Opinions on jackets? Hard shell or soft shell? At the moment

>>1018119
Depends, do you want to survive if you get wet? Yes? Then hardshell.

>>1018133
My waterproof Marmot softshell has never let me down, even in three days of pouring rain and gale.

I've heard that unless you're out in pouring rain then you should choose soft shell due to the breathability of a soft shell.

>>1018134
>waterproof
>softshell
Nice meme, lad

>>1018136
If it's not raining then just wear a t-shirt or your base layer. Put on hardshell when it starts raining.

>>1018119
Any miltiary fags here, you can get the OR Foray jacket for a substantial discount.

>>1018136
Basically if you are ever in actual rain you should wear a hardshell. Soft shells are not water proof and will wet out in minutes. They're good for blocking some wind and blowing snow, and breathe extremely well

>>1018119
Why do softshells exist? Seems to me hardshells are superior in nearly every way. Hardshells are usually wind/waterproofed, thin and light, and less likely to have shit cling to it, therefore easier to clean. Also if you're cold you just layer underneath..

>>1018297
They're 10x more breathable than hardshells. Try skinning uphill on backcountry skis or steep hiking, high exertion activities.

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>>1018119
Today I realized, once again, that I need a light, windproof jacket but that also offers good breathability. What do you guys recommend? Im not a wealthy fag so stuff like Arc'teryx or Patagonia is out of question.

>>1018334
If it doesn't need to be waterproof, Patagonia Houdini is perfect and costs $99

>>1018119
A good hardshell is just a rain sopping wimd blocking demon and can be adapted. From a rain coat over a undershirt in summer to a snow blocking lifesheild in winter.

A soft shell looks way cooler but works for about 2 months.

>>1018119
Both hardshells and softshells are typically given a DWR finish. That's the chemical treatment that makes water bead on the surface of the fabric and prevents it wetting-out. It wears off after a while unfortunately, there are renewal products but they'll never be like-new.

Once the DWR is gone on a hardshell you are left with a garment that is still waterproof because of the membrane (Gore-Tex, eVent etc) in it. However once the face fabric wets out it can't breath anymore as the outside of the membrane is effectively experiencing 100% humidity. So you'll get damp from sweat if you're exerting yourself.

Once the DWR is gone on a softshell you are left with a garment that is at best windproof, but less insulating than a fleece. When rained on you will get wet.

Note things are a bit different when it's snowing. Snow won't soak garments until it melts, so if you can get it to fall off before it melts (with a DWR finish or just by constantly moving) then you won't get wet. This is why snow sports don't require as high a level of waterproofness (for example ski and snowboard shells frequently lack seam sealing).

Which garment is appropriate depends on what activity you're doing in what conditions. Personally I find that if I'm doing something that requires a hardshell then I'm better off just taking a hardshell and using a fleece as my top layer until it starts precipitating.

>>1018368
Came here to post something like this. On point m8!

>>1018297
The primary use of a softshell is as an ultra breathable wind layer. When you hit an alpine zone and it's 50 degrees there is no better layer than a softshell. Once you start thinking about winter where rain has ceased to be a concern a softshell again becomes important for aerobic activities like snowshoeing, cross country skiing, or hiking.

>>1018368
It's also worth noting that medium heat in the dryer can reactivate DWR.

>>1018604
Doesn't low heat ironing have the same result?

>>1018632
Yes but is more likely to damage the fabric or waterproof membrane.

>>1018143
>being this ignorant

>>1018632
Like >>1018682 said and also the tumbling motion generates static which aids in restoring DWR as well. Think of it as a bunch of tiny hairs that suspend water above the garment. Over time these hairs are flattened. Heat and static makes them stand back up.

Why are people so fussed with breathable material, surely you get enough air flow from the head hole, sleeves, and ventilation zips can be used if they have them

>>1018813
For a lot of people good breathability isnt necessary. If your activity is active, like climbing or hiking uphill, it isnt a necessity but its certainly more pleasant than feeling clammy and sweaty. If youre serious about almost any kind of active outdoor persuit, breathability is one of the most important features - you wouldnt catch a free soloist or ultra marathoner wearing a jacket that doesnt breathe, regardless of how well suited it might be to other activities.

>>1018368
I find that with a fleece lined pertex wind shirt I can handle moderate rain. Tight weave and drw plus body heat keep me dry, and I only put a water proof layer on in heavy rain.

>>1018813
Exactly. A good hardshell with all the vents open is a raincoat. With all the vents closed its a snow shield. And a moderately good one isn't very expensive, rei sells their version of goretex, eVent i think, in a shell with tons of zips for like 150. I have one in my closet but i use a walmart rain jacket for the summer that i dwr treat. Far more breathable as its really a nylon shell with dwr on it, but wets out quick. But it keeps me dry in a quick summer rainstorm or running between downtown buildings.

>>1019006
event isn't the same as goretex

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Anyone recommend a navy hardshell with sizeable hood with a firm brim, lots of pockets, ventilation, velcro cuffs, sinching on the waist and hood, sealed zips, taped seams and a two way separating zip

>>1019481
The cheaper the better though if expensive I'll try to find on ebay

>>1018143
I've got a softshell from Wellensteyn and it is absolutely water repelling.
You would've to pour water into the gap of my neck to get me wet

>>1018119
My go-to system for the last 6 or so years has been a arcteryx atom soft shell under a mil surp gore text cold weather parka. If it's super cold then I have a oversized down jacket from old Navy.

Austrian surplus goretex parka is the bee's knees

cost me something like $45 and it's superb in every way

>>1019137
Well obviously or else goretex would sue their pants off. Literally.

But it is the same concept of a 3 layer membrane.