Redpill me on Kratom /pol/ They're trying to ban it, even

I worked with a guy who was hooked on this shit,
He hated using it but the withdrawals or detoxing (I guess it's mildly addictive) gave him vicious headaches and when I left the company he was buying almost a box (12) a day. He was a fucking moron .

It's basically a poor man's heroin, that causes mild euphoria followed by crazy detox headaches

>>128296357
kratom shills

Its really lame.

People do it for the vegan-ish moral superiority compared to other drugs.

>Oh you do weed/coke/speed/mdma, i feel sorry for you, kratom is so much better.

>>128296357
Its already banned in Indiana where I live. Alot people around here used it to get off of heroin.

>>128297020
You have to abuse it like a moron to get it to do that. It's not a real deal drug. Apparently it helps some people deal with opiate addictions.

I don't see what the big deal is. I mean, some people are always going to be stupid.

Kratom fucking sucks

its extremely addictive. im coming off it right now and withdrawals are horrible... i dont think it kills or anything and it helps a lot of people. its not too expensive and anyone with any intelligence knows when they need to cycle down or off of it.

imo it should be legal. people compare it to coffee but it is much more powerful, though not quite enough to be worth banning

>>128296357
>plant
>banned
Statist scum hippity hoppity

>>128296357
Better than opioids, which I probably why it's illegal.

>>128297899
From what I gather the stuff going around today is rather more potent than it used to be. I haven't tried anything recent, but my guess is that if it's easy to feel "much more powerful" than coffee, then a lot of folks are probably mistaking it for something that's good for more than a mild mellow or buzz.

>>128296357

Made me dizzy and angry as fuck,

but my brother claims it helps with his pain management and PTSD

>>128296357
I remember reading about the plant years ago. I always wanted to plant that, and the miracle drumstick tree. you can eat the bark, roots, leaves,flowers,and seed pods.

Big pharma is always on the lookout for competition

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>>128296357
It's an opiate. It's addictive. It will make you look and sound like a junkie. It has the same side effects as opiates, constipation for instance, since it is an opiate. It has less potential to depress breathing than most opiates making it relatively safe. It makes you sick if you take too much making it hard to take too much.

>>128298152
It is an opioid. It's only legal because it hasn't been banned yet, the benefits of Napoleonic law.

>>128297020
based on this post I'd say it seems to be slightly worse for body and mind than pot but better or equal to coffee

>>128298404
because it is an opiate.

>>128298918
the withdrawal effects are much worse than pot too. Typical opiate w/d symptoms because it is an opiate.

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>>128298926
its not from the opiate family so It cant be an opiate. I take it everyday ama.

>>128298870
Opioids are synthetic opiates. Kratom is organic and biologically more related to coffee than opium, but it has a similar high, which is why people frequently use it to ween themselves from opiates/opioids.

>>128296357

I tried to use it for energy and motivation, but it didn't seem to do anything for me.

>>128299017
They aren't that fucking bad. But just keep spamming that shit. I was addicted to it for about 6 months. Wd symptoms are like quitting caffeine/nicotine at the same time. You want some wd that are hell? Get hooked on gabbapentin. I'd rather come off opiates any day.

>>128299313
Looks like charlie

What will you say if you get caught with it?

>>128299498
>>128299467
Idk, I hear so many mixed things, for some people it's like an opiate and for others it doesn't do shit

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>>128299625
Say its green tea or kratom bring me in dip shit faggot cop

>>128296357
see
>>128299361
mainly good for people with an opium problem, avoid it otherwise

>be me
> get hooked on pills
> stealing from friends and family who needed the pills for real
>feellikeanasshole.jpg
> discover kratom
> never steal pills again
The only withdrawal effect i have had from kratom is a runny nose and sneezing. It happens at the same time each evening that i usually take my kratom, and it goes away a few minutes after i take it.

>>128299854
A lot of that has to do with quality of the kratom. Also if your using a powdered plant expecting to get the same effect as pain pills or dope you're just setting yourself up to be disappointed

>>128299313
It works on opiate receptors, Its an opiate in my book. Causes opiate side effects, its an opiate in my book. Causes opiate withdrawal symptoms, its an opiate in my book. Maybe "opioid" is more accurate term, but you are LYING to yourself if you think it is closer to cannabis than opium.

I used to use it every day, but I decided I prefer to be myself, not act/think like a junkie, poop every single day, and generally stop cucking myself.

If you need something every day, you are either cucking yourself, or you are dealing with debilitating pain.

>>128299865
I once got searched during a suspected drug deal and I had a baggie of baking soda in my backpack that I used to neutralize occasional acid reflux. The cop gave me the best look when I told him what it was. Then he tasted it and was really pissed off it was really just baking soda.

>>128299361
>organic
Cyanide is organic.

Kratom works on the same receptors as opium derived opiates. If you think it is any less addictive or closer to cannabis than opium you are lying to yourself. Cuck yourself all you want, but know that a lot of experienced people see you as no different than any other opiate addict.

The addiction has a lot more to do with which receptors are being acted upon than it has to do with which substance is being taken.

>>128299017
>worse withdrawl than pot
oh wow, the drug withdrawl that has less effect than caffeine withdrawl
>less lethragy and being more outgoing
>sounds terrible

>>128298404
>Made me dizzy and angry as fuck
Same. The anger was completely irrational. Had to step outside away from anybody.

>>128299313
Why would anyone ask a heroin addict about heroin? Why would anyone ask a kratom addict about kratom?

Any info you would provide is biased beyond legitimacy since your brain is tricking you into thinking it is acceptable and benign.

You are manipulating the most deep seeded reward system in your brain. Your behavior is shaped by what triggers these reward systems. This is a subconscious process. You are not the same person you would be without a mitragynine addiction.

>>128300262
I use it for depression and anxiety. Before i was introduced to kratom i was crippled with depression. Didnt leave my house until all i haf was condiments in my fridge, slept 15 hours a day and only went out at night to my local 24/7 grocery store.

Its saving my life

>>128298918
>Worse than pot for body and mind
>Better than coffee for body and mind.

You're a fucking moron.

>>128300467
I don't do any of them, and I didn't say it's harmless. I should have clarified that i agree with this anon.
>>128299949

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>>128300824
valid point. i am biased. I dont get a buzz from it anymore. it literally just breaks the fog my mind and body are in. Lets me function like a normal person.

I still have to force my enotions, smile, good day how are you etc... but its 9000% easier.

>>128296357
It is good for opiate addicts to break their habit without methadone.
However, personally I don't like it and every time I have taken it I drink too much to feel the effects and end up feeling pretty sick afterwards.

C- ; can't recommend it

>>128299361
>has a similar high
Because it works on the same receptors as morphine, heroin, codeine, etc. The RECEPTORS that it acts upon has a lot more to do with its effects than the family the chemical structure qualifies for membership of.

If I made a sugar molecule with the same receptor affinities and pharmacological properties of fentanyl, nobody would even bother to comment that it's a member of the sugar family, therefore any attempt to categorize mitragynine as a xanthine is purposeful misinformation, when speaking about it in a pharmacological sense.

>>128296357
I take it only at night to help with chronic pain. Helps me sleep because sleeping while in pain in next to impossible.

>>128297020
If you're a fucking imbecile like this jackass and take the shit 24/7 you're going to have problems. Unlike opioids abuse is not fatal, but I believe it's possible to become physiologically addicted.

People like this will inevitably get the stuff banned, which is a shame because it clearly has medical uses. If a pharma company develops a drug based on the active Kratom alkaloids they'll run the rest of the pain management industry out of business. It'll basically be next-gen pain relief.

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>>128301385
I follow you now.

I like how its natural. My liver and kidneys arent suffering.

>>128299498
>like quitting caffeine/nicotine
basically heroin w/d's then. The big issue is the emotions junkies have to deal with , the actual physical symptoms aren't much worse than the flu.

I think all drugs should be legal, but we shouldn't play this "its just a plant" bullshit game. We shouldn't play this "kratom is just like weed" bullshit game. We should be honest so others can use these substances with informed consent.

There is a lot of bullshit marketing that goes along with kratom and it will only serve to strengthen the effort to ban it in the end.

>>128301670
This.

Misinformation is the biggest reason why a lot of this shit is banned in the first place.

>>128301670
I would buy this illegaly just like how I buy pot.

>assuming it would be in the same class as pot

Theres nothing wrong with it. You have to be seriously weakminded to get addicted to it and abuse it 24/7. Its like those assholes that get "addicted to pot", they have no idea what theyre talking about and have no will power.

>>128300016
Thats how all opiate w/d's start, because it is an opiate. Have fun :D

For real though, I am glad you found a way to avoid stealing and avoid using worse opiates. Hopefully some day you can find a healthy way to fill whatever void you have that kratom fills.

>>128300540
just don't lie to yourself that it is closer to pot than opium.

if pot is 1 and opium is 10, kratom is 8.

I am against all prohibition, but I am for honest information about drugs. I have done more drugs than you know exist, kid.

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>>128302099
>checked

why is kratom rating an 8?

Its closer to pot because its un processed plant life.

However its effects are nothing like pot

>>128301304
I'm glad it's working for you. Hopefully you can find a way some day to train your brain to function without it. Have you considered growing the plant?

Sorry If I come off harsh, I can be an ornery asshole, lost a few friends because they thought they could control addictions, at least kratom is REALLY hard to die on.

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>>128296357
On the 7th day Kek gave kratom to man. To cure the coming society of dope head degenerates. The pharma shills want you addicted to opiates and stimulants. Kratom cures all forms of addiction.Federal government fails to ban it just as trump wins in November. Kek wills it so.

>>128301822
Grow it. Chances are your local police don't have a botanist on staff.

>>128298918
its in the same plant family as coffee actually

>>128296357
Wait I thought they stopped trying to ban it? Any sauce on that?

Kratom is the single best nootropic I ever used, I'll have to hoard the shit out it if true.

>>128302272
Opium is barely processed. How much a plant is processed doesnt really mean shit. Look at the angel's trumpet, in its unprocessed form you could die from eating a single leaf, but if you extract the actives and meter the dose properly you can turn some unlucky fuck into a zombie who will gladly empty their bank account for you.

>Naturalistic Fallacy
Look into it.

>>128300991
what strand do you buy for depression?

I read that there are many types of kratom

>>128299017
>>128298926
>>128298870
>>128298667
>>128300262
>>128300467
you are a shill, its not an opiate you fucking moron...for fucks sake you are a dumbass go kill yourself

>>128302823
red vein bali

>>128302427
good idea. dunno if i can grow it in my climate?

>>128302272
I rate it 8 on that scale because the active ingredients are almost identical in effect to the active ingredients of opium. The only major difference is the chemical structure and the lack of bronchial depression, which is the main actor in opiate overdose deaths. This makes it hard to die from, but in all other ways the subjective experience to the user is incredibly similar to opium derived opiates.

>>128302354
no worrys. I feel like i should defend it because Its working for me.

>>128301917
>>128302099
kratom is not an 8 fucking retard, 13 posts from this id..all full of shit..you dont even know what your talking about...

>>128302920
whatever faggot. You don't like the truth? Go eat some moonflowers. What do you call something that works on opiate receptors exclusively?

>>128299498
>Get hooked on gabbapentin.

Doctor put me on that stuff. Getting off involved teeth-clenching pain. This pharmaceutical is much worse than kratom wd.

Clonazepam was also worse. I was literally dependent on it for sleep.

>>128303008
You might not be able to grow enough to use consistently, but you could have a bush or a few. People in norther climates can grow it by moving it in and out doors seasonally. There is probably a whole forum dedicated to growing kratom.

It's just really fulfilling to cultivate plants you enjoy. Worth a try anyway. Maybe your vendor will send a seed or two if you ask nicely.

>>128303169
it doesnt exclusively act on opiate receptors though, that just propaganda, there are over 20 different alkaloids...its literally the same scientificly classed plant family as coffee...sorry that you are retard but you sound just like the people who say weed makes black people rape white women...you probably are an fda/dea shill to be honest

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>>128303090
I'll fuck you till you love me, faggot.

>>128302592
do you have ADHD?

where can I get Kratom right now?

>>128302949
White borneo gives good feels if you havent tried it.

Cheapest place i know to get is krakenkratom dot com

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>>128303400
>propaganda
on both sides. now start suckin this dick, I didn't bring it out for fresh air.

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>>128303063
You've obviously never tried either faggot.

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>>128303445
fuck off shareblue

>>128303482
thanks for the link, my batch is like 5 years old now. Should probably get some fresh stuff in case I need some real pain relief.

>>128303605
bitch i took it every day when i raised 550k for the NRCC in 2010 when we took back the majority in the House of Reps. I have taken more drugs than you know exist.

I tried the infused shot drinks once and it gave me lucid dreams for months afterwards
Didn't like it, wouldn't do it again.
Be like Trump, be straight edge. Don't fuck with your brain and be retarded on purpose.

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>>128303612
Ive done more to help the republican party than you will in your entire life.

>>128303536
God doesnt even know you exist piggy...
If He did, Hed kill u instantly.

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>>128303482
thnx

>>128296357

I have tried different strands of Kratom from multiple nations over the past years

It's good. I know folks who get hooked on it though.

but when you compare a "kratom withdrawal" from opiate/heroin withdrawal it is a lotttttt easier

that is why people are flippin a bitch is because if all the heroin users were kratom users instead society would technically be better off, and even the drug addicts themselves would be healthier

that's my 2c

especially since the opiate issues being faced today

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>>128303800
because god is a middle eastern super hero from ancient comic books, Achmed.

Ok, I will stop shitting up this thread. Enjoy your conversation dudes!

>>128303796
lol your a fucking retard..it doesnt count when your on a politics simulator program dip shit

>>128303976
literally the dumbest poster on /pol/ in months..how you must be trying really hard..ive seen paid shills not even make it to the levels you are reaching

>>128297020
I tried that stuff a couple weeks ago too and did it heavy for a week. Detoxing from that shit for the past week has been horrendous. I don't think my liver liked it.

>>128303976
oh hell no, now you bring my boy lee into this..SAGE

>>128296357
I dont even know what that is. Its the first time i ever heard about it. Is it like legal weed?

Kratom can help a lot of people, but it isn't that healthy. It also comes from Indonesia, so there's no telling what you're actually buying.

>>128304448
What? Did I miss something? The poster you replied to isn't even the OP...

>>128297020
>It's basically a poor man's heroin,

Heroin is the poor man's heroin

>>128299361
>Kratom is organic
protip: "organic" (mostly) means there's carbon in it. Gasoline is organic. All organisms are organic. Plastic is organic.

>>128299361
I knew a dude that started on kratom after being clean (as in, not on suboxone) when he had a bad week of cravings and depression. Fell off the wagon and now he uses both kratom and oxys again, probably has a life expectancy of a year honestly.

It's a legit drug. I was using it when I quit drinking and then i realized I was just replacing booze with another substance. It can get you pretty faded man, almost no difference from an opioid high for me

>>128296357
A few years back I bought some heavily concentrated grade A kratom extract, it had an opïoid-like effect which lasted a good couple of hours and was quite pleasant. But the taste of that plant is awful... As soon as the kratom-tea enters your mouth, your body wants you to puke... Never had a tougher drink in my entire life, and i'm the kind of guy that enjoy conterfeit chinese sake...

>>128296357
i bought a small bag to fuck around with. yes it does give you a mediocre opiate like high
i didnt use it long enough to experience withdrawls and anything but it did indeed get me high, and i felt the itches one normally feels on opiates.
tasted like fucking lawn trimmings sucked out of somebodys ass desu though

>>128303240
Same for me with the gab. I couldn't sleep when I did I woke up drenched in sweat. Body aches worse than any fever nausea constantly. I'll never take another one again. The worst part is it was marketed as non addictive.

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>http://www.rootsofheaven.com/2015/10/kratom-mitragyna-speciosa.html

Kratom is the name of a leaf native to Thailand, Malaysia, Indonesia, and Papua New Guinea that comes from the tree known as Mitragyna speciosa. Kratom is in the same family as Coffee (Rubiaceae) and is botanically related to Corynanthe yohimbe, as well as Uncaria tomentosa and Uncaria rhynchophylla (Cat's claw). Kratom also shares phytochemicals with Yohimbe and Cat's claw, and contains an extraordinary amount of epicatechin and catechin, two compounds found in Camellia sinensis (Green tea) that possess potent anti-oxidant activity. In addition to these compounds, kratom also contains two opioid agonists and one opioid antagonist. Obviously, it is of great potential interest to sufferers of pain, addicts of drugs, and to the field of medicine as a whole.

Kratom has traditionally been used for diarrhea, relieving pain, improving work ethic, depression, and opium detoxification. It contains over 25 known active compounds with the following pharmacological actions:

● Ajmalicine (Raubasine): Cerebrocirculant, antiaggregant, anti-adrenergic (at alpha-1), sedative, anticonvulsant, smooth muscle relaxer
● Corynantheidine: Opioid antagonist
● Corynoxeine: Calcium channel blocker
● Corynoxine A and B: Dopamine mediating anti-locomotives
● (-)-Epicatechin: Antioxidant, antiaggregant, antibacterial, antidiabetic, antihepatitic, anti-inflammatory, anti-leukemic, antimutagenic, antiperoxidant, antiviral, cancer preventative, alpha-amylase inhibitor
● 9-Hydroxycorynantheidine: Partial opioid agonist
● 7-Hydroxymitragynine: Analgesic, antitussive, antidiarrheal; primary psychoactive in kratom
● Isomitraphylline: Immunostimulant, anti-leukemic....

(continued)

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>>128307382

● Isopteropodine: Immunostimulant
● Mitragynine: Analgesic, antitussive, antidiarrheal, adrenergic, antimalarial, possible (5-HT2A) antagonist (anti-psychotic)
● Mitraphylline: Vasodilator, antihypertensive, muscle relaxer, diuretic, anti-amnesic, possible immunostimulant
● Paynantheine: Smooth muscle relaxer
● Rhynchophylline: Vasodilator, antihypertensive, calcium channel blocker, antiaggregant, anti-inflammatory, antipyretic, anti-arrhythmic, antithelmintic
● Speciociliatine: Weak opioid agonist
● Speciogynine: Smooth muscle relaxer
● Speciophylline: Anti-leukemic
● Tetrahydroalstonine: Hypoglycemic, adrenergic (alpha-2 adrenergic antagonist)

Looking at Kratom's pharmacological profile, it is no wonder that it has been used for a variety of purposes in it's native habitats, specifically Thailand, where the leaf was chewed not only to increase work ethics but as an effective treatment for overcoming the opium addiction that was ravaging the locals. (1) On August 3, 1943, the government of Thailand passed the Kratom Act 2486. This law makes planting the tree illegal and requires existing trees to be cut down. This law was not found effective, since the tree is indigenous to the country. Before this act was passed, the Thai government was applying duties and collecting taxes from opium users and vendors, causing the habit to become unaffordable for many. This is when Kratom first became noticed by government officials, as the opium users started using the leaf to manage their symptoms of opiate withdrawal and end their addiction. At the beginning of the East Asian War in 1942, the diminishing profits from opium taxation forced the Thai government into action, banning their native tree in the efforts of recovering lost income from the government's taxation of opium.

(continued)

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>>128307382
>>128307571

Police Major General Pin Amornwisaisoradej, a member of the House of Representatives from Lampang in a special meeting on 7 January 1943:

"Taxes for opium are high while kratom is currently not being taxed. With the increase of those taxes, people are starting to use kratom instead and this has had a visible impact on our government’s income. (2)"

Sadly, it seems, that a similar situation is occurring today as well. Thanks to Kratom's analgesic and addiction disrupting qualities, it is now being used as an herbal remedy to assist opiate detoxification as well as managing pain symptoms. To many, the leaf is a godsend and is a much safer alternative to pharmaceutical pain killers and anti-depressants. Unfortunately, the herb has not received FDA approval and is relatively unknown to western herbalists. Even more unfortunate, is that the plant has found itself in the hands of the legal high industry, touted as a "euphoric opiate stimulant drug" and not given the proper recognition it deserves as a therapeutic medicinal herb. This irresponsible marketing has recently caused 3 different states to enact legislation on the herb, calling it a "new synthetic drug". It seems that in the haste to put an end to these new & harmful synthetic drugs, Kratom has once again been caught in the crossfire. Hopefully this is just a passing phase, and more research can be given to this wonderful herb that has the potential to improve the lives of many.

Sources:

(1). Asnangkornchai, S. & Siriwong, A. (eds.) 2005. Kratom Plant in Thai Society: Culture, Behavior, Health, Science, Laws.

(2). Series on Legislative Reform of Drug Policies Nr . 13 April 2011 "Kratom in Thailand" Decriminalisation and Community Control? By Pascal Tangua

https://www.tni.org/files/download/kratom-briefing-dlr13.pdf

Kratom leaf powder can be purchased at Meridian Botanicals here: https://meridianbotanicals.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=243

I didn't know 4chan could use bullets

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>>128307916
It can even use zalgo

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>>128307773
thnx for the info. any info on how to grow in northern climates? is it worth growing a few small trees and bringing them inside due winter time?

>>128308077
No goy buy from hi- I mean that website.

>>128308077
I've never tried growing kratom, but growing a few pots of something you like, kratom, peppers, tomatoes, whatever, can be unexpectedly personally rewarding. It's rather different from just houseplants that sit around and look nice.

Might as well have at it.