What is /pol/ opinion on the Ottoman Empire? I think it was

>>133749780
Balkan is the most advanced and peaceful region in Europe because of them, right

>>133749952
Had the turks managed to assimilate all of balkans it would be different, ofcourse there was and still is bitterness and resentment left in the area once the Ottomans left

>>133749780
Endstation

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>>133749780
Not a fan

>>133749780
Thought that thumbnail was a screenshot of one of the Kings Quests

>>133749780
>the devşirme janissairy program was brilliant
It was, but unfortunately later sultans didn't have the intelligence to understand the principles behind its function. They tampered with it in ways that fatally crippled it and led to the empire's downfall.

>>133749780
>devşirme janissairy program was brilliant

no it was evil. kidnapping your enemies' spawn and turning them into killing machines is pretty dark and it's not the turk's way

it was a degenerate multikulti empire and caused so many problems. ruined the turkish collective psyche and we're still having problems because of them

>>133753022
It was a necessary evil to further the Empires cause and many great leaders rose from the devşirme program (such as Mehmet Pasha Sokolovic)

>>133749780
I only wish as a Bosnian that the Bosnians joined the catholics or orthodox, and not started their own heretical church like retards. Then maybe it would still be christian today and maybe there wouldn't be religious tensions there.

>>133753271
there's no necessary evil. one drop of ink and the water is not pure anymore. that's how empires and individual lives fall

>>133753497
I dont think you can survive as a puritan, you have to be willing to cause harm for the greater good, not to mention many janissairies died happy

Another """bosniak""" with massochism.

>>133753271

great leader?No one heard of that shitstain.

Ottoamans are the main reason of Balkan conflicts.

>>133753708
causing harm =/= being evil

here's a story for you when ottomans were still turkic

>orhan I. raids a byzantine castle
>they're winning the fight
>one byzantine knight is fighting like a mad dog, butchering ottoman soldiers with every swing
>all his fellow soldiers dead, he's cornered, ready to die with his sword in his hand
>orhan tells his soldiers to stand down
>tells the knight that he's free to go
>knight can't believe what he's hearing because he killed so many of their soldiers
>orhan says turks respect a good warrior and he earned the right to live
>knight leaves the battlefield, only to come back to orhan wanting to join him
>they fight side by side and fight byzantines together

this is how turks win hearts, not by brainwashing kidnapped children. ofc this story takes place back when ottoman rulers called themselves "bey" not "sultan"

>>133749780
>>133750144
>>133753271
>>133753708

Go back to Turkey, roach

>>133754597
Huh wasn't bey still used in Ottoman empire? Pasha, Bey and Aga are first ones that come to mind, and ofcourse Sultan

>>133750144
>Had the turks managed to assimilate all of balkans it would be different
They'd be just like the advanced and modern society of Turkey?

>>133749780
The only Ottoman trace in that pic is the ugly minaret in the background
And the people, I guess, bosnians are scum

>>133754845
they stopped using it after bayezid, the umayyad rat who ruined the empire for good. the empire stopped being a turkic empire after that son of a whore. we abandoned the ways of our ancestors and that's how we ended up like this

>>133754188
>>133754188

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>>133754245
>Ottomans are the main reason for Balkan conflicts

That bridge was built by Serbians you liar

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>>133755601
Serbs are genocidal rapists: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_during_the_Bosnian_War
Oh lawdy, look at those hefty sentences: http://www.bosniafacts.info/modern-history/serbian-aggression/9-list-of-serb-war-criminals

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fo%C4%8Da_massacres
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omarska_camp
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luka_camp
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liplje_camp
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batkovi%C4%87_camp
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Su%C5%A1ica_camp
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vilina_Vlas
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uzamnica_camp
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trnopolje_camp
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keraterm_camp
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manja%C4%8Da_camp

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>>133749780
t."Serb" LARPing as a Bosnian

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>>133755990
i'm bosniak i swear

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>>133755846
So?

>>133753022
A lot of Christian Balkan peasant families WILLINGLY gave their sons away. They knew they would have a better life as a soldier in the Ottoman courts.

>>133755846
>Serbs are genocidal rapists
this is true
but let's be honest... they only went to jail because they lost the war

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>>133756158
so you got rekt

>>133749780

Last Islamic Caliphate in Europe, before the one currently being put together.

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>>133756527
>you
There is no need to project Anon,i am not from Croatia.Besides those people don't look raped and murdered to me.

>>133756086
Everyone in the Muslim world hates the Ottoman Empire except Bosniaks and Kosovar Albanians.
From Algeria to Iran, everyone takes pride of it being destroyed - Saudis for destroyed that Ottoman Ajyad Fortress abomination in Mecca. They destroyed Mamluk Sultanate and killed other Muslim brethren for its existence. Arab revolt was truly justified.

You perhaps have a Stockholm syndrome for Turks. Perhaps Wh*tes are inferior and cucks to us

>>133755846
Jesus H Christ! We should fucking nuke Serbia from the orbit.

>>133750144

Go live in Turkey then you rapebaby

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>>133755846
>being butthurt about genocides
its a competition anon

>>133755846
literally subhumans

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>>133757109
Oh but sadly,your masters,seem to like us quite a bit.To the point they gave Bosnian serfs ammunition with Hebrew inscriptions.

>>133756996
>people

>>133750144

And they didn't, we are discussing what the ottomans were not what they could have been.

>>133757370

Well that didn't work out pretty well for none of you

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Odžak

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>>133757370
Meh,you don't have 500k Germans and 300k Albos on your tab.

>>133754597
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ezhT7zCJYJY
Ottomans died after annexing mamluks

>>133755846
So that happened in Europe 20 years ago? For fucks sake, that is some hard core animal behaviour. Croats did the right thing by expelling those rats.

>>133757828
The times ottoman was alive was in expandion against rum, after byzies were dead it was steady decline

>>133758023
You're god damn right about that.

>>133749780
Any society that produces architecture like that has my respect and admiration.

>>133758023

>Kill Muslims
>Wow Serbs are animals for lacking (((diversity)))

Serbs had diversity for over 40 years where they weren't allowed to call themselves Serbs or they would be beaten to near death experience which is why the war started

>>133758023
"One always hates what one wrongs."

Isn't it convenient that the west (not "the West") bombs a mostly Christian European country to help muslims, gets 9/11 a few years later (kek), the ISIS-like atrocities committed by muslims against these Christian Europeans are never prosecuted, and the people who got bombed are convicted as war criminals?

>>133757765
I joined this thread just to support you Serbs, thankfully the criminal Clinton cartel is out politics.

Ottomans were dirty sand nigger cockroaches

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>>133758416
>which is why the war started
rrrrright

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>make thread about muslim serbia
>turns into orthodox serbia hate thread
>make thread about catholic serbia
>turns into a orthodox serbia hate thread
nobody really gives a shit about you guise, there is a reason you will always first see a "serbshit" image before you see a serb provoking somebody, they start this because they got OUT FUCKING SKILLED and are posting their favorite cherry picked images about us.

stay mad shitlords, keep this thread up until i come back from the saturday night life :^)

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>>133758261
Agreed, I love Ottoman architecture, especially traditional homes

>>133749780
That looks like christian settlements.
Oh wait, because janissaries were Christan slaves.

>>133753022
Glad to see that some of you have consciences, it would be nice if the Turkic peoples were peaceful Tengrists instead, pisslam is the gift that keeps on giving.

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>>133758654
Anon i posted before any Cuckrats.

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>>133758670
me too

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Fuck off Turkish rape baby shill

>>133758416
>Serbs had diversity for over 40 years where they weren't allowed to call themselves Serbs or they would be beaten to near death experience which is why the war started
well then they wouldnt object to us leaving
its almost as if yugoslavia was better for the serbs

>>133758644

What else?

Everybody wanted independence back in the day, maybe at first it was to calm things down but by 1992 things have already gone to shit

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>>133758895

Or maybe it was because you wanted this?

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>>133749952
Balkaniggers destroyed everything the Ottomans built in the area because muh orthodoxy muh heathens.

>>133759137
ebin meme faggot
what else do i expect from a serbshit diaspora

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>>133758670
There's nothing so beautiful to my eyes as a stone bridge over a canal.

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>>133758416
Serbs were the largest ethnic group, commanded most if the army, etc
It's more because others didn't want to call themselves Serbs

>>133759348

>Oh shit I got called out
>Better call him diaspora top lel xD

Nice argument there Stipe

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>>133759272
But the ottomans were uninvited parasites while the Balkans had thousands of civilization before the ottomans even existed. Plus pisslam is a shit religion, even the bosnian and albanian muslims seem to be full of shame and self-hatred.

>>133759524

>Be largest ethnic group in the country
>Surprised when they make up most of the country's workforce

Holy shit it's like there's a thing called population?

Reminder that Russia, England and France killed The Empire

>>133759532
>xD
neck yourself

>>133759532
in what way did i get called out you fucking retarded idiot
give me 2 concrete proofs that we wanted that
read some books or something before going MUH OPRESSION

>>133749780
Croats kaboom'd that bridge lol

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>>133759492
Then you should enjoy Ottoman bridges, all their bridges were made out of stone

>>133759272
Can you give an example? What did you create in balkans except for some mosques that stand out of place, an university or academy or schools

>>133755339
it would be like bosnia

>>133759645
>what does the word disproportionate mean

>>133756286
Dude you're retarded

>>133759830
He's right you know, it's easy to be morally judgemental when reading history but that was the reality back then

>>133756286
>A lot
A few

>>133759645
You said they weren't allowed to be called Serbs which is laughable, it's actually them that insisted to call they country Jugoslavia until Montenegro split in 2006

answer me fucking faggot
>>133759690

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>>133759644
Bulgarians and Slavs also came to the Balkans uninvited. Good thing Ameritards are too full of themselves to hide their disgusting flag otherwise someone just might take your drooling knob for a head seriously.
>>133759808
Mosques doubled as schools at the time. There was both religious indoctrination and real factual science being thought. Over time emphasis on allahu akbar increased and now islam is shite.

>>133759645
>Be largest ethnic group in the country
run like bitches

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>>133760426
This is a fair analysis. Ottomans took pride in their engineering skills and it's visible in many of their grand architectural projects

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>>133760426
Actually we where invited kek.

>>133749780
Uh, I've been to Mostar: nice place, had a fun time helping children and eating burek.

>>133760426
>Mosques doubled as schools at the time. There was both religious indoctrination and real factual science being thought. Over time emphasis on allahu akbar increased and now islam is shite.

Maybe in the early period but by early modern period 18th and 19th centuries and later those were outdated and far behind any school or university in Europe

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obligatory

>>133760426
Of course Serbs didn't want to send their kids to learn into Mosques and so they burned them once the Turks left.
It's just common sense to do that.

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>>133760426
Bulgarians converted from shamanism to Christianity and otherwise adopted European culture. Besides, Bulgarian is a Slavic language (albeit simplified as a creole patois, like English coincidentally) and I imagine that many Bulgarians are of original European descent who were living in the area. Then they helped protect Europe from pisslamic roaches many times. Same with Slavs.

>Good thing Ameritards are too full of themselves to hide their disgusting flag
We have a beautiful Anglo-inspired flag (pic related) while you have an ugly arab moon god flag. And unlike the ottomans, WE ARE STILL HERE!

>>133761659
Someone needs to clear the conscience of his people for fighting shoulder to shoulder with Muslims against Christians for the last 100 years.

>>133749780
>devşirme janissairy program

>abduct little Christian boys
>fuck them in the ass until they convert to Islam
>send them back to kill their own parents

Yeah it was a peach

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Whooopsies

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>>133762196

>>133761913

(((BRITISH EAST INDIA COMPANY)))

gas your life, jew

>>133762019
They peasants loved it so much, they mutilated their own children so Muslims would have no interest in taking them anymore.
Obviously they loved this according to this Bosnian Muslims "brilliant" programme.
What escapes me is that his own ancestors were forcibly converted using the same methods during the last 300 years.

>>133762248
I never understood anyway what's so special about this small bridge, They all act like it's the Mona Lisa or something.
Let's destroy it again next war!

>>133762256
Let's see your flag big boy.

>>133762257
Most wealthy and scholarly Bosnians left to Turkey by their own will because that was were everything relevant was; schools, jobs, universities and civilization.

The one who remained were peasents and orthodox fanatics who refused to surrender to a clearly superior way of life

>>133762550
Oh, wealthy and scholarly Bonsians. Poorest region except for Albanian lands and maybe some gypsy towns (although many gypsy towns are much richer than the average Bosnian town)
People in this region couldn't even read until to the 20th century.

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>>133761659
Say what you want about Turks/Ottomans but in their prime they were unstoppable, only their name could scare entire armies. Sure there were here and there some heroes that put out a fight but most of their losses and numbers have been exaggerated, in the end like most of empires they become corrupted and decadent and fell in decline

>>133762248
Was that deliberate or a stray shot? Nice job either way, wipe all of the shit off the face of the earth.

>>133762793
There were kings and scholars believe it or not, not claiming what existed back then was anything grand, ofcourse it wasn't. You're acting as if though it was irrational to become muslim and succumb to the Ottomans, even though you also admit there was no civilization or culture prior to their arrival

>>133762550
Everything the Ottomans had, they stole from the Greeks. I'm really really really glad the Holy League conquered the shit out of everything after Vienna. Austrian troops entering Buda and slaughtering all the Jews and Muslims, best day of my life.

>>133762955
I listened a trial in Hague tribunal about destruction of the bridge.Bosnian Croat general says they didn't destroy the bridge.He says someone put explosives one the bridge the other side argues it was blown by tank from HVO ( Croatian Defence Council).

>>133763009
Anyone who has some cultural and national pride will not succumb to people trying to enslave you.

>>133763757
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=SvSwdqS-PcI
Video that shows destruction of the bridge

>mostar

Dirty as fuck.
30 year old bullet holles in buildings.
Garbage everywhere.
Holes in every street.
In summer it has fucking Dubai temperatures.
In winter it becomes a fucking Venice with flooded streets everywhere.
Rampant unemployment and nepotism from idiots from Posušje and Široki.

It's a hellhole.

>>133763757
The bridge was at a frontline separating Muslims from Croats so it was a legitimate target to stop them from advancing.
Say what you will about its cultural value, but a war is a war.

>>133763987
What exactly was there to be proud of? All we had was religion and a vague notion of a "nation"

>>133763009
pisslam is just a bunch of bullshit that an arab made up and got people to follow with violence

Greece and many other parts of Europe had thousands of years of civilization before pisslam even existed, how any "European" could stoop so low as to follow arab bullshit is beyond me.

>>133764664
You just cited great Bosnian kings and scholars dude and why didn't you then succumb to either Croats (with Germans behind) or Serbs (with Russians on their side)?
Both of these cultures are clearly superior at this moment in time.
It's not my business anyway, you are free to feel any way you desire about it. It's just interesting to me to learn how you think about it.

>>133764696
Would you not try and assimilate into a high culture if you could? Europe was a shithole during the medieval times before the Renaissance

>>133765204
So this is what you people tell yourselves?

You can't compare the glory of the ancient Greeks, Romans, and Byzantines to losers and parasites from central asia and arabia.

>>133765094
Yeah but said Bosnian kings and scholars were extremly few in numbers and they left as soon as they could.

Germany and Russia back then weren't that good to live in either and quite comparable to life in Bosnia

>>133764356
Nobody in their right mind would think of crossing that bridge during the war. Snipers were all over it. And the bridge itself is only for pedestrians. So tanks/cars couldnt drive over it. The demolition of the brudge was one of the biggest crimes in the war. They destroyed last thing that was unifing the city. And it was croats.

I should know. Im from Mostar. Also a bit of history. "Most" means bridge. When the bridge was build it was guarded by the soldiers whom they called Mostarci. Over time people settled neared the brige and the area got the name Mostar.

>>133756286
>A lot of Christian Balkan peasant families WILLINGLY gave their sons away.
bullshit propaganda

>>133765344
I don't have an issue with him preferring a certain culture.
It's more interesting to see that he defends cruel methods that were used against his ancestry to force conversion, yet he very strongly feels now about Serbs or Croats using much softer methods to merely conquer their territory.
They at least never planned to do forced conversions and steal their children to raise them as soldiers who will later attack their own people.

>>133765386
Sorry, but I'm 100% positive that Muslim Bosnians predominantly emigrate to Austria and Germany, even back then.
Anyways, it's fine that you feel that way. Just do not assume that your ancestors felt any different about the Turks invading and doing this stuff to them that you now call "brilliant"

>>133761659
>we wuz kebab removers xDDD
>Tesla was a Croat!!!
>Oluja is the greatest military victory in 20th century :--DDDD
>Serbs are genocidal maniacs
>glad we slaughtered them in NDH

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>>133749780

>What is /pol/ opinion on the Ottoman Empire?

An imperfect autocracy; but it kept the middle east in a state of relative peace for hundreds of years and kept the Islamic religious zealots under control.

All in all, I'd say its a pity that its not around any more.

>>133765592
I mean I don't feel that strongly about Serbs or Croats, I feel it's mostly them who aggress on us and not the other way around

This is ofcourse justified the same way the same way the Ottomans justified their occupation, which is that they are civilizing barbaric muslims to become civilized orthodox or catholics (which is completly ignorant of history). My stance today is different needless to say I just wanted to have a discussion about the Ottoman empire initially

Also fun fact. Bosnia flag was given to us by EU. Random triangle representing triangular shape of the country with random number of stars. Literaly no bosnian history in the flag. They did the same to kosovo. Random flag with country shape and stars. Kids cant even draw the shape. Hidious. But this is the sign of removing everything nationalistic from countries around in EU. Norwegian money bills changed from historical figures to a fish, a boat and a building. Everything natinalistic must go. From architecture, statues, songs, flags, books.

Welcome to EU.

>>133765785
After the Renaissance, Germans had a lot of success up until the first world war I'd say, it's on steady decline now, can't see it being a high culture much longer

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What is this thread?

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Deep down I know I hate 'em 'cause I ain't 'em.
>pic somewhat related

>>133766041
Okay, to me the Ottomans were not barbarians or anything like that. They certainly had their time in history where they shined.
But they shouldn't have become so deeply entrenched with the Arabs who are very uncivilised when compared to Turks.

>>133765204
You're a cuck,there's no other way to put it.Your ancestors willingly accepted religion of the aggressor.Since you so easily accepted islam,if hipothetically Hindus attacked Bosnia you would accept Hinduism by your logic.And this is the main complex of Bosniak (Muslim)
identity.You have no allies or friends in Europe.You realize that and that is why you are so afraid of breakdown of Bosnia.You will be new "Gaza" and "Palestine" in the heart of Europe.You adopted customs,traditions and mindset that is incopatible with Europe.The only way that problem could've been solved is you recognizing yourself as Muslim Croats or Muslim Serbs and that might worked and lead to gradual assimilation.Now that time has passed and you are stucked in search of your identity.

>>133766403
If you look at history that is a key sign that an empire is degrading. Roman empire was very similar in that regard, trying to conquer and civilize Germanic people and British people

>>133766206
Germany is the 4th largest economy in the world, with Austria it would be even the 3rd largest, behind US and China.
No other European nation comes even close, which is also strongly reflected within the EU.
I obviously have a very different viewpoint on that.
I also now my people well enough to know, that we will reach a breaking point in the future where we will get rid of all immigrants very quickly.

>>133765592
>>133766041
I imagine that some of them actually converted to get an advantage over their neighbors, they sold out, and now their descendants are trying to rationalize being the traitorous scum of the continent.

>>133750144
But they weren't able to, they didnt even get a majority of people to convert

>>133766626
It's not easy ofcourse, we've been under occupation by 3 different countris for the last 700 years (Ottoman, Austro-Hungarian, Yugoslavia), finding a very clear identity which might be very easy for say a Swede or a German isn't as easy for us, but I see your point

What do you suggest we do now? Or do yoi believe it's "too late"

>>133767000
Yugoslavia? Maybe Hercegovins is occupird by Bosnia by your logic???

>>133756286
Kek no

>>133765422
You are telling nonsense.As i said, i listened a trial in Hague tribunal about destruction of Stari Most and Bosniak general admitted they were carrying ammunition and arms through bridge.As for the bridge being simbol of unity is also bullshit.Here's the link below about that.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=wVkpZK_0be4

>>133767000
It's never "too late" with reason and goodwill.

>>133766754
I mean culturally you are on decline, economy is merely a projection of culture

Not to bash too much on Germans, the ones I've met were very industrious, hard-working and polite, but seeing whats happening to your countries today (rampant degeneracy and huge immigration waves entering your countries) indicates to me that the people today isnt what it was say 150-200 years ago

>>133755846
what's wrong with a bit of genocide?

>>133766626
Whatever happened in the past, after so many generations it's legitimately his identity, just as legitimate as yours.
And blaming him for something we don't know the actual situation his ancestors were in is useless.
Whatever they did, it's not his personal fault and he shouldn't have to hate himself.
I'm sure we'll find in among your or my ancestors enough reasons to justify hating ourselves.
Btw, Slavs in large parts didn't accept Christianity peacefully as well.

>>133767191
We like to call Yugoslavia "Big Serbia" down here but it doesn't matter, Yugoslavia erased any national or cultural pride that was left after first world war, mainly for Bosnia but ofcourse it applied to all nations

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sFF1v0n6VUg

>>133767535
So... bosnia is occuping hercegovina then?

>>133767451
pisslam is still garbage tho, they can still leave it despite muh ottoman lapdog heritage

>>133767843
Yes, we're being oppressed here, help us lol

>>133767982
your country is belgium tier

>>133767843
I see where you're coming from but I think it's a false equivalency because there were no shared culture with Yugoslavia and Bosnia where as there is between Hercegovina and Bosnia, it's one and the same and I have no idea why the country now is called "Bosnia & Hercegovina" except to try and divine and conquer

It would be like calling Germany "Deutschland unt Bayern", makes no sense

one day the muslims will be cleansed from the balkans

>>133768080
Not sure what that means but its pretty shit, if that's what you're trying to say.

>>133767982
Do you still have 3 "president"?

>>133749780
The world would be a lot better with them still around. That or Gaddafi, Assad, and Saddam.

>>133756286
find subs, watch this then comment cuckface

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0096403/
theatrical view of those times from a bulgarian point of view. Same or similar shit happened to our neighbours.

>>133753022

kudos. turkey needs more people like you. apologise for your mistakes to make peace with your neighbours and live on.

>>133768565
Yes, its hilarious

>>133768748
Do they ever agree on anything lol?

>>133768852
Stealing from the population

>>133759799
Dude, he's taunting you; do you see the difference between the European bridge and the ottoman one?

>>133768852
Nah, but the Serb and Croat president often cooperate because no one likes the muslims

>>133769137
Also this

>>133768639
El puto moro to the rescue

So what are the consequences of leaving pisslam in the Balkans? Do you get religion of peace'd?