Why did non-avian dinosaurs grow to such gigantic sizes? If

>>9138469
Never, ever listen to a paleontologists when it comes to size. They're always wrong. The overwhelming single most important reason that animals achieve enormous sizes is because they can and because it's generally better to be bigger. It's literally that simple. The reason we don't have massive Ratites is because 1: Humans kill all large animals and 2: They're not playing their A game anymore. This isn't the Mesozoic anymore. Mammals do that now. And the largest Crocodilians are pretty fucking big. Remember, Dinosaurs had hundreds of millions of years to achieve the things they did - Crocodilians had even longer. Mammals have only had the freedom to do that for about 65 million. Also, keep in mind, the Cenozoic has achieved multiple record-breakers itself, such as Titanoboa, Argentavis and Blue Whales.

>>9138518
Aren't there downsides to being bigger? Like killing just like two dozen elephants could fuck over the whole species. Also aren't there physiological issues?

>>9138469
>Feathered tyrannosaurus
We have fucking skin impressions good damn it

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>>9138469

>>9138534
Aren't those just from the underbelly and legs?

>>9138523
>Aren't there downsides to being bigger?
There are downsides to everything. What of it?

>Like killing just like two dozen elephants could fuck over the whole species
Nah, Earth can support massive numbers of even truly enormous animals as long as humans aren't killing everything. There used to be millions of African Bush Elephants before humans started their shit.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_elephant#Population_estimates_and_poaching
>The World Wide Fund for Nature believes there were between 3 and 5 million African elephants as recently as the 1930s and 1940s.

Humans are a genuine plague upon this Earth.

>Also aren't there physiological issues?
Of course. They overcome them. Evolution doesn't stop where humans say it does.

>>9138534
So much this. I wish we could publicly execute featherfaggots. They're ruining science with their fanfiction bullshit.

>>9138550
Oxygen content is another myth. Animals can get large just fine without muh oxygen meme. The largest Mammoths were as large as Indricotheres, which were as large as medium sized Sauropods just fine. Also, Blue Whales.

>>9138556
No.

>>9138550
>40% oxygen
Son of a bitch. SSTO's might be doable with ramjets and some rocket then though I'm not sure about the fire hazards.

>>9138567
>Oxygen content is another myth. Animals can get large just fine without muh oxygen meme. The largest Mammoths were as large as Indricotheres, which were as large as medium sized Sauropods just fine. Also, Blue Whales.

No. Mammoths had much lower activity levels than a T-Rex, grass isn't nearly as difficult to hunt as other dinosaurs are. There is no way a predator the size of a mammoth could thrive with our current oxygen saturation.

>>9138574
>Mammoths had much lower activity levels than a T-Rex
There is absolutely no way to prove that. Also it's a pretty meaningless statement.

>grass isn't nearly as difficult to hunt as other dinosaurs are
You're describing herbivory, not oxygen content.

>There is no way a predator the size of a mammoth could thrive with our current oxygen saturation.
Says you. Who cares what you say? Morons like you were claiming that Dinosaurs walked with their bellies below ground and had to live submersed to support their weight and couldn't run or climb because "muh ankles". Your kind also claimed that the largest Sauropods, Pterosaurs and Carnosaurs couldn't exist...until we found them.

>>9138579
>Also it's a pretty meaningless statement.


Yes because a herbivore and a predator are exactly the same, its meaningless to compare them!

Fucking halfwit.

>>9138585
What's that got to do with oxygen?

>>9138585
>>9138594
And let me stop you before you act retarded again. Your entire argument is that absence of evidence is evidence of absence.

>>9138595
>>9138594
>HURR

Whatever you say, moron.

>>9138594
It takes more energy to hunt than to graze. You aren't very bright, are you?

>>9138606
Alright, I'm going to say this again. Slowly. Absence of evidence IS NOT evidence of absence. The entire muh oxygen argument is based on blatant assumptions and absolutely nothing more.

>>9138606
Also, all Whales are predators. Now move some goalposts around as you see fit.

>>9138612
>HURR krill are animals so whales are the same as T-Rexes!

You really aren't very bright at all, are you?

im not shure but the preys of the avians now a days are useuly mamals righ? And most of them are not that big, so the genetic encryption of avians might have been modified to save energy by having a body that can still perform correctly but also catch there preys

>>9138621
Knew you would. I bet you're the sort who's absolutely religiously convinced T-Rex had feathers.

>>9138647
>HURR

Whatever you say, moron.

>>9138518
>Remember, Dinosaurs had hundreds of millions of years to achieve the things they did -

Dunno, some of them seemed to get big pretty fast. https://sauroposeidon.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/wedel-and-yates-2011-wavp-a-diplodocus-sized-bipedal-basal-sauropodomorph-from-south-africa.pdf

>>9138469
>That picture.

Not even mad about the feathers -- splitters need to die.

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>>9138579
>Morons like you were claiming that Dinosaurs walked with their bellies below ground

MFW being old enough to recall trench-diplodocids.

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>>9138800

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“What a bully time you must have had in London! The delight which the political caricaturists made of your Diplodocus was most amusing. What a pity the thing died out! What glorious shooting we would have had on the Little Missouri if it survived to our time!”

>>9138599
Wow, I don't see him recovering from a well thought verbal execution like that.

>>9138793
Excuse my ignorance, but what's a splitter?

>>9138806
rofl

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>>9138830
Classification of organisms involves people who prefer to create fewer species/genera/etc., and people who prefere more.

"Lumpers" are seen by their opponents as cramming unrelated critters into the same box out of misguided sense of simplicity.

"Spllitters" are seen by their opposite numbers as being more interested in describing a NEW GENUS!!! than a mere new species, and creating necessary clutter by dividing creatures that should be classified together into superfluous classifications and sub-classifications.

Me, I tend to think more like the former.

Splitting Tyrannosaurus into a bunch of unnecessary groups when one genus is all that is justified irks me.

>>9138806
What the fuck is this and why do I find it hilarious?

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>>9138839
Because "dinosaurs are reptiles," many early reconstructions gave them splayed, sprawling legs like lizards. Some bright boy pointed out that if this were the case, Diplodocus (notably deep-chested) would have to have walked around in trenches.

I am old enough to have seen the spectacular "compromise" mount in the Smithsonian, where a Triceratops was given correctly columnar hind legs, and sprawling forelimbs.

Imagining the poor beast walking with that set-up was amusing.

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>>9138890
Lol I forgot all about this, but I had this guy as a young teenager, of all things.

>>9139020
I just kept seeing the poor dude get spooked by something trying to run, and doing helpless somersaults all over the place.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fAjNjPUbV2g

>>9138789
That's rather fast, but consider also that Indricotherium lived during the Oligocene.

>>9138830
A stupid cunt who ruins taxonomy.

>>9138469
That woman looks like she's down for the BDC