Are all high-level maths students intuitive geniuses, or do you

>>9058373
Maybe, that's why applied math exists.
Do you happen to be a Pure Math major?

Also if you did some geometry puzzles, not everyone has good spatial intelligence OP, I'm a living proof.

>>9058379
Nah it wasn't geometry puzzles, just logical brain teasers and such. You know the type, the dragonfly, the 100 windows, etc. (none of these obviously, these are well known). Actually I'm not as good at spacial reasoning (and my IQ scores seem to confirm it)
I'm a maths student, at the shittiest university there is. (attitude problems got me expelled from everywhere else)
Yet this guy who evidently has average intuition somehow got into one of the best school in the world. I'm bitter as fuck m8.

>>9058393
>Yet this guy who evidently has average intuition somehow got into one of the best school in the world.
He most likely has acquaintances that helped him to get into that uni or rich dad.

Most prestigious places are actually populated by average richfags, it is rare to see an actual smart guy on a prestigious uni these days, especially in the U.S. where saying #BlackLivesMatter a hundred times gets you to Stanford.

Can't be helped, but
>(attitude problems got me expelled from everywhere else)
And why didn't you solved this problem? Were you in a good uni before?
You know that schools can contact each other about you and never admit you, right?

>>9058410
Nah, it doesn't work that way in France.
Schools are free, and you get inside based on your ranking at the entrance exam. So you have to be gr8 at maths. And up until now I thought it meant having crazy intuition, but apparently it doesn't.

As for the attitude problem, I didn't give a fuck back then and I wanted to seem cool so I didn't go to class, I got expelled from my CPGE (a school that gets you ready to take entrance exams) and had to go through another first year of uni.

File: bud dah.gif (3MB, 384x480px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 384x480px

>>9058431
Dammit OP, maybe you didn't got your scores that high too.

But either way, in France everything's different so, maybe do your Master's degree on that school?
Since again, many average people somehow got into prestige but end up getting fucked because they don't have good intuition.

Can't be helped.
Just do some research if you can transfer or get that MS.

>>9058373
>>9058431
OP, math isn't all about pure intelligence and it isn't all about pure studying. There's intelligence, knowledge and maturity in mathematics that sort of combines into a general skill. No one (except maybe Ramanujan) was born good at math with any knowledge or intuition. Think of math like learning an instrument. Most people won't be able to play as well as Rostropovich, but there are tons of people with the innate potential to play at a professional, or even internationally recognized level, given the work. Read this article by Tao himself so you can see it how he sees it:
https://terrytao.wordpress.com/career-advice/does-one-have-to-be-a-genius-to-do-maths/

As for your contest where you were comparing yourself to a EP student, I think that things like this are kind of concerning and if you put too much weight on comparisons to others you will burn out as a mathematician.

>>9058467
Nah I didn't take the exam, uni students can't take them, you have to have completed two years in a CPGE.
And those schools are hard as fuck to get in, which is why I don't understand how a guy with so little natural ability got in, even provided he resorted to cramming which he most certainly did (CPGE students usually work 4+ hours a day on their own time, doing standard exercises, training for writing speed etc).
And since we have schools AND unis, it creates a system where if you come from uni basically you're shit, or otherwise you'd have gone to a "Grande Ecole".
So it all happens right after you graduate, if you don't work your ass of during the first year you're fucked for life, there's no coming back.
Even PhDs are considered unemployable which I'm told is a very french thing.

>>9058373
By my experience (i haven't done all of this myself, before you fags point out that an experienced mathematician isn't going to post anything in sci) you are fine being very smart (in the normal non e-stating sense, above 125 iq or something, nowhere near remarkable among math doctorates) and very hard-working, you can actually reach any milestone in academia. By this I mean that there is no "standard" test of knowledge and skill (getting a degree, getting a phd, publishing a decent amount of papers...) that you cannot complete. Thus if you actually enjoy it you can live off it and be virtuous, but you won't be at all a relevant mathematician nowadays if you arent extremely talented.

>>9058393
Remember than mathematical talent can be very specific, and brain teasers or iq tests to a lesser degree are not always accurate predictors of mathematical ability.

>>9058487
Nah you misread, there were several of us there and we got bored so we started doing riddles and puzzles, it wasn't a game of "how do I measure up next to the EP guy". I dunno I was just surprised is all, I expected him to dazzle us with his elegant proofs. So I thought maybe these guys aren't so different after all.
Anyways, personally I've never studied so while I might be moderately gifted I don't think I'll ever do anything (I'm 20 already). If only my parents hadn't been /his/fags.

As for Tao, I think it's pretty easy for him to write that, he doesn't know how difficult it is to be a brainlet.

File: 1499583217235.png (756KB, 934x1220px) Image search: [Google]

756KB, 934x1220px

>>9058488
Jesus Christ, OP.
So basically you're telling me that if you don't get into the good school, you're basically fucked? That's fucked up.

At least the shitty state uni in the US can get some job somewhere, but in France if you go to a shit uni you are basically wasting your money.

Okay, I'm reaching my limits on advising, then work your ass up on your uni, get HUGE high grades to get a 4.0 U.S. GPA and move your ass out of France and live in the U.S. or something, since you know english already.

Oh and on the school thing, I guess it happens all the time, you will always find that one average dude on a place full of smart and/or rich people, so instead of being mad then try to use your angerey to climb up the ladder to success.

Hell, even get a mothefucking Fields Medal desu.

>>9058511
Oh and sorry for the shitty spacing.

>>9058511
>in France if you go to a shit uni you are basically wasting your money
heh. at least uni is free here.
but yeah I'm considering getting to work and I'll see where it takes me, it's probably about time and I'll regret not trying.

>>9058515
That's alright lad, proper post, except the fields memedal part

>>9058487
>Nah bro, just be yourself, just work real hard, you don't need to be a genius!
>Here, check this child genius' opinion on the matter, that should help you.
You might as well have used von Neumann's quote about maths being hard to understand.

>>9058509
Comparing yourself to other people is worrisome, regardless. That you are now trying to rationalize it indicates to me that you know that.
>maybe these guys aren't so different after all
Yeah, pretty much. See >>9058506
>I'm 20 already
Meaningless. Ignore the "if you haven't solved the geometrization conjecture by the time you left your crib you can't into mathematics" memes
>dismissing Tao for dumb reasons
He's a well respected expert who has worked with countless people in the field for many years. If he doesn't know what he's talking about, I don't know who is.

>>9058489
That's what I thought, but I find it sad that here people who crammed for two years are held in higher esteem than PhD students who are passionate and actually spend time conducting their own research to try and understand what the formulas and ideas mean.
Basically PhD students, even in muh hard sciences, are seen as useless bums who weren't smart enough to get inside a school, and who are going to spend their whole lives in some shit uni doing irrelevant research.

>>9058506
still, they mean a great deal regarding one's ability to come up with an original idea and (pardon my bullshit business school lingo) "think outside the box".
And that's what most people (except maybe engineers) would say math is about.

>>9058547
A salty person using a /r9k/ dogwhistle. Kind of unsurprising.

>>9058488
I don't understand your system. You're telling me you have two parallel options of either going to uni (shit in France apparently) or going to a school (impossible as fuck)? Am I getting it right?

>>9058556
A self-important person belittling me for exagerating instead of addressing my point. Kind of unsurprising.

>>9058557
Yep. Basically at the end of high school, (if you took the scientific "path", that is, dunno about the rest) you can either:
-go to uni and do a licence, mastère then doctorat (bachelor's, master's and PhD), which aren't held in very high regard except for less than a handful prestigious universities with sort of a special status

or

-go to a CPGE (Physics or Maths oriented) after which you attempt the entrance exams, the goal of which is to get the best ranking possible. every week you have oral exams were they ask you to memorize proofs and formulas without always necessarily explaining them, which encourages a trend of learning without understanding.
and anyways you have no choice, a CPGE is almost the equivalent of completing a Maths AND a Physics bachelor's, within two years. as I said some people get up at 5 and go to bed a 11, spend their whole mornings and evenings doing standard exercises and training hand speed. it's pretty sad.

And after that only about 10% of those people get a good school. There's engineering (Polytechnique then Centrale or Mines) and research-oriented schools called the Ecole Normales Supérieures (typically that's were actually gifted people go).

You can still get inside a school after uni if you have a bachelors but each school only accepts like 15 uni students each year.

TL;DR: our system is fucked up, never come to France.

ecole normale superieure > L'x

>>9058554
Yes that's why I believe it's vital to only get into academia if you truly enjoy mathematics. Any mathematician who gets a phd and dedicates himself to academia is almost surely (some tehoritcal mathematicians earn a lot of money too of course) sacrificing a much more economically successful career in some applied field.

About the puzzles being good predictors I reiterate my point that mathematical talent is very specific, even within stricter categories like being good at "thinking outside the box" as you say. I suppose any excellent mathematician will be good at those, but I know people whose ability for original thought seems completely restricted to very abstract reasoning.

>>9058592
Ben oui mais là pour le coup le type était à l'X. Et puis ENS c'est avéré que c'est 145 de QI
M I N I M U M
I
N
I
M
U
M
(pour cachan bien sûr, Ulm c'est non mesurable)

>>9058591
>go to a CPGE (Physics or Maths oriented) after which you attempt the entrance exams, the goal of which is to get the best ranking possible. every week you have oral exams were they ask you to memorize proofs and formulas without always necessarily explaining them, which encourages a trend of learning without understanding.
>and anyways you have no choice, a CPGE is almost the equivalent of completing a Maths AND a Physics bachelor's, within two years. as I said some people get up at 5 and go to bed a 11, spend their whole mornings and evenings doing standard exercises and training hand speed. it's pretty sad.
You talk very bitterly about the CPGE. Could it be the case that you opinion is tainted by sour grapes?

>>9058599
I've more than once heard in /sci/ people talking very highly of Ulm. What makes it so special?

>>9058604
Well as I mentioned they only take the best, and their entrance exam is already quite hard. But even then there are very few places available.
They are research oriented and are said to have a better theoretical level than any other school (which is probably true). Actually that's also true, to a lesser extent, of the other ENS' (Lyon, Cachan and Rennes).
That's were most french researchers come from. Used to be they came from polytechnique but nowadays that's just for douches who waste their talent by going into finance for the cuckbuxx. I mean don't get me wrong, they're good, they have to be, but maths are just a means to an end for them, which I find kind of sad.

>>9058602
See above for why I said about CPGEs being "sad". We have made maths into a competition, almost akin to a speed writing contest at times.
And yeah I'm pretty mad I didn't complete my CPGE but I couldn't have done anything of value anyways, as I'm completely unable to grasp the basic principles of physics.
And the schools bad CPGE students (remaining 90%) get are mostly garbage no employer even knows about, so you don't even get the employability thing. Granted, you still have a degree that says engineer, but honestly most people don't think it's worth it and I understand them. I'd even go as far as saying they would have been better in uni t b h.

>>9058651
fuck I just noticed I write "were" instead of "where" a lot. time for bed.

University admissions isn't about intelligence or demonstrable talent. If it was, then (((Your favorite prestigious Massachusetts engineering school))) wouldn't have a 50/50 gender ratio every year, even when almost twice as many males apply as females.

It would be cheaper if you just got a job and learned to be a street sweeper

>>9058393
which uni?

>>9058373
Honestly, I think part of it is how interested you are in the esoteric results. Part of it is how much exposure to cleverness you've had (you have to read a lot). But it isn't the quantity of reading so much as the quality ("Study the masters, not their pupils"). But most of it is getting enough experience from working problems and knowing what methods tend to work for certain problems and what methods tend to fail for certain problems (thousands of ways to not make a lightbulb). Be interested in what you are doing, find your niche, put in the repetitions to get stronger.

>>9058832
Is it true, anon? I have never been interested in such statistics so I never bothered to find such information. This sounds edgy but presumably true considering the world we live in. Could you tell whether it is a joke or something?

>>9059130
Tours. I was hoping to move to a better city with a better maths uni but this shit is complicated af.

>>9058832
really? seems like americans get the short end of the cuck stick. As I said, it's not the same here, you get in based on your ranking.
Polytechnique is like 20% women, tops.

I still think they should include problems with "elegant" answers that are somewhat hard to come up with, you know the type. But I think that would be too close to an IQ test and people are scared of that over here. It's a literal taboo in France.

>>9059299
>I still think they should include problems with "elegant" answers that are somewhat hard to come up with, you know the type. But I think that would be too close to an IQ test and people are scared of that over here. It's a literal taboo in France.

Actually I just looked it up and as I suspected, whenever it's brought up, butthurt brainlets everywhere start ranting about elitisim.
It's a paradox, really, these guys claim to have the best schools in the world, with the smartest people, yet they're afraid to put that to the test.
I mean it's already elitist, but it selects people based on criteria that mean fucking nothing (fucking hand speed lmao).

>>9058373
>we had sort of a contest since none of us has actually had sex ever
So did you win with the homosex or not?

OP, you need to deliver the details

Let me just say this.

People who are actually great don't need a name brand school to define their accomplishments.

Does anyone really give a shit what school Galois went to? No, it has to do with what you actually achieve in your chosen discipline.

Getting into a great school is nice, and their are some brilliant people there; but at least in America most people just use "brand name" as an ego boost.

French education sounds even more fucked than american desu .

>>9059310
Doesn't really apply because Galois went to ENS, which was not that prestigious at the time. He did fail the Polytechnique exam, twice.
But yeah I get what you're saying. The only reason I would've liked to get into a school was to be reassured as to where I stood talent-wise, i.e. ego

>>9059345
I never understood American education either desu, with your SATs and such. What's up with that.

>>9059155
>Honestly, I think part of it is how interested you are in the esoteric results
maybe. some people aren't interested in some fields and some types of problems. for instance long, drawn out calculus problems bore the shit out of me, I don't even try doing them correctly. That and weirdly enough I'm not gifted at anything calculus. (by calculus I mean integrals, differential equations, etc, hope that's the right word)

>>9059310
Do you really believe you get any kind of opportunity coming from a garbage uni ? Great people are known because they were given an opportunity to shine. This happens less and less often nowadays. Who the hell cares about maths. We have smartphones.

>>9059402
I think what he's saying is, if you're gifted you'll be good regardless of your uni. You might not be held in very high regard but that's not important.

Did you do the french bac? I'm guessing you took S?
Also, IQ means jack, trust me
To answer your question, studying will always get you further at the end of the day, but I believe that the ability to solve certain logic puzzles that involve critical thinking is innate, which is probably why your friend missed out
Don't congratulate yourself just yet though, because the guy who studies his ass off will always top the guy who reaps his innate abilities to an absolute minimum

>>9058373
>135 iq
>brainlet
fuck you faggot
kill yourself

>>9059442
yeah I know that. actually I'm 100% certain that I would never, ever be able to even think about going to polytechnique, because I'm not trained and knowledgeable enough, and I never used my abilities, to the point that I can feel them fading away.
But let's be honest, IQ does mean something. It's not a perfect predictor, there isn't a 100% correlation but come on. You'll never see a math genius with a low IQ.
(I'm saying usually good at maths => high IQ, which in turn woud mean one is good at solving some sort of puzzle. but then it's hard to define who's good at maths and who's done a fuckton different exercises, especially in our system)

>>9059446
literally anyone I know who finished high school claims to have 130-140. Dunno why they'd lie, and if they did dunno why they'd all pick the same range.

>>9059442
whoops, forgot to answer to the first question.
yeah of course I took the baccalauréat scientifique.

>>9059455
The thing is that the way we define intelligence is really quite loose and vague
If anything, calling someone "smart" or "intelligent" is just a run of the mill comment on their character, rather than being anything with a neurological or psychological foothold
IQ is a good predictor of conscientiousness, it's highly correlated with success rates in this academia driven society
Hear that? Academia. Returning to your previous point, the reason that you never see a maths genius with a low IQ is because IQ tests are oriented towards quantitative and verbal-linguistic skill sets, which ties in to why people who score high on IQ tests have a much higher potential for success.
The Flynn effect actually tackles this issue in a roundabout way: people aren't getting smarter, IQ tests are just geared for educated peoples (https://www.brookings.edu/articles/heritability-estimates-versus-large-environmental-effects-the-iq-paradox-resolved/ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flynn_effect)
I could go on for a while, but..
You already have an edge, and so help me god if you don't take advantage of that.. You doubt that you'll ever get into this lycée, but the reality is that you'll be able to advance much faster than someone lacking in quantitative skills IF you decide to study
Don't forget that there's no damn time limit ticking down until you can't go to uni anymore. Just study and improve yourself, then go for it
Don't want your abilities to leave you? Work for them then, as most others have had to
(side note, i've been through the french system and it's hellish, they're so obsessed with mathematics that's it's actually fucking ridiculous)

>>9059487
>If anything, calling someone "smart" or "intelligent" is just a run of the mill comment on their character, rather than being anything with a neurological or psychological foothold
I agree with that, the word as it's used commonly can mean a whole slew of things.
However, here by smart I mean "intuitive" at maths, that's my definition anyways, since it's my background and my day to day. Language students would probably correlate being "smart" with being able to learn a language quickly and efficiently, and so on.

however

>IQ is a good predictor of conscientiousness, it's highly correlated with success rates in this academia driven society
Hear that? Academia. Returning to your previous point, the reason that you never see a maths genius with a low IQ is because IQ tests are oriented towards quantitative and verbal-linguistic skill sets, which ties in to why people who score high on IQ tests have a much higher potential for success.
The Flynn effect actually tackles this issue in a roundabout way: people aren't getting smarter, IQ tests are just geared for educated peoples

That's not true, half of an IQ test is "performance" skills i.e. puzzles, spatial reasoning etc. And even the verbal portion doesn't have much to do with language per se.
Actually there's a guy who's somewhat famous in IQ circlejerks, can't think of his name, he was an near illiterate farmboy who took an IQ test in the army and ended up doing a PhD or something after the shrinks decided it wouldn't be fair to waste his potential.

>>9059535
Yeah the problem with "smartness" being applicable to difference situations is that in a clean cut psychometric approach, they're often too highly correlated to each other to even be considered separate
So what does IQ measure?

I see your point with the alternate skill sets IQ tests target, but it doesn't take away from my original point
Maybe workers weren't able to solve such puzzles, not because they were stupid, but because they hadn't been brought up with such a mindset
https://www.livescience.com/21778-early-neglect-alters-kids-brains.html
https://www.boundless.com/psychology/textbooks/boundless-psychology-textbook/intelligence-11/introduction-to-intelligence-61/genetic-and-environmental-impacts-on-intelligence-243-12778/
These two articles suggest that a low IQ can be either crystallized from early on or grow, depending on the environment the child was raised in
Interesting story concerning the farmboy, I can only think of him as some sort of "sleeper" genius who simply didn't have the opportunity to discover his own skills, however ridiculous that sounds
Anyways, what do you think of my proposition that you work your ass off and try to get into this uni? I have faith in you

>>9059463
They are lying to appear smart.

135 IQ is in the 99th percentile by definition. If you are in the top 1% of intelligence, you are not a brainlet by any means.

>>9059596
Still feel like a brainlet sometimes. But I took the test when I was 7 so it's possible I became a brainlet in the meantime.

>>9058547
Go LDAR. Please dont take others with you, /r9k/ faggot.

>>9059607
He does have a point though. People who were blessed in one area have a tendency to tell others it's just a matter of trying, maybe to piss us off, maybe because they feel guilty, or maybe they just don't understand how different they are. Either way it's very frustrating (hence the fact that every board has their own version of "just b urself bro")

>>9058591
Frenchfag here, are you saying universities like UPMC aren't actually that good?
How difficult is it to get in a master's program there?

L'ami je suis dans le même cas que toi, j'ai foiré dans une bonne prépa parisienne, puis là je suis en MIASHS à la sorbonne parce qu'au moins ca permet de trouver un peu de boulot après. Là ya des anciens mecs de ma classe qu'ont eu L'X et Mines...et je suis dégouté parce que je suis sûr d'être plus intelligent qu'eux.

Not OP, but my experiences give me very relevant information to this thread: I messed up my CPGE (a good one, too) because I was used to spending my weekends in high school playing vidya and smoking weed, did 45 minutes of maths exercices each sunday before bed, and still got only 19s and 20s in math because (HS was all brainlet-tier stuff), so I simply couldn't adapt to the workload of a prépa. I was, in a way, ready for this so I had done some administrative work before going to my prépa (on some shitty french government website designed for brain-dead highschoolers) to make sure that I would have "parallel" options of joining a uni when getting kicked-out of the prépa (you guys should understand: prépas feel like ultra-strict boarding high-schools, because that's exactly what they are except with insane university standards when it comes to the content of classes). I had the choice of doing a comfy Maths, or even Maths and CS, major at a no-name uni, which I was actually interested in, or a meme degree with some maths, some economics, some CS, and even some shit like fucking sociology which I don't even bother attending, all because it's at one of those unis that have the ~same standards as a "Grande École", so I might actually have a chance at being employed after.

L'X's oral entrance exams are actually public to spectate, and if you call to say that you're a teacher, are passing them, or plan to do so, you can actually get an authorisation to sit behind the examiner and look at them. I signed up for that (even though I don't plan on showing up for the exams), and some of the people passing them are pure brainlets.

>>9061684
cont'd:

My point is: the french system generally gives more valor to "hard but dumb work" rather than intuition or out of the box thinking.

>>9061684
>>9061689
Are you sure that not going to a grande école guarantees a shitty career in France, even if you went to a decent grad school?
I'm pretty sure my only option is to hope I can get into a good master's program. That said, I fell for the 42 meme instead of studying proper CS, so I guess I deserve to be jobless.

>>9061689
Name a country that doesn't have this system.

>>9061714
USA

>>9061528
>except for less than a handful prestigious universities with sort of a special status
principalement l'UPMC et sûrement Dauphine. y'en a peut être d'autres.

>>9061684
Bon moi c'était pas une "bonne prépa parisienne", mais une milieu de classement.
J'ai fait une semaine en MIASHS parce que je pensais que ce serai la planque, puis je me suis barré, c'est hyper déprimant. Genre des maths niveau seconde.
Là je viens de foirer une année (dépression, j'allais pas en cours), ce qui me fait deux ans de retard. Je vais essayer de voir si en tapant 18 de moyenne je peux me transférer vers une fac de non-cuck ou tenter une AST mais je pense que mon dossier va me c u c k

>>9061696
it depends on your field. Even if you're a maths/physics/cs/economy PhD you'll always get cucked by people from Grandes Ecoles or business schools (like HEC, which are a complete meme). But if you have a degree in law or biology, since there's no "grande école" in those fields then you're good. My uncle has a PhD in biology from an ok uni and is making 8k a month working in Hong Kong for a big french company.

>>9061905
this.
Apparently at least you have sort of an IQ test to decide whether you get into a good uni or not. Unless that other anon was lying?
Spanish here, it's way simpler in my country: we don't have any good or prestigious uni kek.

>>9061969
Rentrer à UPMC pour un master/doctorat c'est aussi chaud que Dauphine?
>you'll always get cucked by people from grandes écoles
Pourquoi pas aller tout simplement bosser à l'étranger? Si la France veut pas de ses PhD, l'Angleterre et les US en veulent peut être.

>>9061979
>Rentrer à UPMC pour un master/doctorat c'est aussi chaud que Dauphine?
je sais pas du tout. moi avec mon dossier déjà pourri je me fais pas d'illusion. je vais déjà essayer d'avoir 17-18 de moyenne à ma L2/ma Licence pour voir si après l'une ou l'autre je peux aller à une univ moins pourrie, genre Strasbourg ou au mieux Paris 7 Diderot. Sinon, oui idéalement je tenterais d'avoir une Centrale ou une Mines de province sur les places réservées aux facqueux mais avec mon dossier c'est chaud.
Je suis tombé bien bas. Pour les PhD j'imagine que ça marche, j'en sais rien. Quelqu'un sait?

>>9062001
Après y'a toujours les VAE si t'as des notes de merde non? Et même 15-16 me paraît être une moyenne potable pour un master.
Je sais même pas si moi j'aurai la possibilité de m'inscrire en master vu que 42 ne délivre pas un diplôme d'état. Putain la déprime

>>9062010
C'est quoi VAE?
Pour le transfert idéalement je le ferai carrément en L3 si c'est possible, mais comme certaines fac sont plutôt sélectives je sais pas. Y'a des gens qui disent que deux ans de retard c'est fini, mais bon moi j'ai un peu une excuse, j'ai fait un an de MPSI raté, puis un an d'ECS réussi (l'ECS c'est une blague énorme), puis une L2 ratée pour les raisons évoquées. Donc je sais pas, je verrai. Deux ans de prépa et deux réorientations, c'est pas comme si j'avais retapé deux fois ma L1 quoi.
Et 42 c'est con, parce qu'à ce qu'il paraît c'est plutôt chaud, mais ça sert à rien. Au pire essaie de te réorienter en licence de maths info, tu devrais tout torcher non? Si t'as fait 42 en post bac ça devrait pas te faire trop d'années de retard, et au pire si on te demande ben t'as flairé l'arnaque alors t'as décidé de te réorienter.

>>9058431
>Logic puzzles
>Intuition

>Logic
>Intuition

They're two different things, friend.

Maybe the person at l'ecole polytechnique didn't feel like exerting himself, and refrained from applying much brainpower during his deductions.

>>9058591
At least you don't automatically get in because your skin is brown.

File: IMG_0313.png (73KB, 640x1136px) Image search: [Google]

73KB, 640x1136px

>>9059163
Not that anon, but I looked. He's unfortunately not lying.

>>9062094
no, but I do think they tinker with the results in order to take more women in.

>>9062100
That anon also mentioned that twice as many males apply.
Without confirming this information the statistics you've provided is insignificant

>>9059350
American education is shittier because Tyrone and Juan get a full boat if they've passed Calculus and Susan goes to any STEM school she wants because she's a woman interested in STEM (!?!), whereas Joseph and Chen are ignored for obvious reasons, even though Joseph cured cancer and Chen solved the problem of world Africa.

If anything, I'd rather have Frances system - it sounds like a meritocracy, and not one subject to the delusions of virtue politics.

>>9062075
VAE c'est une équivalence qui te permet de valider un master par évaluation de tes compétences, après je sais pas exactement comment ça marche.
>deux ans de retard c'est fini
Pourquoi? Ce serait très con comme fonctionnement, et pas très logique.
J'ai jamais entendu parler d'une fac qui te ferait chier à cause de ton parcours tant que t'as les compétences requises.
>ça sert à rien
Paraît que leurs devs sont plutôt bons, c'est surtout pour le master que ça va coincer. Apparemment le cursus est reconnu comme équivalent à bac +3 ou +5, donc je comprends pas trop.
Ouais j'ai 19 ans donc ça va encore, après "tout torcher" je sais pas vu qu'il y a pas vraiment de maths à 42.
>si on te demande
Ça me semble bizarre ça, j'ai vu pas mal de mecs de 23 ans et plus en L1, depuis quand les facs en ont à foutre de ce que t'as fait avant?

File: IMG_0314.png (225KB, 640x1136px) Image search: [Google]

225KB, 640x1136px

>>9062113
Here's something. Note that a portfolio is something you submit during your application. Just googling "gender imbalance" at MIT yielded some pretty scary articles/blogs, and on their own website.

Even though over twice as many men apply, women still have a higher acceptance rate.

>>9058556
>>9059607
How the fuck would you even know anything he said is from /r9k/ unless you go there yourself? More proof that morons are always projecting.
>>9058511
A grand school is a type of university.

>>9062124
In France, at least at the Msc level, has quotas too. I know it because I completed a master at the ENS, and there is a fixed percentage of foreign people to accept (not sure about gender/race though) but still. Also, there are very good French researchers that are struggling to get by because of this quota. They can't get promoted even if they are better than foreigners, because of muh melting pot.
So yeah, maybe the entrance for people coming from CPGE is strictly result-based, but don't be fooled. Some jewish arab is still going to get a better position than you even if you get superior results.

France should belong to the French only. I mean, you can study there if you want, but if you're looking for tenure, then get the fuck out, faggot.

Aussi, il y a une ségrégation anti-goy assez élevée. Putain de juifs, cassez-vous. La France se fait manger de l'intérieur...

>>9062147
>completed a master at the ENS
After a CPGE or a licence? How harsh is the barrier to entry?

>>9062131
Y'a des parcours très sélectifs en fac, genre les magistères. En plus de ça y'a des facs qui en elles mêmes sont sélectives.
On a jamais vu un mec arriver avec 2 ans de retard d'une université pourrie et être accepté à l'UPMC.
Moi j'ai 20 ans et je rentre en L2 dans une fac sans renommée, j'ai l'impression que c'est la fin.
en plus de ça là j'ai l'impression d'avoir perdu mon talent, c'est fou.
>repenser à mes profs de Term qui me voyaient à l'ENS
>repenser à tous les les brainlets au lycée à qui j'expliquais les maths, et qui aujourd'hui sont aux Mines de Nancy MINIMUM
tuez moi

>>9062124
Yeah it's exactly that, a meritocracy. But as such it doesn't reward the smartest (which I'm not claiming to be a part of) but simply the hardest working. (this is an oversimplification, of course complete brainlets won't get into a good school as I'm assuming it's the case in the US)

>>9062151
Not him but it's really pretty fucking hard. Unless you're among the 150 most gifted mathematicians of your year, you're not getting in.

>>9062170
I should specify, I meant the most gifted in France, obviously. And by mathematicians I meant math students, technically they only take undergrads in (I think)

>>9062166
Ah oui, je parlais des masters normaux, pas des magistères.
Mais je savais pas que l'UPMC était si sélective. Du coup une licence maths-info là bas je peux oublier?
>je rentre en L2 dans une fac sans renommée, j'ai l'impression que c'est la fin
C'est pas comme si t'étais en master dans une fac de merde, y'a encore moyen que tu te rattrapes — c'est quoi ton plan de carrière? Tu veux faire de la recherche?
>perdu mon talent
Oui, mais t'as encore une marge de manoeuvre. Et au moins t'en as, du talent.

>>9062182
>Mais je savais pas que l'UPMC était si sélective. Du coup une licence maths-info là bas je peux oublier?
Je sais pas en vrai, mais c'est ce qu'on m'a dit. Après, on m'a peut être dit des conneries.

>C'est pas comme si t'étais en master dans une fac de merde, y'a encore moyen que tu te rattrapes — c'est quoi ton plan de carrière? Tu veux faire de la recherche?
Avant oui, mais en vrai je suis pas assez intelligent/doué/HAUT QI pour faire de la recherche intéressante ou même avoir un doctorat je pense. Je sais pas, mon cerveau rouille depuis tellement longtemps. Même dans ma fac de merde je loin d'être le meilleur (après je suis jamais allé en cours et je me suis ramené au partiel en ayant bossé 1h30 donc bon).
Maintenant idéalement j'aimerais soit intégrer une école ou Dauphine ou au pire une école de commerce pour me la toucher, soit oui faire mastère+doctorat/agreg pour devenir prof et me la toucher.
Au pire je sais que j'ai toujours les admissions parallèles des écoles de commerce qui sont ouvertes (c'est hyper facile), mais bon payant+c'est de la merde mais il faut bien gagner sa vie.

>>9062198
Ça existe les facs "juste milieu" qui sont pas trop sélectives mais pas trop de la merde non plus, dans le domaine?

>ou même avoir un doctorat
Faut pas non plus être un génie pour ça. Tu voudrais un doctorat en maths (pures)?
Je te connais pas mais t'as pas l'air con. Tous les gens à qui j'ai demandé m'ont tous plus ou moins dit que pour un doctorat faut être intelligent certes mais surtout se défoncer.
Donc actuellement ton projet c'est d'avoir un taff calé et tranquille vu que tu penses pas pouvoir faire de la recherche?
Les écoles de commerce faut aimer, perso je trouve que c'est un gros circlejerk.

>>9062209
>Ça existe les facs "juste milieu" qui sont pas trop sélectives mais pas trop de la merde non plus, dans le domaine?
J'avais fait une rapide recherche et il me semble que Strasbourg, Rennes 1 et Paris 7 sont censées être bien, et je pense pas qu'elles soient si sélectives que ça. Strasbourg et Rennes je pense que c'est aussi parce qu'elles accueillent un magistère, donc évidemment ça doit jouer dans la renommée.

>Faut pas non plus être un génie pour ça. Tu voudrais un doctorat en maths (pures)?
>Je te connais pas mais t'as pas l'air con. Tous les gens à qui j'ai demandé m'ont tous plus ou moins dit que pour un doctorat faut être intelligent certes mais surtout se défoncer.
>Donc actuellement ton projet c'est d'avoir un taff calé et tranquille vu que tu penses pas pouvoir faire de la recherche?
>Les écoles de commerce faut aimer, perso je trouve que c'est un gros circlejerk.

Faut quand même se donner à fond, et moi ça m'arrive très rarement de me concentrer. Je dois avoir ADHD ou un truc du genre, je suis un millénial après tout. Même si j'adore les maths je galère toujours à me concentrer, même pendant un DS.
Mais oui mon but en gros c'est ça. Après si j'ai un doctorat je peux devenir enseignant chercheur dans une petite fac de merde genre la mienne, mais je ferai sûrement rien de transcendant. Enfin je parle de ça, il faut déjà que j'aie ma licence.
Sinon le truc que j'ai repéré c'est les Centrales de province, la barre a pas l'air d'être super haute niveau talent, ils ont un concours d'admissions parallèles et certaines écoles (Nantes par ex) ont un double diplôme avec une école de commerce. Après ça t'es bien je pense (du moins en France). Je vais le tenter mais bon avec mon dossier... J'aurais dû m'intéresser à tout ça en Term ou en prépa.

>>9062209
>Les écoles de commerce faut aimer, perso je trouve que c'est un gros circlejerk.
Clairement, c'est de la merde surcôtée qui tire son prestige de on sait pas où et qui réussit à se faire passer pour une formation réservée à l'élite intellectuelle alors que n'importe qui peut y entrer. tout ce qu'ils savent faire c'est caler des mots en anglais dans chaque phrase histoire de vendre du rêve aux ploucs dont le but est de partir aux "States" faire des liasses. Les "managers" kek.
Comme précisé j'ai fait une ECS, j'ai rien branlé, je me suis absenté comme un malpropre plus de la moitié du temps et j'ai été premier, avec 14 de moy. Et le pire c'est que c'était plutôt une ECS bien classée.
Enfin tout ça pour dire que la voie commerciale c'est effectivement du vent.
Mais bon, ça rapporte énormément alors tant qu'à faire, si y'a pas d'autre solution autant en faire une. Quitte à être trop con pour faire de vraies études, autant être riche hein.

>>9062166
putain je suis >>9061684,

>les profs au lycée qui me vendaient du rêve alors que je survolais des sous-cerveaux qui aujourd'hui ont tous un avenir meilleur que le mien assuré

"hits home", comme ils disent sur /r9k/

>>9062241
Les dossiers pour les facs c'est fini là?
Elles sélectionnent par les notes de lycée?

Je suis pareil et c'est très casse-couilles, t'es allé voir un médecin pour confirmer si c'était vraiment de l'ADHD? Y'a aussi des méthodes du genre pomodoro pour le travail régulier.

>je ferai sûrement rien de transcendant
T'es pas obligé de rester en université non plus. Certains domaines dans le privé sont très intéressants pour les docteurs en STEM.
Centrales de province je connais pas, je pense que viser un bon master déjà ce serait pas mal, après je me suis pas renseigné.
Si tu veux du fric pourquoi tu fais pas de la finance? Avec un master en maths t'es déjà bien, et t'auras pas à côtoyer tous ces suce-boules de "startuppers" et autres qu'on trouve dans les écoles de commerce

>>9062262
>csq les profs au lycée ont abandonné tout espoir à mon égard dés la première parce que je branlais absolument rien
Je peux même pas me dire que j'ai gâché mon talent comme vous deux, parce que j'en ai pas.

>>9062280
C'est mieux que de n'en avoir plus.
>>9062262
J'avais un mec en Ts, un abruti complet, mais au point où il avait sûrement un léger retard mental. A chaque fois qu'il y avait une nouvelle notion il galérait à comprendre. Il bossait 6h par jour chez lui, ses parents lui ayant interdit les écrans. Ben il avait 17 de moyenne en maths, physique, SI et il est aux Arts et Métiers aujourd'hui (dans les 1ers)

>>9062271
>Les dossiers pour les facs c'est fini là?
Oué pour presque toutes c'est fini. Je le sais parce que je voulais changer mais je m'y suis pris trop tard. En plus il paraît que c'est hyper chaud administrativement, voire impossible de changer de fac entre 2 années de licence, même avec un dossier en béton, alors moi... Après il me semble que t'as des facs ou y'a une deuxième vague d'inscriptions fin août. La mienne a ça en tout cas. Mais tu veux pas venir dans ma fac.

>Je suis pareil et c'est très casse-couilles, t'es allé voir un médecin pour confirmer si c'était vraiment de l'ADHD? Y'a aussi des méthodes du genre pomodoro pour le travail régulier.

Non j'y suis pas allé parce que je trouve que c'est un truc de millénial et que ça fait un peu "excuse". J'ai déjà été diagnostiqué Asperger à l'insistance de ma mère donc j'ai déjà donné de ce point de vue là. Je connaissais pas Pomodoro, ça t'aide toi?

>tous ces suce-boules de "startuppers" et autres qu'on trouve dans les écoles de commerce

J'aime pas non plus cette culture de la start up, en fait la culture de l'entrepreneur tout court. On fait un amalgame entre les maths, l'économie, la richesse, l'intelligence et on te crée le stéréotype de l'entrepreneur, ce visionnaire touche à tout qui fait rêver tous les cons (pas que les commerciaux, les écoles d'ingé aussi ont une grosse gaule sur la start up). Bien un truc de burger.
J'ai lu récemment "life is an IQ test and money is how we keep score". Youpi on est tous plus malins que Perelman.

>>9062323
>life is an IQ test and money is how we keep score
>il existe des gens qui pensent ça non ironiquement

>>9062323
>C'est mieux que de n'en avoir plus
Vraiment? De toute façon, y'a bien un moment ou, vrais génies mis à part, tout le monde doit fournir des efforts. Pour la plulart ça vient au collège/lycée, pour d'autres c'est plus tard.

>presque toutes c'est fini
Ça se fait entre Janvier et Avril sur APB c'est ça?
>hyper chaud administrativement
Au niveau des places à pourvoir? Tu vas faire comment alors?
Et du coup ceux qui ont arrêté puis repris, ou qui ont un parcours irrégulier en général, ils sont baisés?
>fin août
Pour le semestre de Janvier? Je vais me renseigner. Elle est vraiment mauvaise en maths-info ta fac?

>ça fait un peu "excuse"
Dans la mesure où la plupart des gens qui disent avoir de l'ADHD ont juste des problèmes mineurs de concentration, oui. Mais ça + asperger ça pourrait être un handicap réel.
Pomodoro c'est un bon moyen de structurer ton travail pour éviter de te faire chier et de te surmener. Moi ça m'aide pour apprendre à programmer mais ça fait que quelques semaines.

>la culture de l'entrepreneur tout court
Je suis d'accord, et ça colle pas du tout avec la culture française, ce qui rend tout ça très artificiel. C'est aussi ce qui me fait peur à 42, j'espère qu'ils sont pas tous comme ça.

>>9062412
>Ça se fait entre Janvier et Avril sur APB c'est ça?
Non y'en avait c'était jusqu'au 20 juillet, genre Grenoble

>Au niveau des places à pourvoir? Tu vas faire comment alors?
>Et du coup ceux qui ont arrêté puis repris, ou qui ont un parcours irrégulier en général, ils sont baisés?
Je sais pas, c'est un peu mon cas aussi.

>Je suis d'accord, et ça colle pas du tout avec la culture française, ce qui rend tout ça très artificiel. C'est aussi ce qui me fait peur à 42, j'espère qu'ils sont pas tous comme ça.

Non et puis même, n'importe quel con peut devenir un "entrepreneur" ou devenir riche. N'importe quel con peut faire HEC/ESSEC et fonder sa startup, il a rien prouvé. Moi j'ai un respect immense pour les gens qui ont des idées que je serais physiquement incapable d'avoir, mais c'est tout.

>>9062521
Et APB c'est galère? Tu dois fournir tes bulletins toi?
>c'est un peu mon cas
Ce qui est certain c'est qu'on est pas prioritaires.

Ouais le principe du succès entrepreneurial c'est d'être chanceux essentiellement, et accessoirement d'être bon en relationnel.

>>9062698
je sais pas j'y suis pas allé depuis ma term sur apb.
effectivement toi je sais pas mais moi je pense pas que mon dossier fasser rêver. aucune uni qui se bat pour m'avoir quoi.

>>9062323
>J'avais un mec en Ts, un abruti complet, mais au point où il avait sûrement un léger retard mental. A chaque fois qu'il y avait une nouvelle notion il galérait à comprendre. Il bossait 6h par jour chez lui, ses parents lui ayant interdit les écrans. Ben il avait 17 de moyenne en maths, physique, SI et il est aux Arts et Métiers aujourd'hui (dans les 1ers)

Arrête, tu me fais mal a penser aux gros crétins de Ts qui étaient tous plus forts que moi en maths et qui ont probablement du faire central / supelec / grandes mines, alors que je me suis fait une CCP moyenne en admission parallèle.
Enfin bon, au moins ensuite t'as une chance de combler l'écart en accumulant de l'expérience, au final 5-10 ans après l'école ton diplôme on s'en fout.

>>9062698
APB demande rien du moment que c'est pas un truc sélectif, mais pour changer de fac d'une année à l'autre faut monter un dossier et les contacter directement. Si tu veux une L1 c'est cadeau par contre, t'as juste a te soucier du nombre de places si c'est pas dans ton académie.

>>9058379
I studied at school with a physics Phd from cambridge. He got average A-Level Results ABB (the B was for Physics)
and submitted a group dissertation for his Phd, his only publication. He wasn't the smartest guy at school but had a healthy enthusiasm and was a pushy, talkative guy. In this case it was enough for a Cambridge physics Phd. He's arrogant as fuck now.

>>9063129
>
Most of the time admission at top schools comes down to luck, even if you have the grades. Did he do his BA at Cambridge? You cant get in with grades like that can you?

>>9063147
UCL

>>9063147
Phd Thesis: Transition Edge Sensors with Few-Mode Ballistic Thermal Isolation. He's the first name: DJ314l

>>9063114
>Arrête, tu me fais mal a penser aux gros crétins de Ts qui étaient tous plus forts que moi en maths et qui ont probablement du faire central / supelec / grandes mines, alors que je me suis fait une CCP moyenne en admission parallèle.
Tiens tu me fais penser à un truc d'ailleurs. Je connais un mec qui était dans mon lycée (pas dans ma classe), c'était un genre de Will Hunting irl. Par contre ses notes le reflétaient pas tant que ça parce que toutes ses copies étaient dégueulasses et mal rédigées. Il a commencé une licence de physique puis il a fait un truc pro, je sais plus quoi. Des fois je me demande comment il se sent.
Quand je vois que moi qui suis en fac et modérément doué je déprime déjà...

>>9063165
Found him. He's a CTO now in an AI company. Next Sergei Brin?

>>9063193
Fuck man this is depressing. Not bad for a guy who had to retake a maths A-Level module.

>>9063209
ROACHED

>>9063209
All these meme-research buzzwords. Dude is not a scientist, he is a careerist.

>>9063114
>si tu veux une L1 c'est cadeau
L1 dans n'importe quelle fac sauf Dauphine ils demandent aucun bulletin/CV/etc et t'as juste à t'y prendre tôt pour avoir des places?

>>9063275
yeah but now with his cambridge credentials, peter thiel will give him a blowjob.

File: 743639268.png (62KB, 1135x678px) Image search: [Google]

62KB, 1135x678px

>>9063209
what does proprietary mean?

>>9064356
It means they haven't figured this shit out yet, but with investor interest they will. By paying someone else to do it.

>>9064366
isn't that cheating?

>>9064367
nah lots of 'interesting' startups do it, a big company may buy it(eg yahoo, Google) when it has attracted lots of capital. Nothing to do with the dude being a scientist, its about earning trust with other peoples money.
Then you just sell out.
If you think some people do Phd's to celebrate Feynman or Euler, you are deluded.

File: 35627567.png (472KB, 430x436px) Image search: [Google]

472KB, 430x436px

>>9064379
Then he marries Miranda Kerr

>>9058373
>seeking validation from 4chan
kys brainlet

>>9058431
You're right in one thing. You're a bitter brainlet. Your IQ doesn't have anything to do with it, it's your attitude. I got to ÉNS while struggling with math during lycée, and am doing pretty good so far. You just have to grind IMO problems and you automatically learn the tools to ace the entrance exams, the rest is up to your diligence. Even if his IQ was 30 points lower than your, you have no right to act like this- you're worthless piece of lazy shit. You remind me of so many disgusting brainlets in mensa, acting superior because of a number while being totally irrelevant themselve. Get yourself together and actually do something, no one but /sci/ gives a shit about IQ, you either work hard and have a chance to achieve or you're a waste of oxygen that has no place in polytechnique and other elite institutes.

Is there any record of a high level math 'genius' accomplishing a remarkable feat of human ingenuity or bravery or wisdom outside of an academic paper?

>>9064434
Grothendieck fighting the Devil. He's the holy paladin m8.

>>9058556
are you trying to be stupid? You're like one of those boomer fucks who likes to give kids false hopes and expectations. "shoot for the stars" "spend tens of thousands of dollars on a degree that will get you nowhere. It worked for me!"
Why is it so hard to believe that most people aren't cut out to be mathematical geniuses? It would be like expecting to become a world class track star, just because you ran a little cross country in highschool. These things take tremendous amounts of effort, as well as natural ability(genetics).

>>9059670
>People who were blessed in one area have a tendency to tell others it's just a matter of trying

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect

>>9064192
La plupart des L1 sont accessibles de plein droit avec un bac général. Jamais eu de problèmes de place/quotas pour entrer en L1, et j'en ai fait plusieurs dans différentes facs (la plupart à distance cependant).

>>9064572
C'est bon à savoir. T'as jamais galéré pour les places? Surtout en ce moment la plupart des filières sont bouchées.

>>9064434
Kaczynski's actions weren't precisely ethical but he was considered a math genius and displayed a high level of ingenuity and boldness outside of academia (of society even).

>>9064581
En cas de doute le plus simple est d'appeler le secrétariat de la fac qui t'intéresse et de leur poser la question.

>>9064595
C'est ce que je vais faire, merci anon.

>>9058599
bullshit

>>9064412
Evan Spiegel is a lucky guy

>>9058373
>citing iq
sage

>>9064695
>2017
>still being an anti-IQ crybaby

>>9063114
>je me suis fait une CCP moyenne en admission parallèle.
comment as tu fait? c'est sur dossier uniquement? c'est quoi comme CCP?

>>9064732
>comment as tu fait?
Ca se fait en fin de L3 ou M1, ou bien fin de L2 dans quelques rares cas (si t'explose tout ou que c'est un parcours special destiné à l'admission sans passer par la prépa - le cas ou l'école d'ingé est rattachée a la fac).
En fin d'année (en général vers avril-mai, mais selon les écoles la période d'admission peut aller de février à juillet-aout) tu vas sur le site de l'école et tu télécharges le dossier à remplir.
J'en ai fait que 4-5 mais j'ai vu que des trucs classiques dedans, du type classement dans la promo, notes, avis des professeurs sur ta poursuite d'étude, et souvent une lettre de motivation.

>c'est sur dossier uniquement?
Ca dépend de l'école ou du réseau d'écoles, en général ils te font dossier + entretien, certaines (pas la majorité) font que dossier, et les mieux classées (eg. "sivouplé prends moi monsieur centrale") font en général soit dossier + entretien + concours, soit dossier + concours

>c'est quoi comme CCP?
ENSEIRB-MATMECA (ca fait longtemps que j'en suis sorti alors je m'en fous un peu de balancer le nom), elle fait élec / télécoms / info, plus quelques parcours par alternance.
Je m'en plains pas, le réseau est plutot bon et les recruteurs la connaissent plus ou moins.

Si tu penses faire une admission parallèle, faut aussi que tu saches que tu perds obligatoirement 1 an, puisque qu'ils te font passer dans l'année au dessous (admission en L3 -> 1ère année d'école), donc ca te fait un diplôme d'ingé en minimum 6 ans, mais le taux de redoublement est faible en école de toutes façons.

>>9058373
>I'm still a 135 IQ brainlet nobully and I'm pretty sure that means I can't get into one of the more prestigious schools
You're right. The only means to get into an Ivy Plus school is to send your IQ scores. If they're below 180, they won't even look at your student record.

Si j'étais une grosse merde en maths en 1re/Tle S (je foutais rien) y'a moyen d'acquérir un niveau correct avec des sites type Khanacademy?
Ou bien brainlet un jour, brainlet toujours?

tfw 125 iq
tfw stupid af
tfw can't understand maths

>tfw iq divergent
>141 verbal iq
>86 fucking processing
my verbal isn't even that good. i just want to discover new things

>>9065414
>tfw 153 verbal 105 performance
just a test anyways, nothing to worry about r-right?

>>9065326
je sais pas, sûrement. ça doit dépendre de ton âge. de toutes façons si ça t'intéresse vraiment, au point que ça t'obsède, tu deviendras forcément bon.

>>9065326
Ca peut se faire du moment que t'as pas un retard mental de diagnostiqué. Le plus important je pense c'est d'avoir quand même des bonnes bases, si tu sais pas factoriser alors tu peux pas intégrer, et sans intégration ou sans suites tu peux difficilement faire de l'analyse, de la même facon que sans algèbre linéaire c'est dur de faire de la topologie.
Le programme de maths de Ts est étonnamment court (hors spé), donc je te conseille de trouver un manuel et de te refaire l'essentiel du cursus, ca devrait pas prendre plus de quelques semaines.

>>9058373
Sorry, but if you don't have an IQ of at LEAST 170, you will never do anything in maths. Maybe you can work your way up to being a franchise owner for Mcdonald's.

>>9065642
>Sorry, but if you don't have an IQ of at LEAST 170, you will never do anything in maths
that's true though. true of pretty much any hard science, I might add.
well not maybe 170 but you get the gist. If you're not super smart (which is LITERALLY equivalent to having a super high IQ) and your brain is not B I G then you'll never do anything noteworthy. what's so hard to understand about that?

>>9065634
>hors spé
tu déconnes ou bien? le programme de spé est ridicule, ça se fait en moins d'une semaine.

>>9065599
you posted this just to say you were smarter than me

>>9058373
>implying 90% of Asians are geniuses
math is a skill

File: rms.jpg (13KB, 220x167px) Image search: [Google]

13KB, 220x167px

>>9064434

File: pepe.png (61KB, 475x382px) Image search: [Google]

61KB, 475x382px

>Big brained boy
>very lazy though
>understand that I'm too lazy to work hard in real sciences and too dumb to be a genius
>change path and go to Sciences Po
>work just a bit more than in high school and graduate after 5 years of partying
>good network and diploma guarantees me a good career from the get go

>>9065634
La TS c'est des bases suffisantes ou faudrait entamer le programme maths sup ensuite?

>>9065326
T'as quel âge maintenant ? T'es allé à la fac ?

>>9066672
20, et oui mais j'ai arrêté pour changer de cursus.

>>9066663
Suffisantes pour quoi? Si t'as pas d'objectif, fais en jusqu'à ce que t'en aies plus envie non?

>>9066876
>Suffisantes pour quoi?
Pour m'orienter vers n'importe quel domaine ensuite. La TS + spé couvre tous les sujets fondamentaux en maths?

>>9066899
Ben ça dépend. Si tu veux t'orienter en L1 maths (ou en L2 MIASHS haha) alors oui. Si tu veux entrer à Normale Sup Ulm probablement pas.

Je viens de réaliser que mon prof de TD en Equa Diff, dans ma toute petite fac, que je prenais pour un brainlet absolu, avait fait l'ENS Ulm. Comme quoi.

>>9066904
Le niveau moyen d'une L1 maths c'est beaucoup moins intense que maths sup?

>>9066962
Pareil, dans ma fac bien paumée comme il faut y'avait un mec avec un double doctorat, anciennement prof a l'UPMC. Ma théorie c'est que soit ils ont plus rien produit de bon au niveau des recherches et ils ont voulu échapper a la pression en faisant plus d'enseignement, soit ils aiment vraiment la région / ont de la famille dans le coin.

>>9066976
Au niveau des heures de cours c'est pas du tout comparable, t'auras peut être 30-35 heures de cours max en L1, alors que la prépa te collera minimum 8h par jour du lundi au vendredi avec devoirs sur table le samedi.
Pour ce qui est du programme (maths uniquement), je pense que la MP doit avoir une longueur d'avance mais que tu dois être a égalité avec tout ce qui est PC, PSI, PT etc.

>>9067006
>PC, PSI, PT
Il y a physique et chimie en licence de maths aussi?

>>9067020
Ca dépend des facs, d'après ce que j'ai vu, certaines groupent les spé math avec les sciences de l'ingé (ex. MIPI a l'UPMC), donc tu te retrouves avec un tronc commun qui contient de la physique-chimie en L1 voire en L2, d'autres ont leur propres département math-info avec un tronc commun 100% maths et des spécialisations plus pointues (en général y'a quand même 1 ou 2 UE de physique par semestre).

>>9067006
>Pareil, dans ma fac bien paumée comme il faut y'avait un mec avec un double doctorat, anciennement prof a l'UPMC. Ma théorie c'est que soit ils ont plus rien produit de bon au niveau des recherches et ils ont voulu échapper a la pression en faisant plus d'enseignement, soit ils aiment vraiment la région / ont de la famille dans le coin.
Après y'a des gens qui perdent leur niveau aussi. Ma prof en ECS était sortie bien classée de l'X et pourtant moi et un autre on l'HUMILIAIT bien souvent. En même temps, prof à la longue ça doit tuer le cerveau, et tu dois perdre ta maîtrise des trucs que t'enseignes pas.

>>9066976
>>9067006
>>9067020
>>9067077
Honnêtement L1 et MPSI c'est le même programme. T'a même plus d'heures de maths en fac qu'en prépa. Mais le niveau d'exigence est pas le même. Bien que le programme porte sur les mêmes notions. Et puis c'est pas la même approche, pas les mêmes types de gens.

>>9067077
Et les cours de physique pour les spé maths ou maths-info L1 et L2 c'est exigeant ou ça sert pas à grand chose?
>>9067116
>pas la même approche
Dans le sens où la prépa c'est plus scolaire?

>>9067124
>Dans le sens où la prépa c'est plus scolaire?
Oui c'est ce qu'on dit en général. Les X eux même reconnaissent en général qu'ils ont une moins bonne compréhension que les bons facqueux, puisque de leur contact avec les maths se résume à leur entraînement pour le concours, ils ont pas vraiment de temps de vraiment s'intéresser. (attention, je dis pas qu'ils appliquent tous bêtement leurs formules comme des collégiens non plus hein)
Enfin c'est ce qui se dit en tout cas.

>>9065695
it is cause it is depressing. it is like loving something and then being told you can never be part of it

>>9058373
>IQ of 135
>brainlet

What is wrong there ? I cant seem to figure it out.

>>9067132
Je pensais que l'X était supérieure à la majorité des facs en terme de niveau.
Comment ça se fait que le rythme est plus intense et les exigences plus strictes, pour un résultat équivalent ou inférieur à l'enseignement universitaire?

>>9058373
>other than the fact that iq is bs
135 is considered "very superior" and is plenty to do math of any sort. it's mostly familiarity, and actually liking it.

>>9067353
I love it, but I'm way better at some things than at others. And I'm shit at tests. I'm just good at solving exercises where there's a clever little trick involved, but I'd be completely unable to take the entrance exam to any Grande Ecole, much less l'X, and I fully realize that. Different ways to be smart I guess, the IQ reference was more of a reference to /sci/ memes anyway, kinda like /fit/'s 6'3" manlet. Simply said I'm not a mathematician, I'm a puzzle-solver at best (not a prodigious one either), I'm fully aware of it. But I thought these two were related up until now.

>>9067265
Je sais pas, ce que disent les X en général c'est qu'ils sont simplement des machines à concours, et quand tu vois ce qu'est la prépa c'est facile à croire. Ils ont des idées évidemment, et ils sont pas cons, encore une fois ils sont bien obligés l'exam de l'X c'est pas un contrôle de connaissance de cours. Mais ce qu'ils disent en général, c'est qu'une fois à l'X, un mec vraiment passionné (qui a plus de temps, peut se consacrer à ça pleinement car aucune autre matière, et aime vraiment ça contrairement à bien des X dont le but est d'être administrateurs) en master dans une grande fac les mettra à l'amende. Encore une fois je ne fais que rapporter ce que j'ai lu et entendu.
Donc le rythme plus intense, les exigences plus strictes, il se peut que ça tue un peu leur créativité et que ça les force à avoir recours au bachotage parfois.

>>9067386
>Donc le rythme plus intense, les exigences plus strictes, il se peut que ça tue un peu leur créativité et que ça les force à avoir recours au bachotage parfois
(cont.) ça et le fait que ce soit pas toujours la passion des maths qui les anime.

>>9067077
Les licences d'info et de maths en france c'est plus ou moins la même chose?

It is true that CPGE don't let much space to the love of science but it isnt't their role to form mathematicians. CPGE are here to teach hard work and thus give the means to study anything later on if you are ever interested.
Talking about ingeneering school (besides the elite ones) the point is to build a network, become social which is quite important in France to have a great career. It matters much more than your level at school (even elite school)

>>9067410
Non pas du tout. Sur le site de la fac tu pourras voir les masters correspondant à chaque licence

>>9067440
Je pensais qu'il y avait beaucoup de maths dans les licences d'info (d'où le nom maths-info). Plus que dans les autres pays en tout cas

>>9067466
Si tu as une idée de ce que tu veux faire, je te conseille de partir des masters en question pour savoir quelles licences suivre, ça évitera des déconvenues.
Il faut aussi regarder les UE car parfois des parcours qui ont des noms proches sont très différents dans leur approche (plus appliqué ou plus théorique, plus de développement ou plus de mathématiques. ..)

>>9067124
>Et les cours de physique pour les spé maths ou maths-info L1 et L2 c'est exigeant ou ça sert pas à grand chose?
C'est un tronc commun donc ca va être assez basique (genre mécanique du point, ce genre de conneries). Le principal intérêt c'est surtout que si tu veux changer de spé t'as juste a faire les UE associées a ta spé.

>>9067487
Ceci. Les facs proposent souvent des parcours un peu différents avec des masters qui existent pas forcément tous ailleurs (et qui sont parfois selectifs), même si en général les licences sont standardisées pour les poursuites d'études vers le master.

>>9058373
Don't mistake someone's ability to do puzzles with his ability to do higher level math.

>>9067487
>>9067585
>partir des masters
Je vois pas de cas de figure pour lequel une L3 informatique serait préférable à une L3 maths; accéder à un master d'informatique avec une licence de maths c'est facile, mais un master en maths avec un cursus informatique, c'est plus difficile.

>>9064332
>>9063275
Peter Thiel gave a speech last year giving advice to investors on tech. He said if a company's pitch had buzzwords you should know it's a scam. His example was "we want to utilize machine learning to process big data on the cloud" or something like that. I'm too lazy to look It up.

I read his book 0 to 1. It was actually decent, half of it is devoted to shitting on pretentious pseuds who use buzzwords

Also frenchies, plz speak in English, I want to know what you're saying

>>9065350
Well you don't even know how to say it correctly lmao.

IT'S FUCKING MATH

>>9058373
lol guys op here doesn't it suck having only 150 iq lol, im so dumb xD

you're the loser equivilant of a fine ass bitch begging for facebook likes by putting a 10/10 photo up and calling herself ugly.

>>9068310
>Also frenchies, plz speak in English, I want to know what you're saying
Meh, too lazy to translate but it's mainly about specific points in our school system and academic orientation, not really interesting since you don't have the exact same system. Basically we're talking about the content of bachelors in software engineering and mathematics and how bachelors of science compares with the grandes écoles (which is kinda like high-ranked tech institutes you have).

>>9068376
yeah, dropping out of first year of anything, CPGE or not, is definitely the embodiment of intelligence and success. OP is trolling us, lowly individuals, and is actually happy not to go to the ENS, which is clearly beneath him.

pd

Putain moi quand j'y pense c'est encore pire, j'avais des résultats corrects (18 maths/ 19.5 physique au bac) et on m'a menti en me faisant croire que la fac c'était la voie idéale pour faire de la recherche. Quand je disais que ce n'était pas vrai, on me disait juste que les CPGE et ENS, etc, c'était SEULEMENT pour devenir ingénieur. Donc je suis allé à la fac comme un pigeon, parce que le gars qui cherche à la fac a sûrement dû faire la fac, c'est logique. Ben non. Je suis baisé maintenant et j'ai même pas eu ma chance. Je me sens trahi et je ne sais pas quoi faire. J'hésite entre l'assassinat frénétique et le suicide. Je déteste ce pays de merde et j'ai trop envie de me venger.

Je ne dis pas que je l'aurais eu, juste que ce n'est pas éthique de me cacher la vérité pour X raison (sûrement car ils pensaient que je ne supporterai pas la pression, mais ce n'est quand même pas une raison pour me manipuler).

>>9068845
Désolé mais faut quand même être pas très malin pour se fier à une seule source d'information, surtout quand on a accès à Internet.

>>9068861
Mes profs de lycée, mon "conseiller d'orientation", et mes proches. Comme je te dis, je le savais que c'était pas vrais, mais il se sont concertés pour me manipuler. Donc oui, pour le coup c'est comme si c'était une seule et unique source d'info. Mais ça, je ne le savais pas.

Et sur internet, si tu cherches, t'as 50% des topics de témoignages où tu trouves des mecs qui disent que CPGE et fac c'est à peu près pareil (LOL) mais c'est juste des gens qui veulent se rassurer car eux ils ont fait la fac, et il y en a beaucoup car (# d'entrants en fac) >>> (# d'entrants en CPGE).

Les gens sont tellement insécure que quand tu vas dans un topic et que tu dis que la fac c'est de la merde, t'as un troupeau de moutons qui disent le contraire.

Là où j'aurais vraiment pu savoir, c'était en regardant tout simplement les CV des chercheurs, mais ça, à l'époque, je n'y avais pas pensé, et je n'en connaissais aucun.

>>9068845
>ENS, etc, c'était SEULEMENT pour devenir ingénieur
t'es un peu con aussi.
Mais au pire tente une admission parallèle. Des mecs qui ont ton niveau en fac il doit pas y en avoir beaucoup (les gens qui ont de telles notes en terminale vont en prépa)

File: leonhardeuler.jpg (31KB, 599x449px) Image search: [Google]

31KB, 599x449px

What exactly do you call what Euler is wearing on his head in this picture?

>>9068948
The swag-hat™®

>>9068845
C'est peut être pas la voie idéale mais je vois pas pourquoi tu serais baisé

Does anyone here actaully study at ENS?
I study at a 3rd wolrd country (Eastern Europe) and during my 3rd year I want to apply. My grades are top tier, but that's probably not enough to get in there. Any advice?

Omelette du fromage

>>9069081
Everyone on /sci/ is in high school.
Have you not seen all the threads about complex numbers and first degree equations?

>>9069112
we're reaching 9gag tier levels of reddit

>>9069081
Admission tests for the ENS are fucking hard and it makes no sense to apply before you're at least at your last year of bachelor, and you must be less than 26.
http://www.ens.fr/en/academics/admissions/international-selection
If you really want to study in france the easiest thing to do is ask for an exchange or pick a lower ranked university

>>9069124
I guess I just wanted to hear some success stories, but the university is so small that most likely no-one on this board has studied math there.
The reason for trying to admit in my 3rd year is because they give priority to those who are in their 2nd or 3rd year.
I guess I'll just try my best. It sucks that you can only apply once in a lifetime. They don't review second applications.

>>9069133
Going into 2nd year. As i wrote earlier, grind IMO and you'll ace it. Don't go here though, it's pretty hard to keep up.

>>9069183
If you had the choice now, you wouldn't go? Why so?

>>9068845
Are you implying that a master's at a good university is worthless and that CPGE+ENS is the only possible way to get a decent career?

>>9069333
Completely. Except if by "decent career" you mean slave of the Jewish in some shitty corporation (codemonkey), depending on your major.

There is no such a thing as a good university in France. It's all pure garbage. I hope Islamists are going to take it over, as I am sure their education level is significantly better than ours.

>>9069354
What is a decent career in your eyes? Becoming a tenured professor?
>slave of the Jewish
Does that mean anything in the private sector? There are interesting things you can do with a math-heavy master's or PhD at a private company, where the barrier to entry might not be as high as in prestigious research universities.
>There is no such thing as a good university in France
Several were named ITT. ENS, Polytechnique, UPMC. I'm sure you could count others like Centrale or Mines as well.

File: download.jpg (9KB, 225x225px) Image search: [Google]

9KB, 225x225px

>>9069354
>What is a decent career in your eyes? Becoming a tenured professor?
Depends on what your goals are. If you want to do research, then yes, it is the only way. Universities offer research-oriented program; if they don't deliver at least a chance to provide this opportunity then it is nothing short of a scam, but France is well-known for being a reptilian, traitor country.

Else, if you don't want to do research, then engineering is good I guess, but I don't know much about that. Anyway, if you don't want to do research, then I have no fucking idea what you are doing in a uni.

Actually, I don't know what good they are for. Engineering ? Go to any grande école. Research ? ENS. As a frenchie I have no idea what universities are for, at least in science. My guess is that they are run by rats who pretend it is useful so they get tenured prof positions.

>There are interesting things you can do with a math-heavy master's or PhD at a private company,
>interesting
Jew detected. What the fuck are you doing out of the oven ?

You're talking about a prestigious research universities. I'd do research in any university. The problem is, they're all at the same level : pure trash, but pretending to be hot shit.

>Several were named ITT. ENS, Polytechnique, UPMC. I'm sure you could count others like Centrale or Mines as well.

You mean the Grandes écoles (except for UPMC), yeah, I was talking about universities. The grandes écoles are great if you plan to be an engineer. Otherwise, the only good ones for research are the ENS and, to a lesser extent, X (Polytechnique) (the others are also pure trash for research, even worse than unis)


UPMC isn't a grande école, and is just as trash as, say, university of Tours or whatever french uni you're thinking of. Some posters in these threads are deluded, thinking that switching from a "no-name" unversity to a Paris one is going to make any kind of difference.

>>9069408
>>9069364
Quoted the wrong post

>>9069195
I wouldn't because i don't have enough time to develop on my own. It's meant for better folks than me.

>>9069408
l'UPMC a une très, très bonne réputation et est très sélective. à ce qu'on m'a dit, les élèves là bas n'ont rien à envier aux X/ENS au niveau du niveau justement. Mais c'est un peu l'exception. Les autres universités, même les "bonnes", se valent un peu toutes.

>>9069333
ENS have shit careers generally since they're underpaid researchers (underpaid relative to their achievements ofc). The real money is in engineering schools (X, Centrale, Mines) though few people actually become engineers afterwards. Also if you go to a business school you'll get more or less the same respect as someone who went to X/ENS, and be paid more, but without actually having to work or be smart.

>>9069449
>est très sélective
Au niveau licence elle l'est autant que n'importe quelle autre fac.

>>9069449
Ok, donc t'es de l'UPMC.

Pourquoi y'a autant d'étudiants là-bas si elle est sélect, et pourquoi tous les profs d'universités no-name ont fait l'ENS plutôt que l'UMPC ? La seule personne que je connaisse qui ait fait UPMC, c'est mon prof... de lycée.

D'ailleurs il me semble que pour intégrer n'importe quelle fac, il faut juste avoir le bac à 10, donc toutes les universités se valent exactement. y'en a juste certaines, dont UPMC, qui notent peut-être un peu plus sèchement pour se la péter, mais le niveau est le même. Genre, peut-être qu'un 11 à l'UPMC est un 10 à Tours, mais rien de transcendant.

ENS don't have shit careers, they chose their paths and got what they wanted in the first place. If they change their minds, they can go anywhere they want.

>>9069408
>As a frenchie I have no idea what universities are for, at least in science. My guess is that they are run by rats who pretend it is useful so they get tenured prof positions.
Holy shit are you retarded Mr epic-jew-meme ? They are there because ENS can't train all of the french researchers just like Polytechnique alone is not going to supply 100% of the engineers

>The problem is, they're all at the same level : pure trash, but pretending to be hot shit.
Yeah it's well known that only grandes écoles are doing acceptable research. Jesus christ, it's the return of "everything ranked lower than the MIT is garbage" man. I can't argue with the fact that universities think they're better than they are but you really sound like an arrogant pile of shit with a fedora mounted on top.

>>9069459
oui, très sélective en master bien sûr. c'est pour ça que je la compare aux écoles.

>>9069469
voir ci dessus. je suis pas de l'UPMC, mais dans une fac no name justement et moins de la moitié de mes profs a fait l'ENS. Et puis le fait que les UPMC reçoivent aucune reconnaissance ne change rien au fait qu'apparemment, de ce qui se dit dans le milieu (mais qui est ignoré des DRH et autres), ils auraient un très bon niveau.
Donc en gros ils sont bons même si ils sont pas tellement reconnus en tant que tels. Mais ça c'est l'énorme problème qu'on a ici, si t'es pas X-ENS-Mines-Centrale ou HEC-ESSEC-ESCP-EDHEC de toutes façons t'auras beau avoir un excellent niveau, personne le saura et même si ils le savaient ils s'en foutraient.

>>9069480
The ENS are very close to being the one and only supplier of researchers in France, in physics and maths. The others just do a trash phd and then get to decide whether it is best to surrender to the Jewish corporations or to kill themselves (or others).

Universities actually carry out decent research projects, and are not total ghost towns, only because the researchers that work there are themselves from the ENS.

Yes, people from the ENS are the only quality researchers in France, partly because the others simply don't get a chance.

The MIT stereotype you are referring to is ridiculous, because even burgers are above us in terms of education. There are multiple ways to get one's chance in the US, even if it is difficult. In France, there is only one path and a very strict age restriction. You can't be late by even one year. So even if you fall very sick, your life as an academic is pretty much over since the start.

France is a disgusting traitor country that gets literally everything it deserves.

>>9069507
How hard is it to get in an ENS master/L3 program?

>>9069514
Insanely difficult from a CPGE, impossible from a University. (University = goy filter).

>>9069507
>Universities actually carry out decent research projects, and are not total ghost towns, only because the researchers that work there are themselves from the ENS.
> There are multiple ways to get one's chance in the US, even if it is difficult. In France, there is only one path and a very strict age restriction. You can't be late by even one year. So even if you fall very sick, your life as an academic is pretty much over since the start.
I think you may need to see a psychiatrist, because you're bitter and deluded at best and paranoid at worst. ENS staff is only about a thousand researchers, i don't think they have the capacity to do all of the decent projects, stop sucking its dick for a second you fanboy.

>>9069524
>impossible from a University
What makes it so hard?
Is it more difficult than to get into a master's at Oxbridge or Ivy Plus?

>>9069532
The ENS staff is only a subset of people who graduate from the ENS and steal positions that should belong to us, who went to the University. But traitors prefer to hire those who come from the ENS even if they're total new comers and dirty jews.

All of my professors are from the ENS, and I am not from the ENS. The ENS graduates who hold tenured positions are much more than 1k, and tremendously overrepresented. Like the jews in media.

I can't believe that we lost the war. It is truly the worst thing that could happen to the world. Every other civilisation is going to perish.

>>9069538
It is so hard because they just won't take a goy. Find the best student at your university and dare him to apply. He'll get rejected even if he has an amazing record.

I don't know about foreign universities, but there are much more diversity and funding there than in France, so even if focusing on one single uni might be as hard as getting in the ENS, it is not your only choice, which makes it easier.

In the US, some are close to the top, many in the middle, while a lot lie at the bottom of the barrel. In France, they're all at the bottom except the ENS, that's the reason why it's so hard.

>>9069556
Getting in a top US/UK school as an international student is probably even harder than getting into ENS

>>9069538
What makes it so hard?
There's very few positions reserved for university candidates
>Is it more difficult than to get into a master's at Oxbridge or Ivy Plus?
I can't tell, but with these types of school the hardest part is the admission exam, once you're in, you're pretty much guaranteed a diploma unless you completely fuck up.

>>9069543
I can't tell if you're serious anymore

>>9069568
You might not agree with my view on jews, but what I say is true for the positions held by the ENS guys. They are every-fucking-where in physics and maths.

>>9069566
Probably, and rightly so. Foreigners shouldn't be stealing positions from other countries.

>>9069575
>They are every-fucking-where in physics and maths.
I'll just apply for a CS degree then.

>>9069568
There's no admission exam for either Oxbridge or top American universities.

>>9069575
It makes sense that they would be part of some of the best research, since they're kind of an elite group after all, but claiming they are everywhere ?
Eh. I highly doubt that more than 300 people graduate from ENS every year.

>>9069597
300 per year is probably enough to fill _ALL_ of the positions.

People work on average for 40 years. What's 40*300 ?

French here, our system is truly the worst
First, you have to slave away during high school and while high school math is easy as fuck, the way some subjects are taught leave little place for imagination or talent, so you just have to work.
That already rules out the "smart but lazy" (yes, I know we love memes but let's face it, we all know they exist, we've all met them, and I'd even go as far as saying the more talented you are, the lazier, probably by force of habit but that's not the topic).
Then, among that pool of already hard working students that get to go to a good CPGE, you have to be among the hardest working, to determine whether you can get to the second year. It's then, and only then, that talent comes into play, as a means of separating the "good from the great" so to speak.
But wait, do you see where's the problem? They're not selecting the 1% most talented in the whole country, they're selecting the smartest 10% of the 10% that worked the hardest in high school and first year CPGE, there's a difference.

>>9069604
Not to mention that even if you make it, salaries in france are shit-tier.
No wonder so many frenchmen are leaving to work in the UK or USA.

>>9069604
>>9069604
cont.
So if you were lazy in high school or had personal problems, it's pretty much all over for you, sorry. You'll go to a university which, as everyone mentioned, hold pretty much the same status in France as Community Colleges in the US (with Grandes Ecoles being Ivy, and nothing in between).
It wouldn't cost a dime more to teach you the same things they do in CPGEs, and have you do the same exericises, but they won't because your ex-ENS professors think all uni students are untalented garbage, which isn't completely wrong since uni is free and everyone with free time who has graduated high school goes there, and it's hard not to be jaded as a professor when most of your students are just there because their friends are there too.
Everyone, including the staff, justs assumes that since you went to uni you're not worth bothering with. Uni is depressing, it's like they're trying to make you understand there's no prospect, french campuses look like ghettos and I suspect they put them in ugly parts of the cities on purpose.
Meanwhile your CPGE friends are studying in nice 19th century buildings downtown with motivated professors who treat them as equals (I get what the goy guy is saying, it's very similar). They train during two years doing the same type of exercise, and no matter how good you are you'll never reach their level of performance on entrance exams, because that's what they trained for. You might be better at math, in the sense that you have a better/deeper understanding, but they are more specific. They know what the jury expects, they know how to divide their time, hell they've probably done most exercises that come up at least once. That's what they trained for. They don't necessarily have to be good at math, they're exam acing robots at that point.

>>9069663
I'd rather understand math than understand exams, to be honest.
>if you were lazy in high school or had personal problems, it's pretty much all over for you, sorry.
This is stupid. Plenty of successful people never went to a top school.

In order to not spew that much bullshit it would be better not to talk about business schools, CPGE, engineering schools if you don't have an overview of the situation.
While some real problems of our education have been highlighted, so much bullshit was written alongside.

Et puis pour ne pas faire perdre espoir aux lycéens, qui ont eu des notes moyennes mais qui souhaitent tenter les concours les plus sélectifs, ce n'est pas impossible.
En excellant dans une petite prépa en sup, on peut en intégrer une très bonne en spé. Mais surtout, ce n'est pas la prépa qui caractérise la réussite d'un élève. Des génies scientifiques sortent de prépa moyennes (cf mes profs de maths en prépa).
Pour ceux qui veulent devenir ingénieur alors qu'ils sont à la fac, c'est aussi possible. Et si vous êtes sérieux, ça peut être plus simple que de passer par les CPGE. Cependant je conseille tout de même de passer par une CPGE si votre objectif est d'intégrer une école.

>>9069676
>so much bullshit was written alongside.
Like?

>>9069663
cont.
And in the US there's what? 15 relevant unis, with 10000+ students each? and if you're from some hick state uni, who cares right? as long as you went to college. sure, you'll probably get cucked by someone from Princeton or MIT, but you'll still have plenty of job offers, especially if you have a PhD.
Not in France. If you're not in the <1% that went to a good engineering school or good business school (which are an absolute fucking joke but somehow are as prestigious as engineering school), then you're a laughingstock and you shouldn't expect to ever get a good job. Really. You can say "I've got a PhD from (any uni that isn't Paris 6 or Dauphine)", people will literally laugh at you. You'll have to suck miles of cock if you want to make more than 2k/month.
The difference with the US, it seems, is that in the US it's easy to have an ok life, just work a bit, don't be a complete idiot, do good on your SATs, go to an ok uni (which again, take in more than 200 fucking students a year) and then you're set, you're in a motivating environment, you might not be a millionaire later but you'll have a comfy life.
In France, either life is so fucking easy and you get job offers left and right (Polytechnicians for instance can get pretty much any job they like because of how prestigious their school is. They hog all of the top paid jobs, even those that don't have anything to do with math)
or
you're garbage and you're going to suffer your whole life.
So the top is way higher but way harder to reach, with no middle ground.
Just typing this as a french PhD student in a no name uni made me depressed.

>>9069711
What's stopping you from getting a job elsewhere than in France?

>>9069676
Are you referring to me? (I'm the guy who wrote the three walls of text)
If so, I'd be curious as to what you think is wrong in what I said. I've been both a Maths Sup MPSI and an ECS student so I'm not just saying things.

>>9069706
For instance
In most engineering schools, not only A and A+, students easily find jobs. You just have to study something applicable to diverse sectors (automatics, software engineering ...) to be sure not to be too impacted by a financial crisis.
This is mostly due to two things : overall lack of engineers and the power of the network.

Business schools are not that liked right now in technology groups (Airbus Group) and if one doesn't network properly one will fail.

Besides, if you excell during your license you can go to a Grande Ecole easily or switch university to follow a master.

>>9069711
>any uni that isn't Paris 6 or Dauphine
And why didn't you go there for your master's?

How likely am I to get into the ENS if I have a 4.0 GPA average after my 1st year of uni?

>>9069727
Yes and I am curious about your PhD btw.
Tu le fais dans quel domaine et sur quel sujet? Comment ca se fait que tu penses que ça ne tapportera de reconnaissance ? Ça m'aurait bien tenté un doctorat et chez nous les doctorants sont placés comme chargé de TD si besoin puis prof .

Je te donne un peu de contexte pour que tu saches où j'en suis.
Perso, je suis un grand branleur, j'ai fait une prépa top 15 (pas le mieux mais on entre pas mal de gens dans des ecoles A+). J'ai rien branlé même en *(j'ai même pas révisé les concours...). Et je me retrouve dans une ecole de catégorie B (une honte pour mes profs *). J'entre en M1 l'an prochain et je me tâte à faire une thèse.

J'ai l'impression que ton avis est très négatif. Je connais des respo RH de grandes entreprises et même si je connais bien la triste dureté du travail pour les masters, je pensais qu'à travers la thèse on pouvait créer un réseau professionnel et trouver du travail dans le public ou le privé.

>>9069794
>la triste dureté du travail pour les masters
Des masters en sciences ou ingé n'arrivent pas à travailler? Je savais pas que c'était autant la merde ici

>>9069813
Master en science. Ingénieur y a pas de soucis dans la majorité des cas. Les politiques RH de grands groupes placent les ingénieurs bien au dessus des masters (même si ils savent que les masters peuvent etre bien meilleurs academiquement) sauf cas très spécifique.

>>9069778
Same as everyone else that doesn't prepare specifically to get to ÉNS. Nil.

>>9069819
C'est difficile pour ceux qui trouvent pas d'emploi en France de simplement s'expatrier? Je parle des masters qui viennent d'universités ou écoles moyennes (pas l'élite).
>sauf cas très spécifique.
Par ex?

>>9069813
Après si tu vas dans un domaine en développement qui recrutera pendant des années (cyber sécurité. ..), même en sortant de l'université tu devrais être employé rapidement.

>>9069823
>cyber sécurité
Y'a pas autre chose? Parce que honnêtement la sécu c'est chiant. Quitte à faire de l'informatique je me serais plutôt orienté vers le big data, machine learning ou autres buzzwords du même genre, au moins c'est intéressant.

>>9069822
L'expatriation j'ai aucune connaissance et encore moins pour les universitaires désolé.
Cas spécifique : secteur qui recrute à tour de bras, spécialité rare/n'existant pas en école, poste très qualifié (dans ce cas un doctorant qui est spécialisé dans ce domaine est apprécié )

>>9069838
>un doctorant qui est spécialisé dans ce domaine est apprécié
Même un doctorant d'une fac moyenne donc? Un autre anon laissait entendre qu'un doctorat qui n'est pas de l'Ulm, Dauphine et autres était littéralement inutile.

>>9069830
Je suis étudiant en école d'ingénieur pas spécialiste des métiers d'avenir. Je préfère ne rien avancer plutôt que me prononcer sur un sujet que je ne connais pas. J'ai cité la cybersecurite car c'est sûr d'être de plus en plus important, il y a bien sur d'autres domaines émergents pu qui émergeront.
Après oui faut chercher dans les buzzwords et les secteurs qui ne souffriront pas des avancées technologiques présentes et futures.

Kek at the people crying here that admission exam to ÉNS doesn't tell anything about their mathematical talent. That's not its purpose, it is made that way to weed out people who couldn't handle the requirements that is put on us as researchers.
Yes, you have to be extremely diligent in your preparations to get in. And the pressure doesn't release as you get admitted, quite the opposite. It gets tougher. At least the staff treats you really as their peer, you can eat lunch with your proff and discuss, even when you meet them outside of academia.
You could be a talented mathematician and still not get into ÉNS, but that doesn't say that much about your talent rather than about your nonexistant work morale. Stop being such crybabies, should have studied harder, you knew how it works in France.

>>9069847
Je ne sais rien au niveau des ULM. Maintenant il faut voire leur nombre et les postes qu'ils tendent à occuper. Peut etre qu'ils se sont accaparés la recherche a certains endroits (j en ai pas la moindre idée ). Néanmoins, ils sont loin des seuls à faire de la recherche, en particulier dans la ville où j'étudie.
Ce que je dis c'est qu'un spécialiste reconnu dans un domaine trouvera du travail tres facilement SI sa spécialité intéresse des recruteurs. Même en France même sans avoir fait une ENS

>>9069598
>300 per year is probably enough to fill _ALL_ of the positions.
Fuck no it isn't

>People work on average for 40 years. What's 40*300 ?
>implying no new position ever because no retirement

>>9069869
Bon au moins ça confirme que faire un master et doctorat vaut le coup même sans être dans une des meilleures écoles.

>>9069863
Fucking shit country I swear.

>>9069890
Après comme je le répète souvent, le réseau, la sociabilité et je rajouterai l'adaptabilité au milieu sont très importants pour réussir sa carrière.
Trois éléments qui peuvent faire défaut aux universitaires (j'ai pas dit que c'était toujours le cas et que tous les ingénieurs réunissaient ses trois critères).
Je répète aussi que le marché du travail est plus dur pour un master universitaire que pour un master avec le titre d'ingénieur (politique de recrutement).

>>9069869
Et à part ça les X qui se font littéralement sucer les boules par tout le monde et qui bossent dans l'administration alors que ça a aucun rapport avec ce qu'ils font, on en parle?
Mais le pire restera les écoles de commerce, ça je maintiens. On traite ces mecs avec respect et déférence alors qu'un lycéen pas trop con avec un bon niveau pourrait entrer à HEC.

>>9069863
Except 17 is a pretty fucking young age to determine your entire fate. Plus not everyone knows how it works. They still tell you uni is a good choice when in reality even a Phd is only marginally better than being a high school dropout.

>>9069794
>Yes and I am curious about your PhD btw.
>Tu le fais dans quel domaine et sur quel sujet? Comment ca se fait que tu penses que ça ne tapportera de reconnaissance ? Ça m'aurait bien tenté un doctorat et chez nous les doctorants sont placés comme chargé de TD si besoin puis prof .
Je vais pas mentir, je viens juste de terminer mon master (Rennes I), j'ai dit Phd parce que ça fait plus classe et que c'est ce que je compte faire, mais chut.

>>9069961
>even a Phd is only marginally better than being a high school dropout.
Now you're just being retarded.

>>9069772
Dauphine is a business school in all but name so my personal ethics prevented me from going.
Paris 6 doesn't have a lot of places available, and while it has a much better reputation than other unis among scientists, and probably a better level too, it's all the same to HR. Either you're an engineer/manager or you're uni trash.

Frenchfag here.
When is it too late to consider doing a PhD?
By the time I get my master's (if I do) I'll be at least 26.
If I get a PhD after that, I'll only start working in my early thirties.
It just seems kind of depressing to start making money that late.
Given how PhDs are treated in France, I'll be making a shit wage for years, and my peers will have advanced to a mid level position in their careers by the time I enter the workforce.

>>9069663
>french campuses look like ghettos
kek this so much.
I grew up on american movies like most yurocucks.
I had a very set view of what a campus should look like: old buildings, lots of grass, happy people partying and playing frisbee, frat houses.
Actually there's none of that.
Everything looks like literal soviet russia, there are ugly immigrants and niggers everywhere, not 10% of these people have french as their mother tongue. Everyone is depressed, there are no parties but no serious students either. Just a bunch of autists sending texts to their high school friends from their 10m2 room.

>>9069961
Ah et du coup en quel domaine ton master pour avoir une vision si négative ?

Même si ils ont des avantages énormes, les X sont très méritants pour moi. Ce sont généralement ceux qui ont réussi à développer une bonne éthique de travail et assurer un bon niveau dans toutes les matières étudiées grâce à celà. Je vois pas pourquoi je devrais prétendre aux mêmes avantages qu'eux alors que je n'ai pas su être à leur niveau en prépa.
La majorité des X qui sortent sont des ingénieurs très équilibrés et vifs d'esprit (ces qualités les rendent appréciables dans la majorité des secteurs) même si il y a quelques paumés dans le lot.
Bien sûr je comprends le problème que tu évoques. Pour rattrapper les avantages qu'ils ont acquis en 2/3 ans de travail intensifs, une vie est rarement suffisante. Mais si l'on vaut mieux que tous les autres sur tous les plans qui comptent, rien ne nous empêche de les dépasser

>>9069895
Could be much worse, couldn't be that much better though.
>>9069961
If you don't know that you want to be in academia when you're 17, you are already a sub-par specimen for it. Most people i met here began prepairing around 12, few even as soon as 8 because of their parents pressuring them. I personally began at 17 because i was a disgusting lazy fuck before, but it became my life. I don't know about you, but teachers on my lycée were very clear about the education system. You might have bad teachers if they tell you to go to uni just because, our were always saying you have to study your ass off to get to GÉ. I think everyone even remotly interested in continuing his education beyond the mandatory basics knows how it works. And for those that didn't get to GÉ, there is still the prospect of working abroad. I have a friend from lycée that works in Hong-Kong for some pretty sweet compensation.

>>9069989
If you're in it for the money, forget it, especially if you can't join the ENS, which I assume is very likely to be the case.
Why did it take so long for you to make up your mind though ? Or maybe you couldn't afford studies at the time ? Just wondering.

>>9070017
>And for those that didn't get to GÉ, there is still the prospect of working abroad.
So how does that work exactly? How different is the hiring process?

>>9069989
The real question is what do you define as too late. Some people get their phd at 50 y.o..

>>9070019
Why forget it? And no, can't join the ENS.
>Why did it take so long
I didn't have a clue what I wanted to do in high school and wasted time.
>>9070021
>what do you define as too late
There's no consensus? I don't know, entering the workforce in my thirties seems late.
Even in terms of salary it sounds like it'd be hard to catch up.

>>9070020
You look at offers from companies abroad, you apply. If they mind you being foreigner, they tell you to fuck off, if they don't they work with you on formalities. That was the proccess my friend went through, it took him about half a year i think to get done with the bureaucraptic formalities.

>>9070021
>Some people get their phd at 50 y.o

That doesn't mean it's a good idea.

Some peope fuck goats for enjoyment.

>>9070029
What's your friend doing now? What/where did he study?

>>9070027
> to catch up
Depends how much you make now and how much you would make after.
I can only give you a general advice since I know nothing in details and this isn't my area of expertise.
Réfléchis bien à tes motivations profondes et vois par toi même (ou fais toi accompagner) pour savoir quelle direction prendre. Le plus dur est de savoir réellement pourquoi on veut faire quelque chose. A partir de là, des professionels pourront te conseiller et non pas des random sur une image board japonaise.

>>9070017
Not even talking about academia. Polytechnicians don't become part of academia. As for me I was good at math. I was great, even, but I had no pressure from my family or teachers to do anything, so I went to a ECS CPGE (business school prépa), and when I realized how much of a scam it was I decided to switch, fortunately it was so easy that I had great grades, so I was accepted in first year MPSI CPGE in a good lycée, still with no purpose but everyone told me if I liked math that's what I should do. But they were wrong. It was for careerist little pricks who didn't understand shit except that if they rote memorized 10 proofs a week they'd be rich later. Seriously one of the top guys in that class was one of the least talented people I've ever met in all of my studies. I wasn't accepted in second year because I didn't study one second and I'm absolute shit at physics (seriously, I'm pretty sure even a /lit/ undergrad has a better level than me), so I went to uni. I don't really regret it, it really wasn't for me. I don't have the right mindset, too much autism. For instance, whenever I don't fully understand and visualise why a property or equation is true, I don't use it. You can see how that would be a problem.
>>9070013
Crypto, ils avaient un truc en partenariat avec un truc en Allemagne. J'ai pas encore commencé à bosser (et je pense pas commencer de si tôt) mais ce que j'ai dit ça se sait, y'a qu'à voir comment on pompe le dard des X alors qu'un doctorat n'impressionne personne. Et oui évidemment, ils sont plutôt intelligents dans l'ensemble, mais faut qu'on arrête de nous dire que c'est l'"élite" de quoi que ce soit. C'est l'élite des mecs qui ont étés assez possédés pour se crever le cul d'une façon impensable pendant 2-3 ans, c'est bien tout.

>>9070032
Well, at some point anyone can set his priorities as he desires.
Some will put a point on being part of the elites (X/ENS), some just want to study a material at a higher level because they have an interest in it others because they are interested in earning more.
If someone wants to start research at 30, why shouldn't he besides the fact that he probably will have a really hard time to find a job far from his university/director of research/firm who paid the thesis?

>>9070048
Bien qu'il y ait des profils tres différents chez les X, ils ont généralement une très grande adaptabilité + réseau. Un bon manager doit comprendre diverses situatios et savoir s'y adapter. Les X en sont capables (généralement) c'est pourquoi ils sont appréciés à des postes de manager/direction. Les entreprises s'en battent les couilles qu'ils ne soient pas des génies des mathématiques ou autres. Ils sont rarement cantonnés à des postes techniques. Je ne pense pas qu'un doctorant lambda même très bon dans son domaine ait développé les qualités qui sont recherchés chez les X.

>>9070035
He's working in some chinese half-commercial institute, presumably related to nanomaterials, since that's what he was always focusing on. He studied physics at UMPC.
>>9070048
So you wanted to go to polytechnique, not ÉNS, my mistake i didn't read the whole thread. I wouldn't know about that, i never wanted there though i can see how employers could be biased for polytechnicians. I too thought i was great at math when i, after discovering Kolmogorov's books at 17, quickly explored a great amount of higher mathematics. I too thought memorising dozens of proofs is a useless excercise for us. Both things i changed my opinion on, first i'm barely good at math. To be good at math means having no problems grasping any topic, being great means discovering and exploring them on your own, without the help of the decades and centuries of great mathematicians. As for the style of memorization, i now think it's great as a filter for GÉ. If we were taught difficult subjects, lazy people would get there. Memorization is the best heuristic we have to judge how hard one is willing to work, which is ultimately what matters. There are no doubt people smarter than me here, i'm just about average in this regard, i'm sure. But they're not performing as good as me because, they choose to visit family or girlfriends or play games or whatever. In just one year i went from being the underdog that everyone thought would drop out, to being offered a part-time on research here. IQ doesn't mean shit when we're in numbers above 140, it all comes down to hard work. The system is currently somewhat unfortunately set up though, in that it is there for pretty much just the elite. Lazy, or let's say those that aren't willing to sacrifice enough, are chewed by it and shat out to work a shitty unfulfilling work. There certainly are things to change to the better, but as it is now, it works well as a filter for elite institutes.

>>9069722
Where? US? UK? Fucking protestant pigs, I'm not that desperate lol. Still love my country and my race.

>>9070099
So typical of french. It's sad you'd rather sit here on kyrghyz yak-milking forum and whine to bunch of high-school roleplayers (and a few undergrads, even fewer grads) instead of trying to get to a better situation, either by going to a country where it's easier or by changing your own country. I absolutely detest the greek genes we have, the laziness is insulting.

>>9070123
>greek genes
You mean latin genes ?

>>9070123
>changing your own country

That's what I intend to do. I will avenge my young self and create an active resistance movement against cuckoldry and the... you know who.

>>9070123
Also, leaving one's country because one is practically kicked out of it for having a PhD is incredibly cowardly. France belongs to white males born in France, whether or not they graduate from X or the ENS.

People have become far too meek, and at some point, some degree of coercion is necessary.

File: laughing wombs.jpg (596KB, 1500x1143px) Image search: [Google]

596KB, 1500x1143px

>>9070149
>France belongs to white males born in France
*breathes in*

>>9070099
>complain about shit country but don't want to go to a place where things could be better

>>9070875
It is much more difficult to get a position as an alien

>>9071184
H1B means you'll just get paid less until you get your green card
An it's really easy for french people to work in england

>>9071185
Just not for research, a.k.a. slave of the Jewish

slave of the Jewish is a position that can be attained anywhere, even in France, but at least here our women are sexy.

>>9071268
>can be attained anywhere, even in France
Salaries in france are utter shit. You're extremely lucky if you manage to break the 100k/y ceiling here.

>>9071286
I wouldn't be a Jewish slave for all the money in the world. I'd rather cut their throat or throw them into an oven, even if it means death to me.

>>9071292
That has nothing to do with my post. You said that a good position in the private sector could be attained in France just like in the UK or in America, but that's not completely true, as French salaries are far from being competitive. This has nothing to do with (((them))).

>>9071297
I assumed the original person you were talking to wanted to do research. If that is not the case, then yeah, salaries are better outside of France, but France also has its avantages (health care and retirement, especially), and it's cheaper to live in France than in the UK or in the US. Obviously, it depends also on the specific location.

100k is really significant in France, you can do a lot of things. It seems like it is nothing in the US.

Also, not everyone is mentally capable or willing to leave and forget his origins. This is why I believe it is for the better that most people remain in their own country, instead of stealing each other's positions, whether it be in the research department, or anywhere else. Weeding out a native has implications, as opposed to letting some nigger in.

>>9071303
>wanted to do research
Then obviously what I said doesn't apply.
>health care and retirement
That's true, though UK healthcare isn't that bad.
>It seems like it is nothing in the US.
100k is still a great salary in the US, provided you don't live in hellholes like SF or NY. But generally, for higher level positions, the salaries are scaled accordingly to the cost of living, so that's a non-issue.
>Weeding out a native has implications
That's an ideological debate, I'm simply talking about facts here.

>>9067440
Les masters sont pas forcément associés à des licences d'après ce que j'ai vu.
Pour la plupart des masters dans le domaine de l'informatique, un mec avec une licence de maths serait capable de les faire, non? Aux US un CS major c'est juste un math major en moins difficile.
Pourquoi ce serait différent ici?

>>9071859
>Les masters sont pas forcément associés à des licences d'après ce que j'ai vu.
Les universités spécifient généralement le type de licence requis pour l'accès au master.
Pour l'UPMC, un master en informatique nécessite une L3 en informatique, ou maths, ou électronique et applications, tandis qu'un master en maths nécessite obligatoirement une L3 en maths.

>>9069711
Mmh this is why a lot research on math or physics in Mexico are from French, PhD in some no big name university.

>>9058431
>be me
>want to do research or r&d
>always had side project like music
>so did not work much for school
>failed to get cpge
>went to paris 6 (nice uni in downtown paris)
>had 3 years of mathematics
>then 2 of fluid mechanics
>looking for a thesis rn
Is CPGE a meme or did i miss something ?

>>9073294
Did you do a maths licence? How intense is the coursework at Paris 6?

>>9058651
i somehow agree CPGE is just a french meme. uni here are great at teaching.
futhermore teachers in "grandes ecoles" like X Centrale or even ENS are the same in uni.

>>9073303
1st year is easy af (because i came from a good high school)
2nd year intense (all students have the same background)
3rd year ok (specialize)

find a group of 3or 4 person to go to library to have 4 afternoons per week at library after class (most work is done here)
on the 5th day drink a beer in mouftar street full of cafés and bars or by the seine (nice place)
6th sleep
7th work or whatever
i never felt like working hard during these years even tho i learned a lot.
good memories from these years...

>>9073326
What were your grades at HS/bac?
>find a group
Is it a bad habit to work alone?
>never felt like working hard
you finished your masters right? How selective are they for postgrad?

>>9073328
Never got a mention for the brevet nor the bac.
I do not like having good grade.
Just enough to got the next year.
This give me time to work on my side projects.

I do not like ppl in general.
but you ll always work with them so try getting use to it.

not yet i ll have my master degree in september doing my internship rn.

\begin{equation}
g'=g\frac{\rho_1-\rho_2}{\rho_1}
\end{equation}

>>9073352
{math}
\begin{equation}
g'=g\frac{\rho_1-\rho_2}{\rho_1}
\end{equation}
{\math}

>>9073353
[math]
\begin{equation}
g'=g\frac{\rho_1-\rho_2}{\rho_1}
\end{equation}
[/math]
ayyy lmao

>>9058373
>Are all high-level maths students intuitive geniuses, or do you think some of them just studied their asses off?

They're both.

>>9073352
How difficult was it to get accepted to the masters program?
Also how old are you if you don't mind me asking

>>9058373
Why is Euler winking at me?

>>9073382
You should be able to solve this ;)

>>9073381
old enough so i studied differentials equations in high school (terminal S maggle haha)
just show motivation and you ll be fine.
I talked to one of my teacher and he admited they most of the time never coverletters and barely look at grades.
As i came from a mathematical cursus mechanic masters are easy to get in.

Master's programs are incredibly easy to get in. What's hard, is to get something out of it.

Jews don't mind your paying them, they just won't pay you in return.

>>9073463
you don't have to pay for a master's in france.

>>9062136
Women are more likely to apply to useless (aka non stem) fields like gender studies and psychology so of course they're more likely to get in. They cast a wider net.

>>9073448
>old enough so i studied differentials equations in high school
everyone studies differential equations in TS though?
>they most of the time never coverletters and barely look at grades
Seriously
Some other anon was saying paris 6 was selective for its postgrad programs

>>9073529
they are selective for stangers not for ppl from paris 6.
You know most of the time you have the same teachers over the years
They end up knowing you and your skills

>>9073592
I see
Last question, paris 6 (and some others I'm sure) have the major/minor system, do you know if it's worth it doing two licences at once with a double major?

>>9073704
cost nothing to try
you can always lower your ECTS after
upgrade btw is more difficult

>>9073844
yeah I guess. thanks

>>9058591
>-go to a CPGE (Physics or Maths oriented) after which you attempt the entrance exams, the goal of which is to get the best ranking possible. every week you have oral exams were they ask you to memorize proofs and formulas without always necessarily explaining them, which encourages a trend of learning without understanding.
>and anyways you have no choice, a CPGE is almost the equivalent of completing a Maths AND a Physics bachelor's, within two years. as I said some people get up at 5 and go to bed a 11, spend their whole mornings and evenings doing standard exercises and training hand speed. it's pretty sad.
that's literally wrong you moron
only the dumbest shits work like that and there is no chance of them going to any respectable school in the end

>>9058599
>>>JV.com

>>9067386
>ce que disent les X en général
source ?
tu devrais regarder à quoi ça ressemble le concours, c'est tout sauf du bachotage

les oraux (de math surtout) peuvent être fait malgré une grande "naiveté"

>>9068845
déso mais 18 en math au bac t'aurais jamais eu l'ENS

>>9075382
>csq 13

>>9075328
litterally right tho. the two people I know who went to Mines did exactly that.
>>9075378
>source ?
je sais pas, c'est ce qu'ils ont l'air de dire en général, en tout cas j'en connais qui disent ça et on en trouve aussi quelques uns sur internet

>tu devrais regarder à quoi ça ressemble le concours, c'est tout sauf du bachotage

Je pensais la même chose mais en fait j'ai l'impression qu'on sous estime beaucoup le pouvoir du travail. On voit un sujet et on se dit qu'il faut du génie, de l'intuition pour voir la solution, on se dit ça parce que nous même on a pas fait un millième du nombre de sujets que font ces gens. Mais en vérité même ça ça s'apprend. Les X ne sont pas tous des génies des maths, ni même des gens particulièrement doués à la base, navré.

>>9058373
I am so tired to see the word "brainlet". Every single time I cringe.

>>9058373
When will the iq delusion end? 135 is way above average, /sci/ just spergs out over numbers and has a completely warped sense of what's normal and what's not.

>>9077022
135 is average on internet IQ tests, which is where most people who aren't retarded get their IQ from.