What's the hardest car to work on? Pic related, it's

what are those blue balls

Citroen DS. Lotus Esprit. (Older) Lamborghini and Ferrari in general.

Basically anything mid-engined.

>>15467295
Anal beads

>>15467281

Anything turbo related on a Mini
Uhh, people drop the motor for Northstar gaskets
Early 00's Audi timing belts
uhhh
VG30DETT 300ZX

>>15467295
Va-cum.

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>>15467301
funny thing is they used the same part for DECADES
my car was made in 1983

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>>15467296
>Citroen DS
SM is worse. WAY worse.

>>15467692
Oh, that's the one I meant. Oh well.

>>15467710
The DS isn't easy either, but the SM just takes it to ridiculous levels.

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>>15467722
dude the efi sm is hot

>>15467726
One of the sexiest cars ever built.

Subaru you've got to pull the engine for just about anything

>>15467299

North star and head gaskets being blown are pretty much synonymous at this point. I belive it's less of a headache to just buy a while new engine while I'm sure aftermarket headgaskets are a major.improvement give no extreme damage was done to the origional motor.

>>15467351
yeah something with the germans and pressure balls that they cant seem to let go of

>>15467737
better or worse than the cardboard ones found in subarus?

>>15467692
dick status: muh

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audis are easy to work on, just different and expensive when you have to get random little plastic parts from the dealer. If you know the routine then doing major service is not that bad

I get more frustrated with american cars, especially the FWD V6es (chrysler can eat shit)

Any EV, because not only are the systems complex as they're electronical beasts, the batteries are WMDs. Probably the easiest way to get killed

>>15467807
Imagine: Youre the CEO of the most profitable car comany in the world. You easily make $30billion each year and you can't manage to make a non-defective, reliable engine. Imagine, that 30b can't buy a good headgasket, can't make a head that doesnt warp, can't make a valve spring that lasts more than 10K miles, can't secure a proper airbag AFTER the takata incident, can sell a new engine that doesn't burn oil, can't install a piston ring pack correctly, can't make a VVT unit that doesnt rattle at every start up. Imagine you had all that money and zero talent. When you consider all of that, does Subaru really seem tnat bad?

fuel filters on Toyotas

>>15467281
most modern longitudinal engine cars look like a fuckfest like that with the front fascia and supporting hardware/radiators taken out.

>>15467726
>>15467692
>have to be a Citroen specialist to make sense of the hydraulics
>have to be a maserati specialist to make any sense of the engine
>have to be clairvoyant to make sense of the electrics

>>15467726
why does it need 2 cans of bleach attached to air intake

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fucking pt cruiser

it's like they drew the body without thinking of the internals at all, and then were surprised that they had to cram this, and this, and this, under the hood

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>>15467692
>built-in spare oil holder

>>15467969
70's Maserati engine, at least they knew what they were getting into.

>>15467902
where do you live that bleach comes in a god damn can? russia?

>>15467929
Motherfucking ford put a transverse i6 in the volvo s80

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>>15468005
How about a veeate?

>>15468022
well that's no longer than an i5.

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>>15468005
whats so difficult about it?
that v8 is a whole can of worms

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>>15468022
America went absolutely haywire on transverse V8s between the mid '80s and the mid '00s. To my knowledge all of them front wheel drive, too.

>>15468042
but that has the same tranny as the volvo

>>15467969
>not having a spare qt of oil under the hood

LS1 and honda D series here


>muh oil consumption

>>15467737
>>15467807
its not the actual gaskets that came in the northstar that are the issue.

>>15468079
is it the head bolts then? its one or the other.

>>15468088
head studs. they don't have enough clamping force to keep the heads to the block. there's a guy in canada that was boring out the holes in the block and putting in larger headstuds with a more coarse thread. not sure if hes still around though.

>>15468042
At least this bay looks somewhat presentable and easier to work on than >>15468035
>>15468022
or >>15467929

>>15468101
well that is shit engineering

>>15467994
Definitely not Japan though

>>15468131
someone dun goofed

>>15468035
The gearbox is behind the engine on that thing.

>>15468141
the navistar 6.0 v8 had the same issue. weak head bolts. the stock head gasket was ok ish.
so international probably hired the engineers from the northstar to work on navistar.

wow that sounds weird.

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>>15467857
This, especially the B5's. I can't think of anything easier that isn't a utility vehicle meant to be repaired on the road, Audis are easy-peasy.

Pic related, got into the timing belt within a few minutes on a longitudinal engine, this was like two bolts for bumper, 7 for the bumper supports, 6 for the front frame and 4 for the headlights, ta-da. All bolts easily accessible too.

This car is perfect for anyone who wants to DIY.

>>15468042
>To my knowledge all of them front wheel drive, too.
Why on earth would they make a transverse rear wheel drive V8?

>>15468194
>guise wat is awd?

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>>15468194
Because Fiero.

>>15467281
Audi and VAG in general is mostly easy as long as you use the service position (like in your pic) and have the tools required. (cam lock pin and cam lock bar) Looks like a timing belt job to me.

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I've never worked on a challenging vehicle. I've mostly only messed with 4-cylinder coupes and V8 trucks which both usually have spacious bays.

Even the Audi TT 225 wasn't too bad.

Though I must say, changing the piping to and from the turbo in my STi was more difficult than belts / gaskets / water pump in my Miata; not more time-consuming, just more difficult.

>>15467692

oh shieeet negro is that one of those toilet paper filters??

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>>15467737
>be a mechanic
>get paid $500/wk under the table
>'08 DTS w/northstar
>rear main seal leak
>the owner of the shop asks if i can get it done by 2:30pm the next day
>its 7pm
>MFW


by the way, its still not done, I refuse to do it, they dont pay me enough.

>>15468221
I said RWD not AWD you schmuck
>>15468289
Perhaps I should have specified front engined

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>>15468178
Also, this was like an evening after work where I installed a completely new washer system and straightened the door.

>>15467281
removing the whole front is easier than hoisting the engine out. they clearly thought this out.
just saiyan.

>>15467296
>>15467692
What about Xantia and C5?

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>>15468467
Xantia Activa bay...

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>>15468475
>>15468467
And the C5.

>>15468475
>>15468486
I'm not a mechanic and these look okay to me. I intend to buy either one because of the super comfy suspension (I'm aware of its issues), but I don't like the idea of spending lots of money on a Citroen.

>>15468475
Activa is a rare pepe though, regular Xantias look like any other I4 shitbox with a couple extra components.

Well that's a RS4, so I'd imagine it'd be hard. My A4 is pretty easy to work on.

>>15468508
Yeah, I did pick out the hardest-to-work-on Xantia. Regular ones have more room under there.

Anything with an LS4.

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Nothing is specifically "hard"
Maybe more work, but not hard. If you know what you're doing apply theory, simple.
Doesn't matter if it's an Acura or a Benz

The Chevy 4.3 V6 is nothing but a Cluster Fuck

>>15468312
>meme air intake
poor car.

>>15468571
I hate to agree with GS400guy, but he's right. There's nothing very difficult about working on any car. It gets difficult when you buy dollar store service manuals instead of factory or neglect to buy the correct tools as shadetree mechanics are wont to do.

>>15468906
It was an OE-optional air intake, not aftermarket.

>>15468917
You mean it was in the parts catalog at the dealership.

>>15467296
You don't know what you're talking about.
Everything is give and take.
A timing belt on a longitudinal MR can mean pulling the engine is easier than not,
But a fairly rare service taking a little more work doesn't mean a car is hard to work on.
>I'm calling 20k mile service rare
Also inboard brakes, but ignore that.

The Japs and Americans love making basic things hard as shit to do.
The Euros tend to make common things easy to do. While the Americans will stick the brake fluid reservoir in a place you can't reach even with a funnel.
And the Japanese will put a clutch master in a position where you have to pull the engine to replace it.

>>15467929
Removing the radiator sucks in a PT. You have ot remove the fan first. But, the top pipe neck for the radiator is in the way. The books show the neck unbolting, but the radiators it hhas (at least for the Turbo version) don't do that, so you have to fuck puuuuull on the radiator and hope you don't break the lower bolt holes when removing fan.

>>15468962
European cars tend to be more maintenance-heavy, so it makes sense that they'd make them relatively easy to service.

As you said, it's all give and take.

Passat is shit to work on

>>15469123
Which gen? My dad's B4 is piss easy.

>>15468798
You must be a total retard

300ZX
jesus fucking christ, no I will not help

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>>15468910
True if you have the right tools the only pain in the ass would be if somethings not going as it should i.e. something stuck, snapped, broken.

But. When all you are doing is wrenching there are cars that make it more of a pain in the ass. You shouldnt have to remove the front facia, radiator fans, intake, and water pump to change a distributor, but some cars require more love than others...and weekends.

Any transvere V-engined van

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Lets flip this thread.
Whats the easiest cars to work on. Cars that actually bring joy to wrenching.

>>15469253
obligatory Civic mention, or most Hondas really

>>15469253
any pre 2000s hyundai

>>15467281
It takes like 15 minutes to get the entire front end off one of those you softcock.

>>15469253
volvo bricks?

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It's a bitch to change spark plugs and gaskets of any kind on my EG33.

>>15467737
True got alot of Cadillac's lol had to do it

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>>15467857
>special parts
You mean special tools?
From time to time mine has just pissed me off with a random socket. VAG and their triple square socket can properly fuck off.

>All the plastic stuff that decays
>All the little clips that will break.
>Having to replace my disptick tube because it crumbled to pieces
>Having to drop the oilpan because a piece of orange plastic fell in.
>That mess of a procedure to replace/look at the air filter.
As far as cars to work on, VAGmobiles are some of the most common bad ones.
For whatever reason I still don't feel all too comfortable on the lift points for the b5.

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>>15469253
My 1.8t Mk4 GTI is pretty easy. I've also worked on a 1996 Toyota Celica and found that to be the easiest I've had to work with.
My worst was a Porsche 928 and an 03 Boxer

>>15467295

Part of the evap system, forget what specifically.

Source: own an S4

>>15468312
I'm a subi tech and yes those fucking turbo inlet tubes are the bane of my existence. I tend to pull a muscle ripping those fucking things out.

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>>15469319
At least they have the common courtesy to give you alternator/drive belt access panels.

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>>15468921
Yes, I do mean that, and I bought the car at an auction w/ 7k miles so...

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>>15469253
French shitboxes from the 90s, but I'll post the most memeable one.

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>>15469253
My metro is so piss easy to work on and I absolutely love it.

>>15467296
>(Older) Lambroghini

as if they're any easier to work on today

they got them pretty reliable now though, other than the damn sensors and electronics

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>want to replace fuel filter
>gotta relieve the fuel pressure in the lines before i can touch that shit
>there's no fuel pump relay i can take out
>gotta remove the back seat, pop open this cover which is sealed with glue or some shit and then disconnect the fuel pump
i mean why not just have a fuel pump fuse or something in the engine bay

>>15468178
>>15467857
>timing belt job requires removing the entire front end including the AC condenser
>easy
Audifags have stockholm syndrome

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>>15469438
>no fuel pump relay
How is the pump switched off and on if there's no relay? A manual switch? Is it hard wired to run all the time when the battery is in? There has to be a fuel pump relay somewhere, I highly doubt a fucking hyundai uses a solid state fuel pump controller with big ass mosfets.

>>15469490
i hear the pump whine when i turn the key so hyundai must have built a magic car i guess

>>15469505
There's a relay somewhere opie. There's no way it's powered by the ignition switch alone.

>>15469505
There will always be a fuel pump fuse and/or relay. find ALL of the fuse boxes in your car(the vast majority of modern cars have more than one) and then check your owners manual.

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>>15467281
Try replacing the clutch in a Subaru.

Shit... Just try replacing the spark plugs.

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>>15469571
>>15469532
just found out it's behind the interior fusebox

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Personally, the all time hardest car I've ever worked on was a 1995 Cadillac seville.

Replacing the alternator goes something like this:
>remove serpentine belt. Kinda squished in there, no biggie tho
>remove top alternator bolt
>remove bottom alternator bo---
>wait a minute
>bottom alternator bolt is hidden so well the only way to get to it is with an open end wrench
>from underneath the car
>and you can only turn it about 1/8th of a turn at a time
>literally spend half an hour getting a single bolt out
>after it's out you have to repeat this process to get the new one in
>about 2 hours to change an alternator
The best part is that the alternators kept burning out in this car.
Also:
>transverse V8
NEVER AGAIN.

The blower motor on this car, while not as hard to get to on others, is also a pain in the ass. The trunk lock housings also kept snapping in half because GM decided to make the housing for it out of plastic.

A close second my hardest to work on car would have to be a 1990 mercedes 300e.

>>15469282
that's what you get for buying a meme car

>>15469577
>Try replacing the clutch in a Subaru.
>Shit... Just try replacing the spark plugs.

Both of these are easy you faggot.

>>15468312
fuck subis, we spent like 2 hours trying to figure out where the god damn hose near the turbo vac line went, its a fucking atmospheric line.

>>15469640
transverse engines are a bitch

>>15470259
>transverse inline 4
hu?H

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>>15469473
You don't have to remove it, faggot, it slides aside as you remove the bumper frame.

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My sister just had a clutch put in her Mini. Boy that looks like fun

>>15467281
a late 90s 5.4L F150 when you have to change the plugs.

>>15471537
Most fagg/o/ts here are lazy, they don't want to put the effort into it so they stick to simple shit.

Nothing really wrong with that, but nothing wrong with wanting to challenge yourself either. Otherwise, how else are you gonna get better?

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>>15470259
>03' duratec taurus

They designed it to be time consuming. I have to remove the entire intake manifold to change spark plugs.

On the plus side the electronics are pretty straight forward on this car

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>>15469640
I feel your pain. 1999 Eldorado here. I have done the alternator 5 times. Failed 2 twice and was given two shitty ones in a row. I got real good at it. Now if only I could track down the coolant leak, the power steering leak, fix the a/c, replace a blown out speaker. Fuck Man I need to sell this car.

>>15472984
>has never picked up a wrench in his entire life

>>15473257
hit a nerve there, buddy?

>>15467281
>What's the hardest car to work on?
FiST, given how often mine is back at the steelership with them being unable to fix the turbo issue.

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>>15469253
Rangers are nice to work on, except for when you have to replace the slave cylinder on anything that's past 1992.

>>15468109
That twin turbo straight six is no fun either. Volvo engine bays manage to look simple yet when you start digging into it start running into stupid stuff.

>>15467281

try to remove the left front panel

>>15467296
Cars a poor guy like me will never have to work on.

>>15469253
1972 gm truck

>>15468035
Can you elaborate what you ment about that v8 being a can of worms?

>>15469473

Yes they do, VWvortex are filled with these people.

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>>15469473
Timing chains are back of the engine.

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>>15474426
lol faggot can't repair autos????

Like already mentioned, you don't need to remove it, it moves aside by opening a locking bolt or two on the sides. But obviously since this is /o/, where sausage-fingered neckbeards fantasize about being car enthusiasts or mechanics, when in reality they spend their days waiting for the bus and reading up on retarded shit on instagram and top gear about silly fuck nothings, how can I expect anything but supressed fear guised as pissy bullshit because working on "complicated" machines is "too hard".

Fuck this meme-board, you're all retarded.

>>15474479
For intake valves, yes. But even on the most sold engines you can replace the rear tensioner without taking off anything more than the valve-cover. It is also well known that with maintenance and correct fluids and lubrication, those chains don't need to be touched, ever, you can go 500 on most engines without ever facing issues if you know how to maintain the damn thing.

>>15474499
You don't need to touch the chains, but the (plastic) tensioners and guides do wear out.

>>15474510
perhaps

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Range Rovers.

>removing the body is easier than removing the engine

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>>15474499
Is there really that much room between the engine and firewall that it does not require engine removal to change the chain tensioners and guides?

>>15474568
BUMPER
T
O
BUMPER

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>tfw motorcycle so your shit will always be easy to work on

2010 Ford Explorer
To change the spark plug wires you need to remove the alternator and open the cooling system

>>15474904
best feel
stealerships can go fuck themselves

>>15472931
Oh fuck.

Did the plugs on my 99 250... Fuck that

as a mechanic ive worked on some junk, worst i can remember is V6 4x4 Ford Escape. have to take the fucking rear exhaust manifold off to remove the transmission and the bolts are always rusted out and fuckered, that and you have to take out the axle to do the alternator

>>15472931

i did a newish Mustang at work with the 2-piece spark plugs, fucking half of them broke in half and we needed to get an extractor tool. worst thing Ford ever did was those shitty 2-piece plugs

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>spent 9 hours trying to get the ball joint off my ranger to replace the front end

>>15474499
You don't know what the fuck you are talking about.

>>15474510
The tensioners are plastic dipshit.

Fucking /o/ full of retards that have never even worked on cars.

>>15475315
*aren't not are

>>15469261
Was just a Mitsubishi shit powerplant

>>15469438
You have a piece of shit Accent and your big gripe if a 5 minute almost toolless fuel filter change?

>>15469159
The 4.3 is junk I've never seen one that lasted beyond 150 thousand miles before it grenaded itself.

early 90's f body, pain to change spark plugs

300zx twin turbo. look at the engine bay

maserati biturbo

>>15474615
yes

>>15467726
I never thought I'll see a messier engine bay than a Nissan one.
Damn Frenchies!

>>15469253
Buicks with the based nailhead

>>15467857
>Chrysler can eat shit.

I agree. They can't design a decent car. Mfw on an episode of Mythbusters they guys were complaining that a Dodge POS they were going to use it took them a long time to locate the battery and it ended up being located inside a wheel well. I couldn't stop laughing at Chrysler's stupidity and lack of common sense.

>>15468475
Why put fruit in engine bays?

>>15467281
from what I gather its not just trying to cram as much stuff as possible in to a tiny space
the real night mare begins when the accountant digs in to the production line
esp the time managing type

sure there are ways to put things together faster than they can ever be taken apart
but all this does is speed up assembly and pass the problem of servicing to some one else

accountants also use quantitative metrics that are easy to measure and miss out on observing the subtitles that are the true key to effectiveness
quality be dammed if you can just save but one cent per hundred fittings and in some cases even less

they make all kinds of excuse but at the end of the day it is just shirking of responsibility and burdening others with the final outcome

>>15469268
This

>>15475315
Fuck off nigger, ADR and APT allow access back there and you can replace the tensioner from under the cover.

What I don't get is faggots complaining about longitudinal engines being cramped, unless you want your car to have a kikenose frontend, there isn't too many options.

>>15467281

honestly that would be very easy to work on. from what i'm reading it takes about an hour to an hour and a half to get to that point but once you do, you have access to literally every point of the engine

beats the hell out of pulling the engine every time you need to do anything like in a 300ZX or FWD V8 Cadillac

>>15477784
That is a 4 cylinder, nothing like the v6 in the picture.

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Anyone tried working on one of these bastards?

Great when they work, but I fucking hate them. It is as if the designer thought "lets make this as bloody difficult as possible" when putting it all together.

Fucking thing.

>>15467281
300zx

I would rather work on Subaru EJ251s all day than one of those fucking cunts for an hour.

SL65 Bi Turbo

Oil filter is easy as fuck, as its right on the top of the motor, as for the rest? Its easier to quit and find a new job than change the plugs.

Any of you want to help change the sparkplugs on my Z/28?

>>15478327
I drive a V12 7 series, so I can sort of relate, although the M70 looks way less painful and probably is than that monstrosity.

The fucc are the MR2 comments

you literally have to take the whole cunt out to do anything

>>15478414
I did a timing belt on an sw20 turbo with engine in the car once. Never again, what a cunt of a thing.

>>15469319
Boxster isn't that bad really. I have a 1998, the one with the bigger single row IMS bearing that rarely fails (1%), and basically the only thing you have to do is sparkplugs, change oil, brakes, and clean your radiator fan shrouds. I had to re do my shifter cables and such. The engine and it's ancillary components like the alternator, power steering system, and cooling system generally last until 200k, at which point your engine internals are going to be tired anyway. It uses a timing chain and has a variable timing system that uses plastic guides that push against the chain, and those wear out around the same time.

>>15478327

Looks like a fucking tank installation