Can we have a thread about proper blade maintenance whether it

What is it you want to know?

>>1003812
everything :^)

>>1003821
Buddy you're going to have to be more specific. Ask questions and I'll do my best to answer them.

>>1003783
You just kind of have to start doing it. I just recently wanted to get something that allowed me to do freehand sharpening, I have only ever had my Lansky kit (which works fine, I just don't find sharpening knives with it enjoyable whatsoever). I picked up the Worksharp guided sharpening system and the upgrade kit. I like it alot and it is very beginner friendly. You can use the supplied 20 and 17 degree guides to help keep the proper angles. You can also detach the plate holder from the base and use it free hand to sharpen axes and machetes, which is nice. Freehand sharpening is definitely alot more enjoyable.

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>>1003783
Just get a gud ferro rod

>>1003812
How about the proper motions when sharpening using a typical flat whetstone by hand?

I've seen only sharpening on the front stroke, or back stroke, or both. From heel to tow and vice versa. Or circular motions, or focusing on 1 section at a time and moving down or up the blade.

Whats myth or truth? And how do you got about sharpening blades like kukri or karambit, or is the philosophy the same?

>>1003783

Here you go OP. This guy is from /k/, He can free hand a d do some wicked sharpness. His videos hold a lot of detail, more than what you'll probably get from just reading comments on here. Hope it helps.

m.youtube.com/channel/UCqPiMuZ82IxI9nkWZcpWifg

>>1003873

Woops, full link didn't post.

https://m.youtube.com/channel/UCqPiMuZ82IxI9nkWZcpWifg

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General carbon steel knife maintenance?

I know you should keep it clean and dry. Oiled too? And avoid acidic stuff.

How often should it be oiled, waxed etc. Which oils to use?
I heard 3-in-one should be great, but i'm having trouble finding it locally.

Any similar oils that are reccomended and available in europe?

>>1003890
Oil keeps it's protected if you are in wet/humid areas.

Any oil will work, I usually just grab olive oil from kitchen and keep it in a small container and throw it in my pack. Nice thing about that is if you absolutely need cooking oil in a survival type situation you have some.

>>1003900
Hey that's pretty smart.

>>1003914
Yeah, until you're in grizzly country

>>1003918
Food in general attracts bears. It's not like cooking with or without oil will make a difference.

>>1003890
3 in 1 a brand name. The oil itself is known as "Sewing Machine" oil or Light Machine Oil.
There is no difference between brands.
Singer seems to be the leading brand in Europe.

To store working knives and tools for the winter I coat them in Linseed oil and let them dry off.

For short term storage the machine oil works.

I usually wipe a knife with oil before putting it away for the night.

Olive oil works too. The internet will tell you Olive Oil goes rancid, but if you're buying from the supermarket, I can guarantee that its not actually pressed from Olives, but from a mixture unrelated nuts so its fine to use on knives.

>>1003939
Thanks anon, that makes sense.

I'll try it

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>>1003783
>Can we have a thread about proper blade maintenance whether it be a knife or axe, etc...?

Sure, friend.

>>1003890
I use WD40. Just spray a bit on both sides and put it in the sheath. Buy the smallest can and carry it with you when going /out/.

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>>1003845

>>1003956
Is there a compilation of knife fails?

>>1003890
I let mine patina so it is easier to take care of and I don't need or use oil on the blade. I only use mineral oil on the wood handle to help prevent water from getting in and rusting the tang or reacting with the rivets. I use my knives for culinary stuff too. For axes I use 3-in-1 oil for handle and blade since it doesn't matter.

>>1003967

This is why I deliberately keep the back edge of my /out/ knife dull, both for batonny chop chop and for ferro rods

>>1003860
depends on blade shape, stone size, edge type, and where the damage/dullness is

>>1003890
Generally speaking you only need to oil it if you're putting it away for storage. If you actually use your knife it's not necessary

>>1003966
not great if you use it for food prep

Free hand sharpening is the skill to learn, but it takes a while, I'm still not happy with my skill level.

>>1003995
>Free hand sharpening is the skill to learn, but it takes a while, I'm still not happy with my skill level.

I use sandpaper for innawood sharpening. It is light, fast, and easy to use. I just fold it in half, pinch it on both sides of the edge and slide it along without the fold touching the face of the edge of course. If you want the micro grooves to be vertical just lay the sandpaper on your thigh and swipe the knife across it without pressing down much. If you need to fix an edge you'll need a solid flat backing, but seriously wrecked edges will need a stone. For honing I use pretty much anything hard.

Since I never wreck the edge on my knives I never need a stone when innawoods. I also don't let other people use my knives (because they tend to fuck them up.)

>"can I burrow your knife for a second?"
>•do you know how to use a knife properly?•
>"sure!"
>*returns knife with dings in the edge and a broken tip*
>"what are you doing?"
>•...counting to ten...•

>>1003968
>Batonny Chop Chop - Knife Fails Compilation.webm
>File size: 74.4 MB
>Length: 11m 41s
https://www.mediafire.com/?bknbvgv3mkvigoy

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>>1003845
You are an idiot.

>>1003925
Bears prefer:

Coconut oil
Canola oil
Menstrual discharge
Olive oil

>>1004000
>just fold it in half, pinch it on both sides of the edge and slide it along
Does this work better than the ferrorod?

>>1004000
>loaning anything you actually want back

>>1004022
"Canola" is rapeseed.

>In the 1970s, the Rapeseed Association of Canada chose the name "canola" to represent "Can" for Canada, and "ola" for oil.

>>1004024
I've no clue since I've never owned a ferrorod in my life.

>>1004027
It was only for 5 minutes and only to cut some cordage, but for some reason he decided the knife would work well for installing the tent pegs too and there were rocks in the ground preventing the pegs from going in......

They still haven't found the body.

This Japanese guy sharpens knives like a mofo, for bushcraft and hunting purposes.

https://www.youtube.com/user/virtuovice

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>>1003968
>Compilation of knife fails
The guy wasn't able to post them

>>1004064
This channel looks comfy as fuck thanks

Freehand sharpening is an art. And like art mediums, no two blades are the same. I'm an old fag. Really embarrassingly old, and have never used a sharpening aid. But now, I can get a 20 dollar Chinese machete sharp enough to shave hair with a mill bastard, carburundum stone, and a 2x4.
Practice. That's the only way. Get a Fine/Medium stone, some oil, a strop and a bit of stropping compound.

You will ruin some blades. You'll find blades (stainless) that just will not take an edge. You'll get so damn close then two strokes and the edge will be gone.
This isn't anything you'll learn in a couple hours.
>Cut into the stone.
>Start on medium
>Keep the stone clean and oiled
>Maintain a constant angle.
>Press lightly
>Slice through the oil.
>Alternate sides of the blade.
>Hold the knife to a light source and sight down the edge. Even out the irregularities.
>When a tiny roll or fold of steel appears, strop by drawing the blade back across loaded leather.
Some blades sharpen easier.
Carbon steel blades will allow you to have success. Hard stainless blades will hold an edge, but will never get as sharp as carbon.
>protip
>You can sharpen a pocketknife on the rough bottom of a ceramic coffee cup.

>>1003925
Yeah but you don't usually keep your food in your tent unless you're some retard from Toronto or Germany.

How fucking hard is it to sharpen a blade at the same angle?

>>1004058
Did the wind carry the tent away with the person in it?
Where did this happen? I've heard wind in Sweden can blow people to another country.

>>1004064
I sent a couple of long messages full of unsolicited advice to this guy some years back.
This was before I discovered I was assbergers.

He was always really polite and responded in detail so I know he read every one of those messages, and that made me happy.

http://www.bladeforums.com/threads/my-advice-for-newbie-knife-sharpeners-2015-updates.963298/

>>1003783
>>1003873
>>1003874

Learning the basics of freehand sharpening isn't that difficult as long as you learn to understand exactly what you are trying to accomplish at each step in the sharpening process, and how to achieve that.

The fundamental problem with how most people online try to teach freehanding is that they are either unwilling or unable to clearly explain why each step is taken and how to objectively verify that the step has been completed before moving on.

As a result, people usually end up trying to follow a bunch of contradictory advice, don't get results in a timely fashion, get frustrated and give up.

What I recommend for a beginner is this: Buy a couple of cheap knives to practice on, buy a Norton India IB8 combination coarse/fine oilstone, buy some light mineral oil, and then watch this tutorial and practice what is shown until you can reliably get the level of sharpness shows in the end of the video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWU_qTp3DLM

>>1004300
God I hate people like you.

>>1004458
I'm fine with that. I feel nothing towards you.

>>1004000
I take a fallkniven cc4 (0.1 and 1 micron sides) to touch up edges, but nothing more serious.

I don't lend out my tools at all. I've had friends jam my bowsaw in a fallen tree even after I've warned them that it'll bind, as well as chipped blades, chopping with axes into the dirt.. ughhh

>>1004188
harder than you think if you want shaving sharp.

>>1004558
well played

A friend of mine found a scythe-type tool that we want to sharpen. It's rusty and very dull. We don't have any proper sharpening tools, any DIY stuff?

>>1004867
Sandpaper wrapped around a dowel.

>>1004188
Evidently people are finding it difficult, Adolph. Maybe some never were taught properly.

To double bevel your edge or not?

It seems to either be fetishized or demonized.

>>1003783
Just do it. Grab some wet stones and a couple of cheap knives, opinel, mora, etc. Try and get different steels as well just so you get a feel for different metals. I just have a double sided wet stone, I forget the grit numbers but it's not super fine. It's more than enough to keep my knife (D2 tool steel) sharp enough for my needs. Also don't forget that blade maintenance starts with how you use your knife.

>>1005536
Depends. For things like scandi grinds and chisels, its a bad idea.
But for normal knives there is no noticeable difference in performance.

I put a microbevel on all my knives.
First I sharpen on a rough grit using a very low angle. Usually almost flat.
Then I remove the burr by using a finer stone and a slightly higher angle.

alright i want to get into sharpening, i have various kitchen knives in awful shape for one, and a skandi mora and a skandi axe for consideration also.

it's kind of expensive to get proper stones, i was thnking about a 1 stone solution a f400 grit (jis 700) is supposed to be okay for single stone, but would i be fucked with the skandis. don't you need a coarser stone for them to make any progress?

i'm confident it would work on the small bevel pocket knives and the kitchen knives.

>>1005733
oh and also i would get a f180 grit stone for maintenance but it could maybe also be used for re-profiling or as a very coarse stone.

a 180, 400 combo is good with some stopping paste to follow up, or i need a 3 stone solution?

180, 280 (jis 360) 600 (jis 1500) for example?

>>1005733
180 and 400 alone is very coarse

I only use 240 when I have chips. I use 800 to do most of my regular sharpening.

>on't you need a coarser stone for them to make any progress?

no but because of the wider bevel you need to take off more metal. this doesnt mean you need coarser grit stones tho

I use a combination stone I found on ebay for about 20 quid.

>>1005742
the FEPA F400 is more like JIS700 or JIS1000 depending on source the 180 is 180 for some reason.

>>1005755
https://www.fine-tools.com/G10019.html
here is a conversion chart, but the manufacturer presents the F400 as JIS700 because SiC stones are very abrasive but as you develop a mud on them they can go "softer" as all wetstones.

>>1004112
see
>>1004006

OP here, I bought some stones and made a strop. I already had a 600 grit water stone, bought 1k and 4k grit shapton stones. Starting with my tojiro 8 inch chef knife which was dull as fuck and had nicks all over.

I was able to get it sharp enough to cut newsprint from any angle but not quite razor sharp (tried shaving with it and could only sort of cut some hair). I was grinding it at probably 17-23 degrees.

I guess my goal now is to be able to get that knife sharp enough to shave comfortably with.

>>1003812

When is a polished edged a good thing or bad?

Edge trailing/leading strokes, when to use them and when not to.

Heel to toe or toe to heel?

What are scratch patterns and why do they matter?

What is cutting aggression?

What should I avoid doing motion wise when freehanding?

>>1005791


>What should I avoid doing motion wise when freehanding?

lifting the angle when you curve to the tip

>What are scratch patterns and why do they matter?
they only matter if you're autistic

>Heel to toe or toe to heel?
personally I prefer toe heel, but only on my finishing grit, the rest of the time I do a straight pull / work parts of the edge

>Edge trailing/leading strokes, when to use them and when not to.
I go back and forth

I am not an expert but I can keep all my knives paper shaving sharp which is sufficient for my needs.

Does alternating sides have any drawbacks or benefits?

I've been doing edge leading push motions from heel to tip, then turning the knife 180 degrees to do edge leading heel to tip pulling motions back towards me, constantly and in 1 motion.

>>1006114
I alternate sides and only go forwards when finishing on the finest stone.

Otherwise I bring up a burr on one side, then switch to the other.

>>1006114
alternating won't build up a burr like if you were to work one side repeatedly then switch

>>1006181
but it's also much slower and easier to make a mistake on the angle.

I use a lansky stone set (up to 2000 grit) and then wood-backed leather strops up to 1 micron chrome buffing compound on it.

Definitely shaving sharp but not quite mirror-edged yet.

I've got some 0.5 micron diamond lapping compound I haven't tried yet though.

>>1004020
How much does a complete care set like that cost you?

>>1004047
BFD YOU FUCKING CANNOOK!

It sucks when you shitbag country's only claim to fame is the best oil for grilling American beef.

>>1006187
sorry maybe it wasn't clear in my post but not having a burr is a negative.

best way to take out a chip? should I take the edgeline back? the chip is right at the tip. the edge is very thin so it might be a good idea to bring it back a bit.

>>1006269
The bricks are $10-15/ea on Amazon. The "Steels" are more. One is ceramic, one is a German co. I will check it.

>>1006279
Chips are like serations, not a bad thing.<smiley face, smiley face, thumbs up emoji, heart hands emoji>

>>1004047
rapeseed is fucking garbage i can't comprehend why it is not banned for consumption.

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>0 replies

what the actual fuck, you casual idiots?

>>1006350
>casual
>not free handing on shapton mahogany obsidian glass stones and finishing on 0.009 micron germanium compound applied to one of the only existing mammoth hide strops

>>1006355
Does this produce an apex sharp enough to split plutonium atoms and create a fission reaction?

>>1006360
Im whittling neutrons with my spyderco S72030 prototype using their diamond tungensten-steel fused super alloy blade which I need a yankee white security clearance to poses after 10 passes on the mammoth strop with germanium compound to mirror polish my less than 1 degree cutting bevel.

>>1006368
>whittling neutrons

I've moved onto higgs boson whittling casual

>>1006372
>he doesn't sharpen his knives to theoretical (used to be) negative degree edge bevels that can push cut space and time against the grain

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>>1006373

Wait is it actually possible to split atomic particles with a blade?

>>1006380
Some mastercrafted katanas probably

>>1006350
This was my first sharpening system.

Its shit.

But the ceramic stones themselves are pretty good. I use them freehand now.

>>1006277
you are weird

>>1006348
>i dont like it
>i dont want you to have it

Fucking gun grabbing, libtard, fuck face!

Go back to Berkley, you anti-freedom hater!

>>1006413
i wonder what you would say about cocoa marketed to kids laced with lead and cadmium among other things.

>>1006463
>watch out for chemtrails dude!

Goose.

>>1005791
>When is a polished edged a good thing or bad?

That is mostly determined by what types of cutting work you will be doing. As a general rule, coarser apex finishes have more slicing aggression and have better edge retention in slicing work (e.g. cardboard, carpet, rope) while more polished apex finishes tend to have better edge retention in push cutting work because they require less pressure to complete cuts (e.g. food prep against a cutting board, whittling, cutting hard plastics).

This means you need to balance your choice of apex grit based on how much of each type of cutting work you expect to be doing and how frequently you prefer to touch-up your apex (as coarse finishes can go much longer between touch-ups or re-sharpening that polished finishes can). If you are mostly going to be slicing cardboard and prefer to sharpen as infrequently as humanly possible then a ~320 grit finish is ideal. If you are sharpening a kitchen knife in a very hard carbon steel and plan to regularly touch it up on a pasted balsa strop then a 10,000 grit finish is a good choice.

>Edge trailing/leading strokes, when to use them and when not to.

Use both most of the time. Alternating edge leading strokes are useful for finishing an edge as they minimize the chance of forming an unwanted microscopic burr at the finishing stage. Edge trailing should only be used when finishing on waterstones (so the slurry doesn't round over the apex) or when using a strop.

>Heel to toe or toe to heel?

As far as I know makes no difference whatsoever.

>What are scratch patterns and why do they matter?

They don't 99.99% of the time.

>What is cutting aggression?

Basically for any sharp apex the larger the microscopic teeth the more slicing aggression that apex has, since it behaves more like a saw.

>What should I avoid doing motion wise when freehanding?

Changing your angle at the tip of the knife. It's the most common motion issue for novices.

>>1006114
In general, if you are using a burr based approach to sharpening then you shouldn't be switching sides until you have formed a burr along the whole length of the edge from heel to tip.

If you are deliberately not using a burr based approach then you should be experienced enough to not need to ask that question, which means you should probably be using a burr based approach.

>>1006511
wat

>>1006368

I stabbed God right in the taint with mine, though.

>>1006368
waat

>>1006368
I made a machete from a band saw, so you're only like 1 belt above me

>>1006516
>so the slurry doesn't round over the apex

so sharpening with a scrubbing (back and forth) motion on a stone is a BAD method?

>>1006786
Only for the last 10-20 passes per side to finish the apex. For the very last 10-20 passes per side when you are finishing the apex you want to use alternating very low force edge leading passes if it is a stone that doesn't produce a slurry, and alternating very low force edge trailing passes if it is a stone that does produce a slurry.

The only downside to using alternating edge trailing strokes to finish on a waterstone is the increased risk of leaving a microscopic burr compared to using alternating edge leading strokes on a solid non-friable stone.

>>1006797
Thanks anon. I have a japanese wet stone (slurry producing) but I find that I often end up negating any progress I've made through bad technique

>knife gets sharp on low grit
>switch to higher grit
>knife gets sharper
>tests on paper
>hmm almost there
>tests again
>not as sharp
>???

Find the same with stropping- I figure I'm rolling the edge by tilting the angle too high and flattening my apex

>>1006814
Diagnosing sharpening issues is usually a process of elimination.

Are you getting a burr along the whole length of the edge from heel to tip on both sides on the coarsest stone you are using to sharpen before moving on to finer stones?

If yes, then is that burr still present and noticeable when after you have moved to finer stones? Then your issue is probably burr removal. This probably isn't the answer for a Japanese waterstone user, but I mention it anyway for the sake of completeness.

Assuming it's not the above, then the most likely issue is that the apex is being slightly rounded over by the slurry from the waterstone when making edge leading passes. This effect tends to become more noticeable on finer stones. The way to test if this is the issue is to switch to making 10-20 very light alternating edge-trailing only passes per side on the stone and see if the sharpness dramatically improves. If it does, then this was probably the issue. If it turns out this was the issue, I can make some recommendations for how to get around the issue in the future.

Another possibility, but one I consider less likely than the above, is that you are generating a microscopic burr which is interfering with the sharpness, but I wouldn't even consider this possibility seriously unless you eliminated all the others because its hard to get much of a micro-burr on a waterstone due to the slurry.

Finally, it's probably unlikely that angle control is the issue because if your angle control was bad enough to cause a large issue you would be having the apex catch on the waterstone and it would be quite noticeable to you.

Note that I am talking about your issues with your finer waterstones here and not any stropping issues. It's better to try and fix the former before worrying about the latter.

i just tried to sharpen two crap kitchen knives on my new whetstones.
the results were disappointing. they got sharp enough to cut paper but can't shave hair.
going with the fepa f180/f400. well it's bound to get better with practice.

>>1007015
well one of them did cut some hair at certain places but nowhere near what i had in mind.

>>1003783
i'm nearly done making a knife with an osage orange wood handle, wondering how to keep the wood nice if anyone has experience?

>>1007015
You wont get shaving sharp edges off of a 400 grit stone, or even x000 stones in most cases. Getting a super refined apex from higher grit stones and proper stropping while dealing with or limiting the creation of burr is critical.

>>1008024
linseed oil?

>>1008026
This is incorrect. You can get a shaving arm hair sharp apex off a 320-grit stone (or even less) with proper technique.

>>1008027
that's what I was thinking, or tung oil, I am told tung is better as it has UV protection but I don't have any experience with it

>>1008030
Tung oil is a meme and costs twice as much

>>1008029
show me a video and I will believe u

>>1008035
Will doing cross-grain pushcuts on newsprint off a 320-grit Norton India fine suffice, or does it have to be shaving arm hair specifically? Note that cross-grain pushcuts on newsprint is a higher threshold.

https://youtu.be/EcrnigC3Anc

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FFS

>>1008033
yeah? that's why I ask out, so I don't make dumb choices, I was just unsure cause uv damages the color of osage over time, but if linseed will keep it in good working order that's what matters

I use the back side of my knife for my ferro rod. Just don't get that shitty "tactical black" pretend-you're-a-badass paint shit on your knife.

>>1008037
India stones get finer with use. Not by a lot but they do.

I still agree that you can get a shaving edge off a 320 grit stone though.

>>1003890
if it's humid in your house that stuff rusts you got other problems than rusty knife edges.

>>1008026
again what you think a 400 grit is and an f400 is totally different things. f400 is 17.3±1 micron finer than a 1000 grit paper.

>>1003967
of course it's a goddamn tracker

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>>1003845
that tanto geometry
that (((jimping)))
that most likely skeletonized handle with
that cord wrap
that edge on ferro at
that angle
absolutely amazing

>>1003967
>not lighting fire with your beard
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cOg4Ud4HiEU