/swg/- Star Wars General: IT'S HERE Edition

>Get to Echo Base
>See an Action Prompt at a console.
>Activate it
>The Ion Cannon from ESB fires outside

I think this is extremely illegal and unsafe. It's also not as cool as you'd think.

Besides, didn't the Imps blow up its power generator?

>>44187379
I just noticed there's another Death Star in that poster.
Can Star Wars get a plot that isn't "The Sith have a super weapon and we need to stop them"?

>>44187448
It's not the Death Star. It's the Doom Star.

Completely different.

>>44187438
Well, after the battle of Hoth they probably occupied the base and repaired the generator, in case the Rebels came back for some reason.
Also so the lights worked.

>>44187448
>>44187462
Well... I'm glad someone pointed that out now so I can avoid a bruising facepalm in the theater.

>>44187462
Nope, that's the Nostril of Palpatine

>>44187448
Hey, ESB had no mention of superweapons.

But the Original Clone Wars game did have a Sith Superweapon and it was really awesome.

But yeah, basing another movie around a superweapon is kinda... blegh.

And after seeing some of the stuff in that encyclopedia that an anon was posting, I'm not very hopeful for this anymore. And I wanted to be hopeful.

>>44187244
Revan is OP and he had better training in both disciplines of the force.

>>44187549
True. However, I don't think he ever achieved Battlemaster rank.

Huh, the E-11 actually makes for a decent DMR. Certainly more useful than the Disruptor rifle at closer ranges.

>>44187448
>Can Star Wars get a plot that isn't "The Sith have a super weapon and we need to stop them"?
Star Wars I, II, III, V.

>>44187508
It seems like a lot of it is "Hey remember this thing from the OT? Well, look here it is."
I'm waiting to see if they're going to kill off Kylo Ren in the movie, because the lack of a common villain throughout the prequels just killed any drama. Along with everything else of course.

>>44187557
Regardless of rank, Revan fought and won against OP characters as well.

Kyle's enemies were:
a librarian's(she appeared in the prequels) apprentice before he decided to become edgy after reading holocrons
an edgy purple dinosaur
Then again I didn't read that much after the Dark Forces/Jedi Knight/Jedi Academy storyline

>>44187590
Eh, Sidious was a common villain throughout, he just never showed up. Dooku was pretty great throughout the various iterations of the Clone Wars.

>>44187615
Sidious was never the focus though, it was Maul, or Dooku, or Grievous. And Dooku may have been great in TCW, but in the movies he appears at the end of II, and dies at the start of III.

Something has always bugged me about Ahsohka. Don't Jedi choose a Padawan to train on their own? The Council assigning a Jedi a Padawan seems like a bad idea.

>>44187650
I think you could argue that during war time they were just desperate to get people trained since masters and Knights were dropping like flies. Plus with everyone leading armies it's not like you get a bunch of opportunities to meet younglings and do interviews. Now I'm wondering if younglings need letters of recommendation.

>>44187736
That's even worse. They're throwing the kids into the middle of a warzone.
_
Not letters, but Masters will ask the instructors about the Initiates they're considering. Most of the time, they'll also watch the Initiate in class.

>>44187749
Is that any worse than hand picking your kid to throw into a war zone?

>>44187772
A bit, yes. Ideally, they wouldn't assign any of the actual commanders Padawans.

>>44187650
>Don't Jedi choose a Padawan to train on their own?
Eh that always seemed to be a thing that could be done. But not the only way.
If a Jedi comes across 2+ force sensitivities on a journey are they just going to leave all but one behind just because they can only personally have one padawan?

>>44187788
If that was the case, then why do the various other Corps get so many recruits?

No, they'd inform the Temple of the Force Sensitives and someone would come by to pick them up.

>>44187781
But I think pretty much all the masters are commanders at least to some extent. Of the top of my head Shaak Ti is the only major master I can think of who spends pretty much all of her appearances in a non-combat (but still military) assignment. And then Kamino gets attacked anyway. I guess you could have a transitional year or something where you work directly with Jedi Masters who are rotating away from the front, and then from there they could select from the students they meet to become their full padawan and join the fight. But change and adaptation have never seemed like the Jedi's strong point.

And another thing. Anakin was knighted because he slew Ventress, which counted as his trial of Skill. But he's a Knight in the CG series and Ventress is alive. What gives?

>>44187828
There were still a bunch of Jedi at the temple and serving in non-Combat roles.

Do you think Masters had to give The Talk to their Padawans or do you think that was something the Temple Instructors handled?

>tfw you will never lock s-foils in attack position

Why even live

>>44187858
Judging from Anakin's issues, I'm guessing they took the good ol' "Never Talk About Stuff Ever" approach.

>>44187858
I'm very certain there's smut of Anakin and Ahsohka that starts that way.

>>44187880
Nah, Jedi had casual sex all the time.

They probably should have marketed Jedi Academy separately from Jedi Knight. Not just because of the awkward title, but because the story is pretty separated.

>>44187906
Also, most of the guns are pretty redundant. Lightsaber handles everything.

>Computer in Echo Base kept recording flight Data
>Luke's X-Wing kept transmitting his flight path location

... Did the writers not watch Empire at all?

>>44187906
Eh, it's still got reborn, and Tavion's there. It is a bit disconnected feeling at first.

>>44187885
>I'm very certain there's smut of Anakin and Ahsohka that starts that way.
Going Against Destiny? It starts that way,then it turns into a full fledged AU.

So, Gen'Dai Sith, huh...Battlemeld?

Thinking about getting into X-wing.
What is a good starter? I am thinking about getting two of the core sets. Either one of each, 1 new 1 old, or 2 old. I havent really decided upon which faction, thinking about either empire or rebel.

>>44187957
The title is still awkward though.

Actually, the titles have been awkward since Dark Forces II.

Come on, I could have come up with better titles. In fact, I will.

>Star Wars Jedi Knight: Dark Forces II

Star Wars: Jedi Knight. Simple.

>Star Wars Jedi Knight: Mysteries of the Sith

Star Wars: Jedi Knight- Mysteries of the Sith. It's just an expansion pack.

>Star Wars Jedi Knight II: Jedi Outcast

Star Wars: Jedi Outcast. Once again, simple.

>Star Wars Jedi Knight: Jedi Academy

Star Wars: Jedi Academy. Again, Simple.

Alternatively, Star Wars: Praxeum. Because it sounds cool and it's simple.

Now you can call the entire series "The Katarn Saga."

Seriously, whoever came up with the original names was an idiot.

Gentlemen, does this list make me a bad man?

https://geordanr.github.io/xwing/?f=Rebel%20Alliance&d=v3!s!89:18,36,-1,126,1,127:-1:11:U.166;9:162,116,126,2,127:-1:-1:;9:162,126,116,2,127:-1:-1:

>>44188211
I haven't read it yet, but yes you're the worst.

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>>44187379

my character is a wookie robot furby.

>>44188218

Yeah, but this list isn't helping though right?

>>44188241

ignore him. he's bitter that the thing he loves the most is a children's toy brand. I'm sure the ennui eats at him every day.

>>44188241
I don't play X-Wing so I really have no idea anyway.

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I often roleplay as a droid filled with cold cream.

So I'm going to make an Epic game with friends next week and I wanted to play a Corvette.

Does this list make sense?

http://geordanr.github.io/xwing/?f=Rebel%20Alliance&d=v3!e!80:86,65,65,91,92,83:-1:-1:;81:29,65,90,66:-1:-1:;48:9,37,32:3:6:;44:44,-1,-1,-1:-1:-1:;44:44,-1,-1,-1:-1:-1:;44:44,-1,-1,-1:-1:-1:;44:44,-1,-1,-1:-1:-1:;66:27,26:-1:-1

Jan should stay close to the CR90 for a higher Pilotskill and the Extra Attack Die.
The 4 Bwings provide raw firepower instead of specialised fighters.
And the Z95 for a potential swarm.

>>44188211
Anon, you were a bad man to begin with. That list is merely a manifestation of your badnes.

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>>44188282

sometimes i roleplay that kylo ren is my dad and i beat him up for taking away my xbox.

This is not an Ad!. It's just a roleplaying discussion of a particular Traditional Game interest!

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>>44188294

Dude, you don't know happiness until you traditionally game as leia's lipstick. I hear it's available in stores, so even if you don't like roleplaying (GET OUT XD) then you can get it for your girlfriend or mom!

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>>44188308

In my settings, darth vader is a toaster. BUT NOT A SYLON XD, just a regular toaster. I don't know why, but traditionally gaming as a large man in a tight leather outfit who makes toast from his head is just so exhilarating.

>>44188336
>Sylon
it's Zyklon

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>>44188308
>leia's lipstick.
Wish I'd known about that yesterday, wifeu just about went thermonuclear when I wouldn't come out of the toy section because 'looking for gifts'

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>>44188336

I traditionally roleplay and game fully wrapped in permanent metal plates and droidized and loving it.

Do any of you fine anons know where i can get replacement sticks for X-wing bases? i managed to lose a whole 7 sticks and my only large ship one right now so a bit annoyed by all that.

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>>44188421

Try toys 'r us, it's your one stop shopping for defeating the evil forces of the sith!

This is me traditionally gaming as a normie, lol. THEY DON'T SUSPECT A THING, NOT EVEN THE POTION SELLER!.

>>44188421
You can get clear acrylic rods from most decent hobby stores, usually its about $5-7 for a metre of it.

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>>44188444

HEY MAN QUIT HATING ON STAR WARS. I TRADITIONAL GAME AS THE NICEST GUY UNTIL YOU CROSS ME THEN I'M A TWISTED PSYCHOPATH.

>>44188387
>not brazzers.jpg

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>Dead Brand
>Dead Thread

The Dark Side Won. Star Wars no longer exists.

>>44188769
It's not like crap like the toasters and fruit snacks didn't exist before Disney, it's just pervasive as fuck due to the movie. Once that comes out and the Twitteratti find some new fad to be OMG XD over it will fade at least till the next film approaches

>>44188030
Please halp

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>>44188917
Yeah for the next decade we will be hypersaturated in star wars merchandise until we choke. Not only that, but a movie per year until 2030.

Not sick of star wars and shameless commercialization? YOU WILL BE.

I say boycott star wars until they calm the fuckdown. Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter.

>>44188933
Don't waste your money on toys. Get a real hobby like rock climbing. You'll live longer.

>>44188942
>a movie per year until 2030.
I hate this so fucking much. I understand that Star Wars is a big money maker, but george didn't need a movie per year for his million millions.

Bleh, if I have learned anything from the current trends in videogames and super hero movies is that people love yearly releases and will waste their money accordingly, so this might be a good move despite being ridiculous as fuck.

>>44188030
Whatever came out latest. Shit's got massive power creep.

>>44189042
Bull fucking shit. Power creep is minor and wont hurt a kitchen table game. Ties are still strong, falcon is still strongest.

>>44188030
Do you have friends who will be playing with you, or just strangers at a lfgs?

>>44189019
Of course it's a good financial move. But it means that if star wars ever had a greater message other than corporate greed, it has been lost forever. Nothing that yoda says can undo what the franchise has done.

You can't promote a movie about good guys when you're objectively the greedy bad guys. What's ironic is how america is fighting terrorism while being unbelievably hyped to go watch a movie about terrorists. It's like how Fallout 4 is essentially a "Life in Syria" simulator.

>>44189042

Factually incorrect.

>>44189067
Shieet, I hadn't thought about it. But, it is true.

>>44188955
Where do you think you are?

>>44189065
>>44189072
>Implying cards from the latest releases aren't the sole reason old ships ever see use again
Whether it is a new crew member that came from whetever new big ship or a missile from a small ship or a title from a set of multiple little ships; there's no denying it that you need the LATEST cards to keep competitive.

Yeah, you're playing a tie, but are you playing the most up to date tie with the card that gives it additional health? Because MY 21 points are worth more than YOUR 21 points, since I bought the latest set!

POWER CREEP
O
W
E
R

C
R
E
E
P

>>44189067
>Rebels=Terrorists
>Star Wars makes money so is inherently evil
>one post

Damn are you going for shitposting bingo today?

>>44189192
Objectively, you're shitposting. I'm just making statements you disagree with. Try to handle it like an adult.

>>44189192
The Rebels ARE terrorists, tho.

Like, they blow up shit belonging to the legitimate government and terrorize legitimate citizens by bringing war to their doorsteps.

That they are the good guys in the narrative does not change this.

>>44189192
Are you saying that the levels of greed disney is showing would be categorized as good behavior in any of the movies they make? greed isn't evil, but it is a negative human vice, one that stems entirely from worshipping "Crude matter"

Someone who uses violence to further their means and are not a part of an officially recognized government are considered terrorists. This applies to the rebels from star wars, the haitian rebels, the american rebels, ISIS, etc etc.

Stop letting your movie-derived narratives get in way of seeing the bigger picture.

>>44189191
do you actually play, or are you armchair? Because besides the T-65, you are just simply wrong. Hell, the dash 58 special won worlds this year, and all of those cards are old. Han solo, with NO NEW CARDS is dominant still. Soontir fel with PTL and steath device is STILL STRONK. And dont you cry and say "but people use auto thrusters", because while thats true, its not remotely required. Some of the Best baron fels use TC to great effect.

Now TLT Y's are strong, and The tie advance was not good until the raider, I concede on those points, because thats what happened, but if you just buy the newest stuff then you are actually really crippling yourself. How often do you see K-wings and the scum k-fighter or the punisher? you are just either literally retarded or butt mad.

>>44189226
Having been around the /swg/ block those are pretty skubby topics. The making money thing I'll give you. But terrorism is acts designed to provoke fear for the purpose of political change. The rebels fight only military targets in the films and never kill any civilians or even fight in urban areas. The Empire on the other hand builds a giant super laser Death Star that has the actual stated purpose of causing terror to prevent revolt: "fear will keep the systems in line." The Tarkin Doctrine is literally terrorism in that it is spreading terror for the purpose of political change, namely stopping revolt and protest. Guerrilla tactics =/= terrorism.

tl;dr: fuck the rebels=terrorists nonsense. Also I need to rethink my life getting so mad about this

>>44189238
The legitimate government that blew up a fucking planet because they could?

>>44189296
>Argues it's not true
>Goes off on a tangent about how it is true
Kek kekkity kek.

Ahaha, Level 3 Force Lightning is awesome.

I encountered one of those cultist pairs and they died like bitches.

>>44189323
lol, there isnt NO powercreep, but it is far from massive power creep. You are intentionally miss informing people.

>>44189312
Yes, like every major power blew up civilian targets constantly during WWII just to pressure the opponents who owned them into giving up.

Again, just because they are bad guys in the narrative, does not change what they are.

>>44189348
You're right: every country in WWII was guilty of terrorism for deliberately targeting civilians to spread fear. Name one situation in which the rebel alliance does that.

>>44189304
>But terrorism is acts designed to provoke fear for the purpose of political change.
Which the rebels do. They attack what is essentially a peacekeeping force. Are we making the argument that The Galaxy is a peaceful place only made bad by the empire, or is the galaxy so full of scum and villainy that only the empire's fist can keep it in line?

>The rebels fight only military targets in the films and never kill any civilians or even fight in urban areas.
We can't objectively say that. We're only shown one side of the story. If a person on the rim joins the empire because they've seen what unregulated piracy can do to civilian populations, is it right to kill them because "they're the bad guys"?

>"fear will keep the systems in line."
So why don't you steal from banks? You just don't need the money? or you think that stealing the FDIC insured funds will hurt the people who put their money in?

Or will you admit that fear in one form or another is all that keeps humanity in line?

It's easy to see the rebels as good guys when we only see their side of the story. I'm sure someone could just as easily be an apologist for ISIS.

>>44189312
The legally elected ruling body, you mean?

Just because you don't like their policies does not give you carte blanche to kill their people.

>>44189364
They knowingly endangered everyone on alderaan by influencing their ruling body. Surely they didn't think they could hide behind the pretense of pacifism while aiding known criminals? That's not how laws work.

>>44189369
> If a person on the rim joins the empire because they've seen what unregulated piracy can do to civilian populations, is it right to kill them because "they're the bad guys"?
Heck! Luke Skywalker, the goodiest of good men in these movies, wanted to join the empire.

>>44189348
But Alderan was by your logic one of THEIR planets, being a member of the Galactic Senate.

If the Senator of Kansas somehow turned out to be an ISIS sympathizer, we wouldn't fire bomb the whole damn state.

>>44189396
Because they fight piracy and were probably the only thing keeping Tatooine out of the hands of the Hutts, which it certainly seemed to be before The Empire.

We don't even see any slaves in Mos Eisley. Now that's 20 years of progress. Does progress have a cost? Of fucking course, life is not perfect.

>>44189398
That's because kansas is not a sovereign body and there are solutions other than military involvement.

The better comparison would be Syria.

>>44189377
>legally elected
>has questionably constitutional emergency powers that were made permanent making the head of state unremovable
>last vestige of elected officials in the Senate, who were already less powerful than the directly appointed governors, are removed in the first 20 minutes of the original film.

I think you should send that North Korean-English dictionary back since I'm pretty sure that's not what "elected" means

>>44189398
Hwat? We have bombed towns just because terrorist leaders are alleged to be there.

Don't you watch the news?

>>44189409
>Because they fight piracy

>The Empire

Black Suns partnership was a thing

>>44189394
You know laws involve due process right? Not only is the entire population murdered for Bail's/Leia's personal involvement, but this is done by decree by Tarkin in a 5 minute scene with no trial or even charges made.

>>44189466
OUR laws, not theirs.

>>44189431
Everything about what palpatine did was in accordance with the republic's system of laws. It is not his fault that they were poorly conceived and that he was able to take power with something as simple as a proxy war.

>>44189442
We drone strike whole apartment buildings to get one guy without any respect to the pursuit of justice or law.

That's what makes the story of star wars so fucking ironic. Imagine being a syrian and hearing about star wars for the first time, your fucking head would explode.

>>44189369
>attack what is essentially a peacekeeping force

Lets put it this way. Lets say the Mayor of Los Angeles who support ISIS. If the U.S. acted as the Empire did, then they would proceed to nuke the whole city.

>We can't objectively say that.

Yes we can, because we're also assuming that the Empire cracks down on piracy in the Outer Rim, which it doesn't.

>"fear will keep the systems in line."

I don't steal from banks because I'm not an idiot or an asshole.

>>44189409
Tatooine is still controlled by the Hutts. And there were plenty of slaves there.

Look, we've had this discussion a bunch of times in these threads and the Imperial sympathizers always lose.

>>44189422
Well Syria is not a crater in the side of the planet and there are people still living there so it would be a particularly good comparison.

>>44189396
wait what was that the academy he was on about, I always presumed he meant a rebel academy

>>44189394
>They knowingly endangered everyone on alderaan by influencing their ruling body.
>That's not how laws work.
Laws aren't a genocidal nuclear laser. There is no shred of pretense rule of law before one man decided "eh, we'll just kill billions of people."

>>44189422
Alderaan is not a soveriegn body, it's a state in the empire that elected an Imperial Senator. It is identical to Kansas

>>44189466
Compare with Drone strikes.

There was probably a legal clause that allowed it, since it was a "Doctrine" and not "ad-hoc"

>>44189442
You're missing the point. We don't do that to our OWN states.
>>44189409
The empire explicitly uses slavery.

>>44189482
Empire has courts and laws Anon. In fact, a good portion of their laws are dedicated towards oppressing non-humans.

>>44189495
It was the Imperial Academy. He was going to do the same thing that his buddy Biggs did - join the academy to get off Tattooine, get a bit of training, then go AWOL.

>>44189511
>You're missing the point. We don't do that to our OWN states.

perhaps

but the US has some bizarre boner for "protecting the entire earth".

>>44187448
>>44187462
>>44187493
It's Starkiller Base, it can apparently cause a supernova anywhere and is built into the side of a real planet.


Let that scale sink in for a moment.

>>44189511
Because the US is not the bad guy in the narrative of life.

This does not make the rebels suddenly not terrorists attacking a legitimate government. It just makes them right in choosing their terrorist ways.

>>44189540
How many Bothans died so we could learn about THAT one?

>>44189540
Welp, there's goes all my goodwill for TFA.

I was hoping they wouldn't bring EU level bullshit into this.

>>44189488
>Lets put it this way. Lets say the Mayor of Los Angeles who support ISIS. If the U.S. acted as the Empire did, then they would proceed to nuke the whole city.
This analogy is never going to be cogent no matter how much you try. Nukes have wide ranging effects on other cities. Alderaan's debris field will never effect anything. Just stop.

>Yes we can, because we're also assuming that the Empire cracks down on piracy in the Outer Rim, which it doesn't.
Not from canon alone.

>I don't steal from banks because I'm not an idiot or an asshole.
Idiot? What's idiotic about free money? Asshole? Why? Do you think the banks would collapse at the loss of a few thousand dollars? Do you think the individual account owners would lose out when their money is federally insured?

You FEAR reprisal. You FEAR consequence. According to your logic, that's terrorism.

>Tatooine is still controlled by the Hutts. And there were plenty of slaves there.
We only see slaves in his private grotto. We do not see any other slaves, especially no child slaves like anakin was.

>Imperial sympathizers always lose.
No, your side just loses their cool and begins shrieking shitposting and trolling until we stop. That's the only way it has ever gone. Care to try something different today?

Huh, the Medium Style Flip Attack is pretty much an instant kill.

>>44189422
>Syria
Unless you mean Syria shooting its own citizens, The Galactic Senate is parliamentary Union formed through alliances., not a UN

The better comparison would be NATO members for the alliance aspects, the EU for raw political union, or any Parliament when the Galactic Senate was powerful. And Kansas is just fine for this distinction.

>>44189556
>not the bad guy in the narrative of life.

What? You really think terrorism has killed more people than the USA has in fighting terrorism?

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ALDERAAN WAS AN INSIDE JOB

>>44189511

When is it canonically shown that the empire uses slavery?

Please post the screenshot from the particular movie, i'm curious.

>>44189508
>Compare with Drone strikes
Drone Strikes are comparable with a weapon of mass destruction?

>>44189502
Legality is just an consensus agreement. Nothing more.

Palpatine made it legal via official channels.

>>44189600
When is it canonically shown that the rebels are committing a terrorist act?

Please post the screenshot from the particular movie, i'm curious.

>>44189604
It's only a tragedy when more than a certain amount of people die? Is that it?

>>44189613
>Legality is just an consensus agreement. Nothing more.
Tripe. Laws without consequences are just agreements, suggestions.

>>44189613
You know, the prequels made me realize how fucking stupid the canon version of the rebellion was.

If palpy took power through official channels, what the fuck prevented the senators from taking power back? Why was "let's start killing motherfuckers" their go to strategy?

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>>44189624
When they blow up a military installation of the legally appointed local government?

Look, AVALANCHE were terrorists, right? Why aren't the rebels?

Post your image, cunt.

>>44189638

No i mean what makes something legal or illegal is just a popularity contest. Why is women going topless outdoors illegal? Buncha people said so. That's it.

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>>44189624

>>44189643

Star Politics doesn't have quite the ring to it.

>>44189643
>If palpy took power through official channels, what the fuck prevented the senators from taking power back?

isnt it a roman empire analog?

Augustus didnt totally dissolve the senate n nobility. he just took the majority power.

if you got an emperor you really didnt like, the only thing you could do is...kill them. Like Carigula.

>>44189575
Fine, replace Nuke with MOAB. Either way, an entire city has been destroyed.

>Not from canon alone.
If we only look at things within the scope of the movie, then we ignore everything else. Either way, we don't see the Empire cracking down on Pirates.

>You FEAR reprisal. You FEAR consequence.

I don't FEAR either of those things. Going to jail is incredibly inconvenient for me, especially at this point in time. I'm not scared of it. I AM scared of getting mugged when I go out at night.

>We only see slaves in his private grotto. We do not see any other slaves, especially no child slaves like anakin was.
Note that any person walking on the street could be a slave. The implants are internal. As we cannot ascertain if a person is or isn't a slave just by looking at them, this point must be discarded.

>No, your side just loses their cool and begins shrieking shitposting and trolling until we stop. That's the only way it has ever gone. Care to try something different today?

I'm pretty sure one guy had a copypasta set up for whenever ImpSymps showed up because it was getting annoying.

>>44187948
In Jedi Academy?

He transmitted his flight plan before the invasion.

>>44189564
It may be a fake designed to lure people out, but given its sheer size that's a MASSIVE undertaking for a fake.

Unless it's some sort of fake micro-planet like in that shitty Crystal Star book.

>>44189643
The fact that once power is abdicated it's VERY hard to claim back when the central executive has a massive military.


>>44189644
Military targets are legitimate. This wasn't even on the level of bombing a barracks.

>>44189644
>>44189667

This is ISIS sinking a missile cruiser. That's the real world equivalent.

It's easy to call them bad guys when you live in the empire.

Check your privilege.

I sort of miss the TFA shitposts now

>>44189671
You mean The Clone Wars?

>>44189690
>Military targets are legitimate. This wasn't even on the level of bombing a barracks.

It's only legitimate when the attacking body is a recognized government.

Otherwise, it's terrorism. That's how our laws justify our actions. The Empire is no different.

>>44189644
>Blows up a target that is actively attacking them without even asking for surrender
>don't do it to spread fear, since it's self-defense and not planned

Let me guess, you think shooting down a fighter plane is "terrorism"?

>>44189695
No, it's Citizens of the United States sinking a Missile Cruiser. The big thing about the Alliance was the fact they were a REBELLION and made up largely of the citizens of the Empire itself. ISIS doesn't come anywhere into this analogy.

>>44189684
What the fuck was your argument again? I fear it has been sidetracked multiple posts ago.

The point was that the empire being evil does not mean the rebels aren't terrorists. Contrary to what you have been led to believe, "terrorist" does not mean "bad guy". Heck, the people who agree with the real life terrorists are 100% sure those guys are heroic, it's why they get new recruits.

The rebellion are terrorists trying to take out a legitimate, if corrupt, government who are the bad guys. That's it. I don't see why you're arguing it this hard.

>>44189728

Isis is a rebellion that wants to establish their own nation. They are fundamentally the same as the rebel alliance.

>>44189728
>>44189695
It's actually Citizens of the United States sinking a Missile Cruiser that blew up a City and is about to blow up their town.

>>44189745

Because using acts of violence to assert yourself is the cornerstone of American cultural identity.

>>44189728
But that still wouldn't be terrorism if this missile cruiser was attack him, it would just be blowing it up. Terrorism is doing it to spread fear, it's about motive. You can be a rebel without being a terrorist, just like you can be a "legitimate government" and be a terrorist.

>>44189724

Russia certainly feels that way about turkey stabbing them in the back.

>>44189728
You crazy, mang. The rebellion is not a legitimate government. They are not the equivalent of X government doing a thing. The rebellion is the equivalent of a group of citizens of various nations taking whatever action.

They have the backing of various planetary governments, originally being born from their representatives' frustrations, but they are not themselves a government.

>>44189775
Wasn't actively attacking them.

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So basically ITT

Lelouch/Zero vs Suzaku

you know from code geass

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>>44189628
Straw man.

Next you'll tell me how cancer is equivalent to the Holocaust because every number of deaths is equivalent, maudlin. Rwanda? Cambodia? Fuck that! America had Newtown, 9/11, and traffic accidents!

>>44189767

The whole fucking world would lose their shit if something as powerful as a missile cruiser was destroyed by isis.

>>44189793
I don't know why but the fact the one anime dude is holding a bottle of tequila made me snicker.

>>44189795
You wouldn't know integrity if it bit you on the ass.

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>>44189599
It was not an inside job. Alderaan shot first. The Death Star only fired in retaliation.

>>44189775
Didn't do it to spread terror even from the Russian "perspective." Your moral relativist argument is incorrect because it's not about good or bad it's about method and motive behind method.

>>44189795

...what?

Jeez man, you're completely out on a limb.

So what I'm gleaning from all this is...Vote for Trump because he is a space wizard

>>44189843

Isis's intent is to create an Islamic state. They do not attack to spread terror, and you cannot objectively prove that they do.

>>44189857
UNLIMITED POWAAAAAAAAAAAAA!

>>44189745
Terrorism's whole purpose is to cause fear. Hence the TERROR. When the Alliance destroyed the Death Star, they did so to prevent a corrupt government from continuing to blow up planets.

>>44189746
Except ISIS isn't made entirely of people who live in the U.S.

>>44189789
I never said it was. And it's the equivalent of Citizens from a bunch of different states in the U.S. coming together to take action. They would have the backing of various state governments.

>>44189793
>LelouchWasRight.jpg

>>44189857
Obviously, nothing can stump the trump.

Come ON, guys. ISIS is clearly the Yuuzhan Vong, get it together.

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>>44189878
>LelouchWasRight.jpg

I hope you're not implying the Zero Requiem was a good idea

it was the ravings of an insane lunatic who thinks his sister was dead and didnt want to live on the world anymore

>>44189871
And you can't objectively prove you're not a gigantic faggot.

>>44189878
>
>>44189871

>>44189871
>They do not attack to spread terror

Right, that's why they attacked Paris and San Bernardino and deliberately massacred civilians. NOT to create Terror.

the amount of times people typed the word terrorist and isis makes me think the fbi is monitoring this topic now

either that or I'm in the Smite game forum

>>44189828
>the quality of being honest and having strong moral principles; moral uprightness.
>"he is known to be a man of integrity"
Apparently integrity means I have to treat a traffic accident like it's a cultural genocide.

No. Both are tragedies. Human life is a tragedy. We don't give as much of a shit about a man who dies peacefully when his time is up than millions of people who are systematically slaughtered. What's the difference in these two extremes?

Drone strikes? I'm fine with you asserting they're fucked up. You can argue that they're morally reprehensible, even. The collateral damage is terribly fucking high. But they're not fucked up on the scale of The Khmer Rouge. Neither was 9/11, nor was Newtown.

>>44189924
Why do those countries bomb ISIS?

Did isis attack them first? Nope. It had nothing to do with france or the USA or anything.

>>44189871
Yes I can.

Their attacks on Paris and San Bernardino, as well as their videos of executing POW's are dedicated to demoralizing and terrifying the populace of the nations that oppose them. Fighting to create an Islamic state is what they're doing in Syria. The other stuff is terrorism.

>>44189940
>but i don't live in the evil empire, not at all.
>i just have to fear reprisal for thinking the wrong thoughts

This right here.

>>44189871
>They do not attack to spread terror, and you cannot objectively prove that they do.
Their entire media presence as publicity whores is designed to elicit terror to outsiders and love bombs to their supporters.

>>44189907
No, Lelouch was right in that Britannia had to be torn down. I wanted him to destroy it all and kill the Emperor. Sadly, we only got one of those things.

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>>44188664
>not brazzers.jpg
Nah, I usually throw this one up when I need to trigger some people

>>44188955
>Get a real hobby like rock climbing. You'll live longer.
As an qualified abseiling instructor I approve of this message, its a fun activity.

>>44189895
An oddly apt comparison.

>>44189973
Who spreads it? Them or the western media who wants people to be afraid so they'll keep tuning in and will support people like trump?

You know who benefits the most from "isis fears"? The Military Industrial Complex. Gee, maybe there's more to this whole thing. Maybe syria is just a proxy war fought by rebels who got ahold of the weapons of the last proxy war. Maybe they're just innocents in someone else's game after all.

>>44190001
It's all a hoax to get a tyrant in power!

ISIS IS THE CIS!

>>44189973

But when Russia or America shows their missiles obliterating towns, it's "Propaganda" to spread fear, right? It's not Terrorism because we call the shots?

>>44189955
Those countries were assisting the legitimate government of Syria in putting down an armed uprising.

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>>44190008

Not the first time it's worked, either. Countless times in history has this happened.

People are just too easily led by the nose by their narratives and moral absolutism.

>Spreading fear is terrorism.
That's a mighty unpatriotic thing to say. You might need more conditioning.

>>44190033
Syria's government is as legitimate as The Empire's.

Again, why is it their concern? What possible benefit does Syria's economy have on france?

>>44190035
>You're all sheep being lead by your narratives!
>You should follow MY narrative! It has Nazis!

>>44190001
>>44190014
Nah, that's a form of terrorism too.

I'm not arguing that America isn't pretty terrible. I'm arguing that the Alliance to Restore the Republic is not composed of terrorists.

>>44190049

It's amazing you typed that considering how you're functionally illiterate.

Would the Jedi allow the existence of a small group of non-jedi light side force users? Perhaps something like the Dark Side Adept, who uses the dark side but is not a Sith, only a Light Side Adept or something. Perhaps a small unit of elite Republic soldiers who utilize the force in combat, but care little for the philosophy behind it? I assume the Jedi wouldn't care too much, but they seem to like being in control...

>>44190046
If Syria is the Empire in this instance, then ISIL still isn't the Rebellion, it's the CIS. The Rebellion never once resorted to "terrorism" whereas the CIS has done so many times.

>>44190066
The old EU had various groups of force users that were in good terms with the Jedi.

>>44190055
Terrorist is a term that only evil empires use. If the Empire wasn't a Britain Expy, they'd call the Rebels Terrorists, since the two are synonymous. So the Empire, at least, would see them as terrorists. Considering most people live in the empire, most people would see them as terrorists.

Would you join ISIS? America doesn't even have a superlaser and everyone knows how pointless it'd be to try and fight NATO.

It only works in star wars because it's a movie for children who are incapable of thinking beyond black and white morality.

Adults should really be more capable than that, imo.

>>44190066
They do.

There's dozens of them in Legends, and in canon we even have the Dagoyan Masters, light side users who are completely non-violent, using the Force only for visions.

>>44190001
>Who spreads it? Them or the western media who wants people to be afraid so they'll keep tuning in and will support people like trump?
So you're fine with censoring the news about bad people because the gullible will get skittish?

Anything's okay as long as it stops the crazy Military-Industrial Complex from happening. Gosh.

>You know who benefits the most from "isis fears"?
Seems to me that the media gets the most ratings out of that shit. The MIC doesn't get shit from trying to shoot up dirt farmers since it's already supplied the actual armies, while rebels have a particularly nasty habit of having financial difficulties. COIN isn't as expensive as mechanized warfare. Why not aim for another land war in Europe?

>>44190085

Nato is the empire. Syria would be some random world in the empire and would represent whatever the first conflict between the rebels and the empire was.

>>44190059
I don't subscribe to your narrative of me being ruled by narratives.

>>44190094
Yeah, fuck Star Wars, I don't even know why I like this baby movie for babies.

ALLAHU ACKBAR!

>>44190094
>Considering most people live in the empire, most people would see them as terrorists.

Yeah, that's totally why planets throughout the Empire celebrated when the Emperor was killed. The Empire was not held in a popular light by a large number of its citizens.

>It only works in star wars because it's a movie for children who are incapable of thinking beyond black and white morality.
>Adults should really be more capable than that, imo.

I don't give a shit about your opinion, I'm arguing a point.

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>>44187885
>You are an intrepid investigative journalist on Corescant
>Looking into shadowy, lurid rumors regarding the Jedi Temple
>You are strangely allowed full access sans secure vaults and classified war docs
>One night you are in the provided guest chambers
>You hear strange sounds coming from down the hall
>You investigate, grabbing your database and night attire
>You peek into a dormitory
>Two Jedi going at it like kath hounds in heat
>They pause, you gasp as they notice you
>They give you that look
>You are pulled into the room with a strong invisible force, the door sealing behind you
>...
>The next morning, you return to your offices, sore and satisfied but with nothing to report

bueno

>>44190107
>So you're fine with censoring the news about bad people because the gullible will get skittish?

Then you're asking for a double standard. When america shows video and images of the results of their bombing campaigns, they do so to drive home the fear of fucking with that kind of power.

You're essentially leaning on the notion that terrorism is something that only non-governments can do. You're refuging in semantics.

>acting like the iraq war, the cause of isis, did not have popular approval at the time, due to the intentional spread of propaganda like "they hate our freedoms and want us all dead"

Is your memory that hazy?

>>44187379
It just occured to me

There's literally no picture of Luke on this at ALL

what does it mean?

>>44190114
Because you are blind to them. You can't see the air you breathe either.

>Yeah, that's totally why planets throughout the Empire celebrated when the Emperor was killed. The Empire was not held in a popular light by a large number of its citizens.
Oh, you mean the scenes added to the post 9/11 Special Editions?

Gee. One wonders why.

>>44190151

bait and switch meant to drive up advertising through forums like this one.

Every single thing you hear about or read about star wars was engineered to sell more tickets and toys. Nobody in the production actually cares. They're actors, they're paid to act.

>>44190151
Mark Hamill is actually one of the Stormtroopers.

No he's not.

>>44190164
Irrelevant. The Empire was held in a negative light by its citizens.

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>>44190014
>But when Russia or America shows their missiles obliterating towns, it's "Propaganda" to spread fear, right?
Aside from the point that the US doesn't use that method of intimidation and propaganda often, they have other ways to intimidate and propagandize, sure.

>propaganda to spread fear
How retarded are you? That's exactly what I'm saying ISIS is doing. Revolutions and terrorism incorporate propaganda elements. Are you about to say burning a Jordanian pilot in a metal cage on live television isn't propaganda?

>>44190183
Well whatever, also is that ANOTHER fucking Deathstar in the background?

>>44190066
In the EU there were Imperial Knights, among others

>>44190187
>Irrelevant. The Empire was held in a negative light by its citizens.

Everyone hates their government or has some petty grievance with it. What else is new?

>>44190183
>Every single thing you hear about or read about star wars was engineered to sell more tickets and toys.

I can't remember the last Star Wars related thing that I bought.

No, wait, it was KOTOR. That was fun.

>>44190202
Nope, it's the lovechild of the Death Star and the Suncrusher.

>>44190164
>Added to the post 9/11 special editions

They were released in 97, you dumbass.

>>44190213
>Nope, it's the lovechild of the Death Star and the Suncrusher.

God fucking damn it, you'd think they'd have learned. I really didn't expect another dumb superweapon.

>>44190208
It's the equivalent of the State Governments setting up celebrations upon hearing the President and Congress were killed and a large portion of the Navy was destroyed.

That's how much the Empire was hated.

Admittedly, plenty of people would set up celebrations if Congress was killed today.

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>>44190197
>Aside from the point that the US doesn't use that method of intimidation and propaganda often, they have other ways to intimidate and propagandize, sure.

24 hour news isn't often enough for you? Blowing people up with a remote control airplane from thousands of miles away isn't intimidating?

>How retarded are you? That's exactly what I'm saying ISIS is doing. Revolutions and terrorism incorporate propaganda elements. Are you about to say burning a Jordanian pilot in a metal cage on live television isn't propaganda?

Why is it bad when isis does it but just normal routine when america does it?

I'm going to let you in on a little secret. Despite their posturing, American soldiers and ISIS terrorists are the same species. There is no difference when it comes down to it.

They are merely portrayed differently to get people to take a side.

>>44190241
Yep. Destroyed all my hopes for the movie.

>>44190272
>Despite their posturing, American soldiers and ISIS terrorists are the same species.

Well, yes, we're all human.

>>44190241
What is their obsession with planet shaped super weapons anyways? Like you know that there were 2 before them and they got fucked over.
And those were held by the top dog. Fuck you can even argue that the Death Star was more a weapon of terror to control the population rather than a practical weapon of war.

So you had the people who had most of the power, the bigger military, the bigger resource supply and had 2 Death Stars and they lose because of said Death Stars. What do you learn from this? Well clearly the Death Star wasn't big enough and that's why they lost.
The Death Star already had enough logistics problems, why not make them worse?

>>44190215
My bad i thought the celebration scenes were from the 2004 release.


>>44190271
>It's the equivalent of the State Governments setting up celebrations upon hearing the President and Congress were killed and a large portion of the Navy was destroyed.
It really does show how completely the star wars universe is disconnected from any sort of reality. I cannot fathom anything like that ever happening.

And we both know that those scenes are among the the worst canon CHANGES in star wars.

>>44190312
But Anon, planets don't have exhaust ports, there's no way this can fail!

>>44190302

But see, we pretend that what ISIS is doing is fundamentally different from what world governments do on a daily basis.

The entirety of the difference between ISIS's actions and NATO's is that a piece of paper says it's alright for NATO.

"I will make it legal" indeed.

>>44190144
>Then you're asking for a double standard. When america shows video and images of the results of their bombing campaigns, they do so to drive home the fear of fucking with that kind of power.
MESS WITH THE BEST, DIE LIKE THE REST OORAH. FUCK YEAH, MURRICCAAAAAAA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XYFdldfYEJk

What are you bitching about, exactly, besides some attention deficit disorder tier rhetoric trying to slutshame me because I'm apparently making double standards?

You want to say the US intimidates and delivers propaganda? Go right ahead. You're not wrong.

>You're essentially leaning on the notion that terrorism is something that only non-governments can do. You're refuging in semantics.
You really love shitting in my mouth, don't you.

>>acting like the iraq war, the cause of isis, did not have popular approval at the time, due to the intentional spread of propaganda like "they hate our freedoms and want us all dead"
Oh I can shit in your mouth too. So what you're saying is, America put movies of the first Gulf War on television to "drive home the fear of fucking with that kind of power" to cause the American people to fear that the US was going to bomb them, so they agreed that Iraq must be bombed?

Are you about to say that I didn't support the Iraq War too and that I still believe that the information wasn't right? That I don't believe the effort to push that shit as fact wasn't propaganda too?

Oh my, you seem to be living in 2003 listening to Green Day while bitching about your moto neighbor with a giant picture of Bush on his wall across the hall. How sad.

Do you seriously think you're just talking to one person the entire time too?

>>44190312
What's Star Trek's obsession with big saucer ships, warp drives, and tachyon anti-matter dispersion array technobabble?

Big planet-sized doomsday weapons are Star-Wars' shick. Right up there with WW 2 style 1-man fighter ships, good guys using rusted, dingy equipment, and space magic.

>>44190321
>It really does show how completely the star wars universe is disconnected from any sort of reality

How so? When corrupt governments that oppress the people fall, the people usually celebrate. This has happened many times throughout human history.

Oh, and the analogy that I gave was just for the political equivalent. This would be the same United States that nuked one of its own cities and burns its people alive.

>>44190338
Well, most governments don't execute POW's.

But yeah, we live in a very imperfect world. Big whoop.

>>44190338
And that NATO actually cares about the public backlash if it were to waltz into a country and destroy all the archeological history. The whole (pretend) separation of religious fervor and government has a lot to do with it.

>>44190338
>But see, we pretend that what ISIS is doing is fundamentally different from what world governments do on a daily basis.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LxubQBkLWyY
That's cool. I'm glad we're on the same page. Here, I'll start the mood while you prepare a nasheed that supports liberal democracy, secularism, and tolerance of other faiths. It's all bullshit the fudds eat up like candy anyways.

>>44190362
The equivalence is more like the borg cube suddenly needing to be everywhere. those are more like wedge ships, hyperdrives and blasters, which nobody is complaining about.

>>44190348
>What are you bitching about, exactly, besides some attention deficit disorder tier rhetoric trying to slutshame me because I'm apparently making double standards?
Basically just that Fighting ISIS while Loving Star Wars shows the immense and disastrously dangerous level of compartmentalism present in most world citizens today.

>You really love shitting in my mouth, don't you.
You're ejaculating the stuff everywhere, i'm just shoving it back down your throat.

>Oh I can shit in your mouth too. So what you're saying is, America put movies of the first Gulf War on television to "drive home the fear of fucking with that kind of power" to cause the American people to fear that the US was going to bomb them, so they agreed that Iraq must be bombed?
No, that was mostly just to justify the immense spending involved. Americans love knowing how strong they are.

>Do you seriously think you're just talking to one person the entire time too?
There's very little difference between people. It's not my fault you all sound the same.

>>44190362
And sword fights with awesome but impractical weapons.

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>all this war and rebellion talk
>mfw just a simple pirate making his way in the galaxy

All for profit with a hint of a golden heart.

>>44190423
I really don't know how he could ever find Aurra Sing attractive.

Speaking of Aurra Sing, did you know that she used to be a Padawan?

>>44190376
>How so? When corrupt governments that oppress the people fall, the people usually celebrate. This has happened many times throughout human history.

Oh yeah, people on coruscant living in opulent luxury sure were oppressed. People on Naboo living on their utopian palace world were certainly oppressed. The only people celebrating on tatooine were the slave traders and criminals.

If anything, the empire falling would have had tremendous effects on the economy. Nobody would celebrate that.

>Oh, and the analogy that I gave was just for the political equivalent. This would be the same United States that nuked one of its own cities and burns its people alive.
Nukes have fallout. I'd say you should try to think of a cogent analogy, but frankly one is not possible.

>>44190395
>And that NATO actually cares about the public backlash if it were to waltz into a country and destroy all the archeological history. The whole (pretend) separation of religious fervor and government has a lot to do with it.

Since when do "Good guys" care more about dusty pottery fragments than people? That's an Empire excuse.

>>44190414
Even so, this is only the third planet-sized super weapon in nuCanon Star Wars. Third times a charm.

I have a feeling this one won't be destroyed during the course of 1 movie.

>>44190401
Oh we're posting videos of liberal democracies that value justice and due process?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rXPrfnU3G0

>>44190459
Have you SEEN Weequay women my friend?! There's one in the back right now!

>>44190459
His standards of beauty are different. Just look at his face!

>>44190466
Hey, I outlined the MOAB thing as well. You just ignored it.

>people on coruscant living in opulent luxury sure were oppressed.

Many of the non-humans, yes.

>People on Naboo living on their utopian palace world were certainly oppressed.

Considering the Empire killed their Queen and instituted a police state? Yes.

>>44190472

It'll be revealed at the end of the first movie. The final battle, after black jedi dies, will be them over that ice world and then the ice world cracks open to reveal a new death star DUN DUN DUN NEXT MOVIE MORE MONEY PLZ.

Can we please get back on topic of Star Wars, and leave out te socio-economic political bullshit of the middile east? Science Fantasy exists because the worls fucking sucks, and we like the escapism of fiction.

What's everyone think of the Imperial Veterans box for X-Wing?

>>44190497
>>44190492
True, but come on, Aurra Sing? Why not go for a Twi'Lek at least?

>>44190528
It's neat, we'll probably get one for the Rebels next as well. People still mad the T-65 isn't the best ship.

>>44190534
I dunno, Aurra Sing is attractive to me. But she's no Ventress.

>>44190510
>Hey, I outlined the MOAB thing as well. You just ignored it.
I'm trying to keep up with all of it.

You have to give up the notion that the empire is like america. The empire is like nato. The countries in it really don't give a shit about the people in the other countries.,

>Many of the non-humans, yes.
Gonna have to back that up.

>Considering the Empire killed their Queen and instituted a police state? Yes.
Amidala died from a broken heart caused by anakin and one of their chancellors became the supreme ruler of the republic. You know how much money palps probably funneled to his old home?

>>44190528
So very stoked. I'm going to put in a preorder for it at my FLGS as soon as I can get in. Might even buy two, although I don't really need four defenders.

>>44190528

If you want stories tailored for children then stick to my little pony.

>>44190528
Hyped as hell. I fly the defender a lot and also lose a lot. I like to fly them in a pack of 2 vanilla along side something else. They're great all around, just a little point inefficient. Now there's an upgrade for that basically made for me. Cheaper and gives evades out like candy.

>>44190510
Had any of the locations shown been displayed in a state of disrepair or strife, you would be correct.

But they look identical to how they did 20 years prior to the empire.

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>>44190459
>Aurra Sing attractive.
I think she's kind of cute out of the goth-girl makeup

>>44190599
I mean shit, what kind of free non-political broadcasting network even got the word out as far as the rim? Clearly if that could exist in the empire says a lot about how oppressed they actually were. A decent empire would have spun that shit and not allowed any pirate hijacking or galaxy-wide broadcasts. Just the emperor died, not their entire command structure.

It's a stupid movie with child-level black and white morality. The Special Editions just make it worse.

>>44190415
>Basically just that Fighting ISIS while Loving Star Wars shows how triggered I am when people watch movies and enjoy them
Morality is a 24/7 activity, friend. Walk in peace.

>You're ejaculating the stuff everywhere, i'm just shoving it back down your throat.
For somebody who I was entirely reactive to, you seem to be awfully concerned with how proactively ejaculatory I am. It's a great thing to love the taste of someone else's reflavored spunk.

I still don't quite get it, it seems as though you don't really notice me leaving my droppings around, but you do think my semen is Star Wars. That's frankly pretty awesome.

>>Do you seriously think you're just talking to one person the entire time too?
>I consider everyone who disagrees with me irrelevant and the victims of herd mentality because it happened in 2002
Well we got that out of the way.

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Gonna be a spoiler-coward for the next few weeks, but I'll be back after I watch TFA. In the meantime, I hope you guys have a Merry Christmas.

>>44190558
You're right about the NATO analogy I suppose.

>Back that up
Are we still sticking with the Movies only? If so, then we should just outline the crimes the Empire committed on screen. IE, Burning Farmers alive, Arresting a Government Official and Torturing her, murdering Jawas, blowing up a planet and armed invasion of a neutral state.

>>44190486
You're talking about Due Process but praising the leak of confidential evidence from the JAG investigation of the Pilot and gunner in that case?

>>44190661
>cookies from Daddy
d'aw

Have a good Life Day, dude.

>>44190486
>Oh we're posting videos of liberal democracies that value justice and due process?
Yeah, sure.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YAfHigPsC_s

>Collateral Murder
Old, hyped, Assange is so overrated.

>>44190658

Wew lad, trying your best i see? You should go back to /sci/ and learn to troll better.

>>44190643
Then why are you here?

>>44190685
Oh that's where it came from?

PFFFFT.

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>>44190702
Right back at you Spunkmaster Fresh.

>>44190668

Murdering Jawas AND framing the attacks as Sand People attacks to try and disguise their hunting down the Death Star plans.

>>44190685
I'm saying that neither side has any claim to that particular horse.

>>44190668
So, killing two people who aided known criminals, Legal.
Arresting a known seditious element, Legal.
Torturing her, Legal.
Murdering thieves and scavengers living outside the protection of the law, Legal.
Blowing up a known supporter of a terrorist group while hiding behind the pretense of pacifism. Legal.

And that's just by NATO law. I'm sure the Empire is a whole lot more draconian.

>armed invasion of a neutral state.
When does that happen?

While the rebellion kills literally millions of enlisted people who likely only enlisted to improve their lives or the lives of their families through their pensions.

I can't morally side with the rebellion on this one. When i look at the denizens of the galaxy in star wars, i have to assume that the empire may be a necessary evil.

>>44190558
Actually, you know what? I'm done discussing this with you. I'm here to talk about the fun stuff about Star Wars, not get into a law/ethics/canonicity debate. This is boring, and I'm tired and my brain keeps on looping the awesome combo I just pulled in Jedi Academy. So, good night to you.

>>44190685
Apparently due process isn't due process if people don't feel the care.

On one hand someone abhors Hollywood reality, but then on the other hand they demand the utmost in all convictions related to their affairs. To do otherwise means that due process is a sham, not the fact that the institution is regularly applied.

>>44190712

A discussion involves all viewpoints.

You're thinking of a circle-jerk.

>>44190785
>I can't morally side with the rebellion on this one. When i look at the denizens of the galaxy in star wars, i have to assume that the empire may be a necessary evil.
Well it's great that you actually put your position on the table after pages of playing pin the tail on the puckered asshole.

>>44190787

Attention spans are at a historical low. I can't fault you entirely.

>>44190597
Yeah, I'm digging that x7 Title! I like that if you don't plan on running cannons or missiles, you'll get a bonus for that. It's kinda like the A-Wing Chaardan.

Flechette Tie/Ds look fun, tol. 32pts for a double-tap stress inducer isn't that shabby.

>>44189690

I'm sorry but no. The Death Star was a warship, and had been used to blow up not one, but two separate planets in state sponsored terrorism incidents. Anyone who was still onboard by the time of Yavin was fully complicit in those war crimes. You will not find any variant of the rules of war that suggest that blowing up a warship of a government that your government is at war with is a war crime.

>>44190814

I await your continued personal attacks in lieu of actual discussion.

>>44190832

So the nuclear bombardment of the civilian cities of hiroshima and nagasaki was an act of terrorism and the united states deserves any and all attacks on its soil for the rest of its existence?

>>44190832

The rebels are not a recognized legal entity. They have no right to attack a military target any more than you or i.

>>44190785
>Killing two people who aided known criminals, Legal.
They didn't aid known criminals. They bought some droids.

>Arresting a known seditious element, Legal.
Acknowledged.

>Torture
Legal by the Empire's Laws. Not Legal by ours.

>Murdering thieves and scavengers living outside the protection of the law, Legal.
Jawas are legitimate traders.

>Blowing up a known supporter of a terrorist group while hiding behind the pretense of pacifism. Legal.
Blowing up a SUSPECTED supporter. And their family, friends, neighbors, house, city, country, ecosystem, biosphere, etc. Genocide isn't legal.

>armed invasion of a neutral state.
Cloud City. Calrissian made a deal with the Empire to keep them out of the City's affairs. The Empire reneged on the deal and invaded.

>While the rebellion kills literally millions of enlisted people who likely only enlisted to improve their lives or the lives of their families through their pensions.

While the Empire kills literally Billions of civilians who were no even guilty by association.

>>44190528
>What's everyone think of the Imperial Veterans box for X-Wing?

wait what I thought that was a joke

>>44190685
>>44190727
If it's the video I'm thinking of, Newscasters with over-the-shoulder cameras got gunned down because the gunner saw the cameraman hefting an object over his shoulder and decided to fire first.

>>44190832
Those were factories, not mere financiers

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Well, I didn't want to do this, but it's obvious I won't get anything out of this thread. Whether this is outsiders shitting it up because the movie is coming soon or you guys are too obnoxious to keep your politics out of your fun science-fantasy settings, I have no idea. Either way, this thread is too stupid for me to keep reading.

Fuck all of you who feel the need to be obnoxious in this thread. See you on the other side of the TFA release.

>>44190800
>A discussion involves all viewpoints

True. I still don't understand why someone who clearly doesn't like the topic would interact with it.

>>44190819
And it's an Internet Argument and is ultimately worthless, therefore I have no real motivation to continue to participate. And I have a Final in the morning.

>>44190898

It's certainly a more legitimate government then the Empire, who's chief of state deliberately overstayed his term of office, orchestrated multiple galaxy wide wars to increase his power, declared himself emperor for life, and routinely orders his forces to commit atrocities against innocent civilians because they're not cheering the jackboot on their head loud enough.

>>44190915
>They didn't aid known criminals. They bought some droids.

How were the stormtroopers supposed to know? All they knew was that these people had the droids but then secreted them away. I bet they refused to say where luke had gone with them and that was all the legal justification they needed. Harboring State Secrets gets you fucking killed.

>Legal by the Empire's Laws. Not Legal by ours.
Nobody's been held accountable yet. What good is the law if it's not enforced?

>Jawas are legitimate traders.
I don't think that even the Lars' considered that true. they saw them as scavengers.

>Blowing up a SUSPECTED supporter.
Having the crown princess gloat about being a being a rebel is pretty good evidence.

>Cloud City. Calrissian made a deal with the Empire to keep them out of the City's affairs. The Empire reneged on the deal and invaded.
It exercised its legal authority to supplant the local authority. Military trumps Police too.
The only thing that they reneged on was the promise that han and them wouldn't be harmed. The troops were there from the getgo.

>While the Empire kills literally Billions of civilians who were no even guilty by association.
We've no idea how small the population of alderaan was. The people on the death star weren't deemed guilty by association as well? If not for the force and the plot, luke skywalker would have been an imperial pilot. How many good people were lost?

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>>44190556
>I dunno, Aurra Sing is attractive to me. But she's no Ventress.

This guy gets it

Howsabout a TIE that is designed to act as a small-scale fleet co-ordinator? It's basically a Lander that was turned upside-down the and the troop bay now acts as a Command deck.

>>44190970
Finals? What school?

>>44190978
>It's certainly a more legitimate government

Palpatine did everything legally if unethically. The Rebellion are just a bunch of thugs.

>>44191031
TIE shuttle. Its even going to be in X-wing.

>>44190800
A discussion that ends up destroying an otherwise childish topic isn't always a good discussion.

This is the shit tier logic that helps demand racial diversity quotas in movies. Apparently trying to not talk about every issue of the day means you're compartmentalizing. Not fighting propaganda means you're a shill. Not talking about the supposed horrors of mistaken identity in Collateral Murder, a military investigation, is apparently sin because it tangentally relates a fucking movie people are talking about. Those aren't necessarily one person's talking points in this conversation, but hoooly shit those devices intended to prove a person's point to be valid in a Star Wars conversation are a waste of time.

This conversation doesn't need to be either a circlejerk, nor a moral imperative.

Somebody wants to say they support the Empire? Go the fuck ahead, /k/ will literally back them. They can even make some assertions about why they're right involving Collateral Murder and how the MIC is bad. But taking a fucking hour to meander through the logic of necessary evil while somebody else gets close to painting everyone who doesn't quite agree with them as an implicit Bush supporter is no goddamn fun. Someone disagrees with the notion? SHOCK. THEY HAVE NO INTEGRITY.

Integrity. In a fucking Star Wars conversation?

Prattling about a work of George Lucas demands integrity all of the sudden? Did I accidentally walk into one of Wagner's epics or Tchaikovsky when I wasn't looking?

Get to your fucking soapbox points sooner, and for fucks sakes don't eeyore when people don't take it seriously. I've legitimately met Communists who were more casual about the American class struggle than you.

>>44191031
I feel like coordination and command craft should be big, burly and defensible. Hence why Victories and ISDs get the job over smaller craft. You don't want your command boat blown up by a single fighter, after all.

>>44191084

So you're literally just here to discuss toys?

>>44191017

>We've no idea how small the population of alderaan was. The people on the death star weren't deemed guilty by association as well? If not for the force and the plot, luke skywalker would have been an imperial pilot. How many good people were lost?

Alderaan's population was 2 billion civilians at the time of the Genocide, which seems rather small for a core planet, but whatever.

The Death Star has a crew of below half a million, all of whom were military personnel. And frankly, they should have risen up and strung Tarkin by the neck when he ordered them to destroy a planet. That they didn't means they're just as complicit in his war crimes.

>>44190917
Nope, check FFG's news!

>>44191106
Canonical source please. Show us the screenshot of the arabic numbers in star wars.

>>44191106
How many windows did that thing have? IIRC, the gunner and a few gossips on the station were the only ones beside the commanders that knew they actually blew up a planet. If the command staff never issued a "we just blew up a planet" briefing to the crew, there would definitely be troopers onboard who had no idea their station just killed Alderaan.

>>44190833
If you didn't notice, there was actually a legitimate argument there. You and/or some others took too long to explain what your position actually was. You didn't put your entire position on the table and abused that to make some fairly mediocre shots.

>>44191105
>This conversation doesn't need to be either a circlejerk, nor a moral imperative.

>>44191129
>Alderaan's population is never physically shown, therefore the Death Star did not kill anyone when it blew up
>Approx 134 troopers, officers, and extras are shown over the course of Death Star scenes in ANH, therefore Luke killed 134 people.
Rebels are the real villains.

>>44191103
fair point.
>>44191079
I did not know this.

>>44191168
If we include the CGI edits, would the entire room of Stormtroopers that Luke and Han run into still count?

>>44191106

just like the us military should have rebelled when ordered to attack iraq?

or do people not see people from other countries as people?

The reason the empire is evil is because it's an almost entirely human run enterprise.

>>44191031
That seems like a poor role for ANY TIE variant.
>>44191031
>>44191079
>>44191190
It's not exactly SUPPOSED to serve that role, it's just the role it gets in the FFG X_Wing game.

>>44191129
>Canon
I'm pretty sure even the new canon variants have SOMETHING about the numbers, but the new canon doesn't really interest me so I wouldn't know.

>>44191197
I was just making up a number to be facetious.

>>44191168
Still more than we're shown of aldraan. we never even see it from anything other than space. there could be only a few thousand there.

I mean, if there was anything of value, someone would have tried to take it, and they would have had a military to stop it.

Pacifism and having nice things don't go together.

>>44191168
At this point I'm not sure if the imp sympathizers are trying to prove America is just as bad as the Galaxy-spanning dictatorship Empire or if the Empire is some kind of necessary evil acting to provide a "stability" that is never shown in the movies. Either way it's pretty retarded.

>>44191253

More like the actions of the empire are a requisite of such a large hegemony.

>>44191221
>>The reason the empire is evil is because it's an almost entirely human run enterprise.
>Humanity (A) runs the Empire (B)
>Empire(B) does evil (C)
>therefore, Humans (A) are evil(C)
And for our next topic, we shall ask if Humanity is inherently evil or not.

>>44191221
MUH POST-9/11 LENS EVERYTHING IS SHADES OF GREY

Ok I think Iraq was a massive mistake and violation of International Law that has led directly to the regional instability, and I still think you're a shit head. Lighten up and enjoy something

>44191238
Still a legitimate moral imperative to find out. Otherwise you're compartmentalizing.

>>44191017
>How were the stormtroopers supposed to know? All they knew was that these people had the droids but then secreted them away. I bet they refused to say where luke had gone with them and that was all the legal justification they needed. Harboring State Secrets gets you fucking killed.

You don't know ANY of that. All we know is that two people were murdered by the Empire when they hadn't committed a crime.

>Nobody's been held accountable yet. What good is the law if it's not enforced?

Then this entire discussion is moot. For all we know, Imperial Stormtroopers have the full authority of the Empire to carry out executions for any crime and torture, rape and genocide are legal.

>Jawas

Salvaging is legal. Or is it? Who knows? Certainly not you.

>Alderaan

Which is enough to arrest her and perhaps her friends and family. Not kill everyone on the planet.

>Cloud City
Yes, they still invaded, which is "wrong". Leaving a garrison behind was not part of the deal Vader made.

>We've no idea how small the population of alderaan was. The people on the death star weren't deemed guilty by association as well? If not for the force and the plot, luke skywalker would have been an imperial pilot. How many good people were lost?

NuCanon says 2 Billion. Most of which were civilians and had nothing to do with the Rebels. Comparatively, the Death Star is a military ship and the soldiers who joined the military know that their lives may be in danger.

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>>44191264
But then you could argue that the Empire's tyrannical attempts at control are exactly what causes the revolting, leading to exactly the instability they are ostensibly trying to preven-
And just like that you bring me back in

>>44191264
And yet the Republic functioned just fine WITHOUT annihilating planets.

>>44191306
>You don't know ANY of that. All we know is that two people were murdered by the Empire when they hadn't committed a crime.
We know they had orders to find the droids. We know they tracked them to the jawas and then to the lars homestead. We can assume that the lars' have an anti-empire leaning due to the fact that they're harboring luke. You don't see it as likely that they would have told the stormtroopers nothing, and that the troopers wouldn't be justified in killing them for withholding critical state secrets? People get gunned down for less irl all the time.

>Then this entire discussion is moot. For all we know, Imperial Stormtroopers have the full authority of the Empire to carry out executions for any crime and torture, rape and genocide are legal.
Just like IRL. The winners decide what is right.

>Salvaging is legal. Or is it? Who knows? Certainly not you.
I'm just going by the way the lars' did not seem to take the jawas very seriously at all.

>Which is enough to arrest her and perhaps her friends and family. Not kill everyone on the planet.
Tarkin Doctrine. aka Zero Tolerance. You know how many lives those laws ruin IRL?

>Yes, they still invaded, which is "wrong". Leaving a garrison behind was not part of the deal Vader made.
They didn't invade shit. Darth Vader asked to stay over for a bit, and lando, knowing what side of his bread is buttered, did not refuse.

>NuCanon says 2 Billion.
Where?

>Most of which were civilians and had nothing to do with the Rebels.
Gee then their leadership really let them down by getting them involved with that. You'd think intelligent pacifists wouldn't support known criminals.

This is all without even mentioning that the only story we see is heavily weighted to one side.

>>44191017
>Nobody's been held accountable yet. What good is the law if it's not enforced?

This right here is what convinces me you're a troll and that nothing you post should be given any kind of consideration. I regret trying to have a discussion with you.

>>44191035
Not telling you.

>>44191322
People never know what's good for them. If you gave people free reign they'd vote away taxes until there was no money for anything.

Basically, you're supporting this town's actions.
http://arstechnica.com/science/2015/12/north-carolina-citizenry-defeat-pernicious-big-solar-plan-to-suck-up-the-sun/

>>44191332
Not cannon until friday, at which point star wars dies forever.

>>44191452
>at which point star wars dies forever

Drama queen

>>44191413
Because most schools had their finals last week and you're just full of shit.

>This right here is what convinces me you're a troll and that nothing you post should be given any kind of consideration. I regret trying to have a discussion with you.

Oh? Please name the enlisted men who are currently serving a prison sentence for waterboarding. Or was "i was just following orders" a defense that only the nazi's couldn't use, and following blindly without moral consideration is A-OK for everyone else?

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>>44191452
>Basically, you're supporting this town's actions.

>>44191484

What? Surely people have the right to choose for themselves no matter how foolish that choice is?

>>44191452
A few of the people in that town spouted utter nonsense.

But the others had good reason to not want a THIRD solar plant further lowering property values for the surrounding houses.

(And if those are Solar-Cell fields instead of Mirror-focus-heated-water-turbine towers they are more toxic and less renewable than almost any other source of power: Photovoltaic is a dead end.)

>>44191332
Can we stop this dumb argument about terrorism and instead talk about how fucking stupid the CIS is?

>lets use our wealth and influence to weaken and gridlock the Senate that way we can do whatever we want as megacorps
>UGH the republic is so weak and gridlocked let's start a rebellion with all our wealth and influence!

Palpatine really was an evil genius

>>44191410
>Just like IRL. The winners decide what is right.

No, you don't get it. In order to judge these things wrong, we have to establish what standard we're judging them by. If it's the Empire's, then all of those things are right. If it's someone else's, such as mine, then all of those things are morally wrong. If we want to get into legality, then the Empire wins. Either way, the Rebellion was morally right.

Anyways, this has been a giant waste of time. Good night.

>>44191520
>muh property values are more important than the future of the planet

That right there is why the species is doomed to extinction. Why do you think elon musk wants to get to mars so badly?

>>44191538

Using violence to dispose people you don't like is morally right?

>>44191477
http://static.fas.harvard.edu/registrar/academic_planning/exam%20scheduled%2015-16/Fall%202015/exam%20schedule.pdf

Kindly insert a needle into your eye.

>>44191507
>democracy has made mistakes in the past, therefore the entire idea is worthless

I'm guessing then that all fascist dictatorships/monarchies didn do nuffin?

>>44191575
A Just cause is worth fighting for.

>>44191608
Hey, you, come back here with that goalpost.

>>44191587
>harvard
Wow, they really will accept anyone. How's your communications studies major going?

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>>44191596
Oh I say

>>44191575
So then the empire is never morally right since it uses violence for all its ends?

ONLY THE SITH DEAL IN ABSOLUTES

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>>44191608

>>44191619
So the Ends justify the Means?

Then a peaceful galaxy omelette takes a few alderaan eggs.

Thanks, you made it easy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hVrIyEu6h_E
I have no idea what this is.

>>44191105
>/TG/
>Traditional GAMES
Yeah friendo, this isnt /pol/

>>44191644
Wow, I just got it.

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>>44191644

There's nothing pleasant with keeping the peace. The rebellion would have evolved into the empire very quickly after its formation if there was even a hint of realism to be found anywhere in the setting.

Planets in star wars might as well have no more than fifty people living in them like rural villages in samuaitime japan, for how the setting behaves.

Oh, right.

>>44191708

Oh yeah they did burn her village in the beginning. hunh. I guess it was a thematic mistake to expand that act to an entire planet "because scifi"

>>44191662
If blowing up the Death Star prevents inhabited planets from being blown up, then great.

If killing the Emperor and tearing down the Empire makes way for a benevolent Democratic Republic, then great.

Those are causes worth fighting for.

The Empire is not a cause worth fighting for.

The Galaxy was doing pretty well before the Empire came along.

>>44191708
If we want to get into the fact that the New Republic didn't turn into the Empire, we could.

Also, I still really don't see how The Hidden Fortress is related.

>>44191755
I wouldn't say pretty well but it probably was better

>>44191551
An immediate tangible, financial harm versus doom-and-gloom proclamations for a distant future that would be better delayed by nuclear power anyway?

Yeah, I'd rather not see my home's equity fucking vanish without getting paid for it.

Also it seems to somehow drain jobs from the locals, not exactly sure how that happens, maybe the imported workers don't generally patronize local stores.

>>44191708
Well if your whole argument boils down to Star Wars isn't realistic, I would have started with the space wizards. But if the entire thing is nonsensical in your view, why try to prove the Empire is justified or that the Rebels are terrorists at all?

>>44191755
>The Galaxy was doing pretty well before the Empire came along.
Weren't a lot of planets being fucked over because bigger, richer planets would pay to have their way?
I mean the only reason the CIS were so big is because of a shitload of planets being sick of how corrupt the republic was, wasn't it?

I'm not saying it was doing worse than the Empire but it wasn't exactly hard to improve on it either.