Why is Autism considered a thing, when the symptoms are so radically

because psychology is a pseudoscience

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>>9116672
Say that to my face, you fucking goy bitch.

>>9116699
>freud
literally the king of pseuds

>>9116699
Freud rhymes with fraud

>>9116699
>>9116704
>>9116791
>Freud
>Fraud Pseud
It's like pottery

>>9116664
Autism is a real thing. The problem is that it's overdiagnosed. Some guy show a remote symptom and he will get an autism diagnosis.

autismo

>>9116704
>>9116791
He was the first person to explore the unconcious and is his ideas are undeniably important.

>>9116664
I also have diagnosed HFA, and i´m a borderline pervert too, but as a German, being kinky and even being autistic should be part of my culture.

I also have been diagnosed with Borderline before and had a girlfriend and mother with BPD those "disabilities" are somehow connected, both have in common a very high sensitivity and a lot people "suffering" seem to have exeptional high IQ, you could say borderline is the female kind of dealing with that, an extreme female brain, and autism is an extreme male brain.

Andrea Brackmann wrote a great German book about Spectrum from BPD Autism, High intelligence and sensitivity.

You can´t really draw a clear line between those. If you look at extremely and very high iq people you will see a lot of autistic traits. Very intelligent people are often extremely sensitive too, her theories was that the extreme amount of input stimulates the brain in a way which forces it to improve.
Also you have to sense details which other not do to be really superior and have a great perception.

Autistic people have a lot of the characteristics which High IQ people have, but too the extreme.

I just dropped this here, i don´t have a final conclusion or anything, i just really like this topic, i still feel more like a gifted individual (also have an officially measured IQ from 135) and i would not pathologise my condition because since i accepted myself and worked out my childhood traumata i´m high achieving and really like myself, besides of some crazy kinks and my inability to stand women, but that could also be a gifted thing, because gifted Men outnumber gifted women from the factor 3 to 1 for IQ130 and 5 to 1 for IQ 145. And objectivily spoken modern women are a pain in the ass.

>>9117382
this

>>9117497
Aren't BPD people sometimes serial killers?

How can BPD be the "ultra-female brain", if women don't kill people?

>inb4 I'm killed by a woman later today

>>9116664

You can objectively spot an Autistic person. Many of them reside on this website. Why is Autism considered a thing? Because you are a massive autist denying his illness. It's no joke that I can spot an autistic person from miles away. Why? Because the symptoms are so radically observable. So what are the radical symptoms the symptoms? Here's a short list:

First symptom: You making this thread.
Second symptom: Sperging out on about your illness - denying it.
Third symptom: A fucking pseud.
Fourth symptom( and this the major one): Browsing 4chan.


Now kys.

>>9116664
Sperglord here. I can confirm that I suffer from ticks that cause me to preform repetitive motions. I do have a well above average IQ and I do quite well with mathematics, physics, and programming. My interests are quite limited as I usually just focus on what I have to do to complete my EE degree. I do love math, physics, and circuitry and see them as actual hobbies more than tasks. I also enjoy anime, manga, and videogames when I can make time for them however I have been interested in these things since early childhood and am still interested in them in early adulthood so I'd say that autists have limited interests like everyone, however they dont go through very many phases and generally like the same things all their lives. I do have powerful senses and I'm not nearly as socially impaired as most would expect. I attend college and communicate with professors and peers whenever needed. I also drive and go out for food quite regularly and have little difficulty making orders. I do suffer greatly in conversation though.

>>9118891
Some excellent points.

>>9118956
Are you able to live on your own?

The guy I work with is almost 30, yet he's gonna have to live with his parents until they die. He didn't finish high school until he was in his early 20s, works a dead-end job washing dishes yet thinks it's the biggest thing in the world; and has no interests beyond bike riding, bowling, and musicals. Not going to musicals mind you, just listening to their soundtracks and writing them.

And by "writing them", I mean he makes lists of all the women he knows for "casting", then stuffs them in his drawer and tells me to leave.

>>9119020
I currently live with my parents but I plan on moving out after I get my masters in Electrical Engineering and a bachelors in applied mathematics. I believe that I am capable of surviving on my own. I already clean my own room, maintain my own vehicle, and do my own laundry. I can even cook simple dished for my self like fried rice with pork and eggs. Your Autistic "friend" sound like a pitiful individual.

>>9118851
first of all, women do kill people, ask my ex, they just do it more subtly, a women will rather let you get killed by manipulating people or let you kill yourself by sytematic destruction of your emotional well being.

Also BPD is often met with other personality disorders, a person with pure BDP is probably more self harming than to others.

A lot of prostitutes or drug users have BPD.


BPD is used very often by doctors when they don´t have another term to describe you, so there is a very wide interpretation for what is bpd, just like with autism, it´s more to see like a spectrum.

High sensitvity + Trauma -> BPD
High sensivity -> High intelligence
High sensitivity + male brain (= focused on things and concepts rather than people) -> Autistic traits.

So an intelligent Female will be a great manipulater, musician, artist and an intelligent Male can become a scientist, and so on.

Of course this are all grey scales and nothing is 1 or 0 in this, that´s exactly what i wanted to state.

Autism, just like borderline Is a concept. Every personality disorder is a concept and an abstraction which has and can not match 100% with the real thing.

>>9120326
What's

>>9116699
Psychoanalysis!=psychology

Shitposts

Don't autistic people have physically different brain stuff going on

>>9119074
I'm pretty sure I'm a sperglord too but it seems like we're different. I hate conversation and never communicate with professors, I can't even look people in the eye when I talk to them. I do have a natural grasp for math and science though. I hate anime and shit like that, I never watched when I was little so I guess I don't have that fondness for it. I guess my autistic interests are just sports.

>>9117476
1. No he wasn't, literally every spiritual master ever did this.
2. Saying "undeniably" doesn't make it true.

>>9122536
He coined terms like ego and the unconcious. If you don't get his influence on modern psychology and cognitive science then you are a complete retard.
Yeah his methodology was wack, that doesn't make him less influential. You contrarian kiddos annoy me.

>>9116664
people are different in general

>>9118891
this

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>How can all these people be diagnosed under a single spectrum, when the symptoms are so varied

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>>9116664
>The first one is extremely vague, and can apply to at least a third of the general population, and half this website.

>half

>>9120326
hmm.. what you're defining as "female" and "male" brain is somewhat arbitrary and doesn't have explanatory power based on sex, seeing as guys have BPD too, and girls can have autism.
btw autists often aren't focused on concepts. rather, they are focused on facts and trivial data (e.g. classic autist trainspotter). I guess this comes from autism + average iq.

>>9116664
Autism is caused by the lack of instinct/automatization.
Lack of social instinct leads to poor social skills.
Lack of motor automatization leads to delayed cordination development.
Normies have an automatic process that makes their brain treat things that "feel similar" like they where the same. The lack of this is the reason why autists react strongly when things are even slightly off.
Autist don't automatically adjust to strong, unexpected or "mixed" stimulus. This leads to a sensitivity towards things like loud noices and weird textures.

>>9122850
Females have more social automatization than males. In this sense males are more autistic than females. Female thinking also tends to be more based on abstractions than male thinking. Lack of abstractions is also an autistic trait.

>>9116791
in what fucking universe do those two sounds rhyme, faggot

>>9122906
>Normies have an automatic process that makes their brain treat things that "feel similar" like they where the same.
More on this? I'd always wondered why NTs are so bad at using definitions in math and philosophy

>>9123005
Autists are forced to think in microstates. Normal people think in macrostates.
Normal people have something that enables them to "think" without the need of clear unambiguous definitions. They can't use definitions because the very concept of a definition is foreign to them.
My personal hypothesis is that normal people replace definitions with clusters of emotions and associations unique to the concepts in question.

This is all i can find right now. I'll try to look for more tomorrow:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMUIbQH-Id8
http://grandin.com/inc/visual.thinking.html

Autism

Are we putting our wild, uncientific theories about autism here? I'm in.

I have read about chromosomic causes of autism, brain damage causes of autism, and those people who grow in isolation (or raised by animals) develop some symptoms of autism. If there isn't a single cause, why are the symptoms so similar? If autism is a single thing, why so much variability in multiple brain structures?

The answer is in cats. Specifically, experiments done to poor little cats, who have a single eye covered from birth, and are never capable of developing vision in that eye (even when the eyepatch is removed).

The brain develops in a certain way, according to genetic, epigenetic and ambient components. There is a timeline to it too, some things develop before others and so on. Logically, perception and interpretation of the senses should follow this rule.

Autist often have problems interacting with people. Yet they are good at other things, sometimes. Extreme autists can be overwhelmed by sounds, lights, touch, and any sort of stimuli.

Thus, I believe autism is simple the result of any process that interfers with the development of the brain structures responsible from "filtering" some inputs. Too little filtering, and the brain gets saturated. Too much, and the brain can never learn to deal with those.

Maybe there is a genetic pressure to alter this filtering system, if the resulting compensations done by the brain offer some advantages. Maybe the alterations of the filtering system are themselves the result of otherwise unrelated genetic changes. Maybe just specific signals (social stuff) get over or understimulated.

So that's my (un)educated guess. Autism is when something alters the input processing structures of the brain during development, and all the changes the brain does to compensate for that fact.

>>9116672
>he thinks psychology deals with autism
>he doesn't know what behavior analysis is

>>9117476
>unconscious
>existing
kek. If you want a serious answer for >>9116672 behavior analysis basically studies a similar topic to psychology (human behavior) without dealing with the unobservable and unscientific aspects of it (hypothetical constructs like the mind, ego, unconscious, etc.) Behavior Analysis doesn't rely on deductive reasoning to test their theory, rather they perform research and then make conclusions based on the data they find. These problems don't necessarily apply to physiological psychology and behavior analysis is compatible with said field, so long as the former doesn't attempt to make any conclusions about notions such as the mind.

>>9116664
Autism symptoms can be a bit vague if you assume that some type of 'construct' inside the person is causing it. If you consider autism only as a constellation of behavior that have a similar social impact on the person (and other potential causes are eliminated), it's much easier to understand.

>>9125179
But what if I want more than correlations? What if I want an explanation, a general model, something that can generate very good guesses and theories? What if I want to put math in there beyond statistics?

>>9125248
Behavior analysis does this better than other paradigms of psychology. Basic concepts like operant conditioning allow for us to predict how an individual will behave in a given situation provided we have enough information (this is why behavior analysis is great at improving the behavior of people with autism and other developmental disabilities).

Concepts like Matching Law and Delay Discounting both provide models for explaining different aspects of behavior (they both also apply math beyond statistics). I should also note that behavior analysts tend to avoid using inferential statistics to make conclusions, you won't see that many journals in JABA (journal of applied behavior analysis) or JEAB (journal of experimental analysis of behavior) relying on correlations.

>>9122906
What exactly is a social instinct?

>>9126534
Have you ever reacted to someone looking at you (if you see them of course)? Or get emotional when participating on a protest with lots of people? When you are on a group and don't know what to do, have you ever followed the rest of them?

Those are social instincts.

>>9126764
>Have you ever reacted to someone looking at you (if you see them of course)? Or get emotional when participating on a protest with lots of people? When you are on a group and don't know what to do, have you ever followed the rest of them?
That just sounds like learned behavior.

>>9126802
Maybe instinct is just particulary well learnable behavior. Evolution does tend to go with whatever works.

>>9126534
Reacting automatically to social stimulus.
When someone tells a funny joke you laugh by instinct. It's not something you have conditioned yourself to do.
Adapting to the social environment happens through instinct, the same way that you learn your first language.

>>9116664
>I get that technically Autism is a "spectrum" of disorders, but what's a common thing that can be found in every person with autism?

The cognitive functions responsible for human-specific behaviour are working at a reduced capacity.

>>9126887
>its not something you have conditioned yourself to do
>what is respondent conditioning
um

>>9126887
>anon, of course that joke was funny! I'm a funny guy, everybody knows it!
>the only reason you didn't laugh is because you don't have "social instincts", which is a sign of autism.

Anon, I...

>>9122577
Anything with a spectrum is bullshit. These are all different mental illnesses of different severity. Nobody wants to put in the time needed to proprtly identify when theres no difference in treatments. Most of these spergs on /sci/ are just psychotic, and not autistic who generally cant speak or communicate.

>>9126989
Explain why laughter is universal among human populations, but no word or gramatical rule is.
>>9127007
so if 2 high functioning autists have a child, said child won't be even more autistic?

>>9127212
Laughter is an "involuntary" response to a stimuli in the same way that feeling other emotions are. However, laughing at a joke is not inherent, that happens when you pair something that inherently causes laughter with another stimuli enough times (note pairing does not necessarily mean a literal stimulus-stimulus contingency, as there are many other different ways this can happen).

Because the "Spectrum" is threefold, and an attempt by Psychiatrists trying to shoehorn more people into diagnostic labels for billing purposes.

Severely autistic people are basically what people used to call "retarded"; most cannot speak and they have little to no control over their bodies.

Functioning autistic is someone with brain abnormalities that cause them to have general difficulties with most things but they can sometimes have the ability to concentrate on a particular task.

Mild autism or Aspergers is complete nonsense and it is used to take people suffering from mild bullying or social ostracization and place them into a category to label them as being "disordered" instead of labeling society as disordered and obsessive.

Most people labeled "autistic" are just people that don't like socializing with most people due the fact people are obsessed with beauty, sex, money and competition, none of which are inherently obsessive concepts in the natural animal kingdom.
Yes, animals have sex and like material possessions, but psychological effects have driven humankind to see OCD in these areas as "normal" and OCD in science or other things as "disordered".

Psychiatrists keep trying to expand definitions of "disorder" without proving disorder because it's good for their careers and political/social power.

Plain and simple.

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>>9126764
>participating on a protest
nice instinct fag

>everything that consensus knows about x is bullshit because x is a pseudoscience
>except for my layman's theories, of course

hmm

>>9116664

>me being a deuce about autism

High Functioning Autist here, I found the post pretty mild (for 4chan), unless you cleaned it up somehow. You seem to have a serious, thoughtful interest in this so you get an actual response.

Those three traits are pretty standard, but you rightfully point out that there seems to be little commonality between people with autism in other important areas. If you want to understand what these guys are all about, you may find it interesting to look at the recent studies into the [math]metacognitive[/math] impairments of autism, as I find too much emphasis is placed on social functioning.


https://digest.bps.org.uk/2017/06/23/researchers-are-figuring-out-how-sense-of-self-develops-differently-in-autistic-teens/

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/8407857.stm

This article is especially important when considering the disconnect of those with autism. Let's say there's a guy named Paul. Paul's relationships in the world are formed by how he reflects on experiences with the people around him, and his interpretation of what other people [math]mean[/math] when they say things to about him, to him. If Paul is autistic, can't conceptualize his feelings in his head, if he can't attribute those feelings and actions to a sense of self, thereby creating a self narrative, how is he supposed to accumulate beliefs and instincts about other people? If he can't conceptualize a sense of self while interacting with somebody else at the same time, how can he attribute senses of self and feelings to others and have empathy?

Ironically, autistic people also have a "default mode network" (the daydreaming critic) that never shuts off, even when engaged in activities. http://www.pnas.org/content/103/21/8275.full

Of course given the lack of social integration it doesn't behave quite the same as you'd expect, mine seem to entirely be speculations on the outcomes of TV shows.

There was also an article that I'm couldn't find explaining my disdain for social skills coaching. It wasn't the point of the article mind you, the study was a brain scan conducted on autistic children while they played a social game with other children, with neurotopical children as a control. The region of the brain supposedly related to "sense of self" remained lit up in the neuroypical children's brains, while it deactivated in the autistic brain. My disdain stems from the fact that all of the autistic children had already been through heavy social training interventions, which means the interventions taught autistic children to function socially without really connecting them.

Finally, here's a page I found full of links to studies on metacognition. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3050057/

I hope this helps.

So autists enter "automatic mode" when thrown into social situations.

We know their true weakness now. It is time to strike!

>>9127889
What exactly is automatic mode?

>>9128381
more pseudoscience

psychiatry is a business

>>9127007
>anythign with a spectrum is bullshit
what, like ciliopathies? and every disorder and disease?

>>9116664
if you google spectrum you'll find your answer. you're welcome

>>9117476
In the same way Aristotle thought about there being only four elements. Freud's work usually doesn't hold up in a modern setting.

>>9116672
More like jewdoscience.

Handflapping, what's all that about? Does it go away as I don't see many adults doing but alot of kids do.

>>9128555
parents arent as strict anymore, so a flappy kid keeps flapping into adulthood

>>9128544 >>9128448
>Jew Pseudoscience
Since Freud was a Jew.

>>9128585
hey man, sometimes a cigar is just a cigar :^) i just like a big fat cigar in my mouth :^)

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>>9127563
This.
Normies, Chads & Sluts obsessed with money, social life, fitness, beauty & sports are seen as normals.
Smart people obsessed with science, technology, coding, anime, waifu, video games, Internet & 4 Chan Shit posting are seen as Autistics & despised by the Normies.

>>9128555
Adult autist with handflapping tendencies here, it doesn't go away. But everyone thinks it does, since you learn to be more discrete.

Also, it looks like ritualistic dancing, and super-activates imagination.

>>9128702
Do you get it if you go outside? Can imagine its difficult to hide out in the open.

>>9128744
I don't "get" it, it is not an itch or an impulse. But if I'm really exited about something, I can call it and get even more exited (accompanied by small jumps, one foot at a time) It also allows my imagination to fly, almost to the point of losing contact with reality. Really good for creativity, really bad for my toe if I'm careless.

>>9128702
>Autistic Adult with Hand Flapping.
I know that feel Asperger Bro.
Relieves anxiety, boost imagination & problem solving & helps to concentrate.
I'm Autistic STEM College Student.

>>9128813
Lad handflaps, 7, just not sure whether to let it run its coarse or try to get him to be aware of himself abit more outside as outdoors he does it near enough constantly, as well as jumping etc. Fine indoors.

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>>9116664

Why is Autism considered a thing, when the symptoms are so radically different?

>I get that technically Autism is a "spectrum" of disorders

You just answered your own question
-

You have personal differences and developments, the disorder itself is just a certain manifestation, autism is just an umbrella term.

The problem is that ignorant bigots think of disorders of the mind in stereotypical terms, not to mention the general misconceptions and plain misunderstanding of certain disorders

There's allot of misconception regarding psychosis and schizophrenia when it comes to the general public, i know this because i have it and experience it daily.

People misuse terms like schizophrenic, the word "psycho and psychotic, i've seen articles and so called educated people use words in a completely wrong context.
-

This is very serious, if misconceptions/ignorance or just lies about psychology spread into the public the consequences are tragic.

>>9117497

BPD oh god plz fuck off !

Category B disorders need to be shot in the face.

BPD's are literally the worst, obnoxious exploitative irresponsible drama fire starters

My sister has BPD and i have lost all tolerance or compassion, self-destructive hateful trainwrecks, selfishly starting a fight to fend their self-loathing, whilst shouting and crying like an obnoxious child on cocaine

>>9118891

lol the term autism is overused by baboons that throw it around at any slight assumption

Seriously autism in itself is casually used as an insult, it's a meme disorder, it's the "insert insult" that is used nowadays, especially on 4chan/the internet.

People hardly know what autism is, it's just a disorder that is now more present in the general public and used to describe "weird" "cringy" or just different social behavior.

You have smart-ass armchair psychologists self assuredly and smuglike labeling someone "autistic" like they know a few things, pff it's a disorder that doesn't mean jack shit anymore.

>inb4 sure you autismo

>>9128905
Rule 1 of psychology (warning: not actually true): If the behaviour causes suffering, it's bad. If the behaviour doesn't cause damage, is not a problem.

Oh, and I'm on the firm belief that autism is not an excuse for sloppyness, unpoliteness and informality. Handflapping doesn't necessarily implies autism, but the same principle can apply.

>>9128978
As an autist, I believe autist is a perfectly good insult. It's a shorthand for calling someone obsessed to the point of self-harm, or utterly disconnected from the world.

Who said insults had to be a nuanced reflection of reality?

It's called a "spectrum" because that means "we just toss a bunch of different shit in there and call it one thing because we are lazy".

Just like "Sudden Infant Death Syndrome" really just means "Cause of baby death unknown"

>>9117497
>I also have diagnosed HFA, and i´m a borderline pervert too, but as a German, being kinky and even being autistic should be part of my culture.
Serious question here: tried latex to see if it is effective as a hug machine? I heard someone had proposed it but back then it was controversial, most likely for the kinky connotations. Since kinks are not a problem for you...

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>>9129113
i wear tight women's underwear like shapewear slips, bodies, pantyhose. haven't tried latex. sleeping under a ball blanket while wearing pantyhose and/or shapewear or just wearing them during the day can be incredibly refreshing. it's probably actually pretty normal to enjoy wearing this stuff just that it's taboo to do or talk about. there are somewhat similar types of clothes for men that are being marketed to runners and such too.

>>9129533
Considering there are so many latex wear manufacturers in Germany it is safe to assume there is a big market. What really tickled my interest is the use of multiple layers. it doesn't change the look so it is hard to believe it is for appearances but it certainly adds to the tightness.

>>9116664
>Why is Autism considered a thing, when the symptoms are so radically different?

It's a deliberate misdiagnosis to prevent true research into the cause.

>>9130100
>Conspiracies at work!
OK, please explain why this would be the case.

>>9130100
This might be the dumbest post on this thread, and thats saying something.

>>9128702
>Adult autist with handflapping tendencies here, it doesn't go away. But everyone thinks it does, since you learn to be more discrete.
>Also, it looks like ritualistic dancing, and super-activates imagination.

Finally someone understand me.

But it has something extremely meditative to dance to music, it´s very relaxing and i get a lot of good thoughts while doing so, it´s a rush without drugs.

>>9128958
completely with you on that

>>9128958
This. My mom's gotten a lot better through extensive therapy, but it won't erase the things she's done. I can't wait for her to die.

>>9117497
>Men outnumber gifted women from the factor 3 to 1 for IQ130 and 5 to 1 for IQ 145.
This is what happens when you let /pol/ do your research for you. Go ahead and ignore all the studies saying they're exactly the same; it's Fake News, after all.

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>>9131101
>men and women
>exactly the same

>>9131106
Men and women are different. Men are better than women at plenty of things. That doesn't mean men have higher IQs than women.

>>9131109
the general consensus is that the variance is greater in men, so that there are more highly intelligent men than highly intelligent women (and more very stupid men than very stupid women)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex_differences_in_intelligence#Variability

>>9116664
>Side note: Only if you spend more time taking care of people with autism than I do, can you complain about me talking deuce about autism.


technically, i do

>>9131123
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lQH2h-eG99g

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>>9131123

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>>9129009
Just go on /vp/, /vg/ and other media boards to see it in action.

https://www.youtube.co/watch?v=dO4FpYQa41Q

Is there any point in living with asd.
What can someone like zach do anything in his life other than delude himself

>>9131143
That's why for your kids you not supposed to let them get exposed to shit that can "trap" them until later on especially for ASD kids.

>>9127678
>If Paul is autistic, can't conceptualize his feelings in his head, if he can't attribute those feelings and actions to a sense of self, thereby creating a self narrative, how is he supposed to accumulate beliefs and instincts about other people? If he can't conceptualize a sense of self while interacting with somebody else at the same time, how can he attribute senses of self and feelings to others and have empathy?

You think this may be a fact in autistic people's interest and engagement in certain types of media?

>>9116664
Fall under a group of symptoms and characteristics, then you're autistic.

Asperger's checking in, decided to check /sci/ for once. I haven't seen any other ASD's checking in so feel free to ask questions i guess?