Why is BMW incapable of making a lightweight coupe? like seriously

>>14111788
Lightweight and luxury don't usually mix.

It's not just bmw that makes heavy cars you know.

>>14111788
You have to sacrifice luxury to make a car light. My Mazda 3 hatchback weights 3k lbs and I can hear myself driving over the pain of the lines on the road. What exactly do you drive that makes a 335i such shit?

>>14111819
Pic is an m3, though I own a Mazda3 and a 335 and love them both

>>14111788
>Why is BMW
You mean why is every manufacturer.

>>14111788
what is m2
what is 1M

>>14111854
Those are both 3400-3500 lbs, not really different, just a bit smaller.

>>14111798
>m3s are luxury cars

Not even

>>14111798
>>14111819
>Luxury
>M3
They're not meant to be luxury.
They were designed at the same time, and for the same reason, as the original turbo porches. They are designed to be rock hard, rough, tail happy things that are equally happy being thrashed around a track as they are killing the rich plebs who buy them.

An M3 SHOULD have an excellent engine, a 6-speed manual and a viscious lsd with no electric adjustment of any of it.
You can have leather seats if you're stupid, but the roof should not be 4" thick with 200kg of sound proofing and you should not need 50,000 ways to adjust the suspension.
Leave that shit for the 335i.

>>14111788
GT-R is over 1700kg yet it breaks records

File: DSC01502.png (1MB, 1200x900px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 1200x900px

they're not incapable, they just don't want to make a light car that's faster than their flagships like they did with the 135i

>>14111894
Every M3 since E36 have been luxury
Especially the E92

>>14111917
Yes, every M3 since they started aiming them for fat, hopeless americans.

>>14111930
You just contradicted yourself, the e36 was the first m3 aimed at fat hopeless americans thank you very much >murica

>>14111930
>yuropeens blaming it on the americans

it's your car pussies

>>14111956
The E36 was the first one sold in the US.
It had inferior everything to the euro spec versions.

The E46 was designed to be sold in the US, hence why it was an ugly, pigfat, electronically controlled, automatic having piece of shit.

>>14111965
>E36 was first
>E30 apparently doesn't exist

>>14111974
IIRC the E30 wasn't done in enough numbers to make it comply with the high volume regulations of the time

>>14111983
E30 M3's were sold in America, I can find them on Craigslist. They were definitely low number cars since they start at something like $25k here but they made it across the ocean.

>>14111983
>>14111993
https://philadelphia.craigslist.org/cto/5373313012.html

>>14112000
>204,000 miles
>$42,000
lol what a retard

They're past 25 years so if you really wanted to drop $40k on an M3 you could import a LHD one from euroland with 50,000 miles.

>>14112013
Oh fully agreed, I just found the first one to pop up near me.

I was thinking of getting 135i. How much weight can you shed without making it an unsuitable DD?

>>14111788
Look, I'm not a promoter of BMW and would never recommend one to literally anyone. But, 3600 lbs is not heavy in today's performance technology. The GTR, damn near the heaviest sports car in the world, holds most of the lap time records on all of the tracks across the world.

So, stop thinking every car needs to be as lightweight as the fucking Miata. Shit, the Mustang has faster lap times than the 2016 Miata at Willow Springs. And most Mustangs are >3500 lbs.

Just letting you know at Streets of Willow...
Fastest lap times by place:
12) Shelby GT500
16) Mustang GT
26) Mustang GT
27) Mustang Boss 302
38) Shelby GT500
43) Mustang GT
45) Mustang Ecoboost
53) Shelby GT500
54) Mustang V6
63) Mazda MX5

And the Miata in the 63rd spot is the >2300 lb 2016 Miata.

So, stop acting like the lighter the car the better performance.

>>14112226
None because everything is tied into electric bullshit.

>>14112272
>A power track is unsuitable to low power cars
Wow good work

>>14112226
>gutting interior on a DD
BMW isn't for you.

>>14112279
What are you smoking? It's a 1.7 mile course. Touring cars tend to do better on the track. The Miata just isn't a high end sports car. And that's okay, because it was never meant to be. It's just a fun affordable car built solely for driver enthusiasts.

It shouldn't be compared to sports cars. It should be compared to roadsters.

>>14112279
>streets of willow
>power track
no

>>14112226
Never do weight reduction on a car that isn't an all out drag car. For every 100 hp you can shed, you only need 10 hp to more than cover it. Literally gain just 9 hp instead of pulling 100 lbs.

>>14112279
0/10

File: oG5MO.jpg (182KB, 900x600px) Image search: [Google]

182KB, 900x600px

>>14111965
have you actually driven an e46 with a proper 6mt and not the garbage smg?

it's also aged very well, you're a moron

>>14112435
I just sold one and it is actually kinda pigfat. Great car though, I actually wanted to keep it more than my e92

>>14112435
Have you actually driven one back to back with a proper euro spec E36 with the 6-speed?
The only difference is it's more pigfat.

>>14111788
The E46 M3 special version CSL which literally means ''Coupe Sport Lightweight'' weights 3053 lbs which is still quite alot for a ''sports car'' but weight doesnt mean much (unless the car weighs 2 tons). Power to weight ratio does though

>>14111788

it's 2015. 3600lbs is actually pretty lightweight these days.

>>14114048
3600 lbs is how much the V8 Camaro weighs now.

>>14112327
So I can just add hp?

hol up
bmw m3
slower
SLOWER
THAN AN X6 M

bmw sucks officially sucks now

(check willow springs track times)

>>14111897
This. BMW adds weight strategically to maximise downforce and therefore grip

>>14114776
the last good bmw rolled off the factory floor in 2006

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_DJ4t5LCfVg

>>14114099
Is this bait? I feel like this is really bad bait, but I also feel like gicving the benefit of the doubt.

Yes, at most you would ultimately be able to reduce the car's weight by 300 lbs before you start really making the car look like shit. So, you can just gain 30 hp to cover this.

Really with just a really good dyno tune from a race shop you can gain 30-40 hp no problem. But, if you are unfortunate enough to not have a shop with a dyno near you, I would recommend a upgraded throttle body, an upgraded intake, and a handheld tuner like the Diablo inTune programmer.

If you aren't big into heavily modifying your car, that will be the perfect amount of power gain for you.

>>14114776
It isn't faster than the new m3

File: 2015-ats-sedan-baseball-card-511x311.png (124KB, 511x311px) Image search: [Google]

124KB, 511x311px

>>14114081
>a v8 coupe based on a compact sedan weighs the same as a v8 coupe based on a compact sedan.

>>14111894
>hurrrr no electronics
Fuck off.

>>14112272
>damn near the heaviest sports car in the world
lolno. Fucking DB9s are over 4000lbs and if the Challenger counts as a sports car that's even worse

>>14111788
What makes you think it's a performance car? BMW prioritizes luxury and appearance so they can sell to non car people.

>>14112272
heavy cars aren't fast on low speed technical courses with bad pavement

AKA- the funnest places to drive

Track times don't mean shit, I want a car for the street (not the highway).

>>14114788
When a car has more downforce due to inertia, it does not really increase grip.

File: 146_1008_00_z+streets_of_willow+.jpg (27KB, 544x634px) Image search: [Google]

27KB, 544x634px

>>14112309
>>14112316
>>14112374
>Look how long the striaghtaways are
>only one 90 degree turn, barely a single hairpin
>every other turn is a sweeper

Really testing the limits there huh

File: best road.jpg (25KB, 1022x452px) Image search: [Google]

25KB, 1022x452px

>>14112272
do those times also apply here?

Keep your pigfat shit on baby tier tracks. They wouldn't last a second on a real drivers course, not some wimpy prefabricated bullshit.

File: gallery-1444764848-p90199689-highres[1].jpg (269KB, 1600x1065px) Image search: [Google]

269KB, 1600x1065px

At least we have this

>>14116299
fatty

>>14116303
Cars are so pigfat nowadays

>>14116121
I don't consider DB9's as sports cars more-so as luxury coupes.

And I do t consider Challengers sports cars as much as two-door family cars.
> based on the Charger platform

>>14116220
Yes, because the GTR doesn't launch like a beast. Like the SVT Cobras and Shelby Cobras don't have torque up the ass.

What do you call "low speed technical courses"? A course with literally no straight always and all hairpin corners that allow only 40 mph before you reach another corner? There is no such thing as "low speed technical courses" unless you're talking about Go-cart tracks.

Track times always mean shit, kid. That's what will determine how far you can push a car. No course at Willow Springs is like highway racing. Not even Big Willow.

You have absolutely no clue what you're talking about. Go wipe the leaking oil off your Miata.

>>14116394
>What do you call "low speed technical courses"?
see>>14116283

Those cars are built specifically for those tracks so of course there times are inflated. Put them on actual difficult course with elevation and multiple turns and they flop.

Keep your fat pigs in their closed course pen where they belong.

>>14116238
> all dem straight always
> 1.7 mile track
> all dem 90 degree turns
> literall my none
> barely no hairpins
> literally none
You have no idea how track courses are, do you?

Go watch your DVD boxset of Initial D and stay off /o/.

>>14116283
You're really samefagging hard, br/o/. I direct you back to your DVD box sets of Initial D.

Also, you'll never drive on a rouge in Japan and you'll never experience a hairpin turn.
> them feels

>>14116411
Again. Back to your DVD boxset of Initial D.

Where in the world is there an actual course built like that? Those are touges. Mountain roads that everyone just casual drives on.

1) Miatas actually suck on touges. Stop going to Initial D for your "facts".

2) The AE86 actually sucks on touges. Again, stop going to Initial D for your "facts".

3) I know you haven't mentioned either car, but I know you think these slump dicked pos cars are Japanese magic and that a Miata and an 86 can beat any GTR on the touge. But, you're wrong. In fact, I bet the Boss 302 or Terminator Cobra could beat them on any touge.

Stop fantasizing about your limp dicked lightweight cars.

>>14116419
Most American tracks are shit and 90% of drivers will never touch one anyways. Fuck track cars.
>>14116419
Your pigfat shits are still slow on the funnest types of course. Enjoy maneuvering your boulder.

There are plenty of mountains near where I live and they are way better than any track.
>>14116438
>Where in the world is there an actual course built like that?

Every state in the US that has a mountain going thorugh it.

I don't care about any type of car. I just don't like heavy cars because they handle like shit when the road ACTUALLY gets tough.

>>14111965
the e46 is one of the best handling cars ever made. its the definition of driver oriented.

File: fucking casuals.jpg (131KB, 750x562px) Image search: [Google]

131KB, 750x562px

>>14116342
>>14116394
>>14116419
>>14116438
pigfat lovers BTFO

Make sure you gain some weight so you can be even faster, right guys?

>>14111788

The BMW M4 GTS weighs 3,500 lbs~ and is the fastest BMW around the nurburgring of all time.

Are you retards ever going to stop talking about weight or horsepower as if one or the exists independently in a vacuum? Power to weight ratios, retards.

>>14116458
>drives a shitbox

File: shitbox.jpg (69KB, 736x498px) Image search: [Google]

69KB, 736x498px

>>14116470
>drives a shitbox

Is that what people are calling amazing cars nowadays? Guess I'll have to change my vocabulary to match you pigfats.

>>14116480
>NA miata
>not a shitbox meme car

top laff

>>14116494
>NA miata with F22C swap

Literally the best shitbox of all time

>>14116505
>muh engine swaps

keep on dreaming, poorfag.

File: best.jpg (87KB, 648x486px) Image search: [Google]

87KB, 648x486px

>>14116505
He'll never understand. He only does trackdays in his pig pen. Let him stay there and rot never knowing any better.
>>14116511
You'll never understand a true drivers car or platform. I hope a new NSX runs over you while a lotus drives by only to laugh.

>>14116524
Funny because you could never afford both of them. Like every other weight shitter you're just a poorfag that would not buy a light car if he had the money to.

>>14116539
>would not buy a light car if he had the money to

I'll never own a car that weighs over 2500lbs, never. Why buy a lotus when I can buy an MR-S or Miata and be 3 times as fast than a pigfat for less and also handle better?

Stay mad

>>14116548
stay delusional with your weeb shitboxes but remember that pretty much everyone is faster than you outside of a kart track/parking lot.

File: Jiata.png (387KB, 600x450px) Image search: [Google]

387KB, 600x450px

>>14116557
>everyone is faster than you outside of a drag strip
ftfy

>>14116571
Stop posting other people's swaps. You will never do one.

>>14116571
*only on

>>14116571
>hurr I will just swap "insert engine" into muh miat and it will be the fastest car on earth because of weight *vapes*

There's always one of you neckbeards at car meets.

>>14116577
>>14116590
>this buttblasted over seeing faster shitboxes that can be made for 3 grand
>pigfats are supreme, only hipsters d-do swaps

only on o

>>14116596
where is your swap m8???

>>14116607
Where is your pigfat m8???

>>14116617
So you do not have a swap ?

>>14116617
In my pants.

>>14116623
So you don't have a super pigfat?
>>14116629
Yeah, we know tubby. Must be hard not seeing your dick when you look down. Don't forget to scrub.

>>14116638
Pigfats are breddy expensive you know. They can't be had for 3k$ like your swapped monsters.

>>14116638
How many vapes do you inject a day ?

>>14116644
Good, let's keep all the boomers and street can't turns in the pig pen where they belong.
>>14116652
42

>>14116688
>42
>lol le answer is 42

back to /reddit/

>>14116691
Google tried to take me there a few times, but never been. No thanks.

I will say this. I can appreciate pigfats, but lighter cars overall are better in every way except going fast in a straight line- period.

>>14116699
So then why don't you own one ? I thought swaps are cheap as fuck and everyone can do them.

>>14116699
you also wont fucking die in the heavier car

>>14116715
pigfats need that because they always crash

>>14116760
*tips fedora*

>>14115825
You made a typo. You are shedding hp and then adding hp.

>>14116444
Trips checked.

You've never driven on a single track. More than likely there is a private track that your local police department or sheriff department use for testing their vehicles and they are usually opened to the public the first Saturday of each month for track day. If you ever get a chance, try one out. They tend to be great.

And I own two sports cars, a 2003 Mustang Cobra and a 2006 Mazdaspeed6. Both perform fuckin' fantastic on tracks. The Cobra more-so. Race tuned Bilstein springs and dampers, 13" vented Brembo breaks, 8.8" IRS with 26 spline half shafts, 3.55 rear gears, upgraded diff cover, new sub-frame for the IRS, Multi-link independent system with cast-iron upper control arm, aluminum lower control arm, fixed toe-control rod, 600-in/lb springs 26mm tubular stabilizer bars, and 17x9 rims with 275/40 tires all around.

So, while you call it pigfat, it's extremely precise with its handling and takes corners magnificently. It's not your regular GT Mustang.

So, you say it will never be as fast or as fun on the "funniest" roads. But, I assure you that it is better than you give it credit for by a long shot. And if you drive one, you'd absolutely love it.

Just to let you know what a live-axel Cobra is capable, the 03-04 Cobras with IRS are significantly better.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AzpDOFOvdek

>>14116088
Under rated post

Is there anything lighter than a miata thats as cheap while having a hard top?

>>14120081
mr2/mr-s

>>14112435
>german cars
>ever aging well
literally the only ones that have aged well are aircooled and have much, MUCH less bullshit to break

>>14112327
Weight also affects handling, not just acceleration. Adding horsepower won't make your handling better. Fuel economy too.

>>14120116
When it comes to a M-class BMW, shedding weight is redundant. Just add more power and be done with it.

>>14120081
A miata with a hardtop

>>14112435
>it's also aged very well, you're a moron
I'll take rear subframe for $1000, Alex.

And then there's the S52 oil issues (mostly pre-lci) requiring the redline to be dialed back to 8100 RPM.

But until the SMG pump breaks, I'd prefer NOT to take my hands off the steering wheel at speed...

>>14120116
im going to have to agree here. the E46 will always be a good-lookin car. but it will always, ALWAYS, look like the epitome of a "Car from 2004"


aged well means it could still look at home on a showroom floor, not that it still looks nice even thought its a couple years old. cars dont age like humans, aged well means something totally different than "Still breaks necks."

>>14111965
>E46
>pigfat

have you ever even seen an E46 compared to ANY modern BMW or American car?