if autistic weaboos weren't calling it a successor to a

Umm. I do believe it was Toyota themselves that called it the ae86 successor.

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>>17580365
>if this was a 4x4 diesel would the toyobaru be considered more of the successor to the camry

>>17580365
>GT86
>cashing in on the two most iconic cars they've ever made
>it's basically an econobox

>front engine 4 seat successor to the MR2
The MR2 has always been the mid engined 2 seater you can afford, it's not even remotely related to the GT86.

I honestly think the boxer 4 kills it, put a goddamn toyota engine in it, it's pretty much always been their selling point. It's almost blatantly a cash grab, nobody buys an enthusiast toyota to work on a subaru engine.

And lmao swap it meme is pretty much entirely perpetuathread/17578052#p17579630ed by people who have absolutely no idea how much work that actually is.

The AE86 was a shitbox with a monster engine (for the time) that you could work on and get pretty great results. Working on a standard GT86 is like polishing a turd.

>>17580705
>monster engine
>4AGE
>highly optimized for N/A FA20
>econobox

>>17580370
this, its a gt86, and also its closer to an 86 in configuration. does not feel similar to driving a fwd, or mid engine car at all

Is it really worth the 20,000$ price? I mean i'd sure like one to get rid of my shitty 2004 taurus.
it's either that or the new honda civic.

>>17580774
i think so, but thats purely subjective, could you buy a used m3 or even a cayman for that price. sure, but thats a used european motor compared to a new japanese one.

>>17580774
For practicality and daily driving, Civic is 10x better. But if none of that matters in your next car choice, try to find a GT86 for cheap

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>>17580774
get a 10 year old si and make it pretty. the new ones are ugly imo.

>>17580809
Oh yeah i forgot how nice revamped old civics look
I guess is that it's cheaper if i just put cool shit on it?

>>17580822
maybe you should keep the taurus if youre just going to "put cool shit on it"

>>17580705
Just think, in an alternative universe Toyota teamed up with Honda and the GT86 came with a modified F20C engine making 270bhp @9,000RPM.

but alas no, if you want power these days its going to the front wheels through an automatic gearbox.

>>17580365
Are you forgetting about that concept they made with the Initial D livery on it? The thing is supposed to be an AE86 successor and they failed.

>>17580365
>front engine 4 seat successor to the mr2?
What the fuck is this nonsense.

>>17580365

I would have fitted the GT86 with a souped-up N/A version of the 1G-FE Toyota engine that could reach 200hp with the actual torque that I4 engines can deliver. Flat engines aren't my thing.

>>17581475
>they failed
How?
>>17581575
But the 4A-GE only made like 100 lb feet of torque. The FA20 makes 150 and the gt86 twins have 4.10s in them to multiply that a hell of a lot.

>performance on par or worse than any of the souped up FWD commuter subcompacts that can be had for 30% less
>coupe
Tells you a lot about the state of American automotive market if this is what passes for the epitome of affordable sportiness.

Do you retards even realise celicas used to be rwd or nah?

/o/ is so retarded.

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>>17581760
Mcdonald struts and pancake engine.

Biggest problem is the engine. It has direct injection, yet makes similar power to what Honda was doing 25 years ago - without torque dip. Can't change sparkplugs without pulling the engine. Cant turbo without worrying about space or upgrading internals after 50hp. Has a front bias despite using a boxer. It's just garbage.

The only good things about the engine are low COG and an easy oil filter.

>>17581991
I'm pretty sure Subaru guys do their plugs without pulling the engine, the AE86 also used mcstruts, today's emission standards have gimped the engine a fair bit but literally with a new exhaust and a tune you'll be over 200whp. I wouldn't consider 53/47 excessive front bias either, and what's this about worrying about space? It's just the stock FA20T turbo location doesn't work because it's mounted higher in the AWD cars so there's clearance on the bottom of the engine bay.

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>>17582032
>>17581991
Also is that a fuckin' F20C you posted as an example of an engine with a "good" torque curve yet the FA20's is not in your eyes?

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>>17582032
Not pulling the engine, but lifting it. It's not a simple task. http://gt86.com.au/forum/f26/thinking-about-changing-your-spark-plugs-think-agian-1102/

They had a long time to think about improvements. I would heavily bet they would have added front DWS just like they added IRS if the engine wasnt in the way.

It's not excessive bias, but disappointing considering the engine choice and how far back the driveline sits.

And the FI option is just that - its not a simple drop in which makes it just like turboing an NA car with no turbo options. Its done all the time, but you're more likely to stick with a SC to avoid the PITA.

>>17582046
I'd much rather have that than pic related.

>>17582121
Also, it's already at 12.5:1 CR. That's hard to FI. You can't get much past 7 psi on 91 octane before knock (around 250 whp). 92 octane will give you about 270 whp at 10 psi before knock.

Here's a pretty good article on it. It seems like they were able to package the turbo pretty well, but pretty expensive with all the insulation.
http://www.revvedmag.com/features/car-features/john-sandersons-subaru-brz-lessons-of-boosting-the-fa20/

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>toyota's hot hatch is faster than the gt86

>>17582566
what's not faster than the gt86?

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>>17580365
all these years later and I'm still salty Toyota ruined this car by teaming up with Subaru with both sides cucking the ever living shit out of it

>>17582121
+1 for obscene torque curve

a miata has better acceleration

>>17582576
That's a good question

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>>17582566
I will never get over the spastics clinging onto the grmn version of the yaris
Theres a fucking grmn 86 as well
It's all extremely limited overpriced garbage

>>17582619
well it's slower than a minvan

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>>17580705
Daily reminder that the FA20 is the most powerful NA 4 cylinder available on the market.

>>17580809
Fwd, no thanks.

>>17581991
The Honda also didnt make any torque until like 6k.

Also, you don't have to pull the engine to change the spark plugs, you're fucking retarded. And no lifting it is not the same thing. Plus, people can do it without even lifting the engine if you have the right tools

>>17582566
>Only 400 made in Europe

>>17582600
Name a better car for under 25k new

>>17580365
they're good cars. i rented one for a track day and it easily kept up with a stock 911 and a turbo mazda. tho they were total yuppies driving. it's a good car

>>17582647
admittedly it was a stripped out version with no back seats but it ran fine. 6 spd manual. power band was 5.5-6.5k rpm, so it took time to whip up to functional speed, but it cornered great

>>17581446
>Toyota teamed up with Honda and the GT86 came with a modified F20C engine making 270bhp @9,000RPM
Even if Honda insisted on a soft top it would have been amazing.

>>17582633
>most powerfull on the market
Well yeah because Honda doesn't have a NA performance car

When then S2000 successor hits goodbye twinfags.

Bunch of niggers in this thread who never actually driven a rear wheel drive Corolla. They are slow as fuck stock and have a live axel rear end. Gt86 is a much better car off the factory floor than the AE86 was.

>>17582633
Do you own an 86? You seem very defensive about it.

>>17582633
Subaru service tech advises pulling. And yeah I can do anything with the right tools or infinite time: doesn't mean it's sane.

How is pulling everything off the top of the engine and lifting the engine not retarded? It's virtually a step away from wheeling in the cherry picker.

Holy christ you are defensive of this car.

>>17582716
>S2000 successor
>NA
It's be turbod

>>17582633
>muh dorifto
>muh anime

>>17582760
I would not mind the new Civic Type R engine in a light weight roadster, to be completely honest with you

>>17582716
>Implying it won't cost 50k
>Implying it won't use the ctr engine

>>17582725
Not defensive, just stating facts

>>17582738
You are just overblowing the service. It's a service you only have to do every 60k. Plenty of people do it without lifting the engine, you act like it will ruin the car or something

>>17582781
Do you own one?

>>17582633
>Daily reminder that the FA20 is the most powerful NA 4 cylinder available on the market.
>nobody buys an enthusiast toyota to work on a subaru engine.

I didn't say it performed poorly, if you're never going to open the hood who gives a shit. But if you're never going to open the hood why buy a GT86?

>muh most powerful NA
Well, great, they have a turbo version too, let's see how that stacks up.
>FA20F
>296hp
>718 Cayman
>345hp
laughingfrauen.jpg

>The Honda also didnt make any torque until like 6k
Until exactly 6k, when do you think VTEC kicks in yo?

>Name a better car for under 25k new
Yes, it is probably the cheapest trackable car NEW, but not by very much, and that isn't that much of an accomplishment when it sucks this hard. It's like going to McDonalds and screaming FIND ME A CHEAPER BURGER I DARE YOU while shoveling lukewarm meat and stale bread down your throat. A good burger costs 5-8 dollars, I'm sorry you had to find out like this.

>>17582121
So you prefer 6000 RPM of sub 125 lb ft to 1500 rpm of 120 lb feet?
>turbo isn't available with premade mounting hardware
>GUYS IT'S HARD TO ADD FORCED INDUCTION

>>17582856
I prefer 9000rpm with 50 extra horsies and no torque dip.

>>17582865
You do have a torque dip, it's the bottom 6k.

>>17582872 you are really reaching here.
One of these:
>>17582046
>>17582121
Is not like the other.

>>17582872
Good thing the car has a manual gearbox with a whooping 6 gears to choose from so I can be in the powerband all the time if I want to

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>>17582783
Yep. I've owned mine for over 3 years now. I've also owned over 20 other cars.

>>17582784
I don't get what you're trying to say, plenty of people modify the 86.

Also, are you comparing a WRX engine to the 60k Cayman engine? What are you even talking about?

>. It's like going to McDonalds and screaming FIND ME A CHEAPER BURGER I DARE YOU while shoveling lukewarm meat and stale bread down your throat. A good burger costs 5-8 dollars, I'm sorry you had to find out like this.

So you are saying that if you spend more money on something that the quality is better? What a fucking genius you are. I should have just spent 60k on a Cayman I guess.

>>17582889
You're at 120ish lb feet for 2/3 of your powerband in the s2000 and less than 1/4 of the 86's powerband. The advantage of the s2000 is you can gear slightly lower because you have an extra 500-ish or 1300 ish (AP1) RPM to play with.
>>17582892
So just like the 86?

>>17582894
>Also, are you comparing a WRX engine
Same engine with a turbo.

>Muh DAILY REMINDER that this engine is LITERALLY THE BEST on the WHOLE MARKET
>gets btfo
>a b-buh porsches are expensive

If Porsche offered it NA it would still take a fat shit on Subaru.

>>17583018
No, he said the FA20 found in the BRZ is the most powerful N/A 4 cylinder on the market today. The FA20DIT in the WRX is obviously not the most powerful turbo 4 out there.

>>17580365
B...but it's a tuners cars real tuners.....
>locked ecu
>void warranty
>high compression NA engine
>plastic tyres

Where's the turbo guys!?
Why dont toyota just put a fucking turbo on it?
Just put a fucking turbo in it for fucks sake and make it the car it should always have been.

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>>17583018
Yeah, but it's not even offered in the 86 so it's completely irrelevant.

>If Porsche offered it NA it would still take a fat shit on Subaru

Ok...But they don't make a NA 4 cylinder. And if they did it would be in a car that costs twice as much.

Even Honda has moved away from NA engines. High revving NA 4 cylinders will soon be completely extinct.

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>>17583073
>Wanting a turbo over a supercharger
You sound like a memeboost mustang owner

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>>17583018
>If Porsche offered it NA it would still take a fat shit on Subaru.
If Porsche made an NA 4 cylinder it would have torque dip just like their NA 6 cylinder did

Should I get this or a Focus ST? it has much more power and the aftermarket is still yuge.

>>17583041
And it's the most meaninglessly special of special olympics. You're too poor to fucking turbo it so you want some sort of award for that?

>>17583076
>And if they did it would be in a car that costs twice as much.
Yeah, better things generally cost more.

I'm honestly not going to miss high revving 4 cylinders, they're inherently imbalanced and generally shit. High revving NA cars are still around, and that's all that matters.

>>17583073
Aren't all ECUs locked?
>high comp engine
So they've already done a lot of the work for you.
>>17583094
>>17583102
Entirely depends on the powerband you want.

> front-engine 4 seat successor to a mid-engine 2 seat car

>>17583106
He was pointing out that anon's statement of the 4age being a monster yet the FA20 being a turd was a dumb statement.

>>17582046
it doesnt have a torque dip at least, just a big bump when it switches to the high cam

>>17583126
>for the time

The FA20 is shit in 2017

More importantly

>"tuner" engine that is shit to work on

The whole fucking car was a swing and a miss.

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>>17583106
>Yeah, better things generally cost more.

Sure it would be better, but would it be good enough to justify spending twice as much? Probably not. They have hamburgers that cost $50. That doesn't necessarily mean it's twice as good as a $25 hamburger.

>>17583106
>High revving NA cars are still around, and that's all that matters

Youre fucking stupid if you think high revving NA 6 cylinder and 8 cylinder engines will be produced for much longer. If you can find one you better expect to pay close to 100k.

>>17581575
cylinder layout doesn't affect torque

>mfw just factory ordered a brz

Test drove an FRS today because that's all they had on the lot. I've only driven slow a super base 2006 Malibu and a '01 Grand cherokee so this is a huge step up for me. Even the interior will be miles ahead of anything I've owned before. Sure it's not as fast as some other cars but I don't need the fastest thing out there. I also think it's one of the best looking new cars under 30k too.

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>>17583154
Why are you comparing a factory engine to an aftermarket kit? The 86 will never have a turbo from the factory. You can't even buy a fucking levorg in the States.

If anything compare the edlebrock to a aftermarket turbo kit.

>>17583146
>Probably not
Who the fuck knows, there's obviously an upper limit to price. Will a 2 million dollar car be twice as good as a 1 million dollar car? No. Will a 30,000 dollar car be twice as good as a 15,000 dollar car? Almost certainly.

The actually correct solution is to listen to the green man and spend your ONLY 25k NEW money to buy an older used car and keep it running. Twenty five thousand dollars of SW20 is going to take you above and beyond anything a stock GT86 can do.

>>17580365
Does it have direct injection?

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>>17583151
I hope you got the performance package

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>>17583191
>Will a 30,000 dollar car be twice as good as a 15,000 dollar car?
Brz is 25k. A Cayman is like 65k. Not worth the difference imo.

>>17583191
>SW20 is going to take you above and beyond anything a stock GT86 can do.
You can buy used 86s for around 16k these days. A clean mr2 turbo will be close to 10k these days with rice tax. Not exactly a bargain for a car that is almost 20 years older.

>>17583214
>Not exactly a bargain for a car that is almost 20 years older.

Except a modded MR2 will absolutely, unequivocally destroy a bone stock GT86 in 0-60, quarter mile, top speed, and track performance.

>>17583194
Why did they put the calipers in front of the axles? Are they actively trying to make the bias worse?

>>17583228
You could get a stock c5 and outperform the modified mr2 for the same price though

Comparing 20 year old modified cars to a car stock car that is barely 5 years old is kind of silly desu

>>17582667
Have both. Coupe for Toyota, call it the GT86 and soft top for Honda, call it the new S2000.

erections all round

>>17583439
When I get an erection it makes me hanker for some direct injection.

>>17583139
Why are you pulling the heads off of an engine that already has extremely good power for being N/A? What is hard to do on a boxer besides spark plugs?

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the altezza rs200 was always the successor, rwd, 5 doors for the kids.

>>17583488
>Why are you pulling the heads off of an engine that already has extremely good power for being N/A?
IT DOESN'T EVEN HAVE DIRECT INJECTION

>>17583518
But it does???

>>17583194
Sure did.

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>>17583518
>IT DOESN'T EVEN HAVE DIRECT INJECTION
What did he mean by this?

>>17583632
Of course subaru owners would be this stupid

Literally worse than a Clio RS.

>>17583636
>being this new

>>17583509
This
Though in the states we only got the 2JZ-GE, which is a real shame

>>17583636
Just keep making remarks without backing up your claims. It makes you sound like a retard.

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>>17580774
Here it's 40k. Bu absolutely worth it as a drivers car.
WRX and GTI are both faster, but neither is as engaging.

No regrets

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>>17581475
>Failed

>>17582723
This.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Enp_XZfSRsI

Pretty much stock 86s beat Tsuchiya's heavily modified AE86

>>17583100
Drive both.
I cross shopped a GTI and WRX against the 86 and chose the 86. Yeah it's slower, but it's a far better driving experience.

>>17583509
AE86 had 3 doors, not 5. 86 is the successor, cheap, lightweight, not that fast, more fun than it should be.

>>17583637
New Clio is a turd. No manual, no steering feel.
The previous gens were top of class, the current one sucks

>>17584484
>enough fucking turbos
check
>I want an engine that utilizes modern technology to improve performance while still being bulletproof and easy to work on
BZZZZZZ fail.

>>17584582
Faster =/= better

>>17583192
Yes

>>17585054
What is hard to work on about the boxer? Why are you pulling the heads on a car with extremely good heads and cams already? What is not durable about the FA20?

>>17582566
toyota sienna is faster in a straight line

>>17582162
It's so weird to think that you could spend all that money for only about 70 Whp.