarred used psitech and mecha to add the penetration value. It's a value for every firearm and most crossbows that you subtract to enemies' armor bonus. I also added that if you have some penetration points left after surpassing all the armor, you can add them to damage.

The spell Bloodsworn Retribution, whats the raw on using temp HP for the damage so I don't really lose anything out of it?

Spell description:

When you cast this spell, you cut yourself and swear an oath of retribution on your own blood. You decide how much damage you want to take from this attack, up to 25 points. This damage cannot be healed for as long as the spell is in effect. Anytime you perform an attack, save, or check that is directly related to the oath and brings you closer to the fulfillment of that oath, you gain a morale bonus to that roll equal to the number of hit points of damage you took from the oath divided by 5. The GM is the final arbiter over whether or not an action qualifies for this bonus. When you fulfill the oath (or choose to forsake it), the spell ends, and the lost hit points can be healed as normal.

>>47752425
Those have gone shockingly well for the lack of testing. I was thinking more of the early drafts of Bloodforge.

>>47752398
Honestly, dunno what to tell you. I don't know Hellknights and I don't care to know them. As far as ZeiSent goes, I'd probably roll with EG and maybe Moon to go with Seraph, or possibly Mirror rather than Moon if you want some unexpected surprises in your hippy bag of tricks.

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So I found out some funny things with a Large outsider I was building, based around protecting allies and making AoOs with its enhanced reach/threatened area.

Str 37 (+13, +19 two-hand)
Mythic PA (+12, +18 two-hand)
Enhancement (+5)
Divine Power (+5)
Total: 47

Large (innate)
Righteous Might (Huge size)
Huge Greatsword (4d6) -> Greater Vital Strike (16d6) -> Mythic Vital Strike (16*47 = 752)

AoO damage = 16d6+752

If it has a Legendary Item and the Foe-Biting property, this jumps up to uh..

32d6+1504 damage on an AoO. And it can make A Lot of AoOs.

>>47752582

***I forgot to add Seize the Opportunity to the list of feats.

>>47752510
Humbug.

Then... the Pyrokineticist psionic prestige class?

>>47752608
I'll take a look but I might end up going with supergenius(?) class package rules or w/e they are to get alchemist bombs and try to mix in something with some self buffing.

Is LBJ Jr shit actually any good?

>>47752398

Oh, fair, fair... it's a bit late for me, apologies for that.

He basically seems like he wants to impose order, so I still keep my Eternal Guardian recommendation.

For your third discipline:

Scarlet Throne is "be good at swording: the discipline" so you can go with that to put on the pain, and should your campaign reach level 15 be one scary motherfucker that people won't want to mess with.

Cursed Razor is good for the "I'm gonna hit you with weaponized malice" process that also synergizes with Eternal Guardian.

Primal Fury is basically "hit them hard until they drop", so you can go that...

Gareth's recommendations are good too.

>>47752582
Vital Strike doesn't work on AoO. It only works when you take the attack action. AoOs aren't attack actions, they're attacks of opportunity. That's why it doesn't work on any other abilities.

Unless you're privy to some rule clarification or errata I'm not ware of.

>>47752710

see >>47752597

>>47752710
the feat Seize the Opportunity lets you vital strike on AoOs.

>>47752597
Not familiar with that one - it's not in the SRD. Does it allow you to use vital strike as part of an attack of opportunity?

>>47752742
>>47752710

For further clarification the assumption was also Mythic being involved, as its a Mythic outsider to challenge players.

Instead I made someone who could one-shot Abyssal Lords and Dukes of Hell with every single attack, on their turn or not.

Therefore, i'm seriously reconsidering my application of Mythic feats and re-evaluating how Large+ sized weapons interact with Vital Strike....

>>47752766
>>47752742

I see. What book is it in? I have an unchained monk build to use it on.

>>47752766

Yeah, like >>47752742 said. Its actually from DSP and not that ridiculous until you start being stupid like me and putting it on Large creatures with Huge weapons and Mythic feats.

>>47751872
why the fate's favored? where does the luck come in?

>>47752582
Mythic Greater Vital Strike only multiplies by 4.
Never any more. Never 16.

>>47752582
Mythic Vital Strike would multiply by 4 here, not 16. Get your shit right, bro.

>>47751804
I wholly agree on the discipline bloat. A lot of the ones I'd toss out are the ones from PoW 1 as iron tortoise, golden lion and steel serpent always struck me as meh and primal fury and broken blade are bonkers in terms of damage (something most initiators don't need damage from maneuvers to help out on)

I like the ones that let me do semi-castery things like teleport or have line attacks or fly. I feel like those are the ones that help move initiators up tiers.

>>47752775
You mean like every player will plan to do?

>>47752798
spell? Divine Favor, Divine Power etc

>>47752798
Divine Favor would be my guess.

>>47752800
It multiplies the number dice the weapon does. A weapon that des 4d6 does 16d6 damage. Mythic vital strike multiples the damage by the number of dice you roll.

>Benefit: Whenever you use Vital Strike, Improved Vital Strike, or Greater Vital Strike, multiply the Strength bonus, magic bonus, and other bonuses that would normally be multiplied on a critical hit by the number of weapon damage dice you roll for that feat.

>>47752849
4d6 is one weapon damage die.
16d6 is four times 4d6, aka four weapon damage dies.

>>47752849
The entire thing is for bringing that vital strike not-quite up to par with the damage of 4 attacks.

>play around with antipaladin shit hurp der derp dur
>Play around with what my paladin would look like if they fell
>switch a few feats around for it all to make sense aaaa

>holy shit its amazing

>i want to play this

>tfw i want to fall

help

>>47752849
Paizo isn't THAT retarded, bruh.
You roll 4d6 four times.
That's your number of weapon damage dice.

>>47752814
>>47752800

Ah, my bad. That's more sane, but still insane.

4*47 = 188

Then 16d6 = 56 on average

Or, 244 total damage.

I think Mythic Improved Vital Strike brings that up to ... 56 + 47 = 412 damage? And of course Greater, as icing on the cake, makes it flat out ignore DR, energy resistance and hardness.

Then use Foe-Biting. I'm not sure where that would calculate though. After Vital Strike damage is totalled? Or would it be additive?

>>47752871
>I think Mythic Improved Vital Strike brings that up to ... 56 + 47 = 412 damage?
No, you don't multiply that a second time.
That applies only to shit like holy weapons.

>>47752879

Thank you for the clarification. So more reason to stack (Un)holy, Bane, Elemental, etc. and milk as much damage as possible. Or grab Mythic Greater Magic Weapon et al so you can tailor your enhancements to your chosen enemy.

>>47752871
>Then use Foe-Biting. I'm not sure where that would calculate though. After Vital Strike damage is totalled? Or would it be additive?
Foe-biting is multiplicative with everything and after everything is totalled.
But, as for damage, see this:
>>47752879

>>47752894
>Thank you for the clarification.
Np.
>So more reason to stack (Un)holy, Bane, Elemental, etc. and milk as much damage as possible.
Ultimately it works out to being equivalent to just attacking for times, except you ignore DR.

>>47752904
Four* times, I mean.

>>47752871
Even if this were right, what's the point? You made a mythic DM only monster to be as arbitrarily powerful as you wanted, as is your prerogative any time you want. I hope you aren't expecting your friends at the table to be impressed by your ability to write down big numbers.

>>47752916
I suspect he's making that character for the DOOM campaign (I'm another player).

>>47752916
Some DMs prefer their stuff to be legit.

>>47752904

Yeah, I think its the fact that it ignores DR and, being a single attack, you could just have a True Strike prepped and have better assurance of landing it. Your attack string might eventually miss once? I guess it depends on the defenses of what you are fighting.


>>47752916

This >>47752932 but it was also a thought exercise. And its making me aware of combos that I should absolutely avoid doing, both from the DM and player's side of the screen, and helps me look out for them as well if a player is being disingenuous.

Has this thread become DSP general?

>>47753012
It has always been DSP general.

>>47753012
If anyone has to discuss Paizo design decisions for long enough, they turn into the Paizo forums?

>>47753012
The way I see it, we could just be mad about the things paizo puts out or we could be happy about the things what dsp puts out. I would choose being happy over being mad.

>>47753089
But paizo have put out good shit before while DSP have put out turd rolls, but DSP don't get the same level of vitriolic hate leveled at them

>>47747725
>"HAHA! I KICKED A PIG! TAKE THAT, POWERS OF GOOD AND LIGHT!"

Who is this antipaladin and why is he always shown doing the most petty saturday-morning-cartoon evil antics?

>>47753112

He does it because its funny.

He's actually a Bard.

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>>47753112
>why is he always shown doing the most petty saturday-morning-cartoon evil antics?
Because why not?

>>47753101
it's not a matter of the past with these things as much as the present. dsp is pretty good with bringing various classes up tiers through archetypes, and paizo has been lackluster

but yeah that's true. If we kept on getting classes like magus and alchemist I wouldn't complain

>>47753101

They aren't as severe and more often than not have a breadth of options that are interesting. They are also aware of their problems, acknowledge them and have been trying to reverse or avoid going in those directions again with new material, at least as far as I can tell.

>>47753112
He loves his job.

>>47753112
Because drawing him while he slays angels and burns down towns would send an improper message.

>>47753149
ANTI-PALADIN OF PEACE

>>47753101
DSP generally at least responds to criticism even if they don't agree with it. Paizo pretends that there's nothing wrong with their products and generally either ignores or shuts down criticism.

>>47753160
that's partly because the dsp devs post here, meaning they're aware of our less hugbox-y and jaded critisisms of the system and products. I wonder what paizo would be like if they posted here and talked with us. maybe the world would be at peace

>>47753185
Not really, just take a look at the paizo forums. I was talking in general, not about /pfg/.

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Well, I got 99 problems /tg/ and they're all bitches
>Bard takes over some fey lands by accident
>Has to subdue a small clan of Forlarren that are living in it since they're challenging me for Mastery
>Slap their have a go Queen around like she burnt dinner and then smack the entire group of them down one by one to make an example before letting them live despite them being abomination
>They start getting all hot and bothered at the show of dominance and benevolence in turn
>Now have an clan of evil, half-feral, rape-fetishist would-be wang waxers foaming at the mouth to be my body guards when I know I can't fuckin' trust them
>At least one of them has some way of sneaking into any room I lock the door of
>One of them has the scent ability
>Have to sleep in a hermetically sealed chamber every night to avoid waking up covered in bitches
>Running out of god damn rooms in my new castle to hide in
Send help.

>>47753238
>literally magical realm

Give the paizo martial classes free marital feats as part of their level progression, hopefully that'll solve some of the discrepancy issues

Give them martial training per your whim

>+12 DEX
>1.5x DEX to damage
How do I make this more ridiculous?

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>>47753185
Basically as always the greatest way to develop as a creator is to go to the place where your product is disliked, rather than where it is loved.

>>47753185
>>47753256
Not so, given the abundance of shills here

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Praise to the God of Fisting!

>>47752865
I know this feel, anon
>play sacred fist warpriest of Shelyn (ex-irori, decided enlightenment was pointless if one denies themselves every form of self-expression or desire)
>wonder what would have happened if she went the exact opposite direction
>she turns on irori and decides she didn't really want enlightenment, she just wants to hurt people
>disciple of Zon-Kuthon, possibly even becomes hamatulatsu
the build would probably be a clusterfuck but it's a cool concept at least.

I've been looking over DPR threads on the Paizo forums and a lot of people there like to assume that an optimized CRB Falchion Fighter is the high mark of where damage should be, and that Paizo 'balanced' the bestiary around it (at least the first one anyway..)

Any idea what later classes average around on DPR? Or what the desired amount should be? I know a Magus, optimized pouncing Barbarian, et al probably blows that out of the water.

>>47753282
But the DPR of a full attacking Falchion Fighter is about where DPR should be in order to keep fights from becoming to quick.

A Fighter with all the bells and whistles is one of the most competitive full attacks in the game.

>>47753282
Don't archers do more than falchions due to that extra attack anyways?

>>47753422
Archers are more MAD and don't get to add 1.5x str to damage.

>Bad touch clerics most competitive way of dealing damage is through harm
>They barely have enough ways to realistically keep this going in a real adventuring day

So lets say a cleric was forced to go solo for a while, whats the best low level spells to keep the damage competitive aside from summoned monsters?

>>47753276
This is now the symbol of the god of lewd

>>47753450
Learn to conserve resources.
Know how in video games you end up saving your powerful weapons for the most powerful enemies?

Apply the same logic to using spells, learn to use disposables like potions, or buy a wand or two if you really rely on a single spell type.

dead game
dead thread

>>47753450
You also forget - clerics have the most powerful self-buffs in the entire game, and they are all low and mid-level spells. If he can cast heal, he can cast a ton of Divine Favor, Righteous Might, Magical Vestment, Greater Magic Weapon, and other "HURT YOU" self buffs.

How does this look?

Primalist Steelblood Bloodrager level 5

Arcane Bloodline

Equipment: +1 Greatsword, +1 Fullplate

Feats: Power Attack, Arcane Strike, Toughness, Blood Arcane Strike (if I'm going with human)

Rage Power: Lesser Celestial Totem, Reckless Abandon

I just wants to be an Arcane Knight in fullplate. My table only allows Paizo-content...

I tried to figure it out via http://paizo.com/store/blog but it seems to have everything but PF, and no fucking dates on post index. What were april, may and june books, and were they any good?

http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/bestiary2/wendigo.html#wendigo

Why isn't Golarion filled with these things?

>>47753450
Cast day-long buffs like magic vestment and greater magic weapon and hit it with your mace. When encounter something tough, buff yourself with round/level buffs and hit it with your mace.

>>47751872
So much as I appreciate this my char is fitting into the secondary healer extremely minor DMG dealer slot we have a rogue a fighter possibly an arcane and a fucking superstitious freight train of a silent barbarion(?)

>>47753124
Paladins aren't actually very popular in-world. Those jokes about them having sticks up their asses, YOU MUST HAVE HUGE EVIL, CLEAVE AND SMITE, all that other stuff, you think *players* came up with that?

Sure they act all thankful when you walk out of that room covered in enough blood to fill six cows and looking like you've just been through a fireball or ten. All people in the neighborhood REALLY know though is that Sam the Accountant will never do their taxes anymore.

But, still, nothing's richer than religions, and few things help like "defeating evil", but in order to actually be seen as defeating evil, you need less insidious evil, more direct, obvious, BLATANT evil.

But no one's dumb enough to be that blatant that survives more than a crime or two, let alone requires church intervention instead of just one or two city guards with clubs.

So... Well, you gotta make'em!

Thean Tagonist wakes up, kisses his wife goodbye, and heads straight to his marketing job.

Paladins are kinda stick-in-the-mud types most of the time though, so the left hand of the chuch doesn't tell the righ hand what its doing.

How do I play Cavalier at 4th level without getting face fucked after I charge?

>>47755993
Kill them on the first charge.
If they survive, you're doing it wrong.

I recall someone saying there was something, or several things, with resistance or immunity to force damage. Anyone know exactly what they were?

>>47754827
The best healer in Pathfinder is Damage dealer.

Healing is freaking suboptimal, since you can't out heal enemy damage.

It's better to just kill everything dead as fast as possible and patch up everyone after battle.

>>47755993
Don't build a one-trick charging pony. You can jump down and flank with your mount (you get free teamwork feat and ability to share them for a reason).

If you're a human, you should already have Power Attack. So drop your lance and pull out your Greatsword.

Is it worth it to go for Psionic Meditation + Sleeping Goddess Style?
Move-action maneuver recovery combined with some of the SG maneuvers seems like it'd lead to some powerful as heck spam-your-best-move-the-whole-fight stuff.

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>>47756079
>you can't out heal enemy damage
>It's better to just kill everything dead as fast as possible

>Silver Crane

Would you/should you use a DM screen? Does it actually add anything to the game? Do they have DM screens that can be clipped to the backside of a laptop?

>>47756953
>killing dudes while topping off health that in no way outpaces the damage you will take
Srsly, stop your faggotry.

I haven't been around for the last couple months. Have I missed anything important? New books, new dumb things Paizo has done, new cool things Paizo has done, etc?

>>47756975
DM screen is a necessity.
You absolutely should have one.
The value of being able to fudge a roll is so high it's difficult to even explain it. Not being able to fudge a roll can break a game.
For example, if my screen wasn't there in a campaign 2 years ago, there would've been 3 separate TPKs because I couldn't stop fucking critting my group for some reason.

Also, you can just roll some random shit behind it, look at someone, then scribble a penis in your notes and that guy will LOSE IT.
>We go inside the crypt seeking shelter and time to heal our wounds
>One second, guys...
>Roll roll roll
>Draw a cat in my notes
>Hey, Steve, what's Valeryn's Perception bonus?
>Uhhh, +10?
>Okay
>Roll roll
>Draw the cat a friend in my notes
>Everyone is visibly sweating because they're low on HP
>There's nothing in there

>>47753112
He's not officially an Iconic and doesn't officially have a name, but /pfg/ has named him Thean Tagonist.

>>47757012
Bruh I'm level 5 with 70 HP, DR2/- and concealment, spamming the 4d6 heal would allow me to fight an infinite amount of CR appropriate encounters

>>47757075
Paizo pushed a book full of wondrous item nerfs.
Literal nerfs.
Quick Runner's Shirt, for example, is a garbage worthless item now.
In fact, pretty much everything they "rebalanced" in the book is worthless garbage now.
But the prices are still the same of course.

>>47757122
Until you get hit with a crit, or are facing superior numbers, or are caught in a situation that is not optimal for you.
12 healing spaced out between 2+ rounds, or 19 over 2, is not going to save you from being whittled down unless you are playing PFS or have a weakshit dm who isn't accounting for PoW material.
Now face an enemy that is also an initiator, see how long that lasts.

>>47757174
Yeah, I was around for that. It was basically the last thing I was around for, I think, so if there's been nothing new since then I guess I haven't missed anything.

I'm glad my DM decided to ignore the nerfs, it would have been troublesome if he couldn't tell just how ridiculous they were.

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>>47748634
Eyyyy

>>47753185
>I wonder what paizo would be like if they posted here and talked with us.
Saltier than the Dead Sea. They can't deal with things that don't conform to their very rigid worldviews. It's ironic.

>>47757094
It's a game.

If your players can't deal to lose characters because the dice gods, and not because you made a stupid unbalanced encounter, they are bad players.

If you don't have the balls to kill your players, you are a bad GM. If you want them to have more survivability, give max HP, use Hero Points (so they can expand a resource to avoid a cheap death), but railroad their success make their wins empty.

>>47757249
>Random encounter I pulled out of my ass as they're travelling
>Enemies go first
>All 3 of them crit and confirm it
>This would've instantly killed 2 PCs
>Not allowing this to happen makes me a bad GM
Whatever you say my man

>>47748569
>Tfw there's a barbarian nerd in our party who reflavored his backup ranged weapon as the ability to shoot lightning bolts without asking the GM first
>The GM found out eventually but said GM is new and inexperienced and it's already part of the barbarian's character so we end up just leaving it as is

>>47757280
So, stop playing Pathfinder if you think that is stupid.

>>47757303
Whatever you say
my man

>>47757249
>>47757280
We already had this thread yesterday.

>>47757249
>If there's an aspect of the game you and your group don't like, and you decide to override it with your judgment instead of taking it as given, you're a bad GM

Okay

>>47757307
>I don't have an argument because I'm a retarded

Whatever you say my man

>>47756938
Guyyyyyys?
Li'l help?

Has the new hellknight book been leaked yet?

>>47757321
>Being killed in an uneventful, completely random and non-interactive way by some wild animals is completely acceptable
Whatever you say my man

>>47757342
If you don't like that, guess what? YOU SHOULDN'T BE ROLLING DICE FOR IT IN THE FIRST PLACE.

>>47757303
>Pathfinder is all about losing your character in turn 1 of combat because a die roll says so and you can't do anything about it
Wowie, that sounds like a ton of fun!!

>>47756938
>>47757322

It's fantastic. Especially for mystics, or other classes with full-round recovery.
Using your move action and standard to repeatedly spam your best move is hardly different from full attacking though, which kind of defeats half the point of PoW.

Main drawback is the other two feats in the Sleeping Goddess Style line are really mediocre, but depending on your build, the style feat alone can make up for it.

>>47757322
Depends. What class are you going with? Zealot, for instance, probably has better uses for its move action, but Warsoul (especially paired up with PsyArm) seems like it would be a pretty fun way to become a stationary artillery during battles.

>>47757354
>Just have the enemies hit or miss on a whim instead of rolling! This makes you a good GM. Way to go!
>Fudging dice to prevent half the party dying on turn one, however, makes you a bad GM. Shame on you!

>>47749458
Who's your character's god?

>>47757368
Are you denying that 3.PF isn't rocket tag? Do you really play this game?

>>47757387
>>47757382
My plan is to shamelessly spam the best maneuver I have as a Warder. When I'm not using the nope-zone, that is.
I've got a free action way to get rid of psionic focus so that I can use that move action recovery. Or, if I use an SG maneuver, I can use the (usually) quite powerful "expand your focus" effects as much as I want.

>>47757303
>>47757354
>"Hey guys there's this stupid thing paizo did in the system that I don't like so I'm homeruling it out"
>Fuck yeah anon, fight paizo's retarded rules with us.

>"Hey guys there's this thing in PF I don't like so I'm homeruling it out but you also like it"
>Fuck off anon, play the game how it's meant to be played or get out

>>47757436
>That strawman

Whatever you say my man

>>47757443
>Strawman
>Implying

Whatever you say my man

>>47757389
If combat has absolutely no risk involved, you're wasting everyone's time running it and should just handwave the situation. "You kill some goblins. Moving on."

>>47757431
>I've got a free action way to get rid of psionic focus
You don't need that, you can do it anyway.

The Sleeping Goddess uses are legit, but if you're using your move+standard to spam a strike, is that really better than full attacking?
Both in terms of interest, and also in terms of damage - there aren't many standard action strikes that can outpace a full BAB class full attack.

>>47757462
>Preventing 2 out of 4 players being instantaneously killed on turn 1 before they've gotten to act is the same as removing all risk from combat
Anon...

>>47757462
Stop trying to argue with autists, anon. It's useless.

>>47756079
>Healing is freaking suboptimal, since you can't out heal enemy damage.

If you could outheal enemy damage, you would multiply your party's damage output by infinity.
If you heal just half the enemy damage, you double your party's damage by doubling how long they last.
How is this suboptimal? Because you don't get to hit things?

>>47757475
>is that really better than full attacking?
I just hit level 5, sooooooo...

I can see what you mean, but I'm more interested in spamming a maneuver for it's added effects, not just for it's damage.
The SG "become a fighter for 3 turns rofl" maneuver would be hilarious to spam every turn, for example.
Or the SC 4d6 heal one.
Hell, I could use the recovery on a counter/boost and also attack normally on the same turn.
Seems pretty nice to me.
But is it worth 2 feats?
I got a lot of other shit I could be taking - my GM allowed a bunch of 3rd party feats.
I could get Anchor and Asura Technique for the ultimate Nope-Zone experience, for example.

>>47757443
Seriously.
I'd understand if the complaint was that they hated the entire battle system, or half the classes, or the reliance on magic to get anything cool - those are fundamental to PF and you can't get rid of them without changing the game.

But just, having a small amount of death ward plot armor so they're not punished for awful luck? That's trivial.
If you think the threat of random pointless death is a defining, irreplaceable part of the D&D experience, then maybe you're the one in the wrong game.

>>47757492
Because the best way to heal is to take the enemy out of the fight before it can kill you.

Healing your party in no way improves their combat ability. HP remaining has no penalties until you fall below 0 and in level appropriate encounters that's not a common thing. Healing should always be a tertiary role of anyone in the party to the point where a wand of CLW or Infernal Healing is plenty.

>>47757492
Generally, most people's games are not houseruled to fix the combat, and fights end up being 4 turns long at most because all the characters just uncork their strongest shit instantly and disintegrate the enemy. The GM has to keep up, so his guys do the same to the PCs. That's why most people will tell you healing is worthless - because in their games, each enemy can 2shot a PC, and each PC can kill half the enemies in one turn on his own. In such games, you're better off making the enemies disappear faster, because there is no way you can output enough healing to keep someone alive, and the fight doesn't last long enough for healing to matter even if you could.

>>47757462
>Threat of death is the only risk
This is the strawman if I ever saw one.

If all the players are knocked unconscious, that's a big blow - it's a hit to their pride, and they might have failed their mission beyond salvage as the village they were defending gets razed or the enemies escape while they're out cold. The story changes from there due to their loss.

And yes, I'm not the original fudge anon and I just realized I don't support fudging to make sure the PCs always win, I just support using fiat to stop them from permanently dying.

>>47757537
>But just, having a small amount of death ward plot armor so they're not punished for awful luck? That's trivial.
Don't want PCs dying to random enemies? There are already ways to do that, like hero points. Fudging dice rolls is pretty much the worst possible solution.

>>47757612
I'm the original fudge anon.
I just came back from taking a huge shit and I see that I managed to hit the thread with it somehow.
I don't know how y'all managed to misconstrue "i prevented my players from being massacred by the dice gods" as "i make sure my players always succeed at everything no matter what."

>>47757630
>PCs run out of hero points
>RNGesus decides they've lived long enough and has an encounter crit the everloving fuck out of them
>Half of 'em die while the other half run away
Heroic adventure!!

>>47757651
Hyperbole is 4chans primary means of communication.

>>47757684
I forget /pfg/ is on 4chan quite often, actually.
The thread quality is really high normally.
Must be Australians or somethin'.

>>47757651
It's okay, I didn't mean to say you were doing that either, so you're misconstruing just as hard.

>>47757702
Sure, maybe you didn't, but I can't tell which posts are you, now can I?

>>47757651
>>47757651
Because trolls and idiots, anon.
Most GMs I know have fudged numbers because being GM also means controlling the pacing and flow of the game, and random deaths generally wreck pacing, unless it is a surprising moment that is singular.
I once had a player die of bleed out after a sniper's ambush shot, short combat that saw a retreat, and the players were hit hard by this death that was unseen, unheard, and totally caught them by surprise.
THAT is good gm'ing, knowing how and when to suckerpunch the players expectations.

>>47757718
This.
>>47757702 is being a snarky cunt who is entirely wrong.

>>47757630
What makes fudging dice the worst solution to that problem? The players don't even need to know it happens- the players SHOULDN'T even know it happens.

>>47757733
You'd think the obvious guess for who I claimed I was was >>47757612 as the post he was replying to.

I believe the other anon misconstrued it to mean you fudged to let them win but I never said that fudge anon did, that should be clear enough

>>47757793
>The players don't even need to know it happens- the players SHOULDN'T even know it happens.

That's precisely the problem. They SHOULDN'T know, but unless your players are total idiots, sooner or later they'll figure it out.

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What's the druid/bloodrager/whatever ability/feat that allows them to selectively shape an animal's features into their normal body?

The only one I found was aspect of the beast, but I know there's another, maybe more flexible.

>>47757849
You shouldn't be doing it every session. Hell, if you're doing it more than once or twice in the entire campaign there's clearly a problem.

>>47757723
I personally think that anyone who willingly lets combat claim the lives of his PCs in uneventful ways (such as the proud Cavalier being killed rather than knocked out when he refuses to run from a fight) is a bad GM. If we completely ignore the "it's a story that you're all telling together, why bother having this part?" aspect, think of it from the logistics side. You all waited a week, maybe more, for this game. Finally, everyone gathers up, and the game begins. Then a player dies. Whoa, hold up! The game now needs to be paused to figure out what they'll do with the corpse of their comrade. If proper RP happens at the table, it's entirely likely that at least one of the partymembers will need a few days to just mourn and not adventure. God help you if the party decides they're giving him a funeral sometime soon, because the pacing is going out the window now. And then the guy who's character died has to sit there for the rest of the session, sad and bored, as his party fumbles around awkwardly, figuring out how to transport his corpse. This guy waited a week for this. He probably bailed out on people for this. Now he has to come up with a new character, too - and that character will have to be awkwardly shoehorned into the party at a difficult time with no setup, even further messing up the dynamic and the pacing.

And yeah, having a PC die in a cool, memorable way is completely fine, especially if you're smart and time it so that it marks the end of the session.
Having your Paladin die because the skeletons in a random, unimportant crypt decided to only attack him and they crit a bunch? Ugh.
Having your Paladin die because he refused to run from the skeleton horde, choosing to hold back the undead so that as many villagers as possible could escape? Fuck yeah!

Just my two cents.

>>47757928
I have no problem with pc deaths, but I am also used to far crueler games where the lethality is high unless the players are either smart or ballsy.
That said, I don't go full ham save when it's time.

>>47757928
I couldn't disagree more. Yeah, it sucks when your character dies and you have to roll a new one. What sucks much more is knowing that that'll never, ever, EVER happen and you could go into combat naked and armed with a sharp stick and there would still be no risk involved unless the GM decides that it's "appropriate" for you to die.

>>47753422

They do, and from range, yes. Also more likely to get their full attack in because melee full attacking becomes Difficult when variables you can't account for, such as difficult terrain, cover, walls, or magic (Black Tentacles, Grease, etc.) come into play. The enemy could also be skirmishers. I know Pathfinder players like to imagine we all stand in a big circle and wail on each other's dicks with full attacks + Haste, but in my experience canny DMs like to throw these out along with Spring Attacking assholes who don't need to full attack to put out a modest amount of damage on you, usually Precision attackers or Vital Strike.

>>47758043
>naked and armed with a stick
Considering PoW, that would still be a reasonable chance of surviving.

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For a spearfighter, for not getting fucked when shit gets upclose, is it better to get feat that allows me to poke point-blank or invest into spare short weapon?

>>47758043
Seriously, anon, stop with the ridiculous hyperbole.
No one has said anything like that, and you are basically baiting at this point.

>>47758043
I can see what you mean, and I myself have felt that "I didn't come here to play fucking candyland" feeling.
However, it's a lot better to have the enemies be deadly without actually killing you.
Being defeated and being killed are completely different.
Dying to a pack of goblins isn't memorable.
Being defeated by a pack of goblins and then waking up in their den and having to sneak about, retrieving your gear and escaping or fighting your way out, is far better. Like, far, far better.
Yeah, it's not applicable to, like, a dire bear or something, but there are very few enemies that would literally only kill you instead of doing something else to you.

>>47758113
3pp or not?

>>47756079

Actually, a good Paladin build can do it, and once you start hitting benchmarks like Heal its almost on par for CR enemies of your level or thereabouts.

No, the problem with healing is all of the 'healing' spells that deal with the games real killers (negative levels, status effects, etc.) don't have anything to do with hit point damage..

>>47757849
This goes back to what >>47757094 was saying, get a DM's screen (or roll behind your laptop, or whatever) and your players won't be able to see the roll when you fudge it. Unless you can't keep a straight face or you make it a predictable habit, the players should never realize. Something like "Hey Ted, have you noticed that the last five times our PCs were almost killed, the enemy rolled a nat one on the next attack?" should never come up. If your players ever actually have real reason to suspect you were fudging dice, you did it wrong.

>>47758113
Invest in the feat that lets you hit point blank; that way you don't have to pay for an additional number of enchantments and feats for the shorter weapon

>>47758123
Then what the fuck do you mean by
>I personally think that anyone who willingly lets combat claim the lives of his PCs in uneventful ways (such as the proud Cavalier being killed rather than knocked out when he refuses to run from a fight) is a bad GM.

Because that's precisely what it means: PCs only die when the GM decides it's appropriate, and otherwise there's no risk of dying whatsoever.

>>47758161
what is it with /pfg/ and only seeing death as the sole outcome of a lost fight

>>47758137
I'd be grateful for both 1pp-only and PoW included options.

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>Have two feat slots open
>Can't decide which direction to take my character in
UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGH

>>47758161
That does not mean the risk of dying is not present.
What it does mean is that anon realizes that outside of animals, most creatures neither fight to the death or to kill out of hand, nor should "death" be the only outcome of a lost battle.
>>47758172 gets it, why don't you?

>>47758172

idk, my group had no issues with scouting, retreating, and at later levels, Scrying, moving about invisible with a silence field, etc.

If anything our DM got mad we kept getting surprise rounds on his fights until he stepped up his game with counters. And even then we weren't afraid to Plane Shift or whatever out if the situation looked like it could go bad.

Any interesting new books come out in the last two months?

Jesus fucking christ why are you niggers STILL being autistic over lethality and why haven't you had the decency to end your miserable lives instead of bothering actual people?

>>47758172
What is it with /pfg/ and playing characters that mercilessly slaughter all encounters?
Fuck, I'm in a group with a Paladin and we got ambushed by bandits and he just started cutting them up, no hesitation.

It's like, dude, if you've got a gun and some junkie tries to threaten you with a knife, you don't fucking shoot him in the head, do you?

Why are PCs uncivilized murderers?

>>47758153

Which feat is that?

>>47758161
But why are you having combats where dying wouldn't be cool? seems like the problem is encounters that are filler and are there to spend time on, not progress story.