Can we all agree trumpcare is obamacare only a lot worse

>>132208556
>implying their's anything wrong with genocide

No and you're retarded

>>132208671
You are the one getting genocided.

>>132208705
Even conseratives like Koch brothers and heritage think this is fucking awful.

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>>132208936
>Koch
>Conservative
Conservatives are Trotskyites

>>132208556
Wait who is it genociding?

>>132208556
There's no obamacare in it at all. It's a tax cut that is otherwise worse than nothing.

>>132211538
It'll cause suffering and death, but no it's not focused or fatal enough to call genocide.

>can we
>we
No.

>>132208556
It's the same thing minus forced sign ups.

>>132213050
Not quite, but even if that were the case it's enough to screw it up. The whole allowing for preexisting conditions thing (which is also fucked ten ways) requires healthy people in the pool to buffer it.

>>132208936

Kochs are open border radicals. They want nothing with tradionalism/religion/abortion. They're not conservative at all except maybe anti-welfare.

They're the globalist. I do admire how they and Soros subverted the left in america to abandon the working class and openly support the Koch agenda. It's more impressive the more you think about it.

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>>132208556
I supported Trump though the election, but I don't understand this foolish new healthcare plan. I think he should move towards medicaid for all.

>>132208556
Was there a genocide before ACA was enacted? How can people screech about all the dead people to come when we didnt have that shit until 09?

>>132208556
>Can we all agree trumpcare is obamacare only a lot worse and genocidal?
You shitlibs have no problem with genociding whites

>>132213197
>The whole allowing for preexisting conditions thing (which is also fucked ten ways) requires healthy people in the pool to buffer it.
This was the idea behind forcing people to buy insurance but it didn't work because half as many people signed up for it as they were expecting. The big difference with the new plan is that instead of subsidizing low income plans they subsidize people with pre-existing conditions by having them in a separate 'pool' than healthier people. I'm always against legislation that creates a sort of 'income wall' which punishes people trying to improve from low income to mid, so I think it's an improvement albeit a small one

>>132208727
no, only poor plebmerican

I have health insurance through my employer so I have a really hard time giving a shit
I'm just glad we wont' be subsidizing so much dead weight so maybe premiums and deductibles can come back down

>>132213836
Yeah it's a problem that health insurance that gets everyone on it is ludicrously expensive when the costs are left up to health insurance companies.

I'd honestly be in favor of requiring everyone to pay for some base level of health insurance similar to medicare, but inevitably we'd have leftists giving out the healthcare for free to illegals which would be too great a drain on the system.

It's all a shit situation with no good solution in sight.

>>132208556
I don't get the whole private vs. public healthcare insurance in the U.S at all. Just have private insurance companies compete every four years ([insert-presidents-name-here]care packets) about government contracts and the winner gets to have government compensate for them taking in all those who can't afford to make their own insurance plans. Everyone will be covered and those who want a better deal may negotiate a better deal on the private sector if the government one isn't enough. It's capitalism for those who can afford it and state-capitalism for those who are too poor or lazy to negotiate a better deal.

Competition cuts the costs per insurance recepient down. Corporations are always willing to deal with governments since they are not only good sources of revenue usually stable payers and thus are usually willing to cut down prices per recepient.

>>132213836
It was a shittily enforced rule, but it was picking up gradually.

Given the recent changes I'm not sure where the current AHCA stands, but the "separate pool" doesn't sound impressive. I'll agree with your last idea in spirit, but all I see actually happening is sick people being financially devastated more and more often.

>>132208727
>>132208556
Then why are the Leftists the ones crying about it? It's because they are about to get fucking slaughtered from our bayonets and their inability to contribute to society.

Later faggots!

>>132210679
The kochs are the reason the tea naggers exist.

>>132214085
Oh and if its about who finances who's healthcare you can always make it so that those on the government plan have a slight increase in their taxes but you also have to make having a health insurance mandatory. Just like with cars.

>>132213050
>It's the same thing minus forced sign ups.

You sign up except giving money to government you give it to insurance comanpies.

>>132214073
> but inevitably we'd have leftists giving out the healthcare for free to illegals which would be too great a drain on the system.
You don't need to be a citizen to go to the emergency room. And relying on emergency rooms is massively more expensive than having proper coverage.

I don't have an ideology, I just favor what works. The lefties have the right idea.

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>>132208556
>implying it's bad to send fats, niggers, spics, and boomers to their graves asap and not waste a single dollar more of taxpayer resources

>>132208556
It wont pass, it doesnt have the liberty caucus.
chilll your tits.

>>132214376
Except u do waste tax money. Do u know what emergency rooms visits cost compared to visiting clinics? You pay more for erengency rooms over clinic visits.

>>132208556
>worse
>genocidal

Pick one.

There are way too many Americans already, it's about time someone did something about it.

>>132214418
You know something similar to this passed the house after they added risk pool money?

>>132214376
Good thing economic and medical hardships only coincide for them, eh?

>>132214465
>There are way too many Americans already,

:( I don't want to die.

>>132214584
You'll be in good company.

>>132214073
>I'd honestly be in favor of requiring everyone to pay for some base level of health insurance similar to medicare, but inevitably we'd have leftists giving out the healthcare for free to illegals which would be too great a drain on the system.
I agree. It's impossible to have a purely free market solution as long as you believe that emergency care should be given regardless of insurance status and everyone but the edgiest libertarians would agree to that. It's all just a matter of figuring out how best to subsidize the worst of society

>>132214148
Sick people are financially ruined no matter what you try to do for them. The key is to give them just enough to survive, but little enough for them to still be motivated enough to try to work

>>132214699
>Sick people are financially ruined no matter what you try to do for them. The key is to give them just enough to survive, but little enough for them to still be motivated enough to try to work
Literally retarded. A person can have worked their whole life, have money put away and be supported by a working spouse, then medical issues nail them for hundreds of thousands of dollars after their coverage hits their cap.

"Motivated by subsisting on crumbs" is ideological nonsense. The more people have and the easier to survive and improve then the more they are motivated and ABLE to do. Do I need to go dig up research on this?

>>132214944
>A person can have worked their whole life, have money put away and be supported by a working spouse, then medical issues nail them for hundreds of thousands of dollars after their coverage hits their cap.
A person like this would have health insurance and be fine. I was more talking about people who stop working at 30 because their shoulder hurts (my uncle) and then live off of gibs for the rest of their lives

>>132214944
You could, but you'd be soundly ignored because facts should never get in the way of a cool story, bro.
There really is no solution but partition or genocide.

>>132215273
>A person like this would have health insurance and be fine. I
Have you ever had to file a health insurance claim, especially in the case of a complex medical situation? No? Then shut the fuck up and put your daddy's cock back in your mouth you ignorant fucking shill.

>>132215273
The BUSINESS of health insurance is to take your money and not give it back. You have to be 18 to be on this board.

>>132215273
>A person like this would have health insurance and be fine.
Until they hit their cap, as I already said. Under the new changes even the best coverage is crap if you actually need it for any amount of time.

>>132215320
>>132215361
wew lad. At least read the thread before you reply

>>132208556
I'm so confused as to how 24 million losing healthcare coverage automatically means that millions drop dead instantly.

The weak need to be put down. It's for the best.

>>132215481
Tens of thousands a year, more like. If you can't afford to be alive, you die. Straightforward enough, I thought?

>>132215468
those caps exist regardless of whether or not this passes so that's a different issue (though still valid)

>>132215701
ACA got rid of lifetime limits, AHCA brings them back.

>>132215473
I did. Know what the fuck you're talking about before you indulge in adolescent fantasies such as that health insurance pays for everything willingly and that insureds "would be fine". Almost nobody gets 0% copay anymore. Trumpcare isn't going to change that.
t.is paid to know about health insurance, you stupid child

>>132215628
Straightforward, but then you'll whine about not enough wipipo or about having to work too much to see your five kids or something else ridiculous. I certainly hope that the terminally ill an hero on all the corporate scumbags involved in health insurance privatization including both political parties.

>>132215795
I'm not quite sure what your complaint or point here is, but saying "fuck everyone" isn't really witty or useful. Stupid and edgy, more like.

>>132216150
>fuck everyone
Not everyone. Just reminding you to see consequences through to their ends, even the ones you don't like.
Also reminding people that centers of political power really do need to be destroyed.

>>132208556
Another bot shitposter?

>>132215795
If you'd read the thread you'd see I agreed with >>132214073. I'm well aware that insurance companies love to scam people. Might want to take that dick out of your ass

>>132215793
I forgot about that. I've always had a plan with no lifetime limit, even before the ACA. Can't imagine why anyone would bother getting a plan with one since that kind of defeats the purpose

>You can have nationalized healthcare, but in return, schools will privatize, several million children will grow up to be illiterate laborers. A healthy workforce to perform the manual labor jobs required to meet all facets of a strong society.
Do you accept?

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>>132214458
>>132214548

make it legal to deny them emergency care if they can't pay up front

these fuckers abuse the system of altruism, and they come here knowing it. they smoke knowing it. they eat cheezeburgers knowing it.

enough is goddamn enough. this dead weight is why healthcare costs so much in the first place and why you """need""" insurance.

>>132208556
>dead patient
>IV still in
Almonds activated

>>132216461
A better idea that has precedent in Europe is to charge medical care back to their home country.

>>132216283
>Also reminding people that centers of political power really do need to be destroyed.
Hmm let's say cleansed by fire. You need something useful there eventually.

>>132216461
I know you don't give a shit about them, but they actually serve a purpose in our economy. Wave a wand to remove them all, and several sectors of the economy collapse or go into tailspins.

>>132216381
>Do you accept?

Yes because my life trumps education.

>>132216641
>You need something useful there eventually.
I don't believe so. New ones will form that are structured differently without the institutional memory of the old system, something that isn't hidebound by muh norms and muh traditions, as DNC shitballs like to say it. Something that's a bit more responsive. Something that actually fears and respects the people rather than selling their labor to other countries, cheap.

>>132216641
In which case we'll find that numbers don't actually mean anything, and that goods and services delivered actually do. I suspect that nothing of value would be lost.

>>132216579
This way they can charge for more 'treatment'

>>132216863
Ah so you're basically like an anarchist, but without any of the usual planning or forethought.

Sure there's a better way to do things, but your approach would never get there. Of course, it isn't up to you or people like you anyway so I guess that works out.

>>132208671
fpbp

>>132208671
Good point

>>132216981
>Ah so you're basically like an anarchist, but without any of the usual planning or forethought.
I don't think that's a fair assessment. As you note, I'm unlikely to be among the actors that engineers whatever new system, and I'm not overly invested in the particulars as long as I can still vote with my feet. If either of those conditions were to change, I'd think it through a bit further. However, I believe that we all are somewhat responsible for smashing what's here now, as it won't smash itself.

>>132213393
That's what he rallied on

>I'm gonna take care of everybody, the government is gonna pay for it, I don't care if it loses me votes

>>132213393
>I think he should move towards medicaid for all.
Obama should have done it when the Dems had a majority in both houses and the White House. There was zero reason for us to get Obamacare and for them to call it a "compromise". They didn't need to compromise with anybody.

>>132208556
poor people should die. Its fair.

>>132217483
As long as they each take out two richies with them, I'm down with that.

>>132217276
I'm not convinced you wouldn't just smash things randomly. Even rioters need to know what the fuck they're fighting, if any good is going to come of it.

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>>132208556

>>132208936
The concept goes back to at least 1970, when the conservative Heritage Foundation proposed an individual mandate as an alternative to single-payer health care.[118] It was championed for a time by conservative economists and Republican senators as a market-based approach to healthcare

The 1993 Republican alternative, introduced by Senator John Chafee as the Health Equity and Access Reform Today Act, contained a "universal coverage" requirement with a penalty for noncompliance—an individual mandate—as well as subsidies to be used in state-based 'purchasing groups'.[124] Advocates for the 1993 bill included prominent Republicans such as Senators Orrin Hatch, Chuck Grassley, Bob Bennett and Kit Bond


After the 2016 election of Donald Trump as U.S. President, Heritage Foundation played a major role in shaping his transition team

they started obamacare

https://watch.pair.com/heritage.html
https://watch.pair.com/rockefeller.html

>The idea of the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA) originated with Heritage Fellow and CNP member, Richard Allen
https://exposingmodernmugwumps.com/tag/rockefeller-heritage-connection/

CFR-affiliated foundations include: The Carnegie Foundation, The Ford Foundation, The Heritage Foundation, and the Rockefeller Brothers Foundation, among others.
http://www.spingola.com/funding%20fathers.htm

http://www.newswithviews.com/Nelson/kelleigh377.htm

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>>132217813

>>132217937
Did you know that before 1973 it was illegal in the US to profit off of health care. The Health Maintenance Organization Act of 1973 passed by Nixon changed everything

>the law Nixon mandated also included clauses that encouraged medical providers to not CURE afflictions, but to PROLONG them by only treating the symptoms. There’s no money to be made in CURING sickness.


Is the health insurance business a racket? Yes, literally. And this is why the shameless pandering to robber baron corporations posing as “health providers” is such an egregious … and obvious … tactic to do nothing more than plump up insurance company profits.

the downfall of the American health insurance system falls squarely on the shoulders of former President Richard M. Nixon.

In 1973, Nixon did a personal favor for his friend and campaign financier, Edgar Kaiser, then president and chairman of Kaiser-Permanente. Nixon signed into law, the Health Maintenance Organization Act of 1973, in which medical insurance agencies, hospitals, clinics and even doctors, could begin functioning as for-profit business entities instead of the service organizations they were intended to be

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>>132208556
>genocidal
If he bans abortion, it will do the opposite of genociding niggers.

>>132218056
Ehrlichman: “This … this is a …”

Ehrlichman: “… private enterprise one.”

President Nixon: “Well, that appeals to me.”

Ehrlichman: “Edgar Kaiser is running his Permanente deal for profit. And the reason that he can … the reason he can do it … I had Edgar Kaiser come in … talk to me about this and I went into it in some depth. All the incentives are toward less medical care, because …”

Ehrlichman: “… the less care they give them, the more money they make.”

President Nixon: “Fine.”

Ehrlichman: [Unclear] “… and the incentives run the right way.”

President Nixon: “Not bad.”

https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Transcript_of_taped_conversation_between_President_Richard_Nixon_and_John_D._Ehrlichman_%281971%29_that_led_to_the_HMO_act_of_1973:

>>132217480
>impying obongo aint a shyster like bush and clinton

>>132217813
>genocide
is this not proof enough?

>>132210679
>Stalin
>Trotskyist
Stalin was like the Trump of the SU, he killed almost all jews from the leadership, who only took back full power after his death

Why do you think he gets blamed for every soviet atrocity while Lenin and Beria rarely get mentioned?
(I still dislike the Koch bros though)

>>132218278
Exactly my point

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>>132213393

>filename

hehe noice b8

>>132217813
wtf

>>132217630
I know of a few of the local oligarchs. Depending on just how many people are in this, the whole local patronage structure could be destroyed or at least significantly threatened.

>>132218880
>>132217937
>In 1993, kristol rose to fame as he led opposition to the Clinton's universal health care plan.

>Prominent opposition to the Clinton plan was led by William Kristol and his policy group Project for the Republican Future, which is widely credited with orchestrating the plan's defeat through a series of now legendary "policy memos" faxed to Republican leaders.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clinton_health_care_plan_of_1993

Obamacare was always Romneycare, the enforced payment of profit bloated insurance company billings, and it was invented by the conservitard Heritage Foundation.
http://www.csmonitor.com/Business/Robert-Reich/2013/1028/The-irony-of-Republican-disapproval-of-Obamacare

>>132217813
NO FUCKING WAY THIS PICTURE IS NOT FAKE... NO FUCKING WAY...
please anons dont tell me its not fake.
please...

>>132208556
How does it chanche the healtcare?
No-one in /pol/ has told anyt details for me.
Tel me. How Obamacare works and how Trumpcare works, and the difference between two.

Yes it's complete shit. Obongocare should have been repealed on day 1 and replaced with nothing.

>>132213916
this. I don't know a single person using obooba care. This shit is so blown out of proportion

>>132208556
It only hurts Democrats as the disabled were already voting blue en bloque (yes, even the whites).