Hey /out/, I'm usually on /k/ but I figured I should come

>>822895
If you just got interested in /out/ you shouldn't spend too much on gear. Buy something cheap. If you find out you really like /out/ then only buy stuff that you really want/like.

Even for a dayhike think in advance, what you're going to do? What you're going to need? In addition to that you should have some basic 'surival gear' to get you out alive if everything goes wrong. That includes some sort of rain cover if you don't have a tent (a tarp), a way to start a fire (a bic lighter with esbit tablets or something) and a way to boil water for drinking (a metal container). Maybe insect repellent depending on where your going. You're on /k/ so you probably know how important a good knife is.

>what should I look for in a ruck
that it fits you. Everything else is a matter of preference.

>Light Infantry packs
>Infantry
Do as you like, but /out/ generally prefers gear made for out, not for war.

>>822895
Look up "the 5 c's for survival"
Start small.

Survival in normal living conditions is really child's play, that's why there are things like the boy scouts.

Stay in your backyard for a day with a pen and paper. Write down what you need as it comes to you. I know it sounds stupid but nature will give you the answers.

10 mins in; hmm it's awfully hot, I should dress light
30 mins in; hmm it's awfully sunny I should bring a hat/shades
4 hours in; hmm I'm awfully hungry, I should bring snacks

I'm busting your balls a little but I'm not lying.

>>822895
If you're not in a hurry, why not lurk here a little
We have this thread every week
If you check the catalog, there is one up already

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This is what I took on a winter 3 day hunt. Pretty much the same I take backpacking minus the orange and rifle.

>>822895
The problem with copying military packing is that the military is predicated on the concept of resupply. If they run out of food, water or ammo, a helicopter or truck will deliver more. So what they pack is completely different than what someone like you should pack for your outdoor adventures.

>>822928
You assume you know how every branch of the military works

>>822928
Sure just send over that truck or blackhawk during a 7 day recon you dumb cunt

>>822928
Many of the more recent military packs are being made by top tier civilian /out/ companies

>>822928
The reason I went with Light Infantry is that they have no vehicles to carry their supplies. Once they are put into an area they are on their own, and thus, have to carry all their shit with thim.

That being said, I get what you mean. I'll definitely keep that in mind and not blindly follow a gear list

>>822910
I'm not gonna get milsurp. At all. I'm in the same boat when it comes to /out/ gear vs. militaria. The military uses gear made by the lowest bidder, and the quality usually reflects that unless it's being used by a specialized unit

Also, what advice do you have for knives/multitools? Don't really go into knife threads.

>>822931
Please tell us this military group that doesn't resupply their soldiers.
>>822932
You on the other hand are the other kind of stupid.

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>>822928

>>822939
Yes, lowest bidder. But the fucking gear still has to meet quality co from requirements. Jesus fuck you cunts think all their shit is made in China by one handed leperous grannies?

>>822940
Periodic resupy not daily you pathetic non veteran scum

>>822940
Do you not know what recon is? Jesus Christ.

>>822945
I know there are standards, but I'd much rather buy something thats simple and reliable for the same price as some "Operator" gear

>>822946
Get bent. The anon was talking about what is packed.
>>822947
Yes , which is what makes you sound even more troll worthy with your tongue in cheek challenge to "just send over that truck or blackhawk."

I wish pogs would leave.

>>822895
Do you plan on hunting/fishing or collecting food? Because food is very important, but if you plan on bringing food you will need a larger pack.

A good pack would be something like a medium alice pack, or something simalar like a canadian forces 82 pack, or norwegian army ruck. But if you insist on going tacticool check out brands like condor, 5.11 tactical, direct action or mil tec. If you go tactical go for molle, it gives you much more versatility.

When packing you should work your way outwards in order of importance (ie: Socks at the bottom first aid pack on top). I reccomend lining the main compartmant of your bag with a large garbage bag, this will keep your stuff waterproof, because most packs arent really waterproof. Fold and roll your clothing: socks and underwear, Warm pants (wool or cotton), a fleece jacket, hat and gloves, and a shemagh. Depending on the climate of where you live you can make adjustmants where appropriate. As for what you wear hiking out, go light. T shirt and hot weather pants (I have a pair of woodland bdu pants labled "hot weather bdu" which are made of nylon ripstop, they are great for the heat since they are thin and breathable, but keep your legs safe which shorts dont. Get a pair of boots broken in too. Pack a tarp or tent + a sleeping bag, these get tied to the bottom of your bag (some packs have straps for this). Bring a metal canteen made of stainless steel or titanium. Alluminum might be light and heat fast, but it leeches into your water and can cause alzheimers. Also bring a pot and pan if you want the extra weight go for cast iron otherwise follow the same lines of the canteen. Bring a fork, spoon and a dedicated food knife if you want. Bring a first aid kit and paracord. Then bring firestarting equipment (ferro rod, matches, lighter) check your local laws for making a fire cause some places wont let you. If you cant burn wood bring a gas stove.

Part 2...

>>822939
>I'm not gonna get milsurp
Maybe a canteen cup? It's good for boiling water. If no surplus look up Zebra pots. You can use common water/soda bottles to carry the water you bring.

>multitools
Leatherman or Victorinox, anything else is not worth buying. That being said I don't carry a multitool (I have some at home). Yes, it is handy in many situations, but it's heavy and I rather carry something else for that weight.

Instead of a multitool, consider a Bacho Laplander (or similar saw) and a strong knife that can be used for batoning. Schrade makes cheap chinese knives with thick blades. If you're going to baton, learn first how to do it right. To split anything big or knotty, use wooden wedges. They are easy to do if you have a big knife and a saw. If you just want a cheap good knife, get a Mora Companion or Heavy Duty and don't baton them.

>>822953
As for tools: bring 2 knives a mora classic or companion, and a mid sized knife 4-6" blade length and 1/8th " thick, Carbon steel is good. Bring a hatchet or axe (gransfor bruks or go home). Bring a folding saw too.

If you live in bear country bring bear spray, and if you plan on hunting bring a set of knives for butchering and field dressing (Something like a buck 119 for field dressing and an old hickory 10" butchers knife + a skinner and a boning knife. If not just bring some food like trail mix and dry frozen meals. If youre going fishing bring your rod ofc and a pair of pliers and filleting knife. As well as your hooks and lures etc.

And bring whatever gun you please.

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Ok I'll chime in.

First to start, the whole military gear thing on /out/ is a trigger.

Some people like tactical style stuff, but it's not nearly common on the /out/ side as it is in the /k/ side.

For real hiking and backpacking, get a proper hiking style backpack. There are dozens upon dozens to pick from. Often military style packs aren't ideal for your typical camping, whereas a backpacking pack is made just for that.

As for knives, some will say they are essential. These people often bushcrafters. As a general rule bushcrafters are frowned upon here. They often don't follow the "leave no trace" philosophy by leaving half asked shelters behind. Now don't get me wrong, this is not ALL bushcrafters, but it is common among the amateurs out there.

I use a knife to cut open packages, and sometime cordage. That's it. I don't use it for "survival". Camping isn't about "surviving". It's about having fun, not struggling to stay alive. A morakniv companion is about $15 and will serve you well. I also have a buck Bantam folder knife which is great. I've never had a need for a multitool while being out. I carry one for work daily and never hike with it.

It's really not all the hard to get supplies to camp. You need shelter, warmth, food, and water.

A tent, sleeping bag, sleeping pad, way to make fire, water and food, and you'd be just fine.

>>822962
>I use a knife to cut open packages, and sometime cordage. That's it. I don't use it for "survival". Camping isn't about "surviving".
It's not about surviving, but if you don't have the essential gear, what are you going to do if you need to survive? Call help with you iPhone?

>You need shelter, WARMTH, food, and WATER.
>way to make FIRE
That's where the knife comes into the picture. Going out camping without a proper knife is like going for a dayhike with nothing but a water bottle.

>>822980
A knife isn't essential though. I have a tarp, hammock, under quilt, top quilt, folding saw, lighter, fire steel, cook kit, fuel... ect ect... what is the knife going to do for me? I carry ine, doesn't mean it's essential. I've never needed a knife while out. Breaking apart a rock lends a sharp edge in a pinch.

If you come prepared to camp, you don't use a knife much. At all. A knife just isn't that useful most of the time.

And please, if you're going to tell me that you use your knife to make a shelter, then just leave. Bushcraft somewhere else.

>>822991
Why all the bushcraft hate?

>>823009
They are outdoor tryhards

Which means your typical backpackers ego is threatened by them.

>>823009
>>823014
I don't see why anyone tries to fit into either being a backpacker or a bushcraft er. I consider myself somewhere in the middle. I carry a light gas stove and pack that backpackers might use, and carry a bushcraft knife and wear heavier duty boots. I would think most of you /out/ists fit somewhere in the middle as well.

I'm a minimalist who wants convenience, light weight and zero-prep food.

I don't carry a stove except in cold weather because cooking food is work. I can cook at home and don't want to hump the house when out having fun.

I do caffeine pills instead of coffee at home along with various vitamins and pack those in prescription bottles for convenience when hiking.

I like MREs and strip them or civilian equivalents out to my preferences if available. I didn't go innawoods for a gourmet meal. Everyone has a favorite recipe for gorp/ homemade trail mix. It's light and convenient. Zero prep food avoids bringing cooking tools so there's that.

Hot weather woodland BDUs are the most comfy pants of any kind I've ever worn.

Bushcraft is work. I don't go innawoods to work even slightly more than I can avoid.

Hammock + rainfly or tarp = maximum comfort if you have places to hang it. Cheap hammocks work fine. If it rains, you stay dry. If it gets windy your hammock won't go anywhere. Fuck tents.

My back is fucked so I sleep in a hammock (ENO Doublenest) at home. I like my Hennessy Expedition for camping because I can hang it high then take advantage of the bottom entry if I have to piss at night. Built-in mosquito net is nice in the South. Check hammock forums for info. Many hangers make their own. It's the least expensive comfy lightweight sleep option.

My Leatherman stays on my belt where every I go (mechanicfag/DIYer) so I don't notice it hiking.

Camelbak + bladder canteen works for me. So does the thick G.I. DEET cream for skin and Permethrin on all clothing. My wife got Lyme disease while clearing brush at home and it ruined the last few years of her life. Take every tick precaution. Lyme is spreading.

>>822895
Sorry for the delayed reply, I should have expected a shitstorm (kinda fdid, but working)

If you just want a rec for a good pack:

ALPS OutdoorZ Commander Freighter Frame plus Pack Bag.

If you just want a rec for a good knife:

Condor Stratos.

Both on Amazon. I have both. Both very excellent.

Have a nice day.

>>823009
Because every time I go into my local state forest I find a dozen half assed "shelters" lashed together with paracord. There's always garbage, a fireplace full of half burnt cans, and a bunch of trees missing limbs. Half the time there's a tree half chopped through, where the bushcrafters got tired of chopping at and gave up. It goes against everything good about being outside, away from people.

>>822980
>Going out camping without a proper knife is like going for a dayhike with nothing but a water bottle
I have been backpacking and mountaineering for decades with a swiss army knife
Fires are usually unnecessary and often impossible
>>823009
because it is a millennial fad that has no respect for the backcountry or other people

>>823056
This x1000

I used to bushcraft.

I was 10 years old. We called it "building forts" back then.

>>822962
>half asked
son, it's "ASSED" I've never seen half assing half assing. jesus.

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>>823082
>2016
>don't know about autocorrect
>clearly his autocorrect kicked in
>mfw.jpg

>>822962
do agree about the knife thing tho, half asked aside. thru-hiked the AT with a leatherman micra, us thru hikers always had a good laugh at the kids out for a day or two with giant ass bowies and shit. I carry a bigger knife (opinel) and sometimes a kukri, but those are just for fun to widdle or hack unbreakable firewood in camp. Would most likely abandon them in a survival situation.

>>823085
I know, I just thought I could be funny. Back to bushcraft hate.

>>823086
Dude I NEED a cold steel 9" tanto folding bowie with a bottle opener, otherwise how am I going to baton my firewood? Use an axe? What are you fuckin gay?

>>822895
Hello, OP.

I'm somewhat limited in experience, but I think some of what I DO know may be of value to you. Here goes:

Packs are like pistols. Most will get the job done (obviously, it depends on the job) - but, only some feel "just right". Choose a size that accomodates your needs and then find the best fitting one. I've tried ALICE packs and they just weren't for me (weight, layout and comfortability were all subpar). I settled on a monstrous sized pack (Kelty Coyote 80) and I just don't fill it to the brim. It fits me great, has a layout I like and isn't nearly as heavy as milsurp.

A lot of sc/out/s ITT have given good suggestions gearwise. Ultimately, it comes down to personal preference. I bring a Sawyer Mini water filter every /out/ing. Sometimes, I bring a LifeStraw as well. I bring my full tang Buck knife every time. Sometimes, I bring a folding saw or a small bow saw (depends on length and location of trip). I like hot food fir little work, so I carry an MSR pocket stove and a few freeze dried meals (and instant coffee). I always have a Bic, but occasionally bring flint & steel.

Beyond that, there's many forms of shelter to choose from. I've slept under a tarp next to a trench fire and it was cozy as fuck. I've been miserable in a tent that was just a bit too small. I always bring a small tarp (or 2), but even a large sheet of plastic cut up would do in a pinch. I have a couple different inflatable mats, but I default to my ThermaRest Z-Lite folder.

Take what anyone says with a grain of salt (don't forget to pack that, too!). There's so many options and opinions. Get something, go /out/ and try it and eventually you will find what you're looking for. Good luck and have fun!

>>823054
A true bushcrafter would have lashed it together with spliced spruce roots and eaten food that mother nature provides. You speak of the survival show wannabes. Their shelters and cans are left behind because they heard a noise 5 minutes into the night and booked it out of there.

>>822928
No.

Millitary-style packs are made to be sturdy, modular and organized. If you want all of those at the cost of some extra weight then it's perfectly fine to go /out/ with it.

>>823182
Sure. Why doesn't every goddamn little fuck with a pinterest account, an unused granforst brooks ax and canvas backpack go out and find themselves some spruce roots. And go around foraging for food. And building shitty survival shelters. YOU DON'T HAVE ANY CONCEPT HOW MUCH IT FUCKS WITH THE WOODS TO HAVE IDIOTS LIKE YOU DOING THIS SHIT ON A REGULAR BASIS. Goddamn. Not only is it destructive to the environment on a short term, it'll cause greater damage in the long run. It's also hideous. Just stop with this bushcraft shit. Go do it on some privately owned trash land, not in parks or ecosystems that need things like living spruce trees to be healthy.

>>823221
Clearly a UK fag where their forests are miniscule at best. Or perhaps an Amerilard who lives on a 1/4 acre plot and is butthurt his neighbor who has many hundreds of acres won't let him play.

>>822895
Fellow /k/ommando here, so I'm not some /out/istic UL faggot here to bust your balls...

>I think looking at what Light Infantry packs would be a decent place to start, but you guys are pretty much experts from what I hear.

The problem with modelling yourself after the military is quite simply that you're not the military. The military plans on infantry to move in squads at bare minimum, have an FOB nearby that they work from, and have a specific operational objective they're trying to meet.

You look at a legit military pack out list and, at best, it's a few changes of clothes, some food, and a shit ton of ammo/operational equipment.

My suggested list:

>A bag
50L is a decent 3 day size. If you're good at packing and don't have bad weather conditions, you could get away with maybe a 35L bag. 70L if you're planning on snow shit, because you'll need bulkier cold weather gear.

>Land nav tools for your area
Topos + a compass. Getting lost in the wrong area will get you killed, plain and simple.

>sleeping bag + tent + sleeping pad
This is general "shelter". Keeps bugs and elements off, keeps you warm. A two-person tent is sufficient and small enough. No need for crazy UL shit unless you're going out in extreme weather and need magical materials to keep you safe.
The pad is not a comfort option, btw. Even in summer, night is colder than day, and such WILL wake you up, disturb sleep, and cause general fatigue for the rest of your outing.
You can hammock camp too, but I know nothing about this. Bear in mind that it's just as heavy and bulky as tent camping; it IS a comfort option.

>Water stuff
I use a 3L hydration blatter + a canteen + a shemagh + water purification tablets.
Why a shemagh? Wipe dew off stuff in the morning, and squeeze it into your canteen of course. Not everywhere is full of rivers.
Rule of thumb: try to maintain 1 gallon (4L) per person per day. This is for not only drinking, but cooking too.

1/?

>>823246
2/?

>Food
Dry goods and cured meats. Canned shit = useless weight + non-field disposable remains, so don't fuck with it.
rice-a-roni type shit is good, summer sausage...asian shit is good too, because alot of their foods are either dried (mushrooms, noodles, rice, etc) or fermented and stable (soy sauce, miso, etc).
Beans can be done and are a good dry protein, but bear in mind that dried beans take something in the neighbourhood of 3 hours to cook...
Bisquik, or any quickbread mix can give you a good source of carbs.
Discussing food and cookery really banks on how good at /ck/ shit you are though.
You could hypothetically make anything from chicken and dumplings, kebabs or red beans and rice in the field if you know what you're doing.

Cookery is what it is. If you know how to into /ck/ shit, just google "camping cookware" and ask yourself whether you can make food in such-and-such folding pot, and whether you have the space to pack it.

>Firecraft
I carry a ferro rod and lighters. Add TP and rubbing alcohol, and you've got tinder and accelerant. Seriously, if you can't start a fire with that, don't go outside.
In addition to this, I count an axe as a fire tool, as basically, it's only use is to split logs for burning. Sure, you could take a machete, but you could also have a hard time splitting hard woods -- cultures that invented machetes all lived in areas with soft woods. You could also baton, but that's for tryhard faggots who like to break knives.

I'd suggest googling different methods for building fires too, just so you can get an idea as to how to build one, how to use feather sticks, how to make tinder when you don't have any, etc. You'd be suprised how hard it is for armchair faggots to build a fire that reliably works.

>>823221>>823182
Hold on I might have some input
>YOU DON'T HAVE ANY CONCEPT HOW MUCH IT FUCKS WITH THE WOODS TO HAVE IDIOTS LIKE YOU DOING THIS SHIT ON A REGULAR BASIS.

>Spruce roots
as a matter of time consumption and effectiveness, as well as possible damage, it's shit

> And go around foraging for food
Well if you're on an authorized population-culling hunting trip, that has a camping component on the tail end- fine.

Killing rabbits and shit isn't cool for the foodchain though, and picking wild berries is a meme with poor energy output/input ratio.
Just bring some dehydrated goods or something you can cook on an x wing.

>And building shitty survival shelters.
I don't see a problem with this. Taking branches- that were already on the ground, and making a tepee against a tree, only to revert those branches back into the ground isn't that bad.

Lightweight tents and sleeping bags are superior though.

>>823255
3/?

>First aid
Carry DEET at bare minimum. Bugs suck, and this is technically a medical supply, yeah?

Other than that, you're /k/: you should know field medicine.

Same rules apply as per usual: don't carry anything you don't know how to use. For a complete idiot, just pack a shit ton of gauze, tape, bandaids and an ace bandage.

OTC meds to consider:
>ephedrine
great decongestant and stimulant. Don't use if dehydrated.
>Aspirin
If it hurts, eat this.
>lotrimin
The woods are dirty. Don't get jock itch.
>bacitracin
If you fuck yourself, make it clean.

Avoid shit like benadryl or nyquil. Itll make you too dumb to operate properly.

>Misc
Carry gloves. If you don't work a heavy manual labour job, /out/ shit will blister your hands pretty bad.
Carry a folding saw. Not all logs are so shaped to split cleanly. Use this to notch them.
Carry an etool if you like digging dakota pits and burying your turds.
Carry a multitool because why the fuck not? it's a belt attachment for fucks sake.

As for /k/ shit: CC if you want/are permitted. Don't carry a rifle unless you're licensed to hunt, just in case some faggot wants to pin you for poaching, esp. in natn'l forests where the only lawful use of a gun is self-defense or hunting.

Anything else (fishing gear, etc) is hobby specific, so I'm not going to fuck with talking about it.

>caveat for primitive faggots/bushcrafters

Primitive tech is less reliable than modern gear and takes hours/calories to make. It's not worth it to fuck around building brush huts when you can simply bring a fucking tent, and in gov't managed land, it's technically illegal to build structures without a permit.

So don't fuck with that shit unless you're in a legit survival situation...

>>822950
Not everyone in the military is operator. If anything, military gear is the pinnacle of simple and reliable.
The thing that annoys me most with the 'lowest bidder' thing is you have to consider the scale. When you've got a contract to supply something for up to a million people the production costs come down considerably. Then strip away the extra cost of having a brand on something and the fact that it is being sold at surplus price, and for the price point it far outclasses most equivalents of a much higher price. Civvy gear at really high price points are better, but most of it is made for yuppies on a one hour hill walk.

main things:
*Army poncho- rain cover and shelter.
*Knife
*Flashlight
*Little pot to boil water
*Backpack-60 litres + for more than 2 days innawoods.
*paracord
*axe
*eating tools
*fires starter( flint and steel or simply matches)
*sleeping bag
*sleeping pad

These are the main things to go innawoods for few days :)
No tacticool shit just things that u need.

forgot about :
*first aid kit (u should put some painkillers in there)
*compass(useful if going in unknown area)

And about backpacks, u should consider Alice pack, its not expensive and its really good, still military use it.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/US-ALICE-Pack-Large-Genuine-Backpack-Army-Field-Bag-/281973964508?hash=item41a6f53edc:g:PxEAAOSwvFZW7xkz

>>823494
Paracord is a meme. It's inferior to many other options. A small spool of bank line is stronger, lighter, AND cheaper.

>>823496
My friend has one of these, he was issued it in the aemy, but they phased them out and he was able to take his home.

They carry the load way too far from your body. He has to hike leaning forward to keep good balance. There are other options that are just as cheap, but carry loads better.

>>822895
>going camping ...and to survive.
well which is it, camping or surviving that you are interested in?

>>823049
> mfw no points fo brevity

>>822953
Aluminum does not cause alzheimers. Alzheimer patients have elevated levels of aluminum, and that got twisted around to mean the misinformation.

>>822942
god damn that hurts my knees just thinking about it

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>>822939
>I'm not gonna get milsurp.
ever used an ALICE pack thats in good shape?
i use my alice bags constantly.... theres a lot of good mil gear out there:
trioxane tabs,
mess kits,
packs of all sorts,
bivys and mosquito nets,
all kinds of stuff....

>>824698
what large knife and sheath are you using?

>>823257
>Killing rabbits and shit isn't cool for the foodchain though

jesus fucking christ you are stupid. you can kill a couple rabbits a weekend and not doom the planet you hippy moron

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>>824698
niccce, I'm just getting back into outing and this looks like my goal, I've been patching up a very beat up alice pack recently though.

>>823258
>>823255
>>823246
Not OP but well said. Thanks.

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>>824727
>>824782
i didnt make it clear
pic isnt mine
although..
substitute large knife in said-pic for tomahawk and its practically identical to my go-to

>>824698
I carry an ALICE pack as well as the ALICE load bearing vest for small thinks like fire starters, canteens, knifes, compass and such.

if you live in a developed country, there is literally zero chance you will need to "survive." stop playing pretend and just camp like an adult, you absolute manbaby.

>>822923
heavy as fucc?

>>827091
surviving could mean being caught and trapped in a natural disaster like a flash flood, hurricane, or other depending of where you live. its not just limited to "muh zawmbie shtf tacticool" faggotry. either way, people can enjoy what they want.

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>>822895
Buy this anon.

It's a great pack.

>>822940
>Please tell us this military group that doesn't resupply their soldiers.
Resupply often comes days late. When given a choice between losing a multi million dollar helicopter and some grunts rationing hard what do you think the POGs do anon? Have you never got drunk with any combat vets and had them open up about all that shit. I love getting drunk with those shitheads, makes me proud to be American.