Why are FWD cars hated so much? Yes, FWD is a compromise, but

>>16843115
>Why are FWD cars hated so much
They aren't. It's just a busrider meme.

>Oh, and people who drive an automatic and consider themselves "enthusiasts" because it's RWD are delusional
Spot the "my povo-spec 90s Civic is a racecar because m...muh RACEKAR manual tranny" Ameriturd.

>>16843115
FWD's are good for econoboxes or cars where eprformance isn't important.

All fwd cars would be so much better as RWD
FWD cars are boring and have limit to how much power they can make
I'd rather buy an rwd car for same price and upgrade suspension and chassis than buy an fwd.
Fwd is just boring.
Not to mention having front wheels do steering, breaking and accelarating while rear wheels just tag along is stupid for performance.
Sure some fwd cars do fine but that's not the point.

Also fwd is way less fun in snow.

>>16843115
i drive a focus rs by myself and know exactly what u mean. it´s a ton of fun to drive on narrow landside streets.

The point is: A FWD can never powerslide, which is also a ton of fun.

But as you said, i wouldn´t buy a RWD just for the rwd´s sake. you get definitely better FWD´s then RWD´s for the same money

>>16843122
Nah, a yuropian RWD driver who was very undecided when buyng a new car and doesnt't undrstand the FWD hate meme.
>>16843130
Every car has compromises, and upgrading the engine costs way less than upgrading the suspension, chassis, and weight of a car.
FWD on a sporty DD is fine, obviously for a dedicated fun car RWD is better but it also depends a lot on the platform

>>16843122
maybe i exagerated a bit with the
>"people who drive an automatic and consider themselves "enthusiasts" rant
but i would never consider buying an auto, but i'd consider an FWD

>>16843168
This is true. Suspension upgrade alone doesn´t compensate a bad chassis.
And good chassis sporty RWD´s are usually expensive. (except a miata or gt86)

Honda makes all their cars except the nsx and s2000 fwd, they perform crazy good on the tracks, that's basically what they're born to do. The integra r was a god machine to the point they were losing money on each produced model. On a windy track fwd for the most part has the advantage. the fact people argue about fwd vs rwd is retarded, in the end it comes down to driver skill

>>16843174
>(except a miata or gt86)
Which are slower than a similar priced sporty fwd.

>>16843180
yes true, but how often are you REALLY on a race track with your car?
Sure it is fun to drive fast on normal roads, but here it doesn´t matter if your a second faster to 60, when you drive a mountain road or doing slides on wet/snowy roads.

Sometimes weaker cars with good ride can be more fun just because you can go full throttle more percent of the time.

pushing a 400hp porsche to it´s limit on open road is not more exciting than doing it with a gt86

>>16843204
Yeah, but how, much of your time on the road is actually spent drifting with an RWD? In the end what matters most is an enjoyable driving experience, and that depends on both the car and driver. Some enjoy a nimble car, some enjoy letting a powerful v8 roar in the straights, others enjoy a a comfortable ride. What is important is to have an open mind when buying a new car and not have silly prejudices.

>>16843209
this is totally true. as i mentioned before I enjoy every minute in my '04 Focus RS. It´s nimble, light, has 215hp and on windy roads it can compete with a lot of cars.

Downsides(which i am fine with): little noise damping, little ride comfort, fuel consumption and sometimes i miss doing powerslides

>>16843209
I have nothing against people who buy FWD cars.
I am mad at honda for only making great fwd cars but making all their RWD's really expensive.
Mostly because I really wanted a RWD car like a prelude or del sol.
I will never buy an FWD car for hooning purposes because FR/MR is just so much better due to half the year being snow and ice.

I think people who make the argument of "this drivetrain configuration is better than that one" haven't owned both while pushing each to the limit.

I've tracked plenty of cars in my younger years: fwd, rwd, awd. They all have their pros and cons and don't necessarily dictate the performance of a vehicle.

RWD can exhibition understeer, FWD can exhibit oversteer, and AWD can do both aswell. It's all about the tuning and style of driving you prefer.

I personally like fwd because it's more predictable beyond its limits and it offers a lower curbweight with all things being equal.

The people who claim that rwd is the only acceptable option are usually bench racers with a lack of experience in the automotive world. They claim that drifting is the only way to have fun in a car, which is incorrect. I've had a lot of fun in other drivetrain configurations that were also just as fast as other options.

>>16843222
Well, it's understandable why honda's RWD cars are not, cheap, for ecample the s2000 is
-light
-good suspension and chassis (/despite being a convertible
-high revving NA engine (as opposed to a turbo that would probably cost less and give more power and torks but loose muh feel)
and the NSX was meant to compete with ferraris, so...

>>16843204
>yes true, but how often are you REALLY on a race track with your car?
On a track I would be given to believe the rwd platform, even having less power, would be faster.

I was referring to 0-60 and quarter mile, which is probably what a sports car is used for by the general public.

>>16843236
I agree with almost everything you just said except for the nsx/Ferrari statement.

The NSX was Honda's statement to the world that they can make a reliable supercar that didn't rely on a ridiculous number of cylinders or displacement to have a great performance vehicle.

Aluminum body, high revving v6, and again, reliability.

>>16843238
yea, but in my opinion people who are talking of straight line performance don´t understand the point of sports cars

>>16843229
>FWD can exhibit oversteer
my first car was a little citroen AX that suffered from crazy lift-off oversteer (might have to do with the fact that i was driving a 15 year old shitbox like a sports car). good times were had, good thing that you can just accelerate to straighten the car when oversteering in an FWD

>>16843238
>On a track I would be given to believe the rwd platform, even having less power, would be faster.
The problem with this statement is simple physics: a rwd will have more parasitic loss than a fwd car because the power simply has a longer path to travel to get to the ground. You then take into account that if the rwd car already has less power to offer than the fwd, there's simply no way that it'd have enough to outperform the fwd car (all things being equal)

>I was referring to 0-60 and quarter mile, which is probably what a sports car is used for by the general public
Quarter mile times definitely sell to the general public, but the general public doesn't understand the overall formula of performance.

A V6 minivan can outperform a miata in a straight line, but when it comes to every other aspect of the vehicle, it will lose everytime.

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Strayafag reporting in.
Anything rwd and manual has whats known as the "drift tax", often applicable to same cars is the "jdm tax" finally followed by the "sydney tax"
None of which are legitimate taxes its just a joke about cars being overpriced because all the cashed up p-platers want to drift them into a tree
Even 20 year old commodores will demand high price if manual, worth nothing if auto though.

>>16843249
Accelerate to correct fwd under/over steer? My experience was the easiest way to get control back from a fwd vehicle was to let off the throttle a bit, apply mild braking, and correct steering. Ofcourse, you may have had different experiences than I have with your vehicle setups.

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The main and only reason why FWD is "hated" is because of the fact that manufacturers have,
for the last 20 years or so, blue-balled enthusiasts with almost no lower end DD-practical RWDs being made.
The only cars that come to mind are BRZ/GT86, Miata/124(sporty coupes) and the fucking Twingo.
2000's were especially sad, and not it seems too late for a resurgence of RWDs like Sierra.

>>16843266
I think the miata has reliably filled that market for almost 30 years now. Ofcourse, if you don't want a convertible, 4 cylinder, lower power, and "girly" car, then that kind of negates that.

But then again, Ford and GM offered the opposite of the miata forever. Just always a little expensive when new.

>>16843254
>there's simply no way that it'd have enough to outperform the fwd car
you´re right when i comes down to acceleration. I´m driving 3h races in an 150hp class and one of the big advantages of RWD is tyre wear.

A fwd car has all the stress (brake, steer, accelerate) on the front tryes. not to mention that in an FR layout u can do transaxles which help a lot in weight distribution(which is also a problem for FF)

>>16843262
Well, no way you can correct understeer by accelerating, but when oversteering in an FWD you point the wheel in the correct direction and the acceleration straightens the car. What you're saying is a good way to correct understeer but braking during lift-off oversteer is just asking for more trouble

>>16843262
that´s maybe true for a dumb safe volkswagen.

but if you´re thinking of vehicle dynamics: the lift-off makes the rear light and let´s you oversteer, so the counteraction is to apply throttle and steer straight.

to initiate a drift in a FWD you brake hard + simultaneously steering while u have still a lot of weight on the front axle. and then you just keep balancing it with left foot brake and throttle

>>16843274
Im in Eastern Europe.
If I want an RWD, my choice basically comes down to either a manual IS300 or Omega.
All the Beemers here are either rusting on their 25th owner or overpriced, and I never really liked the brand.

>>16843292
me too.
You can have a lot of jdm shit for sub 10k
Or import from germoney

>>16843266
supra, s2k, sw20

>>16843314
I have considered it.
Don't really trust local JDM because I am sure that it tself was imported by "dude hectik lmao" retards that I aspire to be.

>>16843320
>Only Supra on sale is for 39k euros and an Automatic
I don't have a garage available so I would rather prefer something I not too worried about being rained on or hit by rogue footballs.

>>16843334
i know most of them are poorly maintained, high mileage, riced shit, but you can find a lot of E36-E46 bimmers around for cheap. It may not be the best platform (or the most reliable) but the aftermarket is good and it sure beats buying rice taxed cars.

>>16843334
I know what supra you are talking about.
Ther was one for 40k that had 1000hp late last year.

Wanna come to discord and discuss some cars? We are in same area.

>>16843352
I am total autonoob though, don't have discord either.

>>16843354
don't worry, you sound like me a few months ago. You don't need to download shit just click link
https://discord.gg/Ytj9q

>>16843115
I´d argue FF and RR are the best drivetrain layouts due to their efficiency, simplicity and price.
For budget sporty cars FF is a great choice and gives you lots of space in a relatively small car.
Also your rear diffusor can be bigger if there is no differential in its way.

MR/RR has basicly the same drivetrain, but rear mounted, wich means it is pretty much as efficient, simple and cheap as FF.
Also it gives you a great weight balance and more freedom for front side aerodynamics.
It is also verry good in acceleration, if you compare 911s and GTRs you will see that the 911 turbos with less power accelerate faster than the GTR and reaches a higher topspeed.

>>16843394
to argue that FF is a bette choice because u can realize a bigger diffuser is ridiculous.

and talking of efficiency. The FF layout is so efficient because of its transverse mounted engine. you lose a lot of that efficiency if you mount it longitudinal, which is fact for rr mounted engines.

and from weight distribution. it´s true that RR layout helps while accelerating and especially braking, but it´s still handicap for doing turns

>>16843115
They are not, this board wanks over civics and corollas

>>16843394
FR is the worst layout.

>>16843423
I only said it would be also a benefit from a FF layout, not that it would be the only one.

>>16843507
okay
Race a 1000hp Ff against an 1000hp FR
Oh wait nobody makes 1000HP FF cars because the FF layout is retarded when it comes to anything over 250 hp

>>16843115
>spacious and compact

Literally my biggest issue. I don't want that.

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>>16843893
Then don't buy euro hatchbacks

>>16843909
Unfortunately that's too small for me too

>>16843922
Easy your momma joke here

>>16843130

T. Busrider.

If you think a 200HP car that weighs under 1800lbs is boring just because it's FWD you obviously know jackshit about what you're talking.

>>16843173
Depends on the auto really, if it's significantly cheaper than a manual I'd go for it.
The real question is how would would an european go about getting their hands on decomissioned crown vic police interceptors?

>>16844291
I'm not interested in boats, anon