>anti post modernism intensifies I've been under a

>>139560142
Jordan Peterson is the quintessential pseudo-intellectual.

>>139560367
says only real pseudo intellectuals.
I am so tired of this. KYS and sort your self out.

File: 39330.jpg (4MB, 6256x3240px) Image search: [Google]

4MB, 6256x3240px

>>139560142
>Has he even glanced at any revisionist material?

>b-but I heard 6 million died in the holocaust!
Normies swallow 6 gorillion because they never critically examine such a grisly topic, believing (((Hollywood))) and Allied history is 100% factual

>b-but what about the Nuremberg trials! Some Nazis admitted war crimes, so it must be true Hitler had a Final Solution to kill all the Jews!
Allies tortured German POWs. Gerstein claimed 25 million were killed, does that sound believable? At Dachau Nazis had their testicles kicked in and crushed beyond repair

At Auschwitz, (((Soviets))) said 4 million died in gas chambers. Today, the death toll sits at 1.1 million (from ALL causes), though still grossly inflated going by Red Cross reports
>Auschwitz - Why The Gas Chambers Are A Myth:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PE56dcgGVMs

>b-but it wasn't just Auschwitz!
At Majdanek, (((Soviets))) said 2 million were killed in gas chambers.
Now they say <60,000 died (primarily of disease). Red Cross estimated 8,800
>The Majdanek Gas Chamber Myth:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDsJtB2F9i8

>b-but the Reinhard death camps: Treblinka, Sobibor, and Belzec!
There is little to support the claim that tens of thousands, let alone 1.3 MILLION died
>1/3rd of the Holocaust (debunked):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7dxsVSzL4HE

>b-but Nazis made lampshades out of tattooed Jewish inmates!
The lampshade myth comes from a propaganda film made to de-Nazify Germany by a US Psych Warfare unit
>Buchenwald: A Dumb Dumb Portrayal of Evil:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3HlPcaP9x5o

>b-but I've seen Steven Spielberg's Survivors of the Shoah!
Watch the following
>The Last Days of the Big Lie
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=80GgRWuXcO8

>o-ok, let's suppose you're right. Why does it matter?!
It matters because no one can criticize the Jews without being labeled an anti-semite. Denial is ILLEGAL in 20 countries
>The JQ:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKy3fCvMz-8

>>139560568
>METAPHYSICS

Neomodernism is meeting postmodernism at its level and butting heads, true post-postmodernism is neoclassicism. What if we instead of hating western stuff we cherry picked the best stuff from history and then made that our thing? Oh wait, it is and it's called neoclassicism.

A good example of this would be Stefan Molyneux citing ancient Greek philosophers or Carl Benjamin reciting some enlightenment era philosopher. Also, that guy who writes the music no one is allowed to talk about.

>>139560367
>>139560568
So much animosity and rage, peace and good love all round.

>>139560367
He's not a groundbreaking intellectual, since he recycles a lot of stuff from Jung, but he's definitely not a pseud. Those would be almost anyone talking about "institutional racism" or other similar middle school tier trash.

>>139560367
the man was a fucking college professor. he has legitimately psychoanalyzed mental patients. if he didn't have the credentials to do so, he'd be in fucking prison by now. i don't think you know the meaning of the term "intellectual".

>>139560976
we need to transcend them all and establish some sort of meta modern system of conversational logic.

>>139560367
He's the definition of a legitimate intellectual.

File: JonathanBowden.jpg (24KB, 250x282px) Image search: [Google]

24KB, 250x282px

>>139560142
His fans only like him because they're too chickenshit to seek out the real thing.

>>139560367

He is/was a professor, what did you expect?

>>139560142
Nobody cares because he is a feminist liberal.

>>139560976
Correct. Modernism is cancer and so is Jordan Peterson. The only bad thing about postmodernism is that it isn't postmodern enough (still holds to most of the basic premises of modernism). We need a true postmodernism that purges all of modenism, not return to the cancer all over again.

File: arguments in the bag.jpg (22KB, 545x409px) Image search: [Google]

22KB, 545x409px

>>139560367
Literally not an argument. Is he a poopy pants too? We're going to need some substance on that claim.

>>139561621
Quick rundown?
>>139560976
So what's this neoclassicism consist of? I assume it accepts the ontological reality of mind-independent truth, repudiates skepticism, appreciation for traditions as 'solutions' to emergent problems, open to the existence of God, anything else?

>>139561336
/pol/ when discussing normal liberal professors:
>College is worthless brainwashing run by marxists
>social science isn't real science
>all professors are scum and need to be killed on the day of the rope
>psychology is Jewish

/pol/ when discussing Jordan Peterson:
>he's a real credentialed psychologist and prestigious professor
>psychology is a real science and totally Aryan
>if professors weren't actually teaching anything of value, then they would be fired by the BASED and trustworthy college administration

>>139563174
>he's a real credentialed psychologist and prestigious professor

They're harping on this because they finally have a man on the inside.

>>139562849
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J92f2S3E0S8

File: ME.jpg (159KB, 851x951px) Image search: [Google]

159KB, 851x951px

First they came for Milo and I was bummed.

Then they came for infowars and I annoyed.

Then they came for Jordan Peterson and I hoped anyone with unnatural dyed hair colors died.

Then they came Ron Paul and I realized the civil was happening.

>>139561336
>if he didn't have the credentials to do so, he'd be in fucking prison by now.
I wish it worked like that.

>when you're falsely diagnosed as autistic and your mother disagrees because obvious reasons and the psychologist double downs by telling your primary school
Bullying is fun and games until it's scared left wing adults who don't know how to deal with someone they believe they can manipulate with emotion.

>>139561416
You can't transcend this dialectic fashion, otherwise artists and real philosophers don't really have a common purpose or style. It really made sense after Beethoven's Eroica, art is for mankind and not the other way around. This is the thought that began romanticism.

>>139562849
>So what's this neoclassicism consist of?
Neoclassicism is actually very crude, it's a perfect reaction to "everything from the west is bad." I don't actually know what the next stage.

>I assume it accepts the ontological reality of mind-independent truth,
No, truth reverts back to the materialism found in classical philosophy.

>repudiates skepticism,
Neither, scepticism is simply change from "just sceptic of the west" to a more open scepticism. Scepticism wasn't really a feature until postmodernism, but unlike the postmodernists we won't throw it out (although if the new agers try to take over neoclassicism again it might).

>appreciation for traditions as 'solutions' to emergent problems,
Obviously, it's a resurrection of the past, the ultimate glorification of the father culture.

>open to the existence of God, anything else?
This is a big one, you can't escape neoclassical music without some sort of allusion to spirituality, true neoclassical will even include hymns and liturgical music.

>>139563379
>they came for milo
>and I was bummed

:^O

File: not an argument.jpg (62KB, 431x582px) Image search: [Google]

62KB, 431x582px

>>139560367
>>139560902

Time for another exciting episode of:

NOT

AN

ARGUMENT

Featuring your host, Stefan Molymeme (who I actually hate, but still, you haven't made an argument).

>>139560976
Horse shit. That isn't postmodernism. Stephen Hicks seems renowned enough, why should I listen to you over him?

>>139563174
No, only the liberal professors need to go, and Peterson is literally THE FUCKING ANTITHESIS TO ALL THE MODERN LIBERAL SHITE IN COLLEGES

That's literally HIS WHOLE THING. IS ARGUING AGAINST THAT STUFF. YOU FUCKING BRAINDEAD MORON. GO FUCK YOURSELF WITH A FUCKING CACTUS. I'M NOT GOING TO GIVE YOU ANYMORE POSTS. ACCEPT THIS AND MOVE ON WITH YOUR LIFE.

>>139563869
it's okay, it was a positive experience for anon

File: Capture.png (24KB, 578x162px) Image search: [Google]

24KB, 578x162px

>>139560367
>Jordan Peterson is the quintessential pseudo-intellectual.
This.

>>139564244
He is trying to undo the snowball of shit that is postmodernism

>>139563854
Interesting. I think Peterson's approach to postmodernism is a good one, because he rightfully recognizes that while an infinite number of interpretations of any given text/set of facts is *possible*, not every interpretation will be equally good at facilitating human flourishment (surviving and thriving).

I think the idea is that short of a radical skepticism, most people will admit that there is a certain amount of facticity to the universe- gravity, cellular respiration, mind-independent reality etc, and that it is generally a good idea to pay heed to the hard facts which the scientific method has established, and the presuppositions which undergird modern science (xyz-t space exists, matter exists, history has happened, cause and effect, mechanisms can be investigated without fundamentally changing the mechanism etc) I'm glossing over a lot of the nitty gritty details/articulations, but you get the point.

AFAICT, Jordan Peterson's worldview relies on at least accepting the presupposition that human flourishment (surviving and thriving) is prefereable to not-flourishment (dying and decay), and therefore we should comport ourselves in such a way as to maximize the probability of human flourishment, because if you try/care, things might get better for you, but if you don't try/care, things will definitely get worse as a consequence of entropy multiplying chaos.

>>139564244

Baking, of any sort, is impossible, without ingredients. Thus raisins are required for all baking.

File: Max_stirner.jpg (10KB, 200x237px) Image search: [Google]

10KB, 200x237px

Is any public intellectual as spooked as Peterson? He's haunted by so many spooks....

>>139564813
Are you calling Pinocchio a spook?

this guy is a total cuck! he doesn't even worship adolf or want to blow up federal buildings whatta cuck!

>>139564244
when he says God he means some sort of base axiomatic system. That could include belief in the bible or the qoran or that ultimately our universe is something like Conway's game of life. You have to have some belief in some kind of base axiom which all else comes from. The postmodernist view however is to attempt to ignore this need. God? Science says no proof, so no creator! How does stuff exist then? Well shit I dunno! Do you have any belief about it? Of course not, the science isn't clear!


Its a void, part of why most libs are depressed.

>>139560142
>how did pol reaction

they didn't. pol has its head stuck in the sand just like everyone else

>>139560142
His account is up and running, as of this second. What are you playing at?

>>139564180
Peterson is a liberal

File: le_pepe.png (61KB, 475x382px) Image search: [Google]

61KB, 475x382px

>>139564612
*accepting the presupposition that iterable and scalable human flourishment is preferable to not-flourishment
>>139564244
Dunno how he goes from 'an axiom is necessary for proof' (which is true) to 'this particular axiom is necessary'.
>>139564751
What axioms underlie your worldview, desu?

>>139564180
>No, only the liberal professors need to go, and Peterson is literally THE FUCKING ANTITHESIS TO ALL THE MODERN LIBERAL SHITE IN COLLEGES
Does liberal mean something different in the UK? Peterson is by all definitions a liberal here, your sentence would make more sense replacing both 'liberal's with 'Marxist'

>>139564612
JBP actually makes no presupposition between society flourishment and decay. He brings everything back to individualism.

>>139561281
He's a teacher so he has to teach the basic and historical theories rather than only tell his beliefs.

>>139565552
>JBP actually makes no presupposition between society flourishment and decay.
Have you listened to his talks with Harris? His notion of truth relies on things not leading to ultimate destruction

>>139564018
I didn't actually describe postmodernism, I'm interested in the next stage which is post-postmodernism if we don't have a word, contemporary if we use an awkward word and new age if we throw our atheist and sceptic friends under the bus.

The "word" is the very meta problem of this stage and comes from the fact no one really liked the word modern, which meant "now," but now "modernism" is two stages over and basically means we're a century ahead of now.

>>139564018
>why should I listen to you over him?
Besides the fact you're a halfwit with reading comprehension and you're unlikely to get anything from anyone, you shouldn't. I don't really care. He's a professor, I'm not.

>>139564244
That's pretty basic ontology (study of knowledge, iirc). Common grounds or axioms are established in which arguments are concluded from common agreements.

I have something like a mid second year philosophy students knowledge. I'm far from a professional but I know some shit.

>>139564612
>not every interpretation will be equally good at facilitating human flourishment (surviving and thriving).
Which is actually that same crude reactionary response to an art movement many of us feel now designed to stifle human flourishment. This is crude because nothing is worse for a movement than to completely frame itself around rejecting another.

>that it is generally a good idea to pay heed to the hard facts which the scientific method has established,
Okay, I was mistaken. I thought you meant post structuralism by mind independent, as in reality becomes independent of what you are capable of observing. It becomes hyper real.

No, I agree. I think reacting to this fuckery of the truth will lead to an end of this fear of being formulaic or following conventions. Postmodernism has many internal dissonances, one of them is that the artists within it actually aren't great, are deliberately mediocre, and justify this by promoting artistic styles that kind of resist greatness.

>>139565552
Well, he does talk about acting in such a way that it would be good for you, your family, your community, your country etc.

>>139566040
Are you just referring to postmodernism in its influence on the arts? I'm more interested in the basic philosophical theses of postmodernism, and how we can effectively combat them, such as relativism (cultural and moral), the denial of objective truth, rejection of science, tradition, etc., while also integrating the insights that postmodernism affords us (limits of language, how our perspective is shaped by our culture/identity/frame, the problem of interpretation, etc.)

I'm a bit wary of Peterson's refusal to affirm the existence of ontological truth, rather than just Darwinian 'truth', as not only is the denial of the existence of ontological truth inconsistent, it effectively dissolves history into nothing but groups attempting to assert their narrative over one another, rather than the attempt to carefully catalog facts of history. That and I think it is the easiest 'leg' of postmodernism to attack, because by denying the existence of ontological truth, the postmodernists implicitly rely upon the concept of ontological truth, handily summed up in the following exchange:
> There is no such thing as truth
> Is that true?
The question of which fundamental axioms to accept/argue from is a very interesting one, and I think that at the very least, the axioms which ground logic and science have demonstrated themselves to be useful
> existence of ontological truth
> law of non-contradiction
> law of identity
> law of cause and effect
I'm sure others could come up with others, but I don't really see how one can do away with any of these and assemble a coherent worldview that corresponds with our individual and collective experiences.

>>139564180
absolutely triggered

>>139560976
>music no one is allowed to talk about.
whats this?

>>139565129
>>139564244
His definition of God roughly translates to "the existence of an ideal way of being", not tied to any scripture really.

>>139565060
Apparently his account was locked earlier this month

I guess that's been undone since then

>>139560142
wish there were more guys like him. he's so attractive even though he's as old as my father :L

>>139564813

Spooks are a spook faggot. Back to square one.

>>139568282
>Spooks are a spook faggot. Back to square one.
Wrong, please read a book before spewing such nonsense, what you wrote doesn't even make sense

>>139568462
>Indoctrinate yourself into my shitty idealogy rather than just call it bullshit.

How about no.

File: 1503532840233.jpg (4MB, 3884x7735px) Image search: [Google]

4MB, 3884x7735px

>>139560725

>>139565552
>He brings everything back to individualism.
Yes, that's the neomodern style.

>>139567647
I've been shadow banned in a fairly interesting way, people just "know," even in real life, never to praise me or anything I've done. It's not personal, it's just what the current culture does.

You can hear this "privilege" in my music, so no one talks about it.

>>139567141
Are you having fun making me think?

>Are you just referring to postmodernism in its influence on the arts? I'm more interested in the basic philosophical theses of postmodernism,
Philosophy is a sort of art, any artist who doesn't respect philosophy is likely a postmodernist to be honest. The dialectic periods are for philosophy and art.

>I'm a bit wary of Peterson's refusal to affirm the existence of ontological truth, rather than just Darwinian 'truth', as not only is the denial of the existence of ontological truth inconsistent,
Bear in mind he is very used to dealing with soft science women. I suspect he doesn't realise how much that influences him.

>it effectively dissolves history into nothing but groups attempting to assert their narrative over one another, rather than the attempt to carefully catalog facts of history.
Which is how they like it, truth becomes malleable to the malicious and scientific to the short sighted.

>> There is no such thing as truth
>> Is that true?
More obnoxious than interesting, it's fairly childish to believe injecting meta-ness directly into everything makes it deep.

File: 2125908.png (186KB, 400x400px) Image search: [Google]

186KB, 400x400px

>>139569264
When did I say anything about indoctrination?

>>139569877
hahah oh my fucking god this amount of delusion is fucking glorious. more likelu you don't know how to market your art. post your shitty music, faggot. i work in audio engineering.