You have ten seconds to justify eating meat that came from literally

>>35478432
>rape
>not okay

Because I don't care about the animals.

Moralizing animals as if they where humans. Lul

eating animals is yummy

>>35478432
Because that's what nature decided for us.

>>35478454
This, fuck them.

>>35478471
Never said that, but they're still living beings. Unless you're captain edgelord, there's no way to justify slaughtering them to death after they live terrible lives tethered to one confined space for months or years.

Because we are the apex predators

>>35478432
Protein. Also cheaper and easier to go for a meat-based diet

>>35478511
Because food and sustenance.
Also, animals are lesser beings.

>>35478432
Genesis says something to the effect of our installation as stewards over the animal kingdom.

Not every animal slaughtered for food is tortured to death.
Here's an interesting fact. Fish can't be domesticated. They don't have a complex enough nervous system. They're quite similar to insects in that regard. Would you think twice about smashing a fly?

>>35478471
What makes it immoral to kill humans?

How would this be any less applicable to killing animals?

Most of the animals we eat would be extinct if humans didn't raise them specifically so we could eat them. You think a chicken could survive a week in the wild? They're slow, defenseless and they can barely even fly. The only thing they are good at is being delicious.

>>35478432
Animal flesh and animal byproducts in general are excellent sources of protein and fat. The simplest way to get big and strong is eating meat. If we ever live in a world where being big and strong doesn't matter then I will gladly give up eating meat, but good luck convincing women to be attracted to scrawny little twinks and good luck convincing the men of the world to never fight each other.

>>35478557
>Because food and sustenance.
You can live perfectly healthy on a vegetarian or even vegan diet.

>>35478557
A lot of animals are smarter than most humans

>>35478432
From an evolutionary point of view, rape is ok. Same goes for eating animals.

>>35478587
Show me an animal cell phone.

>>35478511
>living beings
plants are living beings too you know
unless you sutain yourself using photosynthesis this argument is moot

>>35478432
If animals tasted terrible I would still eat them to trigger you. Fucking faggot.

>>35478432

>not eating your free range chickens on your land that cost barely anything to grow and maintain

Stay pleb.

>>35478432

hey fellow veganon

Eating animals is yummy because we're biologically programmed to think so.

Plus we have teeth optimized for chewing meat.

>>35478584
>good luck convincing women to be attracted to scrawny little twinks
Many vegetarian and vegan guys have wives/gfs.

>good luck convincing the men of the world to never fight each other
Rarely are wars ever fought up close anymore. And if you're referring to things like bar fights, some of us don't want to act like niggers...might want to try actually acting like a human bean.

I enjoy the thought of eating the flesh of tortured animals, and there is nothing you can do to change that.

Because I want to, they're not humans, and you can't stop me.

>>35478511
>Slaughtering to death.
So how about a compromise, we slaughter them until they're unconscious.

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>>35478585
I've lived a perfectly healthy on a omnivorous diet, what's your point.
>>35478587
If their so fucking smart, then why is it so easy to kill them?

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>>35478432
There's no reason for me not to.

If I don't "rape" these animals somebody else will and I won't be an meat virgin just out of some sort of autistic feeling of justice or whatever.

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Carnicucks are so fucking pathetic.

I quite frankly LMAO at them when I see them, I'm 6'6" and they're all 6'2" manlets (I am quite drunk)

>>35478622
Yes, they are living beings as well, but they don't feel as much pain as animals who get killed in the slaughterhouses.

>>35478432
>Implying I don't support rape

>>35478671
>I've lived a perfectly healthy on a omnivorous diet, what's your point.
Yes, but you aren't living morally healthy.

mfw i realize rape is justified. thank you for this.

>>35478684

We don't even have evidence that the plants we eat feel pain to begin with. They don't have a nervous system or brain.

the same reason every other carnivore/omnivore does, it nourishes me.

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Vitamin B12 can only be acquired in reasonable levels from animals. Some vegetables have it, but they do not have enough to realistically cover a person's required intake of the vitamin.

Fun fact: when vegans are forced to take B12 supplements due to their diet, the pills are often actually derived from animal supplements.

Humans have been eating meat for millions of years, and it has gotten to the point that we actually need the vitamins in it to live. You wouldn't make a cat go vegan, would you?

>>35478732
https://www.pri.org/stories/2014-01-09/new-research-plant-intelligence-may-forever-change-how-you-think-about-plants

eating humans is also probably "yummy", but we dont eat them, in the same way we (for the most part) dont rape them, because they are humans

>>35478732
nah bro a plant once twitched a poly graph or sommink, INDISPUTABLE PROOF!

They're not sentient. We don't eat simians and shouldn't eat dolphin

Are there laws that forbid me to have my own pigs, chickens, cows, etc?
No?
Then it is non of your fucking business what I do with my property, doesn't matter is it wrong or right.

Are there laws that forbid private business to own chickens, cows, pigs, etc? No? Are there laws that forbid them to sell it to the general population? No?

Then you have no right to fuck with it and you have no right to tell me what to do or buy with my money. Be it morally wrong or right.

>>35478646
The fact that some scrawny little betas can luck their way into an unattractive partner doesn't change the fact that the archetypal attractive man is large and strong. If women IN GENERAL ever start to prefer twinky vegan pussies then by all means you'll start to see men stop eating meat, but as long as size and strength are still appreciated in our society I'm not going to stop eating the easiest source of size and strength on the planet.

As for your pathetic limpwristed stance on wars and physical confrontation....well all I'll say is that if you ever manage to convince a society of men that they should never have to fight all that's going to happen is another society of men that ARE forced to fight is going to come in, slaughter them, and rape their women. You complain about niggers but that's exactly who will take over your ideal little vegan society where every man is a weak ineffectual bitch.

>>35478646
>Many vegetarian and vegan guys have wives/gfs.
Many ugly dudes do too, doesn't mean I'm going to uglify myself.

>>35478786

So by that logic if the law says I can keep you as a slave, it's wrong for other people to try to free you.

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>>35478795
see
>>35478683

Lol I've been in 2 fights in my life and both times carnicucks were fucking pathetic.

First one he couldn't reach my face so I pinned him against a wall with left hand and kept hitting him in the face with my right, second time I hit one in the nose and he fell over, then I started kicking him in the ribs.

>>35478432
>vegans saying sensory pleasure is an insufficient reason to justify behaviours
>are usually some of the most hedonistic people around
>are really into that yolo, hipster, do whatever feels good culture

Fuck them

>>35478752
each can of monster energy contains 500% of your daily requirement for vitamin B12, this applies for guaranteed vegan cans such as ultra as well. I'm no vegi boy or anything i just thought this was a poor argument.

>>35478432
Why don't you justify why rape supposedly isn't ok?

life is torture.

>>35478715

>vegetarian lifestyle is more morally correct
>still requires multiple industries to provide a vegitarian food
>trucking, farming, retail, processing, regulatory bodies, pesticides, etc
>all of these industries use animal by products or at the very least cause enormous strain on indigenous environments
>all of these jobs allow for more people to be employed which, even if every single person abstained from meat, would further increase the workload of these industries and further make the actual moral choice, local self sustaining farming more impractical

lolk

>>35478432
High energy foods like meat are the only reason we achieved consciousness and civilization

t. History of human biology

>>35478715
I've twisted the necks of my chickens, that's the way I've killed them.
It seemed very cruel, but that's the way my father taught me.
I've killed goats, heard them scream as they bled out.
The pigs I've slaughtered, their shrieks were deafening.
But through out all these instances of death, I've bonded with those I've committed the act with, my uncles, father, brother, cousins, grandparents, they understood the role I played in providing food for them and the rest of my family.
I am a normal person, with good morals, not because of what I eat, but because of how I've interacted with my family.

>>35478732
>>35478684
pain is subjective tho and what if plants can feel pain but we just cant measure it
i mean all we can measure in animals are electro-chemical reactions and we assume that those have to feel like pain

Women deserve rape, it should be a social norm desu.
And if we only ate veggies and no animal products we would be weak and malnourished, underfed, ill, obese, acne-ridden, infertile, full of degenerative diseases etc.

>>35478842
I think it would only be reasonable that if their was such a law that allowed owning slaves, that a complimentary law would forbid releasing them if you were not the owner

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>>35478608
umm, try again sweety

>>35478432
If animals had the capacity to do so they would do the same thing to humans. It's just how nature works.

>>35478757

The fact that the plant processes information doesn't mean it is capable of suffering.

My NES processes information but that doesn't mean it suffers when Link gets hit by a moblin.

>>35478869
Hmm, I guess you're right. No reason you shouldn't be pounded in the ass by Jamal and Bubba in prison, against your consent of course!

>>35478842
Until either:
a) The majority of the population or the people who were elected by the majority of the population to lead them have not decided otherwise.
b) Another nation or the general population itself has taken over control and changed the laws/system.

Welcome to real world.

I love the taste of dead, murdered, mutilated, mangled, raped animal flesh in my mouth.

I fap every time I eat it. Getting hard just thinking about it.

I'll eat an extra burger just for you OP.

>>35478906

So-called civilization started during the agricultural revolution when people started farming grasses for their seeds, to make beer and bread.

>>35479039
>tfw my vegan sister is going to pick me up to get a burger later
Feels good, my family is so understanding.

>>35478511
>there's no way to justify slaughtering them to death after they live terrible lives tethered to one confined space for months or years.

This is riddled with subjectiveness. These animals are raised in many different ways and you have near to no idea how to tell whether an animal experiences their particular life as terrible, the slaughterhouse standard way of putting out an animal is a death quicker and more merciful than most humans get to die. Nor are they aware of what's going on or for what purpose they have been brought to life in the first place.

>>35478859
monster energy is great for you, isn't it?

>>35479039
>I love the taste of dead, murdered, mutilated, mangled, raped animal flesh in my mouth.
Signs of a psychopath: the post.

>>35478432
As far as I'm concerned it depends on how they're treated.

The US specifically has a huge problem with animal cruelty in the industry but that's not the case in many other countries.

If the animals are treated right, and then killed for meat after they lived their lives, I don't see the problem.

In exchange for food and complete absence of predators they get to live a couple years, but they don't have to live in fear or get any kind of stress, and then they die instantly instead of literally being eaten alive by predators.

If your argument is "muh animal cruelty" then what you're really arguing against is animal cruelty in the industry, and not eating meat.

>You have ten seconds to justify eating meat that came from literally tortured-to-death animals.
Because I can.

>>35478432
Meat tastes good. That's all the argument I need.

Your comparison of that to rape is invalid because they're animals, not people.

Because the only thing I care about is my own enjoyment and entertainment

>>35479100
>If your argument is "muh animal cruelty" then what you're really arguing against is animal cruelty in the industry, and not eating meat.
Well both. In the short term, this industry isn't going away, so at least the conditions of the animals needs to be drastically improved.

Ideally, long term, no one would feel the need to kill animals for food products. It's been proven that we (humans) are able to live healthy, happy lives without the need of senseless murder.

>>35478859
>monster energy
> a poor argument

>>35479085
of course not but it has a shitload of vitamin B12

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>>35478432
>justify
>implying there is any action that is inherently wrong or unjust
>implying morals exist
Your kind are cute.

Believe it or not, some of robots really are vegetarians. I agree with the sentiment of OP's pic, but at the same time, I think this is a conclusion that people need to come to on their own terms. Trying to force any kind of belief or lifestyle on another person usually just backfires and causes that person to distance themselves even further from your lifestyle.

Also, old habits die hard. If your family raised you to eat meat, a sudden change in dietary lifestyle is going to involve going against habits you've relied on all your life. It wasn't all that easy for me. I had to learn a great deal more about balancing my nutrition, and what seemingly innocuous food ingredients I had to start avoiding.

>>35479184
the argument was that there is no vegan way to attain high amounts of vitamin B12, i present a vegan way of attaining high amounts of vitamin B12. Whats the problem?

>>35479165
It's not senseless murder, they'd die anyway eaten by predators, and they'd suffer a lot more. If we were to stop eating meat, the cattle we eat would go mostly extinct since they have no place in any environment anymore.

Nature works like that, they'll die, they'll get eaten, they're prey, that is unavoidable. At least in a proper farm they'll live comfy lives and die quickly.

>>35478432
Rape victims are part of the social contract and it is in society's collective interest to ensure they are protected. Animals are not part of the social contract.

>>35479197
Don't worry, bud. Spring break is only one week long. You'll be back in your freshman "intro to philosophy" community college class in no time.

>>35478489
>nature decided animals need to be tortured in factories

>>35478511
>no way to justify slaughtering them to death after they live terrible lives tethered to one confined space for months or years.

It's called mercy killing, or "putting them out of their misery."

>>35479241
>implying all these vegan moralfags aren't philosophy and ethnic studies majors on break

>>35479255
nature dictates our desires, we are just really really good at attaining our desires as a species.

>>35479224
>At least in a proper farm they'll live comfy lives
Maybe, but most are on factory farms.

>>35478906
>High energy foods like meat are the only reason we achieved consciousness and civilization

And what does that mean to civilization now? We've already evolved. It's not as if going vegetarian is going to result in the collapse of civilization, or some regressive "de-evolution" of humankind. Our oversized brains are perfectly capable of being sustained by plant-based protein sources. (and animal byproducts, if you're an ovo-lacto vegetarian instead of a vegan)

Pointing out that meat played a role in human evolution is not a valid argument against vegetarianism today.

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For every post in support of veganism and/or opposed to eating meat ITT, I will buy a burger tomorrow and throw in the dumpster.

meat eaters = nigger
you arent white if you do not recognize the immoralities of meat eating in a western country

>>35479273
That's only in the US senpai.

I don't care about my food's feelings

Animals are tools, subservient to Man.It's God's will

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>>35479241
>implying
prove right now that there is inherent good
go ahead, I'll wait

A vegan shitpost? Well this is a rare one

>>35479277
i support veganism

>>35479295
you aren't a good person if you think being white is all that matters, why even bother with depriving yourself of the joys of steak and burgers to just turn around and be a prick to your fellow man?

>>35478432
Eating animals is yummy. Raping people feels good. I don't need to justify anything to anyone. Subjecting yourself to arbitrary rules of "civilized people" sounds awfully spook-y there OP.

>>35479322
Good for you. You just killed another cow by declaring that.

Anyone else?

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>>35479277
This

Check and mate, vegan bitches

>>35478432
Killing animals is not the same as raping someone. A human can be worth something, but animals are worthless (unless we are talking about meat, fur...)

>>35478432
Proteins and amino acids.

Legumes and powders don't cut it.

>>35478432
fuck animals
if they were the more evolved being they'd be the ones milking us, bumfucking us and cutting us up
until they figure out how to do this, I'm going to enjoy them

>>35479356
i'd say cuteness and companionship has value too, but that value is not inherent and is assigned by each person.

being vegan is fucking dumb, the meat industry is going to be successful either way, the only person you make a difference to is yourself. kys

>>35479380
just so you know, a slug is as equally evolved as we are.

>>35479089
>he says on the board known best by normalfag media for mass shooters

>>35479336
1 cow = 1 burger
was eating a burger while i posted that btw, i just think you are a faggot. so have another post supporting veganism: i love veganism!

>>35478432
I want proof that animals aren't just some form of biological automata.

>>35479406
and yet it's not holding a gun to my head

>>35479414
well 1 cow = 4500 burgers but still

>>35479433
no shit, how evolved something is has no bearing on it's place on the food chain.

>>35479460
Isn't a burger comprised of many cows?

>>35479397
and to all the butthurt meattards struggling with cognitive dissonance

>>35478622
>plants are living beings too officer
>that's why it's ok for me to rape and kill this women

brilliant defense

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>>35479488
you are nitpicking on my words, even though you perfectly understood what I meant, only because you have no real argument
my recommendation : get bent

>>35478432
Eating animals are yummy
Plus they are why we have civilizations. We didn't grow larger brains and smaller mouths just by eating veggies ya know, not enough cals in leafs

Also something something lion king

>>35478853
What the fuck is that supposed to even mean? Do you think just because someone eats/doesn't eat meat they will become instantly super strong? Your body muscle depends mostly on how much you excercise you fuckin green retard

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>>35478432
Try this: I don't give a fuck about your moral posturing. I know it's wrong to eat animals and I don't give a single goddamn fuck. What are you going to do, call the police? Fuck you faggot ass normie.

>>35479496
normally but i'm talking in raw capacity, it you optimised one cow's worth of meat to soley make hamburgers

>>35479520
We were talking about killing animals you fucking retard.
Has that fucking tofu replaced your brain?

>>35479543
>doesnt give a fuck
>writes this post
???

>>35478511
>death
>bad
>not knowing that death is just a permanent dreamless sleep, no brain activity whatsoever
>browsing r9k
>posting on r9k

We're not demi-gods, we're animals part of nature too, and we happen to be omnivores.

Deal with the facts.

>>35479488
i'm not disagreeing with your position, i'm just letting you know you're using a term incorrectly, no reason to get so butt-hurt about it, just learn and move on.

>>35478547
Slavery is cheaper and easier than paying workers, does that make it okay?

>>35478432
I dont care about them as long as they taste so good.

It doesn't matter what moralizing argument you or i make. The meat industry makes way too much money to stop doing it.

>>35478432

Shouldn't you be the one who need to justify why this needs to stop?

After all, it's a custom which has been going on for longer than written history, which isn't the case for behaviors like rape (punished by the law in most era and countries).

Also, it had an incredible positive impact on humans since our ancestors began eating meat millions of year ago, outweighting by far the ethical problem of killing animals to save human lives.

So you would also have to prove that we can stop eating meat without impacting the general health, because killing animals is injustified only if the alternative isn't inferior to eating them.

Even then it would only be true for our rather advanced civilization: I would still give a free-pass to my ancestors, who would have died without meat.

>>35479565
Interesting kafkatrap you got there.

>>35479594
Humans have rights.

>>35479561
m8 he's arguing in favor of eating meat you fucktard.

>>35479409
>An edgy af Oregon community college student and a few others made the media
>This is a psychopath board XD XD

Yeah, no

>>35479594
no, i hold humans in a higher regard than animals as members of my species

>>35479625
Are you him?
Are you?
If not, then fuck off.

>>35479614
how? somebody saying fuck you faggot ass normie is clearly a sign of "caring" (emotional response) in my book. let me know if it isnt in yours

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>>35479540

Nah, I think it's hilarious when they say "hurr durr you're so weak" when they all look fucking hilarious. Lol, my mum is 6' and is bigger then the average carnicuck amele (I am drunk currently)

Sounds like you're spooked OP

>>35479659
no, i understand his argument, i'm guessing these:>>35479561
>>35479540
>>35479525
>>35479433
>>35479414
>>35479380
are all you, you seem to be on edge, quick to lash out if you think anyone is trying to undermine to, desperate to be on top at all times. are you okay anon?

>>35479397

>perfect solution fallacy

Why throw violent criminals in jail? Crime will still exist. lol

>>35479612
>So you would also have to prove that we can stop eating meat without impacting the general health

Here you go
http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/89/5/1627S.full

>>35479660
The fact that you believe someone is guilty of caring because they express that they don't just shows how completely and utterly vacuous you are.

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>>35479717
Wrong.
Jesus, how fucking stupid could one person be?

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>>35479721
that doesn't sound like a fallacy to me, can you explain how the logic of that argument is internally inconsistent? if not could you stop using words wrong?

Because a world where I can't eat chili is not a world I want to live in.

>>35478432
Because I understand that humanity simply isn't going to stop killing animals for food and that we might as well eat their bodies instead of simply letting them go to waste.

At least this way their deaths have meaning. Why are you forcing animals to suffer meaningless deaths by letting their bodies go to waste?

>>35479255

I'm against factory farming sure, but I'll never be against eating other living creatures, it's stupid.

Every living thing survives by consuming other living things, or their remains.

It is an inherent consequence to being a living creature

>>35479766
regardless my observations still stand, simply with a smaller sample set, i'm secure in my intelligence so your baseless insults do nothing for me, you however, seem deeply insecure. if you are not the anon i originally replied to, why did you reply to me?
>Are you him?
>Are you?
>If not, then fuck off.

>>35478966
Bananas are fruits not animals, dumbass

>>35479754
i dont think that he cares because he said he didnt, i think he cares because he clearly does, as exhibited by his aggression towards the subject

>>35479834
you just got memed m8, move on, there's no winning for you today.

>>35479824
im on board with that

>>35479837
>reading emotions from text online
You're even stupider than I thought.

>>35479824
Humans can easily survive without eating meat. Even if you can't see yourself giving up all animal by products, you can still go vegetarian. You don't have to financially support an immoral industry, which you are all but likely doing by buying meat.

*Assuming you're American

>>35479820
where do you think those animals come from? there would be no animal bodies to go to waste if the humans didnt breed them

>>35479315
Oh, would you look at that.
No reply; I win again.

Your fucking morals are spooks, just admit it and stop being roaches. Life becomes a lot more fun when you realize you can't fuck up.

Everyone who cares about animal """rights""" is just trying to virtue signal to other people, or to themselves.

>>35478432
These animals would never be alive in the first place if we didn't raise them to eat them. We did them a massive favor.

>>35479902
but we did and now they are here, so we must deal with that.

>>35479894
L M A O so i see you are just being silly

>>35479910
i don't care about animals as a class or anything, but i think anyone who abuses animals, like for sadistic pleasure or whatever is a reprehensible khunt who should be strung up by their own intestines.

>>35479924
>Being brought into this world to by fed chemically-induced meals, live in a dirty cage that's smaller than the average prison cell, and than face a very painful death
>Favor

>>35479898

There's nothing inherently immoral about killing other creatures for sustenance.

>>35479910
>muh virtue signalling
how to spot a retard 101

i will continue eating animals forever and nobody can stop me

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>>35479965
nice virtue signalling, friendo.

>>35479826
>you must be insecure
>I am smart
Wow, looks like I've been btfo by based anon.
Read me like a fucking book, I guess I have to leave this thread in shame.

>>35478570
The bible also tells us to kill gays. It's based on shitty medieval morality.

>>35478432
Because animals aren't people

>>35479991

Define "immoraI".

>>35479949
YOU FUCKING NORMIE FAGGOT STOP BULLYING ME REEEEE

What emotions do you believe I had when writing that?
Spoiler:This may shock you, but I had none.

>>35479995
>muh not an argument
how to spot someone raised by a single mom 101

>>35479991
It is when there's a perfectly fine alternative for sustenance.

Remember, you're an omnivore, not a carnivore.

Justifications and justice are spooks

>>35478786
Of course i have the right to tell you my fucking opinion. It's free speech cunt. You don't need to obey, but i can call you a sick cunt if you fuck goats and chickens.

>>35480006
you are just a pseudo-intellectual reductionist who uses buzzwords like virtue signalling and spooks.

we get it, if it feels good to you, then you are going to do it. that makes you so special, and not at all like 99% of people.

>>35479910
Oh, would you look at that. Somebody insulted me and then left the thread. I won this "argument" and was not just dismissed as your everyday internet idiot.

>>35479991

There is nothing logically incorrect/fallible, nor "wrong/evil", about slaying other life forms for sustenance.

>>35480006
that's not virtue signalling, i eat cows but i love dogs and cats more than i do humans, i acknowledge that my reasoning is flawed but i don't care.

>>35480041
not a argument kid
>how to spot a /pol/tard 101

>>35480074
>h-he is just a pseudo-intellectual...
>i-i got 'em, haha...

>>35479902
And what am I to do about it?

Sure, if the world got together and stopped eating meat, we wouldn't need to kill animald for food.
And then maybe we could switch 100% to renewable resources, stop global warming, put an end to wars, cure every disease, and every one on /r9k/ gets a free girlfriend.

Oh wait, we don't live in a perfect happy-go-luck world.
We live in a sad grey world where people will always be decided and individuals will never make a major difference.

The best we can do is to at least try to get meat that comes from relatively humane place and make sure nothing goes to waste.

>>35480096

What does "wrong/evil" mean?

>>35480107
You are a pseudo-intellectual. It isn't even an attack on your philosophy, just a statement on the fact that you apparently think it needs to be espouted by you.

>>35480032
Say it all you want, but you are clearly riled up

>>35480009
i never said i'm smart, i said i'm secure, but your constant aggressive behavior implies you have something to prove to yourself or others.

>>35479991
Eating animals because you like their taste even though you could easily avoid it is not sustenance.

>>35478432
Animals raised to be eaten have no rights to live in our society.

False equivalence

>>35480130

Let me google it for you since you're obviously an armchair-sophist that minces words to win arguments.

Evil:
profoundly immoral and malevolent

Wrong
unjust, dishonest, or immoral


There is nothing unjust, immoral, or malevolent about me killing a non-human life form to consume it for sustenance.

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>>35480028
no

>maybe this is why this board has a requirement for originality but fuck it

>>35480151
Yeah I really have something to prove.
On an anonymous site, where no one will ever remember my conversations or even know who I am.
Christ, you really are fucking stupid.

>>35480099
you have yet to produce a single argument

>>35480136
>i-it's not even your philosophy that's wrong
>y-you're just a pesudo-intellectual, a-alright? stop bullying me!!
Fill in the blank.
>not an ________

>>35480060
no it's not, remember you're an omnivore, not a herbivore.

>>35480167

>Let me google it for you since you're obviously an armchair-sophist that minces words to win arguments.

What you're doing there is not becoming of a philosopher.

When I ask you to define your terms, I am showing you respect by taking you seriously.

Clearly, that was a mistake on my part.

>>35480167
>There is nothing unjust, immoral, or malevolent about me killing a non-human life form to consume it for sustenance.
This would only have substance as an argument if there wasn't an alternative for survival.

But when there is, one which doesn't include senseless killings, your statement just doesn't hold any water.

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>>35480015
You're missing the forest for a tree.
>>35478570 didn't say the Bible was right about everything, just that an idea presented there is of value in this conversation

>>35480167
>>35480212

But, let us go on.

>There is nothing unjust, immoral, or malevolent about me killing a non-human life form to consume it for sustenance.

Prove it with a logical argument. Do you know what that is?

>>35480198
That's correct. So I have a choice of two options:

1. Eat plants and animals who face horrible lives and painful deaths
2. Eat plants

>>35480187
PAUSE!
without reading previous comments can you remember what this argument is about? if not then you are wasting your energy and should quit

>>35480187
>muh arguments
why would i want to argue with you and when did i imply that? im just posting to make fun of you

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>>35478715
>Implying I give a shit about your perceived morals
psssh... nothin personnel

>>35480258

Is it because you don't like to argue?

>>35480248
exactly you have a choice, everyone has that choice and everyone should make it as they see fit.

>>35478432
Does this mean vegans are anti LGBTQWERTYUIOP

>>35480251
I said there is no inherent good.
Someone replied with a condescending non argument.
So I told them to prove there was inherent good.
People then continued condescendingly putting non-arguments.

(still not an argument, btw)

>stealing animals food is okay
wow kind of dicks aren't you vegans?
also those animals that are poorly treated probably want to die so im just doing them a favor

>>35480301

>I said there is no inherent good.

What is "inherent good", as opposed to "non-inherent good"?

As I explained to someone else, by asking you to define your terms, I am showing you respect. If you're intelligent enough to realize this, great. If not, I'm sorry.

>>35480240

Burden of proof falls on the accuser sonny

So let's say a horse eats a chick on the farm.

The horse has plenty of other options for food, but it eats and kills another living creature, because it is hungry.

And horses are intelligent, it knows it is causing pain to another creature.

At what part is this immoral/wrong?


Same thing applies to man, because man is an animal.
I think your mistake is taking the perspective that man is anything more than an animal.

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>>35480187
You apparently think you are bullying me, which is ironic, since in the paragraph just above that you complain about a lack of arguments being presented.

>>35480301
>>35480328
it sounds like neither of you believe in an inherent good, why are you arguing?

>>35480258
>i was only pretending to be a retarded! TROLLED! Xddd

>>35478432
The weak should fear the strong.
originali

>>35480279
not

>>35480362
an argument

cya kids

>>35480341

>Burden of proof falls on the accuser sonny

The burden of proof falls on the person making a claim, period. The whole "you can't prove a negative" thing is bullshit from pseudoskeptic cod philosophers like James Randi.

>So let's say a horse eats a chick on the farm.

Incredibly unlikely, but okay.

>The horse has plenty of other options for food, but it eats and kills another living creature, because it is hungry.

This is not a typical horse. Horses are by and large herbivores, but I will accept the plausibility of your hypothetical scenario.

>And horses are intelligent, it knows it is causing pain to another creature.

We don't know that the horse knows it is causing pain to another creature, actually. Perhaps the horse doesn't know that.

>At what part is this immoral/wrong?

That depends on what you're talking about when you say "immoral/wrong". Defining it with a simple synonym like "evil" or "wicked" or "shitty" isn't enough.

>>35480371
Retard who only reacts to sensory pleasures detected.

>>35478432
Because it taste good, I don't care at all about anything other than myself. Let alone a fucking cow or chicken, are you retarded?

>also it's a obvious bait thread but I'll bite

why i should let the farm animals live? for what purpose? they are so cute? no they are big and stinky and useless, until you kill and fry them. now i love them.

>>35480411

Oh damn sonny, you either ousted yourself as a shitty troll or just a dumb person. You're 100% wrong on every single one of your stupid doubts.

You're not ready to grapple with words yet, so, I'm not going to waste my time.

I will however, be cooking up some delicious meat. :)

>>35480411
I am not the anon you are arguing against, but there is a video of a horse eating a chick.
In fact, this is very common for those of us who actually raise livestock, pigs are also known to eat baby chicks.

>>35480328
An inherent good/moral means a good/moral that exists outside of human minds. (In other words, the universe is organized in such a way that there exists a 'proper' way of acting).

>>35480465
Under what authority are you given to determine whether something else gets to live or die?

>>35480475

>I am not the anon you are arguing against, but there is a video of a horse eating a chick.

I'm sure there is, but I don't believe it's a common thing that happens or that horses typically eat chicks.

Pigs are a predatory animal and I certainly wouldn't put it past them to eat live creatures. Horses...I don't doubt it could happen but I don't think it's "very common".

Maybe I'm mistaken on that point. Maybe horses do often eat baby chicks if given the chance. The matter of how common it is for horses to eat chicks isn't really all that relevant.

>>35480507
under the authority of the British government, their monopoly on power within my nation protects my right to do so.

>>35480507
why a lion gets to decide if a deer lives or dies? why isnt he put in court for his moral crime? i dont need authority from nobody.

>>35478432
well you see anon, a lion doesn't care about the well being of the gazelle whose throat it just tore out while it was still alive.

instead of being gay and unhappy, you could be straight, happy, and eating steak every weekend!

>>35480484

Why would you exclude human minds from the rest of the universe as being "inherent"?

We're just as much part of the universe as anything else.

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I don't just eat meat, I hunt it too.

>>35480542
1. A lion is a carnivore, needs to eat meat to survive.
2. A lion doesn't posses the ability to make decisions based on more than reasons of instant gratification. We, humans, do have that ability.

>>35480604
>make decisions based on more than reasons of instant gratification. We, humans, do have that ability.
Which is why we store our meet in a fridge. So we can gratify our needs later

>>35480604
>we have the ability to make decisions other than in the persuite of instant gratification

as a complete fucking failure i can attest i do NOT have that ability

>>35480604
ok whats the negative consequence of me eating meat for dinner tonight that should maje me not want to take that decision. keep in mind, i purchase ecological food.

>>35480567
For the purpose of the definition.

Morality is there because humanity is there.

There wasn't a moral universe, and then humans appeared.

If you removed every human from existence, you wouldn't find any morality (not withstanding any other existing intelligence of the universe that might have evolved similarly to humans, if you want to be pedantic)

>>35480604
>A lion doesn't posses the ability to make decisions based on more than reasons of instant gratification

Animals in general do not. Which means they are objectively inferior and OK to kill and eat. They are not subject to the same rights a human does and your argument justifies it.

So, what's wrong with eating animals, again?

>>35480674

What are you talking about when you say "morality"?

I don't think you've ever really studied philosophy, so my asking you to clarify your terms might seem pedantic to you. Trust me, it's not. You think what you're saying makes sense to everyone but when you actually get into this stuff, the way you thought before goes away and you think in a different way.

>>35478432
Salt water mussels (but not other bivalves) are animals that show no more complex behavior than plants. If I refused to eat them on moral grounds then I would also have to refuse to eat plants, which means I would starve to death, and I do not want to do that.

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>>35480780
>not eating sand to gain moral high ground over literally everyone

>>35480718
I did not say your requests for clarifications are pedantic, obviously it's important to figure out what is meant, otherwise you argue over definitions rather than ideas.

Moral here is defined as something that is proper.

>>35478432
Rape is perfectly OK as long as you are raping an animal and not a woman or man or child

>>35478777
They are sentient

Cows and chickens are more intelligent than dogs and cats

>>35478511
Plants are also living beings and you eat them all the time
>Bu-but plants don't feel pain
Animals get stunned before getting killed so they don't feel it
>But muh cruelty
Wich is always conviniently recorded in third world countries
Or peta pays them to record them torturing animals like with fur

>>35480931

>Or peta pays them to record them torturing animals like with fur

What do you mean by this?

>>35480848

How can you determine whether something is "proper" or not?

>>35480992
you cant, and so any moral code that isnt pragmatic is garbage

>>35478432
The benefits of wool/leather/pigskin among other various animal products is too valuable and useful in our everyday life and to just waste the meat that is perfectly digestible and would be an even bigger economic loss than if we would have thrown it away since it has a high commercial value. Among dealing with the leftover meat as waste should we decide it's not worth it, it's just better for our health and waste management systems if we eat it before it goes bad.

>>35478432

I really couldn't care how it was killed. I like meat. I think if I was offered the cooked flesh of a person; I would probably try it just to see if I liked it.

Literally who gives a flying fuck about eating animals farmed for human sustenance?

>>35481188
You still haven't defined moral code. What you did was provide a synnonym. This is known as a circular definition.

Animals are not humans.

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>>35478432
fuck leaf eaters

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>>35480805
>eating sand and killing a myriad of bacteria in the process like a caveman

pic very fucking related related.

There is not even an evolutionary reason 4 humans to feel empathy 4 animals, it could even be considered an evolutionary imperfection.

Humans feel empathy for animals because it is "morally ok".

Remember:

Humans define morals. You're best with the morals you have, but you can change them if it benefits you and others: Morals exist to help humans.

>"Wait, wait! There is no evolution and morals are defined by God!"

|Even if you believe this, it says in the Bible that humans should rule over animals and eat them.

Normal non-vegan empathy* for animals is okay. It won't hurt you or others.

|*Loving animals, anti animal cruelty, eats meat. (Usually not contradictory, but that wouldn't really matter anyways.)

Vegan-style "empathy" ** for animals can too far.

|**Has empathy for animals 100% as if they were humans

The imaginary problem of a cow being killed hurts a vegan. Instead of trying to stop it, they should realize the root problem.
>You're best with the morals you have, but you can change them if it benefits you and others. After all, morals exist to help humans.
In this case, Their empathy for the animal is misdirected and should be directed at a human. Because the empathy for the animal is harmful to the human.***
They should feel good for humans eating meat instead of feeling bad for the cow's death.

***Not just 'hurting the human's feelings', but also depriving him of the nutrition of meat and making him go out of his way to be vegan

>The pains of veganism are not significantly bad enough to warrant killing animals
Killing animals can't be "worse" than veganism - because killing an animal is only as bad as the human feels about it.

Vegans should realize that human empathy should only be directed towards animals if it does not hurt the human. Empathy exists to preserve humans, not to wipe them out.

If you can survive without eating meat, and you're sure it won't significantly harm you, then do it. But make sure it doesn't hurt anyone else (a human).

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>>35481596
>taking up space and containing molecules that could be used by other creatures

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>>35481596
>siphoning energy from the sun
>not killing yourself in a field to give nutrients to the earth

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>>35478432

I make a living fixing planes that kill people.

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>>35478432
provides more calories in less space making it a better ration for soldiers

>>35478432
I'm not killing them, they were going to die anyway so me not eating them wouldn't make a difference to whether they live or die.

>>35479594
It's not though. The most successful nations are the ones that afford their slaves the most freedom.

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>>35478432
Who said rape was wrong?

>>35478432
If animals aren't meant to be eaten, why are they made out of food?

Because God put the animals on this planet for me to eat them.

>>35478432
because meat is needed in the human diet

I care about people that are raped. I don't care about animals to the same extent. My empathy for them ends where my convenience ends. I will gladly choke a kitten for a Kit-Kat if hungry, and that's my least favorite chocolate bar.

>>35478432
There's no legitimate justification for eating meat that isn't
>appeal to nature
>baseless and logically inconsistent speciesism
>pathetic invocation of moral relativism/nihilism (usually a last-ditch attempt when all other arguments have failed)
Vegetarianism/veganism is one of the hardest pills to swallow. It took me a long while before I managed to admit eating meat is morally wrong and finally alleviate my cognitive dissonance.

>>35478432
>he equates female "suffering" to the murder of innocent animals

The difference is that women deserve to be raped in most cases. The cow or whatever rarely did anything wrong. To suggest that rape is even nearly as bad as murder isn't going to win you my support.

I started dating a vegan. Finding places to eat is so fucking hard.

Animals are not conscious, what appears to be consciousness is just biological reactions and instinct. Human consciousness is also an illusion, however since we "experience" it ourselves we take it in good faith that other humans have the same experience and are sympathetic. Preservation of our own species is just another type of biological instinct.
If you believe that animals have rights then you're probably the same kind of retard who believes that souls exist or that morality is objective (or that it exists at all). When you grow up and realize that the universe is deterministic and our consciousness is simply a unecessary illusion brought about by chemical reactions and there is no such thing as free will or even thoughts, then you will leave behind stupid concepts like vegetarianism.

>>35480015
So the bible is double right?

>>35478432

Civilized people would die without that evil farming industry.

Animal farming and agriculture are the foundations of civilization.

>>35478432
A: Yes it does.
B: The only humane solution would be to kill all the cows at once, who would then go to waste. Or let them roam free where they would destroy the ecology around them.
C: Fuck you.

>>35485289

>setup bird feeder
>squirrel comes up shoot it
>it drops right in front of the feeder covered in blood
>Another squirrel comes up looks at the blood on the feeder
>starts eating from feeder
>shoot it and it drops next to the previous squirrel
>15 mins later and another squirrel comes up looks at dead ones and then starts eating
>this went on for 10 squirrels

Animals are not conscious and most of them are stupid as fuck and deserve to die.

>>35478471
Humans are animals dipshit..

>>35478432
Animals aren't people so animals taste good is perfectly valid.

>>35485301
Of course its right

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQ5cpD8UKvs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lOcDndO7m4Q

>>35478432
My one regret is that i'm not the one personally doing the killing. Maybe i should start hunting, better than hitting deer with my car

Don't treat the dogs like people. Treat the dogs like dogs, they are better than people.

>>35485436

go for it anon. I love moose, bear and deer hunting for food.

Have a few deep freezers full of tasty animals to eat.

Have you niggas never had psilocybin?

>>35485380
Humans are also not conscious, we are all what is referred to as "P-Zombies". We tend not to kill and rape each other because we know that cooperation with other humans is beneficial to the individual. It's all just biological instinct, don't make the mistake of thinking we are any better than the retarded squirrels. We possess better reasoning power but there is no conscious thought or free will in place, we're driven by determinism just as much as any other species in the universe is.

>>35478432
How about because I need it to live a healthy life and there is literally no reason why I should feel bad about eating animals. Animals eat animals all the time. We're animals.
Unless you think we shouldn't eat animals for a religious reason your points are invalid.

>>35485477

Yes and I still hunt and skin animals for fun and food.

Death is just a natural part of life, if I didn't kill them something else would.

>>35485516
kek how would having a religious reason be valid for anything?

>>35485399
Yes, and some animals eat their own young especially when they're starving.

>>35485563

Hamsters do it for the lolz

Eating animals is yummy, dumbass.

>>35485557
I'm under the assumption that the premise is true. I don't have to poke a hole is an argument that hasn't been made yet.

>>35485583
>do it for the lolz
>2017
back to ledddit

>>35485604

>year of the trump

Getting ass blasted over a mediocre meme

kys

>>35480604
Then let's take the humble crow for instance.

The crow is easily one of the most intelligent species of bird, if not animal entirely, that humans have extensive research about. They are able to communicate to each other to avoid areas on crow told others was dangerous, they visit their aging parents years after the fact, they recognize human faces as distinct people and remember interactions with them. Most importantly they have the ability to think beyond instant gratification, as tested crows actually have been able to restrain themselves from eating a smaller portion of food if they can wait to get a bigger portion. They problem solve through trial and error to get food, etc.

Crows are also omnivorous. They eat nuts, berries, seeds, small wildlife, and corpses.

So if a crow spots a field mouse out in the wild, and it swoops down and kills it for food when it instead could have continued searching for berries or something, does that make the crow evil?

>>35478511
>slaughtering them to death
as opposed to slaughtering them to life?

All other species are the same way, okay with killing other species but not their own: we empathize and care more about 1 human than a million cows. It's our programming. Since the rise of large societies, we have even compartmentalized empathy within our species.

>>35485563
I sincerely doubt you're starving but keep meat as a primary part of your diet because high sodium, fat, and animal hormones are so good for you! I bet you drink milk lol

I love meat too and there's nothing I can do about it but the meat industry causes so much pollution

Zero fucks given though because I'm on r9kunts

>>35478511
You give the animals life but you also take it back, the animal wouldn't have been their in the first place. So does an animal on a farm these days suffer more than they did in the wild? The slaughtering is actually not the problem, animals are knocked unconscious first and then killed... Anyways who gives a shit people are going to eat no matter what including me because it's taste y

>>35478432

>dont like current facotry farming

hey here is a cool idea stop buying your meat at grocery stores like walmart and find a local dedicated butcher shop.

The one down the road from where I live buys all their meat local from farmers that raise their cows and pigs from birth to slaughter on their old school free range farms.

That or find an actual farmer visit their farm and ask to buy half a cow or a whole pig to be processed for you.

>>35478432
Morally, it's not justifiable. Practically, I'm not going to starve myself in a world steeped in evil. too autistic to change my taste in food.

(Also in utilitarian terms, the "creating demand" argument doesn't really work. Companies already overproduce food then dump it. For it to actually matter you'd need everyone to act collectively, and if that was possible then we could just have fully automated vegan communism.)

>>35478432
>The animals are products of millennia of artificial selection and would go extinct if not for humans.
>The animals have no concept of morality and are unable to contribute to a moral system. Unless you're stupid enough to believe in moral systems as some sort of 'magic guide from God' then it follows that animals should not be participants in systems they cannot contribute to.
>All arguments for vegetarianism relating to real moral players (ie. people) turn out to be false. For example, whether becoming vegetarian will reduce your environmental impact is unknown. You could easily eat out of season fruits and vegetables and be a BIGGER contributor to environmental problems.
>Vegetarian morality is inconsistent. Do vegetarians support massive campaigns to prevent other animals from eating meat? Why is it only bad when humans do it? Because we should know better? Well, we do know better, we know that being omnivorous is the most efficient way to satisfy our energy needs.

There are plenty of arguments against your worldview and if you weren't the personification of confirmation bias you'd have some awareness of them.

>>35485851
>Not hunting and killing local wildlife
Sure, cuck your wallet out to your local butcher

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>>35478432

Yeah I mean alright, you can make that argument but you'll need a solution too. Guilt tripping people into not eating meat isn't a very effective solution. You're gonna have to find a way to offer a product that's has the same nutrition as meat, is easy and affordable to acquire and find a way to minimize the economic damage when the entire meat industry inventively falls.

Then you'll have to figure out the problem with the hundreds of millions of domesticated farm animals that are now useless to us. Letting them go out into the wild will just get them killed since they literally can't survive on their own or you just end up slaughtering all of them yourself in the end since they can't do anything anymore.

I'll stress again, if you want to stop this you're going to have to offer realistic solutions to the populations.

>>35485881

Hunting has seasons and permits, guns and ammo are an expensive investment.

Wild animals can have mystery diseases and illnesses you don't know about.

Some people are too much of a pussy or idiot to skin and process their own kills. So that costs money if you drop them off at a processing facility.

Not everyone is cut out for hunting or the end game of it.

>>35478432
eating vegan kills more animals than eating meat
eating vegan also does vastly more damage to the environment than does eating meat
there are more but those two you cant refute

>>35486030

not simply eating vegans

>pussy

just ignore the kuru myth just avoid the brains and spinal fluids.

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>wolf eating a deer is 100% ok because it's "natural"
>human eating a cow is 100% evil because it's "unnatural"
Humans are animals, we are part of nature- your liberal moralism means jack shit. We're the only carnivorous species intelligent enough to find a more effective way to get our meat than hunting and that is 100% ok.

>>35478432
Humans need meat. Vegans live less than the average person and have more diseases. It's just in our genes and physical needs.
>>35478587
>A lot of animals are smarter than most humans
Then why the fuck no one says anything about those animals that are "smarter than humans" when they eat other animals in order to live?

>>35478432
Rapists don't enjoy rape. Usually it only last a few seconds before they run off.

>>35478432
We're top of the food chain, we can do what the fuck ever we want.
Do you think tigers in India have ethical issues about eating Pajeet, even though he grew up in street-shitting squalor?

>>35480931
>Animals get stunned before getting killed so they don't feel it
>he hasn't seen the videos where they totally fuck up the procedure for killing animals because there's nearly zero oversight

>>35486224
>Usually it only last a few seconds
can confirm

>>35486385

Where I work we pull them up and slit the neck as they go up.

They pass out from blood pressure drop and bleed out in seconds, the resulting kicking is just nervous system firing off.

>>35478432
I don't eat meat, I do care for animals a lot, but that's not the real reason I don't eat meat, fuck I don't even know why I don't eat meat, but about 2 years in so I can't stop now. I wouldn't mind just saying fuck animals though.

>>35478432
I'm a voluntary egoist.

Easy, an animal may be able to feel pain and shit but an animal unlike a human isn't self aware of it's existence and if it was raised and fed so I could eat then it is fulfilling it's life's purpose.

>>35478432

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>>35478786
>if it was legal to own child slaves, there'd be nothing morally wrong with paedophilia.
found the lolberg

>>35478906
Feudalism is the only reason we achieved capitalism

ergo you are now my serf and I get to fuck your wife. lords didn't actually have this right but we should stick it in anyway.

I feel like animals are more likely to die a much more horrible death in the wild than in a slaughterhouse, and therefore the act of killing them doesnt really bother me

>>35478432
Except animals are inferior to us. Just like niggers.