>A god of fire is the strongest and oldest God. Would you

No, not really.

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Wouldn't a God of Air have to precede them? And either a God of Wood, or Gods of Earth and Water?

I can understand a Sun God being first, or a Light God, and if those domains are within the Fire Gods portfolio, then sure, but a by-the-book Fire God doesn't sound like it would be first because there's nothing for it to burn.

Nope. It's cool.

>>46776843
Nothing wrong with it, everything just depends on your ability to bullshit the reason for him being the first one.

>>46776843
But what about the God of Matches or possibly the Gods of Flint, Steel and Tinder?

>>46776843
Depends on if the gods/elements in that setting are intertwined or are distinct separate entities.

The god of earth/rock would be the best for being the first, as everything begins with the introduction of matter.

Look YHWH that flaming bush act is cute but we all know you merc'd the rest of the Canaanite pantheon that preceeded you

>>46776843
>oldest God
>not the God in Heaven

Shiggy diggy, ye damned pagan

>>46776843
What kind of gods are we taking about? If we were only talking about the elements, four cardinals or otherwise, then I suppose it would be subjective. If we were talking about more abstract concepts, such as time, I'd say that they would be more powerful.

>>46776843
Yes, because with fire came disparity.

>>46776843
Yes. It shouldn't be the god of "fire". But rather the god of heat, i.e. the energy we call heat. Because this is the reason we are still living in an explosion. This is the true god, and you should all worship it by going on cruise trips to warm countries and sipping pina coladas
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5_EIikdFr8
This is the song of God.

>>46776843
No, that makes perfect sense. That's how it happened in our world. First came fire, the blazing quark-gluon plasma birthed from the Big Bang. It's only as it cooled that other forms of matter came into being.

>>46776843
He can be if he's the creator god of the world. Like the Bing Bang but with a spark of life.

>>46777050
>>46777130
>>46777150
>>46777278

>implying every cosmology has to follow the rules defined by our world's conceptions of classical elements or our world's science
LORT

to answer your question op, i would say that wouldnt be strange. fire is a strange thing to see, unlike many things out there in the world, so it makes sense for people to worship fire before they might worship something else. if the god actually IS the oldest and most powerful, well then that would also make sense as to why it is the oldest and most powerful.

>>46777171
This guy knows what's up.

>>46777967
>implying fantasy isn't based in reality

>>46778013
>implying a isnt based in -a
hmmm
i get what you mean my friend but it doesnt have to be that way

>>46778119
I don't understand what you meant to show by condensing the words to symbols and then having one be the negation of the other, but I am glad you understand what I meant.

>>46777773
so the god of fire is actually something akin to the god of energy but because civilization hasn't advanced far enough to actually fully understand his pantheon he decides to essentially appear in a form they are comfortable with?

>>46778177
>fire
>form I am comfortable with
Fire is scary as shit. I would much rather have a god appear as a cute and harmless kitten, probably with a little bell around it's neck, that contains the universe or some godlike magical shit.

>>46778226
fire is a form humanity is comfortable with, quark-gluon plasma not so much

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>>46776843
Depends, why?

>>46778226
>a cute and harmless kitten, probably with a little bell around it's neck, that contains the universe or some godlike magical shit
Galaxy, Orion's belt etc. etc.

>>46778251
speak for yourself. I don't play well with fire.

>>46778357
yes I watch bad movies, what's your point?

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>>46778388
>MiB
>bad

>>46776843
Personally, I'd go with a multifaceted, multiple personality, kinda insane fire god.
One moment you're talking to the Mother of Fire, a warm mother figure that loves her mortal children and wants only the best for them in her own way, the next you're talking to the Eater of Forests, the one who destroys everything so that life may start again from the ashes, then it's the Flame of the Heart, god of passion and lust, and so on.

>>46776843
In the beginning there was a being of fire..and from itself it granted power to the first 4 people it saw.

Some dead guy
A bullshit boss of chaos
Sunbro founder
And
Illidan the betrayer. I mean, blind traitor dragon with freaky squid legs and..stuff.

Oh and some pygmy guy has one too. Just smaller and stuff.

The players are trying to steal the flames and save the world.

>>46778470
Whoops, wrong thread, my bad

>>46778470
>>46777266
Then there was an OCdonutsteel blind crystal dragon, right?

>>46776843
Though to be fair the universe was created after the big bang which was a huge release of heat. So in some way it could be the oldest if not the second.

To be fair, if you're the God of Fire you get to marry the Lord of Sunlight's daughter, who's a Goddess of Fertility with huge tits and amazing hips.

>>46779080
Then as soon as you touch her, she transforms into her weird transvestite brother, and its lovers start to hunt you dowm.
Rocky Horror Londo Show, basically.

>>46778172
fantasy is the opposite of reality, anon

>This world, which is the same for all, no one of gods or men has made; but it was ever, is now and ever shall be an ever-living fire, with measures kindling and measures going out.

Fire should not even be a god, but something even greater akin to Lord Ao or Iluvitar.

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>>46777278
>Because this is the reason we are still living in an explosion. This is the true god, and you should all worship it by going on cruise trips to warm countries and sipping pina coladas
>worshiping the God of the Continual Explosion by going to the beach
Really? That's the best you can do?

>>46776843
Makes sense to me. The big bang was not exactly a combustion reaction, but I imagine it was pretty bright and hot, which in a fantasy world can be synonymous with fire.

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>>46778543

OCELOTTE

>>46776843
No, I don't find Agni or an anthropomorphic personification of Bhuddist Metaphysics to be strange

>>46778470
Blind mutant traitor dragon didn't get its own lord soul. Sun king gave him a fragment of his

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>>46776843
HALLOWED ARE THE ORI

>>46782670
Agni is Hindu though

>>46782758
I said "or", implying the two are seperate entities from one another, implying Agni is not Bhuddist.

>>46776843
Cold is the default state fire warmth light is a deviation from that cold dark so i might find it odd that fire came before its opposite but with a decent hook it could totally work.

> God of Fire gives and consumes life indiscriminately
> Any form of flame is a manifestation of the fire God; rendering It omnipresent
> It is the smallest spark of flint and the largest forest fire
> Tools for creating fire are a means of communing with the fire God, the theology encourages meditation and silent prayer around an open flame
> Those of higher faith can produce a flame without tools, reflecting one's close relationship with the fire God
> Rank of station in a theological establishment is irrelevant, only a cultivation of faith and inner strength will bring one closer to the fire God
>The pantheon consists of once-mortal patron saints who used their faith and devotion to fire to better humanity
> such as the selfless cleric who wandered through the frozen wastes to bring warmth to a forsaken hearth
> or a brave warrior who led a crusade against a faction with no respect for the living or nature
>The devil represents cold and darkness, and has its own devout, if not nihilistic, following

>>46776843
Why not? From the fire came substance, and from substance the universe. And to the fire it shall in due time return to start anew.

And yes, I know pulsating universe was 'disproven'. I still like the concept and will use it.

>>46776843
No, for the night is dark and full of terrors.

>>46778388
Excuse me sir, I need to give you an eye exam.

>ITT: filthy Rh'llor Priests

The night is dark and full of my huge dick, red robes. Go back to Ass-hai and stay there!

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>>46789953

>>46777050
If we go with one of those human centric pantheons (always seemed a bit arrogant to me, but whatever) where our belief creates gods, than it'd make sense for the first men to worship fire as safety, warmth and light.

Of course that would likely make the fire god a god of peace.

>>46776843
No.
Fire is the weakest and the least versatile element. it's shit, and ithas no place in good pantheon.

God of fire should be a jealous, evil weakling. None of the other interpretations make sense. They are dumb.

>>46776843
fire needs something to burn, it cant exist by itself. create the god of wood first then kill him with the creation of the god of fire

>>46776843
The Primordial Fire that spawned the Cosmos? Not at all. A number of cosmogonies use fire as a metaphor for the first spark that differentiated Existence from Nonexistence.
These kinds of primordial entities don't usually tend to stick around and be worshipped, however. Often enough they end up imprisoned by the younger Gods or are simply too remote and alien to care.

>>46785901
I'm sure that's based on something, but I like your style anyway.
>>46790982
No way, dude. Fire consumes. It's not what it DOES; it's what it IS.
>>46791105
Stop thinking RPG's ans start thinking Faith and Metaphysics, dum-dum.
>>46778446
I'll steal this.

>>46782592
REVOLVER

>>46791105
>not using the fire in men's hearts
And that's why you're a shit Fire God.

>>46776843

It depends on how your mythology works.

If the gods predate the world, then you need a reason for fire to be older unless you are doing the Dark Souls thing where Fire has a major thematic role.

But if man created the gods through belief and worship, then the god of fire being one of the first gods and the strongest is actually pretty legit. Fire is incredibly important to early civilizations, obviously powerful, and dangerous. The perfect seed for a divine entity.

There may have been other gods before fire, but many of those probably have not survived into the modern age, whereas fire never goes out of style.

>>46791635
>>46791761
You are dumb.
Fire SHOULD be weak and evil. Nothing else makes sense.

>>46792131
When it burns down your stupid home, it'll be good and strong.

>>46792131
Cold person detected.

>>46777065
Fire, cool?
Heresy!

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>>46792131

>>46776843
>Would you find that strange?
No.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agni

>>46777050
No, because they're primordial forces intrinsic to a setting's reality and not chemical reactions.

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>>46791190
That kind of assumes that trees and other plants don't rely on regular wildfires to renew their environment. Fuck, some species even NEED fire to reproduce. Some produce particularly flammable sap to help guarantee this happens with regularity.

If anything the god of wood and the goddess of fire are doing some really kinky sex shit.

>>46792688
>goddess of growth and nature is actually the same being as the god of fire
>she goes all jekyl and hyde with fire, then he goes all phoenix from the ashes afterward
I like where this pantheon is going

>>46776843
>Fire: safety, warmth, light, renewal, cleansing, passion, lust, courage, battle
>Earth: fertility, strength, protection, stability, endurance, sustenance, agriculture
>Water: sustenance, cleansing, travel, trade, life, healing, agriculture
>Air: ???

What practical things would primitive element-worshippers (we're assuming very early agriculture, not even cities yet) even see in Air?

>>46793170
you fucking breathe it
If you're going to stick something as amorphous as "life" on water I don't think it's unreasonable to put that on air as well. At least a few ancients thought of the spirit as a kind of gaseous something, as well, so spirituality or intellectualism can come from that, as well as emotions depending on how you want these guys' primitive psychology to work. Add birds, wind, and freedom, you have motifs of intellect. Weather is usually associated with air, not just water, so you could give it cleansing as well as change.

>>46793170
You're assuming air would be recognized as an element in itself.

If anything it would be regarded (or perhaps even revered) as the medium through which the other elements must flow and interact.
Maybe considered as what binds them to the waking world.

Air that brings a cool breeze on a hot day, or fair winds to sail by. Or to stoke the fire.

>>46793328
>spoiler

But did they know that? The rest are great points!

>>46776843
A little. Fire should be younger than Earth and Water, but a frightening in his hunger. His pact with humanity has vaulted Fire to the highest echelons in the pantheon, many fear (including some members of humanity as well) that his insatiable hunger will see him consume the whole world over.

Therefore as humans we must kindle our inner spark into a beautiful torch without letting our passions consume us in a blazing inferno.

>>46793348
>But did they know that?
Yes.
I mean, seriously, yes it definitely would. If you stop breathing, you notice that you feel worse in less than a few seconds. I mean, assuming you're a human and not just a robot. Even if they didn't, somebody is bound to choke on a bone at some point.
>>46793347
>or fair winds to sail by
I thought of this bit, but if they're only "early agriculture" would they already have boats?

>>46776843

So, a sun god?

Makes sense.

>>46792688
>If anything the god of wood and the goddess of fire are doing some really kinky sex shit.
Reminds me of something I did where instead of a god of plants and a god of fire, there were the twin goddess of destruction and regeneration locked in constant embrace with one another. One's flames constantly licked at and consumed the the other's branches while her roots and vines sought embrace and overwhelm her sister. For no life grows as strong and as true as that which thrives in the midst of destruction.

Druids who took on their aspect (there were four major aspects and associated primordial gods, one for each wind) not only had your typical druid tree powers, but could also fling pyromancies at people.

>>46777050
Gods relating to Fire and tool use make more sense, since understanding of them (as opposed to opportunistic use) are generally considered to be the main crucial divergence between a smart ape and a sapient hominid.

>>46776843
>God of fire, the sun, and the forge
Because matter is forged inside the "flames" of stars


I'd say it's doable.

>>46776843
No. In fact, that's the case in my setting.

>>46776843
Primative civilization probably wouldn't understand the difference between nuclear fusion and fire. The sun being important is a common theme in every old religion. The sun being in the sky is something that is very real and everyone you know, and their parents, can remember the sun being there. The absence of light will always bring apprehension and creeping dread. Because the sun is so important we will always want to imagine it as fatherly and caring, something to be trusted. It's always going to be there for us and will never fade, and will always come back every morning. The alternative is just too horrifying. Because of how horrifying it is to lose we will always imagine a sword in its hand, the sun can protect itself and it will never be held hostage for long.

Being the oldest depends on culture, but being the strongest is a common theme. Fire and the Sun are almost always going to be related.

>>46777050
Well, the world could have existed before the god.

>>46793397
>but if they're only "early agriculture" would they already have boats?
A gift from the airy trickster deity?

>>46776843
That depends. Is the fire of their domain limited to literal, tangible fire, or is there more to it? Is it representative of energy, or the first chaotic force harnessed by mortals, or something? Like Prometheus's gift to humans?
If it's something like that, I'd understand, but if it's just literal expenditure of energy to produce heat and light, without any of the things that could be associated with that, I'd wonder why no gods of things like time or death emerged before this fire deity.

>>46794395
To clarify, what I mean by this is, the god could preside over the sparking and inevitable fading of the fire and all other things as well, the fire merely being a microcosm of all other things in the universe, making this fire god a god of things like creation and entropy as well, ala the First Flame in Dark Souls.

>>46776843
Based on what? Like, "Big Bang came first, therefore most powerful god is fire god?"

I suppose I could get behind that.

Honestly, now I want to add a father-figure fire god to one of my settings. He's really calm and reserved, practices taoist-ish peaceful meditation because he knows that if he lets his power out for even a second he makes Genos look like a gnat with a bic lighter.

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>>46776843
>god of water disagrees

The goddess of fire used to exist everywhere as a 3d blanket of fire, she bore 7 children who were the brightest fires in the sea of fire and 1 abomination who created a pitch black icy hole wherever he went in the fire. The abomonation wasn't malicious but the children were filled with rage and despair as the abomination ate their mothers fire.

>>46776843
No, as it ties directly into the concept of 'the energy within everything'.
In my setting, the primal god of fire is the father of four gods- the god of ingenuity, forging and crafting (his oldest and most powerful child), the god of war, athletics, and natural predators, the god of solar light, warmth, and healing, and the goddess of wind, romance, and mischief.

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>>46778388
>insulting MiB

>>46776843
What if the Fire God paved the way for the Air, Earth, and Water gods?

>Hey let's burn some shit
>Oh I need some shit to burn, let's make earth and air
>Oh shit water what the hell are you doing here?