What's wrong with Computer Science? Why does everyone hate

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>>8430180
No one likes faggots.

>thinking that being able to program a computer puts you on the same tier as a real scientist or mathematician

>>8430194
>implying a bachelor's degree makes you a scientist

>>8430194
That's Software Engineering, not Computer Science. Programming is just one small topic in the field of CS. CS majors study the theory behind computers and how they work. They also learn programming, but that's not the end goal.

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>>8430215
in 50% of all colleges and universities, CS undergrad do not see CS at all, only SE but still spout the same shit as you

in the other 50% they get ridiculously easy intro courses of stuff that CS needs, but can avoid all further classes and theory in their main studies because there are so many SE electives and other stupid shit
>learn about finite automata and some results from the fucking 50s
>wow discrete maths whoa proofs wtf the pumping lemma is so hard xDDD
>am I a mathematician yet?

>>8430248
>from the fucking 50s
has any theoretical computer science changed since the 50s?

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>>8430180
because you have amazing job opportunities all because the roulette wheel landed on your discipline while actual difficult studies come nowhere near the amount of opportunity your degree affords. I wouldnt be doing a chemistry PhD if I thought I could have the same opportunity as someone who majoerd in CS.

>>8430248
>has a photo saved of gavin mcinness

opinion discarded

>>8430259
Tell me one that didn't

most of them would be better off just getting certifications and being technicians.

then you have the code monkeys.

then you have the ones that go into engineering and actually do something useful with their degree.

>>8430248
> in 50% of all colleges and universities, CS undergrad do not see CS at all, only SE but still spout the same shit as you

> in the other 50% they get ridiculously easy intro courses of stuff that CS needs, but can avoid all further classes and theory in their main studies because there are so many SE electives and other stupid shit

sauce?

>>8430180
People who majored in something more rigorous are upset that the economy doesn't value them as much as CS majors.

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>>8430180

>>8430273
>disliking a man with a beautiful moustache

Opinion disregarded

>>8430467
This is a good thing for individuals that actually apply themselves and actually learn. An easy leg up if you will.

>>8430180
I don't hate you, brah. CS is a pretty cool field, as a matter of fact, I'd compare it with engineering, mathematics, chemistry, and all other types of important sciences. I guess people get kinda mad because they assume it's like a sell out job or something.

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There isn't much wrong with computer science - the problem is computer science students.

Try to reason for a moment what truly motivates people to pursue a major in computer science. 99% of the time, its complete garbage, such as the following:

1. I want a cushy, easy, high paying codemonkey job in the bay area making retarded apps that don't really solve any problems. If these apps even manage to contribute to society in any way, they're very often in trivial and minor ways.

2. I played a lot of video games as a kid and I want to make shitty retarded games as a career.

3. I want to become the next Steve Jobs / Bill Gates / <Insert tech entrepreneur here>. DAE le STARtupps!?!? xD xD

4. I read a lot of pop sci magazines and DAE le AI and MUHSHEEN LERNING and MUHSINGULARITIY!?!??! xD xDDDD

Contrast this to the motivation for virtually every other major:

1. I want to master a difficult field, something that most other people will not want to enter but is nonetheless crucial to society, and hopefully make money from it in the process.

It's really no wonder how CS has pretty much become the proverbial, literal, and figurative most anti intellectual hive of scum and villainy in the whole of the academic ecosystem. If you were anywhere in the vicinity of a CS student you'd often catch them whining about things like basic mathematics or whichever one of their pitiful required classes they think detracts them from their life of making shitty apps and vidya gaymes.

I go to the so called #5 ranked CS school in the US, and all this applies to a darn good percentage of the CS undergrads I've met in the department. I've seen and dealt with literal retards who, of all things, wonder what sort of connection statistics has to machine learning. So although I can't really speak for the rest, I'm pretty sure the problem is worse, not better, at most other institutions.

>>8431602
Just because lots of retarded people are attracted to it doesn't mean we are all retarded.

>>8431614
That's why I mentioned 99%. But in any case, a small minority of people with any modicum of integrity doesn't make the majority any less shitty.

>>8431602
I study comp/elec eng and I do see a difference in the attitude of students between departments. But you can't write someone off based on what attracted then to the subject initially - being interested in machine learning does lead to rigorous mathematics and statistics for anyone who understands their importance. Conversely are you really suggesting that students of other sciences are not also largely attracted to their field due to popsci articles? Lots of people are excited to study quantum biology but the market saturation means that they end up butthurt - complaining about people who considered the jobs available after graduating.

>>8430197
>implying CS is limited to a BS

>>8430467
i played video games all day and passed high school with a 4.8

>>8430180
I don't. Comp Sci is very much an integral part of man's future. Students of it are lovely creatures.

>>8430248
clearly butthurt "mathematician" who has never taken CS classes at his university

People are afraid of automation.

>>8430180

CS is fine, it's just these math faggots are jealous with us getting all the jobs while they flip burgers.

>>8430467
Odd, I could sware that I was in that thread. Is it just a really old pasta, or is it something recent?

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>>8431602
I'm weighing between CS and EE. Leaning towards CS because I thought it had more entrepenural potential. Is this not true? I always thought CS was free as in freedom. Is this not true?

>>8430180
Computer science degrees are essentially bachelor's degree in math except with some classes missing for an actual math degree.

That is why CS has a high dropout rate.

College is full of weeder classes.

For premed students, it is Organic Chemistry.

>>8432934
>Computer science degrees are essentially bachelor's degree in math except with some classes missing for an actual math degree.

And the fact CS majors seriously believe this bull is why CS majors are viewed as autistic retards here.

>>8432909
Split the middle, do CE

>>8430215
>attends uni
>learns algorithms
>learns O notation
>learns java
>state manchines
>compooter scientsit cus theory
>gets job at clinkle

>>8430215
Are CS majors really so self conscious that they fear being called just programmers? Are they afraid they don't deserve their 'science' title since they know next to none of them will ever contribute meaningfully to the theory of computation. They seem to want to live as mathematicians because programming is dirty. They spend all their time professing the beauty of Haskell, but yet, nobody actually builds large complex and feature rich programs in it. It's such a joke.

>>8431663
Other fields don't have a vapid malignant tumor growing off of it called Silicon Valley

>>8432017
auto fellatio

>>8431602
I have a hard time believing any of those.

Do people actually go to college because they l ike something?

I've never really enjoyed or like anything so I don't know the feeling.

I'm also doing CS, I don't really like it but I don't like anything so idk.


I hate my life and think about suicide every day.

>>8430215
I am legitimatley curious; in what way do we not know how computers work? We make the damn things.

I like Informatics and consider it a legitimate field of Science.

Is there any reason the OOP isn't a total cantankerous pile of shit?

Better than IT. That shit is a fucking joke

>>8433203
I'm in my second year of CS but it seems lot more useful from a corporate perspective when you don't have your dudes rewriting the same shit constantly, so you use OOP instead of some meme language that 25 people use and no one has ever heard of.

>>8432909
It's true, don't get meme'd by the idiots on this Balinese trading post

>>8433203
You'll understand once you write bigger projects

I'm in the #1 university for CS in my country and about to finish my BSc
We barely had any SE classes, it's easily been 1/2-2/3 theory + math. You could choose easier courses for the remaining credits, but there is no way around the hard stuff.
There is this one class (Mathematical Logic) which fucks up so many lives it's kinda funny. Last year they made it so you would pass the final exam with 26% of the total points instead of 50% and still the majority of people failed.
Other math courses are more manageable, but require you to do constant exercise sheets over the whole semester and really understand the stuff you are doing, it's not like in engineering where you have to solve the same shit over and over again without any understanding.
Of course there were some meme classes that a monkey could've passed as well, not gonna deny that. But idiots get filtered out over the time. Most of the students nowadays are not only very bright but hardworking as well. I'm unfortunately very much average.

>>8433162
Actually, I'm phys/maths, but nice try.

People on /sci/ hate CS majors because CS majors will make the same if not more cash than "real STEM majors" but the major is much easier.

>>8434150
>There is this one class (Mathematical Logic) which fucks up so many lives it's kinda funny.
Watch some retard on /sci/ think this is intro to predicate logic or whatever.

>>8430467
CS students don't give a shit about school unlike physics/maths tryhards.

Sure I may have failed all my maths and most other classes but that's because I don't give a shit about them, not because they're math.
You go to study cs because that's what you're expected to be doing after wasting all your time playing video games. "He must really like computers to spend so much time on em" is the average conclusion.

cs is crap but glorifying maths students is just plain retarded. Universities are a sham.

Fuck the bachelor's degree.

Get a certificate instead. You take the same core classes without going through the bullshit prerequisites that universities have to make you take.

>>8430304
>any computer science
>the one
wew

>>8430310
>technicians and SE are not useful
What do you think is happening in this world?

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>>8434314
>Have friend with legit 100% real Aspergers
>Unironically wore a trilby before it became a dank meme
>His little brother is severely autistic and can only communicate in grunts and shrieks
>Friend's latch on subject is fortunately programming languages rather than something stupid like light poles
>Spent every waking hours programming in various languages and self-teaching
>Admits half the time it drives him to extreme anger but he just HAS TO learn it or complete what he set out to do
>High School had courses that led to certifications
>Gets many
>Schools are throwing half and full ride scholarships for CS and IT
>Ignores it all for too long so he couldn't apply for that semester
>Says fuck it and applies to a well paying programming job
>His resume is long and contains many personal projects that impress the employer
>Gets hired off the bat
>Get in contact with him nearly 3 years later after going dark
>He's happily employed
>I'm stuck doing university studies with no hope to start at what he did

>>8434366
No point in having the degree if you are doing technician work.

>>8433172
some people do but not all

>>8434150
which country/university?

>>8434398
Germany / one of the 2-3 top CS universities (TU München / RWTH Aachen / KIT Karlsruhe)
And yes, while none of them are on MIT level, they are as close as you gonna get around here and they all have excellent reputation both in research and industry.

Well this is purely anecdotal, but my dad is the principle software engineer for a medium sized software company. He gets the final say in any new technical hire. He's told me that due to experience, he actively avoids hiring computer science graduates if possible, preferring physics, maths, software engineering, really anything else. He basically says that none of the skills they gain are transferable, and if he's going to train somebody up from scratch it might as well be somebody with a 'proper degree'.

>>8434411
thought right, rwth cs 3rd semester here

>>8434442
Yeah I guess that was too obvious with the MaLo lol. Don't think that class is as bad at other universities.
How you doing, have you passed all the classes so far?

>>8434452
>Yeah I guess that was too obvious with the MaLo lol. Don't think that class is as bad at other universities.
What do you do? In Darmstadt our version of it also slaughters the newbies but the whole department has a less theoretic focus

>>8434457
I know people from outside who wanna get their MSc here all have to do MaLo again, doesn't matter if they did a similar course in their BSc.
One guy told me that their version of the course was nothing more than introduction to a couple of logics and some basic automata theory.
But I'm sure it's a killer course at other universities as well. Still don't know how I passed it desu.

>>8430180
They don't want competition.

More CompSci people, lower wages. A huge demand for software development and a low supply of programmers increases the cost for businesses. There is a reason why Obama,Gates,celebrities, etc are pushing people to code. Just look at what happen when women joined the labor force. Almost every job sector reduced earnings for employees.

>>8434452
yep i did pass everything except analysis since i lacked a mathematical background, but after passing linear algebra i'll easily pass analysis.

>>8430271
>This is a full-time role
What use is a salary when you don't have the time to spend it ?

>>8434485
Good job mang.
If you wanna make it slightly easier, I'd recommend waiting until an institute of applied maths (like CES) does Analysis again. The pure math institutes' exams have a bigger focus on proofs.

>>8434498
thanks for your tip but since i want to graduate within regular period of study i'll do it this semester

>>8433177
We don't know the limits of some fundamental aspects of complexity, computation theory and logic. In cryptography some theorical and practical fundamental problems are still opened.

Also we don't know how to deal efficiently with some problems . For example, artificial intelligence, we are still developing search and planning algorithms and improving our heuristics. In AI we also are still understanding the limits of the neural networks and other unsupervised learning models.

Another example, in the computer vision subfield, we are still improving our visual recognition algorithms, for example, face recognition. In the data mining or data science, we are still developing better algorithms that allow us to work and produce information from large data sets.

Also we have technological problems, this is mostly how to make better cpu, gpu, ram, networks, architectures, etc. And of course we have problems in the design of software, from the low level to the high level: compilers, interpeters, OS, drivers, servers, database, distributed system, etc.

>>8430180
I'll copy over most of my response from the "What parts of C S are not a meme?" thread:

Computer science is a bit of a weird one... It came out of electrical engineering in the 60s, and slowly started to consume other fields; economics; statistics; social sciences, etc...
At an undergraduate level, it can be either a glorified code monkey course, or a watered-down mathematics degree. However, at graduate level, it can become useful. Sure, some of it can just be worthless, like human-computer interaction research, but there are other, more useful branches.

>>8430271
it will only last so long tho
>2020
>everyone doing CS
>CS gets oversaturated
>only graduates from top tier colleges considered
>every other STEM field laughs

>>8435057
>"only graduates from top tier colleges considered"
>implying this isn't the case right now in every STEM field

Anyone familiar with C/C++ here? need a quick hand with a homework question on pointers, tis due in an hour and a half

>>8435259
check the eskimo notes: https://www.eskimo.com/~scs/cclass/cclass.html

>>8435259
got buttcoins

>>8435352
It's all about lytecoin

CC transfer student here, I'm going to transfer to a 4 year uni next semester but am going for math major focusing on "comp sci" math (linear algebra out the ass, a big data class they offer, combinatorics etc.) and CS minor. Will big boy CS jobs turn me down because I don't have the programming experience a normal CS major would? I graduated from CC with two AS degrees in math and Comp info sys and 3.9 GPA.

I figured as long as I can come up with a decent portfolio in 1 or 2 languages from a semester and some free time I should be in the clear.

I've been told exactly what >>8434435 says but just making sure i'm not getting memed on.

In addition I think CS majors get a bad rep because the major attracts the worst of the high school rejects at mid-level schools. By sophomore year they drop out or if they somehow graduate, they can't land a job because they have the social / interview skills of a shovel and get stuck with a 50k bill for student loans. I've only ever met a few that could socialize normally and had their shit together. They make bank because of their people skills.

>>8430456
there's no sauce he's just pulling shit out of his ass

>>8435035
Like what othee types of branches?

Because they're ugly fucking autists that brag about muh CS without realizing their jobs are being outsourced to indians.

>>8436304
Machine learning/pattern recognition is an obvious one, useful for medical diagnosis, prediction modelling, risk assessment, AI, self-driving cars, 3D image reconstruction, argument mining, visual question answering, etc...
Then I guess you also have cloud computing research, distribution systems resarch, and whatever other more applied branches.
I singled HCI out because while it COULD be useful, it often isn't. If you make an app for colour blind people; congratualtions! You've made one app for colour blind people.