Why don't commies simply start non-capitalist communes?

>>138601490
>following your convictions
>leftists
pay more attention you dolt

>>138601490
>expecting liberals to get anything productive done

>>138601490
Because communism is incompatible with capitalism there needs to be transactionary period form capitalism to socialism to communism in order for it to work.

File: 1490478844419.jpg (2KB, 122x125px) Image search: [Google]

2KB, 122x125px

>>138601490
>leftist actually taking action to do anything at all

>>138601765
>gives you perfect solution
>b-but my u-utopia

>>138601765
>Because communism is incompatible with capitalism
Why?

What would stop a commune from living the commie life in a capitalist society?
Taxes? (lmao)

>>138601844
Due to the nature of communist society, there cannot be dual power between any governments,corporations or markets.
>>138601839
It might be solution for non-Marxist communists, but not for us.

>>138602107
Why would there be dual power, governments, corporations, or markets within the commune?

>>138602184
It is not about within but without. Commune would still be effected by outside forces, via taxes, social interaction or limits on ownership and goods.

>>138602272
So communism can only work if the entire world is communist?

>>138602411
The entire planet would be enough, ideally we could shoot all the communists to Mars.

>>138601490

Dude, the whole thing about modern commies is that they're too lazy to do ANYTHING. Start
a community? They still live with mumzie and dadders. This is perfect for those who wish to
use communism to control everyone -- no worthwhile human bean would ever go for it.

>>138602272
possibly create your own means of production? spread the idea of small communes across the country so you can trade with them or something

>>138602272
>It is not about within but without.

...food, ambition and self-respect.

>>138601490
they do all the time and they fail every time.

Becuase cummunism is non-functional and retarded.
They are already in a superior system as well so why would they fuck themselves over like that

>>138602755
There would still be people oppressed by capitalism, only solution still would be a violent overthrow of the government.

File: shhhhhh.jpg (18KB, 222x241px) Image search: [Google]

18KB, 222x241px

>>138602865
I know.

>>138602895
>"superior" system

>Planned obsolescence
>production based on market cycles and not material needs
>ineffective usage of resources and labor

>>138602958
what about overrthrow of local government?

>>138603039

>all the shit that would get a company btfo'd, unless it's propped up by government -- aka socialism.

So basically our communist friend here is stating that communism doesn't work. Got it.

>>138601490
Part of communist indoctrination include the belief that the current system needs to be destroyed. This should be a red flag to critical thinkers but commies prefer to let other do the thinking for them.

>>138603039
>capitalism not being superior
>even marx had to admit its effeciency
>capitalism still hasn't collapsed

>>138603039
>>Planned obsolescence
Market preference.
Also, better than planned famine.

>production based on market cycles and not material needs
Nobody "needs" anything other than food and shelter.

>>ineffective usage of resources and labor
Hilarious coming from a communist.

File: maxresdefault-2.jpg (115KB, 1280x720px) Image search: [Google]

115KB, 1280x720px

>>138601490
How would we distribute all of the rich people's stuff then??

>>138601490
Because those interested in communism have zero productive capacity. They're interested in communism in the first place because it allows them to steal the efforts of others.

>>138601490
>Under capitalism, they're perfectly free to do so. No need to enforce their will upon others.

Socialism in a nation was bullshit; socialism in a commune is a joke. Communism needs global adoption or nothing.

>Moreover, pretty much the only intervention they'd encounter from the capitalist state would be taxation, which is a staple ingredient of socialism/communism to begin with.

There is no "taxation" in communist countries. There is no equivalent of the IRS. Taxation happens in capitalist countries.

>>138603380
>Communism needs global adoption or nothing.
I really hope you're not saying this as an argument in favor of communism.

>>138603380

>ocialism in a nation was bullshit; socialism in a commune is a joke. Communism needs global adoption or nothing.

So your ideology cannot even work on a small scale. Yet you magically want to make it global. You are truly an idiot.

File: Julius.png (150KB, 248x270px) Image search: [Google]

150KB, 248x270px

>>138603039
>production based on market cycles and not material needs

Cummies once again prove that they dont understand supply and demand

>ineffective usage of resources and labor

We are so efficient we can afford to put resources and labor into development rather than having to produce more food for the starving

>>138603380
what is supposed to keep communist society afloat?

>>138603380
what is supposed to keep communist society afloat?

>>138601490
it is the power over others they seek.

>>138603583
Markets don`t function on basis of material demand or supply, but supply of marketable goods and monetary supply.

>>138603380
Communism and socialism function best when population is around the Dunbar number. Once the group size exceeds the individual's immediate social network altruism leaves the equation.

Literally all productive output is taxed 100% in a true communist state.

>>138601490
They did in the 50s and 60s in America. None lasted more than a few years because they had trouble farming. Everyone had to work 15 hour days working the land just to survive. Most people said fuck this and left the group.

>>138603435
I am, though? Early marxism defended that communism would happen in a global scale. Later Lenin and Stalin developed the concept of "socialism in one country".

If the idea of global communism sounds utopian to you, consider that we live in a era with almost full global capitalist adoption; this would have sounded utopian a couple of centuries ago.

>>138603620
The economy? Socialism is not really that much different from capitalism, it is just a change on the ownership of the means of production. It is still supposed to produce things.

THey don't because niggers aren't capable of communes. So thanks to leftists and their mass immigration you can't start your precious communes.

So much for logic.

Don't believe me? Look up the r/K Selection theory. Niggers aren't capable of altruism or advanced organization.

>>138604110
>Communism needs global adoption or nothing
So communism is basically a supervillain trying to take over the world?

>>138603997
You opposed your own argument within one sentence.

>>138601490
>Why don't commies simply start non-capitalist communes
There are plenty of hippy communes around

>>138604299
You claim to know how basic economics work but yet fail to understand supply&demand.

>>138604438
No, you're a supply sider larping as a pinko.

>>138604438
A cummunist shouldn't lay claim to any kind of ecomonic understanding at all, since lack thereof is required to become a cummie in the first place.

>>138604110
>consider that we live in a era with almost full global capitalist adoption
Consider that capitalism actually works at any scale from small to international.

File: 1496204587158.jpg (5KB, 266x190px) Image search: [Google]

5KB, 266x190px

>>138601765
>Communism is only good if there's no competition

>>138602716

I just realize this is the perfect jew scheme.

All the goys Will work for them for "free".

Not quite the right time for Communism, considering that countries are no longer independent economically. Even North Korea relies heavily on fuel exports to keep its leader fat. As long as everyone can make profit aka get a job, Capitalism is here to stay.
But then came the machines

>>138605624
oh I cant wait for the machines
and the select few who will become the AI

>>138605189
Hasn't that been the point since the start? The ruling party will consist of Jews and everyone else will be the goyim cattle slaving away for the party.

>>138601490
>communists build commune
>they stop paying taxes because no money
>government kills everyone

>>138603039
You're a product of your mom with planned obsolescence

>>138603039
Free market (laissez faire) capitalism: A bottom up economic environment where any transaction must be voluntary in order to be legitimate. Scarcity creates demand, demand creates supply (due to entrepreneurs meeting the demand by creating companies using capital in order to produce the desired good). The less government intervention, the more the market populates with small businesses and thus supply. The businesses which provide the most customer satisfaction, produce the best quality goods and sells them at the lowest price succeed; those that don't, fail. Companies which harm or under pay their employees either change policy or go out of business due to losing employees and earning a bad reputation.

Though things aren't this way in reality, at least it makes sense and fucking works when implemented. It practically runs itself. With Communism, you have a centralised economy regulated by either the state (muh no true scotsman) or the labourer (muh stateless) which destroys incentive for productivity and profit (two major benefits of capitalism) along with all the bad things we know the USSR fucked up in terms of collectivised farming and food distribution blunders.

Need I say more?

>>138604637
kekd

>>138601490
It is not as easy, however, there are great numbers of well-functioning communes and industrial cooperatives, so your question is irrelevant.

There is absolutely no reason to back down from all other kinds of political action in advancement of communism.

This retarded question can be asked to every kind of people. For example, what does it prevent natsocs from buying up property and settling in at as an isolated racially pure town?

>>138609494
>there are great numbers of well-functioning communes and industrial cooperatives
So why don't commies to there?

Why must they try to convert everyone to their ideology?

>>138609494
>what does it prevent natsocs from buying up property and settling in at as an isolated racially pure town?
Lmao.

Protip: people of different races nearly always self-segregate by race or ethnicity whenever they have that choice.
Be it in churches, prison, or residential areas.

File: 1503189676220.jpg (29KB, 270x320px) Image search: [Google]

29KB, 270x320px

Just a daily reminder that any kind of Communist activities/organisations are outlawed.

>The Communist Party of the United States, or any successors of such party regardless of the assumed name, whose object or purpose is to overthrow the Government of the United States, or the government of any State, Territory, District, or possession thereof, or the government of any political subdivision therein by force and violence, are not entitled to any of the rights, privileges, and immunities attendant upon legal bodies created under the jurisdiction of the laws of the United States or any political subdivision thereof; and whatever rights, privileges, and immunities which have heretofore been granted to said party or any subsidiary organization by reason of the laws of the United States or any political subdivision thereof, are terminated: Provided, however, That nothing in this section shall be construed as amending the Internal Security Act of 1950, as amended [50 U.S.C. 781 et seq.]
(Aug. 24, 1954, ch. 886, §3, 68 Stat. 776.)


>https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/50/chapter-23/subchapter-IV

Your rights as a citizen WILL be stripped. You WILL be disappeared. You've been warned.

Go ask /leftypol/

>>138601490
Read up on how capitalism ruined the kibbutz communities in Israel, there's some great academic papers on how exactly it changed people's mindset and what gradually happened.

It doesn't work if you just try to LARP it inside a society that's against it in every aspect of being.

Actually, they tried to do that in the 60's to the 90's, all of them failed because all of them were drugged up hippies or the system developed into a hierarchical structure

>>138611301
Kibbutzim were never self-sufficient though. They were like miniature North Koreas in this respect: outwardly socialist/communist, but heavily reliant on the outside for many basic needs.

>>138611301
>It doesn't work if you just try to LARP it inside a society that's against it in every aspect of being.
Why the fuck not?

Also, nobody would be against your commune if you did your shit in peace without disturbing anyone else.
You could have your commune members spread out in a regular city, and nobody would actively mess with you for being a communist commune member any more than they would for being a scientologist or something..

>>138611872
>Why the fuck not?
Read this and see:

https://ecpr.eu/Filestore/PaperProposal/e38eaf49-4653-45b1-9a78-468dce758fb2.pdf

It's a very naive question btw, I doubt you don't understand how a vegetarian commune wouldn't work in a cannibal society for example. People still live in larger society, they can't be completely isolated anymore.

>>138612899
>how a vegetarian commune wouldn't work in a cannibal society
Cannibal society?
How does that analogy work?

Also, how "good" is your economic system if it cannot even survive within an extremely permissive system like modern western capitalism?

>>138601490
the question is, where? where is land that is not taken over by capitalism, if i could just walk out of my city and start, off grid or a commune, i would do so.

private properity and land owned by state, stands in the way everywhere you go.

>>138613335
Modern western capitalism is only "permissive" in such a way that it devours everything and integrates it into itself. If you participate, your values are irrevocably corrupted forever.

File: pottery.png (61KB, 584x521px) Image search: [Google]

61KB, 584x521px

>>138601490
>Why don't commies simply start non-capitalist communes?
For the same reason they don't start co-op companies that redistribute the firm's capital. There's absolutely nothing preventing them doing this yet they never do it - really makes me think.

>>138613579
>it devours everything and integrates it into itself. If you participate, your values are irrevocably corrupted forever.
Empty words. You are clearly led by your emotions.

>>138613464
>the question is, where? where is land that is not taken over by capitalism
You'd need to make an initial investment if you want land. Land is extremely cheap in many places.
You can buy entire deserted villages sometimes for the price of a small house.

>>138613999
>Empty words. You are clearly led by your emotions.
Read the link retard.

>>138614243
More empty words.

I already told you Kibbutz were never self-sufficient.
Also, a lot of the drive and motivation behind them came from nationalism and religion. Two elements that are ironically incompatible with communism.

>>138614518
>More empty words.
Read it.

>>138614703
I'm not about to read 29 pages on something that isn't even relevant to the discussion.

>>138614840
Then fuck off.

>>138614958
I accept your defeat.

>>138601490
/leftypol/ btfo
they will never recover from this

Look at what happened in the USSR, and is now happening in Venezuela and North Korea. If you don't participate in capitalism the way the rest of the world wants you too, your economy will be deliberately undermined and sabotaged.

The working class all over the world will wake up before communism becomes a stable, worldwide economic system.

>>138601490
In Brazil there was a religious-communist like city that was ravaged by the republic because they didn't pay taxes and were being so self-reliant that they could secede from the country

>>138615385
The USSR, North Korea, and Venezuela are all fucked because of their own internal problems.
"Hurr durr, we failed. Lets blame everyone else"
Communism in a nut shell.
If your economy can't be internally sustainable at a smaller size, then what makes you think it will be stable at an even larger scale?
If your system relies on globalism (which btw, makes the rich richer and the poor poorer) to fix "inequality" you're system is a literal contradiction.

>>138615385
>Venezuela
Communism can't even survive in an oil country.

>North Korea
Receives much of its food from capitalist states like the US.
Also, always had a pretty reliable partner in China. Its failings are obviously internal.

And at one point the USSR was very much on par with the US in military might, international standing and influence, etc.
And it failed horribly.

File: 451234123.jpg (75KB, 700x484px) Image search: [Google]

75KB, 700x484px

>>138601490
>Why don't commies simply start non-capitalist communes?
Because commies want to be commissars and force others to work. when they themselves do nothing in cushy position When they start voluntary communes these doesn't work people just leave them when commisaring starts.

File: sort yourself out.jpg (156KB, 576x770px) Image search: [Google]

156KB, 576x770px

>>138615385
As well as pic related, folks pushing communism are always from middle class backgrounds. They also don't give a shit about helping the """poor/working class"""; their focus is more on the ruination of the """rich/successful""". Jealousy is truly the ugliest affliction of all.

>>138601490
>Why don't commies simply start non-capitalist communes?

because they always end up killing themselves in 'revolutionary suicide'.

not even being sarcastic, look up jonestown.

>>138602107
Not for nothing but if youre any kind of left wing that isnt anarcho-syndicalism youre unbelievably stupid. Not that the anarchists are right either but at least they didnt watch their dumb idea fail repeatedly

>>138615725
>>138615780
>enact sanctions
>cause extreme famine
>deliberately cause the starvation of thousands of people so you can blame it on communism
>eventually dumb cheap grain and completely destroy local production by making people dependent on capitalist superpowers
>"hurr durr communism this proves communism could never work"

>>138603221
DELET

>>138601765
You're a fucking idiot cunt, the correct process is Capitalism to war to anarchy to 'not real' communism

>>138615849
How about some statistics on libertarian demographics, lol.

>>138615640

you mean like the amish? You literally described the amish.

File: alt-left terror.jpg (411KB, 1481x922px) Image search: [Google]

411KB, 1481x922px

>>138616247
By all means. Please post them.

>>138610269
You can buy land and run it as a commune you dumb fuck, theyve been around for most of american history they just usually collapse

>>138601490
Communism is only enjoyable for the hand full of upper echelon elite.
The people labor to provide protection and means for that elite to remain as is.
The rise to power and shift to communism comes as a social justice and equality movement. Ideals of utopia on earth. In the end you end up with a powerful elite that lives the life of luxury and everyone else supports that lifestyle for them under threat of the military boot. Forced by the state to produce without choice under the watchful eye of the state security apparatus. Anything against the interest of the party is suppressed by the systems in place to control the ideology and action of the population.
/communism
Basically everyone works their ass off by force so a select group can live luxurious lives protected from threat by the economic and military machine the general public support and maintain.

White people suck at collectives, will always be true, just let the asians figure it out if anyone can hivemind it its them

>>138616548
Sounds like a Jewish dream come true.

>>138615385

>USSR

Corrupt, inefficient, bureaucratic. It was dragged down by its own failed system. A leech that had to suck off the developments and wheat of the West to survive, all the while stuck in a purgatorial stagnation.

>North Korea

Kimmy participates in the economy, just not as much the surface economy. He sells a shit-ton of cooperatively produced meth and armaments to help keep his fief up.

>Venezuela

It failed because the gibs ran out, along with a lack of long-term investments and a shitty oil market. Chavez laid the seeds for its self-destruction by focusing on fridges instead of a development fund. Didn't stop him and his cronies from riding in hummers while the common people got shot up by thugs in the streets.

>>138616548
Where did you actually get this "information", do they teach this in American schools directly or just through other American media or what?

>>138601765
>be transactionary period form capitalism to socialism
This transitional period is spreading of communes and worker cooperatives which start to occupy larger portion of economy until they fill everything due to better effectiveness (no exploitation so workers flock to them). In theory this how peaceful transition to communism looks like.

In practice commies can't make anything only steal from others. Their "communism" always, ALWAYS included prohibition of leaving of their communes under death penalty, only then they can "work". Maeks you think.

File: commies1.png (71KB, 480x441px) Image search: [Google]

71KB, 480x441px

>>138616723

DingDingDIng we have a winner!

>>138616367
>More than two-thirds of libertarians are men
>More than 6-in-10 (62 percent) libertarians are under the age of 50, including one-quarter (25 percent) who are under the age of 30.
>Libertarians are actually in personality very much like liberals, not like conservatives.
> libertarians score by far the lowest on empathizing
>libertarians have much lower disgust sensitivity

So libertarians are autistic young men. Also enjoy getting fucked every year when you vote for conservatives who don't give a shit about your ideals.

>>138616798
Lolbertarians always think they are economic geniuses because they took an introductory class on microeconomics. In reality, they all are idiots who can't even discern cause from effect.

>>138601765
thats only under pure Marxist thought. Anarcho-communists don't believe in that.

File: 12353453.jpg (59KB, 688x456px) Image search: [Google]

59KB, 688x456px

>>138616548
>Communism is only enjoyable for the hand full of upper echelon elite.
It was not even really enjoyable for upper echelon elite. This is why USSR eventually collapsed. It literary satisfied no one. If elites are satisfied oppressed serfs alone can't bring change in the totalitarian society.

>>138601765
>Because communism is incompatible with capitalism there needs to be transactionary period form capitalism to socialism to communism in order for it to work.
There is literally no reasoning here, you just made gargantuan claim with no justification or any form of even outlining a hint of an argument. Why is all leftist literature like this? "If we do not heavily regulate the car industry, all paths will become highways", "by paying taxes I buy civilization for the common man", "talent does not really exist", "gender roles have no biological basis"

>>138603039
>Planned obsolescence
this is a meme

File: real alt-leftism has never been tried.png (132KB, 640x360px) Image search: [Google]

132KB, 640x360px

>>138617022
>Wtf I'm a #RedRocket now!
Was this really the best you could do?

>>138616877
Brobably brainwashed by anti communist brobaganda :-DDD fug

>>138601765
so what you're saying is that you fear capitalism will rob you of your servant class minions when they realize they can just go get a job and earn money without having to suck off some goblin looking faggot,
we all know its you jake stratton, you lump of shit

File: 1503260337805.jpg (31KB, 426x604px) Image search: [Google]

31KB, 426x604px

>>138602958
fucking hell you people

File: libertarian.jpg (70KB, 960x720px) Image search: [Google]

70KB, 960x720px

>>138617728
Wtf I'm an autistic libertarian manchild now.

>>138609881
>people of different races nearly always self-segregate by race or ethnicity whenever they have that choice.
Ok then. So I guess we have always lived in a racially pure aryan paradise.

File: 1503244369062.jpg (164KB, 875x1199px) Image search: [Google]

164KB, 875x1199px

>>138618048

>>138601765
So basically you're saying you can't just fuck off and start your own commune because you need to steal shit from other people first. Communism doesn't produce anything so capitalism must be preceded by it and everyone must be forced into communism later on. Kill yourself you stupid sack of shit.

>>138609494
>For example, what does it prevent natsocs from buying up property and settling in at as an isolated racially pure town?
This is illegal unlike worker cooperatives.

because it only takes one shitty leader to fuck everything up.

>>138616248
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_of_Canudos
kinda
a prophet christian guy convinced people to help each other

File: IMG_6879.jpg (165KB, 1500x1000px) Image search: [Google]

165KB, 1500x1000px

>>138617022
>literally nothing wrong with any of the points he posted.

Post the stat on libertarian employment

>>138616877
No they don't teach that in schools nor have i seen it on the media.
All you have to do is look. Ive been around a long time anon. I know people who have lived it.
Imagine a world where you cant say if you are unsatisfied about government decisions or actions. Actions that affect you directly and people you care about cannot be protested. The media is an arm of the government and does not tell any story or push any opinion that is not state sanctioned.
In that system, groups like Antifa never have a chance to form much less march and protest city to city. They are rounded up, crushed, and sent away to be reeducated or forced labor. You cannot find out how they are doing, you cant protest the unjust treatment of them if you did know how they were being treated.
This is no some anti communist propaganda. It is the communist reality. These systems are put in place to protect it because without them, and with a free and open society the whole thing falls apart as people become very unhappy about how they are being treated, how hard their lives are. How they are chosen to suffer and do without while a small portion of the population never do without.
You have groups running around the world today, preaching communism having no idea what that really means in practice. Thinking it will be a great wonderful society and making up all manner of excuses for why it has thus far not worked from, capitalist conspiracy, to having never dominated the world entire.
Notice tho you dont hear any opposition from communist countries? Not because they are utopia. But the people are controlled and not allowed to voice such opinions much less have massive protests. Only in more or less free or wild countries can this happen.
So when you see people selling communism as the great social justice equalizer for all mankind remember that once it comes to power. You no longer have the power to change it back. The mechanisms of change are denied you.

>>138618372
Not only it is not illegal, it was attempted. It would be illegal to force the undesirables to move out from their homes; founding a new town or buying up all property in an existing one is totally legal.

Ex-commie country opinion:
Helicopters exist for a reason.

>>138602107
>Found a join stock company with your comrades
>Evenly distribute the profits with all workers

There you got your gommunism.

File: lolberals.png (444KB, 2000x1500px) Image search: [Google]

444KB, 2000x1500px

>>138618228
>>138618585
>implying you didn't become a libertarian because because you think cp is free speech

>>138618687
>founding a new town or buying up all property in an existing one is totally legal.
It would be illegal to deny access to that property basing decision on race.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_Housing_Act
In Russia it is illegal to even talk about such per 282 article.

>>138601490
Good points.
I think the truth about communism is it's about virtue signaling, weakness, jealousy, and insanity.

It's why they will need to all be rounded up one day.

>>138601490
>Why don't commies simply start non-capitalist communes?

they do, it's called the ghetto

everyone collects welfare and robs each other

>>138619270
Kek

File: dat-man-o-straw.jpg (99KB, 764x1003px) Image search: [Google]

99KB, 764x1003px

>>138618960
>alt-left strawmaning into CP
What is it with you guys and CP?

>>138618899
No, since its not moneyless society.
It would still function on basis of wage labor.

>>138602411
>Anarchists
The second every nation agrees to anarchism I'm rounding up an army, and that's that. It's fucking stupid. These people are so stupid they deserve to just be shot. I'm sick of having to engage with them, they just slow everything down.

>>138603366
Checked
And most people I know that espouse communist views are the same that either do nothing or have no ambition to do more than the do.

>>138619534
So you want to trade in hides or something?

>>138619708
No, I want labor vouchers/credit.

>>138601490
They want to brag the rest of us down

>>138619795
You may also want a CAT scan

File: communism doesn't work.jpg (36KB, 480x360px) Image search: [Google]

36KB, 480x360px

Communism never works it had been tried and tried again. Only cure for communism is death your friend Castro finally got it.

>>138619795
Ain't that the same as money bro.
You just change the name and way of paying.

>>138604031
Wow there is a term for the number of people in an individual social circle. I have been using this same argument without using the term Dunbar.

Sage this murderous Bolshevik nonsense.

Marx and Engels were a psy op.

Marx was a journalist shill working for banking elites.

Stop flooding 4chan with these goddamn commie swastikas.

>>138619641
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prisoner%27s_dilemma

>>138619948
Mental retardation is similar to communism anon, stop trying to reason with communists, shooting them in the head seems to fix it.

>>138618122
I was talking about when people have free choice. In places like Europe, multiculti is forcefully imposed by those few in power. And even there, the brown people self-segregate.

File: w_blessing_way-13-500-400-100.jpg (220KB, 500x338px) Image search: [Google]

220KB, 500x338px

>>138601490
http://www.twinoaks.org/

this one has been around since the 60's

there are noncoercive communists

noncoercive ones are a teeny tiny minority of commies, but they do exist

File: r selected.png (156KB, 557x650px) Image search: [Google]

156KB, 557x650px

>>138619795
Toppest of keks.
IDS NOD MUNEH, IDS VOUCHAZ

File: DHeybUbU0AAISFo.jpg large.jpg (265KB, 2048x1332px) Image search: [Google]

265KB, 2048x1332px

>>138601490
They have tried and failed many times so naturally it's everyone else's fault and wasn't true communism.

>>138616114
>>enact sanctions
You mean international trade sanctions?
Are you saying communist nations cannot be self-sufficient and have to rely on trade (i.e. capitalism)?

>>138619948
No, it hold different functions like it can be only used by one person and it holds expiration date(this helps in tracking of consumption and directing production according to realistic needs).

>>138619948
You can't change value of money. Voucher labor credit you can change arbitrary to inflate value of your commissars "hard labor value "
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1X5Ar3wrSY4

>>138620303
Contaminated

>>138620141
Looks like a bunch of bulldykes and shemales desu, more proof that communism is degenerate and against human nature. Tuna salad day must be a blast there.

>>138620161
It is functionally different. It can be used to direct production according to larger needs and effectively measure up realistic consumption on individual level in society.

>>138620303
like a credit card?

>>138601490
Because they always fail.....

But they do exist. You can go and join a commune. There are plenty around.

>>138620486
Why not just go to south korea and defect across the border?
I hear they cities that are just empty waiting for you.

>>138601490
It's not about communism. That's just the excuse to steal shit.

>>138620390
Yes you can, especially since FIAT currency is not tied to rare metals or anything, it is what the government and the central banks dictate.

File: 1503349637928.jpg (3KB, 125x125px) Image search: [Google]

3KB, 125x125px

>>138620486
You mean like the USSR had under state capitalism... so you want state capitalism, not communism.

It only works when you have other people's resources to steal.

>>138602584
Roll for this.

File: 0329_GroupZK-1316-550-450-100.jpg (252KB, 541x450px) Image search: [Google]

252KB, 541x450px

>>138620459
here is a group picture

>>138620520
Yes, expect it would be tied to your personal labor.

>>138620660
North Korea stopped been communist long time ago, now they are facist.

>>138620846
like a debit card.

The communes don't fail, it's just that those who claim to be communist aren't at all

>>138601765
no you need to steal all the industry created through capitalism to have some sort of support for your means of production. communism on it own cannot create means of production only a free market can do that. but commies are stupid and think that whatever level the industry is at will somehow simply be enough to handle free shit for everybody.

>>138620776
USSR did not use labor vouchers but normal fiat currency aka- rubbles.

>>138602958
Give them an inch...

>>138620853
I would just like to see the anon go there.

>>138620486
Production is useless when your crap is bought with fiat currency that is returned to the state and the state redistribute to workers who are state employed to fuel consumption, right after communism is completely installed it begins a death spiral because it is a closed circuit, faggot.

>>138620938
I`m quite sure that Nazies would have won if Stalin were unable to industrialize the soviets.

>>138620846
Kinda like how labor is valued in a certain numeric value of exchange based upon how much people value that labor in society (lets just call this mythical unit "dollars"). So, you just want to get rid of central banks and go back to gold based currency like almost all US right-wingers want.

>>138620141
Great! So let's point this out to all the commies out there. Show them they CAN live according to their convictions without imposing them on others.

>>138620913
like a debit card but except if you dont spend all the "money" on it it get taken/deleted off the card

>>138620303
>according to realistic needs
And what are those?
I still want some cool stuff you know like a sporty car or a small plane.

>>138621068
Those who fail to meet their duties would face punishment in format of devaluing their labor vouchers.

>>138620755
Well this is problem (such a pity based Friedman solution didn't get traction), good thing international currency trade exits and you can leave currency which changes you don't like so in the end free market of currencies solves this. But you can't leave commie vouchers/rubles. Penalty is DEATH. As usual with commies.

>>138621095
I'm quite sure there is no hope for you anon.

Good luck with your future endeavors

>>138616907
>Their "communism" always, ALWAYS included prohibition of leaving of their communes under death penalty
Sorry that your parents lived in the shittiest possible "communism" but please don't make idiotic blanket statements.

>>138621042
Already happened:
https://unvis.it/newsweek.com/otto-warmbier-dies-north-korea-hostage-627402

>>138601765

>power based oligarchy instead of capitalism

Sure this will work this time. This is the true form of communism!

I give it a month until the fails and excuses.

>>138621288
so no one has savings?

>>138601490
Because the capitalist landlord class own all the available land. There is no place to start such communes. Getting a mortgage to buy land and paying interest to bankers would just be recreating the conditions of capitalist exclusion and exploitation.

>>138618588
>I know people who have lived it.
You're talking to one right now, and I can vouch that you're full of shit.

>>138621324
Sounds like serfdom ironically.

File: w_shade_makerope-395-550-450-100.jpg (149KB, 356x450px) Image search: [Google]

149KB, 356x450px

>>138621216
not so fast there, they don't force anyone to join

but they do force out the slackers

most commies would open up a can of revolution for that and burn the place down

>>138602958
Then they can join your commune, no? Unless of course, god forbid, they prefer capitalism.
You wouldn't have to overthrow the government if workers actually liked your system

>>138621538
nobody has anything i guess, the vouchers are controlled by the elite and so is the food and everything else. anybody not in a uniform has nothing.

>>138601490
>Why don't commies simply start non-capitalist communes?
What is happening more is that people are starting worker cooperatives. However this doesn't change the nature of capitalism as a whole and the same problems are still there.

File: 534534.jpg (151KB, 700x433px) Image search: [Google]

151KB, 700x433px

>>138620964
>can't be freely traded for goods and currencies
>normal fiat currency
Tell me commie, do you know what is this pic?

>>138621779
this is just feudalism then. Is communism textbook serfdom?

>>138621564
Deserted villages come for sale all the time for peanuts.
There is tons of land out there that costs next to nothing.

You could set up an online fundraiser or something.
Personally, I'd GLADLY put up some money if it meant getting rid of commie shitheads.

Look at me coming up with solutions off the top of my head because - surprise surprise - commies are too lazy to see the abundance of opportunities.

>>138613835
>For the same reason they don't start co-op companies that redistribute the firm's capital.
See my previous post, this happens

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_worker_cooperatives#United_States

>>138603365
REMOV THIS

>>138621757
Due to propaganda and the feebel minds of the proletariat they do not know their best interests(yet). Thus we are morally and socially bound to liberate them even if they lack in class consciousness.
>>138621304
Feel free to build one on your own time without using communal resources or facilities and without disturbing the commune.

>>138621662
>they don't force anyone to join

Pretty sure you misread.

>>138621826
Credit union of some kind?

>>138621814
Well the workers have the means of production.
At least and no gubberment in your working quota.

Its perfect and everything is shared.

>>138621928
what the redscum anon seemed to be explaining is. you work for king and court and instead of begging for more food theres a system with a card that lets you beg for food.

>if any food because communism is notorious for no food

File: w_dumpsterdive-431-500-400-100.jpg (81KB, 300x400px) Image search: [Google]

81KB, 300x400px

Living the Communist dream

Dumpster dive. Some members find all kinds of great stuff in dumpsters, including good food, as well as copious junk food. For example, we often get dozens of loaves of Arnold bread in visits to a bread store. And there's the famous local bagel place that tosses hundreds of bagels made same day in one large nicely wrapped plastic bag.

>>138621814
how does a communist state refrain from "capitalist" (ie, wealth generating) practices? They still rely on industry, like we all do, and in order to produce this industry they must produce wealth, because producing wealth is by definition the aim of industry.

>>138601490
because that would involve trying and succeeding and leftists hate that they might actually succeed at something just like uncle ted said

>>138621564
But if labor is truly the source of all value than this should not be a problem at all.

Truth is, you want the extract accumulated value only private property itself can bring, while denying the merits of private property.

That is why commies are fucking dumb.

>>138618122
Step 1. White build a society that becomes the eenvy of the others.
Step 2. Others show up build small enclaves in white society.
Step 3. Othe live in other people groups and refuse to integrate. Continue old ways that enabled their shit hole existence prior to coming to white land.
Step 4. White move to new area. Go to step 1

>>138622144
I unironically agree. It needs to happen more. It tends to be less popular in the US than europe.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mondragon_Corporation

A worker cooperative in Spain with 70k workers

>>138601490
They do that here in America. We have co-ops and communes all over.

They are all extremely scummy and degenerate.

File: 41234234.jpg (224KB, 560x736px) Image search: [Google]

224KB, 560x736px

>>138622130
>another hint

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93tR96egox4

His short clip from a Hollywood movie sums it up better than I ever could.

>>138622047
I think I understood you

I was pointing out most commies would reject living this way.

Most communist think it has to include everyone.

>>138601490
>Why don't commies simply start non-capitalist communes?

that would require commies to actually believe in the shit they are saying, most of them just say it to virtue signal and seem intelligent and edgy but really they are just NEET fags that don't wanna work.

never met a commie that wasn't a raging faggot, I doubt any exist.

>>138621564
All commies could get together and not buy Starbucks for one day a week and use that money instead to buy land. The only problem is that leftist voted for land taxes to pay for social programs decades ago so you just got BTFO by your leftist ancestors (while our right-wingers ancestors warned your leftist ancestors about this very thing). TL;DR: Leftist create a system that they think is evil and then rebel against said system claiming it was a right-wing system all along. Right-wingers waned them not to create the system as it would be abused but they didn't listen and it was obviously all the fault of right-wingers that this system exist. Good job comrade! I'm sure every time your Marxist utopia fails it's always our fault too.

>>138622253
I got the idea he's flying by the seat of his pants here. I'm no longer interested in the moral side of the discussion, it goes nowhere (HOW MANY PEOPLE WERE KILLED BY X), but I really have a meager understanding on how communism is "supposed" to organize their economy, and why it's "supposed" to work. Because it tends to be explained by analogy, but the analogies make it sound like feudalism or civic slavery, but without a hierarchy?

>>138622538
The spacing thew me off, got ya.

>>138622472
Stop posting anti-communist propaganda putin bot.

>>138602584
>>138602411

>muh perfect utopia only works if eveyrone follows it

That's stupid as hell. Dumbest shit I'd heard in a while.

>>138622258
I don't know. I don't believe in 'communist states' (oxymoron) like you are describing. I'm not a marxist either. I think socialism needs to happen from the bottom up

>>138622660
thats because they want to steal the wealth and production of the working class

can't do that if the entire working class isn't forced to join their jewtopia at gun-point

>>138622660
Not everyone needs to follow, but they will once the social engineering will kick in.

File: 1503244862483.png (5KB, 247x234px) Image search: [Google]

5KB, 247x234px

>>138622654
>Stop posting anti-communist propaganda putin bot.
kek what a faggot

>>138601490
>commy-unes
because, like the original (((commies))) they are all talk, have no interest in being a "worker" beyond barista technology/associate professor jobs. Lenin never worked a job in his life, Stalin was a petty criminal/pick pocket. These lefties rely on the able bodied white race to survive. They are ideological parasites that destroy their host, and move on to next victim when host is too sick to suck off. See Soviets for proofs. In reality, they are no better than the over paid CEO's they cry about all the time, nor the Wall Street wolves.

>>138622718
communist territory would be a de facto communist state though. Especially if it requires eliminating the competition. What do you mean by "bottom up"? How do they enforce their vision if they are supposedly powerless?

WHAT WE HAD UNDER SOVIETS AND WHAT WE LOST

1. STYROFOAM WAS MADE OUT OF MILK, YOU COULD FEED KIDS ON IT.

2. GRAVITATION WAS 80% WEAKER, YOU COULD JUMP ON THE ROOF OF YOUR HOUSE WITH A RUNNING START.

3. PEOPLE LIVED 150-190 YEARS ON AVERAGE. THERE WERE NO DISEASES BUT SOLES FROM HARD WORK.

4. IF YOU STUMBLED ON THE STREET, PEOPLE RAN UP TO YOU, PUT MONEY IN YOUR POCKETS, KISSED YOU ON THE LIPS, OFFERED TO SHARE VODKA, BECOME RELEATIVES.

5. RABBITS AND WILD BIRDS JUMPED ON THE OVEN THEMSELVES. YOU BOUGHT BREAD AND GOT SOME MONEY FROM THE BAKERY. IT WAS SCARY TO APPROACH THE RIVER - THE FISH ATTACKED YOUR FISHING ROD.

6. GRANDPA TOLD ME PEOPLE WOKE UP AT NIGHT FROM HAPPY KIND LAUGHTER. EVERYONE WASHED WITH ICE COLD WATER TO BE HEALTHY.

7. PREGNANCY PERIOD WAS 4,5 MONTHS. ALL CHILDREN WERE BORN WEIGHING 12-15 KILOS, ALL NATURALLY BLOND AND WITH BLUE EYES AND STRONG WILLFUL FACES - THEY ASKED TO GET TO THE FACTORY AS SOON AS THEY GOT OUT OF THE WOMB.

8. VOLGA WATER WAS AS SWEET AS MEAD AND YENISEY WAS FLOWING DARK BEER.

9. IT WAS -300C IN WINTER, EVERYONE WAS RUDDY.

10. BERRIES WERE AS LARGE AS A CAT, CATS WERE THE SIZE OF THE DOG, DOGS WERE AS LARGE AS COWS, COWS LOOMED OVER FACTORY BUILDINGS, INSIDE THE FACTORIES WORKERS PLAYED CHESS USING BOTVINNIK'S METHOD - CHECK AND MATE IN ONE TURN!

SUCH WAS LIFE IN THE USSR UNTIL LIBERALS BETRAYED IT.

>>138622792
>Not everyone needs to follow,
Apparently everyone does for it to actually work.
Why else do commies always blame all communist failures on outside influence?

>>138622563
im not quite sure how communism is really supposed to work either. the USSR spent everything it had on building nukes. Venezuela has the biggest oil deposits on earth and still cant get reliable food packages to the few in society that are registered with the party. communism seems to just be a way to keep those at the top warm and full

>>138622302
Finally a commie with more than 2 brain cells.

>>138622302
KILL YOURSELF REFORMIST,REVISIONIST SCUM.

>>138623069
top kek

>>138623055
>What do you mean by "bottom up"? How do they enforce their vision if they are supposedly powerless?
Democracy at work. We need to move into a system where businesses are worker owned as worker cooperatives. This will still be within a capitalist system of course but it is progress. Then as time progresses we can move into real socialism.
>>138623335
NO

File: 451234123.jpg (1MB, 520x5568px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 520x5568px

>>138622654

>>138623181
Sometimes it sounds like they're simply suggesting an anti-monopoly structure, so no conglomerate corporations like Disney, Walmart, etc. But they always trip up on when discussing which arbitrary body is supposed to enforce everything since one of the main tenets of communism is anti-hierarchy. How do they get loans, are there loans? What about retribution, interest, property values, new technologies, banking, investing, taxes, R&D, or credit-ratings?

>>138623403
how do you enforce a stand-down of power?

>>138623069
Legendary pasta. Now in English.

>>138621603
i guess they just moved here and lie about their childhood and teen years

must be conspiracy

>>138601490
Lots of communes happened. They ended up gradually not being Communist anymore.

>>138603039
>material needs
Stopped reading there. Who are you to define what other people (((need)))? It's about what people want.

>>138623181
Well when when the oil price was still 120 dollars a barrel.
It literally printed money for the government to invest in social programs of gibs me dat.

While they should have invested in new industries or in subsidies for new businesses.
So they are less reliant on oil like Denmark an Saudi Arabia does

>>138623069
hmmmmmm
Fresh
2ch dot hk/po/res/24177770.html

File: solidarity.jpg (21KB, 600x248px) Image search: [Google]

21KB, 600x248px

>>138623725
Isn't going to be easy, no. By convincing average workers that a cooperative democratic system at work is better for them than the current system. The capitalists in charge will of course try all they can to pump out propaganda but we can lead by example, hopefully. It would be a long process but there is no other choice, revolution just doesn't work.

because only rural retards and useless city people believe in communism, so they have to force everyone else for it to work

>>138624106
I mean Norway.

How to create a communist business in a capitalist society:
Workers own the fruits of their labor.
It's literally that fucking simple. For example if you were working in a widget factory the workers purchase the materials ( in the context of the existing capitalist society, they might purchase the resource material from the official business owner ), then they use the "employee owned" capital to create the widget. The widget is theirs, and the "employee" is free to sell the widgets they created for any price they want. in order to sustain the factory the "employees" pay a "tax" for business costs that the external capitalist society is forcing upon them.

Why communists think you need to change the entire government to accomplish this is weird.

>>138623829
>i guess they just moved here and lie about their childhood and teen years
People who betrayed their country aren't very trustworthy in general, if you haven't realized by now.

>>138623669
since the ussr the commies havent mad any technological advancements they rely on what is already there and then focus on food production and upkeep on what tech they have. communism sounds good and feels good on the internet im sure to these people but communism always needs a central head. because without it people start to trade and save and gain more than the common person and then things start getting capitalistic and i guess thats what they need the iron fisted government for.

>>138624304
you have no idea do you. Democracy requires parties, parties require leaders, leaders consolidate power because that's their job. At any point people could decide you're wrong and vote differently. What kind of nonsense are you even suggesting? At this point it just sounds like you want what we have now, but somehow *not* corrupt.

>>138623181
> communism seems to just be a way to keep those at the top warm and full

Thats where it always goes. It starts out with idealistic people who mean well and ends in an entrenched ruling elite existing on the backs of the masses under the guise of, "FOR THE MOTHERLAND" horseshit

>>138624106
so if they had invested in anything but social programs for the lazy they would be ok?

>>138624769
Yea its best to just stay under the boot of your masters.

>>138624752
In your example they are still working within a capitalist system, they still have to deal with the market and problems inherent to capitalism but it is a step in the right direction
>>138624846
>At any point people could decide you're wrong and vote differently.
Well yeah, what is your point?
>What kind of nonsense are you even suggesting?
What already exists but on a larger scale
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Co-operative_Alliance

File: 9768978.jpg (104KB, 560x676px) Image search: [Google]

104KB, 560x676px

> hey guys follow me! we can live in paradise! mommy even said so!

>>138625028
Vote for who? A party appointed candidate?
Now thats change you can believe in.

>>138624785
It's funny because sometimes they just glean the surface of Natsoc with the voucher system, but then don't develop it any further. Marx designed it that way to keep people from pointing the fingers at the banks and have them point it at the corporations (whom get their loans from the banks!).

>>138624994
They wouldn't have had a crisis this big, at least.

>>138624898
than why do these redscum traitors feel as if communism will work in the country that tried to eliminate it?

>>138625177
>Vote for who? A party appointed candidate?
What do you mean? I am talking about within the workplace, not political parties

>>138620834
Looks like a bronycon but with more women.

>>138602584
>Ideally we could shoot all the communists.
Ftfy

File: hqdefault.jpg (17KB, 480x360px) Image search: [Google]

17KB, 480x360px

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A2jS0J86d5U

File: ICA.jpg (106KB, 1205x572px) Image search: [Google]

106KB, 1205x572px

>>138625028
Ahah, no way. Check out pic related. Co-ops sound similar to guilds though. They're not necessarily bad, but they don't necessarily have the financial power to compete. Private farms>communal farms.

>>138625219
its almost like marx was in kahoots with the banks.

File: jtuyuy.jpg (93KB, 750x733px) Image search: [Google]

93KB, 750x733px

>>138601765
lkmao, you pathetic piece of shit

>>138625305
detachment from reality? I have no idea really.

>>138602584
Truly the red planet.

>>138625872
> but they don't necessarily have the financial power to compete
Sure they do and they are growing. Have another example from the UK

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suma_(co-operative)

>Despite its trading volume, it is notable for being Britain's largest collectively organised co-operative, in that it avoids hierarchy and practices equal pay and job rotation despite having 160 employee owners.

Heres the fundamental problem and it seems to be common with Americans in particular. When you hear the words socialism or communism your minds immediately jump to violent revolution and marxism. That isn't the only way

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reformism

File: lmao.png (29KB, 500x500px) Image search: [Google]

29KB, 500x500px

>>138626153

>>138626226
>because then it's not communism you dolt

co-ops that grow and compete with private institutions are not capitalist? Evening out shareholders doesn't change anything except business direction.

File: andrew-jackson-money.jpg (115KB, 736x892px) Image search: [Google]

115KB, 736x892px

If you understood economics you would know USA already IS a communist country.

>>138626441
I already said they were capitalist, the point is to change within the capitalist system and these are a good starting point

>>138622028
>I know what you want better than you because you're dumb, so it's my duty to change everything in your life
hahaaa hahaha can't believe anyone has ever been convinced by that, how did you become communist?

>>138613464
You really have no idea what you are talking about. Tons of expansive private property is for sale in "less desirable" lower demand areas slightly outside urban centers, for reasonable prices. A handful of motivated people, or even a single person, would be able to acquire land for a commune if they actually were willing to work for it.

>>138626489
Given that they have food, I doubt.
We did not have food throughout most of the year, only around the commie holidays in May and September. The rest of the time we had what was known as "edibles", aka barely food, but has nutrition value.

>>138626579
so you're not communist?

>>138604370
And they usually depend on living like a permanent camp site and/or like gypsies, dealing in illicit substances/services and theft/fraud/scams.

>>138626653
This. You can start a commune for under 10k total.

>>138626665
I am, although a lot of marxists don't like my point of view. Again the problem is that you seem to be equating socialism/communism with marxism and revolutionary socialism. It happens a lot on here

>>138626226
I hear that no matter how hard i work i am not in control of my own destiny. I loose the freedom to think and speak freely and peruse my own dreams.
To have a government system standing over me at all times coercing my conformity.
Knowing that any child I have would be the property of the state.

>>138626896
Real communism is not even theoretically possible in a non post-scarcity type 1 civilisation.

>>138626966
So literally modern western capitalism then?

>>138626441
>Evening out shareholders doesn't change anything
This seizes means of production. Like literally corner stone of communism.

>>138602584
And this, folks, is why all communists need to be killed. They admit it themselves: they will never leave us alone. They are always the aggressor.

>>138626784
>If you give capitalists money, they will allow you to create a socialist society

How about no?

>>138609494
It's illegal to keep people out based on race.

I actually feel sorry for commies. It's fucking sad. Each and every one I've met has either been a mental case, nu-male pseudo-intellectual or just a lazy no-lifer. I wish they would get on with their life. Waste of a potentially good life.

>>138626896
No, you see the problem is that so far you suggested that co-ops are good, there should be more of them, but they are operating within a "capitalist" system. What is the large reform that you are aiming for beyond that? You mention achieving it through democratic means, but WHAT are you suggesting we change specifically in the economy to make the market more communist? If you even start to suggest border elimination, dismantling of state, or the like, you're the revolutionary that you are suggesting you totally aren't. But I won't put those words in your mouth, I just want to know what you're getting at

>>138627203
>supports impossible infinite growth economic model (aka world cancer)

>wah wah, """they""" won't leave us alone!

Pick one

>>138627096
I can go do whatever I want. I can choose to study, I can choose to work in a peticular field. I can farm grapes or dig ditches. I can be an airline pilot or a cab drive. It is only limited by how hard I am willing to work and my own imagination. Difficulty may vary but anything is possible and the choice is my own. So to answer your question, No.

>>138627232
Then have fun seizing the means of production by using those guns you despise. If you want to create something, work for it. Money is the currency of "value". You exchange your value for theirs, be it land or construction materials. Not even in communism would you have a system with no currency to signify contribution.

File: G2uErReJGxE.jpg (53KB, 487x560px) Image search: [Google]

53KB, 487x560px

>>138601490
Cuz it would look like a beggars meeting. Communism is based on stealing from those who work & earns anything and distributing between other scum. How do u think at list one sane employee would join to that communes for they just do nothing but take his money? Idts. So eventually that bummers will just starve to death, ur plan is failed.

>>138627118
No, because it's localized. They aren't owned by the communist state, they're just owned by the steel workers, doctors, etc. There's no over-arching system that connects them altogether, so they can capitalize against each other. Communists suggest spreading shareholding outside of the people who are involved in the work, otherwise we just have industrial tribes, ie guilds

>>138627390
Anti-communism doesn't mean I support jewish fiat-currency. You're either paid to be posting here or you have fallen for dichotomy schemes. Get your head out of your ass.

>>138627447
You can do the exact same things in communism, except some of them are actually tax funded, what are you on about?

>>138627232
If you don't do it, you'll be giving capitalists a lot more money for the rest of your life.

>>138609494
What is 'US history from 1650-present', with emphasis on 1930-1985.

It's literally in our news daily.

White people aren't allowed to get away with this anywhere.

See: south africa, austrailia, canada, new zealand, south africa, europe, etc

>>138610269
>overthrow the Government of the United States, or the government of any State, Territory, District, or possession thereof, or the government of any political subdivision therein by force and violence
That is not what is being proposed though.

>>138627582
Lol yeah this is called a homeless camp/shanty town. These already exist.

>>138627203
The funny thing is that unlimited mass migration of poor people from third world countries to more developed nations and consequently racial tension, only happens under cucktalism. There would be no such problems under a Communist system.

>>138627385
The end goals are the same, yes. Different methods to achieve it. No it does not make me a revolutionary. Read up on the differences between reformism and revolutionary socialism, its an old debate.

>>138627901
Okay. I'm now fully convinced you're just baiting. Ya blew it.

>>138627901
lol it's always so shit people are trying to gtfo, no wonder there's no immigration

>>138627901
This much is true, we used to shoot those and get medals for it.

>>138601578
>implying leftists will actually start anything

>>138627653
So if everyone in the country wants to be doctors thats allowed huh?

>>138627617
No they are seized. Read Das Capital FFS. Act of exploitation happens when capitalists buys labor. Here workers buy labor from themselves. There is no capitalist. Capitalist BTFO.

>>138614958
>cant formulate own argument
>links 29 page essay
Commies every fucking time.

>>138619795
>labor theory of value

Value is based on the consumer's desires, not the producer.

>>138627942
Okay I will, but I don't understand how propose wearing down power-blocs (and borders especially) with votes. Something like this requires tandem efforts by multiple governments at once. But if co-ops replace EVERYTHING, isn't their parent organization then a monopoly? If it's all localized, then it's just balkanization since the governments will split to represent their locale. Money doesn't cause this, money is only keeping a large amount of a territory able to trade wealth with each other in an abstract mindspace. You are saying you're not revolutionary because you aren't suggesting violence, but you're suggesting changes that would require violence to settle.

>>138628392
>So if everyone in the country wants to be doctors thats allowed huh?
Is it allowed in capitalism? Universities have admission quotas which are adjusted depending on the demand. Or is this not the case in America? It is in all of Europe. Can you force a university to accept you over capacity in America?

>>138627901
Soviet Russia is pretty multicultural.
And you could move anywhere in the Union.
Even the Mongols.

>>138628409
I'm not suggesting it's a good idea, I'm trying to articulate what the commie is proposing. There is no such thing as a worker buying labour for himself anyway. It makes no sense whatsoever.

File: 12353453.jpg (135KB, 1024x739px) Image search: [Google]

135KB, 1024x739px

>>138627901
>There would be no such problems under a Communist system.
>He doesn't know about including of entire third world countries into USSR.

BTW according to commie theory they should promote free migration of workers into commie counties (Workers of the world, unite! bla-bla-bla). Of course here real politics corrects """theories""". Commie counties end to have even more racial tension between each other than capitalists lol.

>>138628994
>There is no such thing as a worker buying labour for himself anyway.
This is worded in capitalists terms. In commie terms workers are communally self-employed.

>>138628812
didn't you need permission to even leave your city back then?

>>138627901
communism is supposed to be borderless

the immigration would be astronomical initially, and in the end everyone would end up brown and equally poor

>>138629185
this is isolation then. Even contractors sell labour which is eventually bought.

>>138629232
Yes i think so but if you where a good Tovarish it wasn't a problem.
Lots of Ukrainians and Asians from Mongolia and siberia went to Moscow.

>>138629232
It is still that way in China

>>138629406
Well if commune would be selling LABOR not PRODUCT they would be exploited by buyer of labor. Sell product.

>>138629371
If everyone is equal what is the point of moving from your country/region/town where your ties lay?

>>138629232
You needed it in capitalist pre-Soviet Russia too. Unless you were rich of course.

>>138629829
Are you assuming all areas would be magically equal at the time of implementation of communism?

>>138629232
>didn't you need permission to even leave your city back then?
Permission was required for entering point of destination. And you needed internal passport to buy tickets. Rural workers didn't have passports by default haha, peasant scum BTFO by based proletariat.

>>138629571
They probably went there for studying purposes

>>138618048
>posts a young man, at a public convention, doing literally nothing wrong
>this is somehow an insult

>>138630051
Go to Moscow once.
Lots of them where there a few generations.

>>138601490
What you are describing is a church. Commies don't church.