Why do we have to pay this government agency $18 billions a year?

So retards on reddit can claim they like science

>>35816980
Just feels bad I'll never live to see a colony on Titan.

>>35817002
If they like science, why don't they pay for it directly instead of forcing everyone's money to go to NASA?

also so they can move the white people off-world to a glorious paradise on the red planet

>>35816980
If we don't figure out how to send a few now then we're not going to figure out how to send many later, and make space colonies, and live on other planets. Baby steps dumbass.

>>35816980
Some of us may well be posting on satellite internet.

Most of the broadcasts you watch will be satellite now too. Mars isn't 10% of what Nasa have done for the entire world.

>>35817083
if that is so important to cost $18 billions a year why force everyone to pay for it?

people should be able to decide if they want to give their money to NASA. if that is important as you claim, people will want to give NASA their money

>>35817169
Do you want resources from other places besides Earth or not? And besides, if you're worried about money being spent on dumb shit, NASA should be the least of your worries.

>>35816980
Because they'll find us a new place to go after we inevitably fuck up Earth beyond repair.

Plus we spend WAY too much on defense if you want to talk about wasteful.

We simply must become an interplanetary species, OP. Then we can dominate the solar system and eventually the entire galaxy.

It is the end result of humanity's destiny.

Nuclear fusion and interstellar travel is a must.

Generally speaking the practical benefit of NASA funding is the useful technology which is invented as a result. Originally the space race and moon landing were only a front for ballistic missile research so that we could deliver nuclear payloads to those filthy Russians on the other side of the planet. There's also a more vague benefit of popularizing STEM, and inspiring a whole generation of engineers.

>>35817195
>Do you want resources from other places besides Earth or not?

What do you mean by resources from other places?
I have personally nothing to gain from that.
There are already companies that want to get all the rare materials from asteroids and crash the market. They can get their money from investors and donations. I shouldn't need to have my tax money go toward that.

>>35817246
>we spend WAY too much on defense if you want to talk about wasteful.

yeah because every NATO ally spends too little. someone has to defend the west if we don't want to get steamrolled by china and russia.

>>35817295

interstellar travel is a pipe dream. We haven't discovered anything since the moon landing that has radically changed the possibilities of space travel. We'd have to find a way to travel faster than the speed of light(Not happening, it's a fundamental property of the universe)

Terraforming mars is also retarded beyond all belief. It serves literally no point except to spend an absurd amount of resources to create a human environment that will never be self sustaining and is far less efficient than living anywhere on earth.

The only way humans can reach beyond our solar system is with robots.

Space travel is fantasy, humans reaching places millions of light years away is about as likley as bacteria building a Rocket to reach the moon.

>>35817466
No. To all of your points. You have no idea what is to come.

>>35817550
You people really annoy me. Your arguments always boil down to "b-but space is cool!"

>>35817466
>>35817325
Hey, retards.

>>35817304

>>35817466
The more you post the more you sound like an angry teenager who doesn't know anything about space or NASA. Just go to bed already.

>>35817304
Scientific knowledge and the advancement of technology are good things and I have no objection to them.

I object to the idea that the space program has to be sending up manned missions. You get more knowledge about the universe per dollar spent if you're sending unmanned probes. Manned missions are circular logic - you send people to space to learn about how humans can live in space, which you need to know to be able to send more humans to space.

>>35817466
>we haven't discovered anything since the moon landing that has radically changed the possibilities of space travel

i don't like the shilling that space explorer wannabes churn out but you have to at least acknowledge the massive difference in funding between then and now

>>35817663
No, my argument is from Hamlet

"There is more to life and the universe than is dreamt of in your philosophy."

You have no IDEA what is possible. Generational ships, reactionless drives, Alcubierre drives, all are tools to forge a new future for the indomitable human race.

>>35817713
Thank you, friend, for putting this negative nancy in his place.

>>35816980
Long term benefits are advances in science, the possibility for colonising (or militarising) other planets etc

Right now, NASA helps keep talented people in the US and creates a braindrain from other countries, develops rockets and satellites, many of which have military use, stops Russia and China from just weaponising space at will and also spawns a ton of inventions and technologies

Tl;dr: Without NASA the commies would shove satellite launched nukes up our asses

>>35817466
Sometime you'll realize that not being able to think positively about ideas or dreams about the future doesn't make you seem as smart as you like to think.

You aren't fooling anyone. We all know you're just a bitter cunt.

>>35817782
>all are tools to forge a new future for the indomitable human race.
And there's zero point in that. Your manifest destiny project has no purpose except "b-but, it'd be really cool to go to space!"

>>35816980
You need government to spend that money because its not really something anyone can make money off of. Doing research on things that might be useful 50 years from now isn't something you're going to get investors interested in since you won't make money. What happens is first we get NASA to send people into orbit then the moon. Then decades later we get Space-X which is only possible because of the knowledge we gained from NASA sending people to the Moon to stick an American flag in the ground. Soon there will be an entire industry and there will be more than just Space-X.

10 billion is fucking chump change. It's the scraps from the table. We pay over 1 billion a day to play in the sand and test our weapon systems while everyone is rallied against muslims like the tards we are. We're all doomed and nobody can see it except fucking NASA, who have documented and well recorded scientific facts that we're fucking everything up and nobody cares. I hope I gain the courage to kill myself before the impending doom hits us directly.

>>35816980
why are you focusing on something that receives relatively little money compared to other US entities?

>>35817466
>Wordly travel is a pipe dream. We haven't discovered anything since reaching China that has radically changed the possibilities of naval travel. We'd have to find a way to travel faster than the speed of the wind(Not happening, it's a fundamental property of the Earth)
>Colonizing is also retarded beyond all belief. It serves literally no point except to spend an absurd amount of resources to create a human environment that will never be self sustaining and is far less efficient than living anywhere in Europe.
>The only way humans can reach beyond our country is with slaves
>World travel is fantasy, humans reaching places thousands of miles away is about as likely as China building a Rocket to reach the moon.

>>35817883
If you weren't a bitter cunt, you'd know that your comment is irrelephant.

If you boil it down, there's no real point to anything, fuckmeister. So with that kind of philosophy, we all just might as well kill ourselves.

No, for all we know, we are the FIRST and ONLY life in the entire goddamn universe. And it's our responsibility to PUSH beyond our limits. To grow the glory of the Human race. Homo Sapiens Uber Alles!!

Whether we succeed or fail, the point is that we tried. But, friend, if I were a betting man, I'd bet on success. Let me tell you that.

i will be the first to sign up for offworld mining jobs

>>35818079
sadly that won't be coming in our lifetime

>>35817883
That's a great reason to do something in it's own right.

To be fair, there is a lot that we could benefit from. We could find abundances of certain ions or molecules that can be adapted towards a lot of different applications. For one, it's been proven that there are certain isotopes of heavy Hydrogen on the moon which we know would greatly improve the efficiency of hydrogen based engines. That's just one thing. What if we find certain isotopes of metalic elements that can be used in increasing efficiency of transistors or used in solar panels.

Also putting in the work needed to make the whole endeavor happen will benefit science in that it will encourage all kinds of discipline to help. Geologists would get to study an entire new planet heads on. Plant scientists will be forced to have to discover new ways to grow food which could directly improve how we do agriculture here on Earth.

So nah. There's a lot to come of this. You're just a cunt who can't think positive and thinks being a negative cunt without any actual knowledge makes you seem better than others. And yes, even if none of above existed, it being cool as shit is enough reasoning for me.

>>35818016
Kek, Nice. But it will surely take long before we can do something great

>>35816980

If it were up to me I'd triple that budget.

>>35818206
who will pay for it?

>>35818049
>If you boil it down, there's no real point to anything, fuckmeister.
That's exactly correct.

>And it's our responsibility to PUSH beyond our limits. To grow the glory of the Human race.
Why would we as a species have any responsibility to do anything? Why is glory worth anything? Especially if, as you suspect, there's nobody else around to see it? If you were suddenly the only living person, you could do all the glorious things you wanted, and it wouldn't matter half a rats ass. You'd die and that's the end of all that. You're deluding yourself in thinking glory matters.

>>35818110
Nothing stops you from looking for new resources or developing hydroponics or whatever right here on Earth. If you want to fund research to improve life on Earth, fund it, don't attach it as an ancillary thing to a space program. Cut out the middleman. Studying other planets close up can be done much more cheaply and with much less risk by an unmanned mission.

>>35817883
Money my friend, Portugal and Spain invested in naval expeditions and were the first to share the wealth of America, but they didn't think about the future, and England rose to power slowly with the industrial revolution. Whoever ignores the future is bound to be destroyed by it

>>35818206
just triple?

>>35816980

it's worse than that, they fake shit, earth is flat, there are no satelites the they have the international fake station, you can't get out of the dome barrier to leave earth's atmosphere

it's not hard to understand, if there was a vacuum of space the air would just be sucked away

stop being fucking brainwashed retards

>>35818296
if the earth is flat, how do you explain the coriolis effect?

>>35816980
As long as we only have one planet we are vulnerable to rogue comet death scenario.

>>35818230
There isn't heavy hydrogen or light helium on Earth yet there is some on the Moon. That's the point.

>>35818250
You're assuming there's some kind of enormous wealth in space. There isn't. The same elements and compounds are out there as are down here. I've heard this kind of argument advanced for a Mars colony more than once. As if rust and dry ice are rare and valuable things that are worth a trillion-dollar space expedition.

If you just care about knowing how the universe works, well, again, technology has long since advanced to the point where we can do that from the comfort of our armchairs with unmanned probes.

>>35817466
so you are saying there is a possibility

>>35818370
Land is worth more than you can possibly imagine, and it's an extremely finite resource on Earth. Those other resources aren't unlimited either. Eventually everything we use will run out. Just because it won't happen in your lifetime doesn't mean we shouldn't care about it.

>>35818230
Blah Blah Blah. All I'm hearing is pathetic excuses to stay at home and not do anything. You're weak, face it. But that's ok, our race in general is strong, adventurous and that's what has propelled us to where we are now and will propel us to continue to conquer. Just for the sheer hell of it, LOL.

But, when we need a lazy layabout to hold down the couches on Mars, drink the Martian beer, and watch the silly Martian sitcoms, we'll give you a call, Bud. ;)

>>35818348
>There isn't heavy hydrogen or light helium on Earth yet there is some on the Moon. That's the point.
Well first you don't need helium-3 to run a fusion reactor, but if you want it, you can just harvest it from the solar wind. That's how it got to the moon, after all. Deuterium you can literally electrolyze right out of the ocean. Most hydrogen atoms aren't deuterium here, but that doesn't matter much when you have a whole oceanful of water. And it'll be easier, safer, and more efficient to get it there then to go all the way to the moon to extract it and ship it back.

Every resource you could get in space is like that. The massive distances you have to cover means that it's invariably better to just focus on refining it here on Earth. The only downside that doing that has is that it isn't in space and therefore you don't think its cool.

>>35818414
Blah blah blah, something about doing shit for the sake of doing shit, because some faggot things it's honorable and manly and glorious. People get tired of funding crap like that. They have concerns that aren't pies in the sky like yours are.

Come back in 20 years when Elon Musk and his Mars venture are bankrupt, and you're shilling some penny-stock he's trying to issue to raise more money for another rocket, just so I can tell you "No, fuck off".

>>35818312
As much of a retard as he is, Coriolis could still work on a flat disc. What he needs to realize, however, is that our atmosphere IS getting sucked away, a few metric tons at a time. The issue is that Earth's gravity slows it down to mere drops in the ocean, and outgassing from inside Earth itself helps to replace the lost atmosphere

>>35818370
>You're assuming there's some kind of enormous wealth in America. There isn't. The same trees and minerals are out there as are down here. I've heard this kind of argument advanced for an America colony more than once. As if wood and grass are rare and valuable things that are worth a million-doblas naval expedition

Finding something as common as iron could be profitable if we can lower the costs of space travel

>>35818571
It's always easier to stand on the sidelines and criticize and be a sad cunt. That's all that we're ALL trying to say.

You should see the movie "Get On The Bus", it's very apropos to your mentality and situation. You are essentially the black man that needs to get on the bus, lest it leave without you.

>>35816980
yeah ive always had a issue with this. the 18 billion should be re directed to help the homeless, mentally ill, vets, the elderly, etc. we need to handle our shit here on earth before we start dumping billions into space exploration. space exploring is a luxury. lets use that money for necessities first. get our priorities straight, you know? science is th biggest fucking money waster

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>>35816980

First off nobody pays NASA, as in the taxpayer does not pay NASA. The government first takes your money from you in sum total amounts and redistributes them as government sees fit. You have no say. You are a human resource, a commodity.

NASA provides strategic propaganda for domestic and international consumption. One of their most successful campaigns was the Moon Landing.

"Buh..buh..NASA gave us cool stuff to use domestically!" All of which could and would have been done whether or not NASA was around. The engineering field will not disappear overnight if NASA disbands. In fact it would flourish.

If you want to understand the phenomena beyond the sky, go buy yourself a decent telescope and have a look yourself. Do the work yourself. Do not rely on a government agency to tell you what is going on around and above you.

>>35818709
>science is the biggest fucking money waster

see: internet, phones, the device you're posting from, etc.

>>35818452
>And it'll be easier, safer, and more efficient to get it there then to go all the way to the moon to extract it and ship it back.

Time will tell whether or not this statement is true. I think there is enough evidence to show that the abundances of these ions show enough reason, and I think the whole endeavor is easier than one might imagine.

You have a biased, overly negative view of space travel, and it seems more coming from a tendency to not want to see other people succeed than it comes from rationalism. so I'm going to leave you to that. Have fun being a bitter cunt.

>>35818709
Tricky, you almost had me going and for that here's your (you)

>>35818571
>come back in 20 years when Elon Musk and his Mars venture are bankrupt

You sound like an awful person. How can you not want someone to be successful? You literally just want some to fail just so you can call superiority.

>>35818657
>if we can lower the costs of space travel
Space travel is inherently expensive and will remain so, because of the negative feedback loop. You need to burn fuel to get out of the gravity well, which means lifting that fuel in addition to your payload, which means you need a bigger rocket and MORE fuel to lift that extra weight, and so on and so on. You're always going to be pushing uphill.

If you have some grand scheme with a space elevator or something, cool. Why not build that before you go off to Mars? Wouldn't that make more sense then just sinking resources into something and trusting that technology will magically make it all work out well?

>>35818760
It comes from a desire to not throw good money after bad, and to not see resources squandered on wasteful endeavors.

If there's a case that's been built on hard science and bottom-line accounting, and not a huge dose of hype, speculation, and "space is cool", I've yet to see it.

Three reasons, so my uncle can have a job, to monitor the earths weather, and to learn about the stars, but aside from that, the private industry should take iver and will most likely reach mars before nasa. Hell, nasa is working on their first spacecraft in years while spacex landed a moving rocket on a moving barge and the airforce has been launching more shit into space than god damned masa. And private industry can launch for a lot cheaper than nasa. I have family that works for spacex and nasa and talked with them over diner a week ago and everyone who works for nasa thinks it is a waste and private industry should take over space.

Despite what people here are saying, we will never travel faster than the speed of light, it defies the laws of physics. We could however find an alternative means of travel, however that would take immensely advanced technology.

part 1/2

>>35817550

>T. Some pleb who doesn't understand basic physics or economics.


>>35817673

Nothing in my post was criticizing the practicality of Nasa, iI was poking fun at elon musk tards if anything.

>>35817713
That was my first post.

I don't have my Physics degree yet, but i'm up to thermodynamics and am currently in a Quantum 1 course. Some are researching concepts that could related to the concept if it actually exists but right now they're really just creaming their pants over gravity Waves and String Theory.
Some SuperString theories if true might make FTL plausible. But it wouldn't be able to be applied to travel for humans without energy or situations that is far beyond what we posses. There is no theory that makes it plausible for Humans to colonize the universe or whatever.
There is absolutely 0 reason to believe that anything you're fantasizing about is plausible. Except colonizing Mars, you can do that but it's still a big waste of money.

>B-but you don't know how things will change in the future.

Boy are you right! But Consider this: Einstein basically Predicted the next 100 years of discoveries in the field of physics with his Theory of General Relativity. Einstein himself was skeptical of some of this theories concepts. For instance he doubted blackholes existed. But the theory itself has been spot on.

But one of the core concepts of this theory is that nothing can travel FTL. The theory was right about everything else, it's going to be right about this too.

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>>35816980
>I'll never live to see a colony on Titan
whatever you say man

>>35818826

>
This is obviously bait, my point is, you dense motherfucker, If we keep advancing the technology there will be a time when it gets so cheap that even iron can pays it, but even If the costs stay high, we could find expensive shit to compensate.

>>35818571
>Elon Musk and his Mars venture are bankrupt
>Elon Musk
>Bankrupt
Are you retarded, the owner of tesla and spacex going bankrupt? You think all spacex wants to do is get to mars while they are making billions sending two rich men to the moon, sending satalites up for multpile industries and buisnesses faster than any other existing company, and sending supplies to the spacestatiom will go bankrupt?
Unrionicly killyourself, clense this world of your autism.

>>35818945
2/2

>>35817845

If you wanna dream scifi by all means go ahead, but don't feign scientific knowledge or understanding to justify it as something that's actually possible like some of these retards.
Sorry to crush your dreams kiddos, but we're not even going to survive on this planet much longer. Interstellar Human travel will never happen. Best we can do is satellites.

We have less than a century before fossil fuels begin to dry up and the world economy starts to tumble. Only Coal will be around for more than a century. The human race is't going to be shit without fossil fuels. And don't you dare even say "B-but Nuclear or Artificial Bio Fuel" Both are far more limited and/or costly than fossil fuels. They have their uses but seriously they aren't replacements by any means.

Unless we can find an alternative to the Combustion engine(nope) we need fossil fuels to maintain literally everything we've built in the last century or so. If the human race survives it's going towards a much more modest existence in terms of Scientific discovery.

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>>35817466
>We'd have to find a way to travel faster than the speed of light(Not happening, it's a fundamental property of the universe)
There are some possible ways around that. Even if those don't pan out, subluminal travel should suffice if we can get suspended animation to work.

>>35818826
>I've yet to see it.
That makes sense.

https://www.hq.nasa.gov/office/hqlibrary/documents/o33273018.pdf
https://www.nasa.gov/home/hqnews/2007/sep/HQ_07193_Griffin_lecture.html
https://www.nap.edu/read/11020/chapter/4#13

Found this in 10 minutes. I'm sure there's better stuff out there. Of course I know you're going to suggest that this isn't enough evidence, but I know your type. There is nothing that could convince you of this, and that's fairly obvious.

>>35818969
So is there anything that would cause you to say "No, the numbers don't add up. This just isn't a viable enterprise, we shouldn't do it, at least not until there's some fundamental change in our capabilities."

Because I've never seen a space enthusiast do that. They're confident that their proposed ventures are absolutely going to work and be worth plowing the money into. No, not now, but some point in the future, if we just keep shoveling money, brains, and time at it, it's sure to be great!

My objection to you is that you jettison practicality in your zeal to make what you want happen. You shouldn't do that just because you think space is cool.

>>35818895
They used to say that about trains too. About how they couldn't go past 40 miles per hour because the "air would be sucked out of the compartment", that it was "against physics".

The calculations add up, meng. They just add up.
>>35819014

>>35818976
Even with large government contracts he's not profitable. Neither is Tesla, which is similarly dependent on vast tax breaks for electric cars. He's living on the forbearance of venture capitalists giving him money.

He and his companies are finished as soon as that money dries up when the next recession comes.

>>35819069
>>They used to say that about trains too.
They laughed at Edison! They laughed at Einstein!

Yeah, well they also laughed at Bozo the Clown.

People saying something can't be done is not evidence that it actually can be.

>>35819032
Not that guy, but I'd be interested in seeing this evidence.

>>35819113
"Oh noes, that looks hard! I guess we shouldn't even try..." Protip: that's you.

It's also not evidence that it CAN'T be done. Checkmate, athiest.

When you know something (anything) about science, I invite you to come back and argue coherently.

>>35819113
>Yeah, well they also laughed at Bozo the Clown.
And Bozo the Clown is probably the world's most well known clown. Clearly, he did well for himself.

>>35819193
When someone says he can go as fast as a jet you laugh at him until he shows you scientific proof that he can go as fast as a jet.

Speed of light is impossible.

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>>35819193
>Oh noes
You know it's 2017, right?

>>35818945
>I don't have my Physics degree yet
Big surprise.

>Einstein basically Predicted the next 100 years of discoveries in the field of physics with his Theory of General Relativity.
You pulled this straight out of your ass.

>But one of the core concepts of this theory is that nothing can travel FTL.
We don't need this to get around the solar system. Even with our current rockets we can still get to Mars within a couple months, which is a lot quicker than what traveling across oceans used to be.


>The theory was right about everything else, it's going to be right about this too.
Illogical as fuck.

i wish i had been born like 500 years later. what a jip being born right during the advent of modern processors/computing

>>35819244
By the Holy Light of Blessed Allah, Peace Be Unto Him, your ignorance flabbergasts and annoys me to no end.

Have you not read even the basics of the wikipedia from Alcubierre? Where the bending of space allows for a superluminal transposition?

Please. For your own sake, leave this thread, you are embarrassing yourself and making everyone feel uncomfortable. The next thing you'll be telling us is that you don't believe in global warming or the moon landings or vaccination.

The Moon landings inspired hundreds of thousands of people to get interested in STEM. How many more will be inspired by watching men walk on Mars?

>>35819372
where is the engine? where is the FTL ship?

>>35819431
has the first person to walk on mars been born already?

>>35816980
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NASA_spinoff_technologies

Dumbass. Kys

18B is nothing. If it were to be cut entirely, you would see absolutely no difference to your personal life, except not getting anymore neat space stories. I choose the neat space stories.

>>35819465
probably, but the people who are paying NASA through the money that's going directly into the already huge national debt are not born already

what a sensible thing to do, indebt your grandchildren so that you can finally go to mars

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>Tfw get to the pinnacle of technology
>still won't/can't explore more than 1% of the universe

>>35819513
>you can finally go to mars

Not even you, a handful of people will.

>>35819513
https://www.thebalance.com/nasa-budget-current-funding-and-history-3306321

Every one dollar spent on NASA contributes 10 dollars to the US economy.

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>people in this thread who think NASA only does research related to space
>mfw

>>35819572
every one dollar spent on NASA is one dollar taken away from your children's future who don't have a saying in anything the NASA does

if investing in space research is so profitable why can't NASA give up on government money and get investors or donations?

>>35819032
The only hope we have is based on human evolution, for thousands of years flying seemed impossible (and some still think it's sorcery), but with step after step we managed to do it. The way you say makes it seem like we are just throwing money away, which is not true, jobs are created and families fed with this money.

The greatest problem here is, that to find "fundamental change in our capabilities" investment is needed. And as far as scarcity is a threat here in Earth (it'll always be, we always want more), we won't stop investing in space travel.

And 18B a year are like 5 dollars per month for each american, with so little money the steps will always seem small and unimportant. There is a very little chance that we find expensive shit out there, but the country that manages to do it will get wealthy as fuck

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>597 billion spent on military (bullying sand niggers on the other side of the planet)

>no lets complain about 18 billion being spent on advanced research and technologies

>>35819636
would you pay those 5 dollars per month voluntarily?

>>35819628
Are you unable to comprehend the article? It takes a dollar from those children and gives them 10 dollars back.

>if investing in space research is so profitable why can't NASA give up on government money and get investors or donations?
It probably could. Look at SpaceX.

>>35816980
1. $18 billion is chump change to the American Government

2. If you're against being part of the first country ever to set foot on Mars in all of human history then you are a fucking small minded faggot, that's all I have to say about that

3. NASA research pays us back 40-fold with manufacturing, engineering jobs, and bustling economic activity. Have a short list of NASA products that you use every day http://www.therichest.com/rich-list/the-biggest/20-shocking-nasa-inventions-we-use-everyday/
Look at some of those products and consider how prolific they are. Imagine the economic activity behind the manufacturing and distribution of those products. It is MUCH higher than $18 billion per year, I promise you that.

4. Basically you are ignorant. It's no surprise you're fucking American. You were probably raised in a shit state with a shit education system like Michigan.

>>35819679
All those inventions could have been made sooner and cheaper in the free market.
NASA hoards all the smart people into a costly government program.
Who knows what those same engineers could have invented in the free market where efficiency is much higher.

>>35818225
..do you realize how fucking small $60 billion is to the U.S. government? It's a substantial amount of money but it would not represent a significant burden to an entity that pulls in 3.18 trillion per year.

Three point one eight trillion dollars.

You fucking idiots who bitch about "balancing the budget blah blah blah" never attack the three money drains in this country: military, medicaid/medicare, social security

If a politican is talking about balancing the budget and doesn't talk about cutting one of those three things, he's simply not serious about his plan. Almost nothing else costs any money compared to those three.

>>35816980
You know you spend 300 times that on a military that does nothing, right?

You're also going to build a meme wall in the fucking desert.

But yeah researching science is a waste of money, let the poo in loos handle that.

hashtag maga

>>35819724
Are you seriously implying the free market is good for anything more than wasting resources on stupid consumerism bullshit? It's completely unsustainable

>>35819724
It's cute that you just assert you're correct

>>35819763
You know the government just doesn't have the power to create wealth out of nothing?

The money is coming from somewhere, all the government does is move it from your pockets to the pockets of people you don't care about for programs you don't care about.

>>35819517
>Tfw everyone ignores the truth

>>35819724
>All those inventions could have been made sooner and cheaper in the free market.

I'm interested in what makes you qualified to make this claim.

>NASA hoards all the smart people
No it does not.

>costly government program
That literally gives more than it takes.

>Who knows what those same engineers could have invented in the free market where efficiency is much higher.

Yes. No one knows. Including you.

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>>35819724
>muh free market

What free market?

Where?

Show us where this magical market exists other than the imagination of libertarians.

>>35819829
is what made the US the biggest power in the 19th century

>>35819724
All long-term R&D requires government investment in some form. Whether it's copyright protection or straight up funding, the government is involved somewhere.

You need government intervention because Pfizer is not going to spend $50 million to invent a drug that can just be backwards-engineered after it's invented and sold for cheaper by competitors. The market would stagnate. You need copyright protection or else there is no incentive to create. A true free market wouldn't create a better world, even hard-line capitalists agree with that. I should know, because I am one.

>>35819848
The USA did not have a free market in the 19th century.

>>35819852
>implying the government is the only entity capable of handling copyrights

>>35819798
What the fuck are you babbling about? Are you a real idiot?
Also why did you decide that I just suddenly don't care about space exploration, science, and huge booms in economic activity due to NASA research?

The biggest problem with politics right now is clowns like you who start first with a narrative and then search for validation.

>>35819671
I would pay even more if I could remove it from my taxes.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emergency_Economic_Stabilization_Act_of_2008
>I could argue that it's better than supporting thieves and crooks

>>35819886
1) How would a privatization of copyright law work?
2) how are we going to overthrow the government and instate this privatization of copyright law?
3) how many lives will be lost in this coup?

I'm not interested in talking to edgy libertarians and AnArchs. I'm interested in real life solutions. Long-term R&D with unknown profit incentives is unattractive to investors and business owners. It is hard to convince big business that they should strive toward scientific achievement like putting men on Mars. I think a more workable solution to advance science is to simply allow the U.S. government to fund NASA, rather than form a guerilla network of edgy anarcho capitalists to overthrow the most powerful military force in the world and then instate a country-wide libertarian free market where private entities research Mars travel "in a more efficient market."

Now get the fuck out because you sound ridiculous. Your arguments only work in a fantasy world, not the real world. You need a dose of realism.

>>35819939
the only boom due to NASA research is the big atomic bomb that the aliens are going to drop on us for sticking our noses where we shouldn't

>>35820041
>It is hard to convince big business that they should strive toward scientific achievement like putting men on Mars

that is because big businesses are owned by smart people who know better to throw away $18B a year to "get on mars some day" and why NASA gets their money from the government who takes it from the people at gunpoint instead of going into the market of ideas

>>35820045
Kek, I support Nasa funding but you won this discussion

>>35820041
>DUDE everyone needs to pay $5 a month to NASA so that.... uh we get to see cool pictures of asteroids I guess?

>>35820094
http://list25.com/25-coolest-nasa-discoveries-that-changed-your-life/

>What is google?

>>35819848
>>35819878

Not only that, it wasn't even a world power in the 19th century

>>35820094
It has been mentioned numerous times in this thread already that the economic activity associated with products of NASA research pays back the American people threefold. If you're not interested in reading then go suck a fat dick.

>>35820222
NASA's work is so important and profitable yet they have to force people at gunpoint to get funds for their programs?

Sounds totally reasonable.

>>35820222
The numbers are tenfold, actually.

>>35820079
You are the prototypical retarded anarcho capitalist Ayn Rand fan. You are a pseudo-intellectual.

NASA's research does create surplus value, it is just unclear how much and at what time. Rich entrepreneurs prefer safe, proven business models over uncertain ones. Warren Buffet made his fortune by investing in safe companies.

>>35820287
NASA is such a great investment yet no one wants to fund NASA voluntarily so they have to resort to taxes

>>35820276
Wow you are actually stupid.

NASA members don't go to peoples' houses and "force people at gunpoint" (libertarian buzz-phrase) to collect taxes. The government does that. The government then happens to pay NASA. NASA is not involved in any of the extortion, as you would call it. The entities are totally separate.

I'm unsure what you are even trying to say because it's not a coherent point.

>>35820276
>force people at gunpoint
This isn't the case.

Trump just signed legislation without any guns involved and so has every president before that.

Again, evidence has been given to support the opposite of what you suggest. You have given no evidence on your side.

>>35820288
so why doesn't it go into the stock market?

>>35820309
>they have to resort to taxes
No proof of this assertion exists.

>>35820318
The mafia sends his own men to collect protection money from stores. With your logic the Mafia is innocent and not involved in the extortion.

>>35820321
They are forced at gunpoint because if they don't pay the taxes they can go to jail.

>>35820345
the space program is a huge waste of money and the brains of everyone involved could be put to better use in literally anything else

>>35820309
.. that's because NASA isn't a public entity you fucking monkey. If it was made a public entity tomorrow it would have numerous investors.

Surprise surprise, the government wants to keep NASA a government entity so that it can claim all of NASA's accomplishments as its own. It's no wonder the government won't let NASA out of its grip.

You honestly just seem like a straight up fucking retarded ignoramus. Like, you don't even know basic facts. You just have this edgy libertarian free market ideology and you don't even fact check before you post.

>>35820380
That's not evidence. Do you have any evidence? Any empirical data whatsoever?

>>35820332
Because the government won't allow it to you fucking retard. That's like asking why the State of Pennsylvania doesn't go into the stock market. God fucking damn you are stupid.

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>>35819285
>>I don't have my Physics degree yet
>Big surprise.
Still better than your facebook level understanding of physics.

>You pulled this straight out of your ass.

Why don't you go do some research about general relativity before you enter a physics discussion. It's kinda a big deal.

>We don't need this to get around the solar system. Even with our current rockets we can still get to Mars within a couple months, which is a lot quicker than what traveling across oceans used to be
No it takes about 9 months to reach mars minimum. That's not a couple. You literally could have googled this to check your retarded assumption.You shouldn't be scoffing at others education when you so willfully ignorant.

>Illogical as fuck

by Far the most retarded thing i've read in this thread.. Not only do you not understand physics but you don't understand the fundamentals of how the scientific theory works. I'm only arguing the theory of General Relativity. You're literally saying the theory of General relativity is illogical. I almost considered not bothering going full autist on you.But instead i'm going to do just that.

1/?

>>35820426
because it needs to welfare its black people

>>35820393
The government wants to keep NASA because they can get more tax money with the excuse of space research.

>>35820437
Do you know what a scientific theory is? Scientists use theories to explain natural phenomena in a consistent manner. They test this theory through various means such as experiments and seeing how other theories relate to it and whether they fit together. But do you know what theories really are in layman's terms? They're assumptions. it relies on the assumption that the evidence provided in experimentation will be consistent with how nature acts outside of the experiment. They assume that if you drop an apple 100 times and it falls to the ground it will also do so the 101st time. And if it doesn't they come up with a new theory to explain why the fuck it didn't. The scientific method assumes the universe works in a consistent manner. It assumes the Universe is mechanical and has a specific set of rules that must all be followed.
General Relativity is the fundamental theory of modern physics. Every single other evidence supported theory and discovery fits into general relativity. Physics IS general relativity at this moment in time. The theory has been right about every single fucking circumstance it has described that we have been able to observe fully. Are there alternative theories? sure. Do they have a comparable amount of supporting evidence if any at all? nope.

2/3

>>35820471
we don't know how gravity works in the areas of the universe we haven't been able to get to

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>>35820380
>huge waste of money
>less than half of 1 percent of the budget

wow it's fucking nothing.

meanwhile it brings 7 to 14 times the investment back to the USA. Where the fuck do you think the $14 billion goes? Do you think NASA goes to a deep lava cave and chants "Research & development" ominously while standing in the middle of a pentagram drawn with virgin blood and then all the $14 billion just disappears into the pits of hell? No, idiot, that money is all spent here, in the USA, with contractors and american companies. Jesus fuckin christ. It's a straight up investment BACK into american businesses that ALSO creates potentially 1,400% R.O.I. every year. It's a no-brainer to fund NASA, only idiots like you oppose it.

>>35816980
Tbh I just wanna find my own planet to go shitpost there alone

>>35820471
Ayo hol up.

General relativity does not cover everything.

Quantum physics, string theory, and brane theory are completely beyond the realm of GR

>>35820555
Also, the satellites they launch mean I can shitpost from my phone and see what the weather is going to be tomorrow.

>>35820437
>>35820471
No. I finished my BS in Physics.

>No it takes about 9 months to reach mars minimum. That's not a couple. You literally could have googled this to check your retarded assumption.You shouldn't be scoffing at others education when you so willfully ignorant.

SpaceX has put out evidence of different numbers using their improved rocket designs.

>General Relativity is the fundamental theory of modern physics. Every single other evidence supported theory and discovery fits into general relativity. Physics IS general relativity at this moment in time. The theory has been right about every single fucking circumstance it has described that we have been able to observe fully. Are there alternative theories? sure. Do they have a comparable amount of supporting evidence if any at all? nope.

This is all completely wrong.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_Model

>It does not incorporate the full theory of gravitation[3] as described by general relativity, or account for the accelerating expansion of the Universe (as possibly described by dark energy).

Go figure. An undergraduate who hasn't even finished his first quantum course doesn't understand that it is all independent of general relativity.

>>35820457
The government doesn't NEED an excuse to take your money. They are going to do it anyway.

Also that's a pretty shitty fucking "excuse" to take money because $20 billion is like you dropping a penny while walking home from lunch. It's nothing.

So you think a bunch of corrupt politicans with an inability to agree with each other about anything all got together in a room on a random tuesday and said "let's all magically agree instantly that we're all going to be complicit in an ongoing conspiracy to take money from the American people! Muahahahaha! And the dollar amount we will steal from them? It will be less than half of 1 percent of our total revenue!! hahahahahah!!! that extra half of one percent of our budget will make such a difference!! And where will we put all this EEeeeevil money that we have collected through conspiracy? Not into our own pockets, but rather into legitimate research and development that advances science!!! MAUUAAUHAHAHAHAHA IT'S THE PERFECT CONSPIRACY"

yeah mate, you're retarded. I bet you're an anti-vaccer too.

>>35820471
>Every single other evidence supported theory and discovery fits into general relativity.
I'm not even going to comment on this because it's just so appallingly ignorant.

You should never comment on science or physics again until you have retaken high school freshman science class.

>>35820753
>I'm not even going to comment on this
>does it anyway

>>35820471
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_relativity

>However, unanswered questions remain, the most fundamental being how general relativity can be reconciled with the laws of quantum physics to produce a complete and self-consistent theory of quantum gravity.

>>35820803
read nigga
>>35820576

>>35819848
>1800's US
>Biggest world power
>even a world power at all
Dumb lolbertarian poster

>>35820913
19th century is the 1900s you dumb retard

who won both world wars?

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>>35820953
Put a bullet in your head you worthless faggot

>>35820975
that is technically wrong.
also the USA were a strong world power in the late 1800s

>>35820953
>19th century is the 1900s
...........................................................................................................................................................................................................
lmfao, this entire thread is satire i'm convinced of it

Asking someone whether they think NASA is worthwhile is one of the easiest ways to check if they are a reasonable person or a dumbfuck. Guess which category OP belongs in

>>35821065
When people say "xth century" they begin that count at 1 AD. I don't know if you're referring to an non-Gregorian calendar or some other form of date keeping, but there's no calendar in which in the 19th century is 1901-2000.

>>35817027
Even with practical technology to do so, how many people would actually want to live on Titan. Titan is cold...stupid fucking cold. Colder than Mars.

>>35817046
I'm all for exploration and setting out new frontiers that humankind has never before set foot on, but let's be honest here: Mars is by no means a paradise, it's a cold unforgiving barren iron-dust wasteland with barely any protections from cosmic radiation.

Survival on the red planet is going to be a difficult chore to say the least.

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>>35818016
This made my night
Pat on the back anon for being so clever

>>35820953
No Anon, the 1900's was the 20th century. We are currently in the 21st. The 1st century was year 1-99, 2nd century being 100-199, 3rd being 200-299, 10th being 900-999, 11th being 1000-1099, and so on ad nauseam....

>>35816980
this is bait, right? NASA's scientific research benefits the entire human race.

>>35816980
Because it's more important than you, the welfare of tyrone, and the potholes in your roads.

>>35822199
Oh yeah, the great accomplishments of NASA.

Such as... going on the moon... and naming asteroids?

>>35823121

>hurr durr
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NASA_spinoff_technologies

>>35818967
DREAM ON, MARS MAN

>>35820953
this had better be bait you faggot

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>>35820354
>his argument point is equating NASA to the mafia