new GOP strategy: repeal ACA and don't replace until Dems

>“A lot insurers who have been filing for 2018 have already been building in a margin to say, ‘We think there might not be an individual mandate, so we are going to have a sicker pool, so we need to charge much higher premiums,'” Fiedler told ABC News. “In the ‘repeal and delay’ construct you could very well have insurers say, ‘Why am I going to deal with the chaos next year if I don’t even know if there is a business opportunity here in the long run and so I am going to pull up stakes and leave.’”

>While the open enrollment period to buy individual insurance on state exchanges does not start until November, insurance companies are far along in their process of designing and submitting preliminary plans and pricing to states. Even if a repeal bill temporarily preserved some part of the law, like the cost-sharing subsides for people purchasing their own insurance for another year or two, experts say repealing the insurance mandates could lead insurance companies to raise prices or leave individual markets immediately.

>In January, the Congressional Budget Office published a report analyzing a previous iteration of a repeal-only bill that would have removed the individual mandate immediately and then later eliminated the federal subsidies of individual insurance and the Medicaid expansion two years later. The CBO estimated that within the first year of enactment, 18 million more Americans would become insured because of the mandates repeal. Premiums in the non-group sector would increase by 20 to 25 percent in the first year, according to the report, as compared to projections under current health care legislation.

>When cuts to Medicaid and the end of cost-sharing subsidies for individual insurance go into effect, the CBO estimated the number of uninsured Americans would grow by 32 million by 2026.

>“If Republicans have been unhappy with the coverage estimates they have been getting so far, I can’t see how a repeal and delay strategy would solve the problem,” Fiedler said.

>He went on, “One of the major challenges and one of the reasons Republicans on the Hill moved away from [repeal and delay] six months ago is that upending the whole health care system and then giving insurers no certainty on what would come after is a recipe for disaster. One of the things we have seen is that the insurance industry just does not deal very well with uncertainty … If the last six months have demonstrated nothing else it is that coming to an agreement on health care reform is hard.”

Democrats should just vote for the Republican bill and let them own it.

The Republican bill is nearly identical to the ACA, but it creates a massive deficit.

The Democrats are too stupid to realize that they could have turned Obamacare into Trumpcare and then let the damage be their fault

It's obvious the Republicans are trying to push a single payer system just as badly as the Democrats.

None of these Republicans bills are addressing any of the problems with healthcare costs or the ACA problems

>>153609
i guess you still believe the 2 party system works

>>153609
Yes, let's let millions of people be without healthcare just to prove a point.

>>153609
Er no, then the Republicans could pin it on the Democrats and the Democrats will muck about like the useless little pussies they are.

I've an uneasy feeling our government is still retarded and malicious enough to go through with this if all else fails.

But I can't practically imagine this working out for the GOP even if some Dems give in so their constituents don't suffer. The voting public might not have the best long-term memory but people are going to remember the GOP tried to hold them hostage to get votes for unpopular legislation.

Then again, Democrats are so low-energy and incompetent at campaigning that they'll probably still manage to let the GOP get away with it.

>The voting public might not have the best long-term memory but people are going to remember the GOP tried to hold them hostage to get votes for unpopular legislation.
I don't honestly believe this.

sounds good. Repeal don't replace. Why replace it at all? Go back to the way it was.

>>153625
keep spreading the "22 million" lie

You know that almost 18 million of those people are people that won't be FORCED to buy insurance anymore?

Yes Obamacare forced people to buy insurance even if they didn't want it. This bill give the people the freedom again to not buy any.

>>153642
People will see their premiums go down and remember it was the gop that did it.

The fearmomngering nonsense from the left about the repeal is laughable to anyone who actually understand what will happen.

FUCK AMERICA

The USA is cancer on the face of humanity.
The sooner it is cut out the sooner we can have peace.

>>153663

No peace until every last cockroach is killed.

>>153663
>foreigner mad that his shitty country doesn't have a fucking flag on the moon

>>153698
Jeje... Tell him, Lance Armstrong!! GO USA!! #tourdelance

>>153658
>the way it was was so fukken gud
yeah people having to choose between rent and other bills or go to the hospital to get healthcare was so great

>>153661
>he thinks premiums will go down when fewer people are in the market
there need to be healthy people in the market subsidizing the care of sick/old people in order to keep premiums down. If people leave, costs will go up. Older people are going to get charged more, and all this is so the wealthy can get a tax cut
>>153660
>BIG EVIL GOVERNMENT MAKING SURE IT'S CITIZENS ARE TAKEN CARE OF
Healthcare is a right that we should guarantee to every American. There is no excuse for the greatest, richest, most powerful country on the face of the Earth cannot pay for its citizens health insurance

>>153698
The last moon landing were almost 50 years ago, since then you guys haven't even managed to put a single rover back on the moon, that honor goes to china. It's like praising the British just because they were the top dog a hundred years ago.

Nations rise and fall and this is probably the decline of the US as we know it. See you guys in 30 years.

>>153701
where you from, friend? How many aircraft carriers does your navy have? What's the GDP of your country? Trump may hold us back for the next 3.5 years, but we'll still be on top when he's finally gone. Then, we'll start winning even MORE goml

>>153700
>Healthcare is a right that we should guarantee to every American. There is no excuse for the greatest, richest, most powerful country on the face of the Earth cannot pay for its citizens health insurance
You're sidestepping >>153660's point. Sure hopefully there could be a health insurance plan that covered everyone even if those people couldn't pay. However the current system is:
A: Buy health insurance.
B: Get fined in federal taxes for the months a person is not covered with health insurance.

>>153661
>People will see their premiums go down and remember it was the gop that did it.
Premiums will decrease for a subset of people who are better placed to afford a premium increase in the first place, and with it, deductibles would increase, yearly and lifetime caps on coverage would increase, and insurance companies would stop covering preexisting conditions, so insurance becomes far more pointless because if you ever encountered catastrophic sickness and found you weren't wealthy, it's likely insurance wouldn't save you from bankruptcy and you would live on the edge of life, unable to afford preventative care, only going to the emergency room every time your condition became dire enough.

Because we'd still have an arbitrary as fuck standard of single-payer healthcare when it comes to emergency care but never for preventative care. Even if preventative care means people can be more productive, suffer less, and save everyone else time and money by not having to head to the emergency room for all their care needs.

The GOP line that people will have more choice is bullshit. Some people will have more choice, some will have less. Mandating people with preexisting conditions be covered by itself is meaningless because it doesn't make business sense. Insurance providers will just price them out of the market, which in turn will drive up the price for everyone else seeking comprehensive insurance policies. And if you don't opt to purchase comprehensive insurance, the US taxpayer is still on the hook for your emergency care if it comes to that, because everybody has risk, that increases as they grow older.

It doesn't help our economic productivity, it doesn't give people more choices, it doesn't give peace of mind, it's arbitrarily cruel;taxpayer is on the hook for everyone's emergencies, for everything else, even if it could save taxpayer money, even if it could let you hold down a job, you're out of luck if you can't afford the cost by yourself.

>>153700
>Healthcare is a right that we should guarantee to every American.

Fuck off commie

No one is responsible for your gibmedats

>>153702
China.
> How many aircraft carriers does your navy have?

Only one, but still we don't go around starting wars left and right so I don't see what's the issue. There's no real point anyway, even with a dozen carriers the US has, you can't actually support an invasion of mainland china for long anyway. How's all the wars in the middle east that costs you trillions with no real gain doing again? But seriously, unless we want to start playing world's policeman, there's no reason to have a dozen aircraft carriers.

>What's the GDP of your country?

Only second to yours.

>Trump may hold us back for the next 3.5 years, but we'll still be on top when he's finally gone.

Trump is only the symptom. The real issues is the anti-science movements, the bloated government system and debt, the increasing wage gap, the increasing divide between your two political parties that hate each other so much that they run the country to the ground just to spite each other, the rise of PC culture and so on. Not to say that my country has no issues but we are set to solve them in a slow and steady approach with clear and simple goals. Unlike your two party system that actively tears down what the previous party has build out of spite. The US may be on top for the next decade but 50 years down the line?

>Then, we'll start winning even MORE goml
>What the British empire and the USSR said before they fizzled into irrelevance.

Oh please, empires and nations may take centuries to build but they collapse easily. Trump is just making this worse, I have never seen your country so divided, half the country hates the other just because of their political views and it's just going to be worse the next election cycle. What was it a US president said? A house divided against itself cannot stand or something like that?

>>153701
>The last moon landing were almost 50 years ago.

Feel free to cite another country who has set foot on the moon. I'll wait.

>>153716
Hell yeah, we need to spread this philosophy. Why should I be force to pay for the military in California when I live in Florida? They aint helping me. Federal taxes are theft! People need to take care of themselves!

>>153740
>Feel free to cite another country who has set foot on the moon. I'll wait.
>The Egyptian build the largest pyramids in the world 5000 years. This surely means that Egypt is the strongest nation in the world.
>The British was the strongest global empire in the world with the largest amount of conquered land in history a hundred years ago. This will surely never change.
>The USSR will forever be a thing.
>Name another country that build a wall as long as the great wall of china.

Are you literally retarded? Nations change, civilizations rise and fall, the US that bought you to the moon back in the 1960s is gone. No nation has stayed top dog forever and trying to credit the current British government for the glory it had a hundred years ago is just futile as the bullshit you're sprouting.

The US is on the decline and it's clear for all to see. Trying to claim past achievements from half an century ago doesn't change that. What have the US actually done recently? For all your boosting about space, NASA is treading water with projects getting canceled left and right and with no clear plan or goal. Hell a year ago, they were solely dependent on Russian rockets to get astronauts onto the ISS. How the mighty have fallen.

>>153701
There's virtually no reason to go back to the moon yet. Still a ways away from lunar mining ops.

The biggest accomplishments regarding space have always been international efforts, right now the big ones are Hubble and the ISS. US still pays a lions share of the funding, but that's beside the point.

>>153725
I'm pretty sure a person from China shouldn't about the US having problems. China literally can't stop polluting it's air, poverty is commonplace despite a high gdp, corruption and aristocracy are just as high as any other country. On top of all that, your country bans skeletons in media because Chinese farmers are so uneducated and gullible that it might make them believe in ghosts.

>>153754

We still carry a lot of weight, but I do agree we've been on a slow decline that was first showing cracks after the 1950's, accelerated by political rot enabled by Reagan.

I don't care about anyone's healthcare coverage except mine, my mother's, and my friends son. Those are the 3 people who I want to live most.

Not bad from a strategy viewpoint. Over 30 million will lose their healthcare and the Republicans know those bleeding heart libs won't be able to just sit back and let them die so they'll have to help them pass whatever new bill they come up with. If the democrats don't help them pass the new bill, then the republicans will simply turn it around and claim that those millions of people now don't have health insurance because of the democrats, and people will eat it up because they're stupid.

>>153700
Declaring commodities and services -- medical goods and people to administer them -- a right does not create supply of those things. To care for more people, we need more production and more doctors.

To get more production, we need to dial back things like medical equipment taxes, get experimental drugs (labeled as such) onto the open market earlier, say after clearing phase 2 trials, and then dial back intellectual property laws so drugs become generic faster.

To get more doctors, we need to open up medical licensing to people not trained in the US. The current licensing scheme drastically restricts supply. This will in turn force American medical schools to restructure their curriculum. We also don't need highly trained pharmacists to count pills.

There are also many regions where a single hospital has an effective monopoly. These can be broken up. We also can reduce barriers to entry for new competitors -- current regulations for building hospitals, or clinics that would compete with them -- are insanely arduous and expensive.

The socialist proposals are simply mandatory mediocrity.

This was Trumps plan all along

To repeal that socialist shit and replace it with nothing.
This is THE ONLY WAY to get the government out of healthcare completely.

Healthcare will become dramatically cheaper because about 2 million Socialist middle man make-work jobs will be cut out. The transaction will be direct cash between patient and doctor.

>>153758
I already said that my country has issues. The difference is that we are actually taking steps to fix it.

>China literally can't stop polluting it's air,

That's why we're spending more money then the US on renewable energy, building tons of nuclear reactors and even investing even things like thorium reactors and whatnot. Meanwhile, your green movement and ignorant population has neutered your nuclear program and your current government is pushing for coal. Fucking coal, the same fuel that making China's air look like a something out of a horror movie.

>poverty is commonplace despite a high gdp,

Our rise to the world stage and the skyrocketing of our GDP has only quite recently began relatively speaking. You can't afford to solve every problem at once. It doesn't help that we have 3 times the population as the US and it's not like the US is a land of millionaires anymore. If what I read is right, more and more US citizens are surviving on minimum wage and student loans are sucking more and more people into debt. Our economy is still growing rapidly and maturing and massive urbanisation is a ongoing process as farmers move into cities and contribute more to the economy.

>On top of all that, your country bans skeletons in media because Chinese farmers are so uneducated and gullible that it might make them believe in ghosts.

Because the US is perfectly scientific? The rise of anti vaccines/GMO, antiscience movements, flat earthers, the various 911/moon landing conspiracy, homeopathy and so much more bullshit is on the rise right now. At least china does have the excuse that yes, a large part of our population are poor farmers who don't have computers, smartphones or interact access. That's changing as more and more farmers move into cities to find manufacturing/service jobs and get educated.

>>153701
Cause we're too busy putting them on fucking mars and asteroids and huffing sweet comet chem trails?

>>153700
>Healthcare is a right that we should guarantee to every American. There is no excuse for the greatest, richest, most powerful country on the face of the Earth cannot pay for its citizens health insurance
There is no excuse for forcing your less wealthy to pay for the services they can't really afford and don't want from a private company, and fining them for not doing so. It is literal corporate fascism, and isn't even constitutional.

>>153642
What's the problem? Why is repealing this garage and going back to the way it was before a bad thing. Democrats after responsible for Obamacare.

>>153700
They will go down because the rest of us won't need to socialize the sick. Health insurance is not at a right.

>>153609
Getting rid of obamacare is something gop wants to own and I want them to do it.

>>153846
The tax dollars are not just paying companies, they're paying for people's preventative healthcare.
That's the point of insurance; everyone pays a little so that everyone enjoys peace of mind that they're protected in case of catastrophy.
Some people don't use the roads either, but we can't have a society where people micromanage where their tax dollars go; nobody would want to take the fall and pay for something someone else uses more out of belief that others wouldn't do the same and their sacrifice wouldn't make a difference.

Personally I want to get rid of for-profit middle men altogether but blame the Republicans for us not being able to have a single payer system and pharma company having obscene profit margins of 5000% on patended medications essential for americans not to die an agonizing death.

>>153700
The hard redpill is is that restrictions on the supply of medicine acts as a means to control population and excise the useless portions of society. One of the reasons why the US is so successful is that failure is punished by bankruptcy and death. This in turn motivates people to do better while cutting out the trash that drags other societies down.

>>153905
Not the anon you're replying to, but I just want to address a few. That entire system you're praising is basically shooting yourself in the foot on a nationwide level. Where do you think the United States ranks on worldwide education? What about overall lifestyle health? What about personal financial growth? What is your measure of success? There are countries all over the world that rank higher in all of these fields. Shit, the United States isn't even top 10 in some quality of life categories.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that single payer healthcare will magically fix all of these problems, I'm just saying that the "America is #1" meme needs to be addressed.

Also, the system is based around abuse tactics. You can ask any psychologist how well that works. What you crank out is rich pieces of shit who resent the system and everyone else stuck in it, and dead pieces of shit who were unable to rise up. When the population is happy and healthy, they act in a grateful manner and you get a return on your investment. With single payer healthcare, you're basically investing in your country's future by ensuring that your citizens live long enough and aren't mentally fucked up enough to contribute back.

>>153905

This is complete nonsense since the US has always had a single-payer system, it's just it only applies to emergency healthcare. People who get sick enough don't die, they live agonizing lives and generally can't work and survive off the taxpayer at emergency rooms.

Our system was ridiculously arbitrary and cruel prior to the ACA. It didn't matter if it preventative care for a patient would have saved the taxpayer money and allowed the patient to remain a productive member of society and not live in suffering.

This also made us less meritocratic since people often have to choose employers or whether to start a business not on the basis of where they best fit into our economy but on the basis of who offers what healthcare plan.

>One of the reasons why the US is so successful

Prosperity comes from lots of places. It also comes from having the peace of mind that health insurance actually works in case of catastrophe for the majority of Americans.

People were once disincentivized from purchasing comprehensive and robust healthcare policies because if you fell sick enough, you were basically fucked if you ever had to change insurances or reached your coverage limits and you could always go to the emergency room for free anyway.

This meant that fewer people opted for high premium comprehensive policies, which in turn concentrated the number of high risk individuals in those pools, further driving up premiums, in a vicious cycle until nobody had useful health insurance. The only way to break this cycle was for government to say, everyone has some risk and almost everyone uses healthcare if they need it, so if health insurance is going to be useful, everyone's got to buy into it before they become high risk.

It's shocking that leftist morons are still pushing single payer.