Do american citizens really need a drivers license? What about

>>135632665
This is why I can't take lolbertarians seriously

>>135632665
You can travel on foot or by bike without a license. Oh wait, you're a faghot who hides his own flag while insulting other people's flag. Don't reply me to faggot.

>>135632665
Technically, in alot of places, you do not need a license. You only require a license when traveling for certain purposes/with certain cargo. Good luck trying to explain this to police though. The sign is actually correct.

>>135632665
There is actually an interesting history to the driver's license in the US. There were actually court rulings that stipulated the right to travel as an unenumerated right, allowing laws requiring commercial driver's licensing, but overturning laws that required driver's licenses for non commercial transport.

Eventually the courts settled the matter like it always does, by ignoring the 9th Ammendment and pretending that the only protected rights that we have are those stipulated in the Bill of Rights.

>>135634498
upvoted for the 9th

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>want to drive without license
>still want to use public roads

>>135632665
>>135632665
only central americans do not need a drivers license in the US

>>135632665
>This dumb shit
If you want to drive on your own property you dont need a liscense. If you are on a public road (99+% of roads in the US) you need a liscense. The "Right to Travel" is a thing but it doesnt shield you from operating motor vehicles without an appropriate liscense. The only good these armchair lawyers have done is create hours of entertainment from their autistic AM I BEING DETAINED videos when they try to put their legal expertise into action

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>>135635928
This.

You have every right to travel, but driving a car on public streets is a privilege.

>>135635304
100% this.

Literally the definition of entitlement.

"I want to contribute nothing to the system but abuse it as I please."

Nope. Not going to happen leech.

>>135635928
>The only good these armchair lawyers have done is create hours of entertainment from their autistic AM I BEING DETAINED videos when they try to put their legal expertise into action
Let us begin.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCozh_vbYdM

>>135632665
You have a right to travel, you DON'T have the right to operate a multi-tonne device capable of killing many people while doing so.

>>135632665
It's true you don't need a drivers license in america. You only need one to drive on public roads

>>135632665
intredasting

how do you tell if this is true?

>>135637065
nice well poisining jew bootlicker

>>135632665

there's enough idiots on the road. I don't know who the hell would ever support removing drivers licenses.

>>135637608
Go get pulled over and refuse to show documents to the officer. Don't worry if he arrests you, you'll win in court

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>>135637065

>c-call the police
>sir we are the police

e v e r y t i m e

>>135635928
>public road

>>135637778
thanks bro!

>>135637608

You would look up the court case cited at the bottom and find...

Judicial branch activism that benefits and is tailored for progressives and the illegal-immigrants they are trying to appease and legitimize for the sole purpose of a larger voter base.

The voter base in question follows the money as their lines of work are commonly employed by wealthier Americans, i.e. these future democratic voters are distributing themselves among areas of conservatives to help reduce the effectiveness of the electoral college.

More to the point, Americans are not restricted from traveling throughout America; this said, a right to travel says nothing about the means in which they travel. The means they can travel unrestricted is decided by the laws set forth governing different modes of travel, i.e. walking, driving, flying etc.

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>>135632665
I'M NOT DRIVING, I'M TRAVELLING

>>135637608
>>135637659
Are you 15?

>>135635402
kek

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AM I BEING DETAINED?

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>>135638257
the point is, is there a requirement to travel by car if not for commercial purposes?

>>135638451
are you a newfag?

>>135638827
>Travel by car
vs
>Driving a car
Do you see a difference?

>>135632665
The right to travel existed before cars, when two horses bumping into each other didn't result in people being maimed. I'm glad we're required to have licenses, plenty of drives with licenses are bad enough, they're already setting the bar pretty low. No need to set it lower IMO

>>135638827

There is not.

>>135639009
that depends on the legal definition of "driving" and "travelling"

some people claim "driving" is defined in legal dictionaries as "travelling for commercial reasons", i.e. driving a bus or a truck

>>135637065
>asking the officer to take his glasses off
Jesus Christ, they'll just make up anything

>>135632665
My sister clerks for the 13th district. The have a motto: "the law is what the courts say"

The courts represent the law. No judge in the entire nation is going to accept a legal argument based on the articles of confederation.

>>135639479
>Legal definition of
Gonna stop you there and ask you to pull out your drivers liscense and tell me what class you have. Then look up what the wording is for that class. If you dont understand basic legal definitions you are going to want to stop arguing that what you are doing is legal because of nuance in legal definitions.

>>135639845
>The have a motto: "the law is what the courts say"
well that's a surprise

in other words "fuck you, pay me, I am the law"

We are still free to travel within our country without a drivers license though. We are just not supposed to use a car without one.

>>135639845

No but in many cases they can render verdicts based on extremely liberal interpretations of the constitution that most times won't be challenged by the state prosecutor in an appellate court.

>>135640020
Get used to it bud

>>135632665
I run into these assholes every once in a while at our local gun range in the forest. If you ever wondered what group of people us white southern gun nuts look at as a bunch of wack-jobs these are it.

>>135639990
what relevence is my class of licence? why would I need a licence to ask about legal definitions?

>>135632665
you can drive on your own private property without a license

>>135635304
>>135636938
My license doesn't pay for the roads though.

>>135638052
>public road

Test your second amendment right on a public road and see if that works out differently

>>135632665
You can walk everywhere you want

MARITIME LAW.

WE ARE CONTROLLED. WAKE UP SHEEPLE.

>>135637065
STOP! STOP! I DO NOT CONSENT! I DO NOT CONSENT!

AAAARGH WHY MY ISN'T MY MAGIC FORMULA NOT WORKING? I DO NOT CONSENT TO BEING TASED IN MY BALLS!

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I've watched enough LIVE PD recently, like 97 fucking episodes to know that this is true. Every nigger they pull over never has a drivers license.

>>135632665
Right to travel is cool and all but if i drive without a license a government bureaucrat will fuck me over and if i shoot them i will likely end up dying in a shootout, its really not worth the overall trouble for something so irrelevant. Besides those faggot kids should be kept away from driving till they learn.

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>tfw too asocial to get license
HELP ME YOU FOOLS

>>135640168
oh, I am used to it. doesn't mean the freemen aren't correct about the courts bein gin the wrong though

>>135640174
you poor baby, nice job atempting to build a negative image of sovereign citizens though

>>135640336

Grow up.

>>135640174
Can confirm. These people are a special breed all their own.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpZBiN_w1os

>>135640133
True. I'm a non-lawyer pleb so I defaulted to judge. But it's not "law is what the judge says" but "law is what the courts say"

That encompasses jurors (did X violate the law) prosecutors (do we give enough of a fuck to see if X is in violation of law), appeals to other courts etc etc. again non lawyer pleb, just a motto they say, because a courts ultimate decision carries weight of law..

>>135640607
You literally walk in, talk to no one except the fat black lady behind the desk for a few seconds, fuck off and take a test, then let some black/Asian dude into your car and follow his directions. There is hardly any interactions

>>135640681
>atempting to build a negative image of sovereign citizens
Nigger these mongoloids build a negative image of themselves everytime they breathe.

>>135640336
It literally does. The funds for public roads typically come from license and registration fees for motor vehicles. Occaisionally additional funds can be petitioned from the federal government.

>>135640212
Because if you dont understand why someone operating a motor vehicle is different from someone riding in a motor vehicle then you likely are too stupid to have a license in the first place. These definitions are set in stone since they get challenged on a weekly basis by retards like yourself.

>>135640724
Grow up? A drivers license literally does not pay for the road. Car registration and the tax they slap onto your gas does.

>>135640492
more info?

>>135640510
it's not like they would use cointelpro to push the meme that these people are just stupid, is it?

what would happen if everyone knew how the law was being abused? can't have that goyim

>>135632665
>I don't need a license to fly a plane
>muh right to travel
Fat fucks probably think this is a good idea

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>>135632665
>citizens
lol
dumb nigger
kys
do it

>>135632665
I stopped driving around 4 years ago.
State took my licence for back child support.
I very rarely even ride in cars anymore they scare the shot out of me.

>>135640607
Dude, maybe the closest thing you will get to interaction is a bit of awkward silence in between instructions, this is their job, and I'm sure no matter how bad you have it they have had to put up with worse.

>>135632665
>LISTEN TO ME YOU STUPID SHEEPLE
Why aren't lolbergtarian sovereign citizens more sympathetic to the oppressed victims of the state?

>>135640850
have you looked into it, or just seen some videos posted in a deliberate attempt to portray them all as crazy?

do you think the same thing about racists, anti-semites, sexists etc?

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>>135640837
I KNOW I KNOW
but its too much
maybe if i go to the doctor & get lots of drugs
but then I feel like I won't be me anymore, I will be someone else

>>135640889
>These definitions are set in stone
that's my point, the claim the soverigns make is that the legal definition of driver(as set in stone) is someone using/controlling a vehicle for commercial purposes

have you looked into wether that claim is true?

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>>135636938
>traveling on public roads without paying for a permission slip from your corporate platation owners is abusing the system
>muh social contract
>muh taxes pay for infrastructure

Fuck off brainlet. Absolute, unfettered freedom of travel is one of THE fundamental human rights alongside freedom of speech and the right to self defense.

I guess I shouldnt be allowed to go to work or buy food at the store unless officer jackboot can "satisfy his need to know" that I'm sufficiently compliant with his (((paymasters'))) infinite labyrinth of onerous bureaucratic redtape bullshit.

>halt, citizen, pick up that can and then show me your papers

>>135632665
>sovereign citizens
These fools are a fucking joke and nothing more than anarchists with snowflake syndrome.

>>135641411
sovereign citizens are demonized just like racists and sexists

hmm, really makes you think

>>135641640
just do it faggot. you'll never get a license otherwise. here's the truth about social anxiety: nobody gives a shit about you

>>135640336
>what is a road tax?

>>135632665

Maybe Drumfy really is playing 11.5D dominos

the use of speeding metal (potential) deathtraps absolutely needs to be regulated. your right to travel (is that even a thing?) doesn't include your right to demolish other people's property and kill kids on bikes because you don't know what you're doing.

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>>135641887
I WILL ASK FOR FREE CAR RIDES
which ironically enough is even more awkward
just fuck my shit up familia

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>>135632665
Traveling != driving, you fucking retard. You need a license to operate a motor vehicle on a main road. Don't like it? Take the bus or walk. Nobody is preventing you from traveling without a drivers license.

>>135640607
at least you don't get anxiety about the act of driving itself like I do. combine that with the shame of beginning in my early 20s, it makes just learning hell.

>>135632665

Holy kek.

Sounds like some serious Sovereign Citizen nonsense.

Americans do have the right to travel. However, the purchase and usage of an automobile is a regulated affair in most every country of the world.

Given that driving takes at least some modicum of skill - and that a poor driver could pose a public danger - individuals transiting via vehicle need a license.

If you don't want to drive, take a fucking wagon or cross the country on foot.

I sure don't want to return home to the United States with a bunch of untrained teenage cunts flying all about.

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>>135642400
I've never done it before, I probably will

>>135640850
>LOL look at these brainlet jerks not sucking Mr. Jackboot corporate shadow government's meaty regulatory cock and loving it like obedient slaves

>not me though, Im bought, paid for, and owned by the state and I embrace the trampling of my rights and the usurpation of my very humanity by the same corporate globalist combine that puts toxic industrial byproduct in my water and tells me to support my own displacement by foreign hordes of illiterate stone age savages as Mr government brings them in on purpose to rape and pillage my family

Some of them misunderstand certain nuances of the law but the basic legal premises they are employing in their cases and arguments are sound, whether or not the corporate franchise monopoly known as the courts decide to recognize it.

>>135632665
You can travel on foot, or horseback or as a passenger, thats a right. Being allowed to operate a 10ton hunk of metal at 70mph is something reserved for people that have proven themselves of sound enough mind to do so safely.

>>135642701
damn son
well I'm admittedly a pussy with poor motor skills so you'll probably be better off.

>>135641727
>For commercial purposes
You are exactly why people laugh at sovereign citizens.The license is for operating motor vehicles of a certain weight and/or purpose, ranging from motorcycles to a CDL for commercial trucks. If you want to use Driver then you better be operating a stage coach (but not a street trolley). What you are looking for is laws pertaining to automobiles and motor vehicle operators. Here is the case setting precedent that regulation of the right to drive a car (oops, operate a motor vehicle, dont want you getting confused) is legal https://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=3467100988685921366. Its under 7.AUTOMOBILES.

As for your dumbass commercial purposes, the definition being cited is old enough to own slaves. Because of this it explicitely references vehicles, not motor vehicles. Theres a difference that youll want to learn before you go flaunting your internet law degree

They always quote thompson v smith but leave out this bit

>"The exercise of such a common right the city may, under its police power, regulate in the interest of the public safety and welfare; but it may not arbitrarily or unreasonably prohibit or restrict it, nor may it permit one to exercise it and refuse to permit another of like qualifications, under like conditions and circumstances, to exercise it.

>The regulation of the exercise of the right to drive a private automobile on the streets of the city may be accomplished in part by the city by granting, refusing, and revoking, under rules of general application, permits to drive an automobile on its streets; but such permits may not be arbitrarily refused or revoked, or permitted to be held by some and refused to other of like qualifications, under like circumstances and conditions."

>>135641640
I'm not sure what kind of drugs you're aiming for but being able to function like a human being made me realize that it was mental illness holding me back from my true self, not medication creating a fake self. You have potential inside you, anon, and if you need help to reach it there's no shame in that. Sick people take drugs to make their life less shitty and that's exactly what you're doing.

>>135632665
If you have a piece of land large enough to drive around on, then you don't need a drivers license to do that. But if you plan on taking that car out on public roads, then you have to have a license.

licenses are permission to use public roads for commercial use. as a citizen, the roads are already yours to use. if you are not driving commercially you don't need a license.

Public defender here. Sovereign Citizens are bar none the most insane and unmanageable clients; they are the number one source of complaints against a lawyer, and almost always end up wrecking themselves any time they open their mouth in front of a judge.

I've been appointed to represent a couple in front of judges who HATE my guts, and I mean these judges do not want to see me alive. Yet SC's are so wound up in their own insanity, these same judges will give me leniency because of the client's behavior.

If you're flirting with the idea of "diving into" their form of thinking, just know that nearly none of it "works," and almost all information in that vein is not applicable. If you try to use the "magic thinking," you are not going to be looked upon kindly. Think about this: at some point, some SC's must have thought "I'm going to go to law school and show them how the law actually works!" And then they're no longer suddenly believers. 100% of people with a JD see this as insanity, so why is that?

Get a goddamn driver's license if you're going to drive. Have insurance. Statutes aren't that hard.

>>135643184
I don't see you denying that definition

the definition comes from the legal dictionaries

the rest of your comment is just pure blather

the writing on the licence(or whatever the DMV says) is irrelevant to the legal definition

>>135643376
>theres no shame in using a crutch to function
your drugged state is not your true self

>>135632665
You shouldn't need a license for anything.
Unless your using someones property and they require it.

You shouldn't need a license to own a firearm or fly a plane or helicopter.

You pay for the roads through your council.
It should be like that anyway as well as roads connecting cities etc.

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>>135632790
Bicycles didn't exist when the constitution was written. Travel was limited to horse-drawn carriages, niggers and boats.

>>135644420
The definition is correct. It does not apply to motor vehicles, only vehicles. The cited study is the legal precedent for a license. You seem to believe you are smarter than 70+ years of legal experts when the extent of your arguement is a totally irrelevent definition

>>135632665
>>135644751

Why are Libtardarians the most retarded people on Earth? A drivers license protects other drivers on the road from retards, old people, and kids from driving and killing other drivers.

Oh wait, you believe that everything is fine right up to the point their car smashes into yours violating your NAP.

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>>135641766
well said, and chekkked

>>135632776
You are an idiot then. You know nothing of the law and declaring yourself the living man and separating yourself from your corporate fiction granted to you at birth from the state. Your ALL CAPITAL NAME. Don't believe me? You are a bondork for the US corporation of human capital, type in the red numbers on the back of your social security card into fidelity.com and you will see how much you are worth. Typical fucking eurocrat, retarded

>>135642396
legal definitions anon

only users in commerce should need licences

>>135644998
Get a better car then
If your scared of others smashing into you get an apc or a car that will keep you safe.
Fly if you don't want to get hit by a car.

>>135645129
bond *

>>135644540
What else are you supposed to do? irrational responses to life situations such as social anxiety and depression aren't so easily cured by therapy or exercise. I find it far more pathetic to let my mental issues consume me for the rest of my life when I can nearly touch normie mode with a single pill.
what is it about meds that makes you not your true self? can't you say the same for mental illness itself? It's all brain chemicals

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>>135642842

>>135645160
No.

States are enabled to regulate "commercial activity," which includes personal travel, commercial travel, business activity, AND individual activity, which in the aggregate, would have economic ramifications. The federal government is also enabled to regulate interstate commercial activity to a certain limited extent.

Do you know what cases establish this?

>>135644841
smarter? no, more correct. well done for taking the jews side

are motor vehicles not a type of vehicle?

>>135632665
lolbertardians everyone

>>135644408
>Public defender here.
(((Public defender here)))

tell us again what priority your client comes? Is it 3 or 4, 5?

implying anyone likes or trusts lawyers

>>135632665
Right to travel =/= right to operate a motor vehicle

Oh so I have the freedom to go to any part of America? Well let me hope in my tank

>>135645196
So if someone totals your car and kills your wife you're just gonna say
>whoopsy! should've bought a better car xD

I want you to tell me that's what you'd do. Tell me.

>>135645129
When I say understand, I want you to repeat that you understand ',:^)

>>135645160
definition, with citation to relevent precedents, for drivers http://thelawdictionary.org/driver/ I was hoping you would eventual look it up instead of trusting some noname retard on reddit, but then again youre a sovereign citizen.
>>135645590
Hello again sovereign, just gonna call jews and keep crying? So how much was that speeding ticket for anyways? Bet that was 3 weeks allowance

>>135645475
>States are enabled to regulate "commercial activity," which includes personal travel
>commercial
>personal

what?

I don't know why you think decisions of judges are straight from god and never wrong, why is this?

>>135632665
You need a driver's license to operate a motor vehicle. If you want to walk over state lines or ride a horse you can do that freely.

>>135645913
>reddit
>sovereign citizen
>crying

can you prove any of those things? jew/jew worshipper

guess who runs the (((legal system)))?

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Just heard on the scanner here in Pennsylvania, a female at an "Islamic Association" is in fear of life from her husband.

>>135645792
1. I wouldn't have cars that aren't safe enough
2. Whoever was driving wasn't aware enough therefore it's their fault too
3. >Not having any defensive mechanisms to protect you from other cars.

Besides I doubt she'd be driving somewhere with out me coming along.
Where would she be going if we grow our own food and have all we need?
Her friends can just come over to our house.

>>135645716
Duty to the client is equal to the duty of administering justice. There's a reason many judges don't like PD's, it's because we make sure they can't get a nice easy conviction rate. I won't lie or deceive for my client, but I will never do any acts against their interest unless I am absolutely required to do so.

And I don't care if you don't like lawyers, it doesn't affect the reality of SC's being wholly uninformed.

>>135645949
I know they're not straight from god, but they are the upheld rules by the sovereign nation that you are a citizen of, and thus you are bound. The car you want to drive on the roads that were built by man were not descended from god either. If you want to travel as God intended, get to walking.

None of this changes the fact that long established legal precedent is binding in our courts, and that you are driving within the jurisdiction of where these laws are established. Personal driving of vehicles is an activity that has commercial implications within each state, and they are allowed to issue rules regarding the activity.

>>135646320

Which car can take an APC running over it since the driver is a 10 year old unlicensed retard?

>2. Whoever was driving wasn't aware enough therefore it's their fault too
Right, like you can react to an APC clipping your car from behind going 250 mph. Dumbshit

>3. >Not having any defensive mechanisms to protect you from other cars.
refer to above

>>135646112
>Da joos!1!1!1
Googling the legal definition of driver google gives its first results are a reddit thread discussing this exact topic, then another. the third is the definition I linked you. Notice how commercial isnt there? Or in any precedent for driving? Youre basing your understanding of the law on maybe 5 minutes of internet searches leading to other people with maybe 10 minutes of searches. But again, sovereign citizens studying past a first pass at uncited legal definitions? I was being too generous. You literally are too stupid to use google. Why would anyone expect you to understand legalese. I even handed you the wrong definition up there so you could go find it yourself

>>135646810
>Not having an apc or tank myself
>not flying a jet or plane

So your saying I wouldn't equip my vehicle with a radar and automated defense turret

>>135646791
do you know the etymology of the word attorney?

>it doesn't affect the reality of SC's being wholly uninformed.
in your opinion, based on a small sample size

do you know the difference between lawful and legal?

>None of this changes the fact that long established legal precedent is binding in our courts
what is we set a new precedent? or are only old (((men))) wearing black cloaks allowed to do that?

>the sovereign nation that you are a citizen of, and thus you are bound
explain the process of how you claim I became bound

>>135633502

You don't have to explain it to the police, you explain it to the court.

>>135641766

Does that mean mexicans should be freely allowed to travel to America and do whatever you're doing there (I'm guessing living off benefits)

>>135646886
oh, reddit talks about it, so I must have seen it on reddit? wow, you sure are real smart

what proof do you have that "thelegaldictionary" is legit and correct?

>Why would anyone expect you to understand legalese
because it's just the same as English?

>>135647298
>because it's just the same as English
Levels of retard off the charts, even common law court would find you mentally unfit. I dont need thelegaldictionary to be legit in itself, just its sources. You did read some of the cited cases and precedents right? I mean it would be silly to base your legal understanding on hearsay and "top 5 ways to get out of a ticket" on youtube.

>>135647265
that's you're argument? I feel insulted

mexicans should not be in the country

>>135632665

Just shut the fuck up. Dumbest thread I've ever seen on here.

>>135640336
You must be 18 to post here.

>>135647651
Sniping dairy cows can be therapeutic sometimes, give it a go

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>>135647616
wow, you sure have sand in your vagina huh?

so mad

legalese isn't English, or there would not need to be a seperate legal dictionary in the courts

I didn't read any of your faggy shit, what ya gonna do about it faggot?

I am amused that you think I've only spent 5 minutes studying the issue at hand though. Another unprovable claim

>>135641640
Ok then, don't think, just act, ust stand up and go do it, don't think about doing it, dont think "what am I doing", just go, the moment a tought comes on just block it/ignore it, by the time you can't block them enymore you'd be in the middle of it with ono other way out than through.
You'd be surprised how much you can achieve by not thinking for a bit.

>>135647144
>lawful versus legal
Former is typically civil matters, latter is in regards to criminal matters. Actions under either matter may involve the State. Since your state created criminal liability through the legislature for driving without a license (courts do not create misdemeanors), the act becomes one of criminal liability. It is not the fault of any judge or attorney that the law was created, it is only the work of the judiciary to enforce it according to how the law was written. Elect different officials or communicate with them that you want different laws, but don't expect the judiciary to do so. Precedent must still be operative with the state statutory scheme.

The reason you and I are bound to it is, as unflatteringly put as possible, that the monopoly of force is held by the government to subject you to such laws in order to create a civil society and minimize self-help [which means violence]. You're going to use the benefits of existing in the country, you're going to be bound by the laws enacted by the sovereign. You could make your own sovereign nation, with its own laws, if you could uphold your borders. Until then, get a license if you want to drive :^)

>>135632665
Every natural person has the right to travel. The issue is most people don't operate in their natural capacity and instead operate using government created trusts which do require licensing.

Anyone interested should check out teamlaw.net or listen to an interview on a radio program the other week here (not until 24:16): http://cdn1.gcnlive.com/cache/gcn_archives/handoff.php?1=CallToDecision&2=2017/jul17/CalltoDecision/0708172.mp3&3=CallToDecisionJul082017Hour2.mp3&4=0&4code=0&4hour=0&4date=0

>>135645129
I hope you're not referring to U.C.C. 1 filings, because a lot of people promote it but it doesn't separate you.

>>135645129
It sounds crazy, but this guys right

Why are you telling them this???

>>135632665
AM I BEING DETAINED?!

>>135647909
>I dont need to read the legal definition of the definition im citing
No one lad deserves all this wew. Literally at the point of umad. Fun fact, the best defense sovereign citizens ever get in court (the real one) is that your delusions warrant an insanity plea.

>>135632665
using the word sheeple destroys all legitimacy

there are enough soverign citizens getting owned on youtube that i highly recommend you not to try that or you will end up in jail

>>135646021
Driving is a commercial transaction

You have a right to travel in your property without taxation...its uniform commercial code.......

>>135645913
This guy works for the state or is a fagbag lawyer

>>135648269
>Former is typically civil matters, latter is in regards to criminal matters
>typically
actually, lawful realtes to common law, and legal to civil

is there such a thing as a victimless crime?

hmm, so courts/judges are only supposed to enforce the law, yet they set precedents that must from then on be followed. how do you square those two things?

>The reason you and I are bound to it is, as unflatteringly put as possible, that the monopoly of force is held by the government
that's a reasonable answer, but the governement is by the people, for the people and of the people, so why don't we just change any laws we don't like?(yeah, I know, try it, heh)

btw I have a licence to drive, my interst is more in the way courts/legal system screw people over, e.g. plea deals, not allowing evidence, proceeding against property(explain how property itself can commit a crime), guilty until proven innocent in many cases including traffic tickets

>>135632665
>Driving means operating a motor vechicle, likely a car
>An average car weighs around two tons and can go up to 60mph
>DL proves that you can operate the car, know and obey traffic rules

>BUT MUH RIGHT TO TRAVEL
Walk faggot or get a bicycle.

>>135648343
I already read it years ago

have I claimed ot be a sovereign citizen, or did you just assume?

are you under the delusion that our courts and legal system are fair?

do you know how many laws there are? do you know all of them?

>>135646886
I have sources from a federal witness and a private attorney general PROVING you dont need a license to travel in your car AND americans arent obligated to pay taxes unless you work for the feds. The IRS is a money laundering service to foreign banks.

Its cool to shill for the uneducated masses we honestly NEED chattel, but this is 4chan so fuck you /pol/bros deserve to know. If ANYONE deserves to know its the conspiracy theorists

Im not posting my source because i have nothing to prove and itd be really stupid

>>135632665
>What about the right to travel?
you mean walk

>>135648605
oy vey goyim, don't assert you're rights!!

that would be anti-semidic!!

>>135632665
You have the right to walk or ride a bicycle. You don't have the right to drive because that puts others at risk if you do not follow the rules.

>>135648806
Depending on what you mean by state, yes. Also whatever air force civilian counts as. I like you, you make me giggle with that caricature you do.

>>135649110
You may want to reread it if you read it years ago, your whole argument about driving hinges on it. You seem to share the delusions and inaccuracies sovereign citizens carry around in fat stack of fake legal documents. The Driving = Commercial argument is a very common one that depends on an outdated definition of Driving from before the proliferation of motor vehicles. Fairness of individual courts isnt the concern. It is the law that is the concern. You have a problem with your court go over their heads with an appeal.

>>135648605
That's because they're idiots who don't know what they're doing or understand the law. You don't fight on the street against cops with guns, you fight in court. Ideally you get it all worked out administratively with whatever you're dealing with before you even take it to the street or have to go to court. That way if you ever DO have to go to court (And you will because cops don't know/care) you will win. It's not difficult.

>>135649557
>You may want to reread it if you read it years ago
>an outdated definition of Driving from before the proliferation of motor vehicles

hmm, why would I need to reread it if you agree that definition is true, but just claim it is no longer in date?

who gets to change definitions? how long do they last?

>>135648913
Oh god, this common versus civil law pedantry. The US a mix of both, wherein certain tasks are delegated between the legislature and judiciary. The attempt to distinguish "legal" and "lawful," does what exactly? Is meant to say that the laws shouldn't apply to you, and because [insert some reason here]?

There are victimless crimes, yes. The legislature created them. Tort and contract require a damaged plaintiff, criminal law does not need one.

The reason such aspects can be reconciled is that the court sets precedent on the INTERPRETATION of law written by the legislature, wherein the need for precedent varies. Take a DUI case: does the defendant fill every element of the statute? Well we have 1. Operating a vehicle 2. While under the influence. Well in order to reach "under the influence," the court may rely of common law rulings for what can be interpreted for or against this, and then communicate that to the jury.

Don't get me wrong, I know that a lot of the system can be fucked up, and it's existence is on the basis of threat of violence at a certain level. Proceedings against property doesn't really apply, but there are duties to those who own property. I'm not going to go over all of law here, but there are reasons for the creation of evidentiary rules (some of which I disagree with or try to stretch in my client's favor).

>>135649981
You want the exact wording, not the gist of what you remember. The definition you read, if it said anaything about commercial anything, was likely changed long before anyone in this thread was born. Its normal for sovereign citizens, in their retardation, to cite irrelevant/outdated legal proceedings like a definition of driver from when a driver was a job description. The change added motor vehicles (motorcars if you want to get specific) and took out the economic clause since Driver was no longer a common occupation. Ill give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you arnt the collossal retard that spreads this nonsense, just someone who believes it.

>>135650035
>Is meant to say that the laws shouldn't apply to you, and because [insert some reason here]?
are you the attorney(the one who helps people to attorn)?

do you know how many laws there are? do you know them all? does anyone? what kind of system is it where there are so many laws that one person(let alone most people) don't even know them all?

I would like to go back to a system of common law - "cause no loss, injury or harm, make no mischief in contracts, do not breach the peace"

could you name some victimless crimes?

>Don't get me wrong, I know that a lot of the system can be fucked up, and it's existence is on the basis of threat of violence at a certain level
hardly a fair system then, are we just slaves?

>Proceedings against property doesn't really apply
yes it does, see asset forfeiture cases. "state of Maryland v $10,000", "state of Virgnia v some street address"
this is not common law, as specified in the constitution

>>135650571
>was likely changed long before anyone in this thread was born
that's your argument? it was changed a long time ago?

what was the process of this change, under whose authority, did the people consent to the change, do I consent to the change? is it ok to just go around changing word definitions whenever I like?

>>135650777
Have you opened your master account at the federal reserve? I actually need help with the operating circulars

I dont wanna work anymore lol

>>135650987
haha, no. sounds too good to be true doesn't it. who knows?

>>135650605
>victim-less
>crime
choose one, no victim no crime

>>135650777
Nevermind, you must be SC if you are this retarded. Your argument is an uncited definition you read some number of years ago and jews. Mine is a cited legal definition that doesnt match up to your claim. Cite something you double nigger so that I can show you why your beliefs are pants on head retarded.

>>135647152
Exactly. Every time you get asked for a license, you will have to go through the court process to be absolved.

>>135640728
Fun fact: he ended up going to jail for 30 days and paying a $500 fine for his dumbass antics in this case. All because he didn't want to pay about $15 for a fishing license to fish at a municipal stock pond.

Totally worth it! Fucking nutters...

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>>135645129
really makes you think

>>135639479
Its true, comes from an early edition of blacks law books

>>135651135
I believe its true.....whys there 5 forms to fill out with 7 documents attached to each form....just to open a bank account. Not to mention i need the $500 adobe acrobat program just to print off the forms to fill it out.

Its in the most jargony way possible

I have sources from a federal witness im WILLING to share but not on here

Filling this shit out is difficult but day by day a little more gets completed

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>tfw libertarian
>get lumped in with these fucking sovereign citizen idiots, people who don't believe in roads and dumbfuck "ancaps" who think they are in good company

>>135639845
Actually its common law vs maritime law

>>135652061
Guys an attorney general as well

ummm i actaully support people having to get a drivers license and pass exams, if anything it should be way harder to obtain one.


fucking dumbasses on the road.

>>135632665
Walk, bike, train, horse, buggy, bus, train, plane, boat. None of those require a driver's license.

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>>135632665
>1 post by this ID

>>135646791
>None of this changes the fact that long established legal precedent is binding in our courts,
for now, easily changed and it seems we would do better to reallocate those funds elsewhere

>and that you are driving within the jurisdiction of where these laws are established.
thats a pretty broad statement, each individual case bears it's own merits

>>135640062
If you have the right to travel by any other means, what makes a car different?

Cars and trucks used for commercial purposes are supposedly regulated due to the commerce clause of the constitution. State's grant the licenses for commercial purposes. Since most people drive to work, and are paid in federal reserve notes, you've needed to get a license, which is paid for in federal reserve notes.

>>135632665
We absolutely do not. If you get pulled over all you have to do is refuse to answer any questions or leave your vehicle, and reletedly ask if you are being detained. If they say no ask if you can leave. If they say no again ask if you are being detained. Etc..

>>135651613
>Exactly. Every time you get asked for a license, you will have to go through the court process to be absolved.
fair enough, sounds like a good use of the court's time for a few months until the changes come in

>>135633502
Um, no. You need a license with the correct endorsements for the vehicle you're driving if you want to travel on public roads. Private roads are another matter, but they're pretty rare. You also need to travel on public roads to get to them.

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>>135644540
If you're so mentally fucked that you literally cannot function in society, maybe it's not so bad to take enough drugs that you become something you aren't.

>>135652616
>ou need a license with the correct endorsements for the vehicle you're driving if you want to travel on public roads

no you don't, I drive all the time and forget my license in the wash or some shit, the car still works, you're obviously a retard

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>>135652753

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>>135640607
>>135641640
try a beta blocker like propanolol it works by blocking your beta behavior so you stop action like a sperg

>>135640889


See driver:

http://thelawdictionary.org/driver/

>>135632665

Right to travel is more about state "you have to live here for a year to vote or be eligible for benefits" residency restrictions than actual traveling

>>135642181

Having a license doesnt stop accidents, s
reckless driving, drunk driving, etc.

>burgershits think a car is the only mode of travel

Buy a bicycle, fatass. Take a train.

>>135642396

http://thelawdictionary.org/driver/

>>135640889
Our nations been in debt for like 100 years now

33rd congress sold us out to bankers

How do you know where the money is going if literally everything in the U.S. is tax gulag?

You don't. You shill so hard and say all these fancy words, but you dont even know the history of your own country.

If you're gonna shill at least know your shit

And why shill against something the population doesnt even know...youre doing more harm than good at this point

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>>135652914
confirmed retardation

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>be president of the united states
>think that owning MUH GUNS is more important rights than driving
And you idiots wonder why every country in Europe is laughing at us.

>>135642416
To be taught and tested, sure.

But you don't need a license in math to solve problems, don't need a license in tree cutting to cut trees, don't need a license to work on your own car, etc. Dont need a license to own a gun....

Plenty of harmless and potentially harmful things are done everyday without a "license"

>>135650605
It's a system of laws that aims to address as many facets of life so as to 1. Pursue the public good 2. Dissuade behavior that harms others and 3. Encourage commerce. Whether laws meet those goals is an entirely different matter, but that's the nature of human error. And no, no one knows all law, but laws must be established by fair notice to the public.

Forgive me for not being clear about actions against property. This is in regards to "in rem" versus "in personum" jurisdiction where the state has jurisdiction over the property but not directly over the title holder. This only applies to suits against a property interest with title. You still may not sue a piece of property and end it there; the jurisdictional reach is only to bring proper notice to the holder of interest in property.

Also, it was "State of Iowa v $10,000 seized from Mary Patrick," I have a family member who was involved in that case oddly enough kek. That was not a lawsuit against property, but simply what the case was titled for a return of seized assets in the pursuance of a criminal investigation. Don't take the name of the case as an interpretation of how it applies to other matters.

But anyway, yes there are victimless crimes, at least by direct causal relations. Drug use, speeding, water retention on property, not difficult to say those are DIRECTLY victimless. However, that goes back to the ability of states to pass laws through the legislature, which is the power granted by the state. Whether there is a victim or not doesn't matter; this goes back to the monopoly of force by the state. Its criminal law, not tort/contract. It's not slavery, but it is a limitation on the people of the sovereign; you want to be part of the state as a person who uses its resources, you have to play by some rules. It's harsh but order is established by some level of harshness. That's the reality of the situation.

>>135653843
>nigger gets knocked out
>still tries to steal bicycle
can't make this shit up

>>135632665
Americlaps have the right to own guns yet the government isn't giving everybody AR-15s, what's up with that and hwere the fuck is Sanders on this issue?

>>135652301
>plane
You need a pilot's license from the FAA

>>135641874
Also this

Lol

4chan knows what shills look like

>>135642842
One wonders why of all subjects taught in American school systems, law isn't one of them.

A healthy dose of skepticism and anger would result, some would see through the bs at a young age, and the youth would tear the sham system down within a generation or two.

>>135653990
Oh no Europeans who are literally dying off and are seeing a violent spike in violent crime at the same time are laughing at us.

>>135642923

http://thelawdictionary.org/driver/


But having a license has nothing to do with education or safety....

>>135642842
Mein niger

http://thelawdictionary.org/driver/

>135643184

See now?

>>135652416
If you believe that the funds should be allocated elsewhere (which can be an entirely valid interest to have), then either get elected to or communicate to the legislature to enact that change to the law. There are avenues for getting rid of license requirements in a state, but there are reasons that they are not used, namely the reasons I have previously cited.

I won't contest that each case should be measured on their own merits, but that's easy to do when the legislature creates a strict liability crime that is easily interpreted by the judiciary.

>>135654562
That definition isn't binding, by the way. The used definition will be that of either a state specific statutory definition or the state common law definition which normally relies on either Black's Dictionary or Webster alternatively. Black's is the preferred.

http://thelawdictionary.org/driver/

>135644357
This

>>135654073
>you want to be part of the state as a person who uses its resources

in my state all the common wealth was given away to corporations for nothing, so what is left to participate in besides demands from the state for funding?

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why do sovereign citizens always mention the articles of confederation like it has any weight in modern law. our current government was literally formed by getting rid of the articles of confederation

>>135645129
AM I BEING DETAINED?

>>135654334
>A healthy dose of skepticism and anger would result, some would see through the bs at a young age, and the youth would tear the sham system down within a generation or two.

this is why you should learn enough latin to translate the latin written on your courthouses

usually says something about all ye who visit this house leave empty handed

who else speaks and writes in latin?

>>135655148
What do you mean it was given away to corporations? Genuinely asking. I personally own some real property through shares of an LLC, so I'm curious what you mean.

>>135644408
The only court that matters is one of the jury, as per the constitution.

There is no such thing as a judge, as its a title of nobility, and ultimately they aren't in control, which is why after seeing him in traffic court, then appealing to appellate court of 3 judges, you are finally given your right to a trail by jury.

The government has these fake lower courts for money extraction. Anybody who submits and accepts a judges decision is wrong.

All this being said, they still do their best to tamper with a jury to make sure jurors support the law and not allow a jury by ones true peers.

If your friends can find you guilty, you were guilty, or so believed the founding fathers. Stacked juries and shows like "law and order" and "bull" are propaganda normalizing a corrupted system.

>>135654770
>If you believe that the funds should be allocated elsewhere (which can be an entirely valid interest to have), then either get elected to or communicate to the legislature to enact that change to the law.

well yes I understand that, would prefer not become involved in the legislature because I don't want to be murdered for being a pain in the ass but yes thats usually the rightest course of action and many young people here should totally go do that

>>135654770
>easily interpreted by the judiciary.
isn't directing the jury technically illegal depending on the venue? just saying, this whole law business is open to anyone who can read and tolerate bullshit

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>>135644824
>Bicycles didn't exist when the constitution was written.
>the nazi-larping kike shill wants you to believe this

>>135655462
On your title to the property are you named as the owner or the tenant? What about property taxes? Fail to pay and be evicted by the state and your former property sold on the courthouse steps to the highest bidder. Also building codes and permits, Why cannot one build a house out of concrete instead of wood? It's cheaper and better but only government owned and commercial buildings may be "hardened" brick and mortar structures. A man's home is not his castle it seems.

>>135655462
>What do you mean it was given away to corporations?
oh shit when you look at this kind of case, I mean typically you tend to see judges overstepping their bounds outside big cities, go to any tiny rural county and once you go county to county for a few hours you'll find some big fish in a small pond stepping all over people's rights, but there is also commonly held property that is usually administered on a county or state level depending,

for instance in NYC there are air rights, these rights can prevent someone from building or getting permit to build because someone else has a right to the view of the sky

Alaska really has the most economical viewpoint on managing public wealth, but so many bad deals have given away so much of the people's commonly held property, rights to sea, air and land have all been given away with zero compensation paid to the municipality minus a campaign donation from fourty years ago,

we're at a new point in history here and I totally disagree with how democrats want to handle it, their minimum wage stuff is all garbage, might as well call it minimum slave

>>135637178
Expecting me to use anything other than that device for travel is cruel and unusual. Distances greater than 10 miles take unrealistically long for modern practices and are expensive.

>>135656042
>What about property taxes? Fail to pay and be evicted by the state
I have a secure and perfect land patent so I can't be removed even if I don't pay.

>>135655513
>a jury by ones true peers.

Look more SC nonsense

"jury of your peers" is british nonsense, not American

>>135637065

The guy at ~13:00 mark actually has a case.

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>>135655952
most people cite the 19th century with the introduction of the bicycle

>>135655513
You can have a jury if you plead not guilty for something as simple as a traffic violation or DUI. I've been appointed to those. Don't confuse a judge's panel as a jury either, as they are not "your peers." But anyway, to say accepting of any judge's decision is wrong is ridiculous; if you actually did violate a law, then the law was violated, regardless of whether a judge or jury decided it. Yes, the court is allowed to ensure voir dire is properly conducted, but I have rarely had an issue with getting a jury that wasn't at least fair to my client, regardless of their interpretation of what that means.

That said, the lower courts are absolutely a money maker for the state/counties, and that's why I do what I do. I make sure to fuck them every way I can, but I do so by way of properly following the law as it stands. They may be imperfect, but they aren't "fake."

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>>135656165
>I have a secure and perfect land patent so I can't be removed even if I don't pay.

Tell me more about this please

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>>135656343
also this is pretty cool

>>135632665

Yes you need a driver license and insurance. Unless you are a nigger or a spic.

>>135640174
They're assholes because you don't respect yourself enough to demand separation from slaves as is guaranteed by your legal definitions of citizenship?

>>135632665
REEEEEEE IWANT GO ON ROADS WITHOUT LIZENS. WHY CANT I! WHY CANT I! WHY ITS NOT FAIR! MOMMY AYN RAND SAID I COULD!

>>135635304
>>135635304
>want to walk without license
>still fon't pay for public sidewalks

>>135632665
Right to travel =/= right to do so in a rolling death machine.

>>135640724
He should grow up because you're too stupid to understand that the government intentionally misappropriates financial resources amongst other things? How about you go fuck yourself with all that edge boomer.

>>135632665
You can travel without a drivers license. You have feet, bikes exist, horses are domesticated,airplanes ply the skies, taxis and Uber and whatnot can take you where you need to go. And you can, in fact, operate a motor vehicle without a license on privately owned and maintained streets.

The right to drive a car on public roads does not exist though. It is, in fact, a privilege, available to anybody who wants it providing they pass a test to show they have at least some familiarity with how to drive a car safely.

>thinks if they say the right magic words the law doesn't apply to them
freemen on the land shit is hilarious and videos of cops fucking them and their shit up is some of the best entertainment to be had

>>135637065
>marijuana with kids in the car
fuckers deserve worse than getting tazed in the balls

>>135637065
The shit these people must deal with to be ablre to do this completely deadpanned
>Can you leave your camara with your mother outside
>Your not god
>God isnt concerned about camaras,sir, I am

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>>135656623
RIGHT TO TRAVEL

>>135656623
>Right to travel =/= right to do so in a rolling death machine.
sure it is, it's defined as common mode of transport, that doesn't prevent you from engaging in contract law having to do with it

8>>135656551
>REEEEEEE IWANT GO ON ROADS WITHOUT LIZENS.
ho ahead, so long as you don't speed or anything you'll just go about your business and come back, I want to stop registering cars and stuff, mopeds don't need a registration, I'm thinking I'll build a moped car and claim it's the same thing

>>135644998
Maybe their parents actually loved them or something. Who knows.

>>135656623
Are clothes a right?

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>>135656476
Everybody Knows the Bicycle was invented by African Chukudu tribe of the Congo.

>>135656724
>>thinks if they say the right magic words the law doesn't apply to them

some of these guys can do this, but very few of them in an ocean of morons

>>135656736
>fuckers deserve worse than getting tazed in the balls
worse than them, the assholes with heroin in the car, worse than them the assholes nodding on heroin with kids in the back seat, worse than them the two junkies who threw the kids off a bridge in a raging fight over who get the last bag of smack

burn them all

>>135646021
Hahaha try riding a horse state to state like that and not getting fucked with by the police

>>135656934
>Are clothes a right?
only if you hold the appropriate license

>>135639479
I just pulled out my license -- I was interested to see it is not a "drivers license," it is a "license to operate a motor vehicle."

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>>135656847
Killdozer is always right.

>>135657040
>Hahaha try riding a horse state to state like that and not getting fucked with by the police
depends on which state, most states no problem, blue dog democrat states, get ready to be raped by police

>>135649557
So he's right?

>>135656847
which Granby?

>>135644998
We're actually national sovereigns. I wouldn't call myself anything but that.

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>>135640062
>We are just not supposed to use a car without one.

Of course you can use a car without one, You just can't OPERATE a car without one.

>>135657212
Any state with a major population you can expect something from the cops, not so much about politics as it is populous and geography.

>>135649557
>go over their heads with an appeal.
isn't there mountains of case law on this? I mean I thought the whole argument here was coded like why should I license when I'm not a nigger and because niggers

what am I missing?

>>135655601
"Directing the jury" would be limited to deliberating over how the applicable law is described to the jury, where the judge has discretion over how both parties want to state the law to the jury. Their job (which they can fail at) is to ensure that it is an impartial interpretation.

>>135656042
Owner of title, specifically. Property taxes are paid because statutes specify that they are required. In exchange, the state enforces my interests against other individuals. Abiding by the rules of construction works similarly, along with the fact that such rules are for the purpose of public good and utility.

>>135656097
I do rural practice. When I say I'm a PD, I mean I have the contract with the county to perform that duty. This discussion is getting to generalized to actually realistically discuss. What rights are being stepped on by the "big fish?"

http://thelawdictionary.org/driver/

>135644998

Drivers license has nothing to do with safety, but of regulation of commerce.

>>135657426
>Any state with a major population you can expect something from the cops,
nah nobody going to say shit to you for riding in Colorado or California, but the people who ride there aren't exactly just riding where ever the fuck either, they can afford to keep their riding to an appropriate area, it's really not fair to the animal to try and ride in a ghetto where they'll be stepping on broken crack vials and used condoms which could hurt their delicate horse feets

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>>135657281
colorado

>>135632665 No, and no you don't. >>135632776 I respect my law, but also know muh constsitution. And in the constitution it states, NO american should have their right to freely travel molested (I know) by fines...fees...or tarriffs. I actually went and redpilled 3 local precincts a few years ago b/c they tried telling me driving was a privilege not a right. Well I do my research. And it seems that

>1. Licenses themselves are a "Fee"
>2. Getting a "Parking Ticket" is a "Fine"
>3. Paying "any" toll is a "Tariff"

Sorry lawbros....but I know my shit, and can source it if needed.

>>135632776
Your just another worthless nigger...your words/opinions don't matter and never have.

>>135657516
>What rights are being stepped on by the "big fish?"

typically I see single women losing property, they fail to serve notice or something after the deceased passes away and end up in litigation with the county most people don't ever experience

just one of many types of things you see happen a lot, family comes home from the wake and the sheriff in in their driveway selling their television,

small town cops can be scum, not always but can be, same with small town judges, but you're on the criminal side so thats a whole different ball game, just trying to juggle everything build up a big enough pile with delay delay delay and then do some horse trading

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>>135656132
>Cars are the only way possible to travel, and the only way to travel in a car is to be the driver.

>>135632665
Damn, that's Bishop's Castle. It's like an hour from where I live.

>>135657904
>NO american should have their right to freely travel molested

See:>>135658016

Please tell me where you can't go because you don;t have a drivers license and cant drive a car. You are not being impeded from going anywhere if you decide not to get a license and so are prevented from driving a car.

>>135632665
Fucking ancaps, the government owns the roads therefore driving on said roads is a privilege. If you want to drive on your property you can freely.

Unless you want a communist society where the roads are publicly owned.

>>135658197
>Unless you want a communist society where the roads are publicly owned.

Even there the public, as owners, will probably want you to show you have some basic ability to drive before letting you on their roads.

>>135632665
haven't had a license for 10 years, if i get pulled over it is a $200 ticket. been pulled over twice in 10 years. I keep my car insured and registered though

>>135632665
You have the right to travel, sure. By foot.

>>135658197
>Fucking ancaps, the government owns the roads therefore driving on said roads is a privilege.
since the government paid for those roads with public money then the public may use them, plenty of people using them without any form of insurance or licensure, varies from state to state of course

MUH ROADS

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>>135658121
http://www.bishopcastle.org/

This is what it looks like. The original owner / guy who built it was a hardcore ancap, and signs like that are all over the place.

>>135657945
... I have never in my years seen what you are talking about, a sheriff selling property within days after a death, even if there was no marriage. So I have to ask, what in the flying fuck are you talking about, and is there any example of this?

>>135657904
I'm sure you schooled them real good.

>>135658313
Exactly, democratically they would decide some sort of control over who can drive because you don't want an ancap society where disabled people and people who would be a threat are allowed on the roads.

>>135658399
>You have the right to travel, sure. By foot.
and by boat, really travel by sea is the best option, why the fuck would you want to go there if they don't have water anyway?

>>135658501
>plenty of people using them without any form of insurance or licensure, varies from state to state of course

In what state are you allowed to drive with no proficiency test leading to a license, and with no insurance?

>>135658590
death or hospitalization, or just out of town, the places where this happens typically are rural but favorite vacation areas of wealthy cities, Chicago especially, the fucking graft flowing out of Chicago to everywhere is just unbelievable, New York has quite a bit as well

>>135632776
Because you don't like the United States constitution?

>>135658700
almost all of them - you just have to be willing to pay the fine if caught (or leave the state etc)

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>>135658016
>No Zeppelin
Reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!

>>135658194
It's not about where I can't go. It's about the fact that it's alllllll a fundraiser.

>Do I believe people should have a license? Yes.
>Do I believe I should pay $80 for it?
No.
>Should we be forced to pay $4-$30 to cross a bridge or use a tunnel?
No...and that's the purposes for it.
>Should I be fined for "Parking too long", "Having an out tail light" or "Not wearing my seatbelt"?
No, and thats what it's about....Sheckels

Always has been. (((They))) break our laws by forcing us to pay for shit were not supposed to...and then make us even pay for that too with legislation.

>>135658802
Can you show an example of this happening? A news article, case opinion, documentary, or anything? Like I said, I have never seen it myself.

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>>135632665

We got fucking swindled. The Transportation codes were only supposed to apply to people using the public roadways for private profits since their actions for profit damage our public usage road ways.

Eventually the states realized how much of a cash printing machine this could be and started to loophole/lie their way into the bank vault.

Hear it from an ex-cop https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q6VqkJ29Jh8

>>135658700
well allowed is a very specific term, but plenty of places in the southwest where people drive with no insurance or license, if they get picked up the car gets papers for a month to show the judge then back to no license, they decided not to crack down on this more unless the county was willing to pay for it, these people stay away from the money areas and there is no problem so just the drug dealers driving in legal cars the rest of the county is dirt poor farmers driving with no papers or licenses

funniest shit I saw these guys towing a car frame, no trailer, no plate on the truck, just towing a car frame spraying sparks all over the road, who was going to pull them over? everyone has better shit to do and a year later that genius drove off the road and killed himself so we saved the county a bunch of money and time with that play.

>>135652086
whats the difference between a libertarian and an anarchocapitalist?

>all the bluepilled retars itt with literally zero comprehension of constitutional freedoms

Especially you guys with American IPs. It doesn't sound like you really want to live under the American system.

>>135658636
You actually do have the right to travel by boat.
>Federal law gives marine traffic the right-of-way over vehicular traffic.

>>135658590
We'll I print out 300 copies of the constitution and then highlight the segment that blew them the fuck out...just like you right now. And even they admitted that they had never known that, so yeah I guess you can say I did. Bro, no offense...I think "Circles" around cops. Please, if your a cop...don't respond. I really do respect the police and don't want to make you look stupid.

>>135659206
Actually I'm an attorney and do some criminal defense work; the cops don't like me either. But I'd like to see what your reasoning is, so please, blow me (the fuck out).

>>135658947
no man, I mean there was no news article about that in the instances I have seen, plenty of video evidence of people catching police stealing shit in their house with cameras now, it's not anything new or newsworthy really,

cops and firemen steal shit, everyone knows this, actually I know of a few cases where the drug dealer or co defendant claimed there was more money or some piece of property that was not in evidence, that happens like every time but mostly you don't hear the defendant complaining about it

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>>135659206
>I think "Circles" around cops.
>Please, if your a cop...

god damn it man; you're right but you're so fucking autistic it hurts.

>>135659426
Ok, sure I think circles around you kikes too. Is there fallacy to my statement? Do you want me to pull .docs to complete your embarrassment as a lawfag?

>>135659206
>Please, if your a cop...don't respond.
hey man, some cops are super cops like Vinnie Valata ok?

don't paint everyone with the same brush, we're all just trying to build a better America

>>135659504
I know XD

>>135659426
>But I'd like to see what your reasoning is, so please, blow me (the fuck out).
you're both right but you're talking about criminal court that is widely accepted as normal even if it perhaps shouldn't be and he's talking about common law which is hardly used for anything although perhaps it should be

>>135659485
You're talking about seizure of assets following a death. Either show it at all, or don't rely on it for your reasoning. I'm

>>135659603
Please, show what you're citing for your statement to be correct.

>>135659613
It's not that and he turned out to be a lawyer. I honestly DON'T like/look forward to correcting cops who get shit wrong.

>>135658700
In the different republics you dont need shit to travel in your property

>>135632665

It's like wearing a "I Hate Niggers" shirt and walking through a ghetto. You have the right to do it.

>>135659485
Recently there was a cop who forgot to turn off or "redirect " his body cam when planting evidence.

That asshole literally planted so much evidence in his "career" that he forgot he was wearing a camera this time. Oops.

>>135659851
Did they NOT teach you this in "law school"?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_movement_under_United_States_law

>>135632665
You can travel as much as you want. You need training to operate 2tons of machinery though.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4746284/34-drug-cases-dismissed-cop-filmed-planting-evidence.html

>135660021

>>135632665
I bet the case reference on that sign has absolutely nothing to do with what the sign is implying.

https://wearechange.org/u-s-supreme-court-says-no-license-necessary-to-drive-automobile-on-public-highwaysstreets/

Sorry lawbros...(((they))) play you against society for money. It's ok, we know a majority of you don't agree or like it either.

>>135659426
Have you ever been into your honor's chambers kek

I got two DUIs and my license was suspended for 4 years.

>Moved downtown
>Walked to work
>Made 14 an hour waiting tables
>No bills other than rent (after court shit)
>Online dating to meet girls with cars

>>135659682
"Sovereign citizens" like this faggot here are great, love watching you autists get fucking demolished by the police, cheers

>>135632665
Nothing in the Constitution states we have the right to own a vehicle. I'm still keeping my guns

>>135637065
> that one cop that tries so fucking hard to not have to arrest the guy

lol. The shit people do for Youtube.

>>135660340
They're in on it to...theyre not getting played lmao

>>135632665
yeah you have the right to travel, you can get off your ass and walk, no one is taking that away from you

stupid ass lolbertarians

>>135632665
Make your own roads then

>>135660981
You're retarded we all have a right to own property

>>135659119
There is a duality of systems in America. There are those who are free and declare it and live by it, and those who serve the interest of money and corporate USA.

Drivers licenses literally give fictitious entities called "corporate citizens" and those operating on their behalf, the right to the same rights as a natual person. >135659119

>>135656578
>what are city taxes

>>135659108
And a national sovereignist?

>>135661354
THIS
>THIS
THIS
>THIS

Licensure only required for employees of the state and commercial drivers..its in the constitution

>>135653990
remove the American flag from your name, move to Europe, and get raped by a pack of muzzis, you ginormous faggot. If you honestly care about what the pathetic's Europeans think of the US, just leave and go get raped and maimed with them. We don't need cucks like you here.

>>135661075
Some...I know some really really good cops bro, cops with a conscious who DON'T just lock people up because they can or it's even deserved in certain circumstances. There are more good cops than bad by far. And don't doubt that I haven't had some fucked up shit happen to me. Im from baltimore...I've had my shit STOMPED by the police in the police station while handcuffed...shackeled....and shackled to an "O Hook" on the wall. Also, when I was 15 got a nice scar on my chin...from getting my face bounced off of a curb.

>>135658913
Its all such a joke, isnt it.

>>135661354
Okay so to be clear, you're totally okay with letting anyone drive a large piece of machinery that can kill people with no proof that they have the ability too on roads that are paid by fees that range from taxes for your car and fees in requiring your license.
You are literally a fucking autistic dunce.

>>135659851
>You're talking about seizure of assets following a death
sort of, I'm talking about local police getting the frat boy bully mode switched on even though they're in their 50s and they decide to steal some people's shit because they know they will usually get away with it

happens all the time

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Is there a license to throw commies out of helicopters? Asking for a friend.

>>135658869
Awesome but impractical and militarily hard to defend. Cars are part of the utilities of the militia, every single vehicle in the US is potentially a war vehicle.

In ww2 before asbestos poisoning was realized, they taught troops hie to make vehicles nearly amphibious by coating the soldiers personal car engines with asbestos.

>>135661738
Not all cops are bad

Some act like they have lil cocks

But i do believe every lawyer is evil.....with all the tyranny going on against the people..these lawschool fags are against us

>>135662248
Asset seizure is one thing, but cops illegally take things all the time. Once when i was 16 i had a cop pull me over and he let me go but stole my lighter off the dashboard, saying i couldn't smoke yet and had no reason to have it. Luckily he didn't find my cigs, but come the fuck on. Really?

>>135661854
Yes and no. There's a duality to everything. What happened is they took something pure for positive funding to actually build shit required for travel...and then (((they))) destroyed the purity of it for profit. Because I'll tell you right now. "1 Bridge" in my area....either the Key Bridge or Bay Bridge makes enough money in 1 year alone to pay for another bridge. Think if 50,000,000 people cross a bridge per year @ 4.00...that's 200 million dollars. And brotha...we have like 5 toll bridges and 3 tunnels within 50 miles of my crib. And ALL of them are in "I badly need work condition"