Warcraft Lore and RPG Discussion

>>46457807
I still love how the Tol'vir had to pull a Belka to stop him.

Post your reaction to
>DKs just walk into fucking light's hope again, win and steal tirion
vs
>DKs get called in to help vs the burning legion at Light's hope, they rise Tirion (Whom no longer can use ashbringer) in a desperate last charge

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Nth for warlocks getting the Eredar Twins from Sunwell Plateau as minions in their class "hall."

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>>46457807

>>46457971
>tfw you can't pull Gorehowl out of the ground if you go back to the site of their duel

>>46457991
I know, right?

BREAKING NEWS:

ILLIDAN IS KERRIGAN CONFIRMED

>>46458021

http://imgur.com/a/Rfbq1

>>46457991
>Gorehowl
If Gorehowl also drops from Karazhan and Siege of Orgrimmar, which one is the real one?

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>>46457894
The second one seems better, but less in tune with the TEAM EBON BLADE: SCOURGE POLICE thing.

>>46458021
>>46458075
that's hilarious.

>>46457971
That's not Kossak,

>>46458080
The one in Karazhan is some sorta time-warped duplicate.

In SoO gorehowl is actually abandoned in the room you fight the Sha of Pride, Garrosh is wielding and drops an image of Gorehowl, not the real thing.

>>46458080
the Gorehowl in Karazhan is from that demon going to AU Nagrand after we leave and taking it
Xal'atoh isn't actually Gorehowl

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>>46458134
>That's not Kossak,

Seconded.

>>46458021
>>46458021

>http://imgur.com/a/Rfbq1
I fucking knew it.

I fucking knew it all along.
>>46457971

>>46458134
>>46458141
>Karazhan Gorehowl is an alternate universe
>An alternate universe different from WoD's
>Countless universes filled with duplicate artifacts
That explains every PC in Legion having an artifact weapon, I suppose.

>>46458176
It explains where they come from, but not how all those duplicates end up on Azeroth Prime. Is someone pulling them out of the nether and distributing them, or what?

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>>46458222
>tfw the next expansion will be all the previous owners of said artifacts coming through portals to reclaim their property

>>46458222
No, no.
You're NOT from azeroth prime.

Why you think 90% of the game is instantiated?

>>46457926
That would've been hot, but Eredar aren't really demons.

>>46458089
Because 1:Daelin is her father and Jaina's monarch right comes from this line
2: Daelin was right all along, Jaina was just deceived by Thrall.

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>>46458075
> Illidan is gonna be the leader of the armies of the Light

>>46458324
Actually Thrall was earnest, the problem is he's pretty unique among orcs.

>>46458326
>dieses bild

WHAT IS THIS?!

>>46458392
ALso he's kinda of an idiot
>Lol k garrosh ur dah leader
>Garrosh: "I don't think I can"
>Everyone: "He fucking can't."
>Thrall:" Muh hellcream muh gromhusbando u can"

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>>46458274
>we lose the fight for (this) Azeroth
>we escape in the Exodar/stole Legion ships/Necropoli/Dalaran/Airships/etc
>next expansion(s) is traveling around various planets and dimensions, gathering supplies and allies, fending off random assholes, and raiding ancient ruins of long-dead civilizations

>>46458324
Theramore is not a Kul Tiras colony, it's a distinct political entity founded by refugees from all over the Eastern Kingdoms, including Kul Tiras but also elves, dwarves, and humans from at least Lordaeron and Gilneas but probably from other kingdoms as well. Jaina's right to rule is not hereditary, it is based onh er being in charge of the settlement's founding. That she has royal blood from a different kingdom is irrelevant, and Daeiin trying to claim ownership of Theramore because Jaina is his daughter is as ludicrous as Dalaran trying to claim it because she's a Kirin Tor agent. And EVEN IF Theramore had been a Kul Tiras colony, life on another continent requres independence. Daelin taking over would be like if The Queen of England showed up in modern Canada to try and oust the Prime Minister and wage war on "those filthy revolutionaries" in the US.

>>46458420
Yeah, that was just cunt move.

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>>46458222
>tfw Tirion actually died to protect a portal that shat out a constant stream of Ashbringers

>>46458435
Bioware pls.

>>46458482
Well the people there seemed to roll with it, didn't they.

>>46458326
That pic. I needed those sides

>>46458510
>Tirion was walking around
>Suddenly portal of ashbringers burst from above him and literally crushes him to death

>>46458525
I'm pretty sure all of the locals are confined to their homes, its only Daelin's marines you fight when you storm the place, and you don't destroy and of the locals' buildings at Jaina's request.

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>>46458510
>>46458539

>>46458482
>>46458525
They were subjugated, you even avoid destroying their structures even though they've been taken over by Kul Tiras marines.

Plus it would be hilariously hypocritical for a former Gilnean colony to deny the independence of an even more distant colony.

>>46458539
>Ebon Blade resurrect him in the hopes of attracting more artifact dumps
>They send him into fights with a bubble spell active to act as a reusable airstrike/supply drop beacon

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>>46458526
I love those glitches

>>46458392
Thrall claims Orcs have changed.
He says orcs changed to be a peaceful group
They did not.
So he was lying out of his ass.

>>46458482
Theramore uses a altered Kul'tiras Flag and Jaina as a monarch's right comes from being a monarch's daughter.

Claim what you want but its how it went.

>>46458683
What is happening here, exactly? Is it trying to fit the wrong skin over the right model?

>>46458716
yes

>>46458703
flags are meaningless, the flags of Belgium and Germany are almost the same and yet they are two very different countries

>>46458734
>Belgium isn't just Germans pretending to be French
nice try Tintin

>>46458769
Fuck off, we don't want anything to do with these degenerates, nothing good ever comes out of Belgium

>>46458703
It's not a lie if he believes it. Then it's just delusion. Plus, the orcs did follow his lead, so it's natural he'd take impression that they at least to some extent share his values rather than just follow him because he da strongest in the hood.

And part of the orcs probably did.

>>46458703
Theramore was founded outside Kul Tirian juristiction by forces not under Kul Tirian command, and populated by refugees primarily from Lordaeron. The legitimacy of Jaina's leadership came from the fact that she founded the place.

>>46458703
The Kul Tiras flag depicts the Proudmoore family crest, and Jaina is justified in using a modified version of it to found her own dynasty. She should have picked something more distinct, but she probably thought that everyone in the Eastern Kingdoms was dead and that there would never be any cause for confusion. As for needing to already be decended from a monarch to become the monarch of a new country, how do you think people become monarchs in the first place? Hint: it's by having the ability to lead and the will of the people behind you. You can pass the will of the people down to your children if you yourself are well-liked or well-entrenched enough, but if your line gets incompetent and unpopular enough, you're going to get replaced by a new dynasty.

>>46458830
Are you French, German or either kind of belgian? And what makes you think any of those is more degenerate than the rest?

>>46458833
A lot of the old-guard veterans of the second war, who have seen how bad war with the humans gets, are all over the idea of just forgetting about the other continent and doing their own thing. It's the young whippersnappers who think warfare is just a great idea.

>>46458840
that's not how middle-age monarch works and you know it.

Was it just me who thought Mogu and Isle of Thunder was the most interesting part of MoP? I mean, Pandaria was fine but Mogu was alot of fun

It's a shame Uther died during the Third War, actually, since he was such a moderating influence on the Alliance leadership, and the one in favor of putting orcs in camps in the first place. I bet he'd have been more than happy to just let them sail off into the maelstrom, and would have worked to convince people like Daelin and Varian to just let it be. And if Daelin could not be convinced not to go after his daughter, I would not be surprised if Uther went with him, since Jaina is a personal friend. The confrontation between the two Proudmoores probably would have gone a lot differently if Uther had been there too.

>>46458939
So tell me, how did the first king of France get to be King, then? And what happened to the last king of France?

Or even better, tell me how the first Emperor of China got to be empreror, and what happened to his dynasty-- and the next dynasty, and the next dynasty, and the next dynasty...

>>46458939
>Azeroth
>Middle Ages

>>46459084
It's really, really inconsistent. The human kingdoms take elements from the High Middle Ages through to the Early Modern period, and the other races are even harder to pin down as they're just a cobbled together image of whatever feels 'right' for them. Dwarves have DORF STUFF, elves all live in trees and have very little government to speak of, and so on.

>>46459031
By pummeling every other guy who claims to be a leader into the ground.

> Last king of France
> middle-age

he inherited and set out to pummel the other 6 kingdom into the ground.
Then his son fucked up the empire and remanent of the other kingdoms rebeing revolting.
Han dynasty's emperor lost the control of the throne- in both case, and got dethroned by powerful
Jin dynasty got beat up by the northern races after a bloody in-fight between nobles, then get dethroned in south by powerful warlord.
Sui dynasty spent too many time at outside war and lost the central to nobilities.
Tang dynasty, again, lost control of the throne then get dethroned by power warlords.

while peasant revoke is a sign on things going bad, they rarely is the reason why a dynasty collapse.

>>46459322
Peasants are not the only thing included in "the people", anon. If your nobles lose faith in you or your warlords lose faith in you, that's still the will of the people you're losing.

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>>46457926
Impressing how a bit of fel-corruption makes them way better than their draenei cousins.

>>46459489
>Impressing how a bit of fel-corruption makes them way better than their draenei cousins.
the Sargerei in Tanaan are the hottest draenei. it checks out

>>46459473
You say it like nobles and warlords follow monarch because they trust them instead of because the power and wealth they gain from it.
That's not how real world works anon.

Those emperors were dethronzed because they lost their power to the nobles or warlords, not because people don't "trust" him. faith was never the issue.

>>46459554
They don't have to trust their leader personally to have faith that following him is the best course of action. It's a bout them continueing to believe that a future with him in charge will be as good as or better than the past when he was in charge and it worked out in their favour. When they no longer believe that a future with him in charge will be that good, then he loses their support. And it IS faith, because the future cannot be accurately predicted, only guessed at based on past evidence.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cGiQjZ1-9FI

Never forget what could have been o,_ o

>>46459640
yeah except that's never the case.
The nobles and warlords are not idiots.
They follow because of necessity, not because they have faith in the monarch.
What do you think all the political intrigue was about anyway?

Will of the people in middle age, Ha.

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> mfw I'm actually helping with working on wowpedia
> mfw ten years from now, newcomers will have a better grasp on the setting due to me
it's a good feel

>>46459554
>faith was never the issue.
Actually it is always issue of faith.

Faith that they are better off with status quo
Faith that they wouldn't be better off with trying to change shit or grab more power
Faith that they are in the winning team
Faith that current arrangement is best for them to keep and expand their holdings.

>>46459725
She brought it upon herself, anon. Stratholme needed to be purged, they arrived to late; but it was too much for him to bear alone. Is it any surprise that he went full vengeance on Mal'ganis afterwords?

Arthas needed support, not to be called a monster for doing what was honestly the best possible solution remaining to them.

>>46459874

Depends.

In both games, culling of stratholme sees Arthas killing people already transformed into zombies. But was it the same in fluff, or was that censorship to make games more palatable to non-playing public?

The dialogue implies that they are cutting people up before they succumb to plague and don't bother to check who's infected and who is not.

>>46459830
again, never the case.
People are always trying to get more off what they got.
Its the power of the monarch that keep them in check, no noble ever believes that the current arrangement is the BEST.
Why do you think there's so many political intrigue anyway?

And now we are going off to the noble and warlords having faith instead of the "WILL of the people" bullshit that originally brought up?

>>46459942
25,000 people in Stratholme, and Mal'ganis is already in the city accelerating the plague and building his zombie army. Given it is a large city with medieval infrastructure and food preservation, it can be assumed that the majority of citizens ate the infected grain. Even the minority who didn't would be raised by the Cult of the Damned if they are left well enough alone.


They're all dead, sooner or later. The only question is whether they're going to stay dead.

>>46459986
Where the fuck do you think the power of the monarch comes from? He can't fight an army all by his lonesome. It come from people under him believing that he should be in charge.

>>46460013
It would being a hilarious mockery of people's perspective if BZ didn't keep going on saying how it is so evil and shit.

Apparently its not ok to kill someone but perfectly fine the next second when they turn into zombies.

All Arthas had to do was sit outside, wait for the entire city to turn into zombies, go purge it and he is now a hero.

>>46459874
Arthas threw a bitchfit, pulled rank, and disbanded an entire order of paladins when Uther questioned him, instead of doing the reasonable thing and taking five minutes to explain. He was emotionally weak and immature , and it was not Jaina's responsibility to be his crutch while he did something monstrous.

>>46460121
There may have been another way, Arthas just got a bit too defensive, He should have invited Uther to go into the city with him as proof while Jaina called in as many forces as Dalaran could manage.

>>46460058
And any of the warlords or nobles can?

Peoples are really dumb without education.
You don't need their faith for them to follow you.

This is seriously going further and further from my intention of debunking >>46458840 's bullshit.

>>46460170
There's no mention of him disbanding the Order of Silver hand, stop talking shit out of your ass.

How is purging stratholme monstrous anyway?
It is not monstrous if arthas just sit outside and wait for them to turn into zombies? cause that's what jaina and Uther wanted to do.

>>46460179
There is no other way as we can see through out WoW.
Even back then neither Uther nor Jaina proposed any other way.

Then its Uther's fault to throw a bitch fit when he heard the idea, isn't it?

>>46460170
I didn't mean to imply that Arthas was blameless, though I will admit that I may have done so accidentally. He definitely could have kept his cool and explained the situation better.

The real point I guess I'm trying to make is that all three fucked up. Arthas failed to explain that it was too late for Stratholme, and Uther and Jaina for both not considering the option and not presenting any alternatives. That's of course, from the perspective that he was right.

Uther and Jaina still failed if the Culling was wrong, because in that case it is Uther's duty, at least, to prevent a mad prince from killing tens of thousands of innocents, which is what he believed was about to happen.

>>46460239
>There is no other way as we can see through out WoW.
In WoW we learn that Arthas Purging the city was necessary because he NEEDED to join the Lich king in order to stage the Scourge rebellion and to tell Illidan about the Skull of Gul'dan.

>>46460222
>Have I? Lord Uther, by my right of succession and sovereignty of my crown, I hereby relieve you from your command and suspend your paladins from service.

>>46460222
https://youtu.be/4g_7c6a_dwA?t=1m12s

>Suspend your paladins from my service

That's pretty much gettin' fired on the spot, yo.

>>46460241
This is actually an aspect of Warcraft lore I really like.

The danger of poor communication is an ever-present plot point in Warcraft 3. From Arthas in Stratholme, to Grom and Cenarius in Ashenvale, to Tyrande and Maiev in Illidan's prison.

Impatience and miscommunication caused much avoidable strife in the third war

>>46460222
>It is not monstrous if arthas just sit outside and wait for them to turn into zombies? cause that's what jaina and Uther wanted to do.
They wanted to at least discus other options before they started smacking people who were still outwardly human.

>>46460399
Personally I find "Always in a rush, no time to negotiate!" to be really dumb.

>>46460366
> suspend
> no knowing what the word means.

Why are you so retarded?

>>46460457
Yeah, I always saw it as an illustration of how slowing down and taking in all necessary information is always the wiser choice... But then there's Cenarius

>>46460457
I'd say it varies. Tyrande in the prison is pretty damn dumb, but Grom and Cenarius seems kind of unavoidable, since both sides are being as reasonable as they know how to be under those circumstances. Arthas, Uther and Jaina are also being dumb and unreasonable, but they're being dumb in ways that fit their characters.

>>46460381
Why don't you people read a dictionary on what suspend means before talking?

Even if the suspend is permanent (which its not) the order is still not DISBANDED by any means.

>>46460538
>>46460575
Other works, including the Ashbringer comic make it clear that he TRIED to disband the Silver Hand, but Terenas belayed his order when He got word of it.

>>46460457
They proposed no alternative and just stood outside watching.

They had no other plans, and we know there's no other option.

>>46460591
Arthas left Strathlome immediately after the purge and never even met with Uther till "digging up the dead".
How could he even try to disband the order without the ability to send any order?

>>46460610
By that point, hasn't Jaina already met the Prophet and been told to leave for Kalimdor since the Eastern Kingdoms are fucked no matter what? She's certainly seen him the once, when he showed up to talk to Antonidas, but hasn't she already seen him on the road a second time, too? She should already be thinking of ' another plan' at that point, even if not seriously considering it yet.

>>46459986
>again, never the case.
Your knowledge of the subject matter is superficial and ideologically distorted.

>>46460639
The suspension from service was interpreted by all present and all the people who heard of it along the Grapevine as an attempt to disband the silver hand.

>>46460591
Frankly, I'm not ever sure he can disband them, since they're an international organization, but I have no doubt he thought he could, and at the very least he could forbid them from operating in Lordaeron, where they were based in the first place, which would probably have the same effect as disbanding them outright.

>>46460665
No, Medivh only informed Arthas at the time.
Jaina's meeting with him was after the Culling.

The plan you are talking about would be be ditching all the plagued citizens behind and run off the Kalimdor.
How is that different to what I said?

>>46460707
Your argument is weak and have no substance.

>>46460740
Then they all need to go back to school and re-study English because that's not what suspended means at all.

Where did the lore say he try to disband the order anyway?
And who the fuck is "Grapevine"? some sort of fruit man?

>>46460765
Just like the Alliance

>>46460765
Just like your idea of courtiers' life.
>>46460805
kek

>>46460795
The grapevine is a term for how news gets distorted as it travels from person to person.

So if B is a witness and F hears about it in the end, C,D, and E all distort the story a little more until it has very little to do with the original statement.

In this case it went from "Arthas has suspended the paladins from serving on the zombie task force" to "Arthas is trying to disband the silver hand!"

>>46460795
The Grapefine is the chain of information.

By the time the people purifying the crystal that became Ashbringer heard about it the Order was widely interpreted by people IN UNIVERSE as an attempt to disband the Silver hand or bar them form Lordaeron lands.

>>46460843
>kek
My intention

>>46460843
And that's all you got?
How pathetic.

Don't talk about history if you never read it.

>>46460879
>>46460906
And since Uther was the one who heard it... he is the one who started spreading the idiocity?

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>>46460805
Fucking savage

>>46461005
Him, Jaina, or any of his paladins.

>>46461005
He had a dozen knights leave with him.

Dathrohan(Before getting replaced by Balnazaar) was apparently one of the witnesses.

And "Suspended form service within Lordaeron where most of your garrisons and member landholdings are." is pretty close to a full disbanding.

>>46461065
Suspended from Service only means you can't work as official forces of Lordaeron.
Your order is still intact, how is that close to disbanding?

and can someone please show me where they talk about the order being disbanded? comic or novel.

>>46461115

Shame the official laws of Lordareon were lost. There might have been a clause on how military order have to be integrated somehow into official forces.

I'm glad Blizzard made the various Hordes more gender balanced in later expansions. female orcs are cool

>>46461115
Suspension of service could have a number of repercussions, such as forcing them out of their various barracks on Lordaeron lands.

Perhaps some of the lords only posses their family lands dependent on their service, this throws their inheritances into disarray.

>>46460291
Hence the Caverns of Time instance. For history to take its course, Arthas must purge and survive Stratholme and chase Mal'Ganis to Northrend. Whether it was an atrocity or not, it must happen.

>>46461287
By the same token, Jaina must not accompany him, because she has to be on Kalimdor for the Battle of Hyjal. So it's not like she was in the wrong either.

>>46461115
You're really anal about this, aren't you?

Fine, there's no direct source saying "disband". The majority of us interpreted it, because we understood that, if you fire a whole knight's order by royal decree, it's likely also going to cause a lot of structural and reputational damage so that the order may actually come together and decide to call it quits.

>>46461279
They sdouldn't need barracks considering their low number, reminder that most of the force they fought along with are regular soliders, not paladins.

And since paladins are inherently priests I don't see them having problem of bunk down in church.

All In all claim they are disbanded over a suspension order doesn't make any sense.
And I am pretty sure paladin can't lie or spread rumors due to their oath.
Which is why I am requesting the source image for this.

>>46461390
So you are saying that you think its disband and therefore its disband? wow the arrogance.
And from the previous post I am pretty sure people believe it is the case because people said its from one of the comics or novels.

Suspending is not firing.

>>46461412
Well the order doesn't exist or is referenced as existing entity anywhere afterward so.

>>46461522
The order still exist after the 3rd war.

> The Order of the Silver Hand was utterly decimated when Uther was slain.
> The boy held out for as long as he could. Pushed to the war torn hamlet of Northdale, he made his final stand.
> Were any of the Order left alive, he thought - and did it matter?

From "Of Lost Honor" in vanilla WoW, so yes its still mentioned as an existing order.

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>>46461452
Why are you so fixated on the word disband?

>>46461452
Would you prefer "wishing you the best in your future endeavors?"

>>46461652
Because here on /tg/, people keep making the claim without presenting the source to support such claim, while the game text said the opposite.

If arguing about a lore piece exist or not is autism then these thread should cease to exist.

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>>46461649
many were killed or turned to death knights though

like, a good number of the random death knights in 3 are corrupted paladins

>>46461726
We are literally arguing semantics here. That's as pedantic as it gets. Chill out.

>>46461726
Arguing about a single word for ~50 posts is autism

>>46461741
I think the WC3 and Vanilla WoW DKs were almost all willing converts aside from maybe Zeilik

>>46461763
I am getting attacked personally here for arguing about a piece of lore exist or not, and i am the one who needs to chill? really?

>>46461764
Its not a single word. its a entire statement.
The Order of silver hand was suspended from service, or disbanded and cease to exist, is a big difference.

if you think its a single word then you are the one with problem

How drastically would it change the world if the Ebon Blade created and advertised a voluntary, public way for elite fighters to be turned into Death Knights after their death so they can just keep fighting demons?

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>>46461833
Holy shit

>>46461741
Well that's what TFT lead us to believe but WoW said otherwise.
Apparently most of them joined either scarlet crusade or Argent Dawn, while some of them left for Kalimdor.
I believe there was a few knight of silver hand in Ashenvale.

>>46461892
>I believe there was a few knight of silver hand in Ashenvale.
I believe they were tied to a BFD low level class quest either as the Silver Hand or Argent Dawn.

>>46461833
>The Order of silver hand was suspended from service, or disbanded and cease to exist, is a big difference.
It's not that big, actually. Even if the order itself was disbanded, the paladins themselves would not stop existing and could still be referred to as order because it's shorter than "former members of the order".

Well, be that as it may, it only went downhill for them from that point.

You don't see paladins in Alliance forces during events of Frozen Throne. Not sure if them being available as hero class in custom games matters fluffwise.

>>46461935
>You don't see paladins in Alliance forces during events of Frozen Throne. Not sure if them being available as hero class in custom games matters fluffwise.
There's one captured by the Naga in the penultimate Nightelf campaign. (Which really should have been brought up by Garithos if he wanted to justify his "No Naga" rule to Kael.)

>>46461935
>
There are three paladins in the very first undead mission, when you're supposed to stop refugees from escaping. The definitely seem to be the dregs of the order, though.

>>46461876

>Do you consent to being posthumously raised by one of the parties listed in annex 12 to extend your service past natural lifespan?
>(Yes / No)

>*side effects of reanimation process may involve mind altering sorcery. By consenting to reanimation you also consent for corrective action in case of unauthorized use of your body.

>>46461965
That cage is surrounded by kobolds, though, not naga. Moreover, these are the ruins of Dalaran, where mages kept all kinds of things in cages. We don't actually know how long he's been there.

>>46461935
It is because order of the silver hand was supposedly the force that fighting off scourge and secured the few non-plagued place in plague land.

In human campaign of TFT you are playing as the bloodelves, not alliance, hence the lack of paladins.
There's one in night elf campaign in "The Ruins of Dalaran".
The first stage of undead campaign had 3 paladins.
Daelin also had paladins in his force.

>>46462124

Alright then. Some of these at least would lend credibility to theory that the order was merely excluded from culling of stratholme and continued to function for some time thereafter.

>>46462024
> Prince Kael'Thas: The naga have captured some human paladins! If we could free them, they might aid us against Illidan!

The place is also mostly guarded by the nagas.

>>46462173
Fair enough. Although Kael is clearly not 100% accurately informed, since there is in fact only one paladin.

I'm actually not sure why the naga would capture a paladin in the first place. Their goal was to use the Eye to destroy Icecrown, and they're actually doing it. It's not like they need a human sacrifice or anything. And if he was trying to interfere, why lock him up rather than kill him? And why put kobolds in charge of guarding him? It's a strange situation all around.

>>46462233
>>46462233
Come to think of it, I kind of wonder if they recorded the line, and then ended up changing the specifics of the mission and just never went back to fix the line.

>>46462024
>>46462173

I was the one who originally thought it was surrounded by Kobolds, I was mistaken I watched the cutscene and the guards right outside his gate were Naga (Though I believe there were also kobolds in that corner of the map)

>>46462233
I think they just wanted to keep him out of the way, which is pretty merciful for Illidan and Vasj.

>>46462370
I just replayed the whole campaign a couple of weeks ago. The Dalaran complex is guarded by and full of naga, but the area that the paladin is in has no naga directly inside and is full of kobolds. I don't think the naga are guarding the door to his room, either, it's kind of half-way down a corridor with stuff at either end.

>>46462449
I just saw a video with someone chain-jumping Maiev to his door and there being a pair of big Naga males plus some Snapdragons guarding his door.

>>46462479
link?

>>46460399
>to Tyrande and Maiev in Illidan's prison
That wasn't poor communication, that was just Tyrane being a dumb cunt.
The Wardens were acting on Malfurions explicit orders.
Tyrande was going against Malfurions orders. Doubly so.
There was no communication to be had here, beyond
>Hey, let's free Illidan lol
>No, fuck off
>Lol doing it anyway

>>46462500
https://youtu.be/mIfIisQuYsU?t=231

>>46462529
Wardens are part of Elune's church, they answer to Tyrande not Malfurion.

Also they attack you even if you just try to walk past.

>>46462535
Weird. It wasn't that long ago and I don't remember that at all. I'll have to replay the mission again.

>>46459874
>Arthus dindu nuffin
>jainu is bich

>>46462529
First of all, they are called the watchers.
Only elite memebers like Maiev are called Warden.

Second, Watchers are form from the sisterhood of Elune, therefore under Tyrande, not Furion.
And since Furion have being sleeping for 10000 years, its unlikely he had command of anything.

>>46462558
Well, the Owlkin clearly tell you to fuck off first.

>>46462784
According to the WoW Encyclopedia from 2006, it was Malfurion that wanted the Watchers to be formed. They are under the direct command of the head of the Night Elves. I guess that was Tyrande at the time, but from the way the Watchers and Maiev act in TFT, it really doesn't seem like she has any say whatsoever in the matters of the prison.
Which isn't really surprising since she never set foot in there while the Watchers were stuck undergrund for 10k years.
Them telling her to fuck off and attacking her when she doesn't go away seems kind off reasonable to me. It's the equivalent of the president showing up in Special Hell Alcatraz after not bothering with it for decades and demanding Magic Hitler to be released right the fuck now.

So for Legion's class quest.
Death knights need to assemble the new four horsemen.
Warrior need to reunite the Watchers as Odyn's chosen.
Shaman have to gain the alliance of the 4 elemental lords.

Its confirmed that Thunderaan will reborn as the New Windlord while its unknown who will be the new firelord.

>>46463085
I like replacing the Windlord with his much more famous (Thanks to his sword) son.

>>46463085
Who would you say has the hardest overarching plan?

>>46463085
I think the new Firelord is named Smolderon. He's a nobody as far as I'm aware. As an additional but unrelated note, one of the Paladin followers is actually a Dreadlord named Leothraxion.

Right now I'm wondering what the Priests are going to get, since almost none of their followers have been revealed. I'm sure we'll have some windchimes sprucing up the place, but I'm hoping that Shadow Priests will be able to recruit a few Faceless Ones to fight beside us.

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>>46463267
>Use the minions of a bigger bad to fight a big bad
>Willingly associating with Lovecraftian horrors
bruv

Read a little about Warcrafts new Chronicles book. Am I right in thinking that the story is currently "Sargeras learns the Void Lords want to kill all life, his solution to this is to kill all life so they can't"?

>>46463197
"My sword is famous across the land".
"Too bad no one has ever heard of you before".

Do we know what role the scourge is playing in legion? Is kel'thuzad active?

>>46463344
Shadow Priest are already doing it with the sapient blade Xal'atath, thus proving that Old God minions are perfectly willing to cooperate in the fight against the Legion.

>>46463223
Probably the warlocks.
They are really underrepresented in fluff.

>>46459942
What? Even in the actual mission you have to kill people BEFORE they turn into zombies to prevent the transformation.

Is Legion the end all expansion?

>>46463344
The minions OF the Minions of a bigger bad.

>>46463344
vague threat that may or may not ever show up > the guys who are literally killing us right now

>>46463345
Kinda, he just wants to make sure they can't make bad Titans out of planets.
So he destroys them anyway.

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>>46463506
I want to see Draenei get desperate and start becoming Warlocks, but due to their nature, they're corrupted into Eredar again.

>>46463738
Draenei warlocks are impossible. It would fly wildly in the face of literally everything they stand for.

>>46463762
Technically so do Orc Warlocks, since they're tapping into the same demonic power Thrall worked so hard to break them from.

>>46463738
That's impossible. The only corrupting thing they can acknowledge to have are Draenei Death Knights, and these are free.

>>46463785
At least PC Warlocks are heroic.

>>46463785
Yeah but they're enslaving the demons in what they see as turnabout and thus fair play.

>>46463785
I'd argue it's worse for draenei. Literally all of them have an ingrained devotion to the Light (hence their racial), and consorting with the demons is reprehensible.

>>46463738
there's non-player draenei warlocks in WoD, they slowly get corrupted back into real eredar

>>46463795
>At least PC Warlocks are heroic.
That's the key distinction to make. PC warlocks can resist the deeper allure of demonic powers and are extraordinarily strong of will. It's that strength of will that separates weak warlocks ("no John you are the demons") from strong ones.

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>>46463797
Really, all Warlocks should be pariahs in regards to their faction.
Except maybe Forsaken since they're already undead via a demon-made plague and for half the game had Varimathras chilling out in their throne room.
>Yeah but they're enslaving the demons
Dabbling in demon magic is only asking for trouble. Warlocks should be treading the razor's edge; always one step from being enslaved themselves.
>>46463816
Which is why I said desperate.
>>46463855
Fuck, if I had a choice, I'd join the Legion as a PC Warlock.
No real reason. I just want to watch the world burn. Well, mostly Metzen and Kosak.

>>46463877
>Really, all Warlocks should be pariahs in regards to their faction.
Which is why warlocks make a big fuss to not reveal they're actually warlocks. There's rules for this.
>Rule number one: never summon your demon(s) in front of the normies.
>Rule number two: if anyone asks, you're a fire mage.
What other rules are there?

>>46463925
>What other rules are there?
always tap first

How fucking hard is it to spare a day of ingame editors and developers and rebuild the fucking Stormwind park?

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>>46463925
>Save the stupid armor seething with darkness and felfire for when you're already outed, you stupid idiot
>If you need to sacrifice someone for a ritual, use a bandit or an enemy to your faction or something- orphans may be unwanted, but the pally-police will start knocking down doors if too many go missing

I could see Forsaken as the only group relatively okay/open with having warlocks in their ranks.

>>46464216
Because it got trashed by Deathwing. YOU rebuild an entire city region and tell me how quickly that goes.

>>46464216
Well, the area is blasted into the sea, so there's no rebuilding it unless they can build that land back up again. Better to just wall it off and reroute the canals accordingly, which would take some doing. Maybe have a memorial near where the park used to be.

>>46464250
A bit faster than three expansions?

>>46464216
There's a trashed building there which is used for the Twilight Highlands start-up quest. They'd need to remap that entire quest if they redid that area.

>>46464333
That building is actually pretty far from the park itself, closer to the harbor.

>>46464333
It can be simply moved, but yeah. I know that Blizzard are lazy and would rather redecorate Orgrimmar instead. Originally there was a Gilnean district planned in there you know.

>>46464216
you're right, Varian should just hire a bunch of stonemasons and get them on that

>>46463925
>If anyone asks, ofcourse this isn't a demon, it's clearly an elemental.
>It's not trapping souls, it's saving them so they can be properly and respectfully dealt with later.
>The ghostly flying skull spell graphic is just a halloween glyph.
>Black is a very slimming colour, right.
>Some mages (which I am ofcourse am) open portals vertical in mid air. Mine lie flat on the floor or take the form of massive stones. Oh and leave the stench of sulphor behind, just ignore that it goes away eventually.

>>46464459
They did quite a good job with the harbor.
I know you are trying to joke about the Defias but there are other Stonemasons as well.

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>>46464459

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>>46464488
>there are other Stonemasons
Who controls the Stormwind crown?
Who keeps the gnomish people down?
We do! We do!

>>46464495
Varian Wrynn is good presidente, filthy Horde lie spreader.

>>46464828
Don't speak ill of the dead.

>>46463345
He sees it as an inevitable flaw in the universe as is, so he's gonna' blow everything up and start over.

>>46464250
Orgrimmar managed to build up, be besieged, and then build up again in the same time. Don't tell me the Alliance lacks the resources to do it.

>>46464495

>>46464488
>there are other Stonemasons as well.


Well there WAS one other Stonemason foreman that didn't go defias. Emphasis on WAS< if this stage of tha garrison weekly wasn't so useful for farming Shatari defense rewp I'd have avenged him long ago.

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>>46458021
Are you prepared /tg/?

>>46465080
MY EYES!!!

I MUST BURN THEM OUT!!

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>>46458021
>>46458075
>>46465080

>>46465080
As long as he romances Maiev.

>>46465481
He'll walk into the Warden's Vault, now empty and abandoned save for Maiev. Alone and reminiscing about the past, the vault doors will open, spilling in a light as glorious as the sun.

>You about ready to get out of hear, cowgirl?
>Hell, it's about time.

>>46457991
I wanted that for a transmog on my Warrior SO fucking badly.

I'm still pissed about it.

>>46465757
Run Kara a few times.'

It's lower rez but almost as good.

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>>46465080
That is the dumbest fucking shit.

I'm out.
Just... fuck it.
Call me back when it turns out to be a false prophecy or something.

>>46465669
>cowgirl
>'Just like the old times, eh?!'

>>46465915
Mah Niggah.

>>46458075
I don't even have enough alcohol on hand to stomach this retardation.

Just god fucking dammit, Blizzard.

>>46463877
>Warlocks should be treading the razor's edge; always one step from being enslaved themselves


According to the new book, Demon hunters are that. It takes a lot of willpower to refrain from attacking themselves for power.

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>>46458075

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>wake up
>see that illydan is now kerrigan.

>>46466045
>attacking themselves
I know that "stop hitting yourself" jokes are old as hell but the mental image still makes me laugh.

Wait, what happened to Kerrigan?

>>46466200
She became glowing gold Zel'Naga.

>>46466200
The Xel'Naga had this Reaper-like cycle of creating universes for the sole purpose of forging two races, one representing purity of essence and the other representing purity of form. Uniting these two creatures into the perfect entity, they create a new Xel'Naga that proceeds to start the cycle anew by forging a new universe.

In this case, Kerrigan was the candidate for Xel'Naga conversion except instead of becoming a gelatinous betentacled space-manatee like all other known Xel'Naga, she became a sexy golden bimbo forged of light and killed Amon.

>>46466200
there must always be a Xel'naga

>>46466434
Really, it's the story of Blizzard itself. Metzen gets promoted out of having much to do with Warcraft, but
>There must always be a Shitty Writer
so in comes Kosak. It's like poetry.

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Every time I go into the Stockades I can't help but notice THESE things are there. Fucking hell, Storrmwind.

>>46466608
They're props for when Varian puts together his metal band composed entirely of former gladiators. They call it Thunder From The Ring. Varian is lead guitar and Thrall plays bass. Valeera sings and Broll is on drums.

>>46466608
Does the Scarlet Crusade still skulk about in the church basement?

>>46465798
>tfw running kara for the achivement and the off chance that cool stuff drops for a transmog and Gorehowl does

>>46463267
>>46463344
>Faceless ones
Jesus fuck, that's even more stupid than DKs kicking the paladins in the dick and stealing tirion's bag.

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>>46458075
Good thing I stopped taking Warcraft seriously, some years ago.

>>46467278
There was that one time adventurers helped a Faceless One escape one of the Scourge's saronite mines.

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>>46463267
>Blizz wasn't taking the piss when they showed off a "holy" Dreadlord
>Other classes get cursed, corrupt, and downright evil or unstable artifacts with enough power to qualify as handheld WMDs
>Including artifacts that may have made contact with Sargeras or the Old Gods

There's no way any of this can backfire horribly and bite Azeroth in the ass. Nope, no sir. Totally safe.

>ywn take in a show at the Karazhan opera house

>>46467589
Adventurers are retarded, no news there.
If arthas was like "did u know tirion drops epix?" everyone would've bumrushed him

>>46467736
>DK LITERALLY fucking steals a demon weapon. Not demon infused, the weapon of a demon.
>Spriest literally revives an old god minion the warrior arms killed. Then guess what he fucking7 decides to do? Just. Eats. It.
>Warlocks

>>46467589
The quest text for that is great. It's heavily implied that he's doing Jedi mind tricks on you the whole time, especially since the name of the quest is literally "Mind Tricks"

To be perfectly fair, he did say "please" and give you his shoes like he promised, all without stabbing you in the back at any time.
>>46467736
>>46468212
>Nope, no sir. Totally safe.
What are you, a pussy?

Death Knights are already addicted to causing pain and Demon Hunters are corrupted to the point where they have to resist eating one another. The playable Demon Hunters are at the point where they're literally Demons that revive in the nether. A few tentacle monsters and cursed artifacts isn't going to make things any worse than they already are.

>>46467589
Hey now, be fair. That guy offered money to do it. So what if Ive seen a Faceless One before and know that they're bad news? I got like 50 mounts to feed.

>>46469179
>That guy offered money to do it.
Money, shoes, and he said "please".

>>46469242
Which is more polite than most quest givers.

>>46469349
That's why I want to recruit a few ingame. I'd also like to play one in space.

>>46468913
>Death Knights are already addicted to causing pain and Demon Hunters are corrupted to the point where they have to resist eating one another.
I want source on this.

What are paladins gonna do? All our great heroes are either dead or death knights. Except for Yrel, but ya know, she's too busy for us and all.

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>>46469857
It means we need to step up to the plate and be the beacon of the Light every Paladin before us was and every Paladin after us will be.

Self-Sacrifice is a virtue, not a tragedy.

>>46469786
The addiction to causing pain is in various Death Knight quests. It's well known.

As to the Demon Hunter cannibalism urge, this guy has the book so take a look.
http://www.scrollsoflore.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1457843&postcount=810

Demon Hunters literally have to resist eating one another. Shadow Priests messing around with a little dark magic and tentacles seems rather tame by comparison.

>>46470074
>step up to the plate and be the bacon of light

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Sargeras: Glad you could make it, Aman'thul.
Aman'thul: Watch your tone with me, boy. You may be the enforcer, but I'm still your superior as a titan.
Sargeras: As if I could forget. Listen, Aman'thul, there's something about the worlds you should know.
Sargeras: Oh no. It's too late. These worlds have all been corrupted. They may look fine now, but it's a matter of time before they turn into tentacles.
Aman'thul: What?
Sargeras: This entire universe must be purged.
Aman'thul: How can you even consider that? There's got to be some other way.
Sargeras: Damn it, Aman'thul. As your future champion I order you to purge this world.
Aman'thul: You are not my better yet, boy. Nor would I obey that command if you were!
Sargeras: Then I must consider this an act of work ignorance.
Aman'thul: Ignorance? Have you lost your mind, Sargeras?
Sargeras: Have I? Lord Aman'thul, by my right of badassery and raw power of my sword, I hereby relieve you from your command and suspend your titans from service.
Aggramar: Sargeras, you can't just...
Sargeras: It's done! Those of you who have the will to save this universe, follow me. The rest of you... get out of my sight. Aman'thul: You've just crossed a terrible pantheon, Sargeras
Sargeras: Aggramar? Aggramar: I'm sorry, Sargeras. I can't watch you do this. (From MMO Champion)

>>46471452
...my god.

>>46471532
It's not perfect but I like it.

It's more like if Uther had decided on the purge against the objections of Terenas and Arthas.

>>46464250
Not as fast as ogrimmars multiple renovations during MoP.

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Huh, no more snake hair, just tentacles.

That's kinda lame.

So, if you were going to run a Warcraft setting in space and the Twisting Nether and included multiple worlds, what races and things would you fill it with?

>>46471643
Yeah, it's been that way for awhile. There's no clear reason for it, so I'm kind of confused why that happened. Did the guy doing the model update just fail to notice that they were supposed to be snakes?

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>>46471452
Good job and thanks for the laffin.

Well, there's a new tidbit on the whole thing with Illidan and the Naaru on SoL.

>When Illidan sees the Sha'tar are attacking the Black Temple, he thinks either the naaru "betrayed" him, or that the Elder Naaru doesn't speak for or have any influence over A'dal and the other naaru.

So, what are the chances we've got more than one faction of Naaru out in the universe, factions who may well favor different methods or have opposing goals?

>>46472100
The faction that supports Illidan will be the good faction and the other faction will be ultimately revealed as corrupt, but Illidan will kill the leader of that faction and take his position because there must always be a Boss Naaru.

>>46458021
On the plus side?
I did not, until this moment, know for sure that I made the right call by completely ignoring StarCraft 2.
Thanks for verifying I was correct, /tg/!

>>46472162
Are you suggesting our buddy A'dal and his windchime bros are evil? That M'uru, who sacrificed himself for the sins of the Blood Elves, was corrupt? The the ones who saved the Draenei and powered their dimensional ships are in the wrong?

Think about it. What sort of Naaru would want someone like -Illidan- as its champion? Illidan's main virtue is that he's a ruthless bastard who will use whatever means necessary and pay any price to achieve his goals.

>>46472227
I'm not saying that they're necessarily evil now, just that they will be by the time Legion ends. After all, Illidan did noting wrong.

In all seriousness, though, they could theoretically get pretty corrupt without turning out and out evil. I mean, Mister Rogers could get fifty percent meaner and still be a pretty nice guy.

>>46472221
Wings of Liberty was pretty good.

Go ahead and ignore the expansions, nothing of value there except Alarak.

>>46472317
Illidan was under the impression Kael was still on his side and didn't realize Kael started it

>>46472337
I don't actually believe that Illidan did nothing wrong, I'm just making grim predictions about Blizzard's future story decisions because every Warcraft thread needs a good prophet of doom. This thread is fucked now, you need to go west to the forgotten threads of Reddit if you want to survive the Legion update.

>>46472227
>the Naaru are evil
That's a line of thought, since Light and Shadow are just the faces of the same coin, named Universe.

>>46471643
Y'know, looking this close, Naga are kinda hot.

>>46472459
>Naga are kinda hot
I always assumed Kael was getting it on with Vashj while they were working together.

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>>46472428
I kind of feel that we've got enough doomsayers to go around and it kills discussion.
>>46472459
I don't think the Naaru are evil. I think they're the Naaru. However, we're now getting a strong hint that the Naaru don't agree on everything and aren't all working together.
>>46472317
I'm not sure we're supposed to think Illidan did nothing wrong. Illidan did lots of wrong things, even if he was fighting someone worse. Illidan is practically useless unless you let him do wrong things. He has no other utility than to be the guy who does wrong things.

His leadership skills are awful, his management is terrible, and he's got nothing resembling a selfless attitude or noble spirit. This is all shown pretty clearly. It's pointed out that he's not a good leader in the same novel.

The only reason why a Naaru could possibly want him is if that Naaru wanted a morally unscrupulous bastard who would be glad to do very wrong things in the name of the greater good.

>>46472568
>>>46472459
>I don't think the Naaru are evil. I think they're the Naaru. However, we're now getting a strong hint that the Naaru don't agree on everything and aren't all working together.
But that was Kael not working with Illidan and him being blind to the betrayal.

>>46472617
Nah, see. The Elder Naaru should have contacted Illidan after the Scryers left, and Shattrath knew that Kael'thas was a traitor before they invaded the Black Temple.

There reason for attacking Illidan had nothing to do with Kael'thas.

>>46472681
Goddammit blizzard.

Okay, i just remembered another loose end from the Andorhal alliance side.

We find out what happened to Koltira but not the alliance-loyal Abomination?

>>46472771
>Goddammit blizzard.
This is what we already knew. We figured out Kael'thas was a traitor before Black Temple was released, and we knew the Scryers seemed to be from Kael'thas's forces.

What's new is that they muddled up the reason for why the Sha'tar suddenly decided to attack Illidan, since Maiev apparently kept getting turned down when she asked for assistance earlier in the novel. We're missing some pretty important details in the current form of the story, and something tells me that the missing pieces are related to this Elder Naaru and exactly how it differs from the Sha'tar.

>>46472926
Yeah, but i thought people believed the Illidari and legion were starting to mend relations thanks to Kael and decided to fuck them up.

>>46472976
Or the adventurers never explained things to the questgivers.

>>46473039
Kael'thas gloated about it right in front of A'dal after you turned in one of his balls.

>>46473061
I thought the gloating came with the Sunwell raid AFTER Black Temple.

>>46472771
We'll probably never hear of it again, or just in another joke quest.

It was probably taken over or destroyed by the Forsaken as they took the place over.

>>46473096
Kael'thas was dead for real by the time you get to Sunwell Plateau, he gloats about them failing to kill him after The Eye

Tempest Keep was merely a setback

>>46473125
The five man on the plateu area? I am a bit lost and on mobile so whatever

>>46473125
you beat Kael but don't kill him in The Eye, then you kill him for real in Magister's Terrace, then Sunwell Plateau comes after that

>>46473096
Nope. Verdant Sphere turn-in came before either of those. It initiates an event where Kael'thas starts gloating and basically announces he no longer works for Illidan. Key quotes here.
>Kael'thas Sunstrider yells: And there is nothing you or that fool, Illidan, can do to stop me! You have both served me in your own right - unwittingly.
>Kael'thas Sunstrider yells: Lay down your arms and succumb to the might of Kil'jaeden!

He directly told A'dal that he was working for Kil'jaedan and was now Illidan's enemy.

>>46473209
Or Illidan's new master. It leaves it a tiny bit vague, but you have the more common and truthful interpretation.

>>46465669
>and then Illidan corrupted Maiev via reverse cowgirl
>then they fucked for ten thousand years

>>46473253
Well, he suggested that Illidan would want to stop him, so I'm pretty sure the right conclusion is that they're on different sides now.

Anyhow, the current lore has created a mystery as to why the Sha'tar wanted Illidan dead, especially because they weren't interested in invading the Black Temple and stopping him when Maiev asked them earlier. The fact that it's some time -after- Illidan was chosen by an unknown Elder Naaru is another confusing piece to the puzzle.

Our two options are that there are other factions of Naaru who don't agree on everything or share their information, or the Naaru are all manipulative bastards who never intended to give Illidan a choice and got us to kill him as part of their master plan to make him into a Champion of the Light.

>>46473344
Slaves want to stop the man with the whip too, but I am being pedantic now.

Also wheeee writing up campaign notes for a warcraft game I may never play.

The various races and factions of Northern EK forming together against the scourge despite HUGE hatreds and with only minmal assistance from the outside world. (Though they can BUY plenty of help, the free stuff is harder to come by)

>>46473407
Also I plan to cameo Bolvir and Volbir the goblin merchant duo from those custom WC3 campaigns based around the early books. (I can't search hiveworkshop by creator name so i can't tell if he made any more beyond the first three [TLG,DoTD,LotC])

>>46473344

Or maybe the Sha'tar was simply unwilling to commit defence forces to carry out an offensive with little potential gain and high risk of loss.

Assuming Illidan was still with Legion, Sha'tar could assume demons would reinforce him if they attacked, while if they were different parties, they could confidently take him alone or even benefit from Legion pressuring him.
Why not ally with him against the legion then? Maybe they made an offer but it was refused, maybe they just couldn't get over his demonic nature, assuming he would always betray them (but there is a demon hanging out in shattrath so that seems not to be an issue).
Or maybe just because he was a competing force who desired dominion over Outland and needed to be dealt with. In fact after defeat of Legion's lieutenants in Outland, Illidan might have been greatest threat to the Sha'tar present on the world, with legion itself being scattered among the various gate points.

Or it was all simply because the raid was only introduced in a later content upgrade. Sha'tar wouldn't agree to humor Maiev because there was nothing to raid.

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Tell me about that obscure or forgotten lore trivia you like, /tg/

> The forces of Stormwind were the one defending Hillsbrad during the initial assault of the Horde

Also recommend me your favorite lore forums, youtube chains and websites, I hunger for more

>>46473621
>> The forces of Stormwind were the one defending Hillsbrad during the initial assault of the Horde
90% of the battles in the Second War were the Blackrock Clan fighting Stormwind because Blizzard didn't want to give up the red/blue colour scheme unless it was essential

>>46473638
Well for the Blackrock Clan it makes senses considering how important it was

I thought that Stormwind defending Hillsbrad was kinda neat since that's probably where the refugees settled, but maybe it's been changed by books now

>>46473621
>The Manta, a beast described to be ten times the size and power of a dragon that was slain by a single black arrow roughly one-hundred years before the opening of the Dark Portal.

>>46473618
In that case, we must assume the Elder Naaru isn't one of the Sha'tar and they aren't working together.

>>46473840
interesting, but probably non-canon considering its sources

>>46473861
I don't think they've yet to say that any of their novels are non-canon, even though some of them are just absolutely terrible when it comes to lore.

I think in one of the books, Malfurion excuses the use of arcane magic when usually he's against it, but still no blue posts or anything like that rectifying it. Chronicle's omission of the Manta might be like a soft retcon to it, though.

>>46462233
>I'm actually not sure why the naga would capture a paladin in the first place

>Paladin uses bubble
>its quicker to build a prison around him than wait for it to wear off

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>>46457807
Damn, Lei. What did they do to you in America?

>>46474896
he became swole

>>46465080

Kerrigan was Illidan in drag all along? My boner is confused.

>>46458075
>http://imgur.com/a/Rfbq1
I'm okay with it. In fact it could be pretty cool.

It does seem like ramping up to another cosmic final showdown that will be difficult to write themselves out of, though. Oh well, dragon aspects seemed pretty final too.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2X9cOZnoTa0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=89mqkcNEszQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VLvBkBc6jUo

So much jas been taken from us...

>>46475119
I can't even be angry about it anymore. All I feel is disappointment.

>>46475119
>karabor
It still hurts

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will metzen sama find his husbando?

>>46475289
>>46475333
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aYLJmR76jtc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dtQ7U2qPZvo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5288VWr1cjE

Early Tanaan looked so awesome

>>46475456
Man, why, they couldn't wait for two or three more months to release it?
It would have been perfect

>>46475119
At least Legion seems to have a better start

>>46475504
hah.

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I usually don't post or lurk these threads, but I have a question:


What the fuck happened to Kul Tiras?

It was super important in warcraft 2 and 3 and now there's just no fucking Kul Tiras in Wow at-fucking-all, it's madness.

And yet simultaneously there's like a hundred brazillion Kul Tiras forces stationed across durotar and the barrens.
What the fuck.

>>46475584
basically Kul'Tiras might have been shifted away due to the cataclysm or destroyed.

>>46475584
Kul Tiras wasn't important in Warcraft 3, some of its fleet where

The Kul Tiras forces in WoW vanilla were the remnants of those fleets but now they're all dead

The kingdom of Kul Tiras is probably just decaying since it has no trade partners or fleets anymore

>>46475608
Not that anon, but pity.

Would see an expansion with Naga and Kul Tiras being a major plot point for both Horde and Alliance. Especially for the latter and you go around trying to whip them back into how they were.

Also we could blame Admiral Proudmoore for the whole destroyed fleet thing.

>>46475650
well he did try a military coup on another kingdom and member of the Alliance

even if he was right he didn't had to do that

>>46475669
does she ever say her dad was right post theramore?

>>46475669
He was right about orcs being a potential menace.
He was wrong about running off to crusade against orcs when there was a much more imminent threat present in Lordaeron. And usurping his daughter's upstart realm to do this was just salt to the injury.

>>46475669
Yeah. Also using Jaina's people and forcing them to fight the Horde in the final fight for Theramore was actually crossing a line even if he was right. Seriously I can understand him hating the Orcs for a good reason, but this was crossing a line.

>>46475706
Does she even mention him?

>>46475730
>Potential Menace
With the shitstorm caused by Garrosh, no wonder his words are so right now.

>>46475745
>Does she even mention him?
I don't know.

>>46475706
I have no idea, I don't read WoW books anymore

>>46475730
>He was right about orcs being a potential menace.
To be honest, without his Kul Tiras marines fucking things up, maybe the fate of Theramore could have been different

>>46475751
>To be honest, without his Kul Tiras marines fucking things up, maybe the fate of Theramore could have been different
Ok, now this is reaching

>>46475768
Well, thanks to Admiral Proudmoore, the Alliance struck first against Orgrimmar

And then there was the situation with Northwatch

I'm not saying the orcs were right to capture the civilians and torture them, but Theramore was turned into a potentially hostile target thanks to Proudmoore

>>46475751
>To be honest, without his Kul Tiras marines fucking things up, maybe the fate of Theramore could have been different
Maybe, but it doesn't seem to me that Daelin's intrusion was the determining factor in Garrosh being appointed the warboss, and once he was in position he'd probably find one reason or another why horde stronk cannot tolerate foreign power in its sphere of influence.

>>46475782
and jaina stopped the entire conflict by helping the then nascent horde.

>>46475782
>>46475768
>>46475751

Had Jaina not helped him escape, Thrall would have been executed by Daelin Proudmoore, and another warchief would have taken his place. Most likely his replacement would not have been as interested in peace overtures as Thrall, meaning Theramore would have been fucked even faster.

Remember, Theramore only got nuked after Thrall handed the reigns over to someone else.

>>46475836
Theramore got fucked because Garrosh stole a powerful magical artifact, got a race of magicians to build a bomb and empower it with the same artifact. This was after the horde was given cheats to match the alliance in manpower and tech.

Daelin would have destroyed the horde before it was born.

>>46475905
I don't know how powerful Kul Tiras expeditionary fleet was, but I doubt it would not have been eventually pushed back into the sea by orcs and their allies.

Who is older, titans or the naaru?

>>46475942
They had the horde on the ropes though. The only reason the horde got united enough was because Rexxar escape. And later told the horde where the weakness in her dad's fleet were

>>46475970
Naaru.
Titans take a long time to be born.

>>46475942
>>46475992

The Kul Tiras fleet had no supply lines and no reinforcements waiting in the wings. At the very best it would have led to an extended, bogged-down tug of war over territory ending with many more civilian lives lost.

There were few enough Kul Tiras troops that a surprise attack from Thrall managed to kill the admiral and demoralize the entire expedition.

>>46476028
Because Jaina literally told thrall where he could find more ships to pull out of his ass. The horde could not have assaulted theramore itself unless Jaina hadn't given them the info they needed.

If thrall would have died at the diplomat ambush it would be game over for the horde.

>>46476028
>The Kul Tiras fleet had no supply lines and no reinforcements waiting in the wings
False, it had at least another fleet in reserve

http://wow.gamepedia.com/Lieutenant_Alverold

>>46473339
Stahp. My boner can't take it.

>>46475706
She went to her father's grave in Tides of war.
She was all crying and regretting, saying her father was right all along.

The Orcs are born evil sadstic murderers with neither conscious nor honor, a fact warcraft have well established.

>>46476028
False, it had everything.
The only reason they lost is because of Jaina turning on her father.

Thrall launched the battle with everything The Horde had, including things that wasn't even in the Horde( stonemaul ogre).
Its not a surprised attack.

>>46476321
do you have the relevant quote?

I must admit I want to hear that bitch squirm

>>46476321
>The Orcs are born evil sadstic murderers with neither conscious nor honor, a fact warcraft have well established.
But that's bullshit senpai
Thrall and that Tirion's buddy what'shisname come to mind, and there are others.

Maybe you could begin to think critically one of these days instead of masturbating to HFY.

>>46476424
> he doesn't masturbate to HFY

>>46475456
The amount of content they scrapped for WoD I never understand. Especially stuff like the interior of Karabor (they had it ready except for the textures, which couldn't have been so hard to do) and Farhlon (the place is right there, albeit with a different name, in TBC, so you can't example pretend it doesn't exist).

I can see cutting dungeons and raids for time constraints, but delaying or scrapping entire zones?

>>46476321

I love seeing lorecucks cry about this shit and make up their own fantasy cloud castles.

>The only reason they lost is because of Jaina turning on her father.

Just like the only reason Germany lost was because Hitler killed himself, right?

>>46476357
I rememebered incorrectly.
She was at Daelin's statue in stormwind.

"Was it only five years ago that I chose my path?”
she whispered. “I chose to ally with strangers, with the enemy, with orcs, instead of you, Papa.
Instead of my own blood. I called you intolerant. Said that peace was the way. You said you would always hate them, that you would never stop fighting them. And I told you they were people. They deserved a chance. And now you are dead. My city is dead.”

“Papa...forgive me. Forgive me for letting the Horde grow so strong. Forgive me for giving them the chance to slaughter so many of our people.”
She lifted her eyes up again, seeing the implacable statue through a haze of purple-white. “You were right, Papa. You were right! I should have listened! Now, now that it’s too late, I see that. It took... this... for me to understand.”

Also, Thrall is a asshole and a joke in the book.

>>46476424
Thrall grew up with humans, he didn't grow up in orc's cultural and is therefore the sole exception in Orcs.
Ettrig was a war veteran and he only learned the lesson after their bitter defeat in 2nd war.
Actually, all the anti-war orcs we saw are war veterans.

The new born mag'har orcs, who supposedly grew up in the shamanic guidance of their eldars, free from demonic taints what so ever. all turns out to be sadist murder machines.
Also, Orcs slaughtered most of the draeneis before drinking mannaroth's blood, they are born this way.

>>46476484
Actually the old guard of the Horde was against Garrosh.

Lumping everyone in the Horde into the same bag is stupid.

>>46476475
The in game text said very clearly The Horde can't win until Rexxar mustard everything and Jaina providing a way to break the blockade.
I don't have to make shits up, cucksucker.

>>46476539
And what did they do against Garrosh's action?
They were still in the army serving his will.

If you are helping, you have no right to say you are not responsible.

>>46476539
>TIP OF THE HORDE SPEAR, NO GREATER HONOR

>>46457807

NEW THREAD

>>46476580
>>46476580
>>46476580
>>46476580
>>46476580

>>46476560
>>46476576
We could blame the writing of this whole situation and Garrosh being a case of bad character development.

>>46476527
They don't seem sadist murder machines to me desu, not that much more than normal people are or used to be in some cultures in real life. Hell, they are more civilized than Daesh. It's more about the culture, as you say Thrall developed into a more sensible being, despite his background of growing up in concentration camp is not awfully rosy either.

If you consider how brutal Draenor's nature is, it's not surprising that they are less sensitive about life and death and pain and more prone to combat and testing their strength.

Keep in mind Draenei are not Draenor's natives and Argus might have been less violent than Draenor.

>>46475584
The most dubious fate of all has befallen the shores of beautiful Kul Tiras: Blizzard forgot about them.

We will never know facts of how they coped with their Lord Admiral dying on foreign lands and a member of the royal family breaking from the nation, but we'll also be save in the knowledge that blizzard can never draw them through the mud with a hamfisted revelation that they're infected with the curse of the Murlogen, which awakens their inner fishmonster and turns them into superfishpeople at the turning of the tide, and their entire life is now spent attempting to tame the beast MRLGHLRGHLRHGL

>>46476589
I propose that a thread must at least have reached page or 9 10 before a new one gets created.

>>46476604
The Orcs wiped out 80% of draenei's population, most of them before any demonic corruption.
I think that alone says enough.

If you think continuously attempt to genocide others (3 times unprovoked, minimum) is not being evil sadist murder machine, you have some real problem.

>>46476643
agreed

>>46461998
>>46461876
>**Side effects include berserking rage, blood thirst, enjoying L70ETC and feeling 16 again