Welp, since I didn't post anything on Sunday I figure it's

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Oof, rough crowd tonight. I guess I'll stay up until the thread goes down.

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I'm not Christian but I hope you find Jesus or whatever it is you guys are up to. Have some nice music:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ySrVCmigxS8&l

>>38449256
Hey, this is some pretty nice music. Thanks, anon.

>>38448888
Are you a Cathdox?
onigiri

>>38449286
Yes. I believe the Catholic Church has become thoroughly corrupt and that the idea of Sola Scripture is lazy Christianity on behalf of the Protestants.

Of course, we all believe we know the one true message and body of Christ. To each their own. Who knows, maybe the nondenominational Sola Scipture crowd will be the ones who are right. We'll find out.

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>>38448888
>Cathdox Churches pray to Mary and other Saints even though the Scripture tells us to only pray to God
>Rosary is basically prohibited by the Bible
>Statues and Icons which could be idolatry
>Have tons of doctrines which may actually be sinful or false

On the other hand:

>Lutheran and other similar churches are often just degenerate or corrupt
>Evangelical Christians seem the most reasonable
>until you realize that it was nothing like Early Christianity and are probably wrong

I don't even know what should be the authority or who I can trust. Every Church has something wrong with its doctrine or history that makes me unable to trust them.
Should I go to a priest to repent and then receive communion to be saved or do I just have to trust Jesus?
Why couldn't the Church just stayed the same, just like it was in early days, instead of adding so much additional unbiblical and doctrines, often based personal revelations?
That way there wouldn't be so many protestants.

I just want to be sure that I will be saved and won't perish.

>>38449837
Veneration and intercession are not equal to worship. We all pray to God, we just ask the saints and Mary to intercede for us as they are righteous souls. It helps reaching God, so to speak.

>>38449970
No, it is idolatory, anon, and you will burn in hell for your heresy. I'm actually really sorry for you

>>38449970
>It helps reaching God
And I thought that God can hear all of our prayers.

>>38449837
You side with whoever you feel best suits your own relationship with Christianity. Do you believe in Sola Scriptura? Go Protestant. Do you believe in the requirement or at least the attempt of Good Works? Orthodoxy or Catholicism.

Or you can always be nondenominational! There may be disagreements and one doesn't have to 100% agree with every position their specific branch of Christianity has.

Pretty sure Jesus isn't going to abandon all the Christians who didn't belong to the closest as possible interpretation of his Word.

>>38450034
OP here, there is a difference between veneration and worship but the Catholic Church really seems to blur the two when it comes to the Virgin Mary. At least that's how it looks to everyone looking from outside in.

I'm not of the opinion intercession is a thing. Why would someone else need to plea with Jesus on your behalf? It seems like God will choose the best possible outcome, as he sees it, and there's nothing an intercession can add to it.

As a body of historical and cultural knowledge The Lives Of The Saints is amazing.

Basically, the way its all been going, we actually seemed to have left god, unintentionally. We were just making things up to help our religion move along with society over the centuries, and it evolved into something that is not really what was intended to be in the beginning. Yes, we do have some of what was meant to be, but everything else was not planned and just made up, and then we thought it was OK, and they stuck. Man I hate going to. Mass Becuasue I have realized what it has become and its nothing what the Bible says it should be

All these versions of Christianity were written by men, they're all flawed. The general ideas of faith, and morality are a commonality, he's always there, though the message is filtered through the writers.

>>38448888
Hi anon. You're quads compelled me to respond. I'm a sceptic and I've never understood the significance of the crucifixion story from the standpoint of God himself- I'd appreciate enlightenment in this regard

>>38450244
>We were just making things up

>>38450244
It's what we have, anon. Instead of tearing things down our best choices are to find the branch that suits you the best without too much concern you may be picking the wrong one along with changing things from within.

I feel like Christianity needs some kind of revival in some ways. It feels like there's a lot of window dressing going on and the vast majority of priests I see don't drive cheap cars and they wear precious metals during the sermon.

>>38450289
Oh wow, didn't even notice those sweet, sweet quads.

The Crucifixion was the moment wherein Jesus took all our sins upon him, forging the new covenant between man and God. And what happened when Jesus bore our sins? God turned away from his only begotten son. What Jesus became to God when he took on humanity's total sum of sins was something God couldn't even look at. On the cross even Good had to look away from the Christ then. That's how Jesus died. That's why he cried out "Why have you forsaken me?" in genuine pain and agony.

When we take into context that Jesus is a part or element or what have you of the Godhead we see that God loved the world so very much, and us, that in forging a new covenant God tore itself in two and a part, the Christ, really did experience death on our behalf, because that's what the wages of sin are.

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>>38450180
>Good Works don't help you get saved
>Usure if the Bible should be the authority when it was supposedly compiled by the Catholic Chruch
>Unsure whether we get saved by believing or receiving communion

How could I possibly be sure that I'll be saved when always, either Cathdoxes or Protties, will tell me that I'll burn in hell for siding with the "opposite" side.

Why can't I be sure even about the fundamental beliefs and authorities of each church?

>>38450289
He created men to be free creatures, choosing between good and evil at will. Since he's not a man, following his example wouldn't be as easy as if he were. Jesus was supposed to be the perfect example of a man lead by God, at least imo. Basically God is such a perfect representation of what good is, we couldn't conceive it, so he created a man who was good in every way a man can be. And then we killed him in the most brutal way imaginable at the time, something God knew would happen, a sacrifice they both made for the sake of making our direction clearer. He died because we needed to know what sin is and isn't, and because we were given that knowledge, we are allowed to try to convince God to let us live an eternity in paradise, or not.

>>38450380
>Good Works don't help you get saved

I don't believe in being combative on these matters with other Christians since for all I know I could be the wrong one in the end. How I see it is that Christ requires true repentance, yes? Even Protestants go along with this notion. You have do to something that shows you truly feel regret for the sin you have engaged in and try to make amends however you can. Even though Protestants go with Sola Scriptura I think by believing in the concept of Good Works too you're being wise in covering your bases.

Besides, why not help others even if you don't put much stock in Good works?

>Usure if the Bible should be the authority when it was supposedly compiled by the Catholic Chruch

The Catholic Church of today is not the same as that back when the Bible was being assembled as we know it. The KJV is the culmination of many, many earlier versions of the Bible. Almost all branches see the Holy Bible as divinely inspired and guided but still written, translated, edited, and retranslated by fallable men.

>Unsure whether we get saved by believing or receiving communion

You got me on that one, anon. I think it is some important element of our relationship with Christ, like how Jews strictly observe certain holidays by still following the relationship arranged in the old covenant.

>Why can't I be sure even about the fundamental beliefs and authorities of each church?

All of Churches are staffed by only mere mortal men, anon. It's unavoidable that even the clergy who are sinful creatures all the same themselves by just being human make errors and mistakes. I think Orthodoxy isn't as nearly corrupted or touching kiddos like the Catholics while still being fairly conservative and united.

>>38450355
Good response, but therein lies my problem. How did Jesus' death absolve humanity's sin? Could God not forgive us without Jesus dying? Am I right to view Jesus' death as a traditional sacrifice (like they did in those days with plants/animals)?

>>38450355
>Why have you forsaken me

It might have also been because he was on the cross for 9 hours. And the wages of sin are a lot worse than dying.

>>38450436
I replied to the other response on my question anon, unfortunately i'm at work and can only focus on one conversation at this stage... Feel free to respond to my other reply though

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>>38450472
>How did Jesus' death absolve humanity's sin?

In the process of going through the Crucifixion and Resurrection the Christ paid for our sins and his sacrifice allows us to approach God in a way we had started to lose. A big chunk of the new covenant is casting your sins before the Christ, doing what you can to follow his teachings, and truly being repentant for your sins. Faking it or just doing it out of some nebulous fear isn't going to cut it.

>Could God not forgive us without Jesus dying? Am I right to view Jesus' death as a traditional sacrifice (like they did in those days with plants/animals)?

Welcome to exactly why the practice of sacrifices to God was put to an end with Christ; he was the only sacrifice good enough to cover our sins. Only an aspect of the Godhead could do such a thing and loved us so much it did so.

>>38450543
Ok. So God sent himself to earth to sacrifice himself to himself to protect us from his own wrath?

>>38450472
It didnt absolve us, he gave us a chance to know see what's good and what isn't. Leaving no excuse for anyone who sinned after not to know what they were doing was wrong. It wasn't really a sacrifice so much as the most infamous case of torture in recorded history.

>>38450623
Oh boy!!! I have a moral compass it must be bestowed upon me by Jesus!!!

>>38450573
The only one who can appease Gods anger - is God.

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>>38450573
>Ok. So God sent himself to earth to sacrifice himself to himself to protect us from his own wrath?

No, see it more as a new chapter in the relationship with man and God. What man had been doing wasn't enough and we strayed over and over and over so much that the Son of Man came to correct things, or at the very least to offer so things were reworked out.

Remember, we have free will. God will not make you do anything. You're not a puppet or a slave. Turns out even with Moses and all that things were always super rocky between man and God so things were reworked a little between us.

Notice how much of the tone of the Bible changes hinged on before and after the life of the Christ? Some say God came to live as the Son of Man to directly experience how we live to understand us better and to communicate with us in a way we would better understand.

>>38450636
Please don't be rude to others, anon. We were doing so good so far. Here, I'll share a rare Christ-chan if it helps.

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>>38450643
Never thought about it like that, anon. That's a very interesting way to frame the sacrifice of Christ.

>>38450636
If morality is a compass, God the perfect idealogical representation of the good magnetic pole, Satan is the opposite. Whether or not you're religious, they're both ideas of absolute good and evil respectively.

>>38450676
I'm sorry anon I am just overwhelmed by which he had bestowed on me. I mean everyday of my life I work myself into the ground on the basis that I have the ability to help and I might make shit money for doing so but holy bologna the Lord hath chosen me.

I am blessed by him and thus I am drawn to 4chan to spread thy Holy word.

(omg my dick is so hard btw any young men wanna say grave with me?)

>>38450756
Trying to help people by sarcastically demeaning their religion and effort to actually do what you pretend to. How is that any better than what we're doing by trying to talk about our beliefs on a fairly diverse weebsite?

>>38450865
Easy, anon. He's just in need of some of those sweet (You)s. It's the kind of thing where a person will seek out negative attention if they can't get any with positive behavior.

I always make sure to pray that all will at least get a chance to accept the Christ and know the occasional touch of grace the Holy Spirit provides. Same thing I hope for that anon.

OP here, this thread is winding down so here's some /comfy/ music from perhaps the only competent band outside of the Doobie Brothers hit.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gc9yZSubhM4

Christian psychedelic jazz rock back in the heydey of it.

>>38450676
It appears that you are willfully blinding yourself anon. I would've enjoyed going deeper into this conversation with you, but you choose to believe in such a way as to not make your religion appear as ridiculous as it truly is and in the process denying the obvious truths in from of you. I don't mean to disrespect you, I come from a christian background myself. I'm just saddened by the effect religion has on it's subjects

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>>38448888

Why isnt this on /x/ or /b/? R9k isnt supposed to have general threads. Thats the whole point of original posting

>>38451152
What negative effects, anon? I'm not from a Christian household or family myself. My family is all atheist or agnostic at best.

So far as I see it, if I'm wrong, well, what did I lose by trying to be a better person and repent for actions that most do consider wrong anyways. I'm not saying one needs to be a Christian to have a moral compass and we all generally have one save for a small group of outliers.

I'm not hurting anybody and it doesn't really hamper my life. I'm not restricted from doing things I wouldn't normally but it always helps me try to reign in better my personal sins out of anger. Doesn't really seem like a bad thing to me.

Are you atheist? Can you not see God as the Prime Mover if nothing else?

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>>38451188
Me and someone else and maybe a third person have been making them a couple times a week for a little while now. They never seem to get pruned.

Can't a few Christians have their own thread instead of pushing it in other threads? Or does the latter sound better to you?

>>38450623
To be fair anon, the bible is pretty clear about it that Jesus took our sins upon him and died as a sacrifice... So I don't think your understanding of the crux of the crucifixion is totally on point

>>38451207
I never said NEGATIVE effects anon. For you it may be possitive to suppress reality and all its pains for purposes of happiness. My happiness is reliant on critical thinking and embracing reality, therefore it saddens me that religion affects people the way it does. Just as you will probably feel pity for people living in a godless existence, because of your views. Regarding pascal's wager you brought up- I don't think it has footing in reality, as it implies that belief is a choice. If you are of opinion that belief is in fact a choice, u would be interested to hear your reasoning behind your view

>>38451207
Oh i forgot to answer your question. I'm a natural sceptic- my religious views are agnostic

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>>38451188
>R9k isnt supposed to have general threads.
says who? read the sticky again

also
>/r9k/ has no topic

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>>38451358
>>38451386
It's super late so I'm going to flop out, anons. It was nice talking to you. Have a good night.

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>>38448888
Is the immense suffering we have endured for the past 100 years proof the God is dead, or proof that he lives and is punishing us?

>>38450676
Us having freedom to make the wrong choice is the worst thing that has ever happened to man.

We need the freedom to never make the wrong choice.

>>38451249
It's like you're trying to say his death excuses all of mankind's sin, and that we all go to heaven, that's how alot of people misinterpret John 3:16. His life was a guideline, his death was when the gates were opened, probably because God was satisfied with his own explanation of what a good man is. It wasn't even a sacrifice, they took him to trial and executed him.

>>38451933
Us having the freedom to make the wrong choice is what makes us man.

>>38451905
It might be proof that we're going in the wrong direction

>>38448888
>8888
>>38451933
Reminder that Fascism is the ideology of God.

Modern Man: "If I cannot choose wrong then there is no freedom."

Fascism: "Freedom comes from choosing to do Right".

Modern man believes that he cherishes "Freedom" when in reality he only cherishes the freedom to do wrong, and if presented with an expectation to do right he acts out, akin to a child, with protests of his "Freedoms" being infringed upon, complaining about "fatalism" at the notion of there being only one correct path, which for him, denies the existence of Free Will.

Fascism prizes real Freedom, the Freedom to do Right, to consciously reject false choices and their trappings that lead man to extinction. Yet it is this message, that the "Free world" is attempting to silence the. Modern man fails the test of Free Will and imposes the Freedom to do Wrong on future generations. Fascism seeks to liberate those generations and give them the Freedom to do Right.

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Reviving this thread
>>38449837
>Cathodox Churches pray to Mary and other Saints even though the Scripture tells us to only pray to God
The Bible says only to worship God, it doesn't say that others can't pray on your behalf. In fact, Ephesians 6:19 supports it.
>Rosary is basically prohibited by the Bible
See first point
>Statues and Icons which could be idolatry
Idolatry is the belief of a work on Earth to be God. No Cathodox believes a statue to be God in physical form on Earth.
>Have tons of doctrines which may actually be sinful or false
I'm not seeing it.
>>38450067
He can, but you've heard or have asked others to pray to God on your behalf right? It is the same things with the Blessed Mary and the communion of Saints.
>>38452499
>Reminder that Fascism is the ideology of God.
St. Franco when? Those damned Jew Bolsheviks burned down churches and murdered priests, they had it coming.
Also shout out to Codreanu.

What's a good daily devotional? Would be nice if they were geared towards women since I am one.

How do I cure my degeneracy? I'm desensitized to gore and nudity in a way.

How do I make someone who doesn't see the point in helping others more charitable? He's convinced that people have to help themselves, which is true, but his heart is completely hardened towards donating, charity, etc. He grew up very religious but is still like this.

Thanks xx

>>38450380
God forgave us for sticking his son on a cross I'm sure it's not THAT important to him.

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Why is this thread still not removed? Superstition is a fucking cancer to human mind
>>38448888(OP)
Stop trying to fool poor robots

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Am I the only one here who can't wait for the next crusade?

>>38453603
Yes but don't delete the homo threads we need those.

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>>38453541
>What's a good daily devotional? Would be nice if they were geared towards women since I am one.
Pray the rosary daily. There's also plenty chaplets to female saints here; http://www.catholicdoors.com/prayers/chaplets.htm
>How do I cure my degeneracy? I'm desensitized to gore and nudity in a way.
Part of it is realizing and accepting that every being is an icon of God, and gore is the act of destroying an icon of God. The same for nudity in many situations: the perversion of an icon of God.
Besides that, perhaps taking a break from the internet where most things of those nature are seen may help.
>How do I make someone who doesn't see the point in helping others more charitable? He's convinced that people have to help themselves, which is true, but his heart is completely hardened towards donating, charity, etc. He grew up very religious but is still like this.
Acts 20:35 - I have shewed you all things, how that so labouring ye ought to support the weak, and to remember the words of the Lord Jesus, how he said, It is more blessed to give than to receive.
Deuteronomy 15:7-11 - If there be among you a poor man of one of thy brethren within any of thy gates in thy land which the LORD thy God giveth thee, thou shalt not harden thine heart, nor shut thine hand from thy poor brother
Luke 6:38 - Give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall men give into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again.

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so yall catholics like raping little children?

>>38453700
I'm not catholic. anyway, thanks.
i wanted a devotional because i want to journal and want daily motivation, idk

>>38453541
>How do I cure my degeneracy? I'm desensitized to gore and nudity in a way.

Self control.
You are the one who makes the choice of succumbing to your base desires and vices, making you no better than an advanced animal.

You must overcome them to be something more than human. You are given the choice to do wrong (like the other anon said) as a challenge, these lies are enticing and satisfy our most base immediate urges, but we are meant to reject degeneracy and follow truth.

>>38453500
As an agnostic,
How do you deal with the corruption and degeneracy in the churches?
The only way I see to fix this is a night of the long knives.

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>>38453758
>I'm not catholic.
Begome gadolic :DDDDD
>anyway, thanks.
No problem
>>38453785
It's a real travesty that a number of faggots and diddlers have infiltrated the Church, and they ought to be given the Lord's justice. But God said that there will be one Church built on St Peter, and the gates of hell will not prevail against it. I have faith in that promise. Also there is the Miracle of Fatima, where the blessed Virgin Mary said that the Church will be delivered at the moment of it's greatest distress.
Aside from those two things, I don't think it's genuine to leave the Church for scandals. Should we deny the disciples because of Judas? Even St. Peter denied Christ thrice, but was chosen as the very first Pope and the rock foundation of Christ's Church.
Last, from a personal view, I like mass, the Latin tradition, and most Cathoic folk I've met at Church are very nice and it helps me from becoming a complete recluse.

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Sure, I COULD worship a god that MIGHT be the right god among MILLIONS of other deities, god and spirits

Or I could be party rockin

Also quit diddlin children you fags

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>>38453977
there is only one god family

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>>38453977
pesky faithless oven dodger

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>>38454056
I dunno man, LMFAO is a two person group

>>38454057
SORRY FOR PARTY ROCKIN
Oh wait, I'm not

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>>38453887
I can't wait for furry priests to give my cummieconfessions to.
:^)

>>38450380
The church has been scaring people into their ranks for centuries. The only one who can save you is essentially yourself. God created everything, we were meant to be different. The summary of Christianity IMO is don't be a dick.
If God is air youll be judged for what you've done, not what sect you belonged to. That is muslim-thinking. There are assholes everywhere, even in the so-call "right" sects. It would be strange if everyone in that one single sect would be saved despite being an evildoer.
Think of it like this: God created everything. Every human is a product of God, so why would he want you to kill the others?

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>Earth is billions of years old
>Mankind is millions of years old
>At best, Christianity is a couple thousand years old

How do you explain this?

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>>38454154
God is eternal.
Atheists 0
Christians 777

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>>38454169
So are a bunch of other gods that are older than Christianity

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>>38454154
>earth is billions of ears old
-Yes according to your heretic sciendicks
Mankind is millions of years old
-See above
At best X-ianity is a couple thousand years old
Like the world, maybe?

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>>38454209
This is why nobody takes Christianity seriously anymore. You live in a fantasy world

Here, you might be able to do this test if you try real hard and pray

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But either way. The simplest answers are often the correct. Look (((them))) for instance. The only power they really have is the one we let them have. Noone is forcing us to do anything. We run their machines, we fight their wars we even clean their toilets. We're not forced to do that. We simply do it because we've been taught to do it in return for comfort.

Pic related is from the Illuminati- cardgame from 1995. It has been right before, several times actually, I'm sure it will be again. Don't listen to priests, TV-saviours or psychics. They're just as blind as we are.

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>>38454236
ooush that's actually fucking retarded.

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>>38454271
Another thing to mention is that most things that are wrong to do yo will feel it deep down. Someplace within you you can simply just feel that it is wrong and you won't need scripture to do what is right.

Use pic for example. We don't need a law or book or ideology to see that this is fucked up beyond description. Those people are sick and rotten to the core and everyone with a grain of brains should keep as far away as possible from it.

But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

Mathew 5:44
So stop hating on us Satanists reeeee

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>>38454549
Before I sign out of this bread theres ONE last statement. Everyone is an individual like you, and noone is the badguy of their own story. Even AntiFa or ISIS don't think they're the badguy. They geniunely believe they are doing the right thing. Keep in mind that most humans aren't very philosophical or deep thinking and never really think about what the rest of the world view think about what they are doing.

>>38454549
>there are still religious retards that think this way

Congrats on killing your own religion.
Meanwhile churches that aren't retarded are openly welcoming gays.

>>38450180
>Sola Scriptura
>but let's also remove books from the Bible that I don't like
Luther was a heretic of the highest order and I hope he's sucking cock in Hell.

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>>38454733
Churches accept sexual deviance out of political correctness. Fact is that homosexuality is dangerous and even deadly in some cases. HIV is running rampant in gay communities. Not only that, but homos usually are pedophiles as well. They also have a higher rate of drug-use and mental illnesses too.

>>38453500
Ephesians 6:19 says to pray FOR saints, NOT TO them. Also, all living christians are saints, see 1 Corinthians 1:2 thus making this verse make much more sense.

>Rosary is basically prohibited by the Bible
"But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking." Matthew 6:7

And what is rosary other than repeating prayers using praying beads like pagans did, but to their Gods?

>Statues and Icons which could be idolatry
Exodus 20:4-5

>Have tons of doctrines which may actually be sinful or false
Immaculate Conception, Original Sin in Catholic meaning (inheriting not only th sinful nature but also the sin of our fathers), Mary being a virgin through all her life, calling priests Fathers, Purgatory and more false teaching and doctrines