Missconception thread. >Brake rotors do not warp. They build

None of those are "missconceptions".

>Cars are sports cars when they accelerate quickly and can do burnouts.
No. Just no.

>>14022828
>wankel engine is great
something inherently finicky isn't great. The EJ257 is inherently a "good" motor when you "take care of it", but it shits the bed eventually. Anything if you "take care of it" "properly" won't have issues. Please don't try to pretend the Wankel is that great, most people swap the LS1 into their RXx's they get from junkyards for $500 over their lunch break.

>>14022828
>>Brake rotors do not warp.
Runout is a real thing but rotors still warp.

>>Semi trucks/rocks
Semi tires do pick up rocks, gravel trucks do toss rocks

>>Rotary reliable
This is the only one that's right, but I think you embedded it in two other weak statements purposefully to trigger people and portray rotaries as unreliable

>>14022828
>Brake rotors do not warp.
Yes they do

>Semi trucks dont throw rocks at your windshield.
Yes they do

>While the wheel diameter is larger on a truck, they travel at much slower speed
90km/h is still 90km/h regardless of wheel diameter. The thread of the tire (and the rocks that stick to it) has the same tangential velocity of the car. What changes with wheel diameter is angular velocity (wheel's RPM), which doesn't really do much when you are talking about debris being thrown out.

>Cars travel faster, and have sticker tires which are more prone to catch, and throw rocks. Unless you drive behind a gravel truck
So your logic is "trucks don't throw rocks because cars usually throw faster rocks"?

>While Wankle engines have their faults, if you properly take care of it, it wont have issues.
Which can be said of pretty much everything.


Quality thread OP. Not only you brought "misconceptions" that nobody had, but you failed to prove them wrong too.

>>14022935
I think you just don't know how to read

>>14022828
It's Wankel, not Wankle!

>>14023097
brake rotors do not warp.
google it.

truck wheels rotational speed at 65mph is the same as a car going 80mph. but a car is much more likely to pickup a rock and throw it with it stickier tires, and lack of mudflaps.

i dont give a fuck about doritos.

stay pleb buttmad

shorter aspect sidewalls = better cornering
stiffer suspension = better cornering

>>14023097

This guy's an idiot.

>>14023227
>truck wheels rotational speed at 65mph is the same as a car going 80mph.

It's the opposite you tard.
A bigger wheel spins slower than a smaller wheel, given the same vehicle speed.
So, just to use the numbers you pulled out of your ass as if truck wheels and car wheels were all identical, a truck wheel going 80 spins as fast as a car going 65.

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>>14023227
>truck wheels rotational speed at 65mph is the same as a car going 80mph

>>14023677
same difference.

point is truck wheels are harder rubber, have mudflaps, and have a slower rotational speed = less likely to toss rocks,

>>14023762
They still throw rocks you idiot, which is the exact opposite of the point you (or whoever the OP) were trying to prove.

Also, I could argue that having more wheels more than compensates for them being less likely to pick up rocks (which is wrong anyway)

>>14023677
>>14023227
Wat? Can you into physics and common sense?

The larger diameter truck tire will be moving at a slower RPM. But for the purpose of this argument, if a truck is travelling at 65mph, the tire tread will be travelling at 65mph. If a car is doing 65mph, the tread of the tire will be noving at 65mph.

And the only time I ever get rocks hitting my windshield is when I'm behind a dump truck with gravel.

>turning signal is useless

>>14023862
You see it more where rocks are near the side of the road or on the shoulder (like at intersections with gravel roads). Trucks are wider, so often travel where the scattered rocks haven't been moved off the road, so they kick up a bunch. Not their fault, it's just a fact of being a wide vehicle. Dually trucks do it, too, and any driver than moves toward the shoulder. You notice it a lot when they sand/salt the roads, then everything dries and all the sand and shit is left on the shoulder. Either the tires or the displaced air kicks up the crap.

However mud flaps don't cover that low down a truck tire in my experience, generally higher than a car's bumper behind the rear wheel. If you're close (probably too close 2bh) they don't block shit.

Also the space between truck treads are generally larger, so larger rocks can get stuck in the tread and kicked up.

So.. Yes. They do. Nothing you can really do about it other than give them more space, which you should do anyways, but it happens.

And gravel trucks.. Well. Obviously. A truck hauling wood chips will throw significantly more wood chips at you than a corolla, too.

>>14023819
>more wheels...

That would make sense if all the wheels weren't behind each other. When's the last time you got hit by a rock from the front tires of another vehicle?

truths:
trucks have exposed wheels
trucks have mudflaps
mudflaps are made of rubber
rocks hit the rubber
the rubber deteriorates over time
there is less mudflap for the rocks to hit
poorly maintained mudflaps will result in rocks being thrown into cars behind
not all trucks are well maintained
cars are low to the ground
trucks have much higher ground clearance
cars have wheel wells that cover most of the wheel

given a deteriorated mud flap and the larger/higher nature of a semi truck, trucks have a higher likelihood of throwing rocks into the windshield of following vehicles

>>14024683
this is false.

i've driven cross country 3 times in the last 2 years, I've spent about 50% of the time drafting behind a semi getting 50mpgs at 68mph.
8k miles later I had no rocks hit my car.

Last week, driving to work, BAM, fucking rock hits my windshield from a subaru. no cracks, but when I looked on the front end I found 2 paint chips that were not there before.
I cant even remember seeing worn mudflaps. they either have them, or they dont. and i dont draft behind semis that look like they are about to fall apart

>>14022935
>Runout is a real thing but rotors still warp.
You can warp a brake disc, sure, but you won't do it if it's on a car.

>>14024511
I was going to mention the gravel on the shoulders too. Whether it is a truck or car that drifts over too far. Especially if a vehicle is pulled over onto the shoulder and comes back onto the highway, they fling up a lot of stuff.

All I'm saying is that "a truck tire spins faster/slower" idea is retarded. The treads travel the same speeds. And truck treads aren't really wider than a car's. They are often similar to A/T tires on a pickup or SUV. But I drive a lot and have never had problems with trucks specifically kicking up more rocks than cars. Only time I ever get his by rocks is behind a dump truck carrying gravel.

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>>14024790
>i dont draft behind semis that look like they are about to fall apart
it's easiest to outbreak those

I'f I'm driving my beetle, it's a fact that it doesn't warm up as well as a newer, watercooled engine. It has no thermostat (maximum cooling all the time), and by nature it's slower. So I let it warm up until the automatic choke is open all the way and it's idling well before even going anywhere, and drive it soft until the oil pressure is below 30 psi/1k revs (high flow pump for maximum pressure all the time). I really need a thermostat to make the warmup go smoothly and proper oil temp gauge instead of winging it based off pressure per 1k RPM.

On a newer car, there's usually a coolant temperature gauge that has an operating temp range on it, I don't warm them up for more than a minute while I get set in the car (seatbelt, mirrors, etc.) and just drive soft until it's at temperature, which really doesn't take long if everything is in order.

>>14024790
this thing that happened to me
it must happen to everybody!

I haven't changed the oil in my car for 70,000 miles and it still runs fine!
I draft behind semi's for a long time and truckers pull over and give me cupcakes and kisses!

>>14023227
Heat= Expansion

Expansion= Warping

>>14022840
Its a rotary troll thread m8.

>>14022828
5/10
you got this faggot to reply >>14022840

helpful hint for any of you dealing with squeak noises that are being a pain to track down:
squeaks when cold then disappears when the engine warms up? suspect the belt
squeaks when engine is warm but not present when cold? look at the pulleys, likely to be your source.

>>14025160
There is no way in hell you are heating up two heavy pieces of iron or steel to temperatures that would allow them to warp.

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>>14025160
sure. but its even heat expansion.

do all the cars in la mans have warped brakes after the first corner?

>>14023227
you are a fucking idiot

brake rotors absolutely warp. you can measure it with runout tests

>>14025479
>brake rotors absolutely warp. you can measure it with runout tests
No, they do not. That's caused by a damage braking system unevenly wearing the brake disc. Or a brake disc that went wrong at the factory.

>Trucks wheel travels at a much slower speed.

Holy fuck you are retarded, RPM isn't speed.

>>14022828
>Brake rotors do warp
All rotors deform under heavy load, but the action of the brake caliper typically returns them to true. Fixed rotors with fixed calipers suffer from a phenomenon called "coning," where the caliper pulls the outside edge of the rotor out of line with the inside edge. Because of this, you should have either floating rotors or sliding calipers.

>Semi trucks do throw rocks at your windshield.
Semi truck tires are typically not as well shrouded from the top and sides, and hard rubber trends to launch rocks at a lower trajectory than sticky rubber. It's not uncommon for race cars with vented fenders to launch rocks through the vents at the top front of the wheel well. Meanwhile, passenger cars tend to direct up into the wheel wells, and semis direct rocks low and outwards. Your highest chances of catching a rock are from passing, not tailgating.

>Rotaries are unreliable on the street
Wankel engines are high duty cycle devices by design. Operated at peak output until failure, they will last much longer than a comparable piston engine. However, they fare poorly with excessive heat cycles and cold starts.

>A wankel rotary can function with damaged apex seals
Without seals to separate the combustion chambers, the high pressure charge in the compression stroke will vent into the intake. If you somehow do have an ignitable air/fuel mixture when it meets the spark plug, you will contaminate the trailing chamber with exhaust gasses until there's little enough fresh air coming in that it can't be burned.

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>>14025417
Well, that's demonstrably false. See the multiple rings caused by uneven contact? That's from rotor deformation.

>>14025417
My mother sure does. Mrs. Brakes my dad called her. Drives 20 over everywhere she goes and brakes at the last possible second. Her brakes barely work and the car jerks back and forth as it rolls to a stop. Is this normal for women and their SUVs?

>>14025545
A rotary can function without apex seals. It will hust make terrible power and probably start tearing up your housings if ran for too long like that

Here's a misconception for you guys

>EFI makes more power

No matter how hard you try to argue it carbs to make more power than EFI.
Now I don't feel like writing down everything for you guys so to make life easier for me, here's a good article to read http://www.pro-system.com/scoop92102.html and if you guys have any questions go ahead and ask. There's a lot you can do to an intake of a carb to add even more atomization which equals more power. And for those of you who think I don't know shit about EFI, I know a huge amount about EFI since I'm currently studying it at school at the moment.
>Before I am martyred, let me just say for the average daily driving and the average person, EFI would work a lot better because of its better idle capabilities, tends to start up better, and fuel mileage, especially when combined with EGR and VVT, and because in todays society the average person doesn't know shit about carburetors.

The main reason we use EFI and computers in cars is for fuel economy.

>>14025612
>I know a huge amount about EFI since I'm currently studying it at school at the moment.
Adorable. Mechanics thinking they are engineers is always just the cutest thing.

>>14025620
What do you know about EFI? You didn't actually come up with any argument. We focus a shit ton on EFI since it is the present of future of vehicles. And to be honest I'm not going to be a mechanic, I'm taking a bunch of mechanic classes though, for the knowledge. I do plan to take engineering and machining classes after words too. Since you're obviously off topic, what have you done/taken to get a better understanding and superior knowledge of vehicles? I'm going for 4 years just purely for automotive.

>>14025677
*and future of vehicles

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>>14024799
I worked at a NAPA Auto Parts for 5 years. Brake rotors warp with heat. This isn't some conspiracy.

>No you can't warranty these rotors.

>>14025580
Oh yea, that can't be caused by the pads at all. Nope. That's definitely an out of true brake disc.
>>14025698
>I worked at a NAPA Auto Parts for 5 years.
Stopped reading there.

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>>14025706
Thought it was relevant experience, but it's obvious you're just here to shitpost.

>>14025720
It's not. Being a parts monkey doesn't mean anything. The shitposter is you.

>>14025677

> Engineering
> Classes

I see you have a misunderstanding of the commitment actual Engineers put into their fields.

>>14025720
>NAPA clerk
>relevant experience
You're just a benchwrencher tbqh family

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>>14025728
>screaming "its not" while putting his fingers in his ears

hot opinions champ you've surely swayed everyone

>>14025728
>It's not. Being a parts monkey doesn't mean anything. The shitposter is you.

Okay.

>>14025731
Again, you have no arguments. I don't under estimate how much they put in their fields. I took 4 years worth of engineering and precision CNC machining in high school and I loved it. We used many programs but the main ones were Autodesk, AutoCAD, Inventor, some plasmacam program and some 3 dimensional designing program. We had to make our own designs on paper and programs, and sometimes cut them out. Sometimes we had to make a running machine on inventor (I made a working train, motor and a secretly made a revolver) and we made running air motors in a small group, and even had to make boring daily life stuff, like cabinets. I just chose to do automotive first because it would be fast, and to be able to restore my own projects.

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>>14022828
>Semi trucks dont throw rocks at your windshield.

confirmed for never commuting on a truck route
>wake me up inside
>[[cant wake up]]

>>14025677

>engineering classes

HAHA

-mechanical engineering student

>>14025995
Fuck you.

>>14026005

Genuinely curious, what is the title of degree you are working towards? You said your doing 4 years of automotive. You sound as if youd be interested in design, why not work towards an engineering degree?

>>14025605
If you blow out all three seals on one rotor, say from excess carbon buildup N/A or lol boost turbo, the motor would not idle and you'd be lucky to get it to 25mph with out backfiring into the intake manifold constantly.

Meanwhile in a normal inline motor you can loose a cylinder via rings and it'll still idle and get you home with only fuel contaminated oil and maybe in need of a new O2

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>>14022828
>the GTR is a good car

>>14025612
carbs make 10% less power

>FORDS are reliable
Lolfucknope

At least aussie fords are unrelaible as fuck ironically even GM shit made after the late 90's is pretty bulletproof

>mfw dunnydoor VT-VE are more reliable than E series to BF shite

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>>14022828
>radial engine powered pick-em-up truck

>>14025995
>ME
Haha

-electrical engineering student

>>14026441
>feeling superior because of your choice of drink from the piss trough
Haha

-electrical engineer

>>14026076
That wasn't me. Anyway I'm currently going for an auto master mechanic, auto body, and I was thinking of mechanical engineering
>>14025995
>see above
>>14026005
Thanks m8

>>14026441
>>14026448
>Working for others
Haha

-semi-retired self employed

>>14026626
>doesn't make enough money to fully retire

>>14026634
If I fully retire I'll spend the next 20-40 years being bored, depending on how long I live

>>14026107
Finally! Alright friend, so what evidence do you have to back that up? And what type of set up? A standard edelbrock carb and older carbs, well yeah they're not the best but holley is good and prosystems (probably the best there is) has proven they make more power with a carb, the key is to tune it right, and have the right set up. New carbs (yes new) have an atomization advantage and have the joule-Thomson effect to help out, so they end up getting a cooler charge than EFI. But EFI has waaay better emissions and that's what states and companies care about.

>>14026448
more like a piss hose force feeding us all piss

-chemical engineer

>>14025508
>this
The larger the diameter the faster any particular spot on the perimeter has to move to match the rotation at or near the center. The tire itself may be doing less rpm because it covers more distance in one turn but any rock in those treads is moving way faster

>>14022828

>Brake rotors don't warp.
Bullshit. They warp if you get them hot then apply a big heatsink to one part of them... like your brake pads.

>Semitrucks don't throw rocks.
Complete bullshit. Semi trucks have those big mudflaps because they do throw rocks. The hard rubber compound won't keep a big rock from getting wedged between dualies and slung out like a missile and don't even get me started on dump trucks that don't cover their load.

>Rotaries are unreliable
You're right.. Rotaries can go the distance if they are maintained properly, but most people don't maintain their cars like they should and that makes rotary the least reliable choice for most drivers.

And so it was written. OP is completely full of shit.

>>14026990
>The larger the diameter the faster any particular spot on the perimeter has to move to match the rotation at or near the center. The tire itself may be doing less rpm because it covers more distance in one turn but any rock in those treads is moving way faster
Omg you are so stupid. It doesn't matter how big or small the tire. A rock will be thrown off at exactly the same speed be it a semi or a mexican impala on 13" rims.

>>14026990
>The larger the diameter the faster any particular spot on the perimeter has to move to match the rotation at or near the center.
yes
>The tire itself may be doing less rpm because it covers more distance in one turn
yes
>but any rock in those treads is moving way faster
no

RPM is not the same, remember? The velocity of the edge of the tire no matter the diameter will always be the same as the velocity the vehicle is traveling at.

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>>14022828
>Brake rotors do not warp.
This is true but it is usually from out of spec rotors or from torquing your wheel incorrectly.
>Semi trucks dont throw rocks at your windshield
This is absolutely asinine
>Rotaries are unreliable
Sure, but not Mazda's in any car that is worthwhile

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>>14022828
>This is why many small aircraft use Wankle.
This guy isn't serious, is he? He can't be, this is so wrong it isn't even funny.

>>14027715
many experimental home built aircraft use wankles because they are very reliable for that application and very light.

>>14025706
>hurf durf I know more about brakes than the fucking SOCIETY OF AUTOFUCKINGMOTIVE ENGINEERS
Kill yourself.

Citations:
http://papers.sae.org/2015-01-2673/
http://papers.sae.org/2014-01-2520/
http://papers.sae.org/2014-01-2493/
http://papers.sae.org/2007-01-3670/

>>14026626
>>Working for others
>implying

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>>14027715
yes hes correct. they have great power to weight ratio and are very reliable in long running applications. also if catastrophic failure happens the plane can limp home on one rotor, whereas this happens with a piston engine and its all ded

>>14023097
>90km/h is still 90km/h is still 90km/h regardless of wheel speed
LOL

>>14028185
Throwing a rod is caused by failed bearings. Spin a bearing in a rotary and you'll crack the block as the crank stops spinning and inertia forces to engine to try to spin around it.

>>14028190
I'm not sure if you're retarded or not actually reading what he's saying, but he's right. Small wheels turn faster and large wheels turn slower in order to make the vehicle go the same speed, because larger wheels have more circumference. If you spun a large wheel at the same RPM as a small wheel, the vehicle would go faster, because the outside of the tire is moving at a higher speed.

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>>14028213
I know, I'm laughing because I was reminded of this bitch

>>14028185
>shows a catastrophic failure that is the result of either massive detonation or a failed bearing
>implying a failed bearing or massive detonation won't stop a wankel

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Brake discs do not warp under normal road nor racing conditions.
http://www.stoptech.com/technical-support/technical-white-papers/-warped-brake-disc-and-other-myths

>>14022828
>Rotaries are unreliable

Everything is reliable if you take "properly care" of it. Even chryslers.

But in real life: rotaries are unreliable.

>>14022907
Please don't meme

>>14022828
>Missconception thread.
>>Brake rotors do not warp.
True
>>Semi trucks dont throw rocks at your windshield.
yes they do. That's why they are required to have the flaps in the first place. The reason isn't because of the compound it's because it's a dually. Rocks get lodged in between the two tires and then get thrown out and back
>>Rotaries are unreliable
>While Wankle engines have their faults, if you properly take care of it, it wont have issues.
I have seen a 4g63t dsm with 400k. Properly taking care of any motor will last. The thing that makes a motor reliable is being able to deal with bad maintenance and abuse. Plus maintenance of a rotary requires apex seals every 90k which means you must pull motor. I'd say that's unreliable.

>>14029128
>I have seen a 4g63t dsm with 400k.
Uh, so? Mitsubishi shit lasts forever even if you don't take care of it.

>>14025471

No, they have $20,000.00 carbon ceramic rotors that have been engineered to resist warping.

>>14028485
>>14029128
See: >>14028176

>>14030014
GT cars that run at LeMans (or any other related championship like WEC and the various LeMansSeries) all have steel brake rotors, only prototypes have carbon brakes.

They are all floating rotors tho, which is what prevents warping in those kind of brakes.