Why do people lie on the internet? I'm looking at my grades

>>7737432
>Why do people lie on the internet?

You on 4chan m8.

>>7737432
>#1: This is not shitmerica. There is no inflated tuition, no loans and no debt. The entire degree costs less than a thousand dollars and you could even get it for free if you were good in high school.

American degrees are worth more than whatever shit-stained paper you get after graduation. In college education you literally get what you pay for. You get it for free, it probably sucks. It costs you high, it will take you high.

>>7737432
>The graduate in mathematics is legally capable of:
>'Venturing into computation, banking, finance, insurance, etc.

If you actually need a math degree to be -legally- bestowed the capacity to perform those roles you live in a shit country and should kill yourself.

>oh no I typed out this reply without a math degree, guess I'm going to be arrested for illegal computation!11!

>>7737432
Yes, there are jobs that mathematicians can do but they will need supplemental training and in addition those jobs can be done by anyone with a degree that has a significant mathematical component.

This means that even people without degrees can those, and that certainly engineers could too. The might be preferred over mathematicians.

>>7737574
>If you actually need a math degree to be -legally- bestowed the capacity to perform those roles you live in a shit country and should kill yourself.

But you probably do in your country too. Do you really want some faggot with no title doing the risk calculations for your insurance?

What if it was YOUR insurance company? Would you hire anyone to do the risk calculation?

Also, if you think computation means anything that has to do with computers then you are retarded.

Thus, your post is a non-argument.

>>7737591
> supplemental training
Every job needs training. Having a math degree lets the company know they don't have to train you as much as some other guy, putting you on top.

>This means that even people without degrees can those, and that certainly engineers could too.
Lets use the example of computation to show why this is wrong. And this is something that really gets me because it is really, really retarded. You claim that engineers could the job and might be preferred but that is not the case.

I know that engineers are competent in mathematics but how much really?

I bet that any engineer (except for CEs and EEs which study the subject) would have no idea what to do if I gave them two sorting algorithms and asked them which one would be more efficient as N (the number of objects to be sorted) approaches infinity.

What if I gave you a sorting algorithm and asked you to implement a change and then prove that as N approaches infinity, it is more efficient than the original algorithm.

This is training you do not have. In the software world, engineers couldn't do more than low level code monkeying, probably in 'app' start-ups that will go bankrupt in a month.

The same goes for banking, finance, insurance, etc. Engineers do not get as much training with things like probability and statistics and as such will not be prefered in these jobs. But this is okay because engineers already have a good market for themselves.

>>7737613
whatever mate.

you tell yourself all that but I reckon any company would choose an engineer over a mathematcian any day of the week.

>>7737622
>whatever mate.

Yup.
This wasn't even a thread against engineers. I never mentioned anyone in specific but you fags just have to jump on anything that could possibly be conceived as an insult to the supposed 'engineer master race'.

Really shows hows pathetic and touchy you are.

Other than that, I hope you understood that I am right. In the example I gave, not even engineers that took programming classes in college would know how to approach those problems (or know that they are actually trivial).

I bet that when you read 'as N approaches infinity' your brain just shut down and you said
infuhneety? Durr but this ain't even calculus! Mak no senz 4 me!

>>7737432
>'Venturing into computation, banking, finance, insurance, etc.'
>Right there is the mention of 4 radically different jobs that can legally be done with one degree so I ask again. Why do people lie on the internet? Where does the 'no jobs' meme come from? It is ridiculous.

So we were right all along?

That's what we've said from the start. Code monkey and finance (and high-school which they are too ashamed to mention).

Any case you're retarded OP we've always said you can only get shitty non-STEM jobs with a math degree.

>>7737432
>So I will live a happy, fulfilling and employment-diverse life while you stay mad and do the one job your degree shoehorns you into, even though in 5-10 years you will be bored of it to death but will have no choice but to keep doing it.

A) Lolno, if you career hop you take a drastic salary hit, you won't be able to do it if you have a family you need to take care of.
B) The degrees you are probably bitching about can also do any of those jobs you mentioned. Any STEM degree can do code monkeying and finance.

>>7737636
>Code monkey and finance
>shitty

Programming jobs average at 78k while finance averages at 84k. Both relatively high paying, rivaling the salary of various engineering disciplines. Nothing wrong about that.

> non-STEM jobs
What is this argument even? Think about this one just a little bit harder would ya? If math students really wanted to work in STEM, why would they study mathematics?

Everyone knows that the only way into STEM for mathematicians is in research and very few are actually interested in that. However, the ones that are do go for the academic life and later become professors. Everyone else goes their own in the millions of ways they can branch out.

Unlike you, we have no autistic attachment to STEM. I would personally enjoy applied mathematics research or theoretical computer science research but that is just me. There are so many other ways to go.

So in fact, your argument only works against the imaginary mathematicians you made up in your mind to try to compensate for why you simply couldn't enter into pure mathematics and had to settle for other shit.

>A) Lolno, if you career hop you take a drastic salary hit, you won't be able to do it if you have a family you need to take care of.
No doubt but it is still an option.

>B) The degrees you are probably bitching about can also do any of those jobs you mentioned. Any STEM degree can do code monkeying and finance.
I already explained why that is not the case. The only other degrees that can are Finance degrees and Code Monkey Studies Degrees.

>>7737613
>risk calculations

>You claim that engineers could the job and might be preferred but that is not the case.
He's right. Unlike a pure mathematician, an engineer has actually done financial math and risk management in his economic/business management component.

>I bet that any engineer (except for CEs and EEs which study the subject) would have no idea what to do if I gave them two sorting algorithms and asked them which one would be more efficient as N (the number of objects to be sorted) approaches infinity.
And you think people are specifically hired for being able to write something that is less efficient than commercial algorithms, but more efficient than other employees can write. Are you retarded? If you brought that up as skill in an interview they would laugh in your face. The finance sector doesn't care about shaving off a few hours on a parameter fitting when it takes 2 years to develop the software anyway.

>Muh bubble algorithm!
Just, wow.

>Engineers do not get as much training with things like probability and statistics and as such will not be prefered in these jobs
And how would you, or more importantly an employer, know that? Most mathematicians do not even take probability and statistics and statistics because it's not required, those who take it as electives do more, but no as much as real actuarial mathematicians. Meanwhile every engineer has not taken the baby intro probability and statistics, but applied it in things like failure rates of components which is the exact same methods used in risk analysis. Employers know this because the technical department in finance firms are usually run by engineers.


Stop fucking talking about degrees you know nothing about. Who's lying on the internet now?

>>7737639
Also, I'm not bitching about any degree in specific.

I am simply showing why studying mathematics is probably a good idea.

>>7737631
>infuhneety? Durr but this ain't even calculus! Mak no senz 4 me!
Yes, you were completely mature and never tried to attack engineers. This thread was clearly not thinly veiled belligerence directed at them.

>>7737650
>Programming jobs average at 78k while finance averages at 84k. Both relatively high paying, rivaling the salary of various engineering disciplines. Nothing wrong about that.
>What is this argument even?

So you only care about money? Fucking kill yourself.

At least engineers have some goddamn passion and integrity.


Why are you even posting on /sci/ if you don't want a STEM career? Go post on /g/ and /biz/.

Seriously fuck off you piss me off so goddamn much. You have no business posting on /sci/.

>>7737654
There's many good reasons to study mathematics, primarily if you want an academic career in mathematics.

YOUR reasons for studying it are pathetic and retarded.

You're trying to argue "I can haz jerbs" that virtually anyone with a degree can have. If your only interest is being a code monkey or working in finance then you're a fucking idiot because you would be orders better off if you studied engineering or physics or literally any other science degree.

Though considering you obviously aren't smart or ambitious enough for an academic career in math, you probably couldn't even get accepted into engineering or physics anyway.

>>7737651
>He's right. Unlike a pure mathematician, an engineer has actually done financial math and risk management in his economic/business management component.
Fair enough.

>And you think people are specifically hired...
In this point I was not talking about finance. And also, knowing your way with optimization does not only apply to sorting. Many applications will have to handle big data in non-trivial ways that will require the developer to implement a new algorithm and if you know nothing about growth rates and optimization then good luck getting hired in any company that does anything important.

>And how would you, or more importantly an employer, know that?
Have you ever gone to any kind of job interview? Even for an internship? You will get asked about your degree and what you know. There will be questions that the employer will require you to know how to answer before they even consider you as a potential candidate.

>Most mathematicians do not even take probability and statistics
It is a mandatory class I can't see how a math curriculum could do without them. It is one of the most applicable and employable skills.

Also, why do you keep mentioning engineers? There will be no engineer applying to software companies or to finance firms!

What is your obsession with engineers? By what you say I see that they could do finance work but I will never see an engineer apply to that job. They have their own job market. However, I still stand firm that they couldn't do any kind of software development unless they were EEs or CEs.

>>7737527
The university i go to costs 60$ per semester and is the best engineering university in the country. Average starting wage after graduation is 80k.

>>7737659
>So you only care about money? Fucking kill yourself.
Careful anon, your autism is showing a bit too much.

>At least engineers have some goddamn passion and integrity.
Maybe they do but don't you dare say I don't also.

>Why are you even posting on /sci/ if you don't want a STEM career? Go post on /g/ and /biz/.
But I do want a stem career. As I said I hope to do research in applied mathematics and/or theoretical computer science. That is what I self study for. I'm just saying that unlike other degrees, math will not trap you into STEM. Math will not trap you anywhere. You are free to conquer the world.

>Seriously fuck off you piss me off so goddamn much

I bet I am.
>Engineering is not the best choice you could possibly ever make
>STOP TRIGGERING ME. I'M PAYING 50K FOR THIS SO IT BETTER BE THE BEST DECISION. COMFORT ME, /SCI/!

>>7737662
You obviously didn't read half of the discussion so I won't bother to re-state my points.

My answers to every single one of your points are scattered around the thread so I do encourage you to read them and then join again when you have valid criticism.

>>7737664
No one is obsessed with engineers, we are using it as an example to show that "careers in computation, banking, finance, insurance, etc" isn't some kind of math exclusive thing.

Let's forget about engineers, there are people that have degrees specifically in those fields that will be hired above we, but even after that there's a long list of degrees that would be hired above mathematicians (not just engineers).


So our argument is that your argument is shit. If you want a moneywhoring career then there is no reason to do math. Only do math if you're passionate and want an academic career. A math degree is not going to give some versatile uber career anymore than pretty much any other degree save for women's studies etc.

>>7737668
no other stem degree traps you. Are you retarded? I know all sorts of guys that do the jobs you mentioned, and they range from PhDs in comp chem to just Bachelors in mathematical economics (and if you want to get technical that there is no such major as mathematical economics, I am talking about economics majors with specific mathematical tracks).

>>7737668
>I'm just saying that unlike other degrees, math will not trap you into STEM
And we're saying that's wrong. There aren't any STEM degrees that trap in STEM.

In fact most STEM graduates don't get to work in STEM, not just math graduates.

STEM is the dream. That's why the usual arguments on this board are for which degrees have a better chance of actually giving you a career in STEM.

>You are free to conquer the world.
Everyone thinks that. Including liberal arts degrees. You are literally arguing like an English Lit. major right now.

>>7737674
> isn't some kind of math exclusive thing.
I know it isn't. That is why there are specific degrees for that. I'm just saying that those degrees will open you that door. A math degree will open you all of them but maybe we will be below them in the percentages hired. I would say that it is still a better choice.

> but even after that there's a long list of degrees that would be hired above mathematicians
Bullshit. For any serious software engineering jobs, the only people getting hired would be SEs themselves, CMS, Math and Physics.

For the rest you either get the degree in that specific area, or get the degree in mathematics... as I already stated.

>If you want a moneywhoring career then there is no reason to do math.
I never claimed that mathematics would make you rich.

My literal conclusion from my original post was that mathematics would get you
>a happy, fulfilling and employment-diverse life

I never mentioned rich. In fact, no degree will make you rich except for petroleum engineering. However there are certain perks you get from studying mathematics that people in /sci/ totally ignore and I'd like to bring up.

>>7737678
>PhDs
That shows how they had to go the extra mile
>economics
And they fall under the category of the specific degree for that career.

Nothing new here that contradicts by argument.

>>7737680
There aren't any STEM degrees that trap in STEM.
Maybe but I still see that mathematics will be the easier way to get to work outside of STEM while also having a nice way to work inside of STEM.

>Everyone thinks that
Indeed but I have statements that support my claim. No English Lit. major will ever see official text, written by government officials, about how they can legally (and as such will be prefered to) do work in the diverse fields I mentioned.

>>7737683
>For any serious software engineering

Do you even what REAL software engineering is? It's not about programming, it's about hardware interfacing, controllers etc. You're talking about software development, which has nothing to do with the legally defined profession of software engineering.
http://sce.uhcl.edu/helm/SWEBOK_IEEE/papers/10%20reprint%205.pdf
>Calling Software Development Software Engineering
>Unless these activities also include the design of hardware interfaces, power systems, or other engineered components, they do not appear to meet the legal definition of engineering practices.
>It might be more accurately described as "code writing", "product support" or other tasks that the board doesn't regulate.
>...if the practitioner is calling the activity software engineering, he or she is violating the law.

While that is unimportant, my point is you only seem to have a vague idea what those professions you mentioned in the OP actually are, you don't really know what is going. Let me simplify for you. Stop looking at the "mean" salary it's not yours. In reality those jobs are pretty much hordes of applicants competing for crappy 30-40k starting salaries. ONLY if you're really good both on the technical and bureaucratic side will you eventually crawl your way into breaking 6 figures. And the job is mostly code monkeying or dealing with people's shit. You won't get to research on optimization and algorithms like you are thinking. Those jobs are reserved for PhDs specifically trained at top schools like Cambridge under advisors with direct connections to the companies offering the position. You might see a job posting every now and then, but that's a legal formality those positions are already filled.

>a happy, fulfilling and employment-diverse life
A shitty conclusion because the math majors on this board (excluding you apparetnlyu) won't be happy in any of those boring careers.

[cont.]

>>7737683
[cont.]
>In fact, no degree will make you rich except for petroleum engineering.
Also wrong. Engineering does make you rich. Not only those who start their own companies/firms etc. (making millions that is not salary data), but you are again making the mistake of looking at the mean salaries. Most engineering jobs pay higher than that petroleum mean salary you've seen. The reason the other engineering discipline's salaries are lower is because the majority of graduates do not end up in STEM careers, but actually things like finance and IT which drags the mean down.

Any chemical engineer is qualified to work in petroleum for example. You really think they wouldn't take those jobs if they could? The best have higher offers in the chem processing industry at home, the shitty ones don't break into professional engineering.

Things are competitive. Which is why degree dickwaving and mean salaries is pointless. Most graduates do not get degree relevant jobs.

>>7737693
> legally (and as such will be prefered to)
Non-sequitur.

>>7737698
Seems pointless to go that hard to protest against one mistake in terminology because you know what I meant.

>a vague idea
I don't. I've actually done internships in software companies and with that I'd like to assure that I know what I'm talking about, at least in this regard.

>You won't get to research on optimization and algorithms like you are thinking
I know that and as such I already have my plans for grad school so that I can actually work in those fields.

The rest of your criticism applies to everyone in any job. Everyone has to start low and everyone has to deal with shit people. I am not a brat and as such I have a good understanding of 'how is life' so I know that managing a career won't be easy.

>A shitty conclusion because the math majors on this board (excluding you apparetnlyu) won't be happy in any of those boring careers.
Another case of your arguments being exclusively against the made up mathematicians inside your head that haunt you at night.

As some other anon said, 'STEM is the dream' and I doubt that someone who doesn't make it would immediately dread life and see no point in living.

non-stem jobs may be boring but a job is a job and if you are useful to society without having to kill starving children in Africa then you should have some pride. That pride and the money you get should be enough to keep your self-steem high.

There is no need to have an autistic attachment to STEM.

>>7737701
Good points but I don't think engineering makes you rich. Every engineer I know is certainly upper middle class and I would never imagine seeing them struggling economically but no STEM will make you rich.

If you want to be rich, study business and eat orphans for breakfast until you have no standards and no morals.

>>7737705
It may seem as such but you have to dig in into what employers will see as favorable. When the human resources departments look for criteria to make sure they hire only the best where do you think they will look first? At government standards that pretty much set the tune for the economy.

>>7737714
>STEM will make you rich.
Seven of the ten richest people on the planet disagree with you. They all either built their companies without wealth or inherited a company built without wealth that was technical industry (2 computer, 3 chemical industry, 2 civilE) and they explicitly claimed that their STEM background helped them to run their business.

Carlos Slim (Civil Engineer) for example specifically said he used linear programming a lot to efficiently run his [construction industry] business.


Also when you look at the fortune 500 CEOs 40% have engineering degrees, higher than any other degree, and 20% have science degrees (the remaining have shit like business/law).


Now of course, most STEM grads won't end up there, but it happens to be the degree that increases your odds of getting really rich the most. It is not uncommon either, most of my faculty for example own their own companies, though only two of them nett in the 7 figure range.

>>7737714
>study business
Worst advice.

Very few business degree grads. successfully build their own business. It's only those that inherited wealth and don't care what they study who do business.

But even then the inheritors of the richest business owners are smart enough to study STEM.

The Koch brothers (6th richest men on the planet) both graduated with Chemical Engineering degrees from MIT.

>>7737729
I actually can't refute that. Mainly because you got my point and I agree with what you are saying.

However, I wouldn't say that being an engineer raises the odds. It could be just a coincidence unless every fortune 500 CEO agreed to take a test that would give us insight in who is more likely to make good business decisions. The engineers may come out on top though and that is okay.

I can also name mathematicians who built their company and later their wealth out of the specific insight their education gave them. Specially one big name now billionaire mathematician who made his fortune by I believe was predicting stocks.

But when doing this discussions we should not aim our sights that high. It is much more logical to talk about the 'everyman' coming out of different degrees. Even here I agree that engineers come out on top but I hope that by now I have made my point that math grads are not that much behind when it comes to big opportunities in the job market.

Why are engineers so butthurt about mathematics? All they do on /sci/ is be salty about math degrees.
Is it sour grapes?

>>7737752
Are you even on /sci/?

Literally everyone of those threads is started by a mathematician with some variation of "le engineers are stoopid and only do calculus I'm so much smurtur xD".

Then after getting BTFO they pretend like engineers where bullying them all along and they're completely innocent.

Engineers don't care about you, they regard you in the same vein as lib art majors, knock off with your arrogant and completely unwarranted elitism and they will you alone.

>>7737752
>Is it sour grapes?
I don't know but for some reason immediately assumed that my post was meant to insult engineers... for some reason.

>>7737758
False. There was just a thread made that said 'Hey math major. I'd like fries with that' and literally nothing else. Just a random attack towards math majors with no intent for discussion. Fortunately it was deleted almost immediately and hopefully the person banned.

The problem is you are touchy and think that everything that does not say 'Engineers are the best!' is some kind of aggressive attack against you, which is not. It is actually a bit ridiculous if you think about it.

>>7737773
>Hey math major. I'd like fries with that
Those people aren't even from /sci/, why are you butthurt?

Mathematician shitposting which is so common it's almost daily is from people like >>7737752.

>>7737432
>When it claims that you can legally do something you better believe that they mean it and employers know this.
So, can you get a banking job in America with just this math degree? Sounds like you just live in some third world shithole with weak professional standards.

>>7737850
Lets break down this claim.

I googled for the skills needed in a finance/banking position

Math: Arithmethic, algebra, statistics and probability.

Soft: Communication and logical problem solving.

You will get the math requirements done in the first two years of a math degree. Communication is covered by college level writing that is mandatory (in my school and hopefully every other) and problem solving is covered in the entire degree.

With that being said, if your country has any law or anything that makes it imposible for math grads to do work in finance or banking then I'd claim that your country is the shithole.

>muh pure field
>end up counting beans in a bank

I always found it somewhat odd that supposedly 'pure' majors make fun of engineers when engineers might at least conceivably do work that's relevant to what they studied and were supposedly passionate about.


Before you start the engineering memes, I'm a physics student and I think I'll have shot myself by 30.

>>7737935
>muh pure field
In this entire thread I have not even used once the appeal to purity argument which I believe is flawed and just retarded.

>end up counting beans in a bank
It is a possibility and I consider this a positive point. Banks are big businesses and as such there is a lot of potential to grow. However the positive is the fact that it is another fine alternative for the math grad.

>make fun
Not once in this thread have I made fun of engineers. With them being the ones bringing engineering into the discussion and even then I addressed them respectfully.

> I'm a physics student
With you being this fucking retarded I do feel comfortable to insult you based on your degree. Fuck you, fuck your physics and everyone who does physics.

> I'll have shot myself by 30.
You better do.

>>7737432

OP, you're right, all those areas take in graduates from any degree. You can become a wall street trader after doing a political science degree. I have been shouting the "degree barely matters for most jobs" truth on 4chan for ages.

Now do you want to know why the lies continue on 4chan, to this day?

Because of HUGE FUCKING IGNORANCE.

IMAGINE THE BIGGEST THING EVER

NOW DOUBLE IT

THAT'S HOW IGNORANT 4CHAN IS

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>>7737432
I think your main mistake is coming to 4chan and believing anything we say.

It doesn't really matter what degree you go into as long as you're resourceful and have connections.

Yeah getting a math degree is great when combined with say a finance/statistics minor or maybe double major (Especially if you take actuary exams).

Any STEM degree for that matter shows that a person is capable of problem solving and complex critical thinking, which is what companies want the most in today's society.

In the grand scheme of things it doesn't really matter what you major in as long you're happy with your decision. If you're happy, fuck everything else, if you're not happy, you might want to go home and rethink your life.

>>7737527
i love this
americans are so indoctrinated

>>7737432
im math at Berkeley, I fail my shit and have no job prospects.

>>7738099

Engineering students will just say that this makes engineering the ultimate degree because you can do all these things AND work as an engineer and get your PE stamp after 4 years (whereas with a science bachelors and a graduate engineering degree it would still take you 7 years after you graduate).

They might also mention a few mathematicians who have engineering undergrads (e.g. Tom Apostol) and use this to claim that you could get into a good math graduate school with only an engineering degree today, even though most people in top grad schools have more math background than is required for undergraduate math degrees at most universities.

>>7737914
>With that being said, if your country has any law or anything that makes it imposible for math grads to do work in finance or banking then I'd claim that your country is the shithole.
No country has that law. The only finance jobs that are regulated is accounting (CA), actuary etc.

why do people talk about the specifics of their lives on the internet? start thinking for yourself. that's why i lie on the internet.

>>7738099
who's this 4chen???

>>7738099
>"degree barely matters for most jobs"

Some professions are regulated by law.

No one has ever said anything to the effect of "If you do X degree you will definitely work in Y", everyone knows about finance, IT etc. Nobody cares because no one who is passionate about their STEM field wants those jobs.

There is no lie. You and OP are just retards who lack reading comprehension.

>>7738099
>>7738420
You're wrong it's not just engineering and legally regulated professions.

Try being a researcher at a national lab without a hard science or engineering PhD.

Degrees do matter for certain jobs.

>>7738285
Your delusional.

Your degree does matter.

What you REALLY mean is your degree doesn't matter if you're a loser who either wants to settle for a beta job or has to use connections to get a over paid meme job. The type of "connections" that allow you to do the latter are more like familial nepotism since you won't make them if you suck and nobody cares about you; not everyone is born with those "connections".

>>7738452
>he fell for the college meme
bro smdh

>>7738454
>W-what do you mean I was rejected? Did you not see my neatly typed CV. Do you have any idea how long it took to learn LaTeX on my own!
>Well Sir, it appears that you have no qualifications to speak of.
>Idiot! Did you not check out my github profile? I published my own Python module. It has THREE stars! Did you even read my mother's letter of recommendation!?!
>Unfortunately the position you are applying for is a regulated profession. Federal law prevents me from hiring you and I would hire you if I could since I don't want my clients to die.
>No, how dare you! I'm not stupid enough to fall for the college meme you Jew! Give me a job now REEEEEE...

>>7738463
i have a degree. you don't seem like a very creative thinker.

>>7738468
>I have degree in AFRO AMERICAN STUDIES you racist RETARD, how dare you not let operate on this man!
>LE College is a meme RAHRARHAR...JEWS...RARHARHAR...

>>7738473
U even suck at memeing. am i talking to an engineer? Is it hard when the pieces dont fit?

>>7738489
How many boogeyman are we going to have to go through before you admit you were retarded?

>>7737432
It's all true, but good luck getting hired over a PhD, of which there are thousands in line.

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>>7737432
kek OP you're in for a rude awakening. You're not a mathematician. You're a undergrad with a degree in math. The only place that will hire you is an insurance company as an analyst, which is fucking boring and doesn't pay that well. gg.

>I will live a happy, fulfilling
an accountant has a more fulfilling job than an analyst. kek

>>7738496
I dont know anon youre the one bringing up jews...they dont come up in my psyche. I never said college is a meme, but there are college memes.

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>>7737432
OP, if you were talking about like EE or something, I'd agree because we actually need as many engineers as possible just because of the nature of their work. unless you're already a genius, nobody is going to give a single fuck about what you do as a mathematician/physicist/chemist because the smarter guys will just call you an idiot and explain why your idea is wrong, making you useless and wasting the smart peoples time.

I'm a physicist and probably 50% of mathematicians could do my job better or the same as me with little to no training. Most training efforts goes to mathematical training because dumbfucks don't understand a thing. If you have a good mathematical foundation (physicists mostly DON'T! and i never met an engineer who does, so shut up with engineers competent in math) learning the application is a 1 day or a few days thing because there's nothing new to understand.

What is not possible in such a short time is learning biological/medical names/things or engineering codes. But most engineers will learn what they need on the job and not in uni anyway.

And yes there ARE mathematicians who are NOT willing and/or able to change their field either because they're autists or bored by other fields. My experience is a lot of physicists work in other fields like finance because a lot of them don't really give a damn about what they're working on (finance is more or less the same as statistical mechanics at this point). They just use their methods and try to make some new.