How does Anarcho-Communism work? Isn't the whole point

>>139332457
inb4
>thats because it doesn't OP, you dum af.
im trying to understand why they think it works.

>>139332457
The end goat of communism according to marx is a stateless, breadless and moneyless society.

>>139332536
read this you fucking leaf >>139332531

>>139332457
Ideally once actual true honest-to-God communism is reached, then there is no need for a state since the workers would organise themselves on a local/regional level without need of hierarchies nor state oppression.

>>139332536
wait no i misunderstood that, sorry.

>>139332649
>the workers would organise themselves on a local/regional level without need of hierarchies

Explain this part if you will

>>139332536
So once all humans are dead, communism is achieved.

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>>139332587
>pinoys calling people dumb
The point of communism isn't meant to be the state control of everything, therefore there is no contradiction, in their own minds communism is anarchy.

>>139332706
communists are dumb as fuck

>>139332706
It doesn't work

>>139332747
i misunderstood ur first reply

>>139332706
That depends on the specific brand of anarchism we could be discussing. Under most commonly understood anarchism principles most workers would organise themselves in communes with common goals and interests. Now, depending on whether you favour Bakunin or Kropotkin, said communes could rule themselves using either direct assambleary democracy where the entire commune decides on who gets what or establish some sort of labour vouchers that you could exchange for communal services. This last part, of course, is what opens the gate for agorists, then mutualists and, even if anarchists don't like to admit it, anarcho capitalists.

>>139332457
> Isn't the whole point of communism is for the state to control everything?
No. To achieve communism firstly the capitalist system must be destroyed with state controlling everything, preferably it should happen on a world wide scale. After that capitalistic classes and structures will be abolished and after that there will be new classless nationless society of free people.

>>139332531
Who said they believe in anarchy? They're being disingenuous and hiding their true aims by calling themselves anarchists because it works. Also, communists realized a long time ago that they could take over a country in crisis and anarchy was an opening they could exploit. Think about WWI and how russia became dominated by the bolsheviks. A group of "anarchists" shot 1 man, the whole civilized world was whipped into a frenzy and the red terror took russia, almost took poland and started a civil war in bavaria. Yuri bezmenov gives a detailed explanation for how this process works but it's fairly simple for advanced societies: demoralize, destabilize, cause a crisis and normalize the new order. The united states figured out how the communists were taking over countries and stopped its geographical domination but was unable(and unaware) to stop the cultural spread, which is why america has so much cultural marxism today.

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>>139332457
>>139332536
>The end goat of communism according to marx is a stateless, breadless and moneyless society.
Canadian attempts at humour are sad.

The actual end goal of communism was to be functional anarchy AKA direct democracy from the base to the top, with commonly owned (at a societal level) resources and means of production. THAT's what Anarcho-communism is.
Antifa is just a joint term for anti-fascist tactics and ideas, not an organization or a group. It's like the Black bloc. Anarchy just means self-organization, not chaos or such.

>>139332457
It's basically Anarcho-capitalism without a market. Everyone just shares things and gets along.

>>139332457
Hegelian dialectic. First the liberals say everything is fucked up. "Problem". Then the anarchist fuck everything up. "Reaction". Then communism is offered. Solution.

they actually want local powers like syndicates to do the communism. so that's why they're anarchists. they don't want huge states

>>139332457
>How does Anarcho-Communism work?
it doesn't because within a week some ancap/authoritatian warlord would violate their buttholes and make his empire larger

>>139333158
confirmed aussies are best posters ever
(thanks its way simpler to think of it this way)

>>139333043
And then goods just magically produce themselves with no real formal system to educate the people as to how this might be done aside from other than "people need it," you just have to rely on everyone believing in the same retarded bullshit that you do. Apparently it's just meant to work when done right, and totally isn't just a fundamentally retarded belief system for lazy cunts who genuinely believe that they will get gibs out of it.

>>139332457
>Anarcho-Communism
>work

Couple of things. First, Communism would actually have to work at all, and secondly

Anarchy: There is no government and you are master of your own possessions.
Communism: The state/government controls all and you have no own possessions.

Anyone with even half a braincell can see the why those two don't mix. Which is incidentally why Antifa doesn't.

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>>139333131
Also, for anarchy to function, society needs to hyperfederalize into groups small enough for natural human relationships (i.e. around 150 people). With current technology, that would easily possible.
Picture somewhat unrelated

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>>139333332
ok take this instead

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>>139332536
>breadless

>>139332457

Anarcho communism relies on peoples internal "goodnes". Ie. rules but no rulers.

>>139333158
Or property rights. Or strict voluntary association only. Or the NAP. Or covenants. Etc etc

The only thing it has in common is the stateless part.

>>139332457
People who believe in communism join their efforts, create a commune, live happily and share everything with each other. A camrade who commits aggression or otherwise problematic for the commune will be expelled back to the evil anarcho-capitalist world.

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>>139333506
and "goodness" means
>no "cultural appropriation"
>no "mansplaining"
>using the correct pronouns for all the infinite genders
>white people pay compensation to everyone else
kek nice goodness you have there

>>139333510
>NAP
??

>>139333510
All of those parts come with the Market economy, private property is worthless without a market economy

The my point in that they're similar is that both systems have little tolerance for abuse and could be quickly broken down, one simply functions with a market economy while the other doesn't

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>>139333737
non-aggresion principle
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-aggression_principle

>>139332457
Everything is free because everyone makes society solely because they want to

If this sounds ridiculous to you, you're probably an evil r*cist

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_Rh3PbnAdw

>>139333635

I'm sure that there are also conservative ancoms.

>>139333833
they would be murdered by the other ancoms immediatly

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The main book for ancoms is Fight in the breadline by Kropotkin. The author sets basic guides for the communist society, but does not gives the final solution to distribute scarce good or how to motivate people to work. He expresses some speculations like having labor-hour cheques. https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/petr-kropotkin-the-conquest-of-bread.pdf

>>139332457
>Isn't the whole point of communism is for the state to control everything?
>And the whole point of anarchy is that there is no state?
>Don't the two contradict?
No. Their state controls everything, but since their society has absolutely nothing of value, "everything" in that case becomes "nothing", which in turn effectively eliminates any need for the state apparatus to grow beyond 0 people.

>>139333878
>they would be murdered by the other ancoms immediatly
No, it is two much authoritative. A women must be happy to have comrades using her vagina. Otherwise she is not a real communist and will be expelled from the communie to suffer of oppression from the evil anarchocapitalist world.

>>139334362
>A women must be happy to have comrades using her vagina.
Sounds like something Bernie Sanders wrote, lmao.

>>139334362
do you know any anarcho communists
just check out their facebook pages. they're authoritian as fuck

>>139334362
>expelled
Not even that, she would be assumed to be mentally Ill and thrown in the nuthouse, as per every gommie society ever. That's if she didn't get 'stalins thanks' ie a .32 to the back of the head

>>139334589
That's the fundamental contradiction and stupidity of their position. They are actually more 'fascist' than those they claim to hate.

>>139334795
a huge amount of them are mentally ill as well. probably because of those contradictions

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>>139334795
>They are actually more 'fascist' than those they claim to hate.
Fascism is a soft form of socialis. Benito Mussolini, the author of fascist doctrine, was a fan of Bakunin's syndicalism. Ancoms are in favor of the syndicalist trade union movement too and value Bakunin.

>>139332457
Communism is inherently anarchy, their is no state in communism

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>>139335300

In the end they would live in small communes with no central authority. Of course it's a utopian ideal that can't even be implemented. Check out the philosopher Proudhon, he's the one the anarchists masturbate to

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>>139336114
thanks. saved.

>>139336114
They say it is a fake quote. These are the words of early Nazi party official Gregor Strasser, printed in a 1926 pamphlet titled Thoughts about the Tasks of the Future.

>>139334928
Thing is, fuck gommunism, but you can see the appeal to muh downtrodden workers slaving away in some eastern euro 19th century shithole. But these kids live in one of the most pampered and affluent societies that has ever existed. They invent oppression and straw man enemies for the sole purpose of giving themselves targets.

>>139332457
it doesn't, truth is those dependent household members are only larping as libertarian left (can't be libertarian without being right), they are nothing but a bunch of authoritarians who want to "get even" with those whose lineage/abilities/luck/x is better than theirs

>>139336614
Yeah, youre right, it's from strasser. The other damning socialist hitler quote comes from rauschning, so it might be propaganda.

Interesting article on socialist national socialism from the independent of all places

https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/hitler-and-the-socialist-dream-1186455.html

>>139337349
What if we archive it
https://archive.is/LvMJx

>>139337349
The article mentions Goebbels, but does not specify he was a communist before he joined NSDAP. This could be another direction to dig quotes. Karl Marx was also chauvinistic and proposed to eliminate trash-nations like slavs and hungarians.

>>139338656
>trash-nation
your new worlder is showing

>>139339284
Excuse me?

>>139332536
>Person A produces bread
>Person B produces chairs
>they give each other the goods that they need
>both decide to set a value for their goods, because 1 bread =/= 1 chair to make exchanging the goods easier
>create coins to represent the value of their goods which make it easier to set a value to different goods
>Person A don't want be as equal as Person B and offer him to sell him more breads, so he can get more coins
>Person C also accept these coins
>Person A buys other goods from person C

Whadd do? :DDD

>>139332457
About the same way as anarcho-capitalism: it doesn't. Both economical systems need government, because property is a spook.

>>139332457
Actual communism is a anarchistic society without heirarchies, technically it's the most free a society can be, no man can tell you what to do, and if everyone somehow agreed with it and didn't try to screw one another over it would be perfect, everyone produces according to his need and recieves what he needs from his community. It's literally a utopia.
Doesn't work because I'm order to achieve anarchy and statelessness you have to have a hyper authoritarian govt that oppressed the capitalists and by some mechanism decides to end itself once it's able to transition to anarchy.
Cool idea but retarded as fuck in practice. There's a reason sterner was able to shit on marx so much in his time

>>139333089
Those ppl are called tankies and most ancom guys at least dislike them

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>>139341219
>Actual communism
>REAL communism
>no one can tell you what to do!
>NEVER BEEN TRIED YET
>hurrdrrudurrur
And peter pan was a great book, but humans still can't fly and will still die every single time they jump out a window trying to do it.

>>139332457
>How does Anarcho-Communism work?
It doesn't.

>Isn't the whole point of communism is for the state to control everything?
No, the whole point is to get rid of private property. In this process the star cannot do anything but fade away, but we need a state to begin with nevertheless. Anarcho-"communists" don't understand that.

>And the whole point of anarchy is that there is no state?
No hierarchy whatsoever.

>Don't the two contradict?
Yes it does, but for the reasons I explained, not the ones you have in mind.

>And isn't this what Anti-Fa believes in ?
Anti-fascist is the broader term I think.

t. Marxist

>>139333024
>said communes could rule themselves using either direct assambleary democracy where the entire commune decides on who gets what or establish some sort of labour vouchers that you could exchange for communal services

Is that so much different from what we have today? What's the point of the revolution then?

>>139341540
If you had bothered to read the whole thing you'd see that I said it's a stupid as fuck ideology

>>139341966
Read your own history mate, the anarchist communes in the Spanish civil war, how they failed.

>>139341966
Our current system actually had more in common with an oligarchy than a democracy desu. Rousseau was right when he said "the English are only free when they hold elections". You have no say whatsoever in 99% of what the govt does.

>>139341219
>if everyone somehow agreed with it and didn't try to screw one another over it would be perfect
the most retarded thing I've ever heard, especially if niggers are involved

>>139332457
They would say that the point of the communist state is to "prepare the way" for the stateless society. Its clear human beings at this moment would are not ready to live in the communal paradise, so they have to be educated/enlightened to such a degree that they become capable.

The key difference between communism and anarchism is one is "from above" and the other is "from below", but in practice it all just winds up being communism. The anarchists wind up discovering that human nature isnt what they hoped it was and that a "vanguard" really is necessary to lead them, at which point the plan is not much different from communism.

Somewhat relatedly, this is why they hate that so many of our traits wound up being heritable. If someone's genetic IQ is 80 there's not much that education and socialization is going to do for them, they probably will always need authority and structure to function. Really puts a damper on the whole anarchist utopia thing

>>139342569
That's why I went on to call it stupid as fuck. It denies the fundamental flaws in humans from sin and asserts that every man is just a perfect being trying to escape. It's actually the opposite, every man is a wild animal being held back by the state and taught morality.

>>139333131
oh wow, you're retarded.

>>139332457
Worker control of the means of production can be achieved without the state. Also governing entity is not the same as state. I am not an ancom but this is what they believe.

>>139333043
>free people
>yes goy. Accept the NWO

It doesnt, they think it does because they are not clever. Communism and order are synnonyms. Anarchism is the opposite of communism.

For some reason some retards dont realize order that comes from the grassroots is the fucking same as order coming from the elite.

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>>139342545
Isn't it more natural to leave most of the work to people who actually can into macroeconomics and stuff, rather than some narcissistic peasants hero?

>>139343146
So what you are saying is that the state is different from the state?

Interdasting.

>>139341219
>everyone somehow agreed to it and nobody tried to screw each other

Oops you created a state, guess you gotta try again haha

>>139333381
>anarchy works guys
>breaks down 7 billion people into tribes of 150
>what could go wrong
>"nuffins" says the retard

this is "scraping the bottom of the 'retard' barrel" tier

>>139332457
No, it doesn't make any sense. That's why communists constantly say "well real communism hasn't been tried!" Because communism is self-contradictory and impossible to occur. It's like insisting that 2+2=5 and every time you try adding 2+2, you get 4, and keep insisting that it just hasn't been added properly yet

>>139343493
Yes, which is why I'm fascist with the caveat that peasents stay well armed enough to overthrow the government of things get messed up. People don't want to be free they want to be comfy. If a fashy regime kept people comfy they wouldn't care. A fash regime is stronger than a democratic one in principle because fascists don't have to have a vote of anything when a existential threat pops up, like Muslim invasion or communist subversion

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>>139332457
>Isn't the whole point of communism is for the state to control everything?
No.

>>139332531

Marx believed you could brainwash people into doing anything. So Communist pretend they will take over the government and brainwash people into not wanting money and working all day.

It all come from the belief that there is no such thing and human nature, and that all people are 100% programed by their environment.

>>139344061
It is, actually. That the useful idiots don't believe that's what they're fighting for is besides the point.

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>ancom
>we too retawded to compete in society
>everyone needs to digress back into da caves

>everyone else
>how about we gas you

this is literally the cycle, ancoms are too retarded to see it
good riddance

>>139344061
>le state will magically beome the peeple
>being this retarded

>>139343988
What if it fails to keep people comfy? Shouldn't they be prepared to peacefully let somebody else rule when the people demand so?
I mean, surely you would agree a monopoly on state powers has proven to be able to turn very nasty

Communism is an extension of tribalism. Or a modern version of tribalism.

You wake up in the morning and you go and work not with strangers, but with your local community with whom you are organised, and with whom you control the means and direction of work.
This is important because in the modern world, work takes up the entire day, meaning the community is essentially destroyed because no one has time for it.

In capitalism you go and work for an organisation that, unless you are a part of the 1%, you have no control over. You have no control over the laws which determine your work either, because they are set by lobbyists. The people you work with are strangers who you otherwise would not associate with.
You can vote for a party that promises some kind of better deal, but in reality the democratic process is controlled by big business so you never get a candidate who would seriously jeopardise the wishes of the 1%, which are to maximise profit in part by increasing working hours (this has been done already. We now spend most of the day working), getting full employment/more workers (i.e. by taking women into work as was achieved in the 20th century), lowering wages (e.g. through mass immigration), outsourcing (e.g. tech jobs to India) and automation as is happening now.
In countries where these anti-1% candidates emerge, the West will overthrow them with help from "pro-democracy" NGOs which disrupt the society or simple military intervention. It's currently happening in Thailand.

>>139344759

wrong, communism is a globalist philosophy, and a worker will be expected to travel to the location anywhere in the world that gives the highest level of production.

Mao literally destroyed all sense of chinese history and community in his cultural revolution.

>>139344759
Well, it's sort of happening in Thailand. Thailand isn't a democracy, which provides a neat excuse to send in business-funded NGOs to agitate and direct the population towards business-friendly candidates who'll do what they are told.

The result of all of this >>139344759 is that profits go up for the 1% and stagnate for everyone else, as we see today.

>>139344943
Capitalism = globalism. The indoctrination of the right by the likes of Friedman, Mises, etc. is one of the globalists great achievements. You actually think it's a good thing to sacrifice the tribe/community for wageslavery in service of a CEO stranger you'll never meet.

>>139345052

you are making up some bullshit snowflake communist philosophy on the spot. Not what marx/lenin/mao preached.

>>139345052
Ancapism and Communism are two sides of the same shekel. Both are universalist globalist ideologies meant as a two-pronged attack on ethnic tribal identity, nationalism, etc. This is how the jews operate.

>>139332649
holy fuck

was Marx that retarded?

>>139336419
>>139336114
>>139335300
Nice safespace you've created for yourself, with nonfactual memes to enforce you beliefs.

Communism is pretty much inherently statist in realistic terms anyway. Being Ancom sounds redundant to me because by the anarchists' definition of living in anarchy you're already done with communism when you reach that phase.

>>139341700
>It doesn't.
Ukraine (Makhnovshchyna) 1917-1920
Spain 1936-1938
There is a entire book by orwell on it "Homage to Catalonia"

>No hierarchy whatsoever.
More like the abolition of the state because as long as the state exists, there will be no liberty. When there is liberty, there will be no state.

>Yes it does, but for the reasons I explained, not the ones you have in mind.
They have a common goal which is to eradicate the Bourgeois class. Communist want to replace it by a worker class, Anarchist want the abolition of the dirigeant class but Marxism is not a statism. On the contrary, it aims at the decline of the state with a phase of transition which is the dictatorship of the proletariat. (same goal not the same methods)

>>139345052
>wageslavery in service of a CEO
You are completely omitting the people who you are actually providing with the fruit of your labor.
I take it you believe these people could still have all those things if you worked less and your company had no direction, no market knowledge, no research and no optimization?

>>139345464

ancom is like, you though regular communism was retarded for thinking the government would create a utopia? Well we can beat that! We are so retarded we think a utopia will magically appear once you destroy the current government!

>>139345556
>muh revolutionary catalonia
top kek, that place was an utter shitshow. Enjoy your "labor coupons" which totally aren't just money :^)